Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators
Latest News => Michael Jackson News => Topic started by: Shout on January 11, 2010, 01:25:57 AM
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I was looking for other news as you know Michael can be really dead. I have found an interesting video on Youtube where CNN repoter says that an official statement is out from the UCLA. It came immediately into my mind that Jermaine maybe just read it out, but it doesn´t mean that it is not real.
I have another question to everybody from the USA can you please research wether it is true that ONLY officials can read out that a member of a family is dead or are there other possibilities... (please send a link if you know). It would be great to know. If there is any possibility that a family member can just read out an official statement from UCLA then we do not have a hoax. And maybe it is just a rumor that a family member cannot read out such an official statement. As I know Michaels death was established by officials and maybe we should pay more attention to that.
Here is the video I am talking about:
[youtube:3hsq475d]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W20ZSeypJ2A[/youtube:3hsq475d]
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If there is any possibility that a family member can just read out an official statement from UCLA then we do not have a hoax.
I wish I had the time to help with your research request, Shout. However, for now I'd like to point out that I don't follow the logic in the statement I've excerpted above.
Whether a family member can "just read out an official statement from UCLA" or not, that doesn't mean the statement has to be the truth. Of course, people assume it's the truth because it's supposedly an official statement.
But if Michael's death was faked with assistance from law enforcement or other officials with appropriate authority, there are several reasons why an untruthful official statement might be released, despite any existing laws or regulations governing official statements. One reason could be to keep the person or people who were endangering Michael's life from knowing they didn't succeed in killing him.
Deliberately lying about the situation and misleading the public would serve a higher purpose in that case, namely apprehending and (hopefully) convicting the person or people who posed a threat. Legal and criminal matters require that kind of manipulation of reality sometimes to achieve the best outcome. It happens fairly often on various levels, too, such as when undercover officers pretend to be people they aren't in order to gain the trust of crooks and catch them committing a crime.
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Thank you Lorrie I am well aware of the fact that it could also be true that Michael was threatened and that it is possible that he will be left alone, nevertheless I have big doubts about that he would now be left alone that those who wanted to kill him or something like that right now think: "Oh yes he is dead we cannot do anything".
The part with the misunderstanding. It was always said that there is no official statement whicht might be not true and what Jermaine has read out is nothing official, which is not true according to this video.
So in the news it was mentioned different.
To make it complete I just want to know wether it is possible for a member to read out an official statement or is it just a rumour that he cannot do it. Apart from that of course it is possible that they want us to believe everything (that the death is real) so they make it look real and if this is true so then my conclusion is that Jermaine could make that statement don´t you think that? I just jump on your way of agumentation...
So I am really curious about that point and woud like to know what is true. can someone help me please...
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There isn't any law that dictates whom may or may not read statements about a death from a hospital, if that's what you're asking. It's definitely unusual for Jermaine to have read that statement about MJ's "death." But it doesn't violate any laws.
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There isn't any law that dictates whom may or may not read statements about a death from a hospital, if that's what you're asking. It's definitely unusual for Jermaine to have read that statement about MJ's "death." But it doesn't violate any laws.
Yes that is what I wanted to know, just because it is unusual it does not mean he couldn´t do that. So this argumentation might be not so strong as many people want us to believe. Thank you for your answer it helps alot to find the truth.
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Hi Everyone, I've been only reading this forum for quite a while and would like to say hi to everyone reading this.
I don't buy into videos THAT much any longer, I like to look at things more closely. So, in this case it's the wording. On first glance it appears to be official, on second glance not at all.
Shout, I cannot recall ANY death statement of a celebrity that wasn't announced by a doctor up to this very day, as it HAS TO BE a doctor pronouncing someone dead. Think of Princess Diana. It was a doctor at the parisian hospital together with a bunch of other docs sitting in front of mics and talking to the press. On June 25, 09 I was expecting a doctor stating Michaels' death. I was a bit surprised it was Jermaine and on top of that I haven't seen any doctor in Jermaines' presence. Also did no doctor follow up Jermaines statement.
Also, I went to the press section of UCLAs Medical Center website sometime around August and there was a 'statement' by UCLA, that Michael died. BUT, UCLA MC solely referred to a statement made by the Jackson Family, that Michael had died. So, UCLA legally NEVER officially stated Michaels' death.
Concequently, IMHO there is still no official statement. Regardless of hoax or no hoax.
Kindly,
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Hm MFFreedom
First of all welcome in the active part and a warm hello from my side.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts about that topic. I really want to know the truth whether Michael is alive or not. But I also doubt that the hoax videos always present the truth(they might not be objective), that is why I want to research for myself to see where are contadictions regarding on what they "tell" us. I am of course very critical what is mentioned in the news but I feel the same with the hoax videos. The people who create that are claiming to be insiders, but they do not see everything. To stay critical is the only way to find out the truth, it doesn´t matter whether Michael is alive or not. We have to be honest to ourselves.
Just because it is very unusual it doesn´t mean it is not possible. Just because it is print (does not matter which side believers or nonbelievers) it doesn´t mean its the gospel!
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Do we have any proof that Jermaine was actually in UCLA at the time of the reading of the death statement? Surely if that was a real hospital there would be doctors surrounding him? Did we see the press journalists who were there? We saw microphones at the podium but that could easily be fake.
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Do we have any proof that Jermaine was actually in UCLA at the time of the reading of the death statement? Surely if that was a real hospital there would be doctors surrounding him? Did we see the press journalists who were there? We saw microphones at the podium but that could easily be fake.
Just because we did not see it, it does not mean it doesn´t exist. Have we seen Michaels children, Randy Philips, Frank Dileo etc. inside UCLA no, but it does not mean that they were not there...
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This whole thing just keeps getting more confusing. :(
I mean-
1)If this were true, why wouldn't UCLA's medical staff release an official statement backing up what Jermaine said?
2)If this were false, why wouldn't anyone on UCLA's medical staff deny what Jermaine said?
I was thinking "Witness Protection Program", but I doubt the CIA/FBI would be this sloppy and put Michael in danger by not convering their tracks better. (7 death certificates! unofficial official statement by the brother of the deceased)
But when I think it's just something Michael threw together, it seems too big with too many people needed to be involved for it to work.(UCLA to keep quiet, the police dept, DA, and coroner's office play along)
So, so confused. :?
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Do we have any proof that Jermaine was actually in UCLA at the time of the reading of the death statement? Surely if that was a real hospital there would be doctors surrounding him? Did we see the press journalists who were there? We saw microphones at the podium but that could easily be fake.
Michael Jackson's death was huge event, if i can put it like that. Everyone knew about it even while the doctors were still working on him in the hospital. If Jermaine didn't announce that in UCLA, and if those journalists were not real, i think you'd have a lot of hospital staff talking and real journalists (who know each other) wondering who actually was in there! If this was a hoax, i think you'd have planned a much simpler scenario than the one that is happening now. Shout has a very good point in posing his question. If people start along the lines of rationality they'll know pretty quickly what's strange and what's not.
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I also think it's a great pity that the actual details of the case are not discussed more. There is a section for the Murder theory....
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To be honest I would believe more if Conrad Murray confirmed MJ's death than Jermaine..
-But they who worked with Michael the last hour should confirmed it.. I don't buy family supporting :lol:
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Also, I went to the press section of UCLAs Medical Center website sometime around August and there was a 'statement' by UCLA, that Michael died. BUT, UCLA MC solely referred to a statement made by the Jackson Family, that Michael had died. So, UCLA legally NEVER officially stated Michaels' death.
Concequently, IMHO there is still no official statement. Regardless of hoax or no hoax
hi and welcome!! interesting first post!!
i haven't heard this before or maybe i've missed it in the past!! have you checked the site recently!! i find this massive if it still says the same!! that the jackson family confirmed Mike had died!! so to speak.. :shock:
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Also, I went to the press section of UCLAs Medical Center website sometime around August and there was a 'statement' by UCLA, that Michael died. BUT, UCLA MC solely referred to a statement made by the Jackson Family, that Michael had died. So, UCLA legally NEVER officially stated Michaels' death.
Concequently, IMHO there is still no official statement. Regardless of hoax or no hoax.
Kindly,
Please send a link.
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Here's the link. It's still up - just checked ;)
http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla/media-reports-that-michael-jackson-94914.aspx
I quote the first line:
The family of Michael Jackson made this brief statement available on June 25 at Ronald Reagan UCLA Medical Center:
The wording last year when I checked was similar to:
According to a statement by the family Jackson, Michael Jackson has died ... now it's the above. But it still is NOT a statement from UCLA MC.
Ergo: no official death statement.
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Here's the link. It's still up - just checked ;)
http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla/media-reports-that-michael-jackson-94914.aspx
I quote the first line:
The family of Michael Jackson made this brief statement available on June 25 at Ronald Reagan UCLA Medical Center:
The wording last year when I checked was similar to:
According to a statement by the family Jackson, Michael Jackson has died ... now it's the above. But it still is NOT a statement from UCLA MC.
