Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators

Hoax Investigation => General Hoax Investigation => Other Odd Things => Topic started by: bec on November 29, 2009, 02:44:22 PM

Title: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: bec on November 29, 2009, 02:44:22 PM
From the old forum, Shikster brought up the no defib argument. Not only was there no defib present at MJs house, despite the fact that Dr. Murray is a cardiologist, but also Dr. Murray refused to allow EMTs to defib MJ at the scene or on the way to the hospital.

Why would this be? If it truly was MJ's dead body laying there and Dr. Murray indeed believed he was facing manslaughter charges, what justification is there for not zapping that corpse into next week?
This simple fact alone makes me believe either we have MJ in make up playing dead on the bed, or an extremely realitstic Hollywood style dummy that Dr. Murray was afraid would catch on fire or melt.

(Originally posted 8-4-09, brought here because I think it's an important bit for folks to remember, especially considering recent Dr. Murray events in the news. Since I posted this on MJKit, I have disregarded the dummy theory. Just an example of what further research can begin to reveal to you if you remain focused on common sense and logic.)
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: SPAKKLE29FUL on November 29, 2009, 02:48:02 PM
well as far as im concerned there was no real doctor present either :lol:
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: Crescendo on November 29, 2009, 02:49:38 PM
thats what i was thinking. but i have a relative who is an Emt. he says debribulator are for shocking the heart back into rhythm so maybe the Dr. didnt find use for it. i have no idea. i wish i had some kinda medical experience.

didnt they say Michael had a faint pulse? how come he didnt give him oxygen?
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: MJFOREVER on November 29, 2009, 02:53:51 PM
He refused it :shock:  i didnt know that at all:P well hes a fake doctor anyway :lol:  HOAXXXX :P
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: lisap27 on November 29, 2009, 02:58:16 PM
well IMO there's definatly something a miss here!! if the Dr refused the de-fib then he had reason.. like u said a dummy, or not MJ, or someone acting dead!!

this brings me to the Dr definatly knowing that he was not going to get blamed for the death of MJ.. otherwise.. PANIC STATIONS all round de-fibbing so to speak left right an centre!!

this is a positive for us investigators i think!!!
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: Alem (Thetruth) on November 29, 2009, 03:15:14 PM
Dr Murray use this product to check Michael's heartbeat/pulse:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse_oximeter (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse_oximeter)
Wow, I would feel safe having that one! Screw ECG....  :x
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: Nathalia on November 29, 2009, 03:21:40 PM
If I had a nickel for all the nonsensical occurrences that seem to spew from Conrad Murray,
I could probably pay for college..
 :lol:
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: SPAKKLE29FUL on November 29, 2009, 03:27:49 PM
Quote from: "Nathalia"
If I had a nickel for all the nonsensical occurrences that seem to spew from Conrad Murray,
I could probably pay for college..
 :lol:
or pay his baby mama :lol:  :lol:
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: alive on November 29, 2009, 03:44:44 PM
Well, if you believe them, according to Murrary and nurse at hospital, his heart was still beating but he wasn't breathing, so I guess you wouldn't use a defib.  IDK
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: lisap27 on November 29, 2009, 03:52:54 PM
Quote from: "alive"
Well, if you believe them, according to Murrary and nurse at hospital, his heart was still beating but he wasn't breathing, so I guess you wouldn't use a defib.  IDK

i dunno but if this would the case then would you do CPR?? and work on him for over an hour!! i've read loads of stuff on CPR an everyone is different!!

i'm just confused!!  :?
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: Nathalia on November 29, 2009, 04:04:29 PM
Quote from: "SPAKKLE29FUL"
Quote from: "Nathalia"
If I had a nickel for all the nonsensical occurrences that seem to spew from Conrad Murray,
I could probably pay for college..
 :lol:
or pay his baby mama :lol:  :lol:

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:
very true! i hear she really needs the money, rotfl!!!
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: Crescendo on November 29, 2009, 04:12:53 PM
Quote from: "alive"
Well, if you believe them, according to Murrary and nurse at hospital, his heart was still beating but he wasn't breathing, so I guess you wouldn't use a defib.  IDK



so in one instance he knew a defib wasnt needed for the situation though he doesnt know how to administer CPR properly. is he a real doctor or not? sheesh.. lol
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: GirlInTheMirror on November 29, 2009, 05:07:00 PM
Another thing that doesn´t add up...
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: CC on November 30, 2009, 03:48:25 PM
PROPOFOL http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propofol (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propofol)
WHAT DO YOU THINK?
"supply of supplemental oxygen, artificial ventilation and cardiovascular resuscitation are not available"
MAYBE THE DOCTORS MUST USE SOME ANTIDOT, OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT KNOWING THAT WAS PROPOFOL, I READ SOMETHING ABOUT THAT OF A DOCTOR MOUTH....
AND THE AMBULANCE PICTURE??? :roll:  :?:
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: angelshadow on November 30, 2009, 03:54:22 PM
With the picture of Michael's supposed "death bed" in the media was, there was an aerial bag with instructions ....... what this should Murray must the instruction before study ... the guy is impossibly a doctor...


Sorry my English, I not always knows like one says a little bit properly :oops:
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: Lou on November 30, 2009, 04:54:38 PM
Quote from: "alive"
Well, if you believe them, according to Murrary and nurse at hospital, his heart was still beating but he wasn't breathing, so I guess you wouldn't use a defib.  IDK

Hello,
I'm still a student in the health area, but as far as I know, if that was the case, he needed ventilation first, that is, before CPR or defibrilation.

Quote from: "CC"
"supply of supplemental oxygen, artificial ventilation and cardiovascular resuscitation are not available"
MAYBE THE DOCTORS MUST USE SOME ANTIDOT, OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT KNOWING THAT WAS PROPOFOL, I READ SOMETHING ABOUT THAT OF A DOCTOR MOUTH....

I've heard about the antidote too...
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: neverlandprincess on November 30, 2009, 05:18:04 PM
It is my understanding-as far as that goes-that the Doc would be in trouble for not allowing a defid-and even if he is the doctor blah blah,the paramedics JOB would be to defib...right? I mean I thought protocol WAS to "do everything you possibly can" so that ,even if you know there is no hope,that you can tell the family you did all you could do...this aint right-and if its true it is soooo bad if somebody really died,they should already have him locked up.
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: mumof3 on November 30, 2009, 05:22:24 PM
it does not add up there was no panic in the voices and why didnt they say who they were dealing with was it security reasons i dont know
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: neverlandprincess on November 30, 2009, 05:31:10 PM
Quote from: "mumof3"
it does not add up there was no panic in the voices and why didnt they say who they were dealing with was it security reasons i dont know
Just kindling on the fire that screams "Nothing is right here!
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: Crescendo on November 30, 2009, 08:21:21 PM
Can someone do time or be in any legal trouble for not administering CPR properly?

I mean he said that he did on the bed. SERIOUSLY??
instead of calling 911 he first administered CPR even when he didnt know how?

did the 911 call come before Cpr or vice versa?
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: Lou on December 21, 2009, 06:08:32 PM
Quote from: "Crescendo"
Can someone do time or be in any legal trouble for not administering CPR properly?

I mean he said that he did on the bed. SERIOUSLY??
instead of calling 911 he first administered CPR even when he didnt know how?

did the 911 call come before Cpr or vice versa?
According to protocol, 911 is the first thing to be done.
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: DontBelieveTheHype on December 21, 2009, 06:22:45 PM
He performed CPR on a soft bed and he left him dead for hours making phone calls, he refused to use a defibrulator at the scene of death and then takes off in a car and refuses to sign the death certfiticate. Wow.. Thats like.. the recipe for death...  ;) I mean a hoax..  ;)
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: THE JACKSONOLOGIST on December 21, 2009, 06:35:13 PM
Ok....here goes.

To the best of my knowledge, if a heart is still beating then you DO NOT use a defib, because that can actually STOP the heart completely. BUT, my bro in law was rushed to the hospital the other day with a racing heart of 180/130 or something and they actually defibbed him in the ambie to slow his heart down and it worked without killing him.
I think if you use a defib on someone with a normal to very slow heartbeat, you can stop the heart..........Im not a dr so dont quote me on this.
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: lisap27 on December 21, 2009, 06:41:45 PM
on a documentry i watched before it had the 911 call.. or a version of it should we say.. and the operator asked the security guard

"was he on the floor.. "
"no"
"well get him on the floor"

and obviously they still didn't so it!! also i'm not sure who said it.. said that Murray had one hand underneath Michaels back an the other hand was on his chest doing chest compressions!! NOWAY!! is that possible!! they also commented on how a Dr should know how to do CPR properly.. And questioned why the security guard rang 911 and talked to the operator an not the DR..  :shock:
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: MJJ1982 on December 21, 2009, 06:42:28 PM
Quote from: "THE JACKSONOLOGIST"
Ok....here goes.

To the best of my knowledge, if a heart is still beating then you DO NOT use a defib, because that can actually STOP the heart completely. BUT, my bro in law was rushed to the hospital the other day with a racing heart of 180/130 or something and they actually defibbed him in the ambie to slow his heart down and it worked without killing him.
I think if you use a defib on someone with a normal to very slow heartbeat, you can stop the heart..........Im not a dr so dont quote me on this.

You are right, I have worked at a cardiac surgery department (don't know how to say in english ;) ) and I've seen it there a lot of times. They use it for example when someone has an irregular heart rhythm.
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: bec on December 21, 2009, 06:53:11 PM
Reports are that Murray was performing CPR, albeit with one arm and on a bed.

Additionally, reports were circulated that MJ had been "dead" for hours pre 911 call, that EMTs wanted to pronounce dead at the scene, that Murray overruled them and forced them to transport to the hospital....

... all rumors that to me seem designed to cover up inconsistancies such as:
-no emergency lights on the ambulance,
-slow driving,
-no life saving actions witnessed upon arrival to UCLA, no IV, no CPR, no rush,
-not signing the DEATH CERTIFICATE at UCLA but instead making it a coronor's case,
-no UCLA doc wanting to make a statement.....

SO.

WHY NO DEFIB THEN IF HE WAS SO "DEAD"???

Why aren't we zapping the crap out of the stiff? It's MICHAEL JACKSON...

These reports seem to want to have it both ways. Upon EMT arrival/UCLA addmission, he was "dead" enough to necessitate no hurry OR he was alive enough to require no defib.

We ARE being tested by this hoax. Are we going to believe what we hear in the news when it doesn't make any sense at all?
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: DontBelieveTheHype on December 21, 2009, 06:59:49 PM
Yep yep Bec!!!! They felt no need to recusitate him when he was at home.. But when he arrived at the hospital ''a team of doctors and nurses'' worked on him for over an hour. As Jermaine put it so nicely into words.  :?:
Title: Re: No defibrulator present on 6-25
Post by: Ninanina on December 21, 2009, 07:06:25 PM
How do we know, he refused that the paramedics used the defib? Who said that?
I'm pretty sure, they are not allowed to follow his instructions, unless they contribute.

And did we get a time of death from the coroner?
The last thing reported was, that he was dead for hours, when paramedics arrived, right?
That means - no faint pulse. Not for the paramedics, not for a nurse at the hospital - these would be false reports.

Just emailed Ed Winter about the time of death.

@bec - in the only moving footage of the arrival at UCLA, it looks like there's someone sitting on the stretcher to perform CPR. "It looks like" - well, the video is very blurry. I think tis_ruthy (is she here??) made a slowed down version of it.

That's my version of the footage. It's a bit quicker than Ruth's, but you still may see the right arm of the supposed EMT doing CPR in the second half of the vid.
[youtube:2ty82soc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLLZ0HDojsg[/youtube:2ty82soc]
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