Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators
Hoax Investigation => June 25, 2009 => Carolwood Drive, Events & Statements on/About June 25 => Topic started by: scorpionchik on April 16, 2011, 11:12:57 PM
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Hello investigators. Just got back from Carolwood dr. I haveabout 12 pictures, will download later. YOu know takes time. YOU CANNOT IMAGINE WHAT I HAVE MISSED.... STUPID ME...71 AMBULANCE SLOWLY DRIVING THERE,THAT WAS ABOUT 7 pm. THEY DROVE RIGHT TOWARDS ME AFTER I GOT THERE, BUT BECAUSE I WAS CONCETRATED TO FIND PARKING, THEY PASSED BY ME AND DROVE AWAY.
WHAT I NOTICED THOUGH is # E 71 ON THE FRONT OF THE AMB. DO WE HAVE AMB. FRONT PHOTO WITH E 71? BACK AND SIDE OF THE AMB. HAD JUST 71.
NEXT, MY IMPRESSION/OPINION ONLY, MICHAEL COULD NOT LIVE OVER THERE. BIZZARE ROAD. CAROLWOOD DR. CROSSES WITH MONOVALE DRIVE THAT HAS A LOT OF CLOSE EACH OTHER HOUSES, A LOT OF CARS PARKED ON THE ROAD. MY IMPRESSION, MICHAEL WOULD NOT LIVE N THAT CROWDY AREA. THE NEIGHBORHOOD ITSELF IS IN ELITE AREA, CLOSE TO BEVERLY HILLS AND BEL AIR, BUT THAT ROAD CROSSES WITH ANOTHER BIZZARE ROAD FULL OF PEOPLE, NO WAY TO LIVE FOR KING OF POP WITH KIDS. UNLESS HE REALLY WAS SO BROKE, THAT HE COULD NOT AFFORD ANOTHER ELITE DRIVE AROUND THAT NEIGHBORHOOD (FOR EXAMPLE LEXINGTON DRIVE WAS AROUND, I DROVE & THAT WAS MUCH MORE PRIVATE AND ELITE AREA SUTABLE FOR MICHAEL). YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN.
NEXT, I SAW THE "HOLLYWOOD TOUR" TRUCK. I WAS THERE LONG ENOUGH TO TAKE THEIR PICTURE.
ABOUT TRASH CANS ON THE PICTURES & VIDEO WE HAVE SEEN SO FAR; THE CAROLWOOD DR. IS VERY CLOSE TO MAIN STREET, SUNSET BLVD, AND TOO NARROW TO PUT THAT MANY TRASH CANS ON THE ROAD, THAT WOULD BLOCK THE VEHICLES' WAY THAT DRIVE IN FROM SUNSET BLVD. NO WAY TO PUT TRASH CANS ON THAT WAY. I HAVE BEEN THERE ABOUT 20 min. TAKING PICTURES & OBSERVING AREA, SO MANY VEHICLES DROVE IN & OUT, I THOUGHT I AM ON THE BLVD, TOO BUSY TRUFFIC OVER THERE.
ABOUT GATE- THERE IS NO WAY FOR GATES TO BE TRANSPARENT IN ONE PICTURE, THEN BLOCKED IN ANOTHER ONE WE HAVE SEEN. I TOOK CLOSE PICTURE OF GATES, SO YOU CAN SEE WHAT I MEAN. THAT GATE IS DEASIGNED ONLY 1 WAY, TO BE BLOCKED.
NEXT VERY WEIRD FACT THAT I THINK OF IS THE AMBULANCE VIDEO WE HAVE SEEN SHOWS OTHER VEHICLES: TOUR BUS, BEN'S CAR, OTHER CARS ON THE ROAD THAT DAY, THERE IS NO WAY ON THAT NARROW ROAD COULD THOSE MANY CARS FIT ALONG W 2 AMBULANCE, BECAUSE OF THE TRAFFIC, WE DON'T SEE ON THE VIDEO ANY OTHER VEHICLES TRYING DRIVE IN OR OUT THE CAROLWOOD ROAD YOU CAN'T BELIEVE WHAT A HUGE TRAFFIC THAT WOULD CREATE ON SUNSET BLVD, WHICH IS VERY BUSY BLVD AND DON'T HAVE PULL OVER AREAS. YOU HAVE TO KEEP DRIVING. THAT'S ANOTHER INTERESTING THOUGHT I GOT.
So, far that's all I remember for now. check back for pictures. IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS FOR CLARIFICATIONS, PLEASE ASK.
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scorpionchik thank you for your time you put into this. Wow you have guts. My friend went to Hollywood last year and she took the tour bus, she told me that the street was narrow, and she did not understand how so many people were around the house the day he died. Only the fire truck would have taken half of the street she said. Maybe he did not stay at that house. He also had a house in Vegas right? So maybe that was his residence, and carolwood drive was just a bate, I honestly thing it was not Michael on June 25/2009. I can't wait to see pictures. Thank you again for all your time and help. God bless.
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scorpionchik thank you for your time you put into this. Wow you have guts. My friend went to Hollywood last year and she took the tour bus, she told me that the street was narrow, and she did not understand how so many people were around the house the day he died. Only the fire truck would have taken half of the street she said. Maybe he did not stay at that house. He also had a house in Vegas right? So maybe that was his residence, and carolwood drive was just a bate, I honestly thing it was not Michael on June 25/2009. I can't wait to see pictures. Thank you again for all your time and help. God bless.
you are welcome all4loveandbelieve. She is right. That's what I too have observed today.
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scorpionchik thank you for your time you put into this. Wow you have guts. My friend went to Hollywood last year and she took the tour bus, she told me that the street was narrow, and she did not understand how so many people were around the house the day he died. Only the fire truck would have taken half of the street she said. Maybe he did not stay at that house. He also had a house in Vegas right? So maybe that was his residence, and carolwood drive was just a bate, I honestly thing it was not Michael on June 25/2009. I can't wait to see pictures. Thank you again for all your time and help. God bless.
you are welcome all4loveandbelieve. She is right. That's what I too have observed today.
So I am wondering, how did the fire truck, the ambulances, the red car the tour bus fitted in that narrow street? Too bad I don't live in hollywood, I would love to see it for myself. I commend you for the good job you have done scorpionchik can't wait to see the pictures so we can get an idea.
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Can't wait to see your pictures! Thanks for taking the time to check this out! We may learn something
new today!!! ;) :)
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wow this is very interesting. The pics please, when you have time.
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YOU CANNOT IMAGINE WHAT I HAVE MISSED.... STUPID ME...71 AMBULANCE SLOWLY DRIVING THERE,THAT WAS ABOUT 7 pm. THEY DROVE RIGHT TOWARDS ME AFTER I GOT THERE, BUT BECAUSE I WAS CONCETRATED TO FIND PARKING, THEY PASSED BY ME AND DROVE AWAY.
this is crazy...they passed by you and you missed them ahhhhhhh, what a bad-luck.....but did it look like in the pics THAT day...or the other day?
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Was there any car parked in the garage?
How many gates were there, only 2 or more?
Because I remember when I went there about a month and a half ago there was a car parked in the garage (side gate)...I went at like 9pm and it was so pitch black I couldn't see anything but there was a light on in the Carolwood house. Then I came back the next day and saw the ambulance #71 with the sirens on and then 20 min later it was parked back at the firehouse.
Like you said the roads are narrow and it is very open...it crosses between two roads...compared to Elvis' house which is more private.
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I could download only 3, I have to resize the rest.
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YOU CANNOT IMAGINE WHAT I HAVE MISSED.... STUPID ME...71 AMBULANCE SLOWLY DRIVING THERE,THAT WAS ABOUT 7 pm. THEY DROVE RIGHT TOWARDS ME AFTER I GOT THERE, BUT BECAUSE I WAS CONCETRATED TO FIND PARKING, THEY PASSED BY ME AND DROVE AWAY.
this is crazy...they passed by you and you missed them ahhhhhhh, what a bad-luck.....but did it look like in the pics THAT day...or the other day?
yes Gina, it looked the same amb. but with E71 on the front. Do we have a front picture of ambulance at all?
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Close picture of the gate for design comparison
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Back side of the house and lot's vehicles around, BTW, the # 100 is the first and last house at the beginning of Carolwood,as I said close to Sunset, then Carolwood continues but that house has no adjacent houses on the left, nor right, nor in the front.
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I took picture of the road, so you can see how narrow it is. Anyone can get explanation how 7-8- large trash cans, those many vehicles and people could fit on this narrow road. The house is on the left side.
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On the one pic. you can see vehicle turns to carolwood dr. how close the house to the Sunset Blv., the house is in the left. Anothe pic. showes that Carolwood dr. ends along with house and crosses to Monovale and you can see residents' vehicles. Very crowdy road. I mean, hard to believe Michael would rent house over there.
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Monovale st that crosses w/Carolwood, see how many vehicles there. Pic. # 103, do you recognize the edge where trash cans were put? NO WAY they can be there and ambulances or other vehicles could drove to Carolwood dr., especially approach to the house. TRASH CANS WOULD DEFINITELY BLOCK THE WAY.
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Again down road of the Monovale rd. See vehicles, all those are residents'. On the right side, the back of the house. Right there I met ambulance 71, there were no place to park. Finally I found one place, but missed amb. :(
It's ok, guys, I am gonna go there again. So, the tour, I guess is a common routine of that area. I don't know why tour brings guests to residential area though. It is weird. Maybe Michael knew that too. There is no way, MJ would live in the area where tours usually come and go. I really got better idea of this whole thing.
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FInal pic. again house. Do you see the crack on asphalt, so that the size of the one way to go up by Carolwood dr., the other same size of the foad is for opposit traffic. Really narrow. After Neverland, that is NOT the place for Michael to live.
(http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/sehrgrosse/large-smiley-007.gif)
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Scorpionchik, thank u so much for the pics and for the info, agree,the road is too narrow, there is no way so many cars could be there at the same time the day MJ "died"
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Was there any car parked in the garage?
How many gates were there, only 2 or more?
Because I remember when I went there about a month and a half ago there was a car parked in the garage (side gate)...I went at like 9pm and it was so pitch black I couldn't see anything but there was a light on in the Carolwood house. Then I came back the next day and saw the ambulance #71 with the sirens on and then 20 min later it was parked back at the firehouse.
Like you said the roads are narrow and it is very open...it crosses between two roads...compared to Elvis' house which is more private.
Only 2 gates, those we have seen. Yes, that car still there, you ca see on the photo. Oh, I forgot about Elvis house. Where is his house , on Carolwood as well? What I recall from the LMP interview w/Oprah, when they show Elvis house, then Michael's, was pretty close. But if it was on Carolwood dr., there is no way that house close to MJ's because there is no house next to house # 100, only back side has if you remember.
It is weird that you also saw ambulance 71. Is that ambulance has nothing to do but drive around that area? THEN WHY THEY NEEDED TO CALL 911, THEY COULD JUST GET OUT OF HOUSE AND WAIVE AMBULANCE & IT WOULD BE RIGHT THERE . IT SHOULD NOT TAKE EVEN 1 MIN. AND THEY COULD SAVE MICHAEL, OF COURSE IF HE WAS DYING. :lol: [/u]
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Scorpionchik, thank u so much for the pics and for the info, agree,the road is too narrow, there is no way so many cars could be there at the same time the day MJ "died"
Your are welcome, my dear.
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Thanks for that information.....Elvis Presley's old home is at 144 Monovale Dve...
I too have many pictures from google saved to my computer...these are it:
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At least the light on the right is working now....It wasn't working on the 25th June.
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This is from a google search and others have added some other photos to it....
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
It was added when Mj (supposedly moved in) and it's just temporary black PVC backing material...that adds as a blackout to allow for more privacy.
What gets me is the monovale dve entrance, that is an underground carpark. It takes you to the other side of the house, where the foyer is. And yes, it looks so much smaller than the original video........
Scorpianchik, thanks for your hard work..I have to rely on Dr Google :lol: :lol:
I will post a video of a person in the Starline tour bus....for comparison...
http://www.wat.tv/video/michael-jackson ... exyf_.html (http://www.wat.tv/video/michael-jackson-ambulance-1lnmx_2exyf_.html)
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Thank you scorpionchik! These pics are really great, and much appreciated!
A couple of things that I have to question:
I totally see your point about the trash cans. After seeing the streets and comparing them, I would think the other gate entrance is more of the utility/day-to-day gate. It does not lead to the front door. I would think that gate is the gate (Monovale) used for trash. Anyone been there on trash day? It seems as though folks are there...caretakers or whatever. Also, time of day is still a big factor for me. I have always felt the shadows were off throughout everything. What time of day were some of these pics taken? One more thought....the other thing I always thought odd, there were no police that day. Surely, they (911 and crew) know that area and know the streets are small. An emergency of this sort would surely need police to help guide/stop traffic. The Hollywood tour companies knew that was MJ's house. If I worked at the 911 call center, I'd keep a list of celebrity addresses. I'd be prepared to know that area very well. I don't buy that they didn't know it was MJ's house....really?
OK....back to my somewhat cold coffee.....might go for tea instead! ;)
Thanks again for the pictures....very sweet of you!
Blessings Always!
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
I JUST LOVE that you went there and snooped for us!!!!!!!!!! I am so excited. I wanted to do that, but, here I am in Michigan.
I think, that I have an answer to your question about seeing through the gate. In one of your pics, 087, I see a "cord" with a panel at the edge of the gate. It looks like a sort of open and close type of covering. So that if you want privacy it closes. The edge of the cover has grommets , like a flag. It's probably electric from the looks of the wire and the long rectangular panel along the gate.
Again, thank YOU so VERY much!!!!!!!!!!!1
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
I JUST LOVE that you went there and snooped for us!!!!!!!!!! I am so excited. I wanted to do that, but, here I am in Michigan.
I think, that I have an answer to your question about seeing through the gate. In one of your pics, 087, I see a "cord" with a panel at the edge of the gate. It looks like a sort of open and close type of covering. So that if you want privacy it closes. The edge of the cover has grommets , like a flag. It's probably electric from the looks of the wire and the long rectangular panel along the gate.
Again, thank YOU so VERY much!!!!!!!!!!
Oh, and, I think maybe Michael was living down the road at the Beverly Hills Hotel, were the family had just had a "meeting" and the phone call came from. Remember, Howard Hughes lived there too! And the vicinity to Carolwood, Hayvenhurst, and the firestation and UCLA were all pretty central to it!
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Is this a hollywood movie set? Strange that the very same ambulance is seen cruising the neighborhood. Has the footage been debunked for any of it being greeb screened? Illusion.
Great pictures. Good work Scorp! Boy do we have some people on this site who have missed their calling. I’ve seen better investigative skills here than I’ve seen anywhere. Great job!
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Question: what’s the make and model of that ambulance?
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
I JUST LOVE that you went there and snooped for us!!!!!!!!!! I am so excited. I wanted to do that, but, here I am in Michigan.
I think, that I have an answer to your question about seeing through the gate. In one of your pics, 087, I see a "cord" with a panel at the edge of the gate. It looks like a sort of open and close type of covering. So that if you want privacy it closes. The edge of the cover has grommets , like a flag. It's probably electric from the looks of the wire and the long rectangular panel along the gate.
Again, thank YOU so VERY much!!!!!!!!!!
Oh, and, I think maybe Michael was living down the road at the Beverly Hills Hotel, were the family had just had a "meeting" and the phone call came from. Remember, Howard Hughes lived there too! And the vicinity to Carolwood, Hayvenhurst, and the firestation and UCLA were all pretty central to it!
Okay...I've compared the crack in the road pic to the video and it IS the same. Everything is the SAME.
I want to look and see if the trash cans were on the side of the road actually...
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Was there any car parked in the garage?
How many gates were there, only 2 or more?
Because I remember when I went there about a month and a half ago there was a car parked in the garage (side gate)...I went at like 9pm and it was so pitch black I couldn't see anything but there was a light on in the Carolwood house. Then I came back the next day and saw the ambulance #71 with the sirens on and then 20 min later it was parked back at the firehouse.
Like you said the roads are narrow and it is very open...it crosses between two roads...compared to Elvis' house which is more private.
About 9 months ago there was also a covered car parked in the garage.
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Thanks Scorpionchik for traveling there and making pics for us too, it's highly appreciated!
One more thought....the other thing I always thought odd, there were no police that day. Surely, they (911 and crew) know that area and know the streets are small. An emergency of this sort would surely need police to help guide/stop traffic.
It's a really important question Wishingstar, thanks for bringing this up, so where the hell were the police? They should have helped in the very first place to get the world's most famous patient to the hospital as soon as possible, but as it seems it was not there intention, cause the ambulance didn't make it fast through the gates either.......If i remember right, the police went there just the next day.....?
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I'm glad you brought that back up!! Whenever I've gone in an ambulance or seen anyone else do so, there is always the ambulance, and a firetruck and a police car!!! The police never did show up did they!!!
Also, I am thinking that that other drive entrance is NOT underground. It is another entrance from the other street, or works like a circle drive. You can see that same shaped cement archway in the pics in the big black gate pics, through to that entrance. On the back sided pics, you can see the same shaped cement. It looks like a very short distance from one gate entrance to the other. Perhaps that one suv had that exit blocked.
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From what I see now there is a soft steel gate as well as an adjusted "wall-like full gate" atthe same place. Hence there would be no difference "sites", just depending on if only one (soft steel) or both (full "wall-type-of-thing") were closed.
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From what I see now there is a soft steel gate as well as an adjusted "wall-like full gate" atthe same place. Hence there would be no difference "sites", just depending on if only one (soft steel) or both (full "wall-type-of-thing") were closed.
Maybe, but I think it's a privacy screen that unrolls behind it, because you can see from the pics that there is a tarp/screen from the ropes, and grommets...YOU CAN SEE IT in pic 087. :)
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
I JUST LOVE that you went there and snooped for us!!!!!!!!!! I am so excited. I wanted to do that, but, here I am in Michigan.
I think, that I have an answer to your question about seeing through the gate. In one of your pics, 087, I see a "cord" with a panel at the edge of the gate. It looks like a sort of open and close type of covering. So that if you want privacy it closes. The edge of the cover has grommets , like a flag. It's probably electric from the looks of the wire and the long rectangular panel along the gate.
Again, thank YOU so VERY much!!!!!!!!!!!1
Fordtocarr,i have an uncle who lives in detroit, Allen Park. Do you live near by?
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From what I see now there is a soft steel gate as well as an adjusted "wall-like full gate" atthe same place. Hence there would be no difference "sites", just depending on if only one (soft steel) or both (full "wall-type-of-thing") were closed.
Maybe, but I think it's a privacy screen that unrolls behind it, because you can see from the pics that there is a tarp/screen from the ropes, and grommets...YOU CAN SEE IT in pic 087. :)
The grommets are very visible on that picture. I agree with your assertion.
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Scorpionchik, thank you so much for the pictures. One thing puzzles me, I live in Montreal, I know when an ambulance is called , police cars are right behind. That day there was a firetruck? Why a firetruck? There was no fire. Unless they needed a ladder to go to the top to get the patient? In case they couldn't bring him down with the stretcher. I have no clue. Probably every country has different laws. Thanks again for your time you have invested in this. Blessings.
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@wishingstar you are right. Police should be there to arrange traffic for ambulance to drive in and out, butbecause maybe they supposedly did not know the area and that it was MJ, therefore police was not involved that day?
However, as MJhasSpoken said on 1st page, she was there some time ago and also saw 71 ambulance driving around those roads and I saw 71 amb. yesterday, so it is unusual but seems set up routine for amb. to supervise that area perhaps. Then why wait for amb., how long they were waiting for ambulance to arrive?
@fordocarr maybe you are right but from what I saw that black sheet cord where waved and twisted too tight within grommets to be easily removed and put back.
@hesouttamylife I could not see make and model, next time I am gonna stop them and interrogate. :lol:
@everlastinglove_MJ the covered car is still there. Did you look at all pictures?
@all4loveandbelieve True, why 2nd fire truck if emergency call is not about fire and they supposedly did not know it is MJ house and could have 2-3 floors therefore they might need ladders. :roll:
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
I JUST LOVE that you went there and snooped for us!!!!!!!!!! I am so excited. I wanted to do that, but, here I am in Michigan.
I think, that I have an answer to your question about seeing through the gate. In one of your pics, 087, I see a "cord" with a panel at the edge of the gate. It looks like a sort of open and close type of covering. So that if you want privacy it closes. The edge of the cover has grommets , like a flag. It's probably electric from the looks of the wire and the long rectangular panel along the gate.
Again, thank YOU so VERY much!!!!!!!!!!!1
Fordtocarr,i have an uncle who lives in detroit, Allen Park. Do you live near by?
I'm an hour and a half from there...92 miles :))
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@wishingstar you are right. Police should be there to arrange traffic for ambulance to drive in and out, butbecause maybe they supposedly did not know the area and that it was MJ, therefore police was not involved that day?
However, as MJhasSpoken said on 1st page, she was there some time ago and also saw 71 ambulance driving around those roads and I saw 71 amb. yesterday, so it is unusual but seems set up routine for amb. to supervise that area perhaps. Then why wait for amb., how long they were waiting for ambulance to arrive?
@fordocarr maybe you are right but from what I saw that black sheet cord where waved and twisted too tight within grommets to be easily removed and put back.
Right...so I figured, that it rolls up sideways...? you understand, like a privacy awning...I mean, you can SEE it's a tarp, with the grommets. Maybe they just put it THERE FOR THE HOAX so no one could watch the goings on!
@hesouttamylife I could not see make and model, next time I am gonna stop them and interrogate. :lol:
@everlastinglove_MJ the covered car is still there. Did you look at all pictures?
@all4loveandbelieve True, why 2nd fire truck if emergency call is not about fire and they supposedly did not know it is MJ house and could have 2-3 floors therefore they might need ladders. :roll:
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YOU CANNOT IMAGINE WHAT I HAVE MISSED.... STUPID ME...71 AMBULANCE SLOWLY DRIVING THERE,THAT WAS ABOUT 7 pm. THEY DROVE RIGHT TOWARDS ME AFTER I GOT THERE, BUT BECAUSE I WAS CONCETRATED TO FIND PARKING, THEY PASSED BY ME AND DROVE AWAY.
this is crazy...they passed by you and you missed them ahhhhhhh, what a bad-luck.....but did it look like in the pics THAT day...or the other day?
yes Gina, it looked the same amb. but with E71 on the front. Do we have a front picture of ambulance at all?
This is the only one I could find on the front of the ambulance.
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@fordocarr that's not a front. E71 was on the front under or above the bumper and I guess looked smaller, not sure.
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@fordocarr that's not a front. E71 was on the front under or above the bumper and I guess looked smaller, not sure.
It says it's the ambulance...I didn't write that under the pic...so, who's wrong here? I realize this isn't the front...but I'm trying for you. I'm just saying, this is the one the press said AT THE TIME OF IT was bringing Michael there.
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
I JUST LOVE that you went there and snooped for us!!!!!!!!!! I am so excited. I wanted to do that, but, here I am in Michigan.
I think, that I have an answer to your question about seeing through the gate. In one of your pics, 087, I see a "cord" with a panel at the edge of the gate. It looks like a sort of open and close type of covering. So that if you want privacy it closes. The edge of the cover has grommets , like a flag. It's probably electric from the looks of the wire and the long rectangular panel along the gate.
Again, thank YOU so VERY much!!!!!!!!!!!1
Fordtocarr,i have an uncle who lives in detroit, Allen Park. Do you live near by?
I'm an hour and a half from there...92 miles :))
That is so cool. The last time I was in Detroit was 15 yrs ago. I need to go visit my uncle and aunt.. blessings.
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
I JUST LOVE that you went there and snooped for us!!!!!!!!!! I am so excited. I wanted to do that, but, here I am in Michigan.
I think, that I have an answer to your question about seeing through the gate. In one of your pics, 087, I see a "cord" with a panel at the edge of the gate. It looks like a sort of open and close type of covering. So that if you want privacy it closes. The edge of the cover has grommets , like a flag. It's probably electric from the looks of the wire and the long rectangular panel along the gate.
Again, thank YOU so VERY much!!!!!!!!!!!1
AND ME!!! If you go, I'll meet you and we can do lunch. Where are you living?
Fordtocarr,i have an uncle who lives in detroit, Allen Park. Do you live near by?
I'm an hour and a half from there...92 miles :))
That is so cool. The last time I was in Detroit was 15 yrs ago. I need to go visit my uncle and aunt.. blessings.
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I found EMS vehicle front pictures serving Homby Hills/Bel Air area, they all have E then number above the front bumper. So, I saw and missed that same 71 ambulance.http://lafd.org/find-a-fire-station
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you are welcome 2good2btrue. I will go one more time and see where the Elvis' house is.
I don't understand how the gate can get transparent. YOu see the close picture of the gate, it looks impossible to remove that blocking sheet or whatever it is. At least from outside it looks impossible to detach.
I JUST LOVE that you went there and snooped for us!!!!!!!!!! I am so excited. I wanted to do that, but, here I am in Michigan.
I think, that I have an answer to your question about seeing through the gate. In one of your pics, 087, I see a "cord" with a panel at the edge of the gate. It looks like a sort of open and close type of covering. So that if you want privacy it closes. The edge of the cover has grommets , like a flag. It's probably electric from the looks of the wire and the long rectangular panel along the gate.
Again, thank YOU so VERY much!!!!!!!!!!!1
AND ME!!! If you go, I'll meet you and we can do lunch. Where are you living?
Fordtocarr,i have an uncle who lives in detroit, Allen Park. Do you live near by?
I'm an hour and a half from there...92 miles :))
That is so cool. The last time I was in Detroit was 15 yrs ago. I need to go visit my uncle and aunt.. blessings.
I live in Montreal, he use to live in Windsor Ontario before, then they moved in Detroit Allen Park, yes we should keep in touch and I will definately meet you for lunch. I will let you know when I am going. I know it is time for a visit soon, they are getting old and they cannot travel as much as they use too.
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scorpionchik thank you for your time you put into this. Wow you have guts. My friend went to Hollywood last year and she took the tour bus, she told me that the street was narrow, and she did not understand how so many people were around the house the day he died. Only the fire truck would have taken half of the street she said. Maybe he did not stay at that house. He also had a house in Vegas right? So maybe that was his residence, and carolwood drive was just a bate, I honestly thing it was not Michael on June 25/2009. I can't wait to see pictures. Thank you again for all your time and help. God bless.
you are welcome all4loveandbelieve. She is right. That's what I too have observed today.
So I am wondering, how did the fire truck, the ambulances, the red car the tour bus fitted in that narrow street? Too bad I don't live in hollywood, I would love to see it for myself. I commend you for the good job you have done scorpionchik can't wait to see the pictures so we can get an idea.
It could have been a set, been blocked off for just those few vehicles? :? :D
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scorpionchik thank you for your time you put into this. Wow you have guts. My friend went to Hollywood last year and she took the tour bus, she told me that the street was narrow, and she did not understand how so many people were around the house the day he died. Only the fire truck would have taken half of the street she said. Maybe he did not stay at that house. He also had a house in Vegas right? So maybe that was his residence, and carolwood drive was just a bate, I honestly thing it was not Michael on June 25/2009. I can't wait to see pictures. Thank you again for all your time and help. God bless.
you are welcome all4loveandbelieve. She is right. That's what I too have observed today.
So I am wondering, how did the fire truck, the ambulances, the red car the tour bus fitted in that narrow street? Too bad I don't live in hollywood, I would love to see it for myself. I commend you for the good job you have done scorpionchik can't wait to see the pictures so we can get an idea.
It could have been a set, been blocked off for just those few vehicles? :? :D
You have a point there. Could be a set. Or maybe another house who has the same gates. I have no clue, I was suppose to go with my friend last year to LA Hollywood but couldn't , I could kick myself now. I could have seen for myself, I want to thank again scorpionchik for doing such a good job. It helps clear a few things. blessings everyone.
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Nah..they could've used it for a set..blocked off the road except for th people they wanted to witness it, but it's the same ..the same cracks in the road, the same bricks in the drive, the same gate, the same mailbox, the same PLANTS. Sure, they could replicate it..but LOOK, it's the same. It's the same, so, it's either real, (not his dying)and someone/thing left there, or it's used as a set.
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Nah..they could've used it for a set..blocked off the road except for th people they wanted to witness it, but it's the same ..the same cracks in the road, the same bricks in the drive, the same gate, the same mailbox, the same PLANTS. Sure, they could replicate it..but LOOK, it's the same. It's the same, so, it's either real, (not his dying)and someone/thing left there, or it's used as a set.
I more tend to believe it was real, no rerecording or rehearsing. Ecpesially rehearsing hoax in that busy, crowdy neighborhood full of residences I saw, no way to do that twice. If that would have been in Neverland where only MJ's house whithin many miles, we can think of recording hoax the day before and on 25th, but not in Carolwood dr.
@all4loveandbelieve , you are welcome, stop thanking please, I was doing it with pleasure and was sure will clarify if not much then something. IF MJ did not live there, but he was there at least to show that he rented it. So, that was trip to historical museum for me. :lol: There were others &tour also stayed in front of the house for while.
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Thanks for that information.....Elvis Presley's old home is at 144 Monovale Dve...
I too have many pictures from google saved to my computer...these are it:
Did you know that Zsa Zsa Gabor and her husband own Elvis's old mansion? They are selling it.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/8270522/Elvis-Presleys-old-home-owned-by-Zsa-Zsa-Gabor-on-market-for-28-million.html
Also, I saw that Sean Connery James Bond, Agent 007) is the owner of 100 Carolwood Dr.
http://www.panoramio.com/photo/17333913
Guys, job well done! Thank you so much.
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Also, I saw that Sean Connery James Bond, Agent 007) is the owner of 100 Carolwood Dr.
http://www.panoramio.com/photo/17333913
Guys, job well done! Thank you so much.
Interesting news, thanks.
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@wishingstar you are right. Police should be there to arrange traffic for ambulance to drive in and out, butbecause maybe they supposedly did not know the area and that it was MJ, therefore police was not involved that day?
However, as MJhasSpoken said on 1st page, she was there some time ago and also saw 71 ambulance driving around those roads and I saw 71 amb. yesterday, so it is unusual but seems set up routine for amb. to supervise that area perhaps. Then why wait for amb., how long they were waiting for ambulance to arrive?
@fordocarr maybe you are right but from what I saw that black sheet cord where waved and twisted too tight within grommets to be easily removed and put back.
@hesouttamylife I could not see make and model, next time I am gonna stop them and interrogate. :lol:
@everlastinglove_MJ the covered car is still there. Did you look at all pictures?
@all4loveandbelieve True, why 2nd fire truck if emergency call is not about fire and they supposedly did not know it is MJ house and could have 2-3 floors therefore they might need ladders. :roll:
When I saw ambulance #71 I think they had a patient in there because they were going really fast and had the lights and siren sound on...also I think they are very frequent because their firestation is on Sunset Blvd.
Also who was living in the Elvis home...was it Zsa Zsa Gabor?
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Just thought I should add these picture I've made to this topic, and then maybe start another topic.
These are the oddities I found after hours of screenshots from various videos of the ambulance backing out of the driveway.
Firstly, we established that the road is very narrow, and would have to be blocked off nearly completely with the firetruck there. Now, shadows time. I have found some inconsistencies with the shadows of the trees in the driveway, which would suggest different times or different days........Hope this all makes sense to you all...I will post the pictures with my findings, so bear with me.......
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As you can see, there are many inconsistencies with the shadows and the scenes are completely different.
Some are taken from Ben Evenstads video....and the others are from the tour bus person, who captured the video as it happened.
It doesn't match up. Especiall the pic of Ben Evenstad. I have a question.. How did he take a far shot view if he and his crew were filming the ambulance backing out...and there is no way the guy in red ran to the back so quickly........
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And this, nobody in the way and no sight of the tour bus. or the paparazzi???
These 2 videos are definitely shot on different days....
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How many trash cans out there, they were taking out trash once a month or something? :lol:
2good2btrue, you know what I think about shadows:
1.Might be photoshop or personal edition of different people who posted on youtube.
2.can be shadow reflected the camera taken from different angles
3. can be sun turning time?
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@scorpionshik
Thank you so so much for your big help ! I have to read all posts later...have not so much time the last day's.
The are much difficult pics and the scene last's ....so i ask myself...wyh was there not one heli in the sky ?
Remember Britney Spears when she was taken to hospital...a while ago...there are always the pap helicopters there.
Not here ?
When does they film that scene ????? Not at the 25. June i think.
Have all a wonderfull day !
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The mail box has changed !
When the ambumance leave the house it was a longer one. On the new pics they have a different one.
The street seems bigger in the ambulance video....isn't it the same with the street at the Holly Terrace ? When the chairs are there and they have also enough place for the cars ?
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This is a google map pic......
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The mail box has changed !
When the ambumance leave the house it was a longer one. On the new pics they have a different one.
The street seems bigger in the ambulance video....isn't it the same with the street at the Holly Terrace ? When the chairs are there and they have also enough place for the cars ?
Yep. They have replaced the mailbox since the "death" day. The street is definitely the same street in all the pics though. You can match the shape of the crack at the end of the drive out to the center of the street and the plants...
Wonder why they've got a new box?
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The mail box has changed !
When the ambumance leave the house it was a longer one. On the new pics they have a different one.
The street seems bigger in the ambulance video....isn't it the same with the street at the Holly Terrace ? When the chairs are there and they have also enough place for the cars ?
Yep. They have replaced the mailbox since the "death" day. The street is definitely the same street in all the pics though. You can match the shape of the crack at the end of the drive out to the center of the street and the plants...
Wonder why they've got a new box?
maybe when the ambulance was backing up they hit the mail box and they need to replace it. Just a suggestion. other than that I have no clue.
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@everlastinglove_MJ the covered car is still there. Did you look at all pictures?
I'm not really sure it's the same car, it looks the same as I can remember. The car I noticed about 9M ago doesn't have to be the same car as the 1 on your picture though because it's covered, so I can't confirm the car is still there.
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I find it strange that the same covered vehicle is in the garage. DIdn't we see video of the moving people pulling it out of the garage to be stored somewhere. How many people keep their cars covered with a tarp in an open garage. DId this house ever get sold?
Scorpinchik thanks for the pics. It is always nice to go back over things that we may have missed. I too agree that the streets are way too narrow for all the people, vehicles and trash cans.
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Thanx, Scorpionchick, for posting the pictures. I can surely sign what you've seen :D
When I was there a bit more than a year ago I was also surprised at how narrow that street was. What stroke me personally was also, how SHORT that bit of street between Sunset and the corner of Carolwood/Monovale was. And as short as it was, as winded it was. The google map picture uploaded by 2good2btrue shows, Sunset practically lies just behind the grass knoll (hight above the blue car). Plus it isn't quite obvious to see but I thought that little street is pretty steep/going practically over a hill.
But nevertheless, I have to agree with Scorpionchick saying she thinks, he wasn't even living there. That was the feeling I had, when I was there December a year ago. Because Scorpionchicks' statement, that the area is pretty crowded around MJs alleged last home is simply correct and it does raise the question, if MJ would live in such a crowded narrow place - no matter how thick the walls surrounding this home are.
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My last post I stated my friend was there last year, she did tell me about the narrow street, and also she did make a statement, how can MJ live on that street, it is a busy street, and also not a place to raise kids, especially MJ kids. I never made anything of it. I figured that's why there are gates and bodyguards. Now I am putting all the pieces together, and I do feel he did not live there. Someone did but not him. Probably a frailed sick man, which is not Michael. If you think, the house in Vegas, was destroyed as per the owner, and Paris had said to Oprah, that they go sit on the roof eating snickers and looking at the lights of the Lexor hotel. I think he was mostly in living in Vegas. Probably there was more quiet. Just a thought.
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My last post I stated my friend was there last year, she did tell me about the narrow street, and also she did make a statement, how can MJ live on that street, it is a busy street, and also not a place to raise kids, especially MJ kids. I never made anything of it. I figured that's why there are gates and bodyguards. Now I am putting all the pieces together, and I do feel he did not live there. Someone did but not him. Probably a frailed sick man, which is not Michael. If you think, the house in Vegas, was destroyed as per the owner, and Paris had said to Oprah, that they go sit on the roof eating snickers and looking at the lights of the Lexor hotel. I think he was mostly in living in Vegas. Probably there was more quiet. Just a thought.
Agreed. I dont think he ever lived there either.
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I remember the story about him and the circumstances surrounding him moving there. It seemed a bit strange at the time. Now that the hoax is in play, it kinda fits. Seems it has been something that was well thought out over the course of at least 6 months, (it would have to be if any type of protection is involved) and everything is falling into place.
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SOME MORE PICTURES TO PONDER ON......
Now what if the reason the ambulance has backed out instead of doing a u-turn,is to hide the number 71, that maybe should read E71 ??
The serial no. doesn't match the original ambulance.. :o
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And these.........
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SOME MORE PICTURES TO PONDER ON......
Now what if the reason the ambulance has backed out instead of doing a u-turn,is to hide the number 71, that maybe should read E71 ??
The serial no. doesn't match the original ambulance.. :o
What is that a police car? :lol:
There you go E71 now showed up on the front. The ambulance I saw on Sunday was smaller though, or maybe the same........ Do you remember the name of 2 paramedics on June 25th day?
I don't see the number you circled. What are the 2 different license plate numbers? I want gather info cause I am planning to go there again.
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Here is a post about license plates. I think I only have the one ambulance plate....
viewtopic.php?f=253&t=10734&hilit=+license+plates (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=253&t=10734&hilit=+license+plates)
Thanks for all you are doing scorpionchik.......much, much appreciated!
Blessings always!
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Here is a post about license plates. I think I only have the one ambulance plate....
viewtopic.php?f=253&t=10734&hilit=+license+plates (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=253&t=10734&hilit=+license+plates)
Thanks for all you are doing scorpionchik.......much, much appreciated!
Blessings always!
Thanks you too.
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Also, I saw that Sean Connery James Bond, Agent 007) is the owner of 100 Carolwood Dr.
http://www.panoramio.com/photo/17333913
The owner is not Sean Connery.
http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=145&t=18688&p=323445#p323445
However, I wonder if this is an older photo or if we face the "double" effect as to the gates, too (not double houses, double entrance / gates / yard would do it):
(http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/17333913.jpg)
We can look into the yard hence no house but a small wall and blue sky only?
The letter box is the one with the lilies that has been replaced after June 25 by a square one.
But where is the house in this photo?
This is a video still of June 25:
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=12652)
I agree that a rehearsal of the ambu scenes is not feasible in the real neighbourhood of Carolwood. So I consider June 25 paparazzi footage may have been pre-produced using greenscreen technology. Everything including trees may have beeen set up (as we witnessed in TII Thriller scenes).
In addition to the missing house on the picture above, I am still searching for the secret rear gates with the glass / plants in in these OVGuide guy videos that were not found around Carolwood mansion, to date . Are they from Vegas, preproduced, scam, fake or what? Don't get confused, there's no proof available from the newspaper date used - the video is too blurry (on purpose?).
I think these videos have been planted and are either fake themselves or should initiate reflections on whether the filming location on June 25 was really "it":
[youtube:cz10cico]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cM8AWX2z-Go[/youtube:cz10cico]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cM8AWX2z-Go
[youtube:cz10cico]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yN9eGKUkhs&feature=related[/youtube:cz10cico]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yN9eGKUkhs&feature=related
[youtube:cz10cico]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdLON-hvsHM&feature=related[/youtube:cz10cico]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdLON-hvsHM&feature=related
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Thanks Grace for the video. I remember this was posted, but I did not remember rear gate blocked by leaves and opens like a door. What kind of door is that on the first video? Did I missed this or this is the same one where covered car is parked? :?
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Sorry guys, I had to go out last night and didn't finish my point of the pictures..
This is comparing the Firetruck from 25th June, and the one at the Station 71 pancake fundraiser.......
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Just 2 thoughts.
In the OV video the maybe 10 foot tall hedge curves down the road, but nowhere on the satelite image do I see any curved line of greenery, although scorpionchik, on your photos 096 and 095 viewtopic.php?f=214&t=18772 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=214&t=18772) it shows that just down the road from the main visitor entrance there is an intersection in the road with signs and after that is the same tall hedge, which would be the bottom left corner of the satelite pic. Could this OVGuide guy be going to the next house over (bottom of sat. pic, on the other side of Sunset Blvd?
[attachment=0:2o768qdh]OV guide, back gate.jpg[/attachment:2o768qdh]
[attachment=1:2o768qdh]100-North-Carolwood-Drive-005[1].JPG[/attachment:2o768qdh]
Yes there's definately lots of open space in this shot. So since no one actually saw or photographed the firetruck or ambulance coming to the house, could they have been there a long time (an hour) getting things ready before anybody started to notice because of news coverage, and started driving by, and shadows then wouldn't match? Could some shots like this one have been taken with a wide-angle lens to give the illusion of extra space?
[attachment=2:2o768qdh]new%20clues%202[1].JPG[/attachment:2o768qdh]
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I found it on google.......Ok. This puts a new spin on things now. WOW :o :o
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The pavement of the pics above does not match the videos and the "bell box" hidden under leaves is missing. In addition, a grey roof is being shown very briefly in the videos.
This is my old post:
http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=145&t=18053&p=309818
[...]
Surprise: some more leaves (this time they are not moving only by overlaying parts of an arm but they are moving themselves).
First, watch the leaves around the bell box. They look familiar, right?
[youtube:3uhsbxi6]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdLON-hvsHM[/youtube:3uhsbxi6]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdLON-hvsHM
These plants are to be found everywhere around the houses of the block, so the (similar but too blurry) leaves in the ambulance may indicate we are somewhat close to the "hot spot".
Watch the video again for noticing the irregular flagstones in front of the hidden gate - usually concrete is being used in Caliland gateways so this is something special to keep in mind.
This is giving another perspective on a rear gate we did not notice so far (watch for 0:25):
[youtube:3uhsbxi6]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cM8AWX2z-Go&feature=related[/youtube:3uhsbxi6]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cM8AWX2z-Go&feature=related
An ariel view on the house (north is left):
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_nHmUxKq2nz4/SkUSsZsPdHI/AAAAAAAADHA/ZV9OL38xHak/s1600-h/100-North-Carolwood-Drive-001.jpg
Notice the small "garden" house behind the pool. Gray roof. Close to the fences / walls.
A Google streetview is available for 144 Monovale Drive, Los Angeles. The mansion appears on the left side.
So we check out whether there is a third "hidden" gate to the property.
Searching for that gate turns out to be a little bit tricky.
(Feeling again like in a fairy tale cracking the prince's brainteaser - a feeling I did not really could shake off during this whole journey in which the prince would ask riddles to be solved...)
OK, my brain will give it a try.
You will notice driving around the block on streetview (except for Carolwood Dr. which is blocked on Google) that the area is a little bit hilly. The mansion is surrounded by straight walls on Carolwood Dr. hidden by trees and a little green, high but irregular walls on Monovale Dr. hidden walls on Sunset Blvd. (behind a little hill and big trees) and some smaller hedges on Ladera Dr. However, on Ladera Dr., there should be no direct connection to the mansion, these should be separate properties.
Now having worked the circuit around the property, I do not see any other possibility of finding the gate except it were hidden north / left of the garden housewith the gray roof (green square). (Btw. the blue square gives Elvis's former house with its main gate on 144 Monovale Dr.)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=12176)
This is a still with the "moving" gate:
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=12179)
This is another arial showing that due to the hilly features of the area and the constructions, the gate is IMPOSSIBLE at that location.
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=12178)
I noticed in addition - when comparing streetview with the video taken in May - that there is not any wild growing tree on Monovale Dr that would resemble those in the "new home" video.
Google streetview / maps are sometimes a little bit outdated. That might explain slight differences.
Conclusions:
1) There was some guy popping up out of the blue in January and May 2009 reporting as a "neighbour" for OVGuide.com - a video platform site (former top 500 site). He was ringing the bell at a rear gate of MJ which appears to be new evidence (I saw those vids in 2009 already but could not connect... LOL). This man introduced the "rear gate" to us.
2) The leaves of the plants surrounding the bell box from the video ressemble those in the ambulance pic pretty much, yet they are not only to be found at that bell's address.
3) There may be a "hidden" gate of "moving branches" as the real gate to the Jackson family home.
4) I would consider talking a complete different house and gate and that Carolwood was a smokescreen since I do not have seen any proof yet that the green "rear" gate does exist there. Maybe one of our fellows in LA may check that for us? If the green gate does not belong to Carolwood mansion, it is likely to be found in some hilly area though and may be located just across the street.
5) This is a DEEP rabbit hole.
6) I'd rather give my eyes some rest now. :lol:
7) Maybe the OVGuide guy was just an attention seeker making this all up.
But why would we have leaves in the ambulance pic? Michael leaving? So simple?
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Thank you guys, for the infos. So, there is 3rd hidden gate that I have to go back and look for. But, if there is a 3rd gate, what do you think that has to do with June 25 hoax, what is the connection ? Michael could simply not be at home at all that day and time, or the day before hoax. For what purpose you think that hidden gate could serve hoaxwise?]And the 3rd gate is on Monovale st. as I understood, no way it can be on Carolwood.
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Thank you guys, for the infos. So, there is 3rd hidden gate that I have to go back and look for. But, if there is a 3rd gate, what do you think that has to do with June 25 hoax, what is the connection ? Michael could simply not be at home at all that day and time, or the day before hoax. For what purpose you think that hidden gate could serve hoaxwise?]And the 3rd gate is on Monovale st. as I understood, no way it can be on Carolwood.
The only thing that I can think of is that Michael had plenty of secret gates to escape without being noticed. They focused on one entrance, everyone was there, ambulance, paps, firetruck etc.... This is the only thing that could have happened that day.
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Thank you guys, for the infos. So, there is 3rd hidden gate that I have to go back and look for. But, if there is a 3rd gate, what do you think that has to do with June 25 hoax, what is the connection ? Michael could simply not be at home at all that day and time, or the day before hoax. For what purpose you think that hidden gate could serve hoaxwise?]And the 3rd gate is on Monovale st. as I understood, no way it can be on Carolwood.
The only thing that I can think of is that Michael had plenty of secret gates to escape without being noticed. They focused on one entrance, everyone was there, ambulance, paps, firetruck etc.... This is the only thing that could have happened that day.
You are right. But I would say yes and no. MJ could simply nor be home or hide in one of the many rooms in the house, or leave house earlier to get to the airport. Did hidden gate plaid any role hoaxwise? I am not sure, I don't see the point unless we are missing something here. If MJ left the house from hidden gate at the same time ambulace and people were there, that actually would be risky.
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Thank you guys, for the infos. So, there is 3rd hidden gate that I have to go back and look for. But, if there is a 3rd gate, what do you think that has to do with June 25 hoax, what is the connection ? Michael could simply not be at home at all that day and time, or the day before hoax. For what purpose you think that hidden gate could serve hoaxwise?]And the 3rd gate is on Monovale st. as I understood, no way it can be on Carolwood.
If you are going to go have another look, please drive up Carolwood to that tall hedge I spoke of and see if it curves like in the OV pic. I'm wondering if the gate may be another house. Thanks.
Just 2 thoughts.
In the OV video the maybe 10 foot tall hedge curves down the road, but nowhere on the satelite image do I see any curved line of greenery, although scorpionchik, on your photos 096 and 095 viewtopic.php?f=214&t=18772 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=214&t=18772) it shows that just down the road from the main visitor entrance there is an intersection in the road with signs and after that is the same tall hedge, which would be the bottom left corner of the satelite pic. Could this OVGuide guy be going to the next house over (bottom of sat. pic, on the other side of Sunset Blvd?
[attachment=1:2ugvw09u]OV guide, back gate.jpg[/attachment:2ugvw09u][attachment=0:2ugvw09u]Photo096_1200x900[1].jpg[/attachment:2ugvw09u]
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from Wiki:
Bread and salt is a Slavic welcome greeting ceremony.
The tradition, known by its local Slavic names (Russian: Хлеб-соль; Ukrainian: Хліб-сіль; Belarusian: Хлеб і соль; Bulgarian: Хляб и сол; Macedonian: Леб и сол; Croatian: Kruh i sol; Serbian: Хлеб и со; Polish: Chleb i sól; Czech: Chléb a sůl; Slovene: Kruh in sol; Slovak: Chlieb a soľ), was also adopted by two non-Slavic nations — Lithuanians (Baltic) and Romanians (Latin) — both of which culturally and historically close to their Slavic neighbours (Lithuanian: Duona ir druska and Romanian: Pâine şi sare).
When important, respected or admired guests arrive, they are presented with a loaf of bread placed on a rushnik (embroidered towel). A salt holder or a salt cellar is placed on top of the bread loaf or secured in a hole on the top of the loaf. In modern Russia, on official occasions, the "bread and salt" is presented by young women dressed in national costumes (e.g., sarafan and kokoshnik).
When this tradition is observed in spaceflight, appropriate small packages of bread and salt are used.[1][2]
BulgariaBread and salt (Bulgarian: хляб и сол, transliterated hlyab i sol) is a traditional Bulgarian custom expressing hospitality, showing that the guest is welcomed. The bread and salt is commonly presented to guests by a woman. Bulgarians usually make a certain type of bread for this occasion called pogacha, which is flat, fancy, and decorated. Regular bread is not usually used, although it may have been historically, but pogacha is much more common in this custom.
Usually, guests are presented with the pogacha, and the guest is supposed to take a small piece, dip into the salt and eat it. This custom is common for official visits regardless of whether the guest is foreign or Bulgarian. One notable example of this custom is when the Russians came to liberate Bulgaria from the Ottomans at the end of the 19th century. A common scene from that period was of a Bulgarian village woman welcoming Russian soldiers with bread and salt as a sign of gratitude.
RussiaThe tradition gave rise to the Russian word that expresses a person's hospitality: "khlebosolny". In general, the word "bread" is associated in Russian culture with hospitality, bread being the most respected food, whereas salt is associated with long friendship, as expressed in a Russian saying "to eat a pood of salt (together with someone)". Also historically the Russian Empire had a high salt tax that made salt a very expensive and prized commodity (see also Salt Riot).
There also is a traditional Russian greeting "Khleb da sol!" (Хлеб да соль! "Bread and salt!"). The phrase is to be uttered by an arriving guest as an expression of good wish towards the host's household. It was often used by beggars as an implicit hint to be fed, therefore a mocking rhymed response is known: "Khleb da sol!" — "Yem da svoy!" (Хлеб да соль — ем да свой! "Bread and salt!" — "I am eating and it is my own!").
With the advent of the Soviet space program, this tradition has spread into space. It was observed at the Apollo-Soyuz project, when crackers and salt tablets were used in the spaceship. Bread chunks and salt were a welcome at the Mir space station[1][2], a tradition that was extended on the International space station.[2][3] Bread and salt are also a welcome for cosmonauts returning to Earth.[4] (???)
In the Russian Orthodox Church, it is customary to greet the bishop at the steps of the church when he arrives for a pastoral visit to a church or monastery with bread and salt.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/fe/Chleb_i_s%C3%B3l.jpg/220px-Chleb_i_s%C3%B3l.jpg)
This seems an unusual tradition for Calefornian neighbours, but maybe I'm just uninformed. If this OV guy is there to give us clues in advance of the "death" day, then maybe there are other clues as well. Seems it's a spoof anyway since it seems like Michael opens the gate and grabs the food (another thread discussion).
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I believe I found the pedestrian entrance...and back gates. They seem to be located on Sunset Blvd...
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Wow, that's amazing. I had a dream just last night that Michael was sitting on the steps to a house. I passed by and didn't believe my eyes. So I drove up to the corner to turn to go back just to be sure, and the sign where I was turning said SUNSET BLVD. :shock:
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I believe I found the pedestrian entrance...and back gates. They seem to be located on Sunset Blvd...
and @MJonmind
guys, I see what you are saying, but this guy could not walk on Sunset Blv, and hedge on my pic. 096 is the other side of Sunset blvd. Sunset blvd has 4 lines-2 for one way traffic and 2 for contrarwise traffic and it is busy traffic with a little high than usual speed blv. There is no way could be that 3rd gate on Sunset blvd where OV guy freely walking.
here is a sunset blvd look
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Sunset+Boulevard,+Los+Angeles,+CA+90077&aq=&sll=34.079216,-118.431265&sspn=0.008318,0.02105&gl=us&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Sunset+Blvd,+Los+Angeles,+California+90077&layer=c&cbll=34.080418,-118.436122&panoid=NKKuagKvRzt0kGj_eIVLAQ&cbp=13,244.21,,0,14.38&ll=34.080311,-118.435989&spn=0,0.001212&z=19
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Wow, that's amazing. I had a dream just last night that Michael was sitting on the steps to a house. I passed by and didn't believe my eyes. So I drove up to the corner to turn to go back just to be sure, and the sign where I was turning said SUNSET BLVD. :shock:
Next time I will specially check steps crefully. :lol: