New Member Asking for Answer to Crucial Hoax Question

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Offline heisinme09

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New Member Asking for Answer to Crucial Hoax Question

  • on: February 20, 2010, 12:55:17 PM
Hello Everyone! First of all, I am a brand new member, but have been following your research for awhile now and I must say, I've been very impressed with your findings...you truly make me want to beLIEve! But I have a very basic hoax question that as probably already been asked and answered in the past, however,  I've yet to discover it here...that question is this: how do we reconcile the existence of a death hoax whenever any outsider in the medical/legal/law enforcement fields are brought into this?....latest example: Joseph Jackson asking for and receiving the right to view Michael's medical records from the hospital...a judge is involved...a court...a hospital...I need someone to explain how it is possible...I want to reiterate that I think what you're doing is wonderful!...I don't even know yet if I want Michael to actually return if he is indeed alive...his true mission on earth might be better served from the position he is in right now...I can't even fathom how the media would crucify him further if he were to "raise from the dead"...I want him to experience true peace for once in his life...anyway, I have so many thoughts on this, I could go on and on...but thank you for your help and please keep up the great work you are doing! Always with the L.O.V.E.! Thanks in advance for your patience with a Rookie Investigator!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places....and those who don\'t believe in magic will never find it" - Roald Dahl

Offline mjsweety

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welcome!!
to answer your question, imo:
1) There was indeed a "body" (whose? Lord knows ,but close enough in likeness to fool officials involved, keep in mind they (the officials) only identified tha body by his drivers liscense
2)there was a threat to MJ, large enough that he faked his death with the help of all these officials
3) about Joe and the medical files, i can only think Joe is not in on it...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline foreverking

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I agree with the previuos post and as for Joe getting the records. We have no idea of why Joe wants those records and for what. I think Joe is representing the family and since Kate cannot rock the boat due to her loosing her percentage of the estate. And I'm from the camp that all of MJ's family does not know about the hoax because he cannot trust them to keep their mouths shut.  Joe is number one on the list.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline KINGdom52

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Hi and welcome  :)

Yes , you're right  this is the most common  question among the new ones in this hoax.
If you have been following our investigation  so far , you should have understand that this
is not a simple thing .
This case, my friend , is HUGE !
It goes MUCH MUCH deeper than you think !
If you realize that , then you'll see that the involvment of judges or lawyers or hospitals
are ABSOLUTELY NOTHING compared to what we have to deal here with.

All of them are simply the puppets on this huge chessboard ! ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline bec

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Good question.

I think the family is largely protected from perjury and filing false lawsuits, etc because "they don't know".

Now they may or may not know, and some family members almost certainly know, but proving they know would be another story. I mean the world thinks Michael Jackson is dead right? Right.

So, the family can function under the guise of ignorance while performing tasks... like Joe filing these lawsuits strategically designed to bring information to the table.

I believe that we are supposed to see these UCLA records for some reason and that is why Joe is in charge of aquiring them. But see the HIPPA laws don't allow them to be public record, so we need an intermediary... Joe plays that role for us.

OR.

Joe genuinely doesn't know and he's just a hoaxer like us. He smells a rat and wants to get to the bottom of it, geuinely, plain and simple.

OR.

It's all BS. Joe hasn't filed any lawsuit at all. I mean we are getting this all third party info and straight from Joe's mouth. He could be lying. We don't really have any substantiation that any lawsuit has been filed.

That's just one example. For further info on how legal entities can be involved read here:
viewtopic.php?f=48&t=5033

and here:
viewtopic.php?f=48&t=5382

Bottom line, there's several different ways to go with this question. Some players can remain on a "need to know" basis, they need not know that it is a hoax for them to function in their normal capacity (ie workers at UCLA doing as they're told and following orders). Some are being set up... to behave in their SOP (standard operating proceedure) which is unethical as per routine, and to hang themselves (ie LAPD and DA), and some are strategic in their manuevers, working within a legal framework assured by lawyers (you know Michael has the best in the business) to pull off the hoax without breaking the law.

I hope that was useful to help you understand that a death hoax IS very realistic and very posible, evn based on what we are seeing right now.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
Are you entertained?

UTisNUM1

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For me, the main problem believing in this hoax is that if Michael was under mind control and being threatened by the Illuminati (aka secret society that control government and media), how would the government or law enforcement officials be in the on the hoax when they themselves have to answer to a higher power?

The existence of the Illuminati to me is horse crap personally. If a society really was secret, we wouldn't have any clue. Especially if it controls the government and such, that would be a nearly impossible secret to discover.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline scorpionchik

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Welcome new member!

I want start from the description of autopcy report of the deceased that written by CORONER. The only description we read is what everyone knows:tatoo on the  top of the forhead, tatoo liner on the lips, brows, no hair, MJ lost hair after commercial fire, scars from couple of cosmetic surgeries, and alike common description that EVERYONE KNOWS. There is NO PROFESSIONAL POINT OF THE EVIDENCE that deceased is MJ,i.e. TEETH (saying that was verified with his dentist record), DISCOLORED (brown) NAILS and overall body that HAD VITILIGO, and alike. NO disfunction of any internal body or description of the internal brain picture. We were told that CORONER performed 3 autopcies, taking some cell from the brain. Do we have conclusion from that test? NO, WE DO NOT. They say "stomac and eyelid were full of propofol ". Autopcy report does not say that. Instead, the conclusion says that deceased is practically healthy person. Oops, BUT WE THOUGHT MICHAEL "WAS" LONG TIME PRESCRIPTION DRUG ABUSER". How he remained that healhty ???????? Fantastatic! As we understand, it is not possible for person who has been abused drugs in life time NOT damaged its liver, stomac, or kedney AT ALL. ?
LAPD involvement- so far we never read affidavit of the bodyquard, video tapes, other doctors involvement in long time propofol prescription to Michael ( where are they?).Do they do their job properly? NO, THEY DO NOT. Because they are not sure, what they are doing.
Judges- their job is to handle the subject matter brought to the court, NOT a HOAX investigation.
If/when hoax discovers, the burden of proof that family was involved in the hoax is on prosecution. That will be AS IMPOSSIBLE, AS NOW THEY "CANNOT PROOF" (or do not want to) ALREADY PROVED PICTURE OF the 2nd DEGREE MURDER.   ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
EndlesslovetoMJ

Offline hesouttamylife

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As for Joe and Michael's medical records, that's all fluff because in order to get those records, you are required to sign a statement that you will not reveal or reproduce ANY of the the findings.  So what good are they?  He can get them, read them, fume over them or whatever.  He can't disclose any of what he learns.  So they are useless.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don't stop this child, He's the father of man
Don't cross his way, He's part of the plan
I am that child, but so are you
You've just forgotten, Just lost the clue.”

MJ "Magical Child"
Still Rocking my World…
   and leaving me Speechless!

“True goodbyes are the ones never said

Offline heisinme09

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Thanks to all who replied to my question....I too agree that the more that is revealed, the deeper and deeper this goes...there are so many facets to it, it is hard to keep it all straight...but there are so many coincidences, questionable practices and inconsistencies on an daily basis, it seems logical to me that there is something "in play" here...the part of me that loves a good mystery is so intrigued by it all that I can't shake it off or walk away...but each time "official" outsiders are involved, it makes me more and more nervous that the hoax will careen out of control...my feeling about Michael is this: I believe he was put here on this earth to deliver an important message...he was blessed with a God-given talent in order to reach a global audience...as he grew and his talent grew and he broke more and more barriers, his power grew...and that power became a threat to the Powers That Be...this is why they attempted to destroy him in every conceivable way...there is no question to me about this...but where is this going? That is my question too...what is the end game? I believe he is handling this in the only way possible at this point...he perceived, I think correctly, that his very life was in danger...he had to back out of the picture and work from behind the scenes...keep in mind what I said about him being a messenger...he is taking desperate measures to get his message through...many, many people are listening...but I still worry about his safety...this all has to be handled very delicately...how much of this is still within his control? With a father like Joseph Jackson, there is a wildcard factor that is quite disturbing to me...thanks for letting me ramble some more...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places....and those who don\'t believe in magic will never find it" - Roald Dahl

Offline heisinme09

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Thanks to all who replied to my question....I too agree that the more that is revealed, the deeper and deeper this goes...there are so many facets to it, it is hard to keep it all straight...but there are so many coincidences, questionable practices and inconsistencies on an daily basis, it seems logical to me that there is something "in play" here...the part of me that loves a good mystery is so intrigued by it all that I can't shake it off or walk away...but each time "official" outsiders are involved, it makes me more and more nervous that the hoax will careen out of control...my feeling about Michael is this: I believe he was put here on this earth to deliver an important message...he was blessed with a God-given talent in order to reach a global audience...as he grew and his talent grew and he broke more and more barriers, his power grew...and that power became a threat to the Powers That Be...this is why they attempted to destroy him in every conceivable way...there is no question to me about this...but where is this going? That is my question too...what is the end game? I believe he is handling this in the only way possible at this point...he perceived, I think correctly, that his very life was in danger...he had to back out of the picture and work from behind the scenes...keep in mind what I said about him being a messenger...he is taking desperate measures to get his message through...many, many people are listening...but I still worry about his safety...this all has to be handled very delicately...how much of this is still within his control? With a father like Joseph Jackson, there is a wildcard factor that is quite disturbing to me...thanks for letting me ramble some more...my mind is racing with all the details...hard to even put into words...thanks for welcoming me....
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places....and those who don\'t believe in magic will never find it" - Roald Dahl

Offline heisinme09

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Oops...sorry about that double post....my laptop gets the "hiccups" sometimes!  :roll:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places....and those who don\'t believe in magic will never find it" - Roald Dahl

Offline hesouttamylife

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OMG, you read my mind.  He had gleaned too much power and it was continuing to grow.  He out shined ANYBODY and EVERYBODY, even the presidents and kings!  He had to be brought down a notch or many notches.  They felt threatened.  Michael could have ruled nations because people believed in him, followed his lead.  If he gave us the charge, we would accept it no matter what the government said and were destined to follow.  Heal the world!  Lends a helping hand to my theory that someone was plotting to get rid of Michael in a very public way that would send a huge message to all of us.  Michael HAD to go away.  He would not allow people to be hurt because of himself.  It was life or death.  I BELIEVE he chose LIFE.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don't stop this child, He's the father of man
Don't cross his way, He's part of the plan
I am that child, but so are you
You've just forgotten, Just lost the clue.”

MJ "Magical Child"
Still Rocking my World…
   and leaving me Speechless!

“True goodbyes are the ones never said

Offline KINGdom52

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@ heisinme09

You already answered to your question  ;)
I agree  100%.
His safety is above all but I'm sure he knows what he's doing.
I trust him completely.
He knows this rotten system better than anyone.
So, let's be patients and praying for his safety. ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline gracesong

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Quote from: "UTisNUM1"
For me, the main problem believing in this hoax is that if Michael was under mind control and being threatened by the Illuminati (aka secret society that control government and media), how would the government or law enforcement officials be in the on the hoax when they themselves have to answer to a higher power?

The existence of the Illuminati to me is horse crap personally. If a society really was secret, we wouldn't have any clue. Especially if it controls the government and such, that would be a nearly impossible secret to discover.
Quote from: "UTisNUM1"
For me, the main problem believing in this hoax is that if Michael was under mind control and being threatened by the Illuminati (aka secret society that control government and media), how would the government or law enforcement officials be in the on the hoax when they themselves have to answer to a higher power?

The existence of the Illuminati to me is horse crap personally. If a society really was secret, we wouldn't have any clue. Especially if it controls the government and such, that would be a nearly impossible secret to discover.
I think you are correct on your view about the Illuminati.
While I do believe there are unseen forces running our government, I don't think there are sinister plots around every corner.
I do believe governments employ technologies beyond our current general understanding to control some and monitor many.
Good question, though. I'll have to look up on that myself.
P.S. Michael was definitely a messenger for love and peace. He wanted us to be informed about the things going on behind the scenes that many people are unaware of, but I don't think Michael would want us to follow him much like acult would follow a master.
I realize what I just said was rather controversial, but Michael's only human. He is just the messenger encouraging us to take charge of our own ships, not a captain ready to stand at the helm of a global warship against the powers that be and not a general ready to head his global army of followers.
He's human, just as we all are.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline heisinme09

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Thanks again, all, for your great replies...you are so welcoming...so much L.O.V.E....thank you!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places....and those who don\'t believe in magic will never find it" - Roald Dahl

Offline simplyme

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Quote from: "scorpionchik"
Welcome new member!

I want start from the description of autopcy report of the deceased that written by CORONER. The only description we read is what everyone knows:tatoo on the  top of the forhead, tatoo liner on the lips, brows, no hair, MJ lost hair after commercial fire, scars from couple of cosmetic surgeries, and alike common description that EVERYONE KNOWS. There is NO PROFESSIONAL POINT OF THE EVIDENCE that deceased is MJ,i.e. TEETH (saying that was verified with his dentist record), DISCOLORED (brown) NAILS and overall body that HAD VITILIGO, and alike. NO disfunction of any internal body or description of the internal brain picture. We were told that CORONER performed 3 autopcies, taking some cell from the brain. Do we have conclusion from that test? NO, WE DO NOT. They say "stomac and eyelid were full of propofol ". Autopcy report does not say that. Instead, the conclusion says that deceased is practically healthy person. Oops, BUT WE THOUGHT MICHAEL "WAS" LONG TIME PRESCRIPTION DRUG ABUSER". How he remained that healhty ???????? Fantastatic! As we understand, it is not possible for person who has been abused drugs in life time NOT damaged its liver, stomac, or kedney AT ALL. ?
LAPD involvement- so far we never read affidavit of the bodyquard, video tapes, other doctors involvement in long time propofol prescription to Michael ( where are they?).Do they do their job properly? NO, THEY DO NOT. Because they are not sure, what they are doing.
Judges- their job is to handle the subject matter brought to the court, NOT a HOAX investigation.
If/when hoax discovers, the burden of proof that family was involved in the hoax is on prosecution. That will be AS IMPOSSIBLE, AS NOW THEY "CANNOT PROOF" (or do not want to) ALREADY PROVED PICTURE OF the 2nd DEGREE MURDER.   ;)

Correction please.....Page 11 of the autopsy report most certainly does say that there is propofol in the stomach and eyes.  1. d] and 1. e]  As for the comment about damage to the organs and drug abuse.  It's not that simple.  Lifestyle in general, eating habits, etc all play a roll.  It is possible not to have damage or a lot of damage but there are many factors to consider - organs can do a recovery also, if damaged.  It happens.  So look up vitreous humor - it's right there in the report page 11 - stomach is written as stomach.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline scorpionchik

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Well, I might missed page 11 or forgot (reading lots of things daily) ,but I will correct that it is too very fishy report because when person gets intravenous medication, it is hardly possible that over dose  fills stomach. It would damage the brain rather than stomach. Kedney very gentle organ and most sensitive in compare to liver for example. Once it is damaged, it will not recover by itself. It might suspend bad process if person follow diet, but NO selfrecovery. Liver may recover after particular treatment if drug abuse stopped permanently.  Michael was not treated for anything like that as we know. At least I have never heard or read tha MJ getting treatment for kidney, or liver, or heart failure.

Everyone here has typos, even grammar mistakes. Don't think that you are "professor" and exception..
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
EndlesslovetoMJ

this1crazygirl

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excerpt from heisinme09

With a father like Joseph Jackson, there is a wildcard factor that is quite disturbing to me...thanks for letting me ramble some more...my mind is racing with all the details...hard to even put into words...thanks for welcoming me....

when you grow up around adults/people who don't make you feel secure, it results in an adult who is very guarded about certain things they tell people including family. Sometimes especially family... I know that from experience
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline JukeBox

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i've always wondered the things you mentioned myself! does anyone think Arnold Schwarzenegger could be part of how Michael could pull everything off? he was a flag bearer at the winter olympics and that has been linked to the hoax cos of the 'believe' theme. i'm not American and i don't know how much power or what the governor of California can do, but maybe he had a hand in authorizing some of the stuff the LAPD did or the court 'scenes'. i personally think the Dr Murray footages in court are part of some elaborate movie and not real!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline 2good2btrue

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Firstly, welcome to the Forum.  And great to hear from newcomers who have an open mind and fresh approach.  Sometimes, we have really bad news days and feel like giving up.  
ON BAD DAYS, I ASK MYSELF THIS.....JUST HOW FAR WOULD I GO TO PROTECT MY 7 yo SON?  WOULD I LIE TO EVERYONE IF IT MEANT IT WOULD SAVE HIM? IF HIS LIFE WAS IN DANGER, JUST HOW FAR WOULD I GO?  
THE ANSWER IS ALWAYS THE SAME...I WOULD DO WHATEVER IT TAKES TO SAVE HIM. I WOULD THROW MYSELF INFRONT OF A CAR.  I WOULD TAKE A BULLET FOR HIM, AND WOULD LIE TO PROTECT HIM..........THIS IS WHY I AM STILL HERE.  I BELIEVE.  I BELIEVE THIS IS MUCH BIGGER THAN WE KNOW, AND I'M SURE, MJ WILL BE FORGIVEN AND PRAISED FOR WHAT HE WILL EXPOSE AND REVEAL.  NOBODY WILL RIDICULE HIM, BUT RESPECT HIM EVEN MORE.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline heisinme09

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Your mention of Governor Arnold caught my eye....it made me wonder what relationship, if any, he might have had with Michael before 6/26/09?...might be worth investigating...it just strikes me that if Arnie loved Mike as much as so many, many other well-known people did, what better person to have in your corner than the governor of California?...there might be death hoax details that Arnold could "smooth over", and by that I mean, legal details...catch my drift?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places....and those who don\'t believe in magic will never find it" - Roald Dahl

Offline deepu priyanka

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HI ,IT IS INDEED A GOOD QUESTION.. THE ANS. IS SIMPLE.. AS U KNOW M.J IS VERY RICH AND POWERFUL GUY WITH A TERRIFIC LEGAL TEAM  ,WHO CAN SHIELD HIM FROM ANYONE N ANYTHING.. ALL THE PEOPLE WHO R INTO THIS MUST HAD BEEN PAID OFF TO RUN THE SHOW.EVEN JOE IS DOING THE SAME THING... JUST RUNNING THE SHOW.. MONEY+POWER+ INFLUENCE=HOAX.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline TinkerbellStardust

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Quote from: "KINGdom52"
Hi and welcome  :)

Yes , you're right  this is the most common  question among the new ones in this hoax.
If you have been following our investigation  so far , you should have understand that this
is not a simple thing .
This case, my friend , is HUGE !
It goes MUCH MUCH deeper than you think !
If you realize that , then you'll see that the involvment of judges or lawyers or hospitals
are ABSOLUTELY NOTHING compared to what we have to deal here with.

All of them are simply the puppets on this huge chessboard ! ;)

I agree. This goes much deeper and is much bigger than we first imagined. And therefore IMO there is also the possibilyty that not all powerfull people are necessary all bad - and that part could have helped in this hoax. And if not.. It does only take a relatively small group of people to engage in something and bring it further to manupulate everybody else follow it or believe in it.

And a WARM WELCOME to the new member! :)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

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this1crazygirl

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the thought makes me weak sometimes... in a good way
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

 

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