Ergo: no official death statement.
I do not agree with you, just because a family member published it to the media (read out in the media the text which was official) it does not mean it is not official. I do well remember that CNN waited for an official acknowledgement before they have spread that Michael Jackson has died. And if a statement by a family member were invalid I am sure they would not have published that Michael Jackson is dead. They wouldn´t accepted it..It is just another point of view
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Quote:
"Die offizielle Bestätigung von Jacksons Tod kam auf CNN gegen 01:00 MESZ vom Sprecher des gerichtsmedizinischen Instituts in Los Angeles."
English: The official confirmation of Jackson's death came on CNN 01:00 AM CEST from the speaker of the Forensic Institute in Los Angeles.
Quelle/Source: http://www.78s.ch/2009/06/26/michael-ja ... z0cKNQ3YNy (http://www.78s.ch/2009/06/26/michael-jackson-tot/#ixzz0cKNQ3YNy)
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Shout, it's ok if you don't agree. I think you're searching too far.
So it came from CNN :roll: ... This so called 'official confirmation' doesn't impress me, as one can buy ANY officaliality if desired. The forensic dept. made this official statement' AFTER Jermaines 'Statement'. I want a doctor to state Michaels' death. Otherways I have to believe that just ANYBODY can pronounce anyone officially dead ... and it also doesn't impress me that it was the forensic department, as they can be bought ALSO, if desired. So, in my opinion, Michael still has not been pronounced dead. That's all I'm gonna say to this issue.
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Do we have the name of the actual doctor who pronounced MJ dead in the hospital. Supposedly they worked on MJ for an hour in the hospital. Who actually "called it".
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Do we have the name of the actual doctor who pronounced MJ dead in the hospital. Supposedly they worked on MJ for an hour in the hospital. Who actually "called it".
The woman physician in charge of the emergency room who treated MJ and spoke to Murray herself is Dr.R.Cooper - in the affidavit.
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ye ... kson1.html (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0824091jackson1.html)
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Have they released a police statement? Although I didnt see a police car in the area of MJ's house on June 25th, which is weird cus I know its standard procedure for the cops to show up to person in distress call...at least where I live it is.
Id like to see a police statement from any cop that was supposedly there that day....
Id also LOVE to see any video footage, even from a cell phone from any hospital staff that SAW MJ that day as well.....you know that if you worked at the hospital that MJ was taken into and you had a camera phone nearby, you would be filming it or at least take a pic. I know thats wrong but considering the magnitude of WHO mj is.. youd think SOMEONE would have a 15 second video of him.
But no one does....
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QuirkyDiana, Thank you for posting that info. I noticed it said "stament of probable cause". Is it not supposed to say "statement"? Unless "stament" is a legal word? If it's a deliberate typo then maybe it's not legitimate?
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Id like to see a police statement from any cop that was supposedly there that day....
Id also LOVE to see any video footage, even from a cell phone from any hospital staff that SAW MJ that day as well.....you know that if you worked at the hospital that MJ was taken into and you had a camera phone nearby, you would be filming it or at least take a pic. I know thats wrong but considering the magnitude of WHO mj is.. youd think SOMEONE would have a 15 second video of him.
But no one does....
this is what i have said all along.. they can't have give everyone GAG orders.. and i'm pretty sure someone would have come forward by now for their 15mins of fame!! seriously its things like this that get's me going!!! its so frustrating.. if someone would come forward it would shut us all up!!! grrrrrrr :evil:
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Do we have the name of the actual doctor who pronounced MJ dead in the hospital. Supposedly they worked on MJ for an hour in the hospital. Who actually "called it".
The woman physician in charge of the emergency room who treated MJ and spoke to Murray herself is Dr.R.Cooper - in the affidavit.
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ye ... kson1.html (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0824091jackson1.html)
On page 2 of the affidavit, http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ye ... kson2.html (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0824091jackson2.html), it says DR.R.COOPER PRONOUNCED JACKSON'S DEATH AT 14.26 HOURS.
An affidavit is a sworn statement of fact and it contains a verification meaning it is under oath or penalty of perjury. You will see at the beginnning of the affidavit it says; affiant declares under penalty of perjury that the following facts are true....
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Shout, it's ok if you don't agree. I think you're searching too far.
So it came from CNN :roll: ... This so called 'official confirmation' doesn't impress me, as one can buy ANY officaliality if desired. The forensic dept. made this official statement' AFTER Jermaines 'Statement'. I want a doctor to state Michaels' death. Otherways I have to believe that just ANYBODY can pronounce anyone officially dead ... and it also doesn't impress me that it was the forensic department, as they can be bought ALSO, if desired. So, in my opinion, Michael still has not been pronounced dead. That's all I'm gonna say to this issue.
I can kind of see your point about the statement not coming directly from UCLA or a doctor, it could be seen as UCLA absolving themselves of any responsibility. However, it is also entirely possible and understandable that someone from the Jackson family wanted to announce this to the world given the poignancy of his death. Does that make it any less true?
Also, do you doubt the veracity of the affidavit and the facts contained within it, and also the statement made by the coroner's office live on tv that they had completed the autopsy? I mean, if they officially say they completed the autopsy then that would quite obviously mean he's dead?
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Shout, it's ok if you don't agree. I think you're searching too far.
So it came from CNN :roll: ... This so called 'official confirmation' doesn't impress me, as one can buy ANY officaliality if desired. The forensic dept. made this official statement' AFTER Jermaines 'Statement'. I want a doctor to state Michaels' death. Otherways I have to believe that just ANYBODY can pronounce anyone officially dead ... and it also doesn't impress me that it was the forensic department, as they can be bought ALSO, if desired. So, in my opinion, Michael still has not been pronounced dead. That's all I'm gonna say to this issue.
I just have written that CNN waited for an official information (it does not mean that they have waited until Jermaine has read out a statement, I mean they could have contacted someone in the UCLA who has confirmed Michaels death, do you remember hom many reporters were in front of the UCLA hospital, maybe there was one of CNN staff who got official statement that Michael is gone) before they have published the news, not that it comes from CNN as an official source, but isn´t it striking at all that CNN waited until the officials have confirmed Michaels death and others have published it and did not wait and just published by chance...Hm...
Please don´t twist what I have written. Thank you
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[youtube:1v526bdl]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OM8RoDt39uQ[/youtube:1v526bdl]
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The guy in the video that Shout posted is LAPD Lt. Greg Strenk.
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QuirkyDiana thank you for the addition. I coudn´t understand it so good.
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Do we have the name of the actual doctor who pronounced MJ dead in the hospital. Supposedly they worked on MJ for an hour in the hospital. Who actually "called it".
The woman physician in charge of the emergency room who treated MJ and spoke to Murray herself is Dr.R.Cooper - in the affidavit.
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ye ... kson1.html (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0824091jackson1.html)
Dr. Richelle Cooper, to be precise. Info here:
http://www.emergencymedicine.ucla.edu/i ... y&Itemid=6 (http://www.emergencymedicine.ucla.edu/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=7:richelle-cooper-md-mshs&catid=1:ft-ucla-faculty&Itemid=6)
http://www.uclahealth.org/body.cfm?id=4 ... &ref=25337 (http://www.uclahealth.org/body.cfm?id=458&action=detail&ref=25337)
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Do we have any proof that Jermaine was actually in UCLA at the time of the reading of the death statement? Surely if that was a real hospital there would be doctors surrounding him? Did we see the press journalists who were there? We saw microphones at the podium but that could easily be fake.
This is a photo of Jermaine and his wife inside UCLA on June 25.
(http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/1794/jermaineucla.jpg)
You can see reporters in the video below, at the beginning and end. The video was from the UCLA Office of Media Relations. It can also be found on the UCLA website.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVaEaDty5_Y (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVaEaDty5_Y)
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I was looking for other news as you know Michael can be really dead. I have found an interesting video on Youtube where CNN repoter says that an official statement is out from the UCLA. It came immediately into my mind that Jermaine maybe just read it out, but it doesn´t mean that it is not real.
I have another question to everybody from the USA can you please research wether it is true that ONLY officials can read out that a member of a family is dead or are there other possibilities... (please send a link if you know). It would be great to know. If there is any possibility that a family member can just read out an official statement from UCLA then we do not have a hoax. And maybe it is just a rumor that a family member cannot read out such an official statement. As I know Michaels death was established by officials and maybe we should pay more attention to that.
Here is the video I am talking about:
[youtube:tt1p8gco]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W20ZSeypJ2A[/youtube:tt1p8gco]
There are stories in the news all the time about people passing away, sometimes tragically. t.v and newspaper obituaries are a source of death notices. Michael was a citizen just like anyone else. There is no special law about making anouncements.
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never seen this photo. looks pretty convincing. :cry:
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There more I get into it the more it convinces me that Michael could really be dead. It was said why Jermaine makes this official statement, he was the one who was chosen this time to do it, to speak for the whole family, that is all. To look with different eyes on this statement makes it more clear that it is quite convincing.
But there are still questions to solve.
One big question to me is why are the dancers acting like imployees the whole liberian girl theme? The dancers are the extensions of Michael Jackson...remember...Why KF and Michael Bush are preparing Michael for the burial (has Michael thought about it and told them that he wanted them to do that when he was alive or is it a show?). And the court of Conrad Murray, with the money, it just does not make sense at all!
Lets wait and see and investigate...
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never seen this photo. looks pretty convincing. :cry:
Yea it does. :( I just want to know one way or the other...I've been on the computer for 10 hours a day for almost 7 months. It's affecting my work, it consumes my thoughts, it's not healthy. But I don't want to give up until we know for sure. :?
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never seen this photo. looks pretty convincing. :cry:
Yea it does. :( I just want to know one way or the other...I've been on the computer for 10 hours a day for almost 7 months. It's affecting my work, it consumes my thoughts, it's not healthy. But I don't want to give up until we know for sure. :?
same here.. my stomach flips when i see stuff like this.. like some of the memorial pics i hadn't seen before!! i dunno what to think anymore.. trying to be open-minded but.. i think its time to face reality.. :cry: still here till the end tho.. :geek:
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never seen this photo. looks pretty convincing. :cry:
Yea it does. :( I just want to know one way or the other...I've been on the computer for 10 hours a day for almost 7 months. It's affecting my work, it consumes my thoughts, it's not healthy. But I don't want to give up until we know for sure. :?
Its the same with me. I am searching for the truth and hope that one day someone comes to give us strong prove that Michael is alive. Everything is so confusing (the family could act but at the same time I think no, maybe not). It affects my life right now and I feel like I am going crazy when it turns out that Michael is... I cannot give up and I am looking for stronger evidences for him being alive.
I sometimes think that it is not healthy to be here for hours, but at the same time I think this is how I feel right now and I accept my emotions and that it is right now a part of my life. There is nothing really wrong about it as long as I do not evaluate it (bad or good). I just accepting it. I think this is more healthy than condemn myself.
What would you do instead of beeing here, would it help you to work up with how you feel. You have chosen this way because it gives you power in a way. There is nothing wrong about it.
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Noticed who postet it? TMZ..
Where is rest of Jermaine's family, and why doesnt he hug his wife?
-Funny how he hugs, whose?, bodyguard and holds the paper he read off.
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Although the above video may be "convincing", we still have to remember that they wanted the world to think that MJ really had died, so they would have to make it look "real." There are more videos out there with "clues" that MJ is alive, then there are of videos proving he is "dead." It's still tough after 7 months with no proof one way or the other. If something BIG doesn't happen on the 18th or the 25th, then I will lose faith, as these dates have been fed to us, saying they are important dates, so I think it is time to "let the truth prevail." Either Michael is alive and will make his return, or we have all been a part of one Hell of an experiment! :?
I truly hope it is the first! We love you Michael and we need you now more then ever...please come back to us now and save what little sanity we have left...Thanks! :D
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Although the above video may be "convincing", we still have to remember that they wanted the world to think that MJ really had died, so they would have to make it look "real." There are more videos out there with "clues" that MJ is alive, then there are of videos proving he is "dead." It's still tough after 7 months with no proof one way or the other. If something BIG doesn't happen on the 18th or the 25th, then I will lose faith, as these dates have been fed to us, saying they are important dates, so I think it is time to "let the truth prevail." Either Michael is alive and will make his return, or we have all been a part of one Hell of an experiment! :?
I truly hope it is the first! We love you Michael and we need you now more then ever...please come back to us now and save what little sanity we have left...Thanks! :D
I am still not shure whether he will returt or not, I tend to say no. We have all not a 100 % proof that Michael is alive as well the other way. It is is possible that they try us so hard to convince that Michael is dead, which reasons might there be
1. Michael is really dead
2. Michael will not return, never planed to do that
3. or other...??
Because there are many people who think that we do not think right I am searching for strong and I mean really strong evidences that underline that he is alive. This that there is no official statement was made seem not to be that strong argument as many/me included have thought. If it is possible for a family member to speak for the whole family and to read out this statement then we should look for other arguments which no one can proof as invalid.
Other interesting opinions, it is a little bit off topic right now, which do not convince me too is that there are many fans out there (in an another forum) who think that Michael is dead.
So I decided to ask them whether it is normal to reheare for a burial with full dress and so on and whether it is not conspicuous that the dancer of Michael Jackson are working there. They do not question anything...
This were the answers I have recieved:
They have just rehearsed how to show the guests where they should sit down. And that it was an honor for them to do it, that the family have integrated them this way.
They are so strong convinced that there is nothing weird about this point, because the family members wonted them to do that and they agreed to that and were very proud of it.
About the rehearsing for a funeral: One explanation I got was: There is nothing weird about it if it is possible to rehearse for a wedding then why not for a funeral.
My oppinion about it is still the same that it is nonsense that the TII dancers appear as staff of Forest Lawn. For me this is a strong evidence that there is something not right about Michael´s death, funeral and TII Film.
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Have they released a police statement? Although I didnt see a police car in the area of MJ's house on June 25th, which is weird cus I know its standard procedure for the cops to show up to person in distress call...at least where I live it is.
Id like to see a police statement from any cop that was supposedly there that day....
Id also LOVE to see any video footage, even from a cell phone from any hospital staff that SAW MJ that day as well.....you know that if you worked at the hospital that MJ was taken into and you had a camera phone nearby, you would be filming it or at least take a pic. I know thats wrong but considering the magnitude of WHO mj is.. youd think SOMEONE would have a 15 second video of him.
But no one does....
The lack of backup to his death is unheard of. I know people have brought up Britanny Spears and her trips to the hospital and I will again. Her house was swarmed by media and police. You are going to tell me that the paramedics "worked" on Mike for 40 some odd minutes and NO police were present when the ambulance left. UNFREAKING BELIEVABLE! I mean think about the small amount of media when they left with Mike. Those things ALONE don't add up folks.
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This message is for Shout. I don't understand what you mean by this comment, can you rephrase it?; :)
'So I decided to ask them whether it is normal to reheare for a burial with full dress and so on and whether it is not conspicuous that the dancer of Michael Jackson are working there. They do not question anything...'
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The lack of backup to his death is unheard of. I know people have brought up Britanny Spears and her trips to the hospital and I will again. Her house was swarmed by media and police. You are going to tell me that the paramedics "worked" on Mike for 40 some odd minutes and NO police were present when the ambulance left. UNFREAKING BELIEVABLE! I mean think about the small amount of media when they left with Mike. Those things ALONE don't add up folks.
Thing is, Britney Spears was having a very public meltdown which was great for the media etc. They were following her every move in the hope that something else will happen. A bit like a predator following an injured prey.
Yes, MJ was embarking on what would be a huge and much anticipated comeback - but how much of the media in LA were actually following him every day? He hadn't done anything big publicly since 2001. How interested were they really? I cannot answer this question. For me, I would be very surprised if media (not to mention general public, fans etc) were not following his every move in the run-up to the comeback, but if this is not the case then it is not surprising that no media/public were there to actually witness things from the get-go. Although it's not like the incident happened in the early morning hours.....it happened midday when people would be around?
As for no police being present, well, even the paramedics didn't know who they were treating - allegedly, and as the 911 call proves, no name was given. It appears that security wanted to keep things as private as possible. It makes sense in way because if you are trying to save someone's life you don't want the whole world to descend on your doorstep. Security obviously took that decision before they made the 911 call. It's an interesting question though. Did i hear also that not many people knew where MJ lived?
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man in that video when they were sticking that "surfer board" in the back of the coroners van..tell me you noticed how ONE dude picked up the body and put him on the floor...and not respectfully place him he just plopped him on the floor...Im sorry how much did MJ weigh??...yeah i know he was skinny but i heard that "dead weight" you are heavier then when your alive...so how could this ONE guy pick up that flat thing in the white sheets?...if thats MJ then that ONE guy he picked him off the stretcher is EXTREMELY STRONG...
ALSO..you know there was an exchange in the helicopter...One body coming from the hospital looked well like a body and had the black straps on and had definate shape ( i remember because i started cry hysterically when i saw them bring him out of the hospital...BUT THEN when they are taking him out of the helicopter to put on the van what do you see...its rediculously flat and didnt look anything like what i saw going into the helicopter and most importantly the black straps are missing!!!
Edit: OMG I AM CRYING SO BAD RIGHT NOW I JUST HAD A CRAZY THOUGHT OH GOSH OH GOSH... I think i know why the black straps are missing!! please say i am wrong because i am hoping so bad i am wrong, but maybe they took off the straps just before landing because they are transporting him from heli to the van!! and the straps was what gave the def shap because they were wrapped around him!!! So right before they land they unlatched the black straps to make the switch off more quickly so that cameras wont get that much footage and stuck him in the van!!! Could this be a logically explanation to why there were no straps when the body came off the helicopter?!?!?!? please tell me i am mistaken please oh please :cry:
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The lack of backup to his death is unheard of. I know people have brought up Britanny Spears and her trips to the hospital and I will again. Her house was swarmed by media and police. You are going to tell me that the paramedics "worked" on Mike for 40 some odd minutes and NO police were present when the ambulance left. UNFREAKING BELIEVABLE! I mean think about the small amount of media when they left with Mike. Those things ALONE don't add up folks.
Thing is, Britney Spears was having a very public meltdown which was great for the media etc. They were following her every move in the hope that something else will happen. A bit like a predator following an injured prey.
Yes, MJ was embarking on what would be a huge and much anticipated comeback - but how much of the media in LA were actually following him every day? He hadn't done anything big publicly since 2001. How interested were they really? I cannot answer this question. For me, I would be very surprised if media (not to mention general public, fans etc) were not following his every move in the run-up to the comeback, but if this is not the case then it is not surprising that no media/public were there to actually witness things from the get-go. Although it's not like the incident happened in the early morning hours.....it happened midday when people would be around?
As for no police being present, well, even the paramedics didn't know who they were treating - allegedly, and as the 911 call proves, no name was given. It appears that security wanted to keep things as private as possible. It makes sense in way because if you are trying to save someone's life you don't want the whole world to descend on your doorstep. Security obviously took that decision before they made the 911 call. It's an interesting question though. Did i hear also that not many people knew where MJ lived?
No No No...the police usually are aware of where celebs live in their cities. Especially one they have an axe to grind with. I feel certain the day MJ moved into or signed the lease for the Carolwood estate they knew it. I don't buy the arguement that they would not have known that MJ lived there. Not to mention once the paramedics arrived and communicated the status to their superiors that the police would not be notified. Again, they were there for 40+ minutes - we are not talking about a turn and burn. No, sorry... still doesn't make sense to me.
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This message is for Shout. I don't understand what you mean by this comment, can you rephrase it?; :)
'So I decided to ask them whether it is normal to reheare for a burial with full dress and so on and whether it is not conspicuous that the dancer of Michael Jackson are working there. They do not question anything...'
I will try to make it more easy to understand. I hope it will work. On another forum (fanforum) I have asked the members whether it is normal for dancers to work at Forest Lawn as you can clear see them in the video(funeral) tha the dancers of TII were there to work... During the burial on September 3rd it was shown how they indicated where Janet and other family members should sit down and so on. In the news was mentioned that they will do (the article was published on 2nd September) full dress rehearsals for the funeral which I find very strange and not usual. The fans from this forum gave me different explanations which did not conviced me at all. That is why I have written that they do not question anything or in other words it seem so...
I cannot find the article right now I have put it on this forum but right now I have problems to login. I will post it here when I can login there..
Here it is: http://www.etonline.com/news/2009/09/78206/index.html (http://www.etonline.com/news/2009/09/78206/index.html)
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Edit: OMG I AM CRYING SO BAD RIGHT NOW posting.php?mode=quote&f=48&p=53601I (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/posting.php?mode=quote&f=48&p=53601I) JUST HAD A CRAZY THOUGHT OH GOSH OH GOSH... I think i know why the black straps are missing!! please say i am wrong because i am hoping so bad i am wrong, but maybe they took off the straps just before landing because they are transporting him from heli to the van!! and the straps was what gave the def shap because they were wrapped around him!!! So right before they land they unlatched the black straps to make the switch off more quickly so that cameras wont get that much footage and stuck him in the van!!! Could this be a logically explanation to why there were no straps when the body came off the helicopter?!?!?!? please tell me i am mistaken please oh please :cry:
This is in deed a good explanation why the straps are missing...and the moving body in the helikopter is just an imagination/illusion. Maybe they have removed the black straps when they have fixed the body inside the helicopter...we do not know exactly, but it still does not proof that Michael is alive (unfortunately). On the white sheet/bag we see not the stripes but shadows in one part when he is in the helicopter. Watch carefully.
BUT there are nevertheless much more questions...Michael could still be alive, there are to many strange things surronding his death. Do not give up until we really know.
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to answer your question, no it is not illegal or it does not make anyone less dead for family to announce a death. The hospital does it as a courtesy to the family in their time of mourning, but they DO NOT have to!!! Call a hospital in the USA and ask them. It's VERY true.
Is it surprising to me that Jermaine gave the announcement.. Yes and no. The reason is because so many people think that Jermaine is a spotlight seeker. Why wouldn't someone who seeks so much fame want to give the announcement. Look what he did with the Vienna tribute. He didn't even tell his family.
He didn't have to include them, but he really should have let them know what he was doing. I think it's only right that the other brothers or anyone else in MJ's family be able to participate in a tribute. At the very least, know about it. That right there shows that Jermaine "may" be a spotlight seeker.
I do not know him so I cannot say for sure. But hospital staff does not have to announce a death. It is not any kind of law at all! However, it is VERY strange to me that NO ONE from the hospital has spoken out. Was the emergency room empty that day?
Were there no other staff except one doctor and a few nurses.. I think not! Not even a cleaning person has spoken out. Is everyone under some sort of gag order? This is very confusing. Maybe one day we will find out for sure. But until then, this is one of many things that is fueling the hoax flames.
I don't have proof that he is alive or dead. We have our ideas. But I believe about 80% that he is alive. I am not sure aside from seeing a body (omg) if I would believe he is dead. Even if we did see a body.. Would it really be a body or some kind of wax figure?
There are so many ways to look at this. I am trying to keep my hopes that he is still here. I do get discouraged and have my bad days.. But mostly, I just wait for the good news!!
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Have they released a police statement? Although I didnt see a police car in the area of MJ's house on June 25th, which is weird cus I know its standard procedure for the cops to show up to person in distress call...at least where I live it is.
I couldn't agree more. In my area of town it's that way too.
As a matter of fact, there were a couple who had been missing since the Christmas holiday and they found the bodies the other day. The police were there!
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As someone whom lives in Los Angeles, I can say that every time I have called 911 (or someone in my neighborhood has) LAPD cars have been dispatched to the location, and usually there are numerous ones. Also, I live in an upscale community (such as Bel Air) and the number of police cars grows exponentially when you live here. It seems the 'richer' the neighborhood, the more the police cars come.
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So I guess what would solve the riddle of whether the police should have been there that day is the question 'under what circumstances, in the area the 911 call was made, would a police car be automatically called to the scene?'. I mean, who notifies the police, when and under what circumstances?
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I thought i would post this. It reiterates some of the questions we've been asking.
http://www.celebitchy.com/58711/lapd_in ... kson_died/ (http://www.celebitchy.com/58711/lapd_in_trouble_for_not_properly_sealing_scene_after_michael_jackson_died/)
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To summerize, for the greatest entertainer, artist, performer of the century, for the most popular singer on earth, the one who gave millions for charities, the most beloved artist on the planet, I can continue, there was no official death announcemenct done, the "funerals" were private. Period.
I am just questionning myself...This is very sad, no, it is suspicious. It would be helpful if Forest Lawmn was able to confirm us that Michael Jackson is really buried there.
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As someone whom lives in Los Angeles, I can say that every time I have called 911 (or someone in my neighborhood has) LAPD cars have been dispatched to the location, and usually there are numerous ones. Also, I live in an upscale community (such as Bel Air) and the number of police cars grows exponentially when you live here. It seems the 'richer' the neighborhood, the more the police cars come.
But there were police cars. That is one of the points, just because we have seen it so often on TV screen, it does not mean that it was not there!
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And wasn´t it said that Michael died at the hospital...so why should the police arrive at his home when someone has called 911...?!
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This info is from the documentary 'Michael Jackson's Last Days - What Really Happened' by Jaques Peretti. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q7_fz-W0As&NR=1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q7_fz-W0As&NR=1)
Watch from 7.00 onwards.
The implication is that because MJ's house was rented it was not celebrity tagged, therefore it was not protected from outside ears such as LA journalists who tap 911 calls. So had the home phone been used in the 911 call it would not have been blocked, anyone could hear it if they wanted to and you would have expected a lot of journalists and media to be there around the same time as the ambulance or after (paramedics stayed 30 mins). However, alberto alvarez made the call on his cell phone, so essentially no-one could hear anyway because the home phone was not used. The lady says though that 'you can also pick up on the dispatch call', and although the address would be given, Jackson's name was not stated. Also, the paramedics only recognised MJ after about 10 mins apparently, http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/ent ... 23378.html (http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/entertainment/medics-mistook-mj-for-an-old-man_100223378.html) Does this explain why there were no police and hardly any media outside the house, despite the paramedics being there for about 30 mins?
There does appear to be a contradiction somewhere. I was under the impression that very few people were outside the house while this was going on. The lady says ' By the time the ambulance went in and came out it was covered, swarming with media people.' Really?