Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators
Latest News => Michael Jackson News => Topic started by: hesouttamylife on January 09, 2010, 05:00:36 PM
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http://www.masala.com/13491-mj---the-missing-tapes
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Los Angeles police investigating the death of MICHAEL JACKSON are desperately searching for lost surveillance footage taken from the King of Pop's Hollywood home that could solve the mystery surrounding the final moments of his life.
The pop superstar suffered a cardiac arrest in one of the bedrooms in his rented Holmby Hills mansion on 25 June, and was found unconscious by members of his staff, including personal medic Dr. Conrad Murray.
Authorities seized vials of prescription drugs from Jackson's property immediately after his tragic passing as they searched for clues as to the cause of his death.
But detectives are reportedly missing the CCTV footage of that fateful morning - which they hope will prove to be a crucial piece of evidence in unravelling the timeline of events that led up to Jackson's passing.
A source tells the National Enquirer, "It was a very sophisticated and high-tech surveillance and security system. Not only were there cameras outside the house, but there were cameras inside as well - in private locations.
"Insiders close to the investigation say Michael's death - possibly his murder - was captured on camera, but the video has not been recovered. There are also gaps in some security camera footage stored on computer hard drives. Police are combing through personal computers recovered from the house."
On Wednesday, a police spokesperson dismissed reports the Jackson investigation had turned into a homicide case following claims on an online blog.
I have the feeling those tapes will never be recovered. Its one of the shadier aspects of the case as who would take these tapes and for what reason?
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I have the feeling those tapes will never be recovered. Its one of the shadier aspects of the case as who would take these tapes and for what reason?
If it was a tragic accident, why are they missing? Makes you wonder..
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I thought something about the family taking things out of the home if that's the case, of course, I don't really know though for sure, but if they had, if They could've found the tapes maybe but then again, as for me, I'm prolly on the "Stupid" side that is.
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I thought something about the family taking things out of the home if that's the case, of course, I don't really know though for sure, but if they had, if They could've found the tapes maybe but then again, as for me, I'm prolly on the "Stupid" side that is.
Withholding crucial evidence from the police is a crime and I don't think the Jackson would do such a thing even if it is to keep some things private. Those tapes could reveal a lot, specially the timeline of the mysterious events and his murdurer.
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If there were cameras in that bedroom that captured the whole thing.. then that is heartbreaking they have gone missing as they would hold all the answers.
Also.. why did MJ have all those cameras??? what was he worried about in order to have CCTV inside his home? When i think about this aspect it breaks my heart... if MJ really is dead and he was murdered... MJ knew it was going to happen and tried to protect himself.. then some bast**d murdered him and stole the CCTV tapes to cover it up.
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weren't those tapes missing a long time ago? and they are just now starting to search for them...?
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I wonder what's on those tapes. I think there's only two reasons why they're missing:
1. He was truly murdered (:( )
2. they show that he's alive and well
So which is it? I hope it's reason number 2.
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I thought something about the family taking things out of the home if that's the case, of course, I don't really know though for sure, but if they had, if They could've found the tapes maybe but then again, as for me, I'm prolly on the "Stupid" side that is.
Withholding crucial evidence from the police is a crime and I don't think the Jackson would do such a thing even if it is to keep some things private. Those tapes could reveal a lot, specially the timeline of the mysterious events and his murdurer.
completely understandable! I guess i was misled & a bit confused to be honest. Anyways, thanks for clearing that up.
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Why have they waited all this time to resume searching for the tapes?
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I don`t believe in accidents here - I am absolutely sure that there is a good reason for the missing footage! Since it might prove just the opposite of what has been suggested: It`ll probably show that NOTHING had happened at that time at that house ...
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Ooh. What if Robert DID intend to kill Michael?
Maybe he came into the bedroom and tried to, but for one reason or another, failed?
Maybe Michael knew what was up and stopped it? Money DOES talk.
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Those tapes are gone.. probably been thrown in a canal or burnt in a fire.
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It's really strange. Didn't they say the investigation was cloncluded? Now they report they're still looking for the missing tapes. I think these tapes are crucial to the investigation.
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Or they didn't even exist because the cameras were turned off that day...
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The LAPD messed up so bad by not locking down the house on the day he "died".
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weren't those tapes missing a long time ago? and they are just now starting to search for them...?
Yep!You're right about that...I'm sure those detectives didn't get their badges by reading "Forensics For Dummies" :shock:...I agree with Dance too...I don't think those tapes will ever be recoverded...if their ever existed in the first place...or is showing an alive and kicking MJ ;)
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Who would have them? Surely the security people would've been watching the cameras?
So....what the hell?
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I´m still thinking that Murray is the Scapegoat. If it was really murder, then I don´t think he´s the murderer or took the tapes..
There´s something bigger..
If that´s really the case, I don´t hope these tapes are destroyed now. They could give big evidence.
On the other hand it would have been easier to take them out of the camera before somethings going to happen, when MJ wasn´t there, to make sure nothings going to be filmed..mhmmm..unless there´s a signal or light when tape is missing.
It´s hard to say if I wish they will be found. When they will be found and it´s not a hoax then it´s really good and helpful i think, if they will not be found maybe that means that nothing happened and it was part of the plan that there are no tapes because everybody would say "just take a look at these tapes!".
I think we don´t know now or never know, because they will be missed anyway... :?
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Not only that, but if the tapes weren't even there to begin with, surely someone on MJ's security detail would've noticed? And what? Were MJ's guards all paid off?
They're oddly silent on this.
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Not only that, but if the tapes weren't even there to begin with, surely someone on MJ's security detail would've noticed? And what? Were MJ's guards all paid off?
They're oddly silent on this.
Yeah, they´re oddly silent... it must have been a big and sophisticated plan, either from michael or from his murderer. It´s all definitely a bit too odd..
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Okay, I may be posting more than I should, but the more I read and think about it, the less it makes sense.
Here's my scenario:
I'm MJ's guard. Have been for a while. ONe day someone comes to me and says "You know, if the tapes were shut off on June 25th, that would be great. You'll be rewarded handsomely. Of course, if you go to the police, we'll hurt you and your family."
Okay. So I do. I leave them off. And if I were then to learn that MJ was dead?
I don't care WHO threatened me or why, I'd go straight to the police and tell them what I knew. That's why they have the Witness Protection Program, right? To protect those who witness a crime.
And how many guards, security people, etc....did Michael have? It doesn't make sense that every single one of them would agree to cover up a murder!
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The CCTV that went 'missing' has always been my little reminder that this has to be a hoax whenever I'm in doubt! It's just too coincidental!
And if this can pretty much sum up most of the mystery surrounding MJ's death .. Why start looking for it 7 months after!? It could have been destroyed or whatever by now. Kinda crazy..
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That´s why i think (if it was murder) those tapes were removed after everything has happened. MJ is dead, staff is quit,... enough time to make things go missing.. Nobody knows who was the last at his house, nobody knows who was the first that entered the empty house..
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I wonder what's on those tapes. I think there's only two reasons why they're missing:
1. He was truly murdered (:( )
2. they show that he's alive and well
So which is it? I hope it's reason number 2.
Totally agree. There can only be 2 reasons as to why there is no CCTV footage for THAT particular day. Murder or he's alive. I really hope he's alive.. But we'll have to wait and see. I've always thought 90% alive, 9% murder 1% stupid accident.
I guess I'm gonna just trust my instincts up until we have total proof that he's not alive!
I love you Michael! You're a genius ;)
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Remember that Janet and LaToya went over the next day and removed Michael's belongings, even down to the covers and sheets from his bed. Perhaps they had been instructed to get them because it is very obvious to me that the police were instructed NOT to secure the crime scene immediately for a reason. When a crime has taken place the scene is IMMEDIATELY secured for forensics. This obviously was planned. This gave them time to go in and plant the notes and all the other stuff they "say" they found, vials of drugs, oxygen tanks, dirty room,etc. Come on, let's get real. For heaven's sake and common sense if Janet and LaToya cleaned out MJs stuff, surely the would not have left vials of drugs and post it notes and a filthy mess on the scene.
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strange after all that happen yesterday with the TMZ story and the DA and what some members have found on the doctor now this I remember last night some was asking about those tape and now here a article about how the police are now looking for those tape this is all a smoke screen to throw people off I am sure if those tape was really missing Joe and Latoya would have said this when they was calling foul play. or the media final got off their butt and started really look in to his case and asking real question and the police is trying throw them off like by saying they looking for those tapes which really should have been their first step
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I'll play the role of bad guys here...
Per your scenerio... "We" approached you to turn off the tapes and promised a bribe. You played along and now our plan to murder has been accomplished. The first thing that we do is approach you again to ensure your silence by threatening you. We convince you to play along again because afterall if we could kill once then we could do it again. If you go to the police anyway then we play a little game called "flush him out and shut him up". We knock off friends and family one-by-one until you retract whatever you're telling the police and suddenly get amnesia.
That was scary. I seem to be pretty good at being a bad guy. :lol:
Okay, I may be posting more than I should, but the more I read and think about it, the less it makes sense.
Here's my scenario:
I'm MJ's guard. Have been for a while. ONe day someone comes to me and says "You know, if the tapes were shut off on June 25th, that would be great. You'll be rewarded handsomely. Of course, if you go to the police, we'll hurt you and your family."
Okay. So I do. I leave them off. And if I were then to learn that MJ was dead?
I don't care WHO threatened me or why, I'd go straight to the police and tell them what I knew. That's why they have the Witness Protection Program, right? To protect those who witness a crime.
And how many guards, security people, etc....did Michael have? It doesn't make sense that every single one of them would agree to cover up a murder!
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Well, after waiting 7 months to start looking for them, what did they expect. Someone shows up at the LAPD station saying, "here, um, I had these tapes and just heard you were looking for them." Yeech!!!
I agree with what's been said:
They will either show Murray or whatever his name is on the phone for 40 minutes, trying to figure out what to do now that he killed our MJ.....or
They will show Michael packing his bags with a ticket to Eastern Europe, Bahrain, Neverland, or somewhere in his pocket, with Murray or maybe KO pulling up with the getaway car.
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A source tells the National Enquirer, "It was a very sophisticated and high-tech surveillance and security system. Not only were there cameras outside the house, but there were cameras inside as well - in private locations.
hummmm...this article is originally from The National Enquirer....
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Let me just get this straight..
Are they saying the tapes have gone missing, or the CCTV footage wasn't working on that day and there's nothing on the tapes?
If this CCTV system is so 'sophisticated', then surely only MJ and his trusted workers would have been able to access them and they would have been very secure and private. I mean, if there were cameras all over his house then Michael wouldn't want to risk letting strangers or random employees watch these tapes of his personal life whenever they pleased. Meaning, only MJ or his trusted employees could really be in possession of these tapes? It would of been tricky for anyone to actually get them other wise right? :? So why haven't more of the people that worked for him been questioned?
So unless this is a hoax, that would lead me to think he was murdered by someone close to him. Quite a horrible thought..
But yeah.. Like I said before. If the tapes are missing, obviously this would be at the top of the list to investigate cos that screams foul play or hoax!
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this is a random thought of mine.
maybe the tape will suddenly appear. & it will consist of Michael speaking directly to it, waving hi & saying "Hi :D I'm actually alive."
hehe.
anyway,
there is no way the tapes will appear. not after 7 months. too long of a time gap.
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Remember that Janet and LaToya went over the next day and removed Michael's belongings, even down to the covers and sheets from his bed. Perhaps they had been instructed to get them because it is very obvious to me that the police were instructed NOT to secure the crime scene immediately for a reason. When a crime has taken place the scene is IMMEDIATELY secured for forensics. This obviously was planned. This gave them time to go in and plant the notes and all the other stuff they "say" they found, vials of drugs, oxygen tanks, dirty room,etc. Come on, let's get real. For heaven's sake and common sense if Janet and LaToya cleaned out MJs stuff, surely the would not have left vials of drugs and post it notes and a filthy mess on the scene.
One thing always seemed very strange in the case ...
I do not know how U.S. law, but when something happens suspicion of murder in Brazil, the location of the alleged crime is sealed, ie no one else can enter the site until the team's expertise in the local police appear not to have any kind of change in the scene of the alleged murder.
I found it strange when I read that Janet and La Toya removing MJ their belongings before police make the expertise on site. 8-)
I remember at that time also entered the mansion of a team change for the removal of belongings.
As I said before I do not know how the U.S. law but comparing it with the Brazilian seemed very strange.
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No doubt. And if I was the guy who ordered MJ's murder, there's no way I'd let the tapes just sit around. I'd have destroyed them.
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I dont know why they havent investigated his sisters for going into the house? Someone took the hard drive for his music, and didn't someone mention MJ had cash in his house? So whoever took those, probably took the video footage. The only person who would want to disappear that footage, if any crime was committed, would be Dr. Murray. Didn't he leave with MJ on the ambulance, and then he disappeared? If one of his sisters took it, and had any evidence of crime, they would have blown the whole story long time ago, but, if on the contrary, there are signs that MJ is alive and well...there are enough reasons to disappear the video.
On the other hand, sometimes I fear a corrupt cop may have "disappeared" that footage covering a crime. But my guess is on that MJ is alive and well...and he has a plan...
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They are just NOW looking for the tape? Give me a break! They are no more looking for those tapes than I'm looking for those tapes. The Keystone Cops lie through their teeth. Next...
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Why have they waited all this time to resume searching for the tapes?
Right! They're JUST NOW starting to look for them?? I agree with another poster above me...either they're missing cuz it's a murder or he's alive.....
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Ok but I am not sure there are "tapes" with new security systems its all computerized right? So wasn't it mentioned that the hard drives and all of MJ's unrealeased songs were taken? Hmm sounds like the family has this stuff.
If not then I would have to say we have a murder. BUT I truly believe 99% that he is alive and the security footage had to go missing.
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It's all part of Michael's FILM career...
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I wonder what's on those tapes. I think there's only two reasons why they're missing:
1. He was truly murdered (:( )
2. they show that he's alive and well
So which is it? I hope it's reason number 2.
I think it's number two. I think he's alive and well. If those tapes were there in the beginning, they'd have to be taken so people won't see him being alive and well. He wouldn't want that proof just yet.
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With him leading the way, do you remember it from TII
I think too that it might be a part of a film! It sound so fake that Michael is dead. As I have read this news I just thought about a film! And who knows maybe they show a little bit in the Reality show of the Jacksons...
They have filmed the memorial service, do you remember that it has started and then interrupted and then went on, so what didn´t we see? LIBERIAN GIRL (Liberian Michael ;) )
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There are 2 scenarios. I have thought about this a lot since I heard they were missing.
Either the family was taking things OUT of the house or
The family were PLANTING things in the house.
My thoughts have always been ( from the beginning) that there was a reason they were allowed in the house the day ( or 2 ) after. Were they staging a scene?
Are the tapes missing due to what they do NOT want us to see about the whole incident?
The tapes are missing for a reason. A very important reason and you can be assured that they have been looking for them since the time they knew they were missing but they will not be found because they contain information someone does not want us to see.
If they could be found they would answer all the questions once and for all ... of that I have no doubt.
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Authorities seized vials of prescription drugs from Jackson's property immediately after his tragic passing as they searched for clues as to the cause of his death.
"It was a very sophisticated and high-tech surveillance and security system. Not only were there cameras outside the house, but there were cameras inside as well - in private locations.
There are also gaps in some security camera footage stored on computer hard drives.
quote]
There are a few statements in this article that have been bothering me
1. Theysaid they took out prescription drugs IMMEDIATELY following his tragic death...didnt it take them days to get to the house afterwards...after his sisters were there...So they could have put the drugs there to create a crime scene. AND didnt they say that there were no drugs found in MJ's body with the exception of propofol. hmmm interesting??
2. There were cameras in PRIVATE LOCATIONS...as in a select group of people knew where the cameras were located..
3. There were GAPS in some security footage stored on computer hard drives!!!!!.....Someone please help me understand this please!!! because when i read this my mind went blank and was like WOAH WOWWWWWWYYY!!! So that means they have some footage that just dont have the MAIN footage!!!...so that either means A) they removed the cameras before the murder took place B) they deleted the footage on the hard drives which means which ev gaurd was responsible for maintaining the security cameras should def be questioned... Or once again ima point at Mj's sisters considering they were removing some personal items of Michaels following is death
Ok another few questions, EVERYONE knows that his sisters were in that house and i mean EVERYONE knows that...so how come they didnt get in trouble for tampering with the evidence or get in trouble for being in the crime scene i mean HELLO if they could take stuff out of the house ( hard drives with music, blankets, clothes, security footage ) you know small stuff nothing important then they can put stuff in the house like oh i dont know DRUGS!!!
ONE OTHER THING...why are they just now looking for the tapes when they said the investigation was complete????
This article is so confusing eerrr...there are so many things stated in here that just lead to what the heck they mean. This article did not leave me with any closure just more confusion and more reason to think that MJ is Still alive :D :D
q0txciityl0ve that would be sooo cute heehee
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If this was real, LaToya, Janet, Alveres, and Murray would have been brought before a grand jury by now, not only to ask about this missing footage but to question them about what they saw, removed from the house, heard, and know. There is no case. There is no "death investigation". The family had to subpeonna medical records from UCLA? You mean to tell me LAPD detectives have closed their case sans UCLA ER medical records from 6-25??? COME ON!! This is about as far from real as it comes.
I think the DA hasn't done any of these things because there truly, in all reality, has not been a crime commited. Just like I have speculated for months, no body=no crime. The 911 call was fake, the EMTs were actors, the ambulance was paid for and ran with it's emergency lights off, no public funds were used for the memorial or funeral, life insurance was cashed in, and just TRY and prove that Michael's music sold better because he died then because of the upcoming O2 concerts of TII movie coming out. Just try. Not a chance there's a case there. Not any case at all.
Michael hasn't done anything illegal, so even though LAPD and the DA strongly suspect Michael Jackson isn't really dead.... there's nothing they can or should really do about it.
But a non-illegal death hoax is unprecidented. So I betcha there's a bunch of detectives not quite sure where to go from here. Press on or drop it? Perhaps the rumor of invol. manslaughter charges against Murray was dropped to flush Michael out from hiding. "Unnamed sources" are at work everyday in the media so LAPD took no risk in circulating this rumor to the press.
Things are getting interesting.
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We need to think logically about these missing tapes. They have bothered me from day one.
Either Janet, LaToya, Conrad Murray or the house staff removed them. Remember the staff were told to go home just after or before the incident.
Who wanted the tapes gone? Who had access? The body guards, Janet and LaToya were there either immediatly after or a few days after. What was on the tapes? All the answers. those tapes would have been the absolute proof as to what happened and they are gone.
Omer Bhatti, the children, the body guards and assistants were the only people possibly allowed access to the computers immediatly after the incident. Janet and LaToya came in days later but were they told what to look for and what to do do to erase the data?
I believe the data on the tapes was erased or edited as there were things we were never meant to see but what? If the Police were there the day of and the days after they would have the tapes. They were aware of the cameras from day one which is evident by the release of the information that the info was gone shortly after the supposide "death".
These tapes were something I brought up fairly early into this investigation as it was the one thing that bothered me the most. There is a cover up somewhere here and if we keep asking about the tapes it will not go away as they are the mosr important thing I can think of.
If you sweep this tape issue under the rug as you have a lot of other things it WILL go away, which I am sure the LAPD hopes it does.
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Michael hasn't done anything illegal, so even though LAPD and the DA strongly suspect Michael Jackson isn't really dead.... there's nothing they can or should really do about it.
But a non-illegal death hoax is unprecidented. So I betcha there's a bunch of detectives not quite sure where to go from here. Press on or drop it? Perhaps the rumor of invol. manslaughter charges against Murray was dropped to flush Michael out from hiding. "Unnamed sources" are at work everyday in the media so LAPD took no risk in circulating this rumor to the press.
Things are getting interesting.
wait you say the LAPD are suspecting Michael faked his death?? Hmm interesting indeed if thats the case...where did you learn this?
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Oh wow...& 7 months later they want to start looking for tapes.
Geesh, If it did have evidence of a murder...seems kinda late to me
to be looking for it. They've gave whomever has them time enough to
get rid of it. Some people on this case need to be handed a pink slip quick.
But I'm thinking that tape is showing Michael packing his little bags
getting ready to leave..(agreeing with Liberian Girl Hee Hee) :D
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all this confuses me!! why is there suddenly new stuff popping up.. :shock: weve been talking about them tapes from day one!! and they've only just caught onto it.. pfffff.. i smell a rat!!!
also i think WHY ON EARTH didn't JANET an LATOYA remove all the drugs etc that made Mike look like the biggest drug taker on earth!! If it was my brother i wouldn't leave them.. i'd wanna leave him some dignity!! and sort that part out in private!! i mean they was tampering with eveidence anyway..
:roll:
why would they leave stuff like this to blacken his name even more!! just when he's was re-building himself!! this stinks of either BETRAYAL or HOAX!! pfffffffff
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all this confuses me!! why is there suddenly new stuff popping up.. :shock: weve been talking about them tapes from day one!! and they've only just caught onto it.. pfffff.. i smell a rat!!!
also i think WHY ON EARTH didn't JANET an LATOYA remove all the drugs etc that made Mike look like the biggest drug taker on earth!! If it was my brother i wouldn't leave them.. i'd wanna leave him some dignity!! and sort that part out in private!! i mean they was tampering with eveidence anyway..
:roll:
why would they leave stuff like this to blacken his name even more!! just when he's was re-building himself!! this stinks of either BETRAYAL or HOAX!! pfffffffff
I also wonder about that .. It makes me think michael is alive ..
If michael was murdered why his family removed his stuff .. it can removed the proof if it's indeed murder case .. :roll:
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also i think WHY ON EARTH didn't JANET an LATOYA remove all the drugs etc that made Mike look like the biggest drug taker on earth!! If it was my brother i wouldn't leave them.. i'd wanna leave him some dignity!! and sort that part out in private!! i mean they was tampering with eveidence anyway..
:roll:
why would they leave stuff like this to blacken his name even more!! just when he's was re-building himself!! this stinks of either BETRAYAL or HOAX!! pfffffffff
Good point...and do you remember when everyone was reporting that there was black tar heroin found in MJ's bedroom? The search warrant said it was his family that reported it to the coroners! How the heck would his family know what tar heroin looks like anyway? :? I thought that was very strange.
As far as the tapes go...has the LAPD actually made a statement about them being missing? As far as I know we've only heard this through "insiders close to the case". This particular article is quoting the National Enquirer. I assume security footage does exist, unless the cameras weren't turned on inside the house that day, but we don't know for sure that the LAPD doesn't have them.
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???
Why do they post that as news today?
I thought the investigations are closed and this does 100% belong to them....
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We should not forget that tapes are allso missing from the office of Murray, remember when he got the boxes removed form his office...
BTW if this system was so high-tech why did it not make back-up's on it's hard disk??? shurly they can be found back!
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When they find the tapes, they'll probably find MJ.
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I don't find it a coincidence that it has been announced that they are looking for the tapes when only recently on this very forum, people have been talking about it. I find it predictable.
We have been asking for months WHY nobody has been looking for them so why now??
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I'm guessing that cctv has always been a part of MJ's household. He is not stupid, especially if he felt his life was in danger over the years. There would have always been a technical person in charge of filing the tapes or some procedure in handling them. Hopefully MJ himself being a technical person having dealt with taping and running sound boards since he was a kid...........hopefully he would have hidden or put questionable tapes in the hands of someone he truely trusted over the years as proof of anything or anyone he may need to prove an enemy. Since so many people would know of past procedure I don't think just a couple of people's word in this case, MJ's bodygaurd, etc would be considered the holy truth when they are questioned.
That said I still feel the tapes are missing to cover up a hoax. The family tie is strong and they did go in there to get 'things'. With 4 brothers and 2 sisters who are pretty smart and with that many heads thinking of all angles they surely would have been certain to take the tapes, all of them, not just one day's worth. When things come to court the answers will be found.
Is any of you familiar with how survellience is usually handled? do they re-use tapes or when one is full it is kept for the record??????
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when they say tapes.. i think they mean footage.. security tape machines are not used.. i wouldn't say completly but everything pretty much goes to computer.. now-a-days.. and i don't think Michael would be living in the dark ages having tapes and not computer cameras so to speak..
so i've been thinking about this.. an unless they have taken the hard drives out of the computers they can vertually get everything back up on it!! from the past even.. cos when you delete something whatever it may be.. i'm pretty certain that it stays on the hard drive and can be recovered.. thats how they catch criminals and perverts.. sorry to make that comparison but there has been a lot of that going on in the UK and thats how they get caught!!
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As someone on here already said, who's to say LAPD don't have the tapes and information they want? Did the LAPD actually say the tapes were missing or they were looking for them? If you look at this article below (excuse the title we know now it was false), TMZ mentions that in an affidavit it says Murray was caught on surveillance arriving at 1AM. So way back in August they already had some surveillance evidence......i don't think it's ever been confirmed they don't have all of it?
http://www.tmz.com/2009/08/27/heroin-fo ... ons-house/ (http://www.tmz.com/2009/08/27/heroin-found-at-michael-jacksons-house/)
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Surely more than anybody, Murray would be the one who wants the security footage found because, it would back-up his statement thus proving his innocence. According to reports , Michael was in Dr. Murrays room because he didn't want anybody to walk in and see him hooked up to a drip. This makes me think that Murrays room possible didn't have CCTV coverage. if it did then why not just get rid of the footage from that room instead of the entire footage from that day? Michael is no fool he probably had back-up of back-ups! wasn't the CCTV footage stored in a hard drive system anyway? My guess is the CCTV footage shows incriminating evidence otherwise they'll be no reason to dispose of it, obviously the events didn't occur as they have been reported. What makes me sick to my stomach is the thought of a corrupt security guard, with some kind of vendetta against Michael, watching the events unfold on screen but, not doing a damn thing about it. Who knows, security may have know something was up before Murray did. I sure hope this is a hoax because i can't even comprehend the latter.
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Surely more than anybody, Murray would be the one who wants the security footage found because, it would back-up his statement thus proving his innocence. According to reports , Michael was in Dr. Murrays room because he didn't want anybody to walk in and see him hooked up to a drip. This makes me think that Murrays room possible didn't have CCTV coverage. if it did then why not just get rid of the footage from that room instead of the entire footage from that day? Michael is no fool he probably had back-up of back-ups! wasn't the CCTV footage stored in a hard drive system anyway? My guess is the CCTV footage shows incriminating evidence otherwise they'll be no reason to dispose of it, obviously the events didn't occur as they have been reported. What makes me sick to my stomach is the thought of a corrupt security guard, with some kind of vendetta against Michael, watching the events unfold on screen but, not doing a damn thing about it. Who knows, security may have know something was up before Murray did. I sure hope this is a hoax because i can't even comprehend the latter.
Funny you should mention a hard drive. Wasn't LaToya reported as going to the house and removing computer drives?
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When we are not in possession of the facts, is there any point in discussing the different scenarios? Since June 25th, aside from some affidavits, and a statement from the coroner about 'acute propofol intoxication, benzodiazepine effects' what reliable information (from LAPD/Coroner) have we really received? What do we really know about the autopsy report - nothing. Details of the investigation - nothing. LAPD from the outset have confirmed....nothing! If there's anything to talk about it's what is in the affidavit, the 911 call etc, that's all the public has. Just my opinion.
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When we are not in possession of the facts, is there any point in discussing the different scenarios? Since June 25th, aside from some affidavits, and a statement from the coroner about 'acute propofol intoxication, benzodiazepine effects' what reliable information (from LAPD/Coroner) have we really received? What do we really know about the autopsy report - nothing. Details of the investigation - nothing. LAPD from the outset have confirmed....nothing! If there's anything to talk about it's what is in the affidavit, the 911 call etc, that's all the public has. Just my opinion.
What's the point in being here at all then if we can't discuss anything except hard facts. As you rightly say, we don't have many of those, so what is there to discuss?
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What's the point in being here at all then if we can't discuss anything except hard facts. As you rightly say, we don't have many of those, so what is there to discuss?
I think there's a lot to discuss generally, with what has been made available for us to see or read, it's just that there are less than a handful of articles (mostly heresay) on the internet saying the tapes are missing...who really says they're missing? If this was true it would be huge, but alas no credible source. People are tying themselves in knots over information that has not been authoritatively verified and it seems a bit pointless. When we're talking about specifics in the case, like the surveillance tapes which we all know existed in the house, it's important to know you're discussing confirmed facts, or speculating around the known facts. IMO the tapes could be missing, or they could not. It's speculating around speculation! But ofcourse, everyone can do what they want ;)
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When we are not in possession of the facts, is there any point in discussing the different scenarios? Since June 25th, aside from some affidavits, and a statement from the coroner about 'acute propofol intoxication, benzodiazepine effects' what reliable information (from LAPD/Coroner) have we really received? What do we really know about the autopsy report - nothing. Details of the investigation - nothing. LAPD from the outset have confirmed....nothing! If there's anything to talk about it's what is in the affidavit, the 911 call etc, that's all the public has. Just my opinion.
What's the point in being here at all then if we can't discuss anything except hard facts. As you rightly say, we don't have many of those, so what is there to discuss?
I also remember someone saying they removed computers hard drives or something cant remember where i read it, it just makes know sense at all it has to be a hoax imo there is no other reason for all the nonsense
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Those tapes would show everybody that was in that house. That is why they are very important. They will show if in fact whether people were ordered out and if everyone actually did leave. They would show everything that went on throughout the home as well as what was happening upstairs in those rooms. If the drip was set up in Murray's room then why were they reportedly found in Michael's room? Because the police went in and set it up that way is why. The tapes are VERY IMPORTANT. I believe Tohme Tohme was there though he says he was no where on the premises. This is the work of some professional thieves. Hired cleanup men.
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i think we're gonna see those tapes and what really happened,like the making of;day _:the death(or hoax)w/e
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That´s why i think (if it was murder) those tapes were removed after everything has happened. MJ is dead, staff is quit,... enough time to make things go missing.. Nobody knows who was the last at his house, nobody knows who was the first that entered the empty house..
What I think happened is after doctor Murray killed Michael, he took the tapes so they couldn't see what happened that morning and catch him in the act .
He had access to them .
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Ive just been reading that latoya,told the telegraph(UK),that 1.2 million pound had gone missing from michaels house,she said he always kept money in the house,plus alot of gems,she said whoever went in,did a good job,and that it was wierd. :?
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Oh man about the million pounds :? its is rumored that Dr. Murray was struggling with money...but now he can afford the number 1 attorney in the area??..hopefully that money was to pay everyone off in the hoax :)...HOPEFULLY
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Was going to post a link,but sorry i cant do it. :oops: :oops:
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Oh man about the million pounds :? its is rumored that Dr. Murray was struggling with money...but now he can afford the number 1 attorney in the area??..hopefully that money was to pay everyone off in the hoax :)...HOPEFULLY
but you don´t murder someone to get his money to get your lawyer paid who you obviously need afterwards. :D
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Anyone seen Life on Mars?
They dont give out DCI badges in lucky bags, you know??
:lol: :lol:
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Hello dear friends of the blog!
When I say I can not believe everything you see and read in relation to Michael nobody believes.
Why only now almost 7 months of "dead" by the police for tapes?
Do you understand now when I say that has many contradictions?
Let There:
First I repeat that's why Janet and Latoya do not remember now, could not have taken anything from the mansion as they did, friends anywhere in the world when it happen to someone what happened, the place is to investigate, even if they say "The lease was ending on this day!"
NOT THIS.
I'm sure that being Brazilian in the United States is a law that would not allow the removal of personal property, or whatever it was, served to clarify the research.
To give you an idea, here in Brazil we find it very strange when we saw the television set, the trucks.
Another thing you ever stopped to think that this death was forged planned long ago, the first step to be taken was the removal of all the tapes?
And be assured, no wonder if neither the hard drive there is no image, who helped Michael really understand things.
Another detail, how this research has been conducted is a shame!
As they declare the press that the case is practically closed, and the next state that they are looking for the tapes that will be the proof?
Where is the family of Michael says nothing, does not give satisfaction to the fans?
I tell you do not expect a definition of justice, it will keep dragging on, this is deliberate, that's part of the plan, every time something new appears, which makes the inquiry is not defined, it is to gain time, I just want to know what all this will give, that's all!
One thing is certain, all this only proves that Michael is alive, if he will come back or not do not know, but he lives, the department just does not know how you will explain to the world that the doctor does not have any guilt.
Today will tape tomorrow, will remember the shirt with blood and so on.
Forgive the long text but I wanted to expose all my thoughts.
Sincerely!
:|
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Brillant posts! Thank you for posting this article, Dance! :D
Everyone has made so many well said comments. I really dont think the tapes will ever been discovered. Prolly the tapes have been destroyed. Either the tapes show MJ's demise :( or show that he is alive. I believe the latter. Very interesting that this article states that they were cameras hidden inside of MJ's home. MJ, you are as smart as a fox! ;)
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Well they better not look inside Latoyas shoppingbag :lol: :lol: :lol:
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How 'bout this scenario: Janet & LaToya gave comp. hard drives to Chief Bratton! IT was all part of "THE PLAN."
(Remember, LAPD Chief Bratton subsequently "quit" (w/ a few years left on his contract). "The chief now is at a new division of Altegrity Inc., which itself is a newly branded holding company that was formerly known as USIS (US Investigations Services). Altegrity Security Consulting will work with law enforcement agencies, both in the U.S. and overseas. He'll be based in NY."
Strange how things unfold.... "Empire State Of Mind"
"In New York,
Concrete jungle where dreams are made of,
Theres nothing you can’t do,
Now you’re in New York,
These streets will make you feel brand new,
The lights will inspire you,
Lets hear it for New York, New York, New York York."
................... :~* Michael <-------> GENIUS *~: ...........................
Brillant posts! Thank you for posting this article, Dance! :D
Everyone has made so many well said comments. I really dont think the tapes will ever been discovered. Prolly the tapes have been destroyed. Either the tapes show MJ's demise :( or show that he is alive. I believe the latter. Very interesting that this article states that they were cameras hidden inside of MJ's home. MJ, you are as smart as a fox! ;)[/quote]
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In this case i totally exclude the murder theory,just think-it's obvious that there were not one but several security guys responsible for the tapes,so if we consider that there was a foul play and someone decided to kill him,he would have to get rid of the tapes either killing all the security guys or corrupting them, as we Know noone was killed that day,the second version is left-the corruption.But cause it's obvious that there must be more then one security guy,he couldn't corrupt them all,that's impossible, i know from Mike's driver and close friend Gokor(who is armenian like me and he told several M.J. interesting stories while bein' interviewed by our local channel) that after being bashed by some tracherous ones whom he used to trust,now Mike was very concerned about people around him,he now had people around him whom he could really trust,the devoted ones as is his driver.Even if we consider that the murderer corrupted one of the securities and he turned out to be a tracherous, he could not corrupt all of them who were responsible for the tapes,so after learning this,i'm keen on the hoax theory,only Mike could take those tapes.
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Latoya has said alot about what happened in the house after MJ's death, and what went missing. Things we wouldn't have known about if she hadn't spoken. If the tapes were missing it would be huge. Given everything she has said so far, i find it surprising she hasn't mentioned this. Again, who says the tapes are missing :roll:
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What about Tohme Tohme?
Didn't he fire all the staff members the same day?
That COULD mean, he was the last person in the house befor going to UCLA.
Is there any footage of Tohme arriving at UCLA?
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I was wondering if anyone had heard if the LAPD looked at any surveillance cameras from other homes around Michael's neighborhood. It is just a thought.
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I don't think those 'missing' tapes are missing. I think they don't exist. Makes for a good story though. And it makes his 'death' even more believable to those who trust the media.
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I don't think those 'missing' tapes are missing. I think they don't exist. Makes for a good story though. And it makes his 'death' even more believable to those who trust the media.
well if it were the goal to make them believe his death then they would flat out say...yes ther were tapes and it shows murray murdering michael haha...BUT Michaael doesnt want murray getting in trouble for helping so they simply hid the tapes so murray could get off free...and it makes a good story at the same time
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agreed they would she him getting away absolutely fine so they had to go missing its ok this is just an extra bit of new to report :)
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Latoya has said alot about what happened in the house after MJ's death, and what went missing. Things we wouldn't have known about if she hadn't spoken. If the tapes were missing it would be huge. Given everything she has said so far, i find it surprising she hasn't mentioned this. Again, who says the tapes are missing :roll:
Did'nt she have MJ's music collection? Whom leaked the sond another day? Sony is'nt happy about this. :?
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Latoya has said alot about what happened in the house after MJ's death, and what went missing. Things we wouldn't have known about if she hadn't spoken. If the tapes were missing it would be huge. Given everything she has said so far, i find it surprising she hasn't mentioned this. Again, who says the tapes are missing :roll:
Did'nt she have MJ's music collection? Whom leaked the sond another day? Sony is'nt happy about this. :?
what i dont understand is why sony got so upset about Another Day and not upset about A place With No Name...hmmm maybe because its newer and it has a very huge clue in it heehee
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Latoya has said alot about what happened in the house after MJ's death, and what went missing. Things we wouldn't have known about if she hadn't spoken. If the tapes were missing it would be huge. Given everything she has said so far, i find it surprising she hasn't mentioned this. Again, who says the tapes are missing :roll:
Did'nt she have MJ's music collection? Whom leaked the sond another day? Sony is'nt happy about this. :?
what i dont understand is why sony got so upset about Another Day and not upset about A place With No Name...hmmm maybe because its newer and it has a very huge clue in it heehee
You never know :D But it is very fishy!!
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http://www.celebitchy.com/58711/lapd_in ... kson_died/ (http://www.celebitchy.com/58711/lapd_in_trouble_for_not_properly_sealing_scene_after_michael_jackson_died/)
This article has some interesting points, though it says he's gone. But securing the area is a concern for many.
I had to laugh at the top "escapism can be smart" LOL!
We LOVE you Michael!!
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http://www.celebitchy.com/58711/lapd_in_trouble_for_not_properly_sealing_scene_after_michael_jackson_died/
This article has some interesting points, though it says he's gone. But securing the area is a concern for many.
I had to laugh at the top "escapism can be smart" LOL!
We LOVE you Michael!!
Well he is gone in a sense but not in THAT sense.
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http://www.masala.com/13491-mj---the-missing-tapes
LOL
We are searching for missing police investigation since 7 months... :lol:
What do they want to investigate if there's nothing to investigate?
At school we would say: not sufficient, 6, sit down, repeat class. LOL
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La Toya was a police officier
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La Toya was a police officier
Latoya was NOT a police officer. It was a reality show!!!! She may have learned a few things but she is not a cop by any means...
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@DancingtheDream:
you wrote: "The LAPD messed up so bad by not locking down the house on the day he "died".
But what if the LAPD is involved in the hoax? Then it would be normal NOT to lock the house down ;) Why locking down the house when simply "nothing happened"?
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@DancingtheDream:
you wrote: "The LAPD messed up so bad by not locking down the house on the day he "died".
But what if the LAPD is involved in the hoax? Then it would be normal NOT to lock the house down ;) Why locking down the house when simply "nothing happened"?
If nothing actually happened then to make everything "look" real, then they should have followed proper potocol and locked down the house as they would in a real situation....but then again...at the time when Toya was in the house, it wasnt yet a homocide, so technically they were allowed to let her in the house.
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I don`t believe in accidents here - I am absolutely sure that there is a good reason for the missing footage! Since it might prove just the opposite of what has been suggested: It`ll probably show that NOTHING had happened at that time at that house ...
I remember reading that after Michael died ,his family went to the house and toot everything out, they even took all the furniture that belonged to the owner of the house because Michael was renting that house. They had to go back with the trucks and return all the owners things, crazy, they must have taken the tapes.
La toya admitted that she took all Michael's new songs he had in his vault for his children , over 100.
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I don`t believe in accidents here - I am absolutely sure that there is a good reason for the missing footage! Since it might prove just the opposite of what has been suggested: It`ll probably show that NOTHING had happened at that time at that house ...
I remember reading that after Michael died ,his family went to the house and toot everything out, they even took all the furniture that belonged to the owner of the house because Michael was renting that house. They had to go back with the trucks and return all the owners things, crazy, they must have taken the tapes.
La toya admitted that she took all Michael's new songs he had in his vault for his children , over 100.
How did LaToyah know those songs were in the vault and how did she get into the vault, as i am assuming it had some kind of lock or code on it?
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If the family removed stuff i assume they did this to protect anything that was his? Perhaps they felt they couldn't trust whoever was in there.
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duh i wouldnt trust the public either!! especially after what we human baings have done to him in the past! i wouldnt even trust the police remember in the 2005 trials they were already picking a side..and it was not Mike's side! If i were his sister i would have def broke the law and gone in there and took his music and personal items. who knows with the world these days...if they didnt then they would see some items on ebay that state..."the exact sheets mj died on" just stupid stuff lik that...but then again they shouldnt have gone in there and taken everything so we can have those tapes and see mj making his escape ;) with his music and personal items heehee
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So they never found the tapes...great investigating. lol I remember reading about a safe MJ had in Neverland and the cops when they raided it hired a lock smith to open it and there was a note in there from MJ lol I think I read it in a book :lol:
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wonder if the idea of there being tapes out there somewhere could be being used to make someone nervous ;)
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So they never found the tapes...great investigating. lol I remember reading about a safe MJ had in Neverland and the cops when they raided it hired a lock smith to open it and there was a note in there from MJ lol I think I read it in a book :lol:
LOL - this is funny.
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What did the note say?
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This may sound dumb but do any of us really know if it is the usual practice for stars or anyone shy of a mobster to have security footage of what goes on in the bedroom, or the master bedroom I should say. I mean who wants their private moments on display. I mean we are all human. I for one don't want anyone seeing me blow my nose when I have a horrible cold, changing clothes, talking to Michael posters, making sexy faces while blasting 2000 watts, and all OTHER things that people do in their bedrooms!!!
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Nefari, Michael is long reputed to have his entire home under surveillance on CCTV, everywhere in the house, the grounds, inside and out, including his private quarters, everywhere. So it seems to be normal for him, or at least he wants us to think that it is.
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This may sound dumb but do any of us really know if it is the usual practice for stars or anyone shy of a mobster to have security footage of what goes on in the bedroom, or the master bedroom I should say. I mean who wants their private moments on display. I mean we are all human. I for one don't want anyone seeing me blow my nose when I have a horrible cold, changing clothes, talking to Michael posters, making sexy faces while blasting 2000 watts, and all OTHER things that people do in their bedrooms!!!
:lol: And Michael so hated the paps secretly taking pics of him, even telling Barbara Walters that one had stuck a camera bug in the toilet. Hard choice between privacy and protection with security cameras.
Nefari, Michael is long reputed to have his entire home under surveillance on CCTV, everywhere in the house, the grounds, inside and out, including his private quarters, everywhere. So it seems to be normal for him, or at least he wants us to think that it is.
I guess it's to prevent theft. I think it was Katherine saying sometimes staff stole from them.
If that footage got into the wrong hands, it would be worth millions, especially clips of MJ and the kids.
My personal hunch if there is footage at all, is Latoya or T.T. have it, and at the right time in the hoax as it plays out, they will reveal more tidbits for us to dismantle and figure out. Afterall if the BAM is later this year or next, we need a lot of "food" to keep us going.
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If the family removed stuff i assume they did this to protect anything that was his? Perhaps they felt they couldn't trust whoever was in there.
It is well documented here - apparently there were trucks even 3 times at the house to clean it up.
http://mjhoaxlive.blogspot.com/2009/09/carolwood-move-1.html
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http://www.masala.com/13491-mj---the-missing-tapes
Sorry to break it you but this is an Indian gosspi website and a wannabe tmz like. Being originally from India, I can assure you there as many such online tabloid sites. Trust me, I wouldn't believe this news, unless TMZ had it on there too and this site just copy pasted stuff. But media in India is known to make stuff up. Isn't it odd that they know about it in India and we in America don't know the tapes are being found again. I can try to find more such baseless articles to prove my point. Will post as soon as I find it.
PS- masala in English means spice. Such online tabloids add spice to gossip to sell. Just saying...
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If the security camera in MJ's bedroom were on....my bet is Latoya &family or
Murray
after all....it is a fact that he was scurrying around in that area for many WASTED minutes before the ambulance was called or even security. He had ample time to
do something like that.
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Makes me wonder if the guys in the ambulance didn't have some sort of previously wired system inside the ambulance itself that was set to view everything going on in that bedroom so they could arrive at a precise time on cue from Michael or Murray, when bogus phone calls were made etc...and maybe it's also how they could see Murray scurrying around or whatever they claimed they saw from the grounds outside.
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I don't think MJ trusts the law enforcement or the DA's particularly in Santa Barbara after what they did to him during and after the trial, that is perhaps why the family went in and removed stuff.
It is not what is supposed to happened but this is Michael's story and he has his reasons for doing it. This is his way of presenting hiSTORY :)
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So CM tells bodyguard Alvarez to remove drug paraphernalia before calling 911 and Alvarez mentions split IV bag containing propofol bottle as being one specific item CM asked him to remove, then family comes in and removes items, then scene is secured and Inspector Fleak removes more drug paraphernalia including the IV bag Alvarez claimed he removed. No mention of tapes in testimony. Not even a mention of a search for them.
My questions are, why, after Alavarez claimed he removed bottles and family came in before detectives, were there still bottles laying around for Insp. Fleak to bag? Why wouldn't family have picked up anything Alvarez missed? Why did family only concentrate on personal belongings and music archives? Why didn't CM order Alvarez to recover tapes if he was hiding something? To me only three options: CM has the tapes, family has the tapes or NYPD has tapes - no one is spilling and none of this adds up.
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And when the police assumes that to begin to look for those tapes. ,19 months later :roll:
(http://www.messentools.com/images/emoticones/mensajes/www.MessenTools.com-Mensajes-big-26.gif)
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MJ has the tapes. :lol:
[youtube:qnobdkxc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WK9Y9WjPTM&feature=related[/youtube:qnobdkxc]
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HaHa Mindseye...Love the sig line!
I was just listening to that song last night...I guess you could call is
dissecting it.
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So CM tells bodyguard Alvarez to remove drug paraphernalia before calling 911 and Alvarez mentions split IV bag containing propofol bottle as being one specific item CM asked him to remove, then family comes in and removes items, then scene is secured and Inspector Fleak removes more drug paraphernalia including the IV bag Alvarez claimed he removed. No mention of tapes in testimony. Not even a mention of a search for them.
My questions are, why, after Alavarez claimed he removed bottles and family came in before detectives, were there still bottles laying around for Insp. Fleak to bag? Why wouldn't family have picked up anything Alvarez missed? Why did family only concentrate on personal belongings and music archives? Why didn't CM order Alvarez to recover tapes if he was hiding something? To me only three options: CM has the tapes, family has the tapes or NYPD has tapes - no one is spilling and none of this adds up.
Excellent summation!
I agree...the other thing IS....why did they let the family show up so quickly?
I am sure that has been discussed before.
Then there was that bloody shirt that they left hanging in the closest ...what was THAT About?
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As well as the inside CTV camera's, there was also multiple outside cameras around the grounds and at the gate to see who was trying to enter...and there was an intercom system at the gate as well........
The footage of the entrance would show the ambulance arriving, them carrying MJ down to the ambulance and putting him in the back, and show everything else that happened outside on that day...including then backing out slowly.
If that footage got in the wrong hands, it would be published all over the tabloids, showing MJ dead and being resucitated. It would be worth millions if that really were true.
We only have one pic taken by Ben Evensted of the final photo of MJ, which is definitely photoshopped.
1. The family remembered to remove it before the media got their filthy hands on it, or
2. Conrad Murray retrieved them when he went back to "Get the Cream" from the house because MJ wouldn't want the world knowing about it ?????
So why would Michael tell CM something so personal like that??? Did Michael say "If I die, can you remove the cream from my house" ????
Hmmmmmmmmm.
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definitely photoshopped.
Completely disagree. First off it's not "definitely" anything and second, there is no evidence of photo alterations present. Conversely, the fact that there are 3 slightly different frames, in essence 3 different ambulance pics, not one, is strong evidence that it is NOT altered in any way. Altering one would require altering 3, which would require 3 originals, all 3 of which would need to match angle and perspective and depth of field in order to match the background in all 3 ambulance pics that the face was pasted to. This process becomes so complex, and to complete it without any discernible shop lines 3 times... it quickly becomes obvious that it would be 100% easier and more realistic to STAGE the pic then to monkey around with shopping it.
If you shop it, someone can find out and prove it. PROVE in black and white that it's fake and hold it up for the world to see. That hasn't happened. No one in 19 months has proven it's shopped... only said it a lot with no real supporting evidence to back it up. Oxman says it was his opinion that it was 99% likely photoshopped. Wtf does that mean? 99% likely to be shopped in his opinion? So that means he doesn't know squat. He probably looked into less then we did, considering he used ANCIENT ago debunked evidence to "back up" his claim. Sorry Oxman, that's the wrong pic buddy. The angle of the face doesn't even match. And some are using this to back up the photoshop theory? Come on. Have we learned nothing? Oxman opened his mouth and spun a weak line of pathetic bullshit with nothing to back it up. It should have been an easy test to pass for even a beginner hoaxer. Oxman's statement=BullShit aka Gossip aka Hearsay aka He Made It Up.
Regardless, why bother with the elaborate trouble of, and giant RISK of shopping when you can just stage it. Get a MJ mannequin, pop it in an ambulance and take a pic from outside. Doesn't even have to be on 6/25/09. Can be any time. The risk of having someone not affiliated with the hoax be able to prove, and I mean PROVE, not just talk, that the ambulance pic is shopped, is way too big because it would take some control of the reveal and timing out of MJs hands. It would be a big mess, starting with a boat load of legal trouble for Ben, extending to who knows where. Is Ben gonna hold the course if he gets sued for slander and fraud and a bazillion dollars by ET? Wow, I don't know. Beyond that, it breaks the rule of staying within the legal boundaries. Working towards a presumed reveal/comeback, legal backlash should be reduced or eliminated as much as possible and this seems a dumb law to break when it can be so easily avoided. You can't sell a shopped or altered pic without disclosing that. Why take even the slightest chance when there's probably several Bad era MJ dummys at MJs disposal. The "MJ" in the pic appears to be MJ from the Bad era so does that mean the pic is fake? No, too big a jump in logic. It means the MJ is fake. That's all. You can't assume anything else from Bad era ambulance riding MJ in "final photo" without proof. And it just isn't there to support the photoshop theory.
I can rant forever on this. I need to shut up about it. It doesn't matter in the long run. Sooner or later he will tell us all the answers.
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Bec, I appreciated your knowledge about photoshopping...talking about the "last" photo can get messy.
There was probably no CTV turned on that day....so there was nothing to lie about ???
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RunFaYaLife wrote:
I agree...the other thing IS....why did they let the family show up so quickly?
Yeah almost like they were waiting out front to go in as soon as the ambulance drove out ...
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Bec, brilliant post about the photo! I'd love for the pic to be used in the trial - Q for EMT's: how come you didn't recognise MJ? A from EMT's: that pic is fake. Call Ben Evensted - explain yourself man!!
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definitely photoshopped.
Completely disagree. First off it's not "definitely" anything and second, there is no evidence of photo alterations present. Conversely, the fact that there are 3 slightly different frames, in essence 3 different ambulance pics, not one, is strong evidence that it is NOT altered in any way. Altering one would require altering 3, which would require 3 originals, all 3 of which would need to match angle and perspective and depth of field in order to match the background in all 3 ambulance pics that the face was pasted to. This process becomes so complex, and to complete it without any discernible shop lines 3 times... it quickly becomes obvious that it would be 100% easier and more realistic to STAGE the pic then to monkey around with shopping it.
If you shop it, someone can find out and prove it. PROVE in black and white that it's fake and hold it up for the world to see. That hasn't happened. No one in 19 months has proven it's shopped... only said it a lot with no real supporting evidence to back it up. Oxman says it was his opinion that it was 99% likely photoshopped. Wtf does that mean? 99% likely to be shopped in his opinion? So that means he doesn't know squat. He probably looked into less then we did, considering he used ANCIENT ago debunked evidence to "back up" his claim. Sorry Oxman, that's the wrong pic buddy. The angle of the face doesn't even match. And some are using this to back up the photoshop theory? Come on. Have we learned nothing? Oxman opened his mouth and spun a weak line of pathetic bullshit with nothing to back it up. It should have been an easy test to pass for even a beginner hoaxer. Oxman's statement=BullShit aka Gossip aka Hearsay aka He Made It Up.
Regardless, why bother with the elaborate trouble of, and giant RISK of shopping when you can just stage it. Get a MJ mannequin, pop it in an ambulance and take a pic from outside. Doesn't even have to be on 6/25/09. Can be any time. The risk of having someone not affiliated with the hoax be able to prove, and I mean PROVE, not just talk, that the ambulance pic is shopped, is way too big because it would take some control of the reveal and timing out of MJs hands. It would be a big mess, starting with a boat load of legal trouble for Ben, extending to who knows where. Is Ben gonna hold the course if he gets sued for slander and fraud and a bazillion dollars by ET? Wow, I don't know. Beyond that, it breaks the rule of staying within the legal boundaries. Working towards a presumed reveal/comeback, legal backlash should be reduced or eliminated as much as possible and this seems a dumb law to break when it can be so easily avoided. You can't sell a shopped or altered pic without disclosing that. Why take even the slightest chance when there's probably several Bad era MJ dummys at MJs disposal. The "MJ" in the pic appears to be MJ from the Bad era so does that mean the pic is fake? No, too big a jump in logic. It means the MJ is fake. That's all. You can't assume anything else from Bad era ambulance riding MJ in "final photo" without proof. And it just isn't there to support the photoshop theory.
I can rant forever on this. I need to shut up about it. It doesn't matter in the long run. Sooner or later he will tell us all the answers.
May be it was cropped but not photoshopped.. that is why there is 3 different angles of the "death" photo. Oxman is just there to throw some curve balls in this Hoax. I would not get too upset at what the has to say.
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The question is: WHO HAD ENOUGH TIME TO STEEL THE FOOTAGE? AND WHEN WAS IT TAKEN? I highly doubt that an idiot like CM is able to handel such a complicate system. Besides, the article states that there were GAPS in the footage!!!!
WHAT DOES THIS EXACTLY MEAN?? AND WHO DELETED THEM AND WHEN? I GUESS THIS WOULD TAKE SOME TIME. SO THE WHOLE THING MUST HAVE BEEN PLANNED FROM THE BEGINNING ...
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The question is: WHO HAD ENOUGH TIME TO STEEL THE FOOTAGE? AND WHEN WAS IT TAKEN? I highly doubt that an idiot like CM is able to handel such a complicate system. Besides, the article states that there were GAPS in the footage!!!!
WHAT DOES THIS EXACTLY MEAN?? AND WHO DELETED THEM AND WHEN? I GUESS THIS WOULD TAKE SOME TIME. SO THE WHOLE THING MUST HAVE BEEN PLANNED FROM THE BEGINNING ...
Is the article from an authoritative source? If so, then the tapes at least exist. CC cameras don't automatically indicate recordings. I have heard of cases where cameras were not set to record even though they were running.
Assuming tapes exist, CM could have ordered one of the bodyguards to retrieve them. If he has them they must implicate him or surely he would have left them there, as this would have easily proven his innocence and avoided his trial.
If the family (including MJ) has them then surely they would have come forward with them in order TO implicate CM and prove his guilt, unless the recordings are to be used as evidence of guilt in the trial by the prosecution and they are therefore being held as an ace card.
On the other hand surely they would have been introduced if they proved his innocence. I would see no reason why anyone would want to force an innocent man to trial, especially if evidence exists to prove said innocence. If NYPD have the tapes all the more reason they should have been produced by now, IF they show no wrong doing by CM.
So imo, IF tapes exist, they are being held as evidence and will be brought forward in the trial or all staff who were in the house are complicit and CM has had them destroyed.
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Bec, brilliant post about the photo! I'd love for the pic to be used in the trial - Q for EMT's: how come you didn't recognise MJ? A from EMT's: that pic is fake. Call Ben Evensted - explain yourself man!!
Also in the testimony at the prelim, it was stated that MJ had on pajamas and a shower cap in the ambulance. :shock: :shock: Not what I saw I the picture. did you? Or did they take off the cap and put his wig on for a cameo shot? Makes no sense.
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Also in the testimony at the prelim, it was stated that MJ had on pajamas and a shower cap in the ambulance. :shock: :shock: Not what I saw I the picture. did you? Or did they take off the cap and put his wig on for a cameo shot? Makes no sense.
More things to ponder...
Okay...here is my take on that one...
he did wear shower caps over his hair at home
I have seen youtubes on the kid's birthday party ...
as I am sure you all have that showed one Under his Fedora.
So cracked me up!.....some of the things he did/does so reminds
me of myself...like wearing strange things
[well to the press and some other people] out in public. Teeeeeeeheeeeeee.
Anyway...yeah it would not surprise me if he did have on a shower cap...but it probably fell off in the room...and out of respect for MJ I think Murray or Alverez would have put his wig on.
He was Verra concerned about how he looked ...and the hair deal would be MAJOR.
This is not saying that I believe the ambulance pic is legit...
like everyone else I DO have questions and wonderments about that.
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It is very much possible that Michael did not have camera in his bedroom, for a privacy reasons. But still, tapes recorded inside the house other rooms, corridor to see what time Murray went to the bathroom and for how long, Murray's bedroom- anything that may show he was going to kill MJ or opposite, or where Murray was talking over the phone for how long, what was his appearance-worried, not worried. Children that supposedly were called for help and pray, chaos in the house while trying to save Michael, call to 911,how Michael was taken out of house, etc. And outside of the house, who got in and out, what time, what security was doing, what time MJ came home the day before, etc.
Lot's of answers will be covered through missing tapes.
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Ok I know I am putting my neck on a chopping block when I say this but ummmmmm
WHAT IF MJ HAD COMPANY OVER AND WANTED TO MAKE LOVE OR SOMETHING U KNOW? MJ BEING AS PRIVATE AS HE WAS WOULD NOT WANT SECURITY OR STAFF WATCHING HIM RIGHT! And I am very serious. :oops:
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Then he probably would put a fedora over the camera if he was entertaining :D
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Ok I know I am putting my neck on a chopping block when I say this but ummmmmm
WHAT IF MJ HAD COMPANY OVER AND WANTED TO MAKE LOVE OR SOMETHING U KNOW? MJ BEING AS PRIVATE AS HE WAS WOULD NOT WANT SECURITY OR STAFF WATCHING HIM RIGHT! And I am very serious. :oops:
Michael reportedly had a very LARGE......... video collection :lol: (what did you think I was going to say? :P )
So maybe he recorded that for his private collection too.. ;)
I assume he'd know where not to 'do the deed' if he wanted that kept private.... if that's what you are worrying about.
And, anyway, if you ask Halperin he'll say Michael was dressing up as a woman and getting his lollipop on with a construction worker in a dirty cheap Las Vegas motel. :roll: ;)
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Halperin makes me vomit. He called/calls himself a friend and then makes these kinds of accusations. Even if one iota of truth were in it, what friend would disclose such personal information? What purpose does it serve? He is an envious jackass :evil: and I have no respect for him or his opinions..
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What are the chances of these tapes 'magically' turning up during or towards the end of the trial/hoax and suddenly everyone will see that it was not Michael Joe Jackson who died that day ... if anyone did at all? ;)
The tape may show this terminally ill MJ lookalike killing himself by self injection or injestion of Propofol when Murray is out of the room - if any tapes actually exist of that day?