Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators

Hoax Theories => References & Similarities => The Bible References => Topic started by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 10:15:44 PM

Title: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 10:15:44 PM
Neverland
The gates of Neverland have/had a royal crest similar to the British Royal families crest on them.

(http://http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/02/16/article-1147286-038ABD84000005DC-931_634x593.jpg)
Neverland gates with the Jackson Family Crest

(http://http://scotthaefner.com/photos/images/fullsize/surface/neverland03.jpg)
British Royal Family Crest

There is a possible link in Michael’s ancestry to royalty. The Royal families claim to trace their bloodline back to King David and beyond. Kind David is a descendant of Jesus.


This link to Jesus is why the are considered Royalty in the first place.

Sheets
Michael was wrapped in sheets and not a body bag when taken from the hospital to the coroner; he was also wrapped in a sheet inside the casket. There was what appears to be a large "Knot" in the sheet when the body is being loaded into the helicopter.
[attachment=0:2al18bbz]<!-- ia0 -->Sheet.jpg<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment:2al18bbz]
Knotted Sheet containing Michael Jackson's "body" being loaded into the sheriff's helicopter on June 25, 2009

John 19:40 (King James Version)
40 Then took they the body of Jesus, and wound it in linen clothes with the spices, as the manner of the Jews is to bury.
 
Mark 15:46 (King James Version)
46 And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen...

The Autopsy Report
In the Autopsy Report it is also reported that Michael is inside the casket wrapped in sheets after a hair sample has been requested for forensic testing.

The autopsy shows that Michael suffered punctures in both wrists/heel of the hands, both ankles and an unexplained abdominal incision (healed). He also had multiple injuries/scars on his back, arms, legs etc. all unexplained.

(http://http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJeYd6ijahI/AAAAAAAAAGY/gqo2-s_rUK4/s640/autopsy.jpg)

Forest Lawn & the Crypt
The casket is placed into an unmarked crypt (sepulchre) which has never been used and sat empty for 50 years.

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcJx0D6KpI/AAAAAAAAAEw/8AxrBa_R5oE/s400/MJ+Crypt.jpg)

John 19:41 (King James Version)
41 Now in the place where he was crucified there was a garden; and in the garden a new sepulchre, wherein was never man yet laid.

Mark 15:46 (King James Version)
46 And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen, and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre.

The stained glass windows above the crypt depict the ascension of Jesus Christ into the heavens after his resurrection.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q3zV9twvNo[/youtube]

Michael had a painting created that he called "The Last Supper" this hung over his bed at Neverland and he was depicted as Jesus.


Nearby the crypt at Forest Lawn are other recreations of other famous paintings and statuary all related to Jesus.



Duality
Two pictures used at the funeral from Liberian Girl.
Two pictures symbolizing duality, the human and divine natures that also defined the natures of Jesus.



The Yin Yang Symbol
The Yin Yang Symbol was also shown repeatedly at the memorial this is another symbol for duality. As well as Religious symbols from all the world's major religions.

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJeh0fdsacI/AAAAAAAAAG4/gMlyL6G7wmQ/s400/Images.jpg)

“I am only Human”
Jesus is not half God and half man.  He is fully divine and fully man.  In other words, Jesus has two distinct natures: divine and human.  Jesus is the Word who was God and was with God and was made flesh, (John 1:1,14).   This means that in the single person of Jesus is both a human and divine nature, God and man.  The divine nature was not changed when the Word became flesh (John 1:1,14).  Instead, the Word was joined with humanity (Col. 2:9).  Jesus' divine nature was not altered.  Also, Jesus is not merely a man who "had God within Him" nor is he a man who "manifested the God principle."  He is God in flesh, second person of the Trinity. "The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word," (Heb. 1:3). Jesus' two natures are not "mixed together," (Eutychianism) nor are they combined into a new God-man nature (Monophysitism).  They are separate yet act as a unit in the one person of Jesus.  This is called the Hypostatic Union.

The 6th of the last Seven Words of Christ - "I'm Thirsty" - A human craving to requirement  to maintain physical life

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPpiCpELA6Q[/youtube]

The Fleur-de-lis
On the gates of Neverland there is also the  Fleur-de-lis

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJ3_DUmVsFI/AAAAAAAAAHE/5eE5Jy8f3OY/s400/Fleur-de-lis.jpg)
The Fleur-de-lis represents the Iris and is associated with the Kings of France and is also used on the British Coat of Arms. It is a representation of the Iris flower.

(http://http://www.ancientrootsresearch.com/Hap-I/Chivalry-iris.jpg)
The Iris and France
There are various legends of how the iris came to represent the French monarchy but most center around two historical incidents separated in time by six hundred years. Clovis who in 496 A.D. is said to have abandoned the three toads on his banner in favor of the fleur-de-lis. His Christian Queen Clotilda, had long sought to convert her heathen husband but he always ignored her plea. Then faced with a formidable army of Alamanni, the Germanic tribe invading his kingdom, he told his wife that if he won the coming battle he would admit her God was strongest and be baptized. He did win and the toads whose symbolism would be most interesting to know disappeared.

The second incident occurred in 1147. Louis VII of France had a dream that convinced him to adopt the purple iris as his device shortly before setting out for his ill-fated crusade. Thus the fleur-de-lis became the symbol on the banner of France for the next six hundred years. Or twelve hundred years if we take it from the time of Clovis that the iris became the symbol for a great nation.

The iris was so powerful a symbol of the French kings that the Revolutionaries in 1789 set out to totally obliterate it the symbol of the hated monarchy. It was chipped off buildings and torn from draperies. Men were guillotined for wearing a fleur-de-lis on their clothes or as jewelry. The revolution succeeded and the symbol of the fleur-de-lis is only a memory now and is considered merely a conventionalized ornament or decoration.
http://www.sfheart.com/iris.html

In the never seen before photograph used at the Funeral, Michael is holding Purple Irises.

(http://http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcLSnvAbhI/AAAAAAAAAE4/CIeA7hkcsw8/s400/michael-jackson-reaches-his--final-resting-place--lrg.png)

The Symbolic and Religious Meaning of the Colour Purple
Some interesting facts and information about the symbolic, religious, Christian and Biblical meaning of the colour Purple

* Purple is always associated with Royalty
* Purple togas were worn by the all powerful Roman Emperors
* The symbolic meaning of the colour purple was for penitence and mourning
* Purple also has a Christian / Biblical meaning and is the liturgical colour for the seasons of Lent and Advent
* Only the most expensive dyes were used to produce the colour purple, it therefore became symbolic with wealth and power
* People who were allowed to wear the colour purple during the Elizabethan era, as decreed by the English Sumptuary Laws, were the Queen, Queen's mother, children, and sisters, and aunts. The King, King's mother, children, brethren, and uncles

The Memorial and Funeral Flowers.
There were also purple Irises throughout the lilies on the arrangement on the coffin at the funeral.

Song of Solomon 2 (King James Version)
1 I am the rose of Sharon, and the lily of the valleys.

Most expositors agree that these are the words of Jesus where he expresses his own excellencies, to draw, allure and enamor the souls of those that love and long after him.

The Rose

(http://http://yourfuneralguy.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/alg_michael_jackson_coffin.jpg?w=485&h=346)

A Rose is the offspring and fruit of a good, though seemingly dry root. Jesus, touching his human nature, is the offspring of David, or “a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots,” Isaiah 11:1.

A Rose is a beautiful flower, very pleasant and delightful to the eye, of different colors, red and white, and in some curiously joined and intermixed together, red and white; shows an excellent complexion, and makes up a perfect beauty. Christ is said to be “white and ruddy” Song of Solomon 5:10. Some understand thereby his two natures (Duality), by the white his divinity, by the red his humanity: the one denotes his natural purity and innocence; the other, his bloody agony and suffering.

A Rose is a fragrant and sweet flower, it yields a most excellent and odoriferous scent. Jesus yields a most fragrant and lovely saviour. What is so sweet and refreshing to the spiritual sense of the soul, as the merits and saving graces of Christ? “Thy name is as ointment poured forth,” Song of Solomon 1:3.

The Rose is called by naturalists the queen of flowers, none to be compared to it. Jesus infinitely excels all others, whether angels or men; none are to be compared to him. He is the Head, the flower, and glory of things in heaven, and of things on earth, “Thou art fairer than the children of men”, “the chiefest among ten thousand,” Psalms 45:2, Song of Solomon 5:10.

The Rose of Sharon signifies the flower of the field, Sharon being a place or plain wherein king David’s herds and cattle were fed, 1 Chronicles 27:29. Roses that grow in a field, are not planted by man, and indeed do lie open to beasts, to be spoiled, plucked to pieces, or trodden down. Jesus Christ was not planted by man, but by the hand of the Father; when brought forth into the field of this world, how open did he lie to evil beasts, such as Herod and the Jews were? How was he plucked to pieces, as it were, and trodden under their feet? He was laid open to almost all manner of sorrow and suffering, Isaiah 53:3-5.

The Roses of Sharon were free: persons might have access to them, when they could not to other flowers that were in close and secret gardens. Jesus is free for all, whoever will, may come and take the good and gracious virtue, and soul-refreshing blessings that are in him, Isaiah 55:1, Revelation 22:17. He is a fountain opened, Zechariah 13:1. The good that is in God is no other ways communicated to mankind, but in and through him.

Sharon was a place of pasture, a place of feeding, where the flocks used to rest, a very fruitful valley. Christ is to be found in green pastures: “He maketh me to lie down in green pastures,” Psalms 23:2.

The Rose yields a very precious oil, good in divers cases. Jesus affords a very precious oil, called the oil of gladness, which is of a most sovereign virtue.
http://www.learnthebible.org/christ-the ... haron.html

The Lily

(http://http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:eYMiCY_biWNcMM:http://parodyfiles.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/full_michael_jackson_funeral_011_wenn5346404.jpg&t=1)
The lily is a sweet and a fragrant flower. Jesus' spiritual sweetness very much excels and transcends the sweetest of any odours that can be mentioned.

A lily is white and very beautiful; within it are seven golden grains or seeds. White denotes holiness, purity and perfection. Purity is essential, originally, perfectly, and absolutely inherent in Christ; He is holiness itself, His glory is infinite, within and without, every way glorious; the perfection of beauty.

The lily is exceeding fruitful; one root puts forth fifty bulbs or scallions. Jesus is exceeding fruitful, from this root, from him many Christians have sprung.

The lily is the tallest of flowers, yet hangs down its head. Jesus is higher than the mighty princes, kings and emperors of the earth, higher than heaven or angels, and yet humble and lowly in heart; therefore he is compared to the lily of the valley, in his exaltation, as God very high; but in his humiliations, he seems to hang down his head.

The lily is a flower that hath many medicinal virtues. Jesus is excellently good to cure all the diseases and maladies of the soul; it cures spiritual blindness, it softens a hard heart, it cures stubbornness and obstinacy. There is no malady too hard for this spiritual Physician.
http://www.learnthebible.org/christ-the ... alley.html

LMP called for sunflowers "Michael's favourite flowers". Sunflowers represent God (as does the sun itself) and God's love.

Lisa Marie Presley Wants Flowers at MJ's Tomb
5/12/2010 3:00 PM PDT by TMZ Staff 
Lisa Marie Presley claims she's disappointed at the "empty space" surrounding Michael Jackson's tomb -- so she's now challenging MJ fans to flood the place with sunflowers ASAP.


LMP just posted a message on her MySpace page describing her recent visit to Michael's grave site at Forest Lawn. Presley -- who was married to MJ back in the '90s -- says she believes Michael "deserves more" than the "few bouquets, candles and gifts" that currently surround Michael's grave.

Presley -- who notes Michael's infatuation with sunflowers -- is calling for fans to send a "Sun Shower" to the tomb because, "I know how much he loved and appreciated being showered with Gifts and flowers by his fans."
http://www.tmz.com/2010/05/12/lisa-mari ... ce-letter/

The Jack5on Family Dynasty
In the A & E show "Jack5on a Family Dynasty" there was another painting showing a Sunflower, Michael, a Dove, and a Butterfly.

(http://http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcWiHNzeFI/AAAAAAAAAFg/DV9gkkLxkCA/s400/JFD+painting+2.jpg)

The Sunflower = God the Father
Michael = The Son
The Dove = The Holy Spirit
The Butterfly = Resurrection

The Video for the Song "Scream"
There are many clues in this video but a significant one is that we are shown the painting entitled "The Son of Man".

(http://http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcXjGi7yrI/AAAAAAAAAFw/9o8aljGUouI/s400/Apple+head+painting.jpg)

TMZ has a gallery of people wearing bowler hats with an apple in front of their face (some related to Michael) just like the painting.

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/05/36286PCN_Jacksons13_1_full.jpg)

Michael's nickname is "Apple Head".

The phrase "Son of Man" is another name for Jesus and is how he referred to himself.

The Halo
The halo is used in depictions of Holy and sacred individuals.

(http://http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=9896)

The Song "Scream" Lyrics
Michael sings "Father, please have mercy, I just can't take it anymore"
Jesus’ first words on the cross “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” Psalm 22:1.

Jam Lyrics
I Just Want You To Recognize Me In The Temple.

Jesus tells us that our bodies are our temples.

1 Corinthians 6:19 (King James Version)
19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

So Michael wants us to recognize who he is within ourselves.
Do you recognize him yet?

The Song "This Is It".
Michael sings "I am the Light of the World, this is real".

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_SLU3m6uCA[/youtube]

The light of the world is another name for Jesus and the Messiah.

The Trailer for the Movie "This Is It"
There are many allusions to Michale being the messiah in the trailer for his movie "This Is It"

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xi_5Ea-Y3GA[/youtube]

The Movie "This Is It"
In the "Thriller" sequence we are shown the dead falling back to earth, symbolizing the resurrection of the dead and Michael is surrounded by "Zombies" who are the dead resurrected.

(http://http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJehhmWJOiI/AAAAAAAAAGw/mSa4ZQEoZJM/s400/Resurrection+of+the+dead.jpg)

Judaism, Christianity, Islam and Zoroastrianism all variously describe a resurrection of the dead, usually referring to a regeneration of all people to face God on Judgment Day.

The Number 7 
– Michael Jackson signed his will on 7/7/02.
– Michael Jackson’s memorial was on 7/7/09 … exactly 7 years after the will was signed.
– Michael Jackson’s two biggest hits — “Black & White” and “Billie Jean” — were each #1 for 7 weeks.
– Michael Jackson’s three biggest albums — “Thriller,” “Bad” and “Dangerous” — each produced 7 top 40 hits.
– Michael Jackson was the 7th of 9 children.
– Michael Jackson was born in 1958 … 19 + 58 = 77
– Michael Jackson died on the 25th … 2 + 5 = 7
– Michael Jackson has 7 letters in his first and last name.
The number 7 is a spiritual number. It is the number of the perfect man. It is associated with God.

The 777 Shirt Michael Wears in the Movie "This Is It'.

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJegeNr1KXI/AAAAAAAAAGo/qyASZxLIsxg/s400/72723030.jpg)

777 is in fact God’s number.

The Phrase "This Is It".
Michael makes it clear that there is finality in his use of this phrase at the O2 press Conference, 
“This is it, this is really it, this is the final curtain call.”

"This is it" when used like this means - This is the end;  It is finished.
Jesus’ last words on the cross “It is finished!” (John 19:30).

Michael’s crucifixion was complete and the next phase of his mission is about to begin.

The Green Man
Michael appears as a “Green Man” in the video for the remake of the song “We Are The World”.

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJeDMpr7iMI/AAAAAAAAAGA/Hf_Rw_vjwIs/s400/MJ+Green.jpg)

Osiris/Horus Connection.
Green man represents resurrection and is associated with Osiris, Jesus, the Messiah, as well as Peter Pan. “Michael tells us in the Bashir documentary “I am Peter Pan”…in other words, I am the Green Man, I am the Messiah.

(http://http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJeDl-GHU-I/AAAAAAAAAGI/oM5modAJcos/s400/SNN2909P_280_877754a.jpg)
Image from the hood of Michael's motorized cart from Neverland

The Arno Bani Photo Shoot
This photo shoot took place in 1991 but pictures have only recently been released. The photos were originally taken to be used for the cover of the "Invincible" album. Michael entitled these photographs "The Sphinx"

(http://http://www.lesechos.fr/medias/diaporamas/2406/DIAP240610717_AF0506/MJ_1.jpg)

(http://http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJ327OnWk0I/AAAAAAAAAHA/vYjwoyMabLc/s400/Back.jpg)

Michael's inspiration fro this photo shoot was a fashion photograph that appeared on the cover of the 'Sunday Times Style'. It features a woman who appears to be Egyptian Royalty. The particular magazine is entitled  "WRAPTURE"

(http://http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af214/moonter/shawl.jpg)

The Rapture
The Rapture is an event in the futurist interpretation of Christian eschatology, in which it is posited that Christians will be gathered together in the air to meet the MESSIAH at his return.
The primary passage used to support this idea is 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17, in which Paul cites "the word of the Lord" about the return of the messiah to gather his saints.
...and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air.

 "Back"
The above picture also shows the Michael's "back" and has multiple meanings
Michael is back - Michael is coming back; he is returning
Michael is Back"- Michael is the poster using the screen name "Back" on the mjjcommunity.com forums.

Screen Name "Back"
This member uses the screen name "Back". They have been giving predictions of all of this years before anything ever occurred (since 2005). It is believed that they are Michael himself and "Back" is still actively posting.

"Back's" posts
The following is just an example of one of the posts by back that indicates that Michael is the Messiah.As one who embodies "vision" past 20/20, occurrences of the future are often "experienced". But many times this "experience" comes in the form of internal jolts, indicative of something of great significance. Séance hoaxes are not applicable.There are tIMEs when details are sparse, but abundant enough to "see" the grandness, just as it was in this magnetism towards the tHeOrY of sEVEN.

Exit Angel Gabriel----enter Angel Michael

Luke 1:36

"And in the sixth month the angel (Gabri)el was sent from God unto a city......
.........espoused to a man whose name was Joseph..."
And in the sixth month the angel (Micha)el was “statused” by God in a city...(of Angels)
.........espoused to a man whose name was Joseph.

On 6-25-09, tIME took a literal backseat to the mOMENt. I could always "see" a Silhouette on a Grand-stage, once again taking over the World. Perhaps also parallel in holding to our proclamation that this was NOT a "comeback", but a take-over. This was it. And in a thunderous sense,----- it was. It just didn't dawn on me that that Grand Stage would be in the Heavens; A visual Staple-d to the Center of our minds for all eternity.

Physically--no more, but with us in an eternal Angelic presence. We witnessed the beginning of this transfer on 7/7 of this historical year.

As History has shown, reflected through the books and logics of many faiths, Prophets do and have walked amongst us. They have sometimes been Angels in the temporary casts of both tIME and human flesh. And in their allotted tIME, their purposes have most often been message DeLIVErance.

In the separation of major tIME factions in our planetary HiStory, specifically Birth of Christ (BC) To nearly 2009 years post his physical exit (AD), there's only one other Worldly figure that has been bestowed the powers to reach EVERY corner of the globe. And that Heavenly Gift was the Incomparable Michael Jackson.

2+5, The days of Christ and Michael.

Although many other Great Worldly figures, ranging from Martin to Mother Teresa, have graced this Earth with soul driven purposes that have benefited humanity, there have ONLY been two who have been subjected to literal crucifixions; before, during and after their deaths. And even in the face of these crucifixions, they both maintained hearts filled with love, sensitivity and care for all man/woman-kind. They carried rare emotional connections to and concerns for every single poor and sick person on the planet; Especially the children. They were in-tune with the necessary nurturance that this magnificent creation we inhabit requires for survival. They both never stopped giving and wanting to give more! They even carried compassion and hope for those who were consumed with evil and sought to do them both harm. An EXTREME rarity!

Christ was the savior of lives once as a physical being
So too was Michael Jackson.
I’m sure there are “many” here on this very board who can attest to that. My word itself does not have to be taken as conclusive. The proof will be provided through acknowledgement.

Throughout the decades of the modern tIMEs we live, many Great figures have suffered untIMEly demises. Deep reflection of these occurrences will or should give you great pause. The easiest approach up until about 20 years ago was always by the bullet. What changed the trend? Well, along came awareness, suspicion, and non-acceptance of "stories" that carry potholes in logic. Thus, it demanded a necessity for more elaborate plans of execution that are now used as a means of thwarting the full truth. This process had to be in magnification ten fold in order to end the physical existence of the most famous person walking this Earth. Many OTHER attempts had failed, even though they left enormous wounds. You see, evil always goes for the jugular by attacking a person's greatest strength. Michael Jackson's greatest strength was pure love. The antagonist of such a principle is hate. So they used that pure love and coupled it with another of his strengths towards healing and caring for sick children to formulate perhaps the most wickedly contrived fiction in history. The goal was to create the most egregious of perceptions and marvel with pleasure and amusement at its historically noted difficulty to disprove. But I'm of the vision that this stain too shall be removed in due course. In fact, I have intuition that the subject of the first narrative has already, years ago, righted that wrong behind the scenes. For that individual or even those of his acquaintance, who are ambivalent about the “open” approach & legalities, these initials (T-M) are your "key". Trust ME!

Though the hands of tIME still move incrementally, tick-tock, tick-tock, it is quickly running thin on the 2 decade long, elaborate planning that culminated in this execution. I can now understand that "vision" of 6/25/06 relapse", with CLARITY. This is no conspiracy theory! However, believe as you may. But believing and knowing--- are two different things.

Arms, wrist and feet. Bludgeoned through the veins.
Arms, wrist and feet, Poisoned through the veins.
Two different Kings, with different Reigns.
And The End result shall be the same.

JUSTICE........For it is already written!

And shall be illUMINATED! (E. Chandler— I hope you left proper notice repenting---the inferno awaits and you shall become a believer in what you didn’t before. HELL is your EQUALIZER. You’ve earned it!

“With all the ingredients—is it Simmering---can you smell it—how long before the “pie” is done.” – As many have realized, IT would have been greatness to an infinite degree.

Mr. Jackson--- you know I still have your back--- until my end.
Connected

KEEP Watchin'.......

"This is my planet. You're ONE of Us" --- The Greatest

11/19/09
http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/showt... ost2388932

"Back" has a reverence, deep love and respect for Katherine, Michael’s mother, he vehemently defends her. He presents her as an almost saintly figure.

Jesus’ mother Mary is considered a Saint and revered in both Christian and the Muslim religions..

Will You Be There?
Michael channelling his higher power and his music came from God.

JACKSON: I wrote "Will You Be There?" at my house, "Never Land" in California. ... I didn't think about it hard. That's why its hard to take credit for the songs that I write, because I just always feel that its done from above. I feel fortunate for being that instrument through which music flows. I'm just the source through which it comes. I can't take credit for it because its Gods work. He's just using me as the messenger.
http://http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1077/is_n1_v48/ai_12824421/

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PiiPhxj8FLg[/youtube]

The lyrics of many of Michael's songs, including “Will You Be There”, also give us clues to whom he really is, as does the symbolism in many of Michael's performances.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COcN_TmWpPE[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kB8uQqbLJH4[/youtube]

Letter to the Media

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJeOKDPphGI/AAAAAAAAAGQ/ur6BZDPu8gY/s400/Letter+to+the+media.jpg)

“I must endure for the power I was sent forth by, for the world, for the children. But have mercy, for I’ve been bleeding for a long time now.”

Dateline Interview of Rabbi Shmuley and the "Michael Tapes"

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Owu1bkBtTbI[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JrJ0GAbKag[/youtube]

Messiah Complex
A messiah complex is a state of mind in which the individual believes he/she is, or is destined to become, a savior. The messiah complex does not appear in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM)

So this is not an actual mental disorder at all.

In the tapes included with Rabbi Shmuley's interview, Michael also claims that he has ability to heal.
Many of the “miracles” Jesus is attributed with include healing.

The Surgical Mask
The surgical mask is a symbol of a doctor.
What is a doctor?
A HEALER.

(http://http://sas.guidespot.com/bundles/guides_ep/assets/widget_cbxP0OhdDcxk1-YUNN9dPS.jpg)

La Toya's Interview with Barbra Walters on 20/20

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86LGDbHPLI4[/youtube]

The Jehovah’s Witnesses
The Jehovah’s Witnesses believe that Arch Angel Michael and the Jesus and the Messiah are one in the same.
There have been many comparisons made between Michael and Arch Angel Michael.

Daniel 12:1
 1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Daniel 10:13
13 But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia.

Revelation 12:7 (King James Version)
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

A group of Jehovah’s Witnesses came forward  and claimed that Michael Jackson was the Messiah.

Dr. Cornel West & Dr. Michael Dyson
They appeared on the "Tavis Smiley Show", here is an excerpt of what was said.

West: "It's almost like a crucifixion, in terms of the cross you have to bear," said professor Cornel West. "We reap the fruits of the resurrection, in terms of the power that emanates from [Jackson's] sacrifice. He sacrificed his childhood because he loved us so. He didn't just entertain us, he sustained us."

Dyson: "There's no question that the transcendent art that he created was a means, an instrument, a vehicle, for others to experience what he did not. His soul got more deeply rooted in the existential agony and the profound social grief. And what he did was he allowed us through his voice and his instrument to see a glimpse of the heaven that he himself was denied."
http://http://www.pbs.org/kcet/tavissmiley/archive/200906/20090630_west.html?vid=tavi08s2b61qa2d#video

The Sign
Let's not forget that TS (The Sign) has told us, in previous updates, that Michael has not revealed himself because we aren't ready yet.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEIAPvz6HeI[/youtube]

The word messiah means
1. the promised and expected deliverer of the Jewish people.
2. Jesus Christ, regarded by Christians as fulfilling this promise and expectation. John 4:25, 26.
3. any expected deliverer.
4. a zealous leader of some cause or project.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/messiah

How many clues must we be presented with, before we decide to consider the message?

Are you ready to see the man you never knew?

(http://http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJeY2STzZMI/AAAAAAAAAGg/a06NPfqcoKs/s640/MJ+THIS+IS+IT+crop.jpg)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 10:16:31 PM
Quote from: 2good2btrue
I wonder whether the pics at the funeral,  with the bandage around his hand and wrist, are symbolic for  injuries from being nailed to a cross.?

Good question 2good2btrue. This is what I found.

Hand Symbolism & Beliefs
The hands are naturally the instruments of that will and divine blessing and have come to symbolize Man, or Adam; for only beings on the evolutionary level of man are given the prerogative to determine their own fate. It is said that not even angels have this freedom to choose, for their nature compels them to abide by the divine law. Man on the other hand, through choice, learns what it means to align himself with, or to disobey Cosmic laws. Man learns the consequences of his actions, and wise is he who takes responsibility for them.

The Hand of Jesus as the Hand of Power
The hand of Jesus as the Hand of Power or "Mano Poderosa." In the depiction of the crucified hand, all of the fingers are extended with various saints standing upon the digits.

"The image is of a huge wounded (but not bleeding) right hand, which points up through clouds, cut palm toward us. The lines in the palm are shown, and it looks like the head line is cut. The fingers are all of eerily uniform length, with a long thin thumb. Small, disembodied, winged cherub-heads float in the sky above the hand.

"To the left and right of the hand are four kneeling female angels who gaze upward and bear the tools of the crucifixion. Of the two on the left, one holds a bowl to catch Jesus' blood; the other holds a spear and vinegar sop in one hand and hammer and nails in the other. Of the two on the right, one holds a cross and the other a crown of thorns.

