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Agreed, Grace. The logic points only to hoax.
[...]You see at the beginning of This Is It that the dancers are in tears because they have almost realized their dream which was to perform live alongside Michael. Knowing how loving Michael is, and knowing how much he cares about the people of our world, why would Michael not allow for their dream to come true? [...]
[...]and especially the costume designers. In the This Is It credits, you see that Zaldi is creating a spectacular outfit for Michael by HAND. Michael put him to work on this knowing it was never going to happen - that just doesn't sound like something Michael would do.[....]
[...]Regarding Front and TS [...] I'm just saying that they haven't given me enough to make me fully believe in what they're saying. [...]
[...]If Front posted up a picture of Michael unedited - a picture we have never, ever seen before with a sentence like "See guys? I'm Michael! You have to believe me! And to make you believe me, I will tell you something about Jermaine no one else knows! *Insert shocking Jermaine secret here*" then I would gain more belief, but that hasn't happened yet to my knowledge.[...]
[...]And I apologize, but I think I used the wrong choice of words when I said "I don't really believe in the BAM". If I may, I'd like to rephrase that to "I'm not quite sure if I believe in the BAM". The reason why I'm not sure if I believe in the BAM is because no one will ever know for sure what Michael has in mind. We aren't psychics or mentalists. In my opinion, we're fans who have found a bunch of interesting clues that we can only hope point to a BAM. The only one who knows if there will be a BAM or not is Michael.[...]
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login[. . . ]Let me clarify better what I mean when I say his life was in danger. When Michael was approached to do the 0-2 Arena concerts, I do believe that he intended to do the 10 shows. I really do. But I also think that he had a change of heart when they kept upping his commitment until it reached 50. Somewhere I read that he agreed finally to 31. If he did, I don’t think he did so cheerfully. However, in view of him having spoken on more than one occasion of someone or a few someones out to harm him, something occurred to me during this time that made me feel uneasy. During the time of all this planning for him to take up residence in London and do all these shows with millions of people in attendance, there was a pandemic outbreak of influenza being reported in London. They were in the middle of taking precautions to keep people away from crowded places where the germs could easily be carried and Michael whose immune system was already compromised, fit right smack in the middle of those more susceptible to acquiring this virus. Then the matter of the insurance policies with the clause specific to “if he dies during the contract” blah, blah, blah. Well hell, if it were me my first thought would be then why are you insisting that I go to live right in the heart of an outbreak of a pandemic that is relevant as we speak, when every one else is preparing to stay away' and not only are you adding shows but insuring me to the max should I “die” in the process? :icon_e_confused: I would wonder now, is this how you plan to get rid of me? Why are we not talking cancellation until further notice like after this thing or the threat of it has subsided? The first case of the Avian flu in London was reported on April 30 2009. By June 5, there were over 100 confirmed cases and on June 11 WHO signaled that the first pandemic of the 21st century was underway. People were being advised to keep children home from school and for others who were most vulnerable to stay away from large gatherings. large gatherings :WTF: How much larger a gathering could there be than a Michael Jackson concert times 50? One of the key mechanisms of communication used in London was the NHS London Noon Brief. This was first issued at 12.00 noon on 25 April 2009 as a simple, black and white Word document, to local NHS flu leads. Over the following weeks and months it evolved into a structured daily command and control document where new information and actions were clearly identified and the audience swelled to over 700 people across the NHS in London, partner organisations and wider stakeholders. Yet there was no slowing down or altering of any plans for Michael to go there with his children and live and breathe for months :icon_evil: No one can convince me that the event planners didn’t know the danger associated with having Michael go to London during this crisis. And from what we’ve been told, some were mean to him and strong arming him which further exacerbates someone’s fear. Well mine anyway. There was mention that the footage used in This Is It was footage from rehearsals over the 3 days prior to June 25th. I have always believed that the practice held at the Staples Center on June 22nd was the big one; the one attended by security and other unidentified onlookers. This was reported by one of the This Is It dancers. AEG apparently was not willing to lose their money and would not release Michael from his commitment regardless of the threat that loomed in London. So he was packed I’ve heard and ready to roll. Well he rolled all right, :smiley-vault-misc-150: and the rest is History - past, present, and future.I don’t have any proof of what or how Michael thought or felt. I’m basing all of this on what seems to me the natural thought process if it were me and I had felt threatened. Would I try to get out of it by any means necessary. Damn right I would. Don’t know if I’d have enough clout or money to fake my death but I know I could fake crazy :icon_lol: and they would be taking me out in a strait jacket.I believe that not only was Michael concerned about his own health and well being, but also all those people, his beloved fans who would put themselves and their lives at risk just to see him. I don’t see him allowing that to happen. I believe that once this became a known pandemic, he decided to make his This Is It 0-2 Arena practice into This Is It the world renowned critically acclaimed masterpiece that it turned out to be. No one had to risk life or well being to see it. He gave it to us as a gift. So the hoax began a little early. I think... :icon_geek: [....]Excellent post! :th_bravo:You are not allowed to view links. Register or LoginNow you can call me crazy, delusional, or what ever fits :LolLolLolLol: it’s okay. I’ve been called worse since I became a hoax investigator for this Michael Jackson Death Hoax. I’ve put on my rhinoceros skin and I can take it. So bring it on :michael_jackson-1135: lolll :icon_lol:You're definitely NOT crazy!!You have a brilliant mind!
[. . . ]Let me clarify better what I mean when I say his life was in danger. When Michael was approached to do the 0-2 Arena concerts, I do believe that he intended to do the 10 shows. I really do. But I also think that he had a change of heart when they kept upping his commitment until it reached 50. Somewhere I read that he agreed finally to 31. If he did, I don’t think he did so cheerfully. However, in view of him having spoken on more than one occasion of someone or a few someones out to harm him, something occurred to me during this time that made me feel uneasy. During the time of all this planning for him to take up residence in London and do all these shows with millions of people in attendance, there was a pandemic outbreak of influenza being reported in London. They were in the middle of taking precautions to keep people away from crowded places where the germs could easily be carried and Michael whose immune system was already compromised, fit right smack in the middle of those more susceptible to acquiring this virus. Then the matter of the insurance policies with the clause specific to “if he dies during the contract” blah, blah, blah. Well hell, if it were me my first thought would be then why are you insisting that I go to live right in the heart of an outbreak of a pandemic that is relevant as we speak, when every one else is preparing to stay away' and not only are you adding shows but insuring me to the max should I “die” in the process? :icon_e_confused: I would wonder now, is this how you plan to get rid of me? Why are we not talking cancellation until further notice like after this thing or the threat of it has subsided? The first case of the Avian flu in London was reported on April 30 2009. By June 5, there were over 100 confirmed cases and on June 11 WHO signaled that the first pandemic of the 21st century was underway. People were being advised to keep children home from school and for others who were most vulnerable to stay away from large gatherings. large gatherings :WTF: How much larger a gathering could there be than a Michael Jackson concert times 50? One of the key mechanisms of communication used in London was the NHS London Noon Brief. This was first issued at 12.00 noon on 25 April 2009 as a simple, black and white Word document, to local NHS flu leads. Over the following weeks and months it evolved into a structured daily command and control document where new information and actions were clearly identified and the audience swelled to over 700 people across the NHS in London, partner organisations and wider stakeholders. Yet there was no slowing down or altering of any plans for Michael to go there with his children and live and breathe for months :icon_evil: No one can convince me that the event planners didn’t know the danger associated with having Michael go to London during this crisis. And from what we’ve been told, some were mean to him and strong arming him which further exacerbates someone’s fear. Well mine anyway. There was mention that the footage used in This Is It was footage from rehearsals over the 3 days prior to June 25th. I have always believed that the practice held at the Staples Center on June 22nd was the big one; the one attended by security and other unidentified onlookers. This was reported by one of the This Is It dancers. AEG apparently was not willing to lose their money and would not release Michael from his commitment regardless of the threat that loomed in London. So he was packed I’ve heard and ready to roll. Well he rolled all right, :smiley-vault-misc-150: and the rest is History - past, present, and future.I don’t have any proof of what or how Michael thought or felt. I’m basing all of this on what seems to me the natural thought process if it were me and I had felt threatened. Would I try to get out of it by any means necessary. Damn right I would. Don’t know if I’d have enough clout or money to fake my death but I know I could fake crazy :icon_lol: and they would be taking me out in a strait jacket.I believe that not only was Michael concerned about his own health and well being, but also all those people, his beloved fans who would put themselves and their lives at risk just to see him. I don’t see him allowing that to happen. I believe that once this became a known pandemic, he decided to make his This Is It 0-2 Arena practice into This Is It the world renowned critically acclaimed masterpiece that it turned out to be. No one had to risk life or well being to see it. He gave it to us as a gift. So the hoax began a little early. I think... :icon_geek: [....]
Now you can call me crazy, delusional, or what ever fits :LolLolLolLol: it’s okay. I’ve been called worse since I became a hoax investigator for this Michael Jackson Death Hoax. I’ve put on my rhinoceros skin and I can take it. So bring it on :michael_jackson-1135:
Quote from: IWantYouBack[...]You see at the beginning of This Is It that the dancers are in tears because they have almost realized their dream which was to perform live alongside Michael. Knowing how loving Michael is, and knowing how much he cares about the people of our world, why would Michael not allow for their dream to come true? [...]this is the way I see this: The dancers are actors and part of the hoax. They got paid for their job. And the tears were fake.
But on the other hand, that MIGHT NOT BE MJ. I still hold out the possibility that there were more then one MJ staring in that interview. The differences ARE stark. I don't see how that could have all been him and I don't see how it couldN'T have been all him. It freaks me out and I don't know which way to go with the whole thing.
Re: the Blanket scene in the Bashir interview, I don't like it either, but mostly because MJ is genuinely PISSED OFF and trying really super hard to keep it together. It bothers me, I want to tell him, you know what? It's alright, we will finish this later. Man, geezus, let the poor guy off the hook. He's obviously having a moment.
Excellent synopsis, Aussie.
Sorry to "barge" into your discussion with Aussie, but I really feel like answering to some of your comments.
this is the way I see this: The dancers are actors and part of the hoax. They got paid for their job. And the tears were fake.
They didn't even have to be IN on it. The costume designers made the costumes and they were paid. It's none of their business what happens to the costumes after that. I rather doubt they were depressed because Michael didn't do the TII concerts with their costumes on. I think they were rather happy spending or investing the thousands of dollars (I'm just guessing) that they got for making them!
Maybe the point is not for them to make you believe in them , but for you to try harder to understand who they really are and what they're trying to tell us --> the MESSAGE JMO!
So what you're asking is in fact a BAM. A BAM is not a clue. A BAM would mean the end of the hoax. That moment is still YET to come. Until then, we've received a LOT of BLUNT "in-yo-face" CLUES and confirmations from the family regarding both TS and Front.But as I said, I think it's up to us to find them and understand them. It's not up to them to "make us believe in them".
But we DO know the causes, reasons WHY he faked his death, amongst which: EOW, the Planet being endangered, real Justice clearing his name and image, etc.... These are just a few of the reasons which indicate us that there's got to be a BAM for them to be FINALIZED.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Logini personally believe he actually never intended to do the concerts. (again JMO, and i could also be wrong) rather, just act like it was going to go ahead.I definitely see what you're getting at and I respect your opinion. But, the only thing that bothers me with this point of view is the dancers. Let's say for a minute that you're correct and that this is what Michael planned. You see at the beginning of This Is It that the dancers are in tears because they have almost realized their dream which was to perform live alongside Michael. Knowing how loving Michael is, and knowing how much he cares about the people of our world, why would Michael not allow for their dream to come true? Why would Michael tell them that he is looking for dancers to perform in front of live audiences with knowing that it wasn't going to happen? I think that would be a little cruel, unless the dancers were in on it and were doing some pretty incredible acting in the first scenes of This Is It. And although the issue with the dancers is my main complaint about this point of view that you have, the same goes for Kenny Ortega, the background singers, and especially the costume designers. In the This Is It credits, you see that Zaldi is creating a spectacular outfit for Michael by HAND. Michael put him to work on this knowing it was never going to happen - that just doesn't sound like something Michael would do. But, as I said before, every person involved in This Is It could be in on it, but it's unlikely in my opinion.
i personally believe he actually never intended to do the concerts. (again JMO, and i could also be wrong) rather, just act like it was going to go ahead.
Regarding Front and TS, I truly believe that no matter what, you can't trust everybody to the fullest. I WANT to believe that Front is Michael and/or that TS and Front know for sure that Michael is going to BAM, but I just don't know for sure and therefore I can't trust them fully. I'm not saying they're wrong, I'm just saying that they haven't given me enough to make me fully believe in what they're saying. If Front posted up a picture of Michael unedited - a picture we have never, ever seen before with a sentence like "See guys? I'm Michael! You have to believe me! And to make you believe me, I will tell you something about Jermaine no one else knows! *Insert shocking Jermaine secret here*" then I would gain more belief, but that hasn't happened yet to my knowledge.
Regarding Jermaine, Latoya, Paris and the rest of the clues given by people in Michael's inner circle, while they are interesting, I don't think they all point to a BAM - I think they more or less point to Michael being alive, but not a for sure comeback. For example, when Latoya told all of us to watch "The Illusionist", I watched it, but at the end, we see Eisenheim living a happy life with his lover without coming back to being the world's greatest illusionist. That clue, in my opinion, points to Michael being alive, but does not point to a BAM.
Also, you'd think that if Michael has had SO many death threats throughout his life that he would never call Dieter and leave a voice mail about it. Don't you think that for Michael to literally pick up the phone and call a close friend of his at 2 AM he must have been pretty worried about it?
...... and as bec said - (not verbatim) cheesy cheesy interviews. staged for sure.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or LoginYou are not allowed to view links. Register or Logini personally believe he actually never intended to do the concerts. (again JMO, and i could also be wrong) rather, just act like it was going to go ahead.I definitely see what you're getting at and I respect your opinion. But, the only thing that bothers me with this point of view is the dancers. Let's say for a minute that you're correct and that this is what Michael planned. You see at the beginning of This Is It that the dancers are in tears because they have almost realized their dream which was to perform live alongside Michael. Knowing how loving Michael is, and knowing how much he cares about the people of our world, why would Michael not allow for their dream to come true? Why would Michael tell them that he is looking for dancers to perform in front of live audiences with knowing that it wasn't going to happen? I think that would be a little cruel, unless the dancers were in on it and were doing some pretty incredible acting in the first scenes of This Is It. And although the issue with the dancers is my main complaint about this point of view that you have, the same goes for Kenny Ortega, the background singers, and especially the costume designers. In the This Is It credits, you see that Zaldi is creating a spectacular outfit for Michael by HAND. Michael put him to work on this knowing it was never going to happen - that just doesn't sound like something Michael would do. But, as I said before, every person involved in This Is It could be in on it, but it's unlikely in my opinion.I get what you are saying, that it would be cruel and un-Michael. But then again IWUB, the same similar argument could be said about the millions upon millions upon millions of devestated fans when MJ "died" on 25.06.09 - which we know he didnt. My point being that to get what needed to be done, done, there had to be some collateral. MJ can't protect and ensure everyones feelings and emotions aren't hurt, otherwise DH would simply not be possible. Same with TII - They were playing a role. They may want to dance with MJ, but then again so does every other good dancer on the planet. And the reality is, its just not going to happen. However to be commissioned / paid for your role as a dancer along side MJ in the filming of TII is just as good if not better, because its not merely a concert, they are privledged to be involved in a historical never done before (to this scale) event for their dancing / music idol.and as bec said - (not verbatim) cheesy cheesy interviews. staged for sure.