DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

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Offline ForstAMoon

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DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: March 28, 2010, 11:04:56 AM
As I have been sick whole week and had time to watch TII DVD extras Stagin the Return, I noticed couple of stange things.  

We see O2-MJ (I call him that way as I am one of those that believes it was not MJ) with his team going out of the bus and then getting onto the golf-cart.

At the time of this scene the lady voice says:
Michael Jackson’s here. Go straight on stage. It will be a 3 minutes video and a little bit of talk from Dermot, so that’s enought time to ring the dial.“

and then you see bits and pieces of O2-MJ with his team on their way to the stage.

So, nothing stange at the first sight but couple of things caught my attention:

Why the lady voice was played in the first place? were is it come from? was it a message, and if yes, to whom? - why the hell is she saying: „enought time to ring the dial“. Is this a message to the team to get on stage as soon as possible and by the way you can still make a phone call?

3 minutes and "a little bit of talk" to get on stage from getting out of the bus seems a little bit short in such a gigantic arena for, as Randy Philips said in the same film, „the biggest press conference to announce a live entertainment project I have ever seen“. This is just my feeling rather then anything else, as I have no idea how this stuff is being managed.

Then you can also see two cuts with O2-MJ driving on the golf cart, then talking to the team and then walking, presumably to the stage. During the first cut with O2-MJ going on a cart, you can see WELCOME on the wall as they pass by, then a second later there is INTELLIGENCE written? What is this „welcome intelligence“?

I also checked subtitiles for this scene and surprisingly in English version (that presumably was the easiest and required no language adjustments) she is not saying DERMOT (O’Leary) but it is written DURHAM? I checked couple of other languages on DVD and its seems it is like 50/50 between Dermot and Durham depending on the language. I am not an English native but still can see the difference in pronaunciation of both?

So at this stage I had no idea if there is anything the above may relate to.

And then later in the Staging the Return, we have a Hamlet scene with the Light Man with Randy Philips saying: „It reminded him of Hamlet when Hamlet was contemplating his friend. The context of him seeing himself in Hamlet, to me it gives chills, because this is fantastic that he knew that and understood that and felt that that was part of the theatrical power that he was presenting“. So again, what the hell suddenly Hamlet has to do with all of this?

So trying to figure out the logic behind Hamlet, Hamlet’s play within the play concept cames up,  which was used by Hamlet to expose the murder and conspiracy.

There is also a bit of Hamlet discussion in this thread apparently. ;)
viewtopic.php?f=50&t=7333&hilit=hamlet

So, assuming these are messages/clues and trying to connect the docts, what about the following:

When you google Durham (mistaken name in the subtitles), of course you can get houndreds of links, we also have Michael Durham Prince as sound editior for This is it, who then filed a claim againts MJ estate, but what I find the most intersting are the following connections:

The City of Durham UK (wrong name in subtitles) – University of Durham (welcome intelligence) – University Chancellor Bill Bryson – Bill Bryson book writer – Book: Shakespeare World as Stage – Hamlet in TII

Bill Bryson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Bryson

The Book: „Shakespeare World as Stage“
wiki on the book: „ Shakespeare: The World as a Stage is a biography of William Shakespeare by author Bill Bryson. The 199-page book is part of Harper Collins' series of biographies, "Eminent Lives". The focus of the book is to state what little is known conclusively about Shakespeare, and how this information is known, with some discussion of disproved theories, myths, and that which is believed by the public but not provable.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Bryson

So, what if these are indeed clues: with WORLD AS STAGE – the play is going on just in front of everybody’s eyes and we have various PLAYS WITHIN THE PLAY to expose conspiracies?

Does it makes sense to you, or it is just far fetched coincidence?

Two other observations:

Place of recording:
I am having serious doubts that all of the backstage of O2 announcement that is shown in the Staging the Return was actually recorded in the O2 arena. I cannot see anything around O2-MJ and the team, the background in all of the cuts from allegdly O2 is always fully covered, it is either bus, with police car and the roof covering the background (you cannot see anything outside) then we have what seems to be long corridors with not much to be seen in the background besides the walls, and then in both cases when you see O2-MJ and the team (taking and walking) the background is fully covered by black curtain. It seems that it could have been recorded in any other place.

Lady's voice message:
Besides the Durham thing, what seems strange to me is the „enough time to ring the dial“. What was it for? I am not native but I think it is not very common to say „to ring the dial“ instead of to make a phone call? Of course I might be mistaken but going further with the ring the dial problem:

"Ring dial" - universal equinoctial ring dial (sometimes called a ring dial for brevity), sundial

wiki on sundial: A sundial is a device that measures time by the position of the Sun. In common designs such as the horizontal sundial, the sun casts a shadow from its style (a thin rod or a sharp, straight edge) onto a flat surface marked with lines indicating the hours of the day. As the sun moves across the sky, the shadow-edge progressively aligns with different hour-lines on the plate. Such designs rely on the style being aligned with the axis of the Earth's rotation. Hence, if such a sundial is to tell the correct time, the style must point towards true north (not the north or south magnetic pole) and the style's angle with horizontal must equal the sundial's geographical latitude.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundial

So, here we have „time“ connected to the „ring dial“, so does it mean that timing of hoax follows the sun? In one of TIAI Updates we have references to sun movements for timing of death and memorial and the burial and full moon dates.

TIAI Update #4c: 777 + 999 = Greatest Proof of Hoax, Not Murder
4-23. The 911 Call Was at 12:21
Whether you think MJ really died, or it’s all a hoax, everyone recognizes that the whole thing kicked off with a 911 phone call placed at 12:21 PM on 6-25-09. However, all the other timing was planned: death 77 days until 9-9-09; memorial on 7-7 (full moon), and 7 years from will; burial 7 days from 9-9-09 (and essentially full moon), etc. So is it possible that the timing of the 911 call was also planned? Yes, there are several ways to show that 12:21 was planned.


It looks like a mysterious fully crypted movie with agents trying to figure out the codes but after reading all of the TIAI updates I feel that there is much more to figure out that we have been able to figure out so far.

Sorry I am not able to upload Staging of Return onto my comp, but may try later to put some pics.

Would love to see your views on that.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline loyalfan

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Re: DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: March 29, 2010, 02:30:46 PM
wow you have really worked hard on this havent you.......lots of interesting thoughts too......wish i was half as clever....lol...xxxx....well done
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Elsa

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Re: DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: March 29, 2010, 09:35:02 PM
Thanks ForstAMoon.  

I've also been looking at the full moon, Light Man, Hamlet, Smooth Criminal (09 in Scene Selections in TII) and the other films credited at the end of TII like Dead Reckoning, His Girl Friday, In a Lonely Place,Tokyo Joe,The Big Sleep, The Whole Town is Talking and This Gun for Hire.  Its not just Gilda with the clues.

Hamlet, the Hatter and the March Hare - all quite mad.  Except that Hamlet was pretending to be mad so he could investigate a possible murder.  

As for Light Man, in the animation we see him floating from under the stage out above the stage.  How was it going to float/fly from under the lifted ramp? Neverland Fairydust? Well, it works in an animation and that was all that was needed for the film.  Eight days from London and they couldn't show us the nine foot Light Man?

Looking at Pacific time (hoax time) the next full moon is 03-29-2010 at 7:25.  
http://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/moo ... 2010&n=137

My time the full moon isn't until 30 March but I've made a mental note to go outside and -just bathe in the moonlight.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Em

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Re: DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: April 01, 2010, 09:35:22 PM
Quote from: "ForstAMoon"
I am having serious doubts that all of the backstage of O2 announcement that is shown in the Staging the Return was actually recorded in the O2 arena. I cannot see anything around O2-MJ and the team, the background in all of the cuts from allegdly O2 is always fully covered, it is either bus, with police car and the roof covering the background (you cannot see anything outside) then we have what seems to be long corridors with not much to be seen in the background besides the walls, and then in both cases when you see O2-MJ and the team (taking and walking) the background is fully covered by black curtain. It seems that it could have been recorded in any other place.

After watching the press conference in "This Is It", I have some doubts  it really was "press conference". It looked like it was filmed in HD. It was not in low resolution like TV would have been. It was the same footage that was shown on TV. The "quality" stood out. To me it looked like the whole thing was staged and filmed by them. The whole thing could have been done somewhere else.

Em
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Elsa

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Re: DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: April 03, 2010, 03:04:20 PM
There are a few different issues in this thread but because of the title I'll add my conclusions about Light Man/Hamlet here rather than starting another thread.

TII, Special Features, Staging the Return – The Adventure Begins.
Watch how the show was to begin – at about 010:12:00.  

Michael Cotten:  Then Michael came onto the stage floating in his suit of light.... Michael would be holding the same chrome orb that the audience had previously seen with his own image reflected in it.  It reminded him of Hamlet when Hamlet was contemplating his friend.  The context of him seeing himself in Hamlet, to me just gives me chills, because that’s fantastic that he knew that and understood that and felt that was part of the theatrical power that he was presenting.

Michael in Light Man holds an orb which reflects his own image.  This reminds him of Prince Hamlet holding the skull of Yorick, the King’s jester.  So Michael is both Prince Hamlet and the skull - Yorick.
 
Hamlet:  Alas, poor Yorick! I knew him, Horatio, a fellow of infinite fun, of most excellent imagination ... Where are your jokes now?  Your games?  Your songs?  Your flashes of laughter that always make the audience roar?... http://www.enotes.com/hamlet-text/act-v-scene-i?start=2

Michael is contemplating the death of Michael Jackson.  That's what he is presenting.

Does Michael Cotten explain that moment as seeming sadly prophetic?  Do we see a mournful realization?  No.  He is delighted to tell us that it is fantastic that Michael knew and understood what he was doing.

So if Michael Jackson is dead who is going to be revealed as Light Man opens piece by piece?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Working Hard

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Re: DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: April 03, 2010, 03:21:08 PM
Quote from: "Em"
Quote from: "ForstAMoon"
I am having serious doubts that all of the backstage of O2 announcement that is shown in the Staging the Return was actually recorded in the O2 arena. I cannot see anything around O2-MJ and the team, the background in all of the cuts from allegdly O2 is always fully covered, it is either bus, with police car and the roof covering the background (you cannot see anything outside) then we have what seems to be long corridors with not much to be seen in the background besides the walls, and then in both cases when you see O2-MJ and the team (taking and walking) the background is fully covered by black curtain. It seems that it could have been recorded in any other place.

After watching the press conference in "This Is It", I have some doubts  it really was "press conference". It looked like it was filmed in HD. It was not in low resolution like TV would have been. It was the same footage that was shown on TV. The "quality" stood out. To me it looked like the whole thing was staged and filmed by them. The whole thing could have been done somewhere else.

Em

I agree - except for the "low resolution" bit..What do you mean by that?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline NickJ47

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Re: DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: April 11, 2010, 09:12:22 AM
It seems like you are really committed to this. In my short time here, it becoming more and more evident to me that you guys have built a strong foundation for your claims. I wasn't much of a believer beforehand, but I'm actually starting to believe this.

ForestAMoon - I can see what you're getting at, and it seems like you've really researched this. Nice find!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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Offline Ninanina

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Re: DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: April 11, 2010, 04:35:51 PM
The first verifiable staging of Hamlet was in July 1602 in London - 407 years before the first planned staging of TII.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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Offline NickJ47

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Re: DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: April 12, 2010, 01:45:20 AM
Quote from: "Ninanina"
The first verifiable staging of Hamlet was in July 1602 in London - 407 years before the first planned staging of TII.

They've been planning it since then?!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
Remember, It\'s all for L.O.V.E
It was the story of an uncommonly gentle man. Innocence is what he knew. Beauty is what he saw.
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Offline rag doll

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Re: DVD: Staging the Return - Hamlet connection

  • on: April 13, 2010, 03:57:25 AM
This is just a negligible observation compared to the amazing and elaborate parallels you draw.

What I like in particular is the Light Man intro with the orb he´s holding that ought to reflect his mirrored image. Hamlet is holding a skull while he´s yearning about the beauty of transience in his monologue.
("To be or not to be.../When he himself might his quietus make with a bare bodkin?")

Michaels sphere again becomes a luminous rising sun/moon.
A transition from darkness to light - death to life?
Would be a beautiful metaphor.

And the effects are stunning. Honestly,  I forgot to breathe for some seconds...  :)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

 

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