Please Michael, go to the light and leave those women alone!

[Shamone Jackson]

If you think about it, she was selfish.  Probably thought she could have him all to herself. She waited a whole year to contact Souza.

But imo, I don't think this person is mental.  I think it's someone that made it all up and hoped Souza would post the pm in the forum so they could read the responses.  They're probably having a laugh.  :lol:

[~Souza~]

If you think about it, she was selfish.  Probably thought she could have him all to herself. She waited a whole year to contact Souza.

But imo, I don't think this person is mental.  I think it's someone that made it all up and hoped Souza would post the pm in the forum so they could read the responses.  They're probably having a laugh.  :lol:

That's exactly what I think.

@MJonmind: I am not a JW but I have been reading a lot about the beliefs of JW's lately, and I think that JW's believe in 'soul sleep', which means that your soul will be in an unconsious state until the end of the world, where everyone will be resurrected and judged out of the book of life. It means any ghost people might have seen, is never human (since human souls have no consiousness) but either angelic or demonic (fallen angels). Correct me if I'm wrong Aussie.

[marumjj]

In my opinion, this woman really believes what he wrote, I think it has a firm thinking about what happens after death. Lamenteblemente to me, that will remain as an anecdote because you never really know what happens after death. Recently it has been a relative of mine, and I think a lot about death. I can only say I hope that those who die at peace and no longer suffer. God grant that this woman also find peace in your life.  bearhug

[BeTheChange]

Mike...the light will always be lit for you.

With L.O.V.E. always.

[MJonmind]

If you think about it, she was selfish.  Probably thought she could have him all to herself. She waited a whole year to contact Souza.

But imo, I don't think this person is mental.  I think it's someone that made it all up and hoped Souza would post the pm in the forum so they could read the responses.  They're probably having a laugh.  :lol:

That's exactly what I think.

@MJonmind: I am not a JW but I have been reading a lot about the beliefs of JW's lately, and I think that JW's believe in 'soul sleep', which means that your soul will be in an unconsious state until the end of the world, where everyone will be resurrected and judged out of the book of life. It means any ghost people might have seen, is never human (since human souls have no consiousness) but either angelic or demonic (fallen angels). Correct me if I'm wrong Aussie.

Thanks Souza.  I'm not JW either, and I grew up in Evangelical Christianity (conservative orthodox).  However I came to the same belief as hers in the area of soul-sleep in my own independant Bible study ( very extensive study of some of the best Bible teachers online as well as Scripture itself)  I asked Aussie what her take on ghosts were because I simply don't know. They seem so mysterious.  I believe there could very likely be species of spirits (angels/demons) just like there are species of fish, insects and apes--all created by God.  I just don't know.  Some say they're from another atomic dimension co-existing with us.  All I know for sure is that if you take ALL Scripture in its entirety, it teaches soul-sleep, not going to heaven/hell in spirit form after death.

[bindupbrokenhearted]

If you think about it, she was selfish.  Probably thought she could have him all to herself. She waited a whole year to contact Souza.

But imo, I don't think this person is mental.  I think it's someone that made it all up and hoped Souza would post the pm in the forum so they could read the responses.  They're probably having a laugh.  :lol:

That's exactly what I think.

@MJonmind: I am not a JW but I have been reading a lot about the beliefs of JW's lately, and I think that JW's believe in 'soul sleep', which means that your soul will be in an unconsious state until the end of the world, where everyone will be resurrected and judged out of the book of life. It means any ghost people might have seen, is never human (since human souls have no consiousness) but either angelic or demonic (fallen angels). Correct me if I'm wrong Aussie.

Thanks Souza.  I'm not JW either, and I grew up in Evangelical Christianity (conservative orthodox).  However I came to the same belief as hers in the area of soul-sleep in my own independant Bible study ( very extensive study of some of the best Bible teachers online as well as Scripture itself)  I asked Aussie what her take on ghosts were because I simply don't know. They seem so mysterious.  I believe there could very likely be species of spirits (angels/demons) just like there are species of fish, insects and apes--all created by God.  I just don't know.  Some say they're from another atomic dimension co-existing with us.  All I know for sure is that if you take ALL Scripture in its entirety, it teaches soul-sleep, not going to heaven/hell in spirit form after death.

Here is the another perspective on that:
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You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

To each his own.  With peace and love

As far as ghosts, I think they are demons, but JMHO.

[Liberian Girl Heehee]

I'm gonna be
Exactly what you wanna see
It's you whose haunting me
Your warning me
To be the stranger
In your life

Am I amusing you
Or just confusing you
Am I the beast
You visualised
And if you wanna to see
Eccentrialities
I'll be grotesque
Before your eyes

Let them all materialize

Is that scary for you baby
Am I scary for you oh
Is it scary for you baby
Is it scary for you

That's what I think...

[bec]

You think you're by yourself,
but it's my touch you felt,
I'm not a ghost from hell,
but I got a spell on you,

Your worst nightmare,
it's me I'm everywhere,
In one blink I'll disappear,
and then I'll come back to haunt you.

Sounds like a really crappy boyfriend. You know the kind.

[Australian MJ BeLIEver]

@mjonmind and others who are interested...

JWs believe that ghosts of dead loved ones are actually demons. the reasoning behind this is that the bible indicates that from "dust you are made and to dust you shall return", (when one dies) this scripture for those not familiar is in gen.3:19. - all bibles say this.

furthermore, the bible indicates that man is waiting in "hades" or "sheol" in an unconscious state. Ecclesiastes 9:5 says "For the living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they any more have wages, because the remembrance of them has been forgotten" - NWT.

Sheol, or Hades, is not a literal place in a specific location. Rather, it is the common grave of dead mankind, the figurative location where most of mankind sleep in death. dead humans wait unconcious, in the common grave until the ressurection to paradise earth, which is after armageddon. meaning they dont go to heaven and dont go to hell. rather they simply dont exist anymore except in gods memory until the appointed time when he raises the dead to an earthly ressurection. this is described in revelation 1:18 "christ having the keys to death and hades" and john 5:28 "all those in the memorial tombs will come out" and acts 25:14 which says "there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous"  (i encourage those who are interested to look at these scriptures in their own bibles)


so then, this then begs the question, what of the ghosts and interactions with supposed 'crossed over - dead loved ones" via apparitions, ghosts, seances, spirit mediums, and other appearances or messages from people who have died.

JWs reason that since the bible clearly indicates that the dead are consious of nothing, these spirits or ghosts are demons who are charading as dead loved ones. they sneakily get people who are emotional, greving and vulenerable to speak and interact with them. unbeknownst to the person who is speaking with their 'dead loved one' they are getting involved with spiritism. yet they think it is somehting beautiful, communicating with someone they love. 2 corinthians.11:14 - "satan transforms himself into an angel of light". (meaning somthing that appears beautiful) and revelation 12.7-17 - "satan and his demons are cast own of heaven and down to earth"  and Job 1:6 "satan roaving around the earth like a lion seeking to devour"

the demons pose as dead loved ones, (not much unlike satan posed as a talking serpent in eden to decieve eve) because as long as people think they are doing something harmless and speaking with their dead loved ones - they are partaking of the table of the demons. they do this to keep people away from god. i know this is a sensitive subject, as many who have lost loved ones feel they are doing a beautiful thing by trying to communicate with loved ones who have died. but as the bible says in 1 corinthians 10:21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons too; you cannot have a part in both the Lord's table and the table of demons - new international version.

1 Samuel 28:7-12, I Corinthians 15:39-40, I Timothy 4:1, Matthew 12:43, I Corinthians 12:20. Are just some examples of Ghosts and demons that God warns the human world to stay away from.

the demons were cast out of heaven. they live on the earth amongst us. explains why the world is so demonic and evil. it is inspired by satan and his fallen angels. they seek to mislead us from god via various methods. astrology, fortune telling, palm reading, spiritism, outright satan worship and sadly the more subtle, speaking with those loved ones who have 'crossed over' etc etc.

i hope this helps. again, want to say i am not belittlling anyone elses beliefs in heaven or hell or ghosts, etc. but this is what JWs believe based on the bible.  respect/


peace and love to all

[Australian MJ BeLIEver]

If you think about it, she was selfish.  Probably thought she could have him all to herself. She waited a whole year to contact Souza.

But imo, I don't think this person is mental.  I think it's someone that made it all up and hoped Souza would post the pm in the forum so they could read the responses.  They're probably having a laugh.  :lol:

That's exactly what I think.

@MJonmind: I am not a JW but I have been reading a lot about the beliefs of JW's lately, and I think that JW's believe in 'soul sleep', which means that your soul will be in an unconsious state until the end of the world, where everyone will be resurrected and judged out of the book of life. It means any ghost people might have seen, is never human (since human souls have no consiousness) but either angelic or demonic (fallen angels). Correct me if I'm wrong Aussie.

didnt see your post. correct this is what we believe. the scriptures i have included in my post are the basis for the understanding that we have arrived at.

[thrillerdancinmachine]

WTF ?
 mj_bad/
Michael has been getting these kinds of letters since he was 11 years old, he just has that affect on people who are looking for something they are missing in their lives. So I think he's enjoying getting energy from his fans, WHEREVER he is. He said he never wanted to die. He may be more earthbound than that woman knows, heeheehee.

There was a comment putting people who are educated on the subject of Jesus and rational enough to not blindly believe that such a person every historically existed -- like me, most scientists, the Founding Fathers, most of the people in the world, tons and tons of the top intellects and achievers in history, all indegenous people of this land, and African tribes -- in the same category with that woman who wrote Souza about MJ's energy-sucking adventures. I hardly think that is a comparison that has any merit. People who illogically and fanatically cling to belief in a mythical figure in spite of there not being any evidence to support that figure's historical existence would be the more obvious parallel. That's like believing MJ was a child molester in spite of the total lack of evidence when the accusers were proven liars, or believing MJ swallowed propofol and died in the 2 minutes CRM pretends he was out of the room, or believing we are the only planet capable of sustaining life, or believing 19 hijackers with boxcutters (who are still alive, BTW) carried off 911 without the help of Dick Cheney, or believing everything the government tells you.
I am part native, as is MJ, and our ancestors' traditions tell us we CAME FROM THE STAR PEOPLE. That's why Michael is so OUT OF THIS WORLD!

[voiceforthesilent]

@mjonmind and others who are interested...

JWs believe that ghosts of dead loved ones are actually demons. the reasoning behind this is that the bible indicates that from "dust you are made and to dust you shall return", (when one dies) this scripture for those not familiar is in gen.3:19. - all bibles say this.

furthermore, the bible indicates that man is waiting in "hades" or "sheol" in an unconscious state. Ecclesiastes 9:5 says "For the living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they any more have wages, because the remembrance of them has been forgotten" - NWT.

Sheol, or Hades, is not a literal place in a specific location. Rather, it is the common grave of dead mankind, the figurative location where most of mankind sleep in death. dead humans wait unconcious, in the common grave until the ressurection to paradise earth, which is after armageddon. meaning they dont go to heaven and dont go to hell. rather they simply dont exist anymore except in gods memory until the appointed time when he raises the dead to an earthly ressurection. this is described in revelation 1:18 "christ having the keys to death and hades" and john 5:28 "all those in the memorial tombs will come out" and acts 25:14 which says "there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous"  (i encourage those who are interested to look at these scriptures in their own bibles)


so then, this then begs the question, what of the ghosts and interactions with supposed 'crossed over - dead loved ones" via apparitions, ghosts, seances, spirit mediums, and other appearances or messages from people who have died.

JWs reason that since the bible clearly indicates that the dead are consious of nothing, these spirits or ghosts are demons who are charading as dead loved ones. they sneakily get people who are emotional, greving and vulenerable to speak and interact with them. unbeknownst to the person who is speaking with their 'dead loved one' they are getting involved with spiritism. yet they think it is somehting beautiful, communicating with someone they love. 2 corinthians.11:14 - "satan transforms himself into an angel of light". (meaning somthing that appears beautiful) and revelation 12.7-17 - "satan and his demons are cast own of heaven and down to earth"  and Job 1:6 "satan roaving around the earth like a lion seeking to devour"

the demons pose as dead loved ones, (not much unlike satan posed as a talking serpent in eden to decieve eve) because as long as people think they are doing something harmless and speaking with their dead loved ones - they are partaking of the table of the demons. they do this to keep people away from god. i know this is a sensitive subject, as many who have lost loved ones feel they are doing a beautiful thing by trying to communicate with loved ones who have died. but as the bible says in 1 corinthians 10:21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons too; you cannot have a part in both the Lord's table and the table of demons - new international version.

1 Samuel 28:7-12, I Corinthians 15:39-40, I Timothy 4:1, Matthew 12:43, I Corinthians 12:20. Are just some examples of Ghosts and demons that God warns the human world to stay away from.

the demons were cast out of heaven. they live on the earth amongst us. explains why the world is so demonic and evil. it is inspired by satan and his falled angels. they seek to mislead us from god via various methods. astrology, fortune telling, palm reading, spiritism, outright satan worship, speaking with those who have 'crossed over' etc etc.

i hope this helps. again, want to say i am not belittlling anyone elses beliefs in heaven or hell or ghosts, etc. but this is what JWs believe based on the bible.  respect/


peace and love to all

This is incredibly solid and easy to understand - thank you for sharing this.

Just so happens that my faith believes exactly the same thing and I am not JW. In fact, one might say we are almost opposites. I guess that isn't true when it comes to spirits and demons.

Blessings to you

[~Souza~]

WTF ?
 mj_bad/
Michael has been getting these kinds of letters since he was 11 years old, he just has that affect on people who are looking for something they are missing in their lives. So I think he's enjoying getting energy from his fans, WHEREVER he is. He said he never wanted to die. He may be more earthbound than that woman knows, heeheehee.

There was a comment putting people who are educated on the subject of Jesus and rational enough to not blindly believe that such a person every historically existed -- like me, most scientists, the Founding Fathers, most of the people in the world, tons and tons of the top intellects and achievers in history, all indegenous people of this land, and African tribes -- in the same category with that woman who wrote Souza about MJ's energy-sucking adventures. I hardly think that is a comparison that has any merit. People who illogically and fanatically cling to belief in a mythical figure in spite of there not being any evidence to support that figure's historical existence would be the more obvious parallel. That's like believing MJ was a child molester in spite of the total lack of evidence when the accusers were proven liars, or believing MJ swallowed propofol and died in the 2 minutes CRM pretends he was out of the room, or believing we are the only planet capable of sustaining life, or believing 19 hijackers with boxcutters (who are still alive, BTW) carried off 911 without the help of Dick Cheney, or believing everything the government tells you.
I am part native, as is MJ, and our ancestors' traditions tell us we CAME FROM THE STAR PEOPLE. That's why Michael is so OUT OF THIS WORLD!

No historical evidence that Jesus really existed? That's not true. There is more historical evidence that Jesus existed than many other people in history. Here is an interview with a historian who is NOT a christian:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdqJyk-dtLs[/youtube]

[thrillerdancinmachine]

"JWs believe that ghosts of dead loved ones are actually demons. the reasoning behind this is that the bible indicates that from "dust you are made and to dust you shall return", (when one dies) this scripture for those not familiar is in gen.3:19. - all bibles say this."

I am pretty sure Michael got away from the JWs after Thriller. That was the religion he was raised in, but they were not real happy with him making Thriller, thus the disclaimer he put at the beginning about not believing in the occult. He grew up and out of it, like he grew out of the Jackson 5 and Joseph's controlling his career. And he became his own person.

[Australian MJ BeLIEver]

That's like believing MJ was a child molester in spite of the total lack of evidence when the accusers were proven liars

the two things are completely different and the comparrison doesnt even come close to relevant. no offence, JMO.

some articles of interest for you may be the historical writtings of josephus, dating back from a mere 40 years after jesus existed where he was able to record first hand experiences similar to what are noted in the bible. click here: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

in addition, the tax census of the time which parallels bible records is an interesting read. click here: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

another point is his chronology dates back to the line of king david and even beyond. to early israel, many of these bible characters that are the forefathers of chirst have been noted in archological finds. it might just take some research locating them.

there are a plethora of other facts, reasons, proofs.. but here are three to start you off.