Official back & Front thread

[Love4Michael]

I'm of the opinion (though I could be mistaken) that the accident was in fact real.  There were many available options and most would have been easier to gain publicity at that time.  I do think however that when Michael started developing his master plan for the hoax...he may have used the date of the fire as an impetus...a marker of sorts from which to work off of or from. 

[SimPattyK]

he may have used the date of the fire as an impetus...a marker of sorts from which to work off of or from. 

Totally agree!! VERY possible variant!

[RK]

Since we all have our conjectures and interpretations on the pepsi incident, I don't see it as a hoax, but the birth of the hoax...my take on it is that it was no accident. "THEY" wanted to send a serious message to Michael , a reminder to put him in [their idea] of his place. However, "THEY" underestimated his patience, perseverence and determination, as he carefully perfected and fine tuned his plan. Working away at it always, regardless of the ongoing personal attacks coming his way in the form of false allegations and charges while being publicly crucified and villified by "THEIR' media in the minds of the greater public at large.  However, when the timing was exactly perfect, on the 9282nd day from the start of this war, the plan we have come to call MJ's vindication, restoration, payback also known as death hoax was launched. And tied up and connected with, as well as interwoven through out this hoax is this pepsi incident. 
Now maybe I am wrong and I see everything through the eyes of a conspiracy nut, but for the record......I think the pepsi fire was real.  .

[Love4Michael]

Since we all have our conjectures and interpretations on the pepsi incident, I don't see it as a hoax, but the birth of the hoax...my take on it is that it was no accident. "THEY" wanted to send a serious message to Michael , a reminder to put him in [their idea] of his place. However, "THEY" underestimated his patience, perseverence and determination, as he carefully perfected and fine tuned his plan. Working away at it always, regardless of the ongoing personal attacks coming his way in the form of false allegations and charges while being publicly crucified and villified by "THEIR' media in the minds of the greater public at large.  However, when the timing was exactly perfect, on the 9282nd day from the start of this war, the plan we have come to call MJ's vindication, restoration, payback also known as death hoax was launched. And tied up and connected with, as well as interwoven through out this hoax is this pepsi incident. 
Now maybe I am wrong and I see everything through the eyes of a conspiracy nut, but for the record......I think the pepsi fire was real.  .

Those are some of my similar thought patterns RK.  That the fire was indeed real... and maybe the first blatant "message" from the evil ones that we can knock you down whenever we want (or worse).  Maybe he just planned it out so that in the same amount of days he'd send back the following message...you may THINK you can...but you're WRONG.

[sweetsunsetwithMJ]

I have mixed feelings.

I am so enjoying myself these past 3.5 years, I almost wish it would never end.

And honestly I am at a loss as to know what I will do with myself if there is no more hoax to investigate.

I have mixed feelings as well for the same reasons.  The hoax has and is such a huge and important part of my life.  But it can't last forever and I'm as ready as I can be for Michael to return which will be another life-changing event.  A new and exciting beginning of something but I don't know what. 

I can't help but wonder what will happen to the forum post-BAM.

I guess the forum will remain as a good friends that love Michael Jackson Forum and we will keep on posting MJ's news, vids and so on.... maybe? :icon_eek: At least I wish it were that way.

[Loveunited]

auction on Dec 12; my personal bam choice...
Lot number 72650-------anything from the numerology people?

I found something interesting. Take away the zero... 7265 days?

From and including: Friday, January 27, 1984  Pepsi fire
To, but not including : Thursday, December 18, 2003  "Jackson was charged with seven counts of child molestation and two counts of administering an intoxicating agent, in order to commit that felony"

It is 7265 days



also From date:Wednesday, February 10, 1993  His televised interview with Oprah

Added 7265 days
Resulting date: Tuesday, January 1, 2013

BRILLIANT   :th_bravo: :th_bravo:

[RK]

Speaking of numerology....that "accident happened on the 6th take at around 6pm or 1800 hours. 

[sweetsunsetwithMJ]

Sweetsunset what do you mean a pepsi video started the hoax?

Pepsi fire video didn't start the hoax but the hoax was started with Pepsi fire video which was uploaded on July 2009, so it's weird that if the hoax is to end it's ending with the Pepsi fire auction, isn't it weird? So that means that Pepsi fire accident has been something very significant throughout this hoax.

Hadn’t connected that but you are absolutely right.   :icon_eek:

I have to think the fire was a hoax and that Pepsi took a hit only to be rewarded later, as they have been.  It wouldn't make sense otherwise if they were a party, innocent or not, to the original incident.

And here's a crazy thought about that hair burning.  Notice where his hair was burned.  On the very top of his head.  His crown chakra.  A fire in the head.  An awakening.  Did the incident have a spiritual significance as well? 

In 'The Song of Wandering Aengus' William Butler Yeats refers to the ‘fire in the head’ that characterises the visionary experience.   

If this auction heralds the end of this hoax I will know for certain there is a God.   

Yes that was what I thought from the start because I always thought: how come that Michael's scalp injuries from the fire drew a perfect circle on his head? So your theory about the crown has sense to me.

[mindseye]

I'm of the opinion (though I could be mistaken) that the accident was in fact real.  There were many available options and most would have been easier to gain publicity at that time.  I do think however that when Michael started developing his master plan for the hoax...he may have used the date of the fire as an impetus...a marker of sorts from which to work off of or from. 

I agree, I think it was real and it was an accident - but maybe after all that had happened throughout the years he may have reflected back, questioning that incident and used it as a marker...  seems the media uses it a lot to back up stories about his drug addiction.

For 3yrs La Toya has said over and over in interviews and publicly that Michael thought someone was trying to kill him and he was murdered. But it seems that most ppl haven't taken her words seriously or care, she's only an emotional family member speculating ... they rather believe the media stories about drugs and addiction.

I think the starting point is the fire, to years of allegations, with media paying ppl for stories, Sneddon, Sony ...AEG leading to the hoax, or as La Toya pointed out - the illusion.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFPjFyfcj8E[/youtube]

[Australian MJ BeLIEver]

Will clarify. When I say I sit on the fence abt Pepsi burn... It's not abt what I believe. I believe it was an act unbeknownst to Pepsi and the fans and crew. (maybe one person was in & brothers) When I say I sit on the fence, its regarding talking about it so as not to cause offense. Considering no one is getting angry and we are being open minded, I decided to elaborate on other reasons in addition to my previous post.

It may have in some way or other boosted his image as a celebrity, but personally, not only the burns but any pain is dissuading to say the least. So how would you ever explain the video? That's not Michael? any impersonator? or not fire at all. And what about all the witnesses who actually saw him getting burned? Accidents do happen...

I still don't find this convincing...unless we have a SOLID PURPOSE to back it up...

Re the video

• We never saw his face on the 6th take. Are we even sure it was MJ?
• His highly flammable sequined jacket remained unscathed...
• Which raises possibility of controlled fire on the head
• After the burn he is covering his head? Why so no one sees the burn? Or so no one sees what little device / attachment he wore to ignite the fire (whether that be wig, or something else I am unfamiliar with)
• When most people suffer a burn, even a small one on the kitchen stove, the least human reaction would be to touch it. The pain would in fact cause the opposite reaction of not wanting it to be touched. Yet MJ covered his head? What was he hiding?

In addition here is quote from a fan who was there on the day:
Some studio audience members said at the time that "Jackson was so calm, they thought the incident was part of the act"



Re possible reasons

• Money for the children / hospital
• Massive sponsorship post 1984 and even still to this day with the MJ cans, etc
• Controversy laden publicity stunt
• As discussed other incidents hang off the Pepsi incident - so it lays ground work for other events that end up part of the support story for the hoax
  
  Also, 2 yrs before pepsi incident, 1980 MJ handed the P.T. Barnum book to his crew and said it was his bible and he wants his life to be the Greatest show on earth.
  
  Interview with Shmuley
  
  Michael : How to play people, yeah. He knew how to make the public interested. P.T. Barnum was pretty good at it himself.
  
  Shmuley: But with you, when you say it’s become about playing the public, is it as simple as withdrawal and they want more? And more ways how to reveal yourself?
  
  Michael : It’s rhythm and timing. You have to know what you’re doing.
  
  
  As for the burn patch on his head post explosion, if that is even what caused it (I think MJ in fact ignited his head), just remember we know that he is familiar with make up, prosthetics, woundish / gorey looking make-up (think thriller) as well as had prior association with burns victims. He knew how his head needed to look after the burn.
  
  
  In finale, the one thing I don't believe (and I do believe in TPTB) is that this was an attack from them on MJ. I don't believe he was the victim, scared, fragile, meek, weak lil person that he and others made out he was. I believe that all that is strategy / manipulation / business and entertainment. We love and are drawn to gentle people. He got us with that hook. (Not saying he isn't lovely. We know he has a heart of gold and is incredibly generous, kind etc) However because of those gorgeous Bambi eyes and sweet as sugar persona he puts out, a benefit is that 'we' (the general public) don't question the publicity stunts, nor immediately think "he manipulated this event" His sweetness became a method / alibi for him to do such things. It is possible that the "MJ is in illuminati danger card esp @ Pepsi" is a great scapegoat and allowable excuse for such stunts.
  
  
  LMP "he was a master at manipulating the media" and "The manipulation was a survival tactic for him"
  
  
  Not because he was in 'danger' - No his survival tactic to 'stay on top' for all of these years and keep us watching. And it worked. No other artist has stayed on top to the level of MJ - but also no other artist has been shrouded in as much controversy. Too much controversy to be incidental. The controversy is planned. He is topping Thriller. He has been since Thriller. It's all Thriller II and these stunts / controversial moments in MJs life, including Pepsi fire are part of the Thriller II monster. Were watching MJ - We love you x
  
  Really phenomenal if you think about it. Considering the rest of the world only JUST caught up with the concept of reality entertainment in the late 90's early 00's
  
  :bearhug:
  
  LOVE you MJ for all your wiley ways and magnificent entertainment that goes even BEYOND the realms of song and dance. You gave us entertainment for more than the eyes and ears. This is entertainment for the mind!
  
  
  

[sweetsunsetwithMJ]

Will clarify. When I say I sit on the fence abt Pepsi burn... It's not abt what I believe. I believe it was an act unbeknownst to Pepsi and the fans and crew. (maybe one person was in & brothers) When I say I sit on the fence, its regarding talking about it so as not to cause offense. Considering no one is getting angry and we are being open minded, I decided to elaborate on other reasons in addition to my previous post.

It may have in some way or other boosted his image as a celebrity, but personally, not only the burns but any pain is dissuading to say the least. So how would you ever explain the video? That's not Michael? any impersonator? or not fire at all. And what about all the witnesses who actually saw him getting burned? Accidents do happen...

I still don't find this convincing...unless we have a SOLID PURPOSE to back it up...

Re the video

• We never saw his face on the 6th take. Are we even sure it was MJ?
• His highly flammable sequined jacket remained unscathed...
• Which raises possibility of controlled fire on the head
• After the burn he is covering his head? Why so no one sees the burn? Or so no one sees what little device / attachment he wore to ignite the fire (whether that be wig, or something else I am unfamiliar with)
• When most people suffer a burn, even a small one on the kitchen stove, the least human reaction would be to touch it. The pain would in fact cause the opposite reaction of not wanting it to be touched. Yet MJ covered his head? What was he hiding?

In addition here is quote from a fan who was there on the day:
Some studio audience members said at the time that "Jackson was so calm, they thought the incident was part of the act"



Re possible reasons

• Money for the children / hospital
• Massive sponsorship post 1984 and even still to this day with the MJ cans, etc
• Controversy laden publicity stunt
• As discussed other incidents hang off the Pepsi incident - so it lays ground work for other events that end up part of the support story for the hoax
  
  Also, 2 yrs before pepsi incident, 1980 MJ handed the P.T. Barnum book to his crew and said it was his bible and he wants his life to be the Greatest show on earth.
  
  Interview with Shmuley
  
  Michael : How to play people, yeah. He knew how to make the public interested. P.T. Barnum was pretty good at it himself.
  
  Shmuley: But with you, when you say it’s become about playing the public, is it as simple as withdrawal and they want more? And more ways how to reveal yourself?
  
  Michael : It’s rhythm and timing. You have to know what you’re doing.
  
  
  As for the burn patch on his head post explosion, if that is even what caused it (I think MJ in fact ignited his head), just remember we know that is familiar with make up, prosthetics, wound / gorey looking make up (think thriller) as well as had association with burns victims. He knew how his head needed to look after the burn.
  
  
  In finale, the one thing I don't believe (and I do believe in TPTB) is that this was an attack from them on MJ. I don't believe he was the victim, scared, fragile, meek, weak lil person that he and others made out he was. I believe that all that is strategy / manipulation / business and entertainment. We love and are drawn to gentle people. He got us with that hook. (not saying he isn't lovely. We know he has a heart of gold and is incredibly generous, kind etc) However because of those gorgeous Bambi eyes and sweet as sugar persona he puts out, a benefit is that 'we' (the general public) don't question the publicity stunts, nor immediately think "he manipulated this event" His sweetness became a method / alibi for him to do such things. It is possible that the MJ is in illuminati danger card is a great scapegoat and allowable excuse for such stunts.
  
  
  LMP "he was a master at manipulating the media" and "The manipulation was a survival tactic for him"
  
  
  Not because he was in danger - no his survival tactic to stay on top for all of these years and keep us watching. And it worked. No other artist has stayed on top to the level of MJ - but also no other artist has been shrouded in as much controversy. The controversy is planned. He is topping Thriller. He has been since Thriller. It's all Thriller II and these stunts / controversial moments in MJs life, including Pepsi fire are part of the Thriller II monster. Were watching x
  
  Really phenomenal if you think about it. Considering the rest of the world only JUST caught up with the concept of reality entertainment in the late 90's early 00's
  
  
  :bearhug:
  
  LOVE you MJ for all your wiley ways and magnificent entertainment that goes even BEYOND the realms of song and dance. You gave us entertainment for more than the eyes and ears. This is entertainment for the mind!
  
  
  
  

Good job, you found the connecting dot in between the Pepsi fire issues and this hoax, I think Michael is wonderfully obsessed by making an hospital for children then and now, his stubborn love to children is moving his brain mechanism steadily to make dreams come true.

[Dontwalkaway]

Sweetsunset what do you mean a pepsi video started the hoax?

Pepsi fire video didn't start the hoax but the hoax was started with Pepsi fire video which was uploaded on July 2009, so it's weird that if the hoax is to end it's ending with the Pepsi fire auction, isn't it weird? So that means that Pepsi fire accident has been something very significant throughout this hoax.

Great remark!! Someone posted something similar on my FB page earlier today...

@Sim:
Vegetarians don´t eat meat (no fish either or seafood).
Vegans don´t eat meat (fish/seafood) and do not consume any other animal products. So no dairy products, no eggs, no honey.

Lol @Sus

Yeah my friend she calls herself a vegetarian, loves chicken but eats fish (well only from Maccas, the ones with preservatives...lol).
The word Vegan sounds so fancy doesn't it..."I'm a vegan not a vegetarian" (said in a very posh English accent)....ahaha, but for me personally I'm such a carnivore.

lol  :icon_lol:@Sus ? What/Who's SUS ?  :icon_lol:

@MaryK: tks for precising that !  :icon_e_wink:
@UYI: what are you talking about there? Maccas ...preservatives"? :icon_eek: :icon_lol: :icon_lol:

I have mixed feelings.
I am so enjoying myself these past 3.5 years, I almost wish it would never end.
And honestly I am at a loss as to know what I will do with myself if there is no more hoax to investigate.

I guess we all agree on that!

Funny how we all seem to think exactly the same !
few days ago I was talking with some hoax sistas in private...and we were expressing the same kind of feeling of impatience & excitement mixed up with nostalgia and sadness that this is all gonna end!! For the past few weeks/months.... noticing how gradually, little if nothing was left to investigate, I've kind of got worried abut what I was gonna do after BAM with my favorite Hobby missing!
Another hoax maybe!?  :affraid: :affraid: :icon_lol: :icon_lol: :icon_lol:

This isn't the end.  We'll have plenty to do because it's the start of a new beginning.  The world will be totally different. 

Waiting and ready  :woohoo2:

[SimPattyK]

@DWA: LOVE youuuuu  :bearhug:



@Aussie: great post sumarizing all the good reasons to believe in the Pepsi fire-hoax!  :icon_e_wink:

[use_your_illusion]

Hahaha Sims you're too cute...
Sus = suspicious minds BABY!!! Lol
Maccas = McDonalds, which is what most people in Australia call it.

Ok, class dismissed....lol

Love you Simmer

[Australian MJ BeLIEver]

LOL, I got it and didn't blink an eyelid. Us Aussies and our horrendous slang!  :icon_razz:

Meanwhile.... I'll use it in a sentence....

"I'm sus on maccas"  :animal0017:  Hahahaha