"Atop clouds on the little finger stands an older male saint with a book. The ring finger's clouds hold a female saint; the middle finger's, a younger male saint with a white lily; the forefinger's, the Virgin Mary; and the deformed thumb's clouds bear the toddler Jesus holding a globe in his right hand and raising his left."

From the above we may surmise that not only are hands the symbol of Man, they are also the symbol of divinity, for the sacred hand of the Divine One have its influence upon the mundane affairs of humanity when men have gone too far astray from the path of Truth and righteousness. Scriptures are replete with stories of divine intervention or action with materialized hands as a media of information conveyance or operation. Not only did the hand of God "inscribe" the Ten Commandments upon the stone tablets prepared by Moses, it also warned Belshazzar of his impending doom--a spirit hand materialized and wrote on the wall "Mene, Mene Tekel, U-pharsin" (Daniel 5: 24-25).
http://www.buzzle.com/articles/mudras-hand-symbolism-hand-symbolism-beliefs-part-1.html (http://http://www.buzzle.com/articles/mudras-hand-symbolism-hand-symbolism-beliefs-part-1.html)

The PowerfulHand
The Powerful Hand (Mano Poderosa in Spanish) depicts the right hand of God with fingers and thumb stretched upright. The palm, with its stigmata, faces toward the viewer.  The figures that stand at the top of the four fingers represent  the Virgin Mary, St. Joseph, and her parents, St. Anne St. Joachim.  The Christ Child is depicted on the thumb.

The meaning of the hand may derive from ancient times as a sign of magical protection and benediction.  Historian Carla Wisch explains, "Within popular Catholicism, the Omnipotent Hand symbolizes the all-powerful hand of Christ.  With its stigmata, the severed hand evokes the image of Jesus' hand nailed to the Cross. It most likely evolved from pre-Christian pagan rituals that prophesied the coming of Christ.

(http://http://www.udayton.edu/mary/images2/poderosa.gif)
http://http://campus.udayton.edu/mary/questions/yq2/yq327.html (http://http://campus.udayton.edu/mary/questions/yq2/yq327.html)

Michael has tape on all his fingers and thumb, except the middle one, of his right hand. The middle one represents St. Joseph, Jesus' father. He also has his palm taped which is representative of the crucifixion. The tape on the wrist, may be symbolizing the disembodiment of the hand, as we see it depicted in the painting.

(http://http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=10090)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 10:20:54 PM
Quote from: "paula-c"
"The autopsy shows that Michael suffered punctures in both wrists/heel of the hands, both ankles and an unexplained abdominal incision (healed). He also had multiple injuries/scars on his back, arms, legs etc. all unexplained".

When it comes to the unexplained injuries, you think you are stigmata?.
Wound type reflects his correspondence with the passion of Jesus through the following signals:
Injured hands or wrists, similar to those caused by similar to those caused by Spears injured foot, similar to those caused by stakes injured in the head, resembling those caused by the Crown of thorns injured back, similar to the whip in the wound flagellation flank, stakes.

Stigmata
The stigmata take various forms. Many show some or all of the five Holy Wounds  that were, according to the Bible, inflicted on Jesus during his crucifixion: wounds in the hands and feet, from nails, and in the side, from a lance. Some stigmatics display wounds to the forehead similar to those caused by the Crown of Thorns. Other reported forms include tears of blood or sweating blood, and wounds to the back as from scourging.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stigmata

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJeYd6ijahI/AAAAAAAAAGY/gqo2-s_rUK4/s640/autopsy.jpg)

[attachment=1:3rrzuu8x]Autopsy pag 15 16.jpg[/attachment:3rrzuu8x]
[attachment=0:3rrzuu8x]Autopsy page 17.jpg[/attachment:3rrzuu8x]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 10:23:46 PM
Lost years of Jesus
The lost years of Jesus concerns the undocumented timespan between Jesus's childhood and the beginning of his ministry as recorded in the New Testament.

The gospels have accounts of event surrounding Jesus' birth, and the subsequent flight into Egypt to escape the wrath of Herod (Matthew 2:13-23). There is a general reference to the settlement of Joseph and Mary, along with the young Jesus, at Nazareth (Matthew 2:23; Lk. 2:39-40). There also is that isolated account of Joseph, Mary, and Jesus' visit to the city of Jerusalem to celebrate the Passover, when Jesus was twelve years old (Luke 2:41-50).

Following that episode, there is a blank space in the record that covers eighteen years in the life of Christ (from age 12 to 30). Other than the generic allusion that Jesus advanced in wisdom, stature, and in favor with God and man (Luke 2:52), the Bible gives nothing more about Jesus' life during this time span. A common assumption amongst Christians is that Jesus simply lived in Nazareth during that period, but there are various accounts, that present other scenarios, typically including travels to India.

Several authors have claimed to have found proof of the existence of manuscripts in India and Tibet that support the belief that Christ was in India during this time in his life. Others cite legends in a number of places in the region that Jesus passed that way in ancient times.The Jesus in India manuscript was first reported in modern times by Nicolas Notovitch (1894). Subsequently several other authors have written on the subject including, the religious leader Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (1899), Levi H. Dowling (1908), Swami Abhedananda (1922), Nicholas Roerich (1923–1928),[1] Mathilde Ludendorff (1930), Elizabeth Clare Prophet (1956) and more recently Holger Kersten[4] in his book Jesus Lived in India (1981).

Aquarian Gospel of Jesus the Christ
The Aquarian Gospel of Jesus the Christ by Levi H. Dowling, published in 1908, claims to be the true story of the life of Jesus, including "the 'lost' eighteen years silent in the New Testament."

The narrative follows the young Jesus across India, Tibet, Persia, Assyria, Greece and Egypt.

Saint Issa
In 1887 a Russian war correspondent, Nicolas Notovitch, visited India and Tibet. He claimed that, at the lamasery or monastery of Hemis in Ladakh, he learned of the "Life of Saint Issa, Best of the Sons of Men." Issa is the Arabic name of Jesus. His story, with a translated text of the "Life of Saint Issa," was published in French in 1894 as La vie inconnue de Jesus Christ. It was subsequently translated into English, German, Spanish, and Italian.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_years_of_Jesus

Saint Issa Meditating
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_niPwTW3rBbU/SVD21iDPVNI/AAAAAAAAB-U/nR7JRpNmYIU/s400/jesus+meditating)

Screen Captures from the Video for "Scream"

[attachment=1:ex57vge8]MJ Meditating Scream Video.jpg[/attachment:ex57vge8]
[attachment=0:ex57vge8]Budha statue.jpg[/attachment:ex57vge8]

Roza Bal The Tomb of Jesus by Dan Brown (author of the Da Vinci Code)
Product Description
An amazing first-hand journey to Kashmir-a look into the evidence that Jesus survived crucifixion-proof that he lived and died in Kashmir and is buried in the famous tomb known as Roza Bal. Meet the family who claim that Yuzu Asaph, Jesus, is their ancestral grandfather. Learn about the efforts to create a DNA profile of Jesus' family. From John the Apostle to Saint Thomas, many were with Jesus years after the crucifixion who have historically verified his journey. Records in Kashmir mention his wife named Marjan and their son, Ely-Kim-the same son that Saul met on the road to Damascus known as Ely-mar, 'a man with a great mind'. The most startling revelation of all? Jesus lived to fullfill the last words on the titulus, he lived to become 'King of the Jews' in India. This is a troubling and factual investigation,but necessary for a complete study of the life of Jesus after crucifixion, a life that leads us directly to his tomb and his Grail children hidden away in Paradise on Earth, Kashmir. Behind this book have gone years of danger, personal hardships,and threats from fundamentalists to bring you the research of two world experts, best known for their intimate knowledge of the tomb of Jesus. Share their journey of discovery into his tomb. Enter the world of Roza Bal.
http://www.amazon.com/Roza-Tomb-Jesus-Fida-Hassnain/dp/1419697587

34. Elvis believed that he was chosen by God for something special. He thought he had special powers like, hands-on-healing. I think he may have had some special gifts other than his voice. Elvis was always studying about religion. He didn't want to take any chances when it came to getting into the Kingdom of Heaven. One of his favorite books, which you will find on display at Graceland now, was The Passover Plot by Hugh Schonfield in 1966. The book is a story of how Jesus may have faked his death and came back 16 years later instead of being resurrected. Elvis may have faked his death and given up all worldly possessions in an effort to make it into the Kingdom of Heaven. Elvis once mentioned to a friend that he would like to become a Monk. After August 16, 1977, a man dressed as a Monk went into a popular entertainment club. Another customer reported that the face under the hood looked remarkably like Elvis Presley. As it turns out, the club was owned by a good friend of Elvis'.
http://members.fortunecity.com/sivlenoramoran/mysteries.htm

The Passover Plot
The Passover Plot is the name of a controversial, best-selling 1965 book, by British Biblical scholar Hugh J. Schonfield who has also published a translation of the New Testament informed with a Jewish perspective.

Schonfield's conclusions

Based on scholarly research into the social and religious culture in which Jesus was born, lived and died, into the source documents of the Gospels, and into other literature, Schonfield reached the following conclusions:

* That Jesus was a deeply religious Jewish man, probably well-versed in the teachings of the local northern sects such as the Nazarenes and Essenes.
* That growing up in Biblical Galilee he had a skeptical and somewhat rebellious relationship to the hierarchy and teachings mandated by the authorities (the Pharisees) of the Temple in Jerusalem.
* That Jewish Messianic expectation was extremely high in those times, matched to the despair caused by the Roman occupation of the land, and by their subjugation of the Jews.
* That he was in many ways both typical of his times, and yet extraordinary in his religious convictions and beliefs, in his scholarship of the Biblical literature, and in the fervency in which he lived his religion out in his daily life.
* That he was convinced of his role as the expected Messiah based on the authority of his having been descendant from King David (the royal bloodline of David), and that he consciously and methodically, to the point of being calculating, attempted to fulfill that role, being eminently well-versed in the details of what that role entailed.
* That he was convinced of the importance of his fulfilling the role perfectly (after all prophesy and expectation), and that he could not allow himself to fail, as that would undoubtedly lead to his being declared a false Messiah.
* That he was perfectly aware of the consequences of his actions all along the way, and that he directed his closest supporters, the original twelve Apostles, unknowingly to aid him in his plans.
* That he involved the least possible number of supporters in his plans ("need to know" basis), therefore very few knew of the details of his final plan, and even then only the least amount of information necessary.


The culmination of his plan was to be his death (the crucifixion), his resurrection and his reign as the true Kingly and Priestly Messiah, not in heaven but on earth— the realized King of the Jews.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Passover_Plot
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 10:25:08 PM
I was sent this PM and asked to post our exchange. I respect that the sender wishes to share this but remain anonymous at the same time.

Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Quote
Hi there,
I firmly believe that you are definitely on to something with the Jesus/Michael connection, not to mention the Back=Michael=TS connection.  I know that it's a 'hard pill to swallow' for some due to lifelong conditioning.

You have mentioned the trinity a few times now and I really think it ties in with the hoax somehow (as you mentioned, could be literally, metaphorically or symbolically).  You may have already discovered it, but if not I hope you can somehow use it for your research and/or theory.

the father in Jewish Gematria Equals: 313 = 7
the son in Jewish Gematria Equals: 293 = 14 = 7 & 7
the holy spirit in Jewish Gematria Equals: 939 = 21 = 7,7 & 7

Interestingly enough is The Son....where have we seen those initials before?  :shock:

Quote
I am fascinated by your interpretation of the trinity info I sent you. I know it has meaning within the hoax, I just haven't figured out exactly 'how' yet....although The Son (TS) keeps jumping out at me! I would much prefer you post our findings in the thread if you would like to.

Hi,

Thank you for your message and for reading my posts. I do believe that there is connection between Michael/Jesus/Messiah/ArchAngel Michael.

the father in Jewish Gematria Equals: 313 = 7
the son in Jewish Gematria Equals: 293 = 14 = 7 & 7
the holy spirit in Jewish Gematria Equals: 939 = 21 = 7,7 & 7

Well, look at that. Seven is a spiritual number associated with God.

The Father first of the Trinity = 7
The Son the second in the trinity = 77
The Holy Spirit = 777

Combined they are the embodiment of the totality of God.
And we have 777 & 777 which could represent the dual aspects present in all of creation.

As I do believe that there is a very good chance that TS is Michael, the initials might very well represent The Son, which in turn represents the Messiah and therefore our beloved Michael.

with love
Serenity
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 10:27:24 PM
Quote from: "paula-c"
The sign of the zodiac I number 13, remember that thisisalmostit publish in his twitter on September 04 the word "Ophiuchus  " that is the name of this sign, and I to write more or less something this way that lei in Internet;

As I understood, when astrologers laid the foundations for the Zodiac of twelve signs, Ophiuchus was a constellation that was hidden or not passing by the ecliptic, and therefore was not considered a sign of the zodiac. However, the phenomenon of the precession of the equinoxes did that currently this constellation Scorpio and Sagittarius, passing through the ecliptic.

This would mean that currently the Zodiac could be composed of 13 signs, and the dates on which the sun passes through each might already distina, as a result of the precession of the equinoxes, and the inclusion of Ophiuchus as sign.

Here are some things that they found me curious about Ophiuchus:

It is found near the center of the Galaxy, opposite to the area of Orion constellation... The Mayans considered the area of the belt of Orion as a resurrection, or the heart of the creation. A place to which the Maís Dios (what mankind?) is directed in a canoe (the solar system? what Earth?) from the underworld (the center of the Galaxy?). Astronomically solar system makes a cyclical journey through the Galaxy, and in these times is coming increasingly at the Centre.

Mythological perspective, Ophiuchus was a character with very specific characteristics. Son of a God and a human, with large capacity for healing, which could even resurrect the dead.

Personally, I become characteristics similar to the attributed to Jesus in the Catholic religion. I am not surprised that the Sun at the time of his birth was passing Ophiuchus and the zodiac sign of Jesus that were. In fact some miracles attributed to Jesún included healing the sick and resurrect dead people, and likewise the Catholic religion believed in the resurrection of the dead at the end of times.
This could perhaps be an element of hope within all forecasts of chaos, war, penalties and destruction.
Leaving aside the religious and astrological point of view, and still somewhat neutral or secular, there are many coincidences that point to that "the end of time" is nearby. But that doesn't necessarily mean that it is "the end of the world". It is perhaps only the tragic end of an era decadent, following which continues a cycle of evolution which leads to a different stage, maybe better.

And the interesting thing about this is that you so you may live, because it seems the 21 or 22 December 2012.

http://elartur.blogspot.com/2009/01/ofi ... cipio.html (http://elartur.blogspot.com/2009/01/ofiuco-un-posible-simbolo-del-principio.html)

http://twitter.com/thisisalmostit (http://twitter.com/thisisalmostit)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: wishingstar on October 01, 2010, 10:33:21 PM
Yes, ready.

Many Blessings to you Serenity!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 10:41:53 PM
The Zodiac and Michael Jackson

There are actually 13 signs in the zodiac.

(http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=9764)

Michael Jackson is actually a Leo.

Leo is represented by the Lion.


[attachment=3:pt2iw492]Leo.jpg[/attachment:pt2iw492]
Lion of Judah
In Christian tradition, the Lion of Judah represents Jesus.

The Lion and the Lamb are both the Messiah...

Revelation 5:5 (King James Version)
1 And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals.

The painting of Michael entitled "The Book".

[attachment=2:pt2iw492]The Book painting.jpg[/attachment:pt2iw492]
2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?

3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.

5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

7 And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne.

8 And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

11 And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;

12 Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing.

13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.

14 And the four beasts said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=revelations%205&version=KJV

Lion of Judah in Ethiopia
Ethiopia's traditions, recorded and elaborated in a 13th century treatise, the "Kebre Negest", assert descent from a retinue of Israelites who returned with the Queen of Sheba from her visit to King Solomon in Jerusalem, by whom she had conceived the Solomonic dynasty's founder, Menelik I. Both Christian and Jewish Ethiopian tradition has it that these immigrants were mostly of the Tribes of Dan and Judah; hence the Ge'ez motto Mo`a 'Anbessa Ze'imnegede Yihuda  ("The Lion of the Tribe of Judah has conquered"), included among the titles of the Emperor (King of Kings) throughout the Solomonic Dynasty. It is unknown whether John of Patmos was directly aware of this hereditary title when he penned it into the text of the prophecy. The Lion of Judah motif figured prominently on the old imperial flag, currency, stamps, etc. and may still be seen gracing the terrace of the capital as a national symbol. After the collapse of the Communist Derg in 1990 and the increase of Western-style political freedoms, a minor political party bearing the name Mo'a Anbessa made its appearance.

Royal Bloodline of Ethiopia
The Ethiopian kings claim descent from King David just as the British Royal Family and all other Royal families. King David is descendant of Jesus.

See a resemblance between the way Michael is dressed and the King of Ethiopia?

(http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=9965)

(http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=10010)

Michael is descended from slaves. many slaves brought to the US were from Ethiopia.

[attachment=1:pt2iw492]Joe Jackson desecended from slaves.jpg[/attachment:pt2iw492]
This may very well be the explanation for the coat of Arms that Michael wore on his clothes and that is on the gates of Neverland.

The Sphinx
The Sphinx in Egypt is facing it's mirror image in the night sky as it looks directly at the constellation Leo.
(Man in the Mirror?)

[attachment=0:pt2iw492]Sphinx in the Mirror.jpg[/attachment:pt2iw492]
The Sphinx was built by Pharaoh Khafre (aka Kafra, Khefren).
Khafre was an Egyptian pharaoh of the Fourth dynasty, who had his capital at Memphis. Khafre built the second largest pyramid at Giza. The Egyptian name of the pyramid was Wer(en)-Khafre which means "Khafre is Great". He is also credited with the building of the Sphinx.

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TKZdU-Ie-EI/AAAAAAAAAIA/JSv4aCHpOp8/s640/Khafre+2.jpg)

Michael recreated himself as the statue of Khafre in the HIStory CD Booklet.


(http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=9768)

The Arno Bani Photo Shoot
This photo shoot took place in 1991 but pictures have only recently been released. The photos were originally taken to be used  for the cover of the "Invincible" album.
Michael entitled these photographs "The Sphinx"


(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJ327OnWk0I/AAAAAAAAAHA/vYjwoyMabLc/s400/Back.jpg)

Michael's inspiration fro this photo shoot was a fashion photograph that appeared on the cover of the 'Sunday Times Style'. It features a woman who appears to be Egyptian Royalty. The particular magazine is entitled  "WRAPTURE"

(http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af214/moonter/shawl.jpg)

The Rapture
The Rapture is an event in the futurist interpretation of Christian eschatology, in which it is posited that Christians will be gathered together in the air to meet the MESSIAH at his return.
The primary passage used to support this idea is 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17, in which Paul cites "the word of the Lord" about the return of the messiah to gather his saints.
...and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air.

You see we are going back in a circle now and headed into things I have already posted. Multiple clues, all ending up in the same place
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 10:55:10 PM
What is a Virtual Easter Egg?

A virtual Easter egg is an intentionally hidden message, in-joke or feature in an object such as a movie, book, CD, DVD, computer program, music/movie file, web page or video game.

Quote
dontmakeitfactual wrote:
Ok, this will probably have a very simple explanation, but...here is something very odd I came across while syncronising my MJ songs in my computer.

So I have all albums added to my iTunes library, but yesterday I got a new phone and so I transferred all tracks to 'kies', which is the software I'm using for the new device. Now, you know how this software gets you all track details, right? As I was browsing through all new added tracks, I came across one that wasn't related to MJ at all -in fact, which I don't recognize at all as ever having downloaded it, or it even being in my computer as one of those dodgy music samples that come with windows player, etc.

The info about this particular track reads:

Joseph Haydn, Die sieben letzten Worte unseres Erlösers am Kreuze, Le Concert des Nations, Jordi Savall

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TKY-xKtxQ4I/AAAAAAAAAHQ/2v04If4qWD0/s400/PlanetEarthInfo1.JPG)

This translates from German to English to:  
'Seven Last Words of Christ on the Cross'
http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=14407

The Seven Last Words of Christ

1. Father forgive them, for they know not what they do (Luke 23:34).
2. Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in paradise (Luke 23:43).
3. Woman, behold your son: behold your mother (John 19:26-27).
4. My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?, (Matthew 27:46and Mark 15:34).
5. I thirst (John 19:28).
6. It is finished (John 19:30).
7. Father, into your hands I commit my spirit (Luke 23:46)

Die sieben letzten Worte unseres Erlösers am Kreuze
The Seven Last Words of Christ (German: Die sieben letzten Worte unseres Erlösers am Kreuze, "The Seven Last Words of Our Saviour on the Cross") is a composition by Joseph Haydn, featuring seven meditations on the last words of Jesus Christ, commissioned in 1787 for the Good Friday service at the Grotto Santa Cueva near Cádiz in southern Spain. The work exists in several versions, including the original for orchestra, an oratorio with vocal forces, and a transcription for string quartet.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Last_Words_of_Christ

[youtube:22fbuj7j]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGszT6Z2PWE[/youtube:22fbuj7j]

Joseph Haydn
Franz Joseph Haydn (31 March 1732 – 31 May 1809), known as Joseph Haydn was an Austrian composer, one of the most prolific and prominent composers of the classical period. He is often called the "Father of the Symphony" and "Father of the String Quartet" because of his important contributions to these genres. He was also instrumental in the development of the piano trio and in the evolution of sonata form.

A life-long resident of Austria, Haydn spent much of his career as a court musician for the wealthy Hungarian aristocratic Esterházy family on their remote estate. Isolated from other composers and trends in music until the later part of his long life, he was, as he put it, "forced to become original". At the time of his death, he was one of the most celebrated composers in Europe.

Joseph Haydn was the brother of Michael Haydn, himself a highly regarded composer, and Johann Evangelist Haydn, a tenor. He was also a close friend of Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart and a teacher of Ludwig van Beethoven.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Haydn (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Haydn)

Le Concert des Nations
Le Concert des Nations is an orchestra with period instruments, able to perform the orchestral and symphonic repertoire from the Baroque to Romanticism: 1600 - 1850. The orchestra was created in 1989, the youngest of the groups conducted by the Catalan maestro and viola da gamba virtuoso Jordi Savall. Le Concert des Nations is the first orchestra of its kind made up of musicians who originate mainly from Latin countries (Spain, South America, Italy, Portugal, France as well as many other countries). The name Le Concert des Nations refers to the work by François Couperin as an assembly of "tastes" and bears the mark of the Age of Enlightenment ). Le Concert des Nations is the orchestra of La Capella Reial de Catalunya.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Concert_des_Nations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Concert_des_Nations)

François Couperin
François Couperin was a French Baroque composer, organist and harpsichordist. He was known as Couperin le Grand ("Couperin the Great") to distinguish him from other members of the musically talented Couperin family.

Couperin was born in Paris. He was taught by his father, Charles Couperin, who died when François was 10, and by Jacques Thomelin. In 1685 he became the organist at the church of Saint-Gervais, Paris, a post he inherited from his father and that he would pass on to his cousin, Nicolas Couperin. Other members of the family also later held the same position. In 1693 Couperin succeeded his teacher Thomelin as organist at the Chapelle Royale (Royal Chapel) with the title organiste du Roi, organist by appointment to Louis XIV.

In 1717 Couperin became court organist and composer, with the title ordinaire de la musique de la chambre du Roi. With his colleagues, Couperin gave a weekly concert, typically on Sunday. Many of these concerts were in the form of suites for violin, viol, oboe, bassoon and harpsichord, on which he was a virtuoso player.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fran%C3%A7ois_Couperin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fran%C3%A7ois_Couperin)

Age of Enlightenment
The Age of Enlightenment (or simply the Enlightenment) is the era in Western philosophy and intellectual, scientific, and cultural life, centered upon the 18th century, in which reason was advocated as the primary source for legitimacy and authority.

Developing simultaneously in France, Great Britain, Germany, the Netherlands, Italy, Spain, the American colonies, and Portugal, the movement was buoyed by Atlantic Revolutions, especially the success of the American Revolution, in breaking free of the British Empire. Most of Europe was caught up, including the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, Russia, and Scandinavia, along with Latin America in instigating the Haitian Revolution. The authors of the American Declaration of Independence, the United States Bill of Rights, the French Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen, and the Polish-Lithuanian Constitution of May 3, 1791, were motivated by Enlightenment principles.

The "Enlightenment" was not a single movement or school of thought, for these philosophies were often mutually contradictory or divergent. The Enlightenment was less a set of ideas than it was a set of values. At its core was a critical questioning of traditional institutions, customs, and morals, and a strong belief in rationality and science. Thus, there was still a considerable degree of similarity between competing philosophies. Some historians also include the late 17th century, which is typically known as the Age of Reason or Age of Rationalism, as part of the Enlightenment; however, most historians consider the Age of Reason to be a prelude to the ideas of the Enlightenment. Modernity, by contrast, is used to refer to the period after The Enlightenment; albeit generally emphasizing social conditions rather than specific philosophies.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment)

Jordi Savall
Jordi Savall i Bernadet (born 1941, in Igualada, Catalonia, Spain) is a Spanish Catalan viol player, conductor, and composer. He has been one of the major figures in the field of early music since the 1970s, largely responsible for bringing the viol (viola da gamba) back to life on the stage. His characteristic repertory ranges from Medieval to Renaissance and Baroque music, though he has occasionally ventured into the classical or even the romantic period.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jordi_Savall (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jordi_Savall)

The Song "Scream" Lyrics
Michael sings "Father, please have mercy, I just can't take it anymore"
4. My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?, (Matthew 27:46and Mark 15:34)

The Song "Will You Be There" Lyrics
"I'm Only Human"
"5. I thirst (John 19:28). - A human craving, a necessity of physical life.

And just a note here in the song "Will You Be There" the lyrics are also:

"Lift Me Up Slowly", "lift me up, lift me up" & "lift me"

This is a reference to the crucifixion, the "lifting" of Jesus

John 3:14 (King James Version)
14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up (Physically Killed, The Crucifixion)

John 12:32-33 (King James Version)
32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
33 This he said, signifying what death he should die. (The Crucifixion)

Son of Man painting from the "Scream" video

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcXjGi7yrI/AAAAAAAAAFw/9o8aljGUouI/s400/Apple+head+painting.jpg)

Michael's nickname "Apple Head"

"This is It"
6. It is finished (John 19:30)
Michael's Crucifixion was completed and he announced this during the O2 Press conference, he then "died" and now we await his Resurrection.


The Song "This Is It"
Michael sings "I am the Light of the World, this is real".
The light of the world is another name for Jesus and/or the Messiah.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 11:02:33 PM
"Casket Man": Another Clue...
On July 20, 2009, an unusual video was uploaded to a channel on youtube called "Casketamerica". http://www.youtube.com/user/Casketamerica (http://www.youtube.com/user/Casketamerica)

The video is entitled:

Michael Jackson Casket - Sleep In One At Your House!

Video Description: DON'T BELIEVE THE STORIES!!! Regardless of media reports, Michael Jackson was in his Golden Casket. It is unethical to think otherwise, regardless of the circumstances! Let the "King of Pop" rest in peace...NOW, you can have your own peace of mind by owning a reproduction of his famous Golden Casket: complete with Flame Blue Velvet Interior, "Engraved Memorial Plate" and "Certificate of Authenticity." Use this most unique momento to store your MJ concert memorabilia, clothing, music, posters, etc...you can even add a CD or MP3 player to "rock the evening all night long" and even sleep in it. (Although a genuine burial casket, it has a safety non-gasketed lid for home use.)

[youtube:1dtjcg9i]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F599ZCcwMwg[/youtube:1dtjcg9i]

This video upset many people and a campaign to have it removed was even started but there are few things that actually make this video seem like it might be Joke created by Michael Jackson himself.

1. The whole premise is ridiculous and quite silly to begin with.
2. The video lists a website for more information at : http://www.casketamerica.com (http://www.casketamerica.com) this website doesn't exist.
3. The Company: Casket America also doesn't even exist.

But there was something interesting at the end of the video did you catch it?
Here is a screen shot:

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TKZErmAOQqI/AAAAAAAAAHU/yHjW-0Gfxjo/s1600/year.jpg)

2009 -1988 = 21
21 = 3 x 7


777

The triple seven (777) is symbolic of God; it is literally God's number.

But there is also this...

1988 - 1958 = 30

Ministry of Jesus
According to the Canonical Gospels, the ministry of Jesus began when Jesus was around 30 years old and lasted a period of 1–3 years. In the biblical narrative, Jesus' method of teaching involved parables, metaphor, allegory, sayings, proverbs, and a small number of direct sermons. This was the first coming of Jesus; as most Christian denominations believe in a Second Coming when Jesus will return to the earth to fulfill aspects of Messianic prophecy, such as the general Resurrection of the Dead, the Last Judgment of the dead and the living and the full establishment of the Kingdom of God on earth (also called the "Reign of God"), including the Messianic Age.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ministry_of_Jesus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ministry_of_Jesus)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 01, 2010, 11:10:50 PM
I posted this another thread but it is a symbolic representation of the Trinity.
The Father, the Son and The Holy Spirit.

Quote from: "salomon"
look at this link and observe Michael's face, it's a new book about Michael. Do you see the same thing ?

This is the official site of the book: http://www.mjthrillerbook.com/ (http://www.mjthrillerbook.com/)

Publication Date: October 28, 2010 by Filipacchi Publishing.

(http://www.mjfrance.com/site/news/septembre10/4days.jpg)

http://mjfrance.com/actu/index.php?post/2010/09/26/Livre%3A-Michael-Jackson%3A-The-Making-Of-Thriller-4-Days/1983.../2098

The Three Faces of God.

(http://curatormuseo.files.wordpress.com/2006/08/trinitythreefacesonebody.jpg?w=497)

(http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/ciu/a6/41/fed6024128a0dbb5ca1a3010.L._SL500_AA300_.jpg)

(http://trinities.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/a-three-faced-god.jpg)

Screen capture from the unusual video by Dave Dave

(http://i.ytimg.com/vi/jWDJiehQLic/0.jpg)

[youtube:3dn9cejn]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GolrKskS55U[/youtube:3dn9cejn]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: SoldierofLOVE on October 02, 2010, 12:51:57 AM
wow.  this is amazing.  serenity's dream, you should write a book about this.  it'd be the best book out there about Michael.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Le Papillon Bleu on October 02, 2010, 03:22:54 PM
WoW! I'm amazed by your post....i always had the feeling that Michael was very very religious...and that he wants to spread the messages of love to everyone....I always thought that even his death would be Jesus-like.
Please tell me.. what's your opinion about this "back" forum user?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Stranger In Chi-town on October 02, 2010, 05:39:25 PM
Duality
Two pictures used at the funeral from Liberian Girl.
Two pictures symbolizing duality, the human and divine natures that also defined the natures of Jesus.

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcVhsoUMBI/AAAAAAAAAFQ/idXShixSysI/s320/0021.jpg)

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcLSnvAbhI/AAAAAAAAAE4/CIeA7hkcsw8/s320/michael-jackson-reaches-his--final-resting-place--lrg.png)

Wow, that is interesting, Serenity. Funny thing is, I have one of these Liberian Girl shots saved to the PC (in a MJ pics folder) mainly cuz it's nice and I wanted to draw it one day. But the way his right hand is wrapped, it never crossed my mind how similar it could be to Jesus' hands being wrapped up in bandages from the wounding of nails. I mean I noticed the papers on his fingertips but not his wrapped hand, not in the way you mentioned it here. x]  :)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Ijustcantstoplovingu on October 02, 2010, 06:14:58 PM
Amazing job Serenity, thanks a lot for your research interesting reading.  :)

Lots of reading to do tomorrow.

 ;)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dancer on October 02, 2010, 06:17:08 PM
Thank you very much, Serenity!!  :)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: kel70 on October 02, 2010, 06:54:02 PM
i have to be honest and say i have been totally confused by all the religious side of things... but this has helped me understand a bit better...i will come on again tomorrow to re-read..thank you so much serenity  :D
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 03, 2010, 04:21:56 AM
Please watch this video by Seeing Clues, it reveals some very interesting things.

[youtube:33glgfo1]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgZd_243ZjA[/youtube:33glgfo1]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on October 03, 2010, 06:49:29 AM
Great Scot, Serenitys_Dream, you are on the trail! :o
All I could think of to respond right now is --way back in the beginning last summer I couldn't get this out of my head. That The Thriller was the Messiah, the Christ. He is both the evil and the good, the duality you spoke of. I remember one time Michael said shyly that he was "bad in the song Bad, but in a good way". :lol: In the sense that God is the originator of both good and evil, all for the purpose of darkness showing the Light. Evil is a backdrop to show the sheer beauty of goodness and love.
Quote
Thriller lyrics
Songwriters: Temperton, Rod;
It's close to midnight and something evil's lurking in the dark
Under the moonlight, you see a sight that almost stops your heart
You try to scream but terror takes the sound before you make it
You start to freeze as horror looks you right between the eyes
You're paralyzed

'Cause this is thriller, thriller night
And no one's gonna save you from the beast about strike
You know it's thriller, thriller night
You're fighting for your life inside a killer, thriller tonight

You hear the door slam and realize there's nowhere left to run
You feel the cold hand and wonder if you'll ever see the sun
You close your eyes and hope that this is just imagination, girl!
But all the while you hear the creature creeping up behind
You're out of time

'Cause this is thriller, thriller night
There ain't no second chance against the thing with forty eyes, girl
Thriller, thriller night
You're fighting for your life inside a killer, thriller tonight

Night creatures calling, the dead start to walk in their masquerade
There's no escaping the jaws of the alien this time
(They're open wide)
This is the end of your life

They're out to get you, there's demons closing in on every side
They will possess you unless you change that number on your dial
Now is the time for you and I to cuddle close together, yeah
All through the night I'll save you from the terror on the screen
I'll make you see

That this is thriller, thriller night
'Cause I can thrill you more than any ghost would ever dare try
Thriller, thriller night
So let me hold you tight and share a
Killer, diller, chiller, thriller here tonight

'Cause this is thriller, thriller night
Girl, I can thrill you more than any ghost would ever dare try
Thriller, thriller night
So let me hold you tight and share a killer, thriller, ow!

(I'm gonna thrill ya tonight)
Darkness falls across the land
The midnight hour is close at hand
Creatures crawl in search of blood
To terrorize y'alls neighborhood

I'm gonna thrill ya tonight, ooh baby
I'm gonna thrill ya tonight, oh darlin'
Thriller night, baby, ooh!

The foulest stench is in the air
The funk of forty thousand years
And grizzly ghouls from every tomb
Are closing in to seal your doom

And though you fight to stay alive
Your body starts to shiver
For no mere mortal can resist
The evil of the thriller

© RODSONGS;
Michael IS the Thriller, he is the "evil" in a good way, he is the solution!  He has thrilled, is thrilling and he will thrill us again in the future. This song captures all History--40 thousand years? :lol:  This is Revelation end-times in its terror and grisliness, and Resurrection in its Glory and comfort. This song has stirred the heart-strings of all humanity, and cuts to our core being. God has encapsulated the story of man's history and future in a comedy format, with the Messiah as the Thriller. Just my impressions. Two other creation's of MJ's that really stuck with me are PM's and MJ's song "The Man" and MJ's poem "Magical child". Both speak of divinity strongly.

Serenity_Dream is there any detailed study you could do from your perspective, on this Michael's greatest masterpiece of all time? You are a gifted researcher and presenter. Thanks! :)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: sprint911 on October 03, 2010, 10:08:08 AM
Quote from: "MJonmind"
. I remember one time Michael said shyly that he was "bad in the song Bad, but in a good way".
Did you watch the video? it clearly speaks for it self
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: sprint911 on October 03, 2010, 10:59:59 AM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Please watch this video by Seeing Clues, it reveals some very interesting things.

[youtube:z3lo3sdq]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgZd_243ZjA[/youtube:z3lo3sdq]
WOW, sorry serenity, but i have to post this in hoax video section. if you don't mind :lol:
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Le Papillon Bleu on October 03, 2010, 11:20:38 AM
Quote from: "sprint911"
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Please watch this video by Seeing Clues, it reveals some very interesting things.

[youtube:ih6dd9mz]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgZd_243ZjA[/youtube:ih6dd9mz]
WOW, sorry serenity, but i have to post this in hoax video section. if you don't mind :lol:
Hmmm Ian Halperin said that in "his last days" he red the bible  (clue?)
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/ar ... -life.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1205277/Reading-Bible-listening-Gipsy-Kings--final-chaotic-hours-Michael-Jackson-s-tortured-life.html)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on October 03, 2010, 11:27:32 AM
This video this one very good, I had never thought in the dates of TMZ's articles and to relate them that way, a test mas of that this TMZ in the hoax. Thank you  serenity ;)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: ijcsly on October 03, 2010, 01:10:43 PM
this video was simply AMAZING!!!! It's a goosebump moment for me here, right now, the first ever watching a "hoax" vid, my goodness this makes sense!
With this in mind does anybody think we could actually predict future aticles regarding MJ via TMZ? I'm absolutely not religious at all, but i'd like to give it a try "predicting " what articles may come next and on what dates, regarding anything MJ through TMZ using the "gospel" and dates still to come , i'm thinking stuff concerning Murray this month...
Do i just google "gospel" or "bible" or "old or new testament" or what? Can anybody point me in the right direction please? I would'nt know where to start. Thanks :mrgreen:
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: ijcsly on October 03, 2010, 01:41:02 PM
Thought about this some more and remembered something! Some where on this forum are examples of TMZ articles where it seems they waited to post these articles until a certain time or date, i don't know if anyone knows what i'm on about?? We got alot of 3's and 7's and 9's etc from the post "times" but this "gospel" stuff could absolutely tie in with the dates.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Sarahli on October 03, 2010, 03:21:17 PM
Great find SeeingClues! Woohoo! Oh My! This is great after that I don't know who will still doubt!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Rita Hayworth on October 03, 2010, 05:28:15 PM
This connection seems really out there but it does validate so many of us who feel a strong spiritual connection to Michael's death and who have been almost uncontrollably drawn to this site--those of us who liked his music but were never "fans" so to speak. This is one of those spiritual moments when it's almost too much knowledge to attempt to absorb let alone understand.

Serenity- thanks so much.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: jenwren20 on October 03, 2010, 06:51:30 PM
:shock:  :shock:  :shock:  :shock:  :shock:

OMG!! That Video blew my socks off!!!

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on October 03, 2010, 07:00:19 PM
Rita Hayworth, your you have described exactly like we feel many persons ;)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dancer on October 03, 2010, 07:40:28 PM
This video is amazing...
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: thepeacock2012 on October 03, 2010, 08:04:58 PM
I Don't know how I missed this video anyway I'm glad i found it!!!! :D  :D  :D  :D  :D  :o  :o This just confirms for me what I believed all along and that is that MJ is not just any normal man...he is sent to us from God....I truely believe that. Thank you Seeclues and Serenity..not only am I a big fan of Michael but also a BIG fan of you guys too. Thank you both for all your hard work and your knowledge...I have huge faith, but I could never come close to finding the things you guys are finding....although I could give you a low down on all the movies I believe Micheal has influenced...because he knows that reaching us through the same medium that has sedated our minds is how to reach us!!!!! Thanks again...wish someone would seriously look it the clues in alot of movies....its a great adventure!!!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: DREAMSandTRUTH on October 03, 2010, 08:45:14 PM
There are two interesting lines in "Cry" - which I have to admit, cannot understand...

[Verse 1]
Somebody shakes when the wind blows
Somebody's missing a friend, hold on
Somebody's lacking a hero
And they have not a clue
When it's all gonna end

[Verse 2]
Stories buried and untold
Someone is hiding the truth, hold on
When will this mystery unfold
And will the sun ever shine
In the blind man's eyes when he cries?

[Chorus:]
You can change the world (I can't do it by myself)
You can touch the sky (Gonna take somebody's help)
You're the chosen one (I'm gonna need some kind of sign)
If we all cry at the same time tonight

[Verse 3]
People laugh when they're feelin sad
Someone is taking a life, hold on
Respect to believe in your dreams
Tell me where were you
when your children cried last night?

[Verse 4]
Faces fill with madness
Miracles unheard of, hold on
Faith is found in the winds
All we have to do
Is reach for the truth

[Chorus]

And when that flag blows
There'll be no more wars
And when all calls
I will answer all your prayers

[Chorus x3]

Change the world


Michael IS the chosen one   :?:

HE will answer all our prayers   :?:


Sorry if I misunderstand... but is he saying that he is someone like Jesus or he is God-like?

I find Michael's last supper version unhealthy... Honestly, I don't like it.


Michael is a great human, but for me he is only a human.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Andrea on October 03, 2010, 09:06:09 PM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Please watch this video by Seeing Clues, it reveals some very interesting things.

[youtube:i42un9ox]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgZd_243ZjA[/youtube:i42un9ox]

Huh.  Now the improper English and grammar in so many of the TMZ headlines and articles makes sense.  Everyday I realize more and more how complex and how deep this hoax is and it leaves me feeling absolutely amazed and humbled.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: jacilovesmichael on October 03, 2010, 09:23:27 PM
Quote from: "Andrea"
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Please watch this video by Seeing Clues, it reveals some very interesting things.

[youtube:80y0qx7d]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgZd_243ZjA[/youtube:80y0qx7d]

Huh.  Now the improper English and grammar in so many of the TMZ headlines and articles makes sense.  Everyday I realize more and more how complex and how deep this hoax is and it leaves me feeling absolutely amazed and humbled.

HOLY CRAP!!! This is nuts. I think this might be one of the most convincing videos that this is all planned. Seriously! Wow.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Stranger In Chi-town on October 03, 2010, 10:03:28 PM
Watched this video this morning. Man. I must say, this discovery is something! :shock:  :shock:  :o
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: 2good2btrue on October 04, 2010, 12:39:08 AM
Thanks for all your hard work Serenity...and that video blew me away....

I kinda wanted it to continue...I wonder if this pattern continued...
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: 2good2btrue on October 04, 2010, 03:11:49 AM
Not being negative, but I tried to see if the video "seeingclues" made, actually fits in with the rest of TMZ's random articles....  There has been many since this video was made.

I'm not to sure which Gospel the verses were taken from...
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Sarahli on October 04, 2010, 03:57:47 AM
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
There are two interesting lines in "Cry" - which I have to admit, cannot understand...

[Verse 1]
Somebody shakes when the wind blows
Somebody's missing a friend, hold on
Somebody's lacking a hero
And they have not a clue
When it's all gonna end

[Verse 2]
Stories buried and untold
Someone is hiding the truth, hold on
When will this mystery unfold
And will the sun ever shine
In the blind man's eyes when he cries?

[Chorus:]
You can change the world (I can't do it by myself)
You can touch the sky (Gonna take somebody's help)
You're the chosen one (I'm gonna need some kind of sign)
If we all cry at the same time tonight

[Verse 3]
People laugh when they're feelin sad
Someone is taking a life, hold on
Respect to believe in your dreams
Tell me where were you
when your children cried last night?

[Verse 4]
Faces fill with madness
Miracles unheard of, hold on
Faith is found in the winds
All we have to do
Is reach for the truth

[Chorus]

And when that flag blows
There'll be no more wars
And when all calls
I will answer all your prayers

[Chorus x3]

Change the world


Michael IS the chosen one   :?:

HE will answer all our prayers   :?:


Sorry if I misunderstand... but is he saying that he is someone like Jesus or he is God-like?

I find Michael's last supper version unhealthy... Honestly, I don't like it.


Michael is a great human, but for me he is only a human.

I understand your concern and this sentence 'I will answer all your prayers" also "disturbed" me since some days now and with this talk about the messiah I cannot sleep at night. Being the chosen one doesn't disturbs me but for answering the prayers I had to reflect on it and it may mean that Michael will come back and then answer what we asked for from him as a human being and hoax related; "I'm only human" he also sang, so I really don't think that Michael is implying that he is god-like, maybe Jesus like but not Jesus himself, a kind of messenger chosen by God to warn us on the upcoming events...Well looks like I interpreted that sentence the way it fits my belief  :D  now I don't know what was Michael's intent when he sang that. Michael, please? :cry:  :?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Miss-Zazi95 on October 04, 2010, 07:45:37 AM
Michael actually didn't write 'Cry'. R Kelly did.
Michael said thousand times that he was NOT Jesus, but he was TRYING to be like him and make God proud, that's all. No need to worry Sarahli. :)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Sarahli on October 04, 2010, 07:55:58 AM
Quote from: "Miss-Zazi95"
Michael actually didn't write 'Cry'. R Kelly did.
Michael said thousand times that he was NOT Jesus, but he was TRYING to be like him and make God proud, that's all. No need to worry Sarahli. :)

 ;)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: jacilovesmichael on October 04, 2010, 09:20:22 AM
I personally believe we are all chosen. But it's our choice whether we do anything about it. Michael is just doing what he knows he was put here to do. Not many people can say that unfortunately. If you believe in God and you believe God is Love and we are all One... then I think it's okay to believe that Michael is performing miracles right now. By choice, and by faith. I don't think it's disrespectful to the bible or whatever religious book you hold as truth. This is an ultimate test of our faith, not just in Michael but in all our own personal spiritual beliefs. We have to mash up our beliefs, embrace them all, come TOGETHER, instead of letting them get in the way of believing what is right before our eyes. My opinion...
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: DREAMSandTRUTH on October 04, 2010, 10:26:36 AM
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "Miss-Zazi95"
Michael actually didn't write 'Cry'. R Kelly did.
Michael said thousand times that he was NOT Jesus, but he was TRYING to be like him and make God proud, that's all. No need to worry Sarahli. :)

 ;)
Yes, R. Kelly wrote that, but Michael did sing it without changing those lines... I don't think it was a wise thing as people can misunderstand it...
Anyway, it just came to my mind because of this thread.

Otherwise I know that Michael was always very humble in his interviews when he talked about his great talent, saying that it's a gift from God. I love him for this.  :)

ps: I also don't understand why he liked to "wear" angel-wings... Doesn't look that humble to me to be honest. I mean I can believe that he only wanted to say with that that he tries to be like an angel or Jesus, tries to go on that path, but again, it can be misunderstood. For example, when an angel covers him with her wings in his Will You Be There video, that's something clear and beautiful, which cannot be misunderstood.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Miss-Zazi95 on October 04, 2010, 03:22:40 PM
I agree with the 2 last posts.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dancing_Machine on October 04, 2010, 03:40:20 PM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Please watch this video by Seeing Clues, it reveals some very interesting things.

[youtube:3dwnzpjh]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgZd_243ZjA[/youtube:3dwnzpjh]

Just:  :shock: !!!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Sarahli on October 04, 2010, 04:12:10 PM
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "Miss-Zazi95"
Michael actually didn't write 'Cry'. R Kelly did.
Michael said thousand times that he was NOT Jesus, but he was TRYING to be like him and make God proud, that's all. No need to worry Sarahli. :)

 ;)
Yes, R. Kelly wrote that, but Michael did sing it without changing those lines... I don't think it was a wise thing as people can misunderstand it...
Anyway, it just came to my mind because of this thread.

Otherwise I know that Michael was always very humble in his interviews when he talked about his great talent, saying that it's a gift from God. I love him for this.  :)

ps: I also don't understand why he liked to "wear" angel-wings... Doesn't look that humble to me to be honest. I mean I can believe that he only wanted to say with that that he tries to be like an angel or Jesus, tries to go on that path, but again, it can be misunderstood. For example, when an angel covers him with her wings in his Will You Be There video, that's something clear and beautiful, which cannot be misunderstood.

I get what you're saying 'I don't sing it if I don't mean it'....well that's true he didn't change those lines but the interpretation is open to everyone so we cannot fix this unless Michael tells us exactly what he meant. It's difficult to know exactly what is in Michael's mind, obviously not possible, God knows best so I will just do that, put my trust in God. Michael says that he believes in God and wants to be like Jesus, closer to what purity of the soul is, maybe that the angel wings just represented what is pure not him being an angel. I presume. 'I'm only human' again.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Miss-Zazi95 on October 04, 2010, 05:48:29 PM
I believe 'Cry' has something to do with the hoax.

Stories buried and untold, someome is hiding the truth >> Obvious meaning
Somebody is lacking a hero >> Talking about us, the fans, cause Michael is as a hero for us now that he faked his death to save the world.
I will answer all prayers >> By coming back, may be he could have put wishes intead of prayers, to me he was telling us "All your dreams will come true, because I'll come back after a long time of hope and prayers"

This is just my own interpretation, I'm still not sure about what he EXACTLY meant.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: DREAMSandTRUTH on October 05, 2010, 09:34:40 AM
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "Miss-Zazi95"
Michael actually didn't write 'Cry'. R Kelly did.
Michael said thousand times that he was NOT Jesus, but he was TRYING to be like him and make God proud, that's all. No need to worry Sarahli. :)

 ;)
Yes, R. Kelly wrote that, but Michael did sing it without changing those lines... I don't think it was a wise thing as people can misunderstand it...
Anyway, it just came to my mind because of this thread.

Otherwise I know that Michael was always very humble in his interviews when he talked about his great talent, saying that it's a gift from God. I love him for this.  :)

ps: I also don't understand why he liked to "wear" angel-wings... Doesn't look that humble to me to be honest. I mean I can believe that he only wanted to say with that that he tries to be like an angel or Jesus, tries to go on that path, but again, it can be misunderstood. For example, when an angel covers him with her wings in his Will You Be There video, that's something clear and beautiful, which cannot be misunderstood.

I get what you're saying 'I don't sing it if I don't mean it'....well that's true he didn't change those lines but the interpretation is open to everyone so we cannot fix this unless Michael tells us exactly what he meant. It's difficult to know exactly what is in Michael's mind, obviously not possible, God knows best so I will just do that, put my trust in God. Michael says that he believes in God and wants to be like Jesus, closer to what purity of the soul is, maybe that the angel wings just represented what is pure not him being an angel. I presume. 'I'm only human' again.
I absolutely agree with you. With the line "I'm only human" as well  ;)
Basically I'm only worried that with this song and angel wings he gives an easy reason to his enemies to attack him - like with the History Teaser video. They said he was using anti-semite symbols in that video. Michael answered: he is not anti-semite, it's art.
Well, almost all artists can be misunderstood ("what did the poet wanted to say with that?"  ;)  ) I know that, but Michael needs to be careful - unfortunately...
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: bec on October 05, 2010, 12:14:39 PM
Quote from: "2good2btrue"
Not being negative, but I tried to see if the video "seeingclues" made, actually fits in with the rest of TMZ's random articles....  There has been many since this video was made.

I'm not to sure which Gospel the verses were taken from...


There are many many many to chose from.

Let's remain analytical, look beyond the surface for the whole story, and think for ourselves.

Just because the clue is packaged in a user friendly wrapper doesn't make it legitimate.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Im_convincedmjalive on October 05, 2010, 03:15:52 PM
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
There are two interesting lines in "Cry" - which I have to admit, cannot understand...

[Verse 1]
Somebody shakes when the wind blows
Somebody's missing a friend, hold on
Somebody's lacking a hero
And they have not a clue
When it's all gonna end

[Verse 2]
Stories buried and untold
Someone is hiding the truth, hold on
When will this mystery unfold
And will the sun ever shine
In the blind man's eyes when he cries?

[Chorus:]
You can change the world (I can't do it by myself)
You can touch the sky (Gonna take somebody's help)
You're the chosen one (I'm gonna need some kind of sign)
If we all cry at the same time tonight

[Verse 3]
People laugh when they're feelin sad
Someone is taking a life, hold on
Respect to believe in your dreams
Tell me where were you
when your children cried last night?

[Verse 4]
Faces fill with madness
Miracles unheard of, hold on
Faith is found in the winds
All we have to do
Is reach for the truth

[Chorus]

And when that flag blows
There'll be no more wars
And when all calls
I will answer all your prayers

[Chorus x3]

Change the world


Michael IS the chosen one   :?:

HE will answer all our prayers   :?:


Sorry if I misunderstand... but is he saying that he is someone like Jesus or he is God-like?

I find Michael's last supper version unhealthy... Honestly, I don't like it.


Michael is a great human, but for me he is only a human.

I understand your concern and this sentence 'I will answer all your prayers" also "disturbed" me since some days now and with this talk about the messiah I cannot sleep at night. Being the chosen one doesn't disturbs me but for answering the prayers I had to reflect on it and it may mean that Michael will come back and then answer what we asked for from him as a human being and hoax related; "I'm only human" he also sang, so I really don't think that Michael is implying that he is god-like, maybe Jesus like but not Jesus himself, a kind of messenger chosen by God to warn us on the upcoming events...Well looks like I interpreted that sentence the way it fits my belief  :D  now I don't know what was Michael's intent when he sang that. Michael, please? :cry:  :?


I would like to address your concern regarding Michael's version of The Last Supper.

According to the quote below there are "Extremely Famous Historical People" sitting at the table with Michael. Now in the quote they state Michael is playing the role of Jesus.
And others have stated that as well here on the thread.

But, my interpretation is that Michael is sitting with a group of genius', innovative, first of their kind, out of the box thinkers, and seen maybe as odd or strange.

These are men that Michael obviously admires and probably studied. As they are greats.
I don't see this painting as Michael trying to be Jesus or saying he is, and besides has anyone ever heard him say that is what he meant by this painting?


Quote
Artist Nate Giorgio signed a deal in 1985 with Michael Jackson to do 50 paintings of him. That would be used for private and commercial reasons. This version of the Last Supper hung over Jacko's bed at Neverland. Michael as Jesus and 8 extremely famous historical people: Abraham Lincoln, John F. Kennedy, Thomas Edison, Albert Einstein, Walt Disney, Charlie Chaplin, Elvis Presley and Little Richard. Against tradition only 9 people are there.

Let's study these greats also.

1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham_Lincoln (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham_Lincoln)
Abraham Lincoln (February 12, 1809 – April 15, 1865) served as the 16th President of the United States from March 1861 until his assassination in April 1865. He successfully led the country through its greatest internal crisis, the American Civil War, preserving the Union, ending slavery, and rededicating the nation to nationalism, equal rights, liberty and democracy. Reared in a poor family on the western frontier, he was mostly self-educated and became a country lawyer, an Illinois state legislator, and a one-term member of the United States House of Representatives, but failed in two attempts at a seat in the United States Senate. He was an affectionate, though often absent, husband, and father of four children.

John F. Kennedy
2: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F._Kennedy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F._Kennedy)

3: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Edison (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Edison)
Thomas Alva Edison (February 11, 1847 – October 18, 1931) was an American inventor, scientist, and businessman who developed many devices that greatly influenced life around the world, including the phonograph, the motion picture camera, and a long-lasting, practical electric light bulb.

4: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein)
Albert Einstein: 14 March 1879 – 18 April 1955) was a theoretical physicist, philosopher and author who is widely regarded as one of the most influential and best known scientists and intellectuals of all time.

5: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Disney (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Disney)
Walter Elias "Walt" Disney (December 5, 1901 – December 15, 1966) was an American film producer, director, screenwriter, voice actor, animator, entrepreneur, entertainer, international icon, and philanthropist.

6: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Chaplin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Chaplin)
Sir Charles Spencer "Charlie" Chaplin, KBE (16 April 1889 – 25 December 1977) was an English comic actor and film director of the silent film era. He became one of the best-known film stars in the world before the end of the First World War. Chaplin used mime, slapstick and other visual comedy routines, and continued well into the era of the talkies, though his films decreased in frequency from the end of the 1920s. His most famous role was that of The Tramp, which he first played in the Keystone comedy Kid Auto Races at Venice in 1914


7: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elvis_Presly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elvis_Presly)
The forum is filled with Elvis/ Mike parallels...

8: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Richard (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Richard)
Richard Wayne Penniman (born December 5, 1932), known by the stage name Little Richard, is an American singer, songwriter, pianist, bandleader and recording artist, considered key in the transition from rhythm and blues to rock and roll in the 1950s. The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame web site entry on Penniman states that:

"He claims to be “the architect of rock and roll,” and history would seem to bear out Little Richard’s boast. More than any other performer - save, perhaps, Elvis Presley, Little Richard blew the lid off the Fifties, laying the foundation for rock and roll with his explosive music and charismatic persona. On record, he made spine-tingling rock and roll. His frantically charged piano playing and raspy, shouted vocals on such classics as "Tutti Frutti", "Long Tall Sally" and "Good Golly, Miss Molly" defined the dynamic sound of rock and roll."

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now I know I have heard Michael say in his speech that most dancing style and singing style came from Black artists, but they don't get the recognition they deserve instead it goes to the White artists.

So including Little Richard in his painting makes sense.  ;)

Now to address the song Cry and the lyrics.
viewtopic.php?f=107&t=14289 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=107&t=14289)

Don't read to much into it, it is simple and non threatening.
Michael needed a sign from God to know if he was The Chosen One to carry out a mission of warning the world of ends times.

He is our Hero. Think about what he has done. He laid down his life on June 25 2009 for us to be awakened to TRUTHS and lies that have been plaging us for a LONG TIME.

He has sacrificed his life for us.
Thank You Michael.

Maybe someone somewhere was asking that in a prayer and so he has answered that prayer for that person.

I can answer my child's prayer when she needs something in her life.
She just has to make it known and her prayer will be answered.

Peace
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Sarahli on October 05, 2010, 03:35:40 PM
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "Miss-Zazi95"
Michael actually didn't write 'Cry'. R Kelly did.
Michael said thousand times that he was NOT Jesus, but he was TRYING to be like him and make God proud, that's all. No need to worry Sarahli. :)

 ;)
Yes, R. Kelly wrote that, but Michael did sing it without changing those lines... I don't think it was a wise thing as people can misunderstand it...
Anyway, it just came to my mind because of this thread.

Otherwise I know that Michael was always very humble in his interviews when he talked about his great talent, saying that it's a gift from God. I love him for this.  :)

ps: I also don't understand why he liked to "wear" angel-wings... Doesn't look that humble to me to be honest. I mean I can believe that he only wanted to say with that that he tries to be like an angel or Jesus, tries to go on that path, but again, it can be misunderstood. For example, when an angel covers him with her wings in his Will You Be There video, that's something clear and beautiful, which cannot be misunderstood.

I get what you're saying 'I don't sing it if I don't mean it'....well that's true he didn't change those lines but the interpretation is open to everyone so we cannot fix this unless Michael tells us exactly what he meant. It's difficult to know exactly what is in Michael's mind, obviously not possible, God knows best so I will just do that, put my trust in God. Michael says that he believes in God and wants to be like Jesus, closer to what purity of the soul is, maybe that the angel wings just represented what is pure not him being an angel. I presume. 'I'm only human' again.
I absolutely agree with you. With the line "I'm only human" as well  ;)
Basically I'm only worried that with this song and angel wings he gives an easy reason to his enemies to attack him - like with the History Teaser video. They said he was using anti-semite symbols in that video. Michael answered: he is not anti-semite, it's art.
Well, almost all artists can be misunderstood ("what did the poet wanted to say with that?"  ;)  ) I know that, but Michael needs to be careful - unfortunately...

 ;) I wanted to add and your answer triggered that thought that the enemy will find any way to bring you down and I think that this is what happened with Michael, they tried hard. Therefore I believe that whatever Michael would have done they would have found a way to discredit/critize/diminish/twist his work, his words, and this is part of the reason why some people have a wrong appreciation of whom Michael really is. The way the enemy convey his message is through the media. They have done so many damages already. So in order to avoid that, did Michael had to be careful all the time with every single thing that he did/say? Did he had to tell himself "what will the haters say?". This makes me think of what they've done to him "because" of his love for the children. TWICE. An innocent and pure thing has been turned into hell. Does he had to avoid to be publicly with children because of what people would have said for example? No matter if he was innocent? The thought of it just makes me sick. This is an example of what I think cannot prevent the enemy to attack you, by preventing yourself from doing certain things just because of that, you give them the victory. I know that compared to angel wings it's maybe too much...or maybe not after all, maybe I'm off-topic so excuse me  :) . But hopefully Michael is one person who stands firm with his principals and beliefs "I'm a still remain the same. I'm unbreakable".

p.s.: when I use the past tense it's because Michael is momentarily out of sight.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Im_convincedmjalive on October 05, 2010, 04:19:14 PM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Please watch this video by Seeing Clues, it reveals some very interesting things.

[youtube:2k4qubqa]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgZd_243ZjA[/youtube:2k4qubqa]

I am agreeing with you on this. Seeing Clues has done a great job putting the pieces together in video format.

Here is my 5 cents worth of opinion and also a few others from this link below:

viewtopic.php?f=21&t=12256 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=12256)

These are my qouted words from that thread. Seriously read the scripture and while doing so visual this "hoax" in mind and apply the words to the "hoax" and see how it is mirroring what Jesus said to his apostles.

Quote
I posted the whole Sermon on the Mount on TS update 6 and when I read it I see almost everything that has been happening in this ”hoax” from the moment of the Memorial up to the anniversary starting to come to pass, this sermon starts to take on a whole nother meaning for me when I see what is happening in the fan community and this “hoax”

Im_convincedmjalive wrote:
Matthew 24:1-34 (Amplified Bible)

Matthew 24

1 JESUS DEPARTED from the temple area and was going on His way when His disciples came up to Him to call His attention to the buildings of the temple and point them out to Him.

2 But He answered them, Do you see all these? Truly I tell you, there will not be left here one stone upon another that will not be thrown down.

3 While He was seated on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately and said, Tell us, when will this take place, and what will be the sign of Your coming and of the end (the completion, the consummation) of the age?

4 Jesus answered them, Be careful that no one misleads you [deceiving you and leading you into error].

5 For many will come in (on the strength of) My name [appropriating the name which belongs to Me], saying, I am the Christ (the Messiah), and they will lead many astray.

6 And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars; see that you are not frightened or troubled, for this must take place, but the end is not yet.

7 For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and there will be famines and earthquakes in place after place;

8 All this is but the beginning [the early pains] of the birth pangs [of the intolerable anguish].

9 Then they will hand you over to suffer affliction and tribulation and put you to death, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.

10 And then many will be offended and repelled and will begin to distrust and desert [Him Whom they ought to trust and obey] and will stumble and fall away and betray one another and pursue one another with hatred.

11 And many false prophets will rise up and deceive and lead many into error.

12 And the love of the great body of people will grow cold because of the multiplied lawlessness and iniquity,

13 But he who endures to the end will be saved.

14 And this good news of the kingdom (the Gospel) will be preached throughout the whole world as a testimony to all the nations, and then will come the end.

15 So when you see the appalling sacrilege [the abomination that astonishes and makes desolate], spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the Holy Place--let the reader take notice and ponder and consider and heed [this]

16 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains;

17 Let him who is on the housetop not come down and go into the house to take anything;

18 And let him who is in the field not turn back to get his overcoat.

19 And alas for the women who are pregnant and for those who have nursing babies in those days!

20 Pray that your flight may not be in winter or on a Sabbath.

21 For then there will be great tribulation (affliction, distress, and oppression) such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now--no, and never will be [again].

22 And if those days had not been shortened, no human being would endure and survive, but for the sake of the elect (God's chosen ones) those days will be shortened.

23 If anyone says to you then, Behold, here is the Christ (the Messiah)! or, There He is!--do not believe it.

24 For false Christs and false prophets will arise, and they will show great signs and wonders so as to deceive and lead astray, if possible, even the elect (God's chosen ones).

25 See, I have warned you beforehand.

26 So if they say to you, Behold, He is in the wilderness (desert)--do not go out there; if they tell you, Behold, He is in the secret places or inner rooms--do not believe it.

27 For just as the lightning flashes from the east and shines and is seen as far as the west, so will the coming of the Son of Man be.

28 Wherever there is a fallen body (a corpse), there the vultures (or eagles) will flock together.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not shed its light, and the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.

30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn and beat their breasts and lament in anguish, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory [in brilliancy and splendor].

31 And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect (His chosen ones) from the four winds, [even] from one end of the universe to the other.

32 From the fig tree learn this lesson: as soon as its young shoots become soft and tender and it puts out its leaves, you know of a surety that summer is near.

33 So also when you see these signs, all taken together, coming to pass, you may know of a surety that He is near, at the very doors.

34 Truly I tell you, this generation (the whole multitude of people living at the same time, in a definite, given period) will not pass away till all these things taken together take place.



If you can review back over some of the article headlines from TMZ you will see the references to the Sermon.
It is all related to what you are discovering and the tweets, scripture in TS posts, redirects and even TMZ articles have been giving clues to the facts of what you are discovering
.

Peace
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: DREAMSandTRUTH on October 05, 2010, 05:27:26 PM
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "Miss-Zazi95"
Michael actually didn't write 'Cry'. R Kelly did.
Michael said thousand times that he was NOT Jesus, but he was TRYING to be like him and make God proud, that's all. No need to worry Sarahli. :)

 ;)
Yes, R. Kelly wrote that, but Michael did sing it without changing those lines... I don't think it was a wise thing as people can misunderstand it...
Anyway, it just came to my mind because of this thread.

Otherwise I know that Michael was always very humble in his interviews when he talked about his great talent, saying that it's a gift from God. I love him for this.  :)

ps: I also don't understand why he liked to "wear" angel-wings... Doesn't look that humble to me to be honest. I mean I can believe that he only wanted to say with that that he tries to be like an angel or Jesus, tries to go on that path, but again, it can be misunderstood. For example, when an angel covers him with her wings in his Will You Be There video, that's something clear and beautiful, which cannot be misunderstood.

I get what you're saying 'I don't sing it if I don't mean it'....well that's true he didn't change those lines but the interpretation is open to everyone so we cannot fix this unless Michael tells us exactly what he meant. It's difficult to know exactly what is in Michael's mind, obviously not possible, God knows best so I will just do that, put my trust in God. Michael says that he believes in God and wants to be like Jesus, closer to what purity of the soul is, maybe that the angel wings just represented what is pure not him being an angel. I presume. 'I'm only human' again.
I absolutely agree with you. With the line "I'm only human" as well  ;)
Basically I'm only worried that with this song and angel wings he gives an easy reason to his enemies to attack him - like with the History Teaser video. They said he was using anti-semite symbols in that video. Michael answered: he is not anti-semite, it's art.
Well, almost all artists can be misunderstood ("what did the poet wanted to say with that?"  ;)  ) I know that, but Michael needs to be careful - unfortunately...

 ;) I wanted to add and your answer triggered that thought that the enemy will find any way to bring you down and I think that this is what happened with Michael, they tried hard. Therefore I believe that whatever Michael would have done they would have found a way to discredit/critize/diminish/twist his work, his words, and this is part of the reason why some people have a wrong appreciation of whom Michael really is. The way the enemy convey his message is through the media. They have done so many damages already. So in order to avoid that, did Michael had to be careful all the time with every single thing that he did/say? Did he had to tell himself "what will the haters say?". This makes me think of what they've done to him "because" of his love for the children. TWICE. An innocent and pure thing has been turned into hell. Does he had to avoid to be publicly with children because of what people would have said for example? No matter if he was innocent? The thought of it just makes me sick. This is an example of what I think cannot prevent the enemy to attack you, by preventing yourself from doing certain things just because of that, you give them the victory. I know that compared to angel wings it's maybe too much...or maybe not after all, maybe I'm off-topic so excuse me  :) . But hopefully Michael is one person who stands firm with his principals and beliefs "I'm a still remain the same. I'm unbreakable".

p.s.: when I use the past tense it's because Michael is momentarily out of sight.
Basically I agree with you again.
I just add that as Michael's life turned this bad because of those money-hungry people, IMHO he has to think as a polititian does: never do anything that can be attacked if he cannot clear his name easily from the accusations. It's very hard to live that way, but unfortunately this is what he has to face in his life. Prevention is much easier than clearing your name. I know that even the greatest polititians fail in this from time to time, but still, they use this technique as much as they can.
Probably Michael knows it better than me :) I just shared my opinion.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Sarahli on October 06, 2010, 04:22:27 AM
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Sarahli"
Quote from: "Miss-Zazi95"
Michael actually didn't write 'Cry'. R Kelly did.
Michael said thousand times that he was NOT Jesus, but he was TRYING to be like him and make God proud, that's all. No need to worry Sarahli. :)

 ;)
Yes, R. Kelly wrote that, but Michael did sing it without changing those lines... I don't think it was a wise thing as people can misunderstand it...
Anyway, it just came to my mind because of this thread.

Otherwise I know that Michael was always very humble in his interviews when he talked about his great talent, saying that it's a gift from God. I love him for this.  :)

ps: I also don't understand why he liked to "wear" angel-wings... Doesn't look that humble to me to be honest. I mean I can believe that he only wanted to say with that that he tries to be like an angel or Jesus, tries to go on that path, but again, it can be misunderstood. For example, when an angel covers him with her wings in his Will You Be There video, that's something clear and beautiful, which cannot be misunderstood.

I get what you're saying 'I don't sing it if I don't mean it'....well that's true he didn't change those lines but the interpretation is open to everyone so we cannot fix this unless Michael tells us exactly what he meant. It's difficult to know exactly what is in Michael's mind, obviously not possible, God knows best so I will just do that, put my trust in God. Michael says that he believes in God and wants to be like Jesus, closer to what purity of the soul is, maybe that the angel wings just represented what is pure not him being an angel. I presume. 'I'm only human' again.
I absolutely agree with you. With the line "I'm only human" as well  ;)
Basically I'm only worried that with this song and angel wings he gives an easy reason to his enemies to attack him - like with the History Teaser video. They said he was using anti-semite symbols in that video. Michael answered: he is not anti-semite, it's art.
Well, almost all artists can be misunderstood ("what did the poet wanted to say with that?"  ;)  ) I know that, but Michael needs to be careful - unfortunately...

 ;) I wanted to add and your answer triggered that thought that the enemy will find any way to bring you down and I think that this is what happened with Michael, they tried hard. Therefore I believe that whatever Michael would have done they would have found a way to discredit/critize/diminish/twist his work, his words, and this is part of the reason why some people have a wrong appreciation of whom Michael really is. The way the enemy convey his message is through the media. They have done so many damages already. So in order to avoid that, did Michael had to be careful all the time with every single thing that he did/say? Did he had to tell himself "what will the haters say?". This makes me think of what they've done to him "because" of his love for the children. TWICE. An innocent and pure thing has been turned into hell. Does he had to avoid to be publicly with children because of what people would have said for example? No matter if he was innocent? The thought of it just makes me sick. This is an example of what I think cannot prevent the enemy to attack you, by preventing yourself from doing certain things just because of that, you give them the victory. I know that compared to angel wings it's maybe too much...or maybe not after all, maybe I'm off-topic so excuse me  :) . But hopefully Michael is one person who stands firm with his principals and beliefs "I'm a still remain the same. I'm unbreakable".

p.s.: when I use the past tense it's because Michael is momentarily out of sight.
Basically I agree with you again.
I just add that as Michael's life turned this bad because of those money-hungry people, IMHO he has to think as a polititian does: never do anything that can be attacked if he cannot clear his name easily from the accusations. It's very hard to live that way, but unfortunately this is what he has to face in his life. Prevention is much easier than clearing your name. I know that even the greatest polititians fail in this from time to time, but still, they use this technique as much as they can.
Probably Michael knows it better than me :) I just shared my opinion.

Yes some precautions are needed, a kind of armor, I basically also agree with you  :D
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: mjj4ever777 on October 08, 2010, 10:40:17 PM
Quote from: "Rita Hayworth"
This connection seems really out there but it does validate so many of us who feel a strong spiritual connection to Michael's death and who have been almost uncontrollably drawn to this site--those of us who liked his music but were never "fans" so to speak. This is one of those spiritual moments when it's almost too much knowledge to attempt to absorb let alone understand.

Serenity- thanks so much.

This is exactly how I feel also Rita Hayworth! I've been drawn to Michael in a totally "spiritual" way...this journey really has changed my life and it is so good to know there are others out there, who are having similar experiences. Michael has definitely brought us together through a "spiritual" realm and some of the info I've uncovered is mind boggling, but at the same time, it makes perfect sense to me.
Blessings and L.O.V.E
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 09, 2010, 12:37:25 PM
HIStory Teaser Trailer

[youtube:1l34p8vn]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c93o05SrWzE[/youtube:1l34p8vn]

In the video Michael is dressed in a Military uniform, leading an army parade in celebration of victory.

Revelation 12:7-8 (King James Version)
7nd there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

In other words Archangel Michael and his Army of angel (Army of Love?) fought and is victorious against Satan and his army.

The Number 777

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/777ArmbandHIStory.jpg)
777 Armband

Judaism
The numbers 3 and 7 are considered both "perfect numbers" under Hebrew tradition

Orthodox Church
777 represents the threefold perfection of the Trinity

777 is God's number

You can also see angels atop of columns lining the parade ground.

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/AngelsHIStory.jpg)

And an Arch of Triumph which are found all over the world.

Triumphal Arch
A triumphal arch is a structure in the shape of a monumental archway, in theory built to celebrate a victory in war.

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/TheArchOfTriumphHIStory.jpg)

Pentagrams

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7f/Pentagram_green.svg/200px-Pentagram_green.svg.png)

Pentagrams were used symbolically in ancient Greece and Babylonia as a symbol of faith akin to the use of the cross by Christians and the Star of David by Jews. Christians commonly used the pentagram to represent the five wounds of Jesus.

The pentagram is used as a Christian symbol for the five senses, and if the letters S, A, L, V, and S are inscribed in the points, it can be taken as a symbol of health (from Latin salus). Medieval Christians believed that the "pentalpha" symbolizes the five wounds of Christ. The pentagram was believed to protect against witches and demons.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/95/Bolzani_XP_Pentacle.JPG/220px-Bolzani_XP_Pentacle.JPG)
Christ as a Pentagram, from Valeriano Bolzani's Hieroglyphica (Basel, 1556)

The pentagram figured in a heavily symbolic Arthurian romance: it appears on the shield of Sir Gawain in the 14th century poem Sir Gawain and the Green Knight. As the poet explains, the five points of the star each have five meanings: they represent the five senses, the five fingers, the five wounds of Christ, the five joys that Mary had of Jesus (the Annunciation, the Nativity, the Resurrection, the Ascension, and the Assumption), and the five virtues of knighthood which Gawain hopes to embody: noble generosity, fellowship, purity, courtesy, and compassion.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentagram

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/HIStoryStar1.jpg)

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/HIStoryStar.jpg)

It is pretty clear to me, that Michael was displaying the Christian Pentagram

The Eyes of Horus
"Let the Eye of Horus come forth from the god and shine outside his mouth." The Pyramid Texts

(http://www.sangraal.com/library/images/eyesof1.jpg)
Horus "who rules with two eyes"

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/TheRightEyeHIStory.jpg)

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/TheLeftEye.jpg)

Utchat
The word utchat, sometimes spelled udjat, refers to Egypt's sacred eye symbol. The right eye is called the Eye of Ra, symbolizing the sun. The left is called the Eye of Thoth, symbolizing the moon. Both eyes together are the Two Eyes Of . The eye is the part of the body able to perceive light, and is therefore the symbol for spiritual ability.

(http://www.sangraal.com/library/images/eyesof2.jpg)
The Right Eye of Horus represents concrete factual information controlled by the left brain. It deals with words, letters, and numbers and those things which are describable in terms of sentences or complete thoughts. It approaches the universe in terms of male oriented ideation.

(http://www.sangraal.com/library/images/eyesof3.jpg)
The Left Eye of Horus represents abstract aesthetic information controlled by the right brain. It deals with esoteric thoughts and feelings and is responsible for intuition. It approaches the universe in terms of female oriented ideation. We use the Left Eye, female oriented, right side of our brain for feeling and intuition.
http://www.sangraal.com/library/eyesofhorus.htm

Horus The Elder
Is one of the oldest gods of Egypt. He was a sky god, whose face was visualized as the face of the sun. As a result his name ("Heru") was sometimes translated as "face", rather than "distant one", and was sometimes modified to "Herut" ("sky").

He was originally considered to be the counterpart and enemy of Set. While Horus represented Lower Egypt, Set represented Upper Egypt, and the two were locked in a battle which would not be won or lost until the world ended and everything slipped back into chaos. This myth evolved and soon it was thought that Horus and Set fought for eighty years before the Council of the Gods ruled that Horus should rule Egypt. It may seem strange that Horus was associated with Lower Egypt and yet he is associated with Nekhen, in Upper Egypt. It has been suggested that Horus actually originated in Upper Egypt (as  Horus Behedet in Behedet) and that his cult spread north with the unification of the country under Narmer or Hor Aha

He was the son or husband of Hathor and was considered to be a creator god and the archetypal king. His right eye was the sun and his left eye was the moon and images of the "Eyes of Horus" were considered to be powerful protective amulets. His speckled feathers formed the stars and his wings created the wind.
http://www.ancientegyptonline.co.uk/heruur.html
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: finfin on October 09, 2010, 01:49:18 PM
At 2:30 in the History Trailer. The statue of Michael covered in the white sheet and surrounded by helicopters reminded me of his body in the white sheet and helicopters taking him from UCLA to the coroners. Please tell me I am not going mad.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on October 09, 2010, 02:26:06 PM
Quote from: "finfin"
At 2:30 in the History Trailer. The statue of Michael covered in the white sheet and surrounded by helicopters reminded me of his body in the white sheet and helicopters taking him from UCLA to the coroners. Please tell me I am not going mad.
I believe you are not going mad, because everything is interconnected, and we here are seeing it unfold before our very eyes, almost like a fulfillment of thousand details of historical symbolism and stories.

I hope you don't mind but since this is more a religious thread I will post what I posted late last night on the thread viewtopic.php?f=17&t=14414&p=245383#p245383 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=14414&p=245383#p245383)
because I don't know if anyone saw it.


Quote
by MJonmind » Sat Oct 09, 2010 5:00 am
From Serenitys_Dream on page 2
Revelation 5:5 (King James Version)
1 And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals.
2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?

3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.

5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

7 And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne.

8 And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

I want to zero in on the painting on page 2 of Michael, sitting and holding the book with the key, also going with the Revelation verses that SD posted about it, but adding something to it. My computer has a virus and won't allow me to do a lot a normal functions and I can't post the picture. Could someone post it for me please? Thanks. Even when I put the whole post of SD's the painting won't show up for some strange reason. I'll have to ask my son to redo the system soon.

I'm feeling a sense of awe while I'm seeing the beauty in this painting and a new aspect I hadn't noticed before. There is a prominent curtain or veil being brushed or held aside to reveal Michael who is holding the book and key. Here is what the Bible says about this veil.

Isaiah 25:6-8 (New King James Version)
6 And in this mountain
The LORD of hosts will make for all people
A feast of choice pieces,
A feast of wines on the lees,
Of fat things full of marrow,
Of well-refined wines on the lees.
7 And He will destroy on this mountain
The surface of the covering cast over all people,
And the veil that is spread over all nations.
8 He will swallow up death forever,
And the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from all faces;
The rebuke of His people
He will take away from all the earth;
For the LORD has spoken.

The whole world is blinded and cannot see truth until the Messiah, the Christ removes this veil over people's eyes and hearts. Also remember the 2nd and 3rd verses of the song as they carry MJ's casket in, "No more crying there...no more dying there."
Matthew 27:51-53 (New King James Version)
51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; 53 and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.
This one doesn't relate as much to the painting, but the graves opening right when Jesus died, and people coming out alive reminds me of Thriller 2, resurrection!

2 Corinthians 3:12-18 (New King James Version)
12 Therefore, since we have such hope, we use great boldness of speech— 13 unlike Moses, who put a veil over his face so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the end of what was passing away. 14 But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ. 15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart. 16 Nevertheless when one turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17 Now the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the Spirit of the Lord.
Not only is the veil a picture of not seeing clearly until the Messiah comes, but here is the idea of looking in the mirror and seeing Christ reflected in us, just as Michael sang about the man in the mirror, making that change.


Hebrews 6:19-20 (New King James Version)
19 This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and which enters the Presence behind the veil, 20 where the forerunner has entered for us, even Jesus, having become High Priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek.
In the painting the curtain or veil is swept away and we enter with Michael there. This Melchizedek is an interesting person as well. If you read up on him, many theologians believe he is another of the pre-incarnate forms of the Messiah Christ, just as Archangel Michael is.

Hebrews 9:2-5
2 For a tabernacle was prepared: the first part, in which was the lampstand, the table, and the showbread, which is called the sanctuary; 3 and behind the second veil, the part of the tabernacle which is called the Holiest of All, 4 which had the golden censer and the ark of the covenant overlaid on all sides with gold, in which were the golden pot that had the manna, Aaron’s rod that budded, and the tablets of the covenant; 5 and above it were the cherubim of glory overshadowing the mercy seat. Of these things we cannot now speak in detail....24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;
This inner veil is what separates us from the Ark of the Covenant, but Christ removes that veil. Remember the Ark of the Covenant being announced the day of MJ's "death". And the earthly Ark may not be as important as the one up above, the real one. I remember one poster saying the similarity of the Ark having the mercy seat between the 2 archangels, to the tomb where Jesus had lain--Jesus between 2 angels who sat at each end when Peter looked in the empty tomb.

Song of Solomon 4:1-2
1 Behold, you are fair, my love!
Behold, you are fair!
You have dove’s eyes behind your veil.
Finally here is the book SD referring to in another thread about the Song of Solomon being a picture of the Messiah/Christ's love for His bride, the church which is the world-wide body of believers (not a building). We can tell that he can see her eyes through the veil. I don't believe a veil is the same as a curtain, but that you can faintly see through, as a bride would be covered with a veil so her soon to be husband can barely see her, and lifts the veil to kiss her when the clergy announce they are man and wife. Christ and his bride.

I think Michael's been reading all these same passages of Scripture through the years.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Le Papillon Bleu on October 09, 2010, 02:27:09 PM
Quote from: "finfin"
At 2:30 in the History Trailer. The statue of Michael covered in the white sheet and surrounded by helicopters reminded me of his body in the white sheet and helicopters taking him from UCLA to the coroners. Please tell me I am not going mad.
no you're not..actually it's a good point!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on October 09, 2010, 02:34:50 PM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
HIStory Teaser Trailer

[youtube:3a25asn0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c93o05SrWzE[/youtube:3a25asn0]

In the video Michael is dressed in a Military uniform, leading an army parade in celebration of victory.

Revelation 12:7-8 (King James Version)
7nd there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

In other words Archangel Michael and his Army of angel (Army of Love?) fought and is victorious against Satan and his army.

The Number 777

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/777ArmbandHIStory.jpg)
777 Armband

Judaism
The numbers 3 and 7 are considered both "perfect numbers" under Hebrew tradition

Orthodox Church
777 represents the threefold perfection of the Trinity

777 is God's number

You can also see angels atop of columns lining the parade ground.

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/AngelsHIStory.jpg)

And an Arch of Triumph which are found all over the world.

Triumphal Arch
A triumphal arch is a structure in the shape of a monumental archway, in theory built to celebrate a victory in war.

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/TheArchOfTriumphHIStory.jpg)

Pentagrams

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7f/Pentagram_green.svg/200px-Pentagram_green.svg.png)

Pentagrams were used symbolically in ancient Greece and Babylonia as a symbol of faith akin to the use of the cross by Christians and the Star of David by Jews. Christians commonly used the pentagram to represent the five wounds of Jesus.

The pentagram is used as a Christian symbol for the five senses, and if the letters S, A, L, V, and S are inscribed in the points, it can be taken as a symbol of health (from Latin salus). Medieval Christians believed that the "pentalpha" symbolizes the five wounds of Christ. The pentagram was believed to protect against witches and demons.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/95/Bolzani_XP_Pentacle.JPG/220px-Bolzani_XP_Pentacle.JPG)
Christ as a Pentagram, from Valeriano Bolzani's Hieroglyphica (Basel, 1556)

The pentagram figured in a heavily symbolic Arthurian romance: it appears on the shield of Sir Gawain in the 14th century poem Sir Gawain and the Green Knight. As the poet explains, the five points of the star each have five meanings: they represent the five senses, the five fingers, the five wounds of Christ, the five joys that Mary had of Jesus (the Annunciation, the Nativity, the Resurrection, the Ascension, and the Assumption), and the five virtues of knighthood which Gawain hopes to embody: noble generosity, fellowship, purity, courtesy, and compassion.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentagram

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/HIStoryStar1.jpg)

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/HIStoryStar.jpg)

It is pretty clear to me, that Michael was displaying the Christian Pentagram

The Eyes of Horus
"Let the Eye of Horus come forth from the god and shine outside his mouth." The Pyramid Texts

(http://www.sangraal.com/library/images/eyesof1.jpg)
Horus "who rules with two eyes"

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/TheRightEyeHIStory.jpg)

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/TheLeftEye.jpg)

Utchat
The word utchat, sometimes spelled udjat, refers to Egypt's sacred eye symbol. The right eye is called the Eye of Ra, symbolizing the sun. The left is called the Eye of Thoth, symbolizing the moon. Both eyes together are the Two Eyes Of . The eye is the part of the body able to perceive light, and is therefore the symbol for spiritual ability.

(http://www.sangraal.com/library/images/eyesof2.jpg)
The Right Eye of Horus represents concrete factual information controlled by the left brain. It deals with words, letters, and numbers and those things which are describable in terms of sentences or complete thoughts. It approaches the universe in terms of male oriented ideation.

(http://www.sangraal.com/library/images/eyesof3.jpg)
The Left Eye of Horus represents abstract aesthetic information controlled by the right brain. It deals with esoteric thoughts and feelings and is responsible for intuition. It approaches the universe in terms of female oriented ideation. We use the Left Eye, female oriented, right side of our brain for feeling and intuition.
http://www.sangraal.com/library/eyesofhorus.htm

Horus The Elder
Is one of the oldest gods of Egypt. He was a sky god, whose face was visualized as the face of the sun. As a result his name ("Heru") was sometimes translated as "face", rather than "distant one", and was sometimes modified to "Herut" ("sky").

He was originally considered to be the counterpart and enemy of Set. While Horus represented Lower Egypt, Set represented Upper Egypt, and the two were locked in a battle which would not be won or lost until the world ended and everything slipped back into chaos. This myth evolved and soon it was thought that Horus and Set fought for eighty years before the Council of the Gods ruled that Horus should rule Egypt. It may seem strange that Horus was associated with Lower Egypt and yet he is associated with Nekhen, in Upper Egypt. It has been suggested that Horus actually originated in Upper Egypt (as  Horus Behedet in Behedet) and that his cult spread north with the unification of the country under Narmer or Hor Aha

He was the son or husband of Hathor and was considered to be a creator god and the archetypal king. His right eye was the sun and his left eye was the moon and images of the "Eyes of Horus" were considered to be powerful protective amulets. His speckled feathers formed the stars and his wings created the wind.
http://www.ancientegyptonline.co.uk/heruur.html


Hello Serenity!!!


Thank you very much about your post ,its very helpfull!!!!
Like Souza said Michael has something with number 7. Talking about 777 I have some more intresting pictures with Michael wearing this magic number,here it is:


Michael at the trial from 2005
[attachment=4:3a25asn0]Yahoo12.jpg[/attachment:3a25asn0]

[attachment=3:3a25asn0]yahoo16.jpg[/attachment:3a25asn0]


What more can I give charity
[attachment=1:3a25asn0]34988914.jpg[/attachment:3a25asn0]

[attachment=2:3a25asn0]WhatMoreCanIGiveJacketWith777.jpg[/attachment:3a25asn0]


Jackson family honors 1994
[attachment=0:3a25asn0]cc16c7c8aad59e4a7f86688b60fb7110.jpg[/attachment:3a25asn0]


LOVE from Romania!!!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dancer on October 09, 2010, 04:29:24 PM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
In the video Michael is dressed in a Military uniform, leading an army parade in celebration of victory.

Revelation 12:7-8 (King James Version)
7nd there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

In other words Archangel Michael and his Army of angel (Army of Love?) fought and is victorious against Satan and his army.
In his speech on his 45th birthday celebration, Michael not only said that his fans are his army of love, he also mentioned that he's often been asked why he often puts soldiers on stage during his concerts, and said that they are soldiers of love.
Thank you very much to you all, especially Serenity, for the very interesting informations in this thread.  :)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: finfin on October 09, 2010, 05:56:13 PM
Quote from: "Le Papillon Bleu"
Quote from: "finfin"
At 2:30 in the History Trailer.  [youtube:76v29tfl]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c93o05SrWzE&feature=player_embedded[/youtube:76v29tfl]The statue of Michael covered in the white sheet and surrounded by helicopters reminded me of his body in the white sheet and helicopters taking him from UCLA to the coroners. Please tell me I am not going mad.
no you're not..actually it's a good point!
@ Le Papillon Bleu, thank you for acknowledging my comment, also thank you @Mjonmind, I was contemplating posting my comment somewhere else but realised that Serenitys Dream has written a lot about sheets in the first post on this thread, so I will leave it here as I think it is relevant after all.
A big thank you to Serenitys Dream, your posts are always a fascinating, thought provoking and riveting read
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Im_convincedmjalive on October 10, 2010, 11:54:05 AM
Quote
I remember one poster saying the similarity of the Ark having the mercy seat between the 2 archangels, to the tomb where Jesus had lain--Jesus between 2 angels who sat at each end when Peter looked in the empty tomb.

Hi MJonmind,

I think you were referring to my post in this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=72&t=12426&start=75 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=12426&start=75)

Quote
The True Ark
With regard to this concept of Christ as our mercy seat, let me add a penetrating insight which I picked up from John MacArthur, one of this country's greatest preachers. He pointed to a simple historical verse that contains a profound truth about Jesus being our mercy seat.

The verse is John 20:12. Speaking of Mary looking into the empty tomb of Jesus, the verse says, "she beheld two angels in white sitting, one at the head, and one at the feet, where the body of Jesus had been lying."
What Mary saw, MacArthur observed, was the new mercy seat, the perfect mercy seat.

Consider again what Mary saw. She witnessed two angels, one sitting at each end of the slab which had held the broken body of our Lord. That scene points us back to the Ark of the Covenant where two cherubim hovered over its blood splattered mercy seat!

There is no more need for the Ark. Jesus has fulfilled all that the Ark stood for. He was deity who took on flesh. He rendered complete obedience to the Law, being made perfect and becoming the source of our salvation (Hebrews 5:8-9). His blood was shed for our sins, and His victory is attested by the fact and the power of His resurrection.

Just as the Ark was designed to be a symbol of the presence of God in the midst of His people, Jesus is the ultimate expression of God's love and care and presence. He is our Ark. He is our Law. He is our Manna. He is our Budded Rod. And, thank God, He is our Mercy Seat.

I find it very interesting that the scripture in which Mary saw 2 angels in white one at each end of where Jesus was resting is John 20:12
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se ... ersion=AMP (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%2020&version=AMP)
The whole passage.^^^^^^^^

Also I think that some of this info on this thread could be placed in the above thread.

Peace

P.S. Here is what I wrote about The Book Painting in this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=50&t=12374&start=0 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=12374&start=0)

Quote
by Im_convincedmjalive » Tue Jul 13, 2010 1:50 am

"Writings on the wall"
The Key...and The book painting take on a new meaning.  

Revelation 20 (Amplified Bible)

1 THEN I saw an angel descending from heaven; he was holding the key of the Abyss (the bottomless pit) and a great chain was in his hand.

2 And he gripped and overpowered the dragon, that old serpent [of primeval times], who is the devil and Satan, and [securely] bound him for a thousand years.

3 Then he hurled him into the Abyss (the bottomless pit) and closed it and sealed it above him, so that he should no longer lead astray and deceive and seduce the nations until the thousand years were at an end. After that he must be liberated for a short time.

4 Then I saw thrones, and sitting on them were those to whom authority to act as judges and to pass sentence was entrusted. Also I saw the souls of those who had been slain with axes [beheaded] for their witnessing to Jesus and [for preaching and testifying] for the Word of God, and who had refused to pay homage to the beast or his statue and had not accepted his mark or permitted it to be stamped on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived again and ruled with Christ (the Messiah) a thousand years.

5 The remainder of the dead were not restored to life again until the thousand years were completed. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed (happy, to be envied) and holy (spiritually whole, of unimpaired innocence and proved virtue) is the person who takes part (shares) in the first resurrection! Over them the second death exerts no power or authority, but they shall be ministers of God and of Christ (the Messiah), and they shall rule along with Him a thousand years.

7 And when the thousand years are completed, Satan will be released from his place of confinement,

8 And he will go forth to deceive and seduce and lead astray the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth--Gog and Magog--to muster them for war; their number is like the sand of the sea.

9 And they swarmed up over the broad plain of the earth and encircled the fortress (camp) of God's people (the saints) and the beloved city; but fire descended from heaven and consumed them. [II Kings 1:10-12; Ezek. 38:2, 22.]

10 Then the devil who had led them astray [deceiving and seducing them] was hurled into the fiery lake of burning brimstone, where the beast and false prophet were; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever (through the ages of the ages).

11 Then I saw a great white throne and the One Who was seated upon it, from Whose presence and from the sight of Whose face earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them.

12 I [also] saw the dead, great and small; they stood before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is [the Book] of Life. And the dead were judged (sentenced) by what they had done their whole way of feeling and acting, their aims and endeavors] in accordance with what was recorded in the books.

13 And the sea delivered up the dead who were in it, death and Hades [the state of death or disembodied existence) surrendered the dead in them, and all were tried and their cases determined by what they had done [according to their motives, aims, and works].

14 Then death and Hades [the state of death or disembodied existence) were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.

15 And if anyone's [name] was not found recorded in the Book of Life, he was hurled into the lake of fire.

Speaking of "The Writing on the Wall"

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se ... ersion=AMP (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Daniel%205&version=AMP)

We should be careful and be ever watchful for The writing on the Wall, we don't want to end up like King Belshazzar... 8-)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: ibelieveinmj on October 10, 2010, 05:49:59 PM
Hi Im_convincedmjalive,

I have just recently came to understand Revelation 12:1-2.... that God will soon do away with the Devil's influence over the earth and rid all wickedness, can't wait !!!!!  Oh, and who is that angel again battling with Satan?   ;)

I don't quite understand the Ark of the Conevant and have always thought that it was destroyed and just doesn't exist any longer, any more thoughts?

L.O.V.E.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: suspicious mind on October 10, 2010, 06:21:29 PM
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
There are two interesting lines in "Cry" - which I have to admit, cannot understand...

[Verse 1]
Somebody shakes when the wind blows
Somebody's missing a friend, hold on
Somebody's lacking a hero
And they have not a clue
When it's all gonna end

[Verse 2]
Stories buried and untold
Someone is hiding the truth, hold on
When will this mystery unfold
And will the sun ever shine
In the blind man's eyes when he cries?

[Chorus:]
You can change the world (I can't do it by myself)
You can touch the sky (Gonna take somebody's help)
You're the chosen one (I'm gonna need some kind of sign)
If we all cry at the same time tonight

[Verse 3]
People laugh when they're feelin sad
Someone is taking a life, hold on
Respect to believe in your dreams
Tell me where were you
when your children cried last night?

[Verse 4]
Faces fill with madness
Miracles unheard of, hold on
Faith is found in the winds
All we have to do
Is reach for the truth

[Chorus]

And when that flag blows
There'll be no more wars
And when all calls
I will answer all your prayers

[Chorus x3]

Change the world


Michael IS the chosen one   :?:

HE will answer all our prayers   :?:


Sorry if I misunderstand... but is he saying that he is someone like Jesus or he is God-like?

I find Michael's last supper version unhealthy... Honestly, I don't like it.


Michael is a great human, but for me he is only a human.
http://www.gotquestions.org/many-called-few-chosen.html (http://www.gotquestions.org/many-called-few-chosen.html)
http://bible.cc/acts/2-1.htm (http://bible.cc/acts/2-1.htm)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: suspicious mind on October 10, 2010, 06:54:20 PM
Quote from: "suspicious mind"
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
There are two interesting lines in "Cry" - which I have to admit, cannot understand...

[Verse 1]
Somebody shakes when the wind blows
Somebody's missing a friend, hold on
Somebody's lacking a hero
And they have not a clue
When it's all gonna end

[Verse 2]
Stories buried and untold
Someone is hiding the truth, hold on
When will this mystery unfold
And will the sun ever shine
In the blind man's eyes when he cries?

[Chorus:]
You can change the world (I can't do it by myself)
You can touch the sky (Gonna take somebody's help)
You're the chosen one (I'm gonna need some kind of sign)
If we all cry at the same time tonight

[Verse 3]
People laugh when they're feelin sad
Someone is taking a life, hold on
Respect to believe in your dreams
Tell me where were you
when your children cried last night?

[Verse 4]
Faces fill with madness
Miracles unheard of, hold on
Faith is found in the winds
All we have to do
Is reach for the truth

[Chorus]

And when that flag blows
There'll be no more wars
And when all calls
I will answer all your prayers

[Chorus x3]

Change the world


Michael IS the chosen one   :?:

HE will answer all our prayers   :?:


Sorry if I misunderstand... but is he saying that he is someone like Jesus or he is God-like?

I find Michael's last supper version unhealthy... Honestly, I don't like it.


Michael is a great human, but for me he is only a human.
http://www.gotquestions.org/many-called-few-chosen.html (http://www.gotquestions.org/many-called-few-chosen.html)
http://bible.cc/acts/2-1.htm (http://bible.cc/acts/2-1.htm)

i cannot believe that i never noticed before that michael didn't write this song.
is there any kind of imformation about the artist motivation for it.?
i may have to reexamine a few things in my perspective of this whole thing.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 11, 2010, 12:12:56 AM
R&B Group AquaLeo Thinks That Michael Jackson Was Jesus Christ And They Are Serious!
Posted on July 10th, 2010 - By Bossip Staff

[youtube:cy2o3x0o]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMcpeUDsJeY[/youtube:cy2o3x0o]

http://bossip.com/265631/mathew-knowles ... ous-video/ (http://bossip.com/265631/mathew-knowles-rb-group-thinks-that-michael-jackson-was-jesus-christ-and-they-are-serious-video/)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 11, 2010, 01:00:06 AM
Santana Lauds ‘Angel’ Michael Jackson, Leads Love Chant: Review
By Robert Heller - Oct 5, 2010 4:00 PM PT

Carlos Santana dedicates his concerts to the “archangel” Michael Jackson.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-05/santana-lauds-angel-michael-jackson-leads-love-chant-at-concert-review.html

Archangel Michael
Jehovah's Witnesses, Seventh-day Adventists, and certain New Age Christian denominations refer to Michael as the Christ Michael, or Christ before he became man.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_%28archangel%29

Jehovah's Witnesses believe that Michael is one of the names Jesus has in heaven. In this view, Michael is the first and greatest of all God's creatures, the chief messenger of Jehovah that takes the lead in vindicating God's sovereignty, sanctifying God's name, fighting the forces of Satan and protecting God's people on earth. (Revelation 12:7; 19:14,16• Daniel 12:1) This belief is held because of the prominence Michael has among the heavenly sons of God in the Bible, the similarity of Michael’s and Jesus’ mission and the connection of Jesus with the archangelic office in 1 Thessalonians 4:16, where it is said: "Because the Lord himself will descend from Heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel's voice." Taking also into account that the Bible refers to one archangel only using a definite article (Jude 9), Jehovah's Witnesses have concluded that Michael and Jesus are one and the same.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archangel#Jehovah.27s_Witnesses
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: ibelieveinmj on October 11, 2010, 01:51:54 AM
Thank you Serenitys_Dream... interesting video !!!

I don't question that Michael is another name for Jesus Christ.  I hope my post wasn't misunderstood.
Here is a link with regards to JW's belief about Michael the archangel.

http://www.watchtower.org/e/bh/appendix_11.htm (http://www.watchtower.org/e/bh/appendix_11.htm)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: ibelieveinmj on October 11, 2010, 02:45:03 AM
Number 777
Here is something interesting that may be related to these numbers.  
Does anyone think that these letters in Hebrew look like 3 7's ????
Please be gentle with me....I am stepping out a little here.

http://www.watchtower.org/e/bh/appendix_01.htm (http://www.watchtower.org/e/bh/appendix_01.htm)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Hassan on October 11, 2010, 03:25:26 PM
/Facepalm !!!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: DREAMSandTRUTH on October 11, 2010, 05:01:06 PM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
[
The Number 777

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/777ArmbandHIStory.jpg)
777 Armband

Judaism
The numbers 3 and 7 are considered both "perfect numbers" under Hebrew tradition

Orthodox Church
777 represents the threefold perfection of the Trinity

777 is God's number

I'm not really well-educated in this field, but something is not clear for me...
Why is 777 God's number? Where can I find something about it in the Bible?
Where can I read more about that orthodox church connection? I only find that in numerology 777 is the number of the Trinity.

What really bugs me is that 777 is also the number which was used by the crazy Aleister Crowley. And scientology is based on his stupid teachings. And LMP is a scientologist...

I don't want to suggest anything with it, I just summarized what I know about this number.


For example here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/777_(number (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/777_(number))#Orthodox_Church
I can read only these:
Judaism
The numbers 3 and 7 are considered both "perfect numbers" under Hebrew tradition.[citation needed]
Orthodox Church
According to the American publication, the Orthodox Study Bible, 777 represents the threefold perfection of the Trinity.[citation needed]
Thelema
777 is also found in the title of the book 777 and Other Qabalistic Writings of Aleister Crowley pertaining to the law of thelema.


Why did Michael used numbers anyway...? It would have been clearer if he wrote his messages in words... For examle 'LOVE' on his armband...By the way the red stars can be misunderstood as well...
All in all I cannot really understand why he chose these symbols.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: nefertari on October 11, 2010, 08:32:10 PM
I'm thinking about painting of Michael sitting and holding the book with the key ... can it refer to this?

http://www.pierre2.org/en/key.htm (http://www.pierre2.org/en/key.htm)

You can find it translated in several languages on the Web
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 11, 2010, 08:54:51 PM
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
[
The Number 777

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/777ArmbandHIStory.jpg)
777 Armband

Judaism
The numbers 3 and 7 are considered both "perfect numbers" under Hebrew tradition

Orthodox Church
777 represents the threefold perfection of the Trinity

777 is God's number

I'm not really well-educated in this field, but something is not clear for me...
Why is 777 God's number? Where can I find something about it in the Bible?
Where can I read more about that orthodox church connection? I only find that in numerology 777 is the number of the Trinity.

What really bugs me is that 777 is also the number which was used by the crazy Aleister Crowley. And scientology is based on his stupid teachings. And LMP is a scientologist...

I don't want to suggest anything with it, I just summarized what I know about this number.

For example here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/777_(number (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/777_(number))#Orthodox_Church
I can read only these:
Judaism
The numbers 3 and 7 are considered both "perfect numbers" under Hebrew tradition.[citation needed]
Orthodox Church
According to the American publication, the Orthodox Study Bible, 777 represents the threefold perfection of the Trinity.[citation needed]
Thelema
777 is also found in the title of the book 777 and Other Qabalistic Writings of Aleister Crowley pertaining to the law of thelema.

Why did Michael used numbers anyway...? It would have been clearer if he wrote his messages in words... For examle 'LOVE' on his armband...By the way the red stars can be misunderstood as well...
All in all I cannot really understand why he chose these symbols.

7
http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu7.php

777
http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu777.php

Attributes of the Number 7
Spirituality, wisdom, solitary, the inner-self, the inner-life, inner-strength, independence, birth, re-birth, individuality, purpose, the specialist, inventor, loner, eccentric, thoughtful, psychic, natural healer, inner-strength, quick-wit, discernment, an understanding of others, philosophy, endurance, deep contemplation, the mystic, psychic abilities, a keen mind, determination, knowledge-seeking, non-conformist, persistence of purpose, perfection, the path of solitude, analysis, contemplation, sacred vows.

7 is a mystical number symbolizing wisdom, the seven charkas, and the seven heavens. The number 7 symbolizes humanity's deep inner need to find depth, purpose, meaning and spiritual connection.
http://hubpages.com/hub/Angel-Numbers-Recurring-7s

Disclaimer:
The following article had some good examples of why the number 777 is considered "God's" number. The views in regards to "Satan" belong to the writer of the article and are not necessarily mine.
:D

The Number 777
The number seven has deep spiritual significance. It has been held sacred by the Hebrews and other Semite peoples since the dawn of time. It represents perfection and holiness. It is used throughout the Scriptures and in this sense is the Almighty's Number.

A few examples:
* Samson's seven locks of consecration. (Judges 16:13-19)
* The seven pillars of wisdom's house. (Proverbs 9:1)
* The sevenfold sign of total commitment and dependence (2 Chron. 29: 20-21)
* The seven lambs to attest the conclusion of a peace treaty. (Genesis 21:28-30)
* The seven fold sprinkling of blood before cleansing was complete. (Lev:16:19)
* The seven week count to Pentecost, the seven year count to the sabbatical year and the seven times seven year count to the Jubilee year. (Lev. 23:15, Lev.25:1-9)
* The seven candlesticks, seven churches, seven stars, seven seals, seven trumpets, seven thunders, and seven plagues mentioned in the book of Revelation etc.

In addition to these examples, and there are many more, the Almighty has blessed each seventh portion of time in The Sacred Calendar:   the The Seventh Day of the Week,   the seventh year and also the seventh thousanth year period referred to by Bible students as the Millennium. Together with the Festivals of the God of Israel these all express the concept of totality, maturity, holiness and absolute perfection.

The triple sevens (777) numerically symbolize Yahweh, the Father of Yahshua the Messiah. He is the pinnacle of perfection, power and purity. The number 777 may also be the numeric value of some word or group of words: we do not know. Satan has hijacked this number and uses it in all kinds of bizarre ways; but as far as Scripture is concerned, seven is the number of perfection and holiness.

The number 777 numerically expresses the Almighty's Truth as regards His 7th day Sabbath, His 7 annual Sabbaths, His 7th year Sabbath and His 7th thousand year Sabbath - the millennium. We could go further and write 7777777 - ad infinitum, or 70 times 7, with each additional seven representing another perfect revelation of His character: but 777 will do for the time being.

By contrast the treble sixes - 666 - represent Satan the perfection of imperfection: the unholy and immature one: the one who will always fall short of Yahweh's moral stature just as the number 6 will always fall short of the number 7. Perhaps that is why Satan seeks to abolish every sacred seventh portion of time in the calendar of the Almighty: because his evil mind is totally incapable of ever matching the majesty, might and maturity of Yahweh the Holy One of Israel.
http://www.sabbathcovenant.com/doctrine/number_777.htm
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on October 11, 2010, 09:07:55 PM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Disclaimer:
The following article had some good examples of why the number 777 is considered "God's" number. The views in regards to "Satan" belong to the writer of the article and are not necessarily mine.
:D

Haaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa haaaaaaaaaa :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

10 points, LOVE IT  :lol:
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on October 11, 2010, 09:16:36 PM
The number 7 had (as we have seen) many uses. Was a magic number, Divine.
Among the western races, the canon of beauty revolves around the classic canon of Polykleitos of Argos, Greek sculptor, the most popular Greek beauty standard that through generations came to us and in which the height of the human being is equal to 7 times the height of the head. Polykleitos, concerned to achieve ideal proportions of the male human body, based on mathematics...the artistic ideal and conception of beauty.

The 7 wonders of the world.....
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: DREAMSandTRUTH on October 12, 2010, 09:59:31 AM
Thank you Serenitys_Dream and Gema for your help!
I didn't have enough time yet to think it over thoroughly, but I plan to do it later, as I would really like to understand why Michael loves 777.
By the way number 7 is clear for me, I like that number  :) , it's only 777 I have problems with. And I would like to find it in the Bible rather than getting other explanations for it, like from esotericism, gematria, numerology etc...
Because from my experiences we tend to read almost anything into things if we want to get an "answer" or "clue".

Here http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu777.php (http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu777.php) I read:

Bible

Age of Lamech, father of Noah, when he died. In the posterity of Seth, Lamech is the last patriarch before the flood. (Gn 5,31) I haven't checked yet what they refer to... but if you can explain to me, that would be very helpful.  :)

The book of the Genesis contains 777+777-21 or 1553 verses. This is too farfetched for me. If you want to get something "interesting" with number 5, for example, I bet you can. Not especially for the number of the verses but something else in connection with the  book of the Genesis.

The number 777 is used 1 time in the Bible. Where?

The word priest is used 777 times in the Bible. Okay, but how many times the word "faith" or "love" is used? Why did they chose "priest"? Because it's used 777 times?


As I said I will try to think it over better in the future. Thanks again!  :)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 12, 2010, 11:08:08 AM
Quote from: DREAMSandTRUTH
Thank you Serenitys_Dream and Gema for your help!
I didn't have enough time yet to think it over thoroughly, but I plan to do it later, as I would really like to understand why Michael loves 777.
By the way number 7 is clear for me, I like that number  <!-- s:) --> :) <!-- s:) --> , it's only 777 I have problems with. And I would like to find it in the Bible rather than getting other explanations for it, like from esotericism, gematria, numerology etc...
Because from my experiences we tend to read almost anything into things if we want to get an "answer" or "clue".
Here <!-- m -->http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu777.php<!-- m --> I read:

Bible
Age of Lamech, father of Noah, when he died. In the posterity of Seth, Lamech is the last patriarch before the flood. (Gn 5,31) I haven't checked yet what they refer to... but if you can explain to me, that would be very helpful.  <!-- s:) --> :) <!-- s:) -->

The book of the Genesis contains 777+777-21 or 1553 verses. This is too farfetched for me. If you want to get something "interesting" with number 5, for example, I bet you can. Not especially for the number of the verses but something else in connection with the  book of the Genesis.

The number 777 is used 1 time in the Bible. Where?

The word priest is used 777 times in the Bible. Okay, but how many times the word "faith" or "love" is used? Why did they chose "priest"? Because it's used 777 times?

As I said I will try to think it over better in the future. Thanks again!  <!-- s:) --> :) <!-- s:) -->

I can't answer these questions, you will have to ask them of the website creator. I am not a bible scholar and have never even read the bible until recently.

This will be my final post in regards to the belief that 777 is God's number. You have an obligation to do your own research if you really want to understand the significance of anything. No one can tell you what to believe. This is an investigation into why Michael may have chosen the 777 and not what the investigators personal feelings on the subject are or what individuals choose to believe about a subject. You can not discount any factors such as esoterica, gematria, etc. because you are not Michael so all things must be considered as potential influences into why Michael chose to display the number 777.

My understanding is that the number 777 isn't in the bible at all but that it is considered God's number because of the number 7 being mentioned so many times in the bible, considered a spiritual number, and that 7 contains the combined qualities of both the number 3 and the 4 (3 + 4 = 7).

The Number 3
Number representing the Holy Trinity, it is also the number of the Holy Spirit, the third person of the Trinity. Furthermore, the number 3 being associated to the triangle by its geometrical form, the Holy Spirit.
http://http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu3.php

3
The number 3 is a very mystical and spiritual number featured in many folktales (three wishes, three guesses, three little pigs, three bears, three billy goats gruff). In ancient Babylon the three primary gods were Anu, Bel (Baal), and Ea, representing Heaven, Earth, and the Abyss. Similarly, there were three aspects to the Egyptian sun god: Khepri (rising), Re (midday), and Atum (setting). In Christianity there is the Trinity of God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Plato saw 3 as being symbolic of the triangle, the simplest spatial shape, and considered the world to have been built from triangles.
http://http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/1086220/number-symbolism/248160/3

The Triangle
Some keywords associated with triangle meaning:
[attachment=1:25j1bl9d]<!-- ia1 -->Triangle Meaning 1.jpg<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment:25j1bl9d]
None of the other basic shapes offer this kind of inherent duplicity. When we turn a square on its side, the symbol meaning remains the same. Same with the circle - rolling it around, it's still a circle.

But the triangle proposes mammoth (polar even) variables in meanings when tipped top from bottom. To wit:

[attachment=2:25j1bl9d]<!-- ia2 -->Triangles Meaning.jpg<!-- ia2 -->[/attachment:25j1bl9d]
These are just a few examples of how a simple shift of this symbol can offer huge variations in meaning. I invite you to contemplate these and other similarities, as I believe pondering these solidifies the symbolic experience the triangle symbol has to share.

Any discussion about triangle meaning cannot continue without connecting it with the number three. Indeed, the triangle meaning is inseparable from the number three.

All the mystic teachings incorporate the power of three within their folds. Three represents the union of the numbers prior to it (One and Two). Numerologically speaking, if One represents force, and Two represents an opening, then Three is the birthing of true wisdom.

Consider just a few time-honored triads proposed by esoteric triangles:
[attachment=0:25j1bl9d]<!-- ia0 -->Triangle meaning 2.jpg<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment:25j1bl9d]
The symbolic idea here, is that the vertical side represents one aspect, the horizontal side another aspect and the hypotenuse is offspring of the combining sides. The combination of one and another produces a new form of being altogether (a child, as it were).

To the Greeks, the triangle is seen as the delta glyph and is symbolic of a doorway. This really appeals to me because it revisits the combination of polarities to push out a new opening. For example, balancing thought and emotion would provide a doorway to higher wisdom (the hypotenuse).

Triangles are featured in Aristotle's conception of the five elements too (shown below). Why did he assign triangles to each of the elements? Why not circles or squares?

I contend that there is a deeper activity of creation inherent within each individual element. Certainly, combined these elements are the sum of infinite potential and Divine creativity. But individually they flicker their own creative sparks too.
(http://http://www.whats-your-sign.com/images/AristotelianElementSymbols.jpg)
http://http://www.whats-your-sign.com/triangle-meaning.html

(http://http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b3/Shield-Trinity-Scutum-Fidei-English.svg/220px-Shield-Trinity-Scutum-Fidei-English.svg.png)

The Number 4
Represent the union of the three Persons of the Trinity in only one Being.
Symbolize the incarnation of the beings in the matter.
Symbol of the totality, it is considered as the root of all things.
Number of the double duality, two plus two, and of the universal measure, according to the Pythagorean.
Represented symbolically by the square or the cross.
Symbolizes the Earth, or what is terrestrial, the totality of created and revealed, according to the Bible.
Number of the balance.
http://http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu4.php

4
The number of order in the universe is 4—the four elements of earth, air, fire, and water; the four seasons; the four points of the compass; the four phases of the Moon (new, half-moon waxing, full, half-moon waning). The Four Noble Truths epitomize Buddhism. To the Pythagoreans 4 was the source of the tetractys 1 + 2 + 3 + 4 = 10, the most perfect number
Because 4 is generally a practical, material number, few superstitions are associated with it. In the biblical Revelation to John the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse wreak destruction upon humanity.
http://http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/1086220/number-symbolism/248160/3

So the number 7 and it's attributes is the key to why 777 would then be considered God's number. You also can not just decide to dismiss gematria either because this is the Ancient Jewish form of numerology.

Numerology - Numerology is any of many systems, traditions or beliefs in a mystical or esoteric relationship between numbers and physical objects or living things.

Everything that exists in creation has numbers involved with it, absolutely everything.

Introduction to Gematria - Hebrew Numerology
In Hebrew, each letter possesses a numerical value. Gematria is the calculation of the numerical equivalence of letters, words, or phrases, and, on that basis, gaining, insight into interrelation of different concepts and exploring the interrelationship between words and ideas.
http://http://www.inner.org/gematria/gematria.htm

Gematria
Gematria or gimatria is a system of assigning numerical value  to a word or phrase, in the belief that words or phrases with identical numerical values bear some relation to each other, or bear some relation to the number itself as it may apply to a person's age, the calendar year, or the like. It is likely that the term derives from the order of the Greek alphabet, gamma being the third letter of the Greek alphabet (gamma + tria). Alternately, the word "gematria" is generally held to derive from Greek geōmetriā, "geometry" (Triangles are a geometric figure)
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gematria

When a number is tripled it is believed it then encompasses the aspects of that number three fold; three times as much in size, strength, number, or amount.

All of this is in contrast to the number 666 being representative of Satan and the unholy trinity. The thinking is that if 666 represents Satan than 777 represents God. 7 is greater than 6 so Satan falls short when trying to copy God's works.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on October 12, 2010, 02:13:18 PM
I'll repeat a comment from one of the people on youtube that I agree with what you said and I also feel that way, "I can not say I know what's going on here, but I can say with certainty what is happening is much more than a superstar doing tricks with their fans. He said it himself. "I am the Light of the World." Was not Jesus described?"" ;)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 22, 2010, 06:42:15 PM
The Lion on the gates of Neverland looks like the Lion on these belts from the TMZ story. (The Lion of Judah)

(http://http://scotthaefner.com/photos/images/fullsize/surface/neverland03.jpg)

(http://http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/belt1.jpg)

(http://http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/Belt3.jpg)

(http://http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/belt2.jpg)

(http://http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/Belt4.jpg)

http://http://photos.tmz.com/galleries/michael_jacksons_belt#tab=most_recent

Michael Jackson Estate -- MJ Belts Are Bogus!
5/27/2010 1:00 AM PDT by TMZ Staff
http://http://www.tmz.com/2010/05/26/michael-jackson-estate-belted/
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 22, 2010, 06:49:21 PM
Carlos Santana Pays Tribute To Michael Jackson
OCTOBER 7, 2010
At his recent concert at London's O2 Arena, Carlos Santana dedicated the show to Michael Jackson, calling the King of Pop an "Archangel," according to reports by Bloomberg News and the London Evening Standard newspaper. Santana, one of the world's greatest guitarists, is one of many artists who have paid respect to Michael in concert tours during the past year. Michael had been scheduled to perform in residency at the O2 Arena for the "This Is It" concerts, making Santana's dedication all the more poignant.
http://http://www.michaeljackson.com/us/news/carlos-santana-pays-tribute-michael-jackson

Symbolizing Archangel Michael Jackson?

(http://http://www.michaeljacksonbelts.com/sites/default/files/mj-necklace.jpg)

(http://http://ll-media.tmz.com/2010/10/22/1022-joe-jackson-necklace-credit.jpg)

Joe Jackson Blings MJ Back from the Dead
10/22/2010 2:00 PM PDT by TMZ Staff 
http://http://www.tmz.com/2010/10/22/joe-jackson-michael-jackson-bling-chain-necklace/
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on October 24, 2010, 02:15:33 PM
Ok, I could not believe I would post this...but....I can´t deny all the symbols, or at least, I can´t go on opposing to the Archanguel Michael theory when I know about iconography...this is very hard for me  :oops:

Sooo, here I goooo *believes is already losing the last screw*

Red, Blue, white (black)...colors representing Michael the Archangel in art.
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_GMT12N5R-ko/RjOMM-vr-rI/AAAAAAAAAX4/azgZ7cUq0us/s400/san+miguel+arcangel.jpg)

Michael Jackson
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_cudiB-AbcIs/TEE3diSmHXI/AAAAAAAAApo/BB651OToIFc/s400/MJ+2009+TII+10.JPG)

And now, I will go to a corner and stop breathing....
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on October 24, 2010, 02:30:26 PM
Quote from: "Gema"
Ok, I could not believe I would post this...but....I can´t deny all the symbols, or at least, I can´t go on opposing to the Archanguel Michael theory when I know about iconography...this is very hard for me  :oops:

Sooo, here I goooo *believes is already losing the last screw*

Red, Blue, white (black)...colors representing Michael the Archangel in art.
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_GMT12N5R-ko/RjOMM-vr-rI/AAAAAAAAAX4/azgZ7cUq0us/s400/san+miguel+arcangel.jpg)

Michael Jackson
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_cudiB-AbcIs/TEE3diSmHXI/AAAAAAAAApo/BB651OToIFc/s400/MJ+2009+TII+10.JPG)

And now, I will go to a corner and stop breathing....

(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/Capturadepantallacompleta2112200-1.jpg)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on October 24, 2010, 02:50:28 PM
Did Michael ask David La Chapelle to make those pics? I read that he made them after MJ "died".
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on October 24, 2010, 09:46:06 PM
I do not know what to say ...
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: looking4truth on October 24, 2010, 10:25:03 PM
Quote from: "Gema"
Did Michael ask David La Chapelle to make those pics? I read that he made them after MJ "died".

No Michael did not ask.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: looking4truth on October 24, 2010, 10:26:18 PM
Quote from: "Gema"
Ok, I could not believe I would post this...but....I can´t deny all the symbols, or at least, I can´t go on opposing to the Archanguel Michael theory when I know about iconography...this is very hard for me  :oops:

Sooo, here I goooo *believes is already losing the last screw*

Red, Blue, white (black)...colors representing Michael the Archangel in art.
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_GMT12N5R-ko/RjOMM-vr-rI/AAAAAAAAAX4/azgZ7cUq0us/s400/san+miguel+arcangel.jpg)

Michael Jackson
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_cudiB-AbcIs/TEE3diSmHXI/AAAAAAAAApo/BB651OToIFc/s400/MJ+2009+TII+10.JPG)

And now, I will go to a corner and stop breathing....

Interesting. Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Stranger In Chi-town on October 24, 2010, 11:03:01 PM
Hm, well, interesting coinkydink. I think I did read before, that MJ adores Archangel Michael. =]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: DREAMSandTRUTH on October 25, 2010, 09:28:53 AM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Quote from: "DREAMSandTRUTH"
Thank you Serenitys_Dream and Gema for your help!
I didn't have enough time yet to think it over thoroughly, but I plan to do it later, as I would really like to understand why Michael loves 777.
By the way number 7 is clear for me, I like that number  :) , it's only 777 I have problems with. And I would like to find it in the Bible rather than getting other explanations for it, like from esotericism, gematria, numerology etc...
Because from my experiences we tend to read almost anything into things if we want to get an "answer" or "clue".
Here http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu777.php (http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu777.php) I read:

Bible
Age of Lamech, father of Noah, when he died. In the posterity of Seth, Lamech is the last patriarch before the flood. (Gn 5,31) I haven't checked yet what they refer to... but if you can explain to me, that would be very helpful.  :)

The book of the Genesis contains 777+777-21 or 1553 verses. This is too farfetched for me. If you want to get something "interesting" with number 5, for example, I bet you can. Not especially for the number of the verses but something else in connection with the  book of the Genesis.

The number 777 is used 1 time in the Bible. Where?

The word priest is used 777 times in the Bible. Okay, but how many times the word "faith" or "love" is used? Why did they chose "priest"? Because it's used 777 times?

As I said I will try to think it over better in the future. Thanks again!  :)

I can't answer these questions, you will have to ask them of the website creator. I am not a bible scholar and have never even read the bible until recently.

This will be my final post in regards to the belief that 777 is God's number. You have an obligation to do your own research if you really want to understand the significance of anything. No one can tell you what to believe. This is an investigation into why Michael may have chosen the 777 and not what the investigators personal feelings on the subject are or what individuals choose to believe about a subject. You can not discount any factors such as esoterica, gematria, etc. because you are not Michael so all things must be considered as potential influences into why Michael chose to display the number 777.

My understanding is that the number 777 isn't in the bible at all but that it is considered God's number because of the number 7 being mentioned so many times in the bible, considered a spiritual number, and that 7 contains the combined qualities of both the number 3 and the 4 (3 + 4 = 7).
Hi Serenitys_Dream! Sorry that I answer just now, and thank you for your help.
Honestly I misunderstood something and I thought you know the Bible well, and that's why I asked for your help in this question.
I wished to find some connection with the Bible and the 777 because I hoped Michael took it from there. (Although I have never heard it either that it would be in the Bible...)
As I said "What really bugs me is that 777 is also the number which was used by the crazy Aleister Crowley. And scientology is based on his stupid teachings. And LMP is a scientologist..."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/777_and_Ot ... er_Crowley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/777_and_Other_Qabalistic_Writings_of_Aleister_Crowley)
Of course, 777 was used in the Torture video of The Jacksons too, way before LMP, but who knows whose idea was to use it there. (Jeff Stein directed the music video, and Al Kirschman was the scenic designer for the video.) Michael didn't even appear in the video.
Well, I guess I will wait for Michael to tell why he likes this number, and give up trying to find out.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: angelshadow on October 25, 2010, 09:40:25 AM
This Thread is incredibly astonishing!!!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: SeeingClues on October 25, 2010, 10:52:05 AM
You all may find this interesting as well.  A story about a blue "eye of God" that had been discovered by astronomers was published in February 2009.  The news article was published on the 25th of the month, and the image is 700 light years away from Earth.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/spac ... space.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/space/4805889/Eye-of-God-pictured-in-space.html)

[attachment=0:1io9xaj8]eye_of_god_1350800c.jpg[/attachment:1io9xaj8]

Eye of God pictured in space European astronomers have taken a stunning photo of a Big Brother-style cosmic eye, nicknamed the Eye of God, staring down from space.

The bright blue pupil and the white of the eye are fringed by flesh-coloured eyelids - but this eye is so big that it light takes two and a half years to cross from one side to the other.

The object is actually a shell of gas and dust that has been blown off by a faint central star. Our own solar system will meet a similar fate five billion years in the future.

It lies around 700 light-years away in the constellation of Aquarius, and can be dimly seen in small backyard telescopes by amateur astronomers who call it the Helix nebula. It covers an area of sky around a quarter the size of the full moon.

The photo was taken with a giant telescope at the European Southern Observatory, high on a mountaintop at La Silla in Chile. It is so detailed that a close-up reveals distant galaxies within the central eyeball.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: TheRunningGirl on October 25, 2010, 11:04:29 AM
Quote from: "SeeingClues"
You all may find this interesting as well.  A story about a blue "eye of God" that had been discovered by astronomers was published in February 2009.  The news article was published on the 25th of the month, and the image is 700 light years away from Earth.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/spac ... space.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/space/4805889/Eye-of-God-pictured-in-space.html)

[attachment=0:mnllhbco]eye_of_god_1350800c.jpg[/attachment:mnllhbco]

Eye of God pictured in space European astronomers have taken a stunning photo of a Big Brother-style cosmic eye, nicknamed the Eye of God, staring down from space.

The bright blue pupil and the white of the eye are fringed by flesh-coloured eyelids - but this eye is so big that it light takes two and a half years to cross from one side to the other.

The object is actually a shell of gas and dust that has been blown off by a faint central star. Our own solar system will meet a similar fate five billion years in the future.

It lies around 700 light-years away in the constellation of Aquarius, and can be dimly seen in small backyard telescopes by amateur astronomers who call it the Helix nebula. It covers an area of sky around a quarter the size of the full moon.

The photo was taken with a giant telescope at the European Southern Observatory, high on a mountaintop at La Silla in Chile. It is so detailed that a close-up reveals distant galaxies within the central eyeball.

Thank you for posting.  This fits nicely with the Age of Aquarius theory - Here is an extract from a post I wrote a couple of weeks ago in the "Age of Aquarius" thread:

Quote
The Bible description of "Jesus" correlates nicely with the cosmic law theory where main events in the Bible are representative of the movement of the stars at a certain moment in time. Jesus birth marks the start of the age of Pisces and his second coming would correspond to the start of the age of Aquarius (Possibly around 2012). Jesus represents the Son (Sun) of God, the light on Earth, the one who is here to show us the way.

A couple of interesting facts supporting the above theory:
1.   Before the sun entered Pisces Jesus was the Lamb of God in Aries. "The next day he saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!" (John 1:29)
2.   After his resurrection, he entered Pisces the fish. 
"They gave him a piece of broiled fish, 
and he took it and ate before them". (Luke 24:42-43).
3.   Jesus is referred to as carpenter in Mark 6:3. Carpenters build houses.
4.   Room and house are synonymous with house of the Zodiac. The man carrying a jar of water describes Aquarius. Aquarius is a large constellation which Luke describes as a large upper room. 
He said to them, "Behold, when you have entered the city, a man carrying a jar of water will meet you; follow him into the house which he enters, 
and tell the householder, 'The Teacher says to you, Where is the guest room, where I am to eat the Passover with my disciples?' 
And he will show you a large upper room furnished; there make ready." (Luke 22:10-12).
5.   The place of their last supper symbolizes the Age of Aquarius, the time of his return.
6.   And he said to them, "I have earnestly desired to eat this passover with you before I suffer; 
for I tell you I shall not eat it until it is fulfilled in the kingdom of God." (Luke 22:15-16)
 In my Father's house are many rooms. (John 14:2)
7.   I am the light of the world. "I am the light of the world; he who follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life." (John 8:12)
 "As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world." (John 9:5)

 ;)

With L.O.V.E
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on October 25, 2010, 01:16:10 PM
I have been researching the prophecies of ancient peoples. The first place where I found evidence of change was in books about 2012 those as Jose Arguelles, Carl Calleman and John Major Jenkins, who studied the ancient Mayas and Incas prophecies yHopis. His research in these ancient prophecies reveal very similar on a great change of consciousness predictions to bring us closer to 2012.
The Mayans, who have been saving time on Earth for 5000 years, they created codices or cosmic calendars like this, to trace the timing of the passage of humanity on a great metamorphosis.
According to the calendar of the long count they use to measure long cycles of time, the year 2012 marks the closure of several cycles of time.
According to the Mayans, the closure of the first cycle is the realization of the Galactic year. Milky way, 225 million Earth years takes it to do a complete rotation in the sky. 2012 also marks the end of:
· A cycle of 26 million Earth years
· A cycle of 78,000 Earth years
· The closure of the Mayan calendar of 26,000 years

According to the prophecy of many indigenous groups, 2012 seems to be the time when the odometer is a turnaround for the whole history of humans, Earth, our Galaxy, and perhaps all creation--the time when life experiences a break that is similar to that of caterpillars into butterflies.
The Mayans believed that human evolution is deployed as a result of these long cycles of time. His mystery plays with myths, spiritual rites and practiced the repetition of the cosmic drama created by the alignment of the Sun the Earth with the Galactic Center in 2012.
They described this alignment as a kind of cosmic exchange between father Sun and the grand mother of the Galactic Center to sent to all creation to birth a new reality. Pregnancy, birth and the embryonic origin were central concepts in their tradition.
The Mayan Tzolkin, a Mayan calendar type is based on the 260-day human gestation term. It is a harmonious representation of the Mayan calendar 26, 000 years. 260 x 100 = 26,000. It seems the Maya used the Tzolkin calendar to track both the evolution of an individual human being and the Mayan calendar 26, 000-years as a way to monitor the evolution of the human species.
From the maya, perspective in time preceding December 21, 2012, the Earth is making its shift toward the christic consciousness and transforming humanity into beings Crísticos. This process of transformation of humans, which can be bought to the transformation of a caterpillar in monarch, butterfly is known as the Ascension. The climbing term is typically used to describe the human transformation. Jose Arguelles also wrote about this from a planetary perspective in his book, Earth in ascent (Earth Ascending).

From an astrological point of view, we are in transit from the age of PISCES to the age of Aquarius. When we look in one direction, we collapse Piscianas, structures based on competitiveness and shortages. And when we see the other side, we see sprout new structures of Aquarius, based on the principles of partnership and sharing resources. This transition may cause confusion and anxiety, but nevertheless represents a single window to evolve.

Scientific information about the change the scientists who are studying the evolution from a heavenly perspective believe that there are four types of celestial events and cosmic forces that could be activating the change:
The Galactic · cycles · Solar cycles Sale · events Supernovae

There is a tremendous amount of evidence in these four areas that indicate that we are quite steep in great change of the ages. So let us look first: Galactic cycles. They are created by our Galaxy rotation of evenly-spaced energy areas that are not visible to the naked eye.
Takes approximately 26 million years pass through one of these areas and appears to us we are now moving towards one that is highly loaded. That we are moving through this accelerated energy means that it is changing our DNA, our conscience and activating our metamorphosis.

Our Galaxy, the milky way is about 100,000 years light diameter, this 30,000 years of light, and belongs to a group of three large and 30 + smaller galaxies, and is the second largest of the Andromeda Galaxy. Our solar system is almost out, on the edge of the spiral arm of Orion.

The Hubble telescope, launched by NASA in late 1995, has been opening stars us, revealing a secret once world of celestial activities and events. Many of these images really go beyond amazing - seems a window into the world of creation and evolution. Here are some of them.
This image, known as the Hourglass nebula has generated much interest.

The circle of the crop (crop circle), below, appeared in England during the month of June 2005. Some refer to him as God's eye that sees it. A specialist of the eye, who considered the top image, indicated that it is structured as a human eye.
http://www.angelesamor.org/energia/sobr ... mayas.html (http://www.angelesamor.org/energia/sobre-profecias-mayas.html)


[URL = http://img638.imageshack.us/i/20120217small.jpg/ (http://img638.imageshack.us/i/20120217small.jpg/)] [IMG] http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/5290 ... 7small.jpg (http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/5290/20120217small.jpg) [/ IMG] [/ URL]

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Subido con [URL = http://imageshack.us (http://imageshack.us)] ImageShack.us [/ URL]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on October 25, 2010, 01:40:44 PM
(http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/5290/20120217small.jpg)
Creepy eye,eewwww
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on December 28, 2010, 01:33:09 PM
The date June 25 also has religious significance relating to Jesus.

Pontius Pilate
Pontius Pilate was the governor of the small Roman province of Judea from 26 until 36 AD. According to the Christian Gospels, he presided at the trial of Jesus and gave the order for his crucifixion.

According to the New Testament, Jesus was brought to Pilate by the Jewish authorities in Jerusalem after they had arrested him, questioned him, and received answers from him that they considered blasphemous. Pilate's main question to Jesus was whether he considered himself to be the "king of the Jews".

In the continuing interrogation by Pilate, related in the Gospel of John, Jesus states that he "came into the world ... to bear witness to the truth; and all who are on the side of truth listen to my voice", to which Pilate replies, "What is truth?" Pilate then offers the Jews the choice of a prisoner to release, said to be a Passover tradition, and they choose a murderer named Barabbas over Jesus. John 18 makes it apparent that Pilate could not have cared less about the conflict between Jesus and the priests, or about executing Jesus; he certainly does not seem to see Jesus' "kingdom" as any sort of a threat to Rome.

In the Gospel of Matthew, after condemning Jesus to death, Pilate washes his hands with water in front of the crowd, who had demanded that Jesus be crucified, and says, "I am innocent of this man's blood. It is your concern."
http://http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Pontius_Pilate

Pontius Pilate declared publicly that Jesus was innocent at least three times.
http://http://www.scribd.com/doc/3084217/The-Illegalities-of-Jesus-Religious-and-Civil-Trials-Laurna-Berg

Coptic Orthodox Christianity is the indigenous form of Christianity that, according to tradition, the apostle Mark established in Egypt in the middle of the 1st century AD (approximately AD 60).

The Coptic Orthodox Church
The Coptic Orthodox Church is the national church of Egypt. It is one of the Oriental Orthodox churches. Its leader is the Pope of Alexandria and the Patriarch of the Holy See of Saint Mark; a position not to be confused with that of the Roman Catholic Pope in Rome, nor to be confused with either of the other two bishops bearing the title of Patriarch of Alexandria (one in communion with the Roman Pope and the other the head of one of the canonical Eastern Orthodox churches). The current incumbent is Pope Shenouda III.

Egypt is often identified as the place of refuge that the Holy Family sought in its flight from Judea: "When he arose, he took the young Child and His mother by night and departed for Egypt, and was there until the death of Herod, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt I called My Son" (Matthew 2:12-23). The Egyptian Church, which is now more than nineteen centuries old, was the subject of many prophecies in the Old Testament. Isaiah the prophet, in Chapter 19, Verse 19 says "In that day there will be an altar to the LORD in the midst of the land of Egypt, and a pillar to the LORD at its border."

The first Christians in Egypt were mainly Alexandrian Jews such as Theophilus, whom Saint Luke the Evangelist addresses in the introductory chapter of his gospel. When the church was founded by Mark during the reign of the Roman emperor Nero, a great multitude of native Egyptians (as opposed to Greeks or Jews) embraced the Christian faith. Christianity spread throughout Egypt within half a century of Mark's arrival in Alexandria as is clear from the New Testament writings found in Bahnasa, in Middle Egypt, which date around the year 200 AD, and a fragment of the Gospel of Saint John, written in Coptic, which was found in Upper Egypt and can be dated to the first half of the second century. In the second century Christianity began to spread to the rural areas, and scriptures were translated into the local language, namely Coptic.
http://http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Coptic_Orthodox_Church

The Third Roman Civil Trial of Jesus
During this last trial, Pilate received a message from his wife (Claudia), telling him of her dream warning him to have nothing to do with Jesus, who was a righteous man.
http://http://www.scribd.com/doc/3084217/The-Illegalities-of-Jesus-Religious-and-Civil-Trials-Laurna-Berg

Pontius Pilate
In the Coptic Orthodox Church (predominantly African), Pontius Pilate is commemorated as a saint. According to their tradition, he secretly converted to Christianity sometime after the death of Jesus Christ, through the influence of his wife Claudia. Pilate and Claudia are both commemorated as saints on June 25.
http://http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Pontius_Pilate
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on December 28, 2010, 08:30:35 PM
Days that are held at these two "saints" are from June 25 to Pontius and Claudia Prócula October 25. :?:
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: mst1 on December 29, 2010, 08:44:10 AM
Let us look at some interesting facts about the number seven.

Mathematical Facts about the Number Seven

    * Seven has the highest probability of occurring as an addition when rolling dice.
    * The number seven is the fourth prime number as also a Mersenne prime, the first Woodall prime, the fourth factorial prime, the second lucky and the second safe prime.
    * Seven is the only number below 15 that cannot be represented as a sum of the squares of three integers. Wondering all other numbers can be represented? You will have to check out and see!

Interesting Facts about the Number Seven

    * There are seven wonders of the ancient world.
    * There are seven continents in the world.
    * There are seven colors of the rainbow. Their names are famously abbreviated as 'vibgyor'.
    * There are seven days in a week.
    * One of the most interesting facts about the number seven is its correlation with the cognitive abilities of a human being. The limits of human cognitive capacity lie within the range of 7 plus or a minus 2.
    * There are seven basic musical notes, namely, 'do', 're', 'me', 'fa', 'so', 'la' and 'te'. In Indian music they are ‘sa’, ‘re’, ‘ga’, ‘ma’, ‘pa’, ‘dha’ and ‘ni’.
    * Felix Vasquez, an employee of the New York City Housing Authority was born on July 7, 1977. He was the winner of the New York's Bronze Medallion for his brave act of saving a three-week old child. He became famous in New York for this courageous feat and appeared in many television interviews.

Facts about the Number Seven in Science and Technology

    * A ladybug commonly has seven spots!
    * Most of the mammals' necks have seven bones.
    * The number of rows in the periodic table is seven.
    * The neutral pH value that lies between acidity and alkalinity is seven.
    * The code for international direct dial phone calls to Russia and Kazakhstan is seven. Seven is also the number of digits in an American or a Canadian telephone number.
    * Digital devices use a seven-segment display.
    * The OSI model has seven layers.
    * There are seven logic gates namely, NOT, NOR, XNOR, XOR, AND, NAND and OR.

Facts about the Number Seven in Different Religions

    * The Indian astronomy regards a constellation of seven stars as a group of its seven prominent saints. It denotes this constellation by the name, 'saptarishi mandalam'.
    * Seven is also the number of stars in the constellation, Big Dipper.
    * The number of celestial bodies visible to the naked eye is seven. The stellar objects visible to naked eyes are the Sun, the Moon and the five planets namely, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn. Earth is a stellar body but since we are on it, it is 'invisible' in the 'sky'.
    * The roman number seven, VII signifies the seventh discovered satellite of a planet.
    * In Christianity, the number seven has been made significant by the Seven Joys of Virgin Mary, the Seven Sorrows of Virgin Mary, the Seven Corporal and the Seven Spiritual Acts of Mercy of Roman Catholic. The number seven appears in the Seven last words of Jesus on the cross, the Seven Virtues and the Seven deadly sins.
    * In the Islamic tradition, there are seven heavens and seven Earths. The numbers of fires in hell and the number of doors to both the heaven and the hell is also seven.

The Number 7
7 is a Prime Number.

7 is a Mersenne Number.

7 is an Octahedral Number.

7 is a Lucas Number.

7 is a Centered Hexagonal Number.

7 is a Heptagonal Number.

7 is a Hexagonal Pyramidal Number.

5 can be Partitioned in 7 ways.

7 can be Partitioned in 15 ways.

7 is the number of + signs needed to write the Partitions of 4

Sum of the first 4 Fibonacci numbers= 1 + 1 + 2 + 3 = 7

7 is the number of frieze groups, i.e., the groups consisting of symmetries of the plane whose group of translations is isomorphic to the group of integers.

7 is the maximal number of regions into which 3 lines divide a plane.

The 7 Hexagonal (6-fold) crystal classes.

The 7 Tetragonal crystal classes.

Topologists have been able to prove that 7 colors may be needed on a donut shaped map to ensure that no adjacent areas are the same.

There are seven different ways of linking four hexagons together.

7 is the smallest number of integer-sided rectangles that tile a rectangle so that no 2 rectangles share a common length.

The Chemical Element Nitrogen has an atomic number of 7.

The 7 directions: north, south, east, west, up, down and the center.

In Humans: the 7 Endocrine glands.

The 7 colors of the rainbow.

The 7 double letters of the Hebrew Alphabet.

The 7 classical planets.

The 7 bodies of the Human microcosm.

In Humans: the 7 chakras.

Seventh heaven is the farthest of the concentric spheres containing the stars in the Moslem and cabalist systems.

Seven is the maximum number of eclipses of the Sun and Moon that can occur in any one year.

Christianity
The seven Virtues are: Faith, Hope, Charity, Fortitude, Justice, Prudence, and Temperence

Mahatma Gandhi
Wealth without Work
Pleasure without Conscience
Science without Humanity
Knowledge without Character
Politics without Principle
Commerce without Morality
Worship without Sacrifice

Budo
The Seven Virtues: Jin: benevolence, Gi: honor or justice, Rei: courtesy and etiquette, Chi: wisdom, intellligence, Shin: sincerity, Chu: loyalty, Koh: piety

Vices recognized by Christianity: The seven deadly sins are:
Pride:    excessive belief in one's own abilities, that interferes with the individual's recognition of the grace of God. It has been called the sin from which all others arise. Pride is also known as Vanity.
Envy:    the desire for others' traits, status, abilities, or situation.
Gluttony:    an inordinate desire to consume more than that which one requires.
Lust:    an inordinate craving for the pleasures of the body.
Anger:    is manifested in the individual who spurns love and opts instead for fury. It is also known as Wrath.
Greed:    the desire for material wealth or gain, ignoring the realm of the spiritual. It is also called Avarice or Covetousness.
Sloth:    Avoidance of physical or spiritual work.

Film: The Magnificent Seven.  :D


The Year 7 AD
In the year 7 AD Publius Quinctilius Varus is appointed governor of Germany.

In the year 7 AD the Illyrians revolt against Roman rule.

In the year 7 AD Abgarus of Edessa is deposed as king of Osroene.

In the year 7 AD Roman Emperor Caesar Augustus dismisses the Judea ethnarch Herod Archelaus.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on December 29, 2010, 10:42:26 AM
Quote from: "paula-c"
Days that are held at these two "saints" are from June 25 to Pontius and Claudia Prócula October 25. :?:
In the Eastern Orthodox Church, she is celebrated on 27 October. The Ethiopian Orthodox Church celebrates Pilate and Procula together on 25 June
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on December 29, 2010, 10:44:57 AM
@ Serenity, I asked you in the visions thread already with no answer from you.
Where does this Pilatus and Claudia research leads us. I am lost.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 29, 2010, 06:09:19 PM
I looked  back to a very favorite huge site of mine before all of this interest. <!-- m -->http://www.askelm.com<!-- m --> , a goldmine of
understanding of the Bible not so much from traditional viewpoint but technically and digging
deep intellectually. This brilliant humble writer, now deceased, lived in Israel, knew ancient languages well, taught
Astronomy at University, and Archeology and was very involved in digs around the Temple Mount. On this page
he talks about how from the Garden of Eden to Solomon's Temple to the Universe how the Tabernacle design is for
all history and future and for all the Universe. 7's is throughout. Also in this chart (blow up to 100% to read) he
shows the symetry and design of the Bible. Especially Revelation he lists all the 7's there, but there's many more
elswhwere, such as 7 miracles in John, 7 General Epistles, so many. And this all relates to the Ark of the Covanent
which relates to Michael in the June 25, 2009 announcement from Ethiopia.
<!-- m -->http://www.askelm.com/restoring/res000a.pdf<!-- m -->

Quote
The Geographical Design of the Holy Scriptures
By Ernest L. Martin, Ph.D., 1984

The Temples of Solomon and King David were designed to be permanent replicas of the Tabernacle that Moses constructed in the wilderness. There were some minor differences between the permanent Temples and Tabernacle, but their central designs were always retained. The architectural necessity was the retention of the three distinct compartments known as the Holy of Holies, the Holy Place and the Court of Israel. That is, the western portion of the Sanctuary had the compartment called the Holy of Holies with an eastern entrance. Just to the east of that was another compartment called the Holy Place where the priests did their daily administrations. It also had an eastern entrance. Further east was the large compartment called the Court of Israel where ordinary Israelites were allowed to congregate.

In the Tabernacle this large eastern Court also had a single entrance on its east side. Besides these three compartments, surrounding the Tabernacle was the Camp of the Israelites with its outer limits being 2000 cubits from the Holy of Holies where the Ark of the Covenant was housed. Just to the east of this outer limit of the Camp was the Altar of the Red Heifer which was positioned precisely east of the entrances to the Court of Israel, the Holy Place and the Holy of Holies

The Temple Symbolized the Garden of Eden
These three compartments found in the Tabernacle and the permanent Temples were analogous to the three divisions of the Garden of Eden.

The Holy of Holies was the spot in the Garden where God appeared to Adam and Eve "in the cool of the day."
The Holy Place itself represented the whole of the Garden which was located in the Land of Eden.
The Court of Israel represented the Land of Eden and in its western part (after the expulsion of our first parents from the Garden region) was an altar on which Cain and Abel offered their sacrifices. This altar was located at the east entrance to the Garden.
But further east (and outside the limits of Eden) was the Land of Nod into which Cain was banished.
A further altar was raised up in Nod on the east side of Eden on which the sin offering for Cain and his descendants would be offered to cleanse them of sins. This was analogous to the Altar of the Red Heifer which was also east of the Tabernacle and the permanent Temples.
In the time of Christ, this Altar of the Red Heifer was situated directly east of the Temple entrances near the summit of the Mount of Olives. This was the region of Golgotha where Christ (the greatest sin offering of all time) was offered for the sins of Israel and the world. 1

The Jews Are the Legal Custodians of the Holy Scriptures
The 22 books of the Hebrew and Aramaic Scriptures along with the 27 books of the Greek Scriptures (representing 49 books in all, that is, 7 times 7 books) are found in seven precise divisions:

The Law of Moses
The Prophets
The Writings or Royal Section
The Gospels with Acts
The General Epistles
The Epistles of Paul
The Book of Revelation
These books were given into the custody of the priests and elders of Israel for safekeeping (Deuteronomy 31:9, 26) and Paul confirmed this by stating that the Jews had great advantage over the Gentiles because "unto them were committed (or "entrusted") the oracles of God" (Romans 3:1–2). The priests and elders of Israel were assigned these authoritative roles in association with the Tabernacle and later at the Temple in Jerusalem. Interestingly, the Seven Divisions of the Holy Scriptures are also intimately connected with Temple symbolism.
The Temple and the Holy Scriptures
The Holy Scriptures are called the Word of God for Israel and mankind. Paul said they represent "the oracles of God" in an authoritative way. But the Temples were also called "the Oracles of God" (1 Kings 6:5; Psalm 28:2). 2 The place where God spoke in a Temple was specifically referred to as "the Oracle of God" (2 Samuel 16:23). It was significant that the written Law of Moses was deposited for safe keeping alongside the Ark of the Covenant inside the Holy of Holies (the Oracle, Deuteronomy 31:26).

When we look closely at the relationship between the written Oracles of God and that compartment of the Temple called, in a geographical sense, the Oracle of God, there is a definite connection. The First Division (the Law of Moses) placed alongside the Ark of the Covenant became inextricably affiliated, in a geographical sense, with the First Compartment of the Temple (the Holy of Holies.

Division One: The Law of Moses. These first five books of the Bible were written by Moses and given into the hands of the priests and elders for preservation and teaching (Deuteronomy 31:9–10ff). They represent the primary "oracles of the law" and they were placed in the "Oracle of God" (the Holy of Holies) in the Temple alongside the Ark (Deuteronomy 31:26). For those who lived during the Old Testament period, this was the holiest written part of the divine oracles and they were placed in the holiest geographical spot in the Temple.

Division Two: The Prophets. The next six books of the Bible (Joshua/Judges, the Book of Kingdoms, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, the Twelve) were written by prophets (most of whom were priests) and these books were prophetic introductions or messages designed for Israel and spoken primarily by priests. The priestly division of the Temple was the Holy Place just east of the Holy of Holies and Division Two of the Bible became associated with this area. The Prophets’ Division is analogous to the Holy Place.

Division Three: The Writings or Royal Division. These eleven books of the Bible were associated with the royal personalities such as David, Solomon, Hezekiah, Josiah, etc., and they represented the philosophical and esoteric teachings to Israelites in a calendar context. The holiness of these books is associated with the Court of Israel located east of the Holy Place or the Holy of Holies.

Division Four: The Gospels and the Book of Acts. These five books of the Bible represent the Law of Christ as found in the Greek Scriptures and are similar to the Law of Moses in the Hebrew Scriptures. They are also associated with the Temple, but NOT with the three compartments of the Temple located near the southern summit of the Mount of Olives. Ezekiel prophesied that the Shekinah of God (the Spirit of God which made the Temple on Mount Moriah holy) was to leave the three compartments of the physical Temple at Jerusalem and position itself on the top of the Mount of Olives (Ezekiel 11:22–23).

Both Jewish and Christian records from the 1st to the 4th centuries show that the Shekinah did in fact leave Moriah and located itself at the top of Olivet near where Christ was crucified and resurrected. 3 What this means is that the Shekinah left the Temple and the Camp of Israel to go to the Altar of the Red Heifer east of Mount Moriah on the Mount of Olives and that Olivet became a new "El-Beth-El" (or God’s own House of God) for Israelites and for Gentiles.

The Shekinah through the death and resurrection of Christ established itself in the midst of the world for all people to approach and become part of it. This was the place of the sin offering that God promised Cain and his descendants that was east of Eden (the Camp and Court of Israel) and east of the Garden (the Holy Place on Moriah). And the five books of the Bible that represent this new "House of God" are the four Gospels and the Book of Acts. Note that these historical works about the life of Christ (on earth and in heaven) began their messages within Israel but the final destination of teaching the Gospel extended to the capital of the Gentile world, Rome (Acts 28).

Division Five: The General Epistles. The "Jewish apostles" wrote these seven epistles and they were written to the twelve tribes in the dispersion — that is, to those Israelites who were away from Jerusalem and the new "House of God" which was associated with the Red Heifer Altar on the Mount of Olives. These seven epistles to the Gentiles are placed before Paul’s simply to accord with biblical law that the oracles of God should go first to the Israelites (which teaching is found throughout the Book of Acts and the epistles of Paul).

With the Shekinah’s abandonment of Mount Moriah as the "House of God" as Ezekiel promised, the new "Bethel" (the "El-Beth-El") was now centered around the ritualistic symbolism associated with the Red Heifer and the sacrifice of Christ on the Mount of Olives. The Jewish apostles in these seven epistles were directing Israelites to devote their attention now to Jesus and to the symbolism of the Mount of Olives — the new gateway to heaven in a figurative sense (like in the case of Jacob’s ladder). In other words, Jesus had become the new "Holy of Holies" on Olivet for all Jews scattered over the whole world.

Division Six: The Epistles of Paul. Paul, the apostle to the Gentiles, wrote these fourteen books of the Bible. Since the Book of Acts started its message with the symbolic holiness now attached to the Mount of Olives (the new "House of God) and leads us directly to Rome (the capital city of the Gentile world), the teachings of these fourteen epistles were designed to bring to conversion the Gentiles in the European section of the Empire (and by later extension to all those in the whole world).

Division Seven: The Book of Revelation. The final book of the Bible sums up the prophetic history of the earth with the earth becoming the residence of God the Father with no physical Temple. Finally the earth itself becomes the new "Holy of Holies" for the entire universe. The biblical story thus began with the Holy of Holies being at the center of the Garden of Eden, then the Tabernacle and physical Temples were its center, then the Mount of Olives, then it expanded to all areas on earth where Israelites were, then expanding to include Gentiles, and finally continuing to expand until all the earth becomes the "Holy of Holies" to the whole universe.
(See the many 7's in Revelation in the chart link above.)http://www.askelm.com/restoring/res999.htm

Also I wanted to mention the amazing generations in the Bible from Adam to Jesus Christ that are 7's.
From God and his son Adam to Abraham is 21 generations. (7x3=21 or 777) Luke 3:34-38
"17So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations."
Matthew 1:17 (2x7=17, 2x7=14, 2x7=14; or 77, 77, 77)

And I'm sure there's many more 7's. Makes me wonder how many generations are in MJ's life but I guess we'll
never know unless told. 2010 years later. Oh well...
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on December 29, 2010, 06:32:25 PM
Quote from: "Gema"
@ Serenity, I asked you in the visions thread already with no answer from you.
Where does this Pilatus and Claudia research leads us. I am lost.

Pontius Pilate declared Jesus innocent at least three times and for this he is considered a Saint.
Saint Pontius Pilate is celebrated on June 25 in Ethiopia.
Michael's "death" occurs on June 25, 2009.
Ethiopia is the possible location of the "Ark of the Covenant".
Th Ethiopian Church announces on June 25, 2009 that the Ark is going to be revealed.
On June 26th this was rescinded after a meeting with the Pope.
Michael has a Royal Coat of Arms (resembling the British COA, not exact but similar) on the Gates of Neverland. It is described as "the Jackson Family Crest".
The Royal Families in this world, are Royals because it is believed that they can trace their lineage back to King David of Israel which Jesus is also supposedly a descendant of.
Michael dresses very similar to the King of Ethiopia.
Michael is descended from slaves, many slaves came from Ethiopia.
When Michael visited Africa he was made a king and was greeted with signs saying "Welcome Home".

So where does that leave us Gema?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: mst1 on December 29, 2010, 11:46:06 PM
In the Book of Revelation the number SEVEN is used throughout. There are SEVEN churches, SEVEN Spirits, SEVEN stars, SEVEN seals, SEVEN trumpets, SEVEN vials, SEVEN personages, SEVEN dooms, and SEVEN new things. SEVEN symbolizes Spiritual Perfection. All of life revolves around this number. SEVEN is used over 700 times in the Bible. It is used 54 times in the Book of Revelation.

The whole Word of God is founded upon the number SEVEN. It stands for the SEVENTH day of the Creation Week, and speaks of the Millennial Rest day. It denotes COMPLETENESS or PERFECTION.

In Leviticus 23:15-16, the number SEVEN and the Sabbath, which was the SEVENTH day, is connected with the word COMPLETE. The word COMPLETE follows after the words “SEVEN SABBATH” (Seventh day). The day following the SEVENTH sabbath there was something NEW that took place.

The word FINISHED is also connected with the number SEVEN. In Revelation 10:7 we read,

“In the days of the voice of the SEVENTH angel, when he shall begin to sound the mystery of God should be FINISHED.”

“It is DONE” is another expression found in connection with the number Seven.

“And the SEVENTH angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne saying, It is DONE.” (Revelation 16:17)

The word CREATED is used SEVEN times in connection with God’s creative work. (Genesis 1:1; Genesis 1:21; 1:27 (three times); 2:3; and 2:4). God created all things in the beginning and then took six days of restoring His creation and then rested on the SEVENTH day. (Genesis 2:1-3). He appointed SEVEN days for the week, and most, if not all advanced nations reckon time in that way: SEVEN days to the week. Few ever stop to think of why there are SEVEN days in a week. Do atheists and infidels give God and the Bible credit for it?

There are SEVEN notes in the musical scale. All other pitches are only variations of these. When the musician uses the eighth note he goes back to “do” and starts over. Man named the notes but God fixed the sounds, even as God fixed the days of the week, and man named them.

Noah took the clean beasts into the ark by SEVENS (Genesis 7:2) SEVEN days after Noah went into the ark the flood came. (Genesis 7:-10) Peter tells about the long-suffering of God waiting in the days of Noah. (I Peter 3:21) Those SEVEN days COMPLETED God’s time of waiting.

Before Aaron and his sons entered their priestly work they were consecrated SEVEN days. (Leviticus 8:31-36) Here is a picture of a life COMPLETELY or WHOLLY consecrated or dedicated to the Lord for service.

On the day of atonement the high priest sprinkled the blood upon the mercy seat SEVEN times. (Leviticus 16:14) This is a picture of the COMPLETENESS of the redemptive work of Christ.

“By his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us." (Hebrews 9:12)

When Christ offered Himself that FINISHED the sacrificial offerings. They were ended. No longer must we place sacrifices upon an altar.

When Israel took the city of Jericho God told them to march around the city SEVEN times. Thus, on the SEVENTH day, when they marched around the city SEVEN times, they COMPLETED their marching. (Joshua 6:1-16)

There were SEVEN FEAST days of our Lord. (Passover, Unleavened, First-fruits, Pentecost, Atonement, Trumpets and Tabernacle). (Leviticus 23:1-44)

There were SEVEN branches on the CANDLESTICK in the Holy Place in the Tabernacle and this pictures the COMPLETE light of God for the souls of man.

Solomon was SEVEN years in building the Temple and kept the Feast for SEVEN days. Job had SEVEN sons. When his friends came to visit him they sat SEVEN days and SEVEN nights in silence, and afterward they were required to offer a Burnt Offering of SEVEN bullocks and SEVEN rams. Naaaman washed SEVEN times in the Jordan. The Saviour spoke SEVEN words from the Cross. SEVEN men of honest report were chosen to administer the alms of the church in Acts 6:1-7. There were SEVEN years of plenty and SEVEN years of famine in Egypt during the days of Joseph.

SEVEN times in the Book of Revelation blessing of the Lord are promised to His people. These are called the “BEATITUDES” of Revelation. These are found in Chapters 1:3; 14:13; 16:15; 19:9; 20:6; 22:7, 14.

There are SEVEN Dispensations -- Innocence, Conscience, Government, Patriarchal, Law, Grace, and Milleniah (sic) Age.

SEVEN times the Book of Life is mentioned in the Bible. The Book of Revelation is a Book of SEVENS. We have SEVEN churches, SEVEN seals, SEVEN Trumpets, SEVEN Personages, SEVEN vails (sic), SEVEN dooms, SEVEN new things. SEVEN SEVENS make up this Book . It is the COMPLETENESS of all things.

Jesus said to “forgive SEVENTY times SEVEN“ In other words, He is saying, “Keep on forgiving until you are complete.” Even the duration of Israel’s great punishments was based upon this law of SEVENS. Their captivity in Babylon was for SEVENTY years, ten periods of SEVENS. (Jeremiah 25:11-12; Daniel l9:2)

Life operates in a cycle of SEVENS. Changes take place in the body every SEVEN years. There are SEVEN bones in the neck, SEVEN bones in the face, SEVEN bones in the ankle, and SEVEN holes in the head. Most births are multiple of SEVENS. The hen sits three weeks (21 days); the pigeon two weeks (14 days); after having laid eggs for two weeks. Of 129 species of Mammalia (sic) the majority have a period from conception to birth of an exact number of weeks, a multiple of SEVEN.

Human physiology is constructed on a law of SEVENS. Children are born to mothers in a certain number of weeks usually 280 days, a multiple of SEVENS. Fevers and intermittent attacks of gout, ague, and similar complaints have a period of operation of SEVEN, FOURTEEN or TWENTY-ONE days knows as critical days.

All departments of nature are marked all over with mathematics. In this realm practically everything is in SEVENS. Notice next time the shape of frost when it crystallizes on the window. Notice the small snow flakes. It is wonderful how God formed everything in a pattern of SEVENS.

It would be well for the reader to always remember the SEVEN means COMPLETENESS or SPIRITUAL PERFECTION. Whenever you come to a SEVEN in the Word of God read the meaning and the message is plain.

SEVEN is found 735 times in the Bible. SEVENFOLD is mentioned 6 times and SEVENTH is found 119 times.

The SEVENTH time Noah’s name occurs is where it is said,

“Noah was a just man, and PERFECT in his generations.” (Genesis 6:9)

In the second chapter of Daniel, Nebuchadnezzar had a dream of a great image whose head was of gold, arms and breasts of silver, his belly and things of brass, legs of iron, and feet of iron and clay. (Daniel 2:31-33) Daniel told him that he was the head of gold (vs 37-38) In the next chapter Nebuchadnezzar made an image of gold to be worshipped. At that time he called together SEVEN kinds of officials to the dedication of the image: (1) princes, (2) governors, (3) captains, (4) judges, (5) treasurers (6) counselors, (7) sheriffs. The penalty for refusing to worship that image was death by being cast into the burning fiery furnace. THREE Hebrew children refused to worship the image and were cast into that furnace of death, and brought forth alive, thus picturing the resurrection, signified by the number THREE That furnace was heated SEVEN times hotter than it had ever been. Here is a COMPLETE DELIVERANCE FOR GOD’S PEOPLE from the power of death. (Daniel 3:1-27) When those THREE Hebrew children came out of that furnace of fire, or death, there was not a trace of fire upon their bodies or their clothing. When Christ brings His people out of death there will not be a trace of death left on them. The will be COMPLETELY delivered from its power.


Ivan Panin  discover NUMERICAL SYSTEMS IN THE BIBLE

http://www.cai.org/faq/bible-mathematics (http://www.cai.org/faq/bible-mathematics)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_(number) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_(number))
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on December 30, 2010, 07:30:09 AM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
Quote from: "Gema"
@ Serenity, I asked you in the visions thread already with no answer from you.
Where does this Pilatus and Claudia research leads us. I am lost.

Pontius Pilate declared Jesus innocent at least three times and for this he is considered a Saint.
Saint Pontius Pilate is celebrated on June 25 in Ethiopia.
Michael's "death" occurs on June 25, 2009.
Ethiopia is the possible location of the "Ark of the Covenant".
Th Ethiopian Church announces on June 25, 2009 that the Ark is going to be revealed.
On June 26th this was rescinded after a meeting with the Pope.
Michael has a Royal Coat of Arms (resembling the British COA, not exact but similar) on the Gates of Neverland. It is described as "the Jackson Family Crest".
The Royal Families in this world, are Royals because it is believed that they can trace their lineage back to King David of Israel which Jesus is also supposedly a descendant of.
Michael dresses very similar to the King of Ethiopia.
Michael is descended from slaves, many slaves came from Ethiopia.
When Michael visited Africa he was made a king and was greeted with signs saying "Welcome Home".

So where does that leave us Gema?


HOLLY COW  :shock:  :shock:

Thanks for the spoon feeding  :D

Are we being lead to Ethiopia?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Supervision on December 30, 2010, 10:59:00 AM
Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
 by Gema » Thu Dec 30, 2010 7:30 am
Serenitys_Dream wrote:
Gema wrote:@ Serenity, I asked you in the visions thread already with no answer from you.
Where does this Pilatus and Claudia research leads us. I am lost.


Pontius Pilate declared Jesus innocent at least three times and for this he is considered a Saint.
Saint Pontius Pilate is celebrated on June 25 in Ethiopia.
Michael's "death" occurs on June 25, 2009.
Ethiopia is the possible location of the "Ark of the Covenant".
Th Ethiopian Church announces on June 25, 2009 that the Ark is going to be revealed.
On June 26th this was rescinded after a meeting with the Pope.
Michael has a Royal Coat of Arms (resembling the British COA, not exact but similar) on the Gates of Neverland. It is described as "the Jackson Family Crest".
The Royal Families in this world, are Royals because it is believed that they can trace their lineage back to King David of Israel which Jesus is also supposedly a descendant of.
Michael dresses very similar to the King of Ethiopia.
Michael is descended from slaves, many slaves came from Ethiopia.
When Michael visited Africa he was made a king and was greeted with signs saying "Welcome Home".

So where does that leave us Gema?



HOLLY COW   

Thanks for the spoon feeding 

Are we being lead to Ethiopia?
Minkin güerveeeee

Gema..Do you not recall, that,
.this subject of MJ 's Royalty question as leading or pointing to the Ethiopian Royals  was already discussed/debated at length on the thread Visions from Michael between me and Serenity month ago?..

.In fact I was going to post a summery of that same debate back up, to serve as a refresher to our mem. for my long promised upcoming post touching the subject or question of Michael and his possible Royalty connection.

And just to answer your question above Gema,while all are free to believe as they wish ,and any thing is possible, I personally do not think this is the case.
 

As a native of Ethiopia and knowing it's history and culture and Religious practices as well, I honestly do not believe , that we are being led to Ethiopia at all in connection to  Mike and his Royalty .

Sorry ,  too long of an explanation as to why I believe as I do, etc. too much for me to get into right here and now,

but if you interested what I got to say about it,  pls check out my upcoming post regarding this subject,  at Visions from Michael,,
 as I will post the issue there as I have originally planned to do anyway, and promised our posters and readers there over and over again,  as you already know Gema, <!-- s:roll: --> :roll: <!-- s:roll: -->

Lol, I can see , I need to really make time and post about this issue. Gives people a counter point to consider,  at the very least? <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->
Peace.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on December 30, 2010, 01:47:26 PM
On my way to the visions thread!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 08, 2011, 12:43:04 AM
SMOKING GUN IN MICHAEL JACKSON'S DEATH - SADE ANDING

Smoking Gun - Something that serves as indisputable evidence or proof
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/smoking+gun

Sade means "Ray of Light"
http://www.behindthename.com/name/sa12de

Anding-  an administrative subdivision of the province of Gansu in China.
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anding

Gansu - a province located in the northwest of the People's Republic of China. It lies between the Tibetan and Huangtu plateaus, and borders Mongolia, Inner Mongolia, and Ningxia to the north, Xinjiang and Qinghai to the west, Sichuan to the south, and Shaanxi to the east. The Yellow River passes through the southern part of the province. The capital is Lanzhou, located in the southeast part of the province.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gansu

The Yellow River - is the second-longest river in China and the seventh longest in the world. Sometimes the Yellow River is poetically called the "Muddy Flow" . The Chinese idiom "when the Yellow River flows clear" is used to refer to an event that will never happen and is similar to the English expression "when pigs fly". Its Tibetan name is "River of the Peacock".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_River

Yesterday, in the thread about Murray's bow tie, a member suggested that the circles on the tie resembled those on a peacock feather.

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/comparepeacock.png)

Bingling Temple &Thousand Buddha Caves
Binglingsi Grottoes is located on the Small Jishi Hill, about 35 kilometers (about 22 miles) south-west of Yongjing County in Lanzhou City, Gansu Province. It is a series of grottoes filled with Buddhist sculpture carved into natural caves and caverns in a canyon along the Yellow River. It lies just north of where the Yellow River empties into the Liujiaxia Reservoir created by the Liujiaxia Dam at Yongjing, about 80km from Lanzhou.
http://yeschinatour.com/china-guides/china-attractions/binglingsi-grottoes-lanzhou/

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3a/Buddha.BinglingSi.jpg/387px-Buddha.BinglingSi.jpg)

From the Video for "Scream"

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Budhastatue.jpg)

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/ScreamHalo2.jpg)

Buddha
‘Buddha’ means ‘Awakened One’, someone who has awakened from the sleep of ignorance and sees things as they really are. A Buddha is a person who is completely free from all faults and mental obstructions.
http://www.aboutbuddha.org/english/who-is-buddha.htm/

Parallels between Buddha and Jesus
Numerous scholars have made parallels between Buddha and Jesus. According to Jerry Bentley, they "have often considered the possibility that Buddhism influenced the early development of Christianity. They have drawn attention to many parallels concerning the births, lives, doctrines, and deaths of the Buddha and Jesus"
More at the link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallels_between_Buddha_and_Jesus

[youtube:1xpoq92f]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IR5_rTCi-Bo[/youtube:1xpoq92f]

Sade - Soldier Of Love lyrics
I've lost the use of my heart
But I'm still alive
Still looking for the life
The endless pool on the other side
It's a wild wild west
I'm doing my best

I'm at the borderline of my faith,
I'm at the hinterland of my devotion
In the frontline of this battle of mine
But I'm still alive

I'm a soldier of love.
Every day and night
I'm soldier of love
All the days of my life

I've been torn up inside (oh!)
I've been left behind (oh!)
So I ride
I have the will to survive

In the wild wild west,
Trying my hardest
Doing my best
To stay alive

I am love's soldier!

I wait for the sound
(oooh oohhh)

I know that love will come (that love will come)
Turn it all around

I'm a soldier of love (soldier of love)
Every day and night
http://www.directlyrics.com/sade-soldier-of-love-lyrics.html
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 08, 2011, 01:04:30 AM
The paramedics have testified that Murray told them he was trying to rehydrate Michael; that he was dehydrated. The autopsy report also says that Michael was dehydrated.

Dehydrated - suffering from excessive loss of water from the body
http://http://www.thefreedictionary.com/dehydrated

Dehydration
You may have heard that by the time you feel thirsty, you are already dehydrated. This statement is a little bit drastic, but holds some truth.
http://http://hubpages.com/hub/Dehyration

Okay so someone suffering from dehydration feels thirsty. Kind of obvious right.

But Michael  suffering and being thirsty may be symbolizing something else...

John 7:37-38
37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
http://http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=john%207:37-38&version=KJV

From The Last Seven Words of Christ on the Cross
John 19:28

THE FIFTH WORD

28 After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst.
http://http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=john%2019:28&version=KJV
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 08, 2011, 02:05:46 AM
Quote from: "Serenitys_Dream"
SMOKING GUN IN MICHAEL JACKSON'S DEATH - SADE ANDING

Smoking Gun - Something that serves as indisputable evidence or proof
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/smoking+gun

Sade means "Ray of Light"
http://www.behindthename.com/name/sa12de

Anding-  an administrative subdivision of the province of Gansu in China.
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anding

Gansu - a province located in the northwest of the People's Republic of China. It lies between the Tibetan and Huangtu plateaus, and borders Mongolia, Inner Mongolia, and Ningxia to the north, Xinjiang and Qinghai to the west, Sichuan to the south, and Shaanxi to the east. The Yellow River passes through the southern part of the province. The capital is Lanzhou, located in the southeast part of the province.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gansu

The Yellow River - is the second-longest river in China and the seventh longest in the world. Sometimes the Yellow River is poetically called the "Muddy Flow" . The Chinese idiom "when the Yellow River flows clear" is used to refer to an event that will never happen and is similar to the English expression "when pigs fly". Its Tibetan name is "River of the Peacock".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_River

Yesterday, in the thread about Murray's bow tie, a member suggested that the circles on the tie resembled those on a peacock feather.

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/comparepeacock.png)

I just wanted to add the symbolism of the peacock to this.

Peacock Symbolism
The peacock is a possessor of some of the most admired human characteristics, and is a symbol of integrity and the beauty we can achieve when we endeavor to show our true colors.

In history, myth, legend and lore, the Peacock symbolism carries portents of: Nobility, Holiness, Guidance, Protection and Watchfulness.

Here is a keyword quick-list of peacock symbolism:

    * Glory
    * Vision
   * Royalty
    * Spirituality
    * Awakening
    * Immortality

    * Refinement
    * Incorruptibility

In Greco-Roman mythology the Peacock is identified with Hera (Juno) who created the Peacock from Argus whose hundred eyes (seen on the tail feathers of the Peacock) symbolize the vault of heaven and the “eyes” of the stars.

In Hinduism the Peacock is associated with Lakshmi who is a deity representing benevolence, patience, kindness, compassion and good luck.

Similar to Lakshmi, the Peacock is associated with Kwan-yin in Asian spirituality. Kwan-yin (or Quan Yin) is also an emblem of love, compassionate watchfulness, good-will, nurturing, and kind-heartedness. Legend tells us she chose to remain a mortal even though she could be immortal because she wished to stay behind and aid humanity in their spiritual evolution.

In Babylonia and Persia the Peacock is seen as a guardian to royalty, and is often seen in engravings upon the thrones of royalty.

In Christianity the Peacock symbolism represents the “all-seeing” church, along with the holiness and sanctity associated with it. Additionally, the Peacock represents resurrection, renewal and immortality within the spiritual teachings of Christianity.

Themes of renewal are also linked to alchemical traditions to, as many schools of thought compare the resurrecting phoenix to the modern-day Peacock.
http://www.whats-your-sign.com/peacock-symbolism.html
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dancer on January 08, 2011, 02:39:55 PM
Thank you, Serenity!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on January 08, 2011, 06:58:48 PM
....And this is a "Smoking Gun" of religious symbolism related to Michael ;)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 09, 2011, 03:41:04 AM
I was looking at the Neverland Fire Department patches because of the ambulance picture thread and there is something interesting on that patch.
http://www.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/michael-jackson-neverland

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Neverland1.jpg)

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Pancp.jpg)

Pan (god)
Pan  in Greek religion and mythology, is the god of shepherds and flocks, of mountain wilds, hunting and rustic music, as well as the companion of the nymphs. His name originates within the Greek language, from the word paein, meaning "to pasture." He has the hindquarters, legs, and horns of a goat, in the same manner as a faun or satyr. With his homeland in rustic Arcadia, he is recognized as the god of fields, groves, and wooded glens; because of this, Pan is connected to fertility and the season of spring. The ancient Greeks also considered Pan to be the god of theatrical criticism.

One of the famous myths of Pan involves the origin of his pan flute, fashioned from lengths of hollow reed.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_%28god%29

Green Man
Represents such figures as Jesus, Osiris, Pan, Dionysus (also known as Bacchus), Robin Hood, and a modern version is Peter Pan who emerges from Neverland clothed in Green leaves.

Green man is a symbol of rebirth and resurrection.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Man

"We Are The World" remake
(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/phpLwiU9FPM.jpg)

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Bacchus.jpg)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on January 09, 2011, 09:56:56 AM
Serenitys_Dream as research all this?, need some classes :lol:
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 11, 2011, 03:29:03 PM
I was looking at TMZ today and they have a photo Gallery of items that were being auctioned by Julien's Auctions. Some of these photographs are jumping out at me.

http://http://photos.tmz.com/galleries/juliens_michael_jackson_auction#tab=most_recent&id=71665

Crowns

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/06/85970327_10_full.jpg)

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/06/85970394_10_full.jpg)

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/06/85951614_10_full.jpg)

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/06/85970156_10_full.jpg)

And Especially the sword in this one...

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/06/85970295_10_full.jpg)

Reminds me of this painting too.

(http://http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3581/3446038124_305064e2fe_o.jpg)

Darth Vader Light Saber (or Light Sword)

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/06/85970323_10_full.jpg)

Edward Scissor Hands (blades again)

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/06/85970120_10_full.jpg)

There is also the gold Fencing outfit.

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/06/85970390_10_full.jpg)

Fencing
The English term fencing, in the sense of "the action or art of using the sword scientifically"
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fencing

According to the Gospel of Barnabas, chapter 57, at the day of the judgment the Angel Michael will strike Satan 100000 times with the sword of God.
http://http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu100000.php

Look at the belt too, it has the fleur-de-lis on it.

(http://http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/06/85970216_10_full.jpg)

The fleur-de-lis

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Ql6WEmb-9jE/Sf3fyJq7nCI/AAAAAAAAAmM/HPH6G74LXC4/s400/ist2_1921743_fleur_de_lis_9_variations.jpg)

The fleur-de-lis (or fleur-de-lys) is a stylized lily or iris that is used as a decorative design or symbol. It may be "at one and the same time, political, dynastic, artistic, emblematic, and symbolic", especially in heraldry. By the 12th century the fleur-de-lis had become the heraldic emblem of the Capetian kings of France.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fleur-de-lis#Royal_symbol

The  fleur-de-lis was also on the gates of Neverland, Irises where mixed in with Lillies on the casket at the funeral, and Michael was holding Irises in the second "Liberian Girl" photo at the funeral. All of this was in my original post in this thread.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 11, 2011, 04:02:40 PM
Quote from: "Maja01"
I think I read that the fleur de lis is also a masonic symbol?

It is from this hieroglyph that the French "fleur de lis" [fig.16] traces its origin. The "fleur de lis" represents the Tree of Life.
The glyph which denotes the sacred knowledge associated with Hu is also formed by the three stems of the three sacred lotus lilies. The Osiris Crown can be similarly considered in these terms.
Following the role model of Osiris, in 1346 AD Edward the Black Prince won three feathers at Crecy which he adopted as his emblem. If the three feathers are gathered at the stems a 'fleur de lis' is created. [fig.17]

(http://www.freemasons-freemasonry.com/rosette15-17.jpg)

But Edward was not the first. Crusaders introduced lilies into European Christian art; because of its association with the Crusaders, the lily came to stand for chivalry, and the French nobility adopted the fleur-de-lis as its symbol. The motif was first used by King Philip I (1052-1108) of France in the 11th century. The 'Lilies' are said not to have appeared in the French arms until the time of Philip Augustus (1165-1223). In Christian symbolism, the fleur-de-lis is used as a symbol of the Holy Trinity and as an ensign of the Virgin Mary, mimicking the rose.
http://www.freemasons-freemasonry.com/masonic-apron-rosette.html
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on January 12, 2011, 02:59:21 AM
Serenity, you always blow me away. I especially like the swords and fencing theme--apocalyptic! That boy knows what he's doing, has always known.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 12, 2011, 06:45:29 PM
"Milk" - Propofol
It has been reported that Michael supposedly referred to Propofol as "Milk". Besides Propofol being white in colour and referred to as milk by medical professionals, could there be another reason?

The following bible passage speaks of how we are fed by God on spiritual milk, like babies, until we have matured enough to accept the "meat" of the message. This passage also addresses division amongst believers.
http://www.christnotes.org/commentary.php?b=46&c=3&com=wes

1 Corinthians 3:1-3
1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.

2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.

3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20corinthians%203:1-3&version=KJV

And what is Propofol? An anesthetic.
What was Michael supposedly using this anesthetic for? To go to sleep.

The following bible passage is referencing Resurrection.
http://biblecommenter.com/1_thessalonians/4-14.htm

1 Thessalonians 4:14
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Thessalonians%204:14&version=KJV
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Supervision on January 13, 2011, 12:30:42 AM
Quote
by Serenitys_Dream » Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:45 pm
"Milk" - Propofol
It has been reported that Michael supposedly referred to Propofol as "Milk".
Besides Propofol being white in colour and referred to as milk by medical professionals, could there be another reason?

The following bible passage speaks of how we are fed by God on spiritual milk, like babies
, until we have matured enough to accept the "meat" of the message.

O.k. I get it,based on the prosecutors and defense presentations of what happened to our Mike, and his alleged propofol intoxication/addiction  etc.,  and as all of us have heard by now, Mike as reported ,has  referred to propofol as his milk ,the same he reportedly referred to wine as “Jesus ‘s Juice”as also reported by Media in his 2005 trial.
.
Well, we could forget about the wine for a minute, but this milk euphemism of  propofol, that Mike supposedly used,  suddenly has got a new meaning/clue, as suggested by the post above. <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->

I suppose, we just need a very open mind to see it, is all..  <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->

I mean, I  could perhaps try to  see something in all this comparison of propofol with milk,by Mike,   especially, since Serenity has just very recently kindly advised me, to really open my mind and look for the real clues beneath the surface,  in all the media reports, ,
 and all that good stuff,in order for me to see the hoax.  <!-- s;) --> ;) <!-- s;) -->

So I am here trying to  do just that, and here is what comes to mind.

Our  Michael was so spiritual he had his spirituality administered to him by an incompetent DoC ..intravenously, directly  into his veins,  :?

 and if that act  by chance  failed to do the trick,   supposedly Mike  himself,  perhaps could  always reach into the Baby Essentials Bag ,and take a few sips of “ milky spirituality” into his stomach,mixed with his fave juice ?  <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->

Spirituality compared with propofol? <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->  <!-- s:shock: --> :shock: <!-- s:shock: -->  <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->


Hilarious comparison , about Mike’s nighty night “milk” and St. Paul allegory of a tender stage of spirituality of  the seeker of God, as told in NT of the Christian Bible IMO...

Chamone..
...way to go.
.Really!!  <!-- s:lol: --> :lol: <!-- s:lol: -->

This is what I call , really,thinking way out of the Box,
 Or is it way out of left field. ? <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->

But of course every one of us  are entitled to see things the way we wish to see them, or understand them.

And this is just my own take of this particular  matter. .

And it goes without saying, that I could be wrong of course, in my own humble understanding of Mike calling propofol his milk. <!-- s;) --> ;) <!-- s;) -->

He may have been talking about his spirituality or something else altogether different,every time Mike talked about propofol as  his milk . <!-- s:lol: --> :lol: <!-- s:lol: -->

Well, anyway,just thought I stop by this thread, and drop a few lines about my take of the matter,since when I read the post LOL, it really did make me laugh.
 Honestly..
Thanks for the belly laugh. <!-- s;) --> ;) <!-- s;) -->
Peace.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 14, 2011, 08:28:27 PM
@Supervision

But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic. Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back. Do to others as you would have them do to you.
~ Luke 6:27-31
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dancer on January 14, 2011, 09:32:22 PM
Quote from: "MJonmind"
Serenity, you always blow me away. I especially like the swords and fencing theme--apocalyptic! That boy knows what he's doing, has always known.
Agree.
Thank you for your great research, Serenity.  :)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Supervision on January 15, 2011, 10:48:01 PM
Quote
Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
 by Serenitys_Dream » Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:28 pm
@Supervision

But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic. Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back. Do to others as you would have them do to you.
~ Luke 6:27-31

A good Christian quote, I so do believe,  though most  inappropriate under the circumstances? <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->

 LOL, I mean what is with the enemy talk here ?
Who really is the enemy in this,our story? <!-- s:?: --> :?: <!-- s:?: -->  <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->

Well, to me, it really is quite easy to see who is the real enemy here in our story. Why,in this here , our story, it  is more than likely  none other than the  "Milky Spiritual Substance" itself,  which may have finally  killed our Mike, <!-- s:cry: --> :cry: <!-- s:cry: -->

or is it that, the "famous"  "milky" substance"... may actually have  contributed and/or added  to Mike's Spiritual standing,as suggested by the previous post,  and thereby,  and ultimately  made KOP Michael, an utter Saint or even as great as a bona fide Messiah in his own right  LOL.? <!-- s;) --> ;) <!-- s;) -->
Peace.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 15, 2011, 11:54:51 PM
Quote from: "Supervision"
Quote
Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
 by Serenitys_Dream » Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:28 pm
@Supervision

But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic. Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back. Do to others as you would have them do to you.
~ Luke 6:27-31

A good Christian quote, I so do believe,  though most  inappropriate under the circumstances? :?

My post is in response to your sarcastic/ironic posts and has nothing to do with propofol, religion or Michael and is therefore quite appropriate.

Sarcasm - A sharp, bitter, or cutting expression or remark; a bitter jibe or taunt. Sarcasm has been identified as a possible bullying action. In sarcasm, ridicule or mockery is used harshly, often crudely and contemptuously, for destructive purposes. It may be used in an indirect manner, and have the form of irony, as in “What a fine musician you turned out to be!” or it may be used in the form of a direct statement, “You couldn't play one piece correctly if you had two assistants.” Hostile, critical comments may be expressed in an ironic way, such as saying "don't work too hard" to a lazy worker. The use of irony introduces an element of humour which may make the criticism seem more polite and less aggressive.

Please stop hijacking this thread with all this negativity.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Supervision on January 16, 2011, 01:11:22 AM
Quote
Serenity wrote:
Please stop hijacking this thread with all this negativity.


Beg your pardon,but... No one is hijacking this thread at all as far as I can see anyway? <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? --> .

 This thread too, though , you have started it, I believe is still a part of the forum, and I have every right to post my views here,just as well as  you post in the thread Visions from Michael, for instance,  which,as you well  know I myself started, just like as you did this one.


But,be that as it may be, as return request of my own to you,
 please stop saying that I am your Enemy,,
 as you so plainly were obviously  saying with your post of the “turn the other cheek” quote.  :?
 
To tell you the truth, when I first read your post, the comparison you were making of propofol and the milk stage of spirituality ala St.Paul in NT , was really something I found quite hilarious,.

.and yes, I  posted my reply here, as I  really had  wanted you perhaps  see, the humor in it as well.  <!-- s;) --> ;) <!-- s;) -->


So, If you failed to see the humor in it,just quite as I did,  then ,I am sure, my own attempt to do so,  does not make me your enemy.


And yes, without  a doubt, your post has most definitely to do with Mike and propofol,

I mean the whole thing about your post  was,   you actually were trying to compare St.Paul’ s reference to milk,as in a young stage in  a spiritual journey of the believer, with that of Mike’s euphemistic label of propofol as milk. <!-- s;) --> ;) <!-- s;) -->

I am sure, that, I do not have to tell you, that if You post your views  on this public forum, I am sure you can expect a reply from other posters,  even if you do not agree with their reply post, or even perhaps won't  like the contents of their  post either.

 This is still  an open forum as far as I know. <!-- s:?: --> :?: <!-- s:?: -->  <!-- s:? --> :? <!-- s:? -->
 

So pls. stop ordering people around about what they should do and not do,  and especially calling people your enemy without a cause, such as you are calling me here in your post once  again.

Really, I am sorry to see, that you couldn’t recognize the humor in your own comparison of propofol with that of spirituality,ala St.Paul,LOL <!-- s:lol: --> :lol: <!-- s:lol: -->


IMO, if one wishes not to incite humor , one should perhaps  not tell funny stories. <!-- s;) --> ;) <!-- s;) -->
 And yes ,your post was extremely hilarious to me personally anyway LOL. <!-- s:lol: --> :lol: <!-- s:lol: -->

Peace.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on January 16, 2011, 02:31:14 AM
SD, I just want to comment on the Jackson family crest on the Neverland gates. You've said it is similar to the British Royal Family Crest.

Quote
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jackson is a common surname of English and Scottish origin. It literally means "son of Jack". In 1980 Jackson was the 24th most popular surname in England and Wales.[3] In the 1990 United States Census, Jackson was the thirteenth most frequently reported surname, accounting for 0.3% of the population.[4]

Quote
<!-- m -->http://www.towncalleddobson.com/?p=1111<!-- m -->
Black History: Slave Names
By stormbear, on April 7th, 2008

The vast majority of African-Americans in the United States were enslaved prior to the ratification of the Thirteenth Amendment to the US Constitution. During enslavement, slaves’ names were assigned by their owners. Others received a name based on what kind of work they were forced to do. Some African-Americans have last names such as Cotton, reflecting when they were made to pick cotton as slaves.

After emancipation, many freedmen and -women took the surnames of their former owners as their own. Some blacks in the U.S. took on the surname Freeman, while others adopted the names of popular historical or contemporary figures of social importance, such as former presidents Washington, Jefferson, and Jackson.
A number of African-Americans and Jamaican Americans have changed their names out of the belief that the names they were given at birth were “slave names.” An individual’s name change often coincides with a religious conversion (Muhammad Ali and Louis Farrakhan, for example) or involvement with the black nationalist movement (e.g., Amiri Baraka and Assata Shakur).

Some organizations encourage African-Americans to abandon their “slave names.” The Nation of Islam is perhaps the best-known of them. In his book, Message to the Blackman in America, Nation of Islam leader Elijah Muhammad writes often of “slave names.” Some of his comments include:

“You must remember that slave-names will keep you a slave in the eyes of the civilized world today. You have seen, and recently, that Africa and Asia will not honor you or give you any respect as long as you are called by the white man’s name.”
“You are still called by your slave-masters’ names. By rights, by international rights, you belong to the white man of America. He knows that. You have never gotten out of the shackles of slavery. You are still in them.”
Other organizations, such as the Black nationalist US Organization also advocate for African-Americans to change their “slave names.”

Nevertheless, the overwhelming majority of African-Americans bear “slave names.”
I believe that was the enemy's concerted attempt to wipe out all recognition of who they were as a people. The Hebrew Israelites of the Old Testament. Could it be that there is some irony found in this crest. That Michael might be saying, though slavemasters sought to wipe our history and names from our knowledge, God can bypass all of that and give the true royalty their crest? He is saying he is the true descendant of David, not the British crown. Remember Michael's deep respect and sympathy for Princess Diana, caught in that whole affair of producing an heir. (True and counterfeit lines running parallel, leading to the ultimate joust.) JMO
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 20, 2011, 09:37:49 PM
Quote from: MJonmind
SD, I just want to comment on the Jackson family crest on the Neverland gates. You've said it is similar to the British Royal Family Crest.

Quote
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jackson is a common surname of English and Scottish origin. It literally means "son of Jack". In 1980 Jackson was the 24th most popular surname in England and Wales. In the 1990 United States Census, Jackson was the thirteenth most frequently reported surname, accounting for 0.3% of the population.

Quote
<!-- m -->http://www.towncalleddobson.com/?p=1111<!-- m -->
Black History: Slave Names
By stormbear, on April 7th, 2008

The vast majority of African-Americans in the United States were enslaved prior to the ratification of the Thirteenth Amendment to the US Constitution. During enslavement, slaves’ names were assigned by their owners. Others received a name based on what kind of work they were forced to do. Some African-Americans have last names such as Cotton, reflecting when they were made to pick cotton as slaves.

After emancipation, many freedmen and -women took the surnames of their former owners as their own. Some blacks in the U.S. took on the surname Freeman, while others adopted the names of popular historical or contemporary figures of social importance, such as former presidents Washington, Jefferson, and Jackson.
A number of African-Americans and Jamaican Americans have changed their names out of the belief that the names they were given at birth were “slave names.” An individual’s name change often coincides with a religious conversion (Muhammad Ali and Louis Farrakhan, for example) or involvement with the black nationalist movement (e.g., Amiri Baraka and Assata Shakur).

Some organizations encourage African-Americans to abandon their “slave names.” The Nation of Islam is perhaps the best-known of them. In his book, Message to the Blackman in America, Nation of Islam leader Elijah Muhammad writes often of “slave names.” Some of his comments include:

“You must remember that slave-names will keep you a slave in the eyes of the civilized world today. You have seen, and recently, that Africa and Asia will not honor you or give you any respect as long as you are called by the white man’s name.”
“You are still called by your slave-masters’ names. By rights, by international rights, you belong to the white man of America. He knows that. You have never gotten out of the shackles of slavery. You are still in them.”
Other organizations, such as the Black nationalist US Organization also advocate for African-Americans to change their “slave names.”

Nevertheless, the overwhelming majority of African-Americans bear “slave names.”
I believe that was the enemy's concerted attempt to wipe out all recognition of who they were as a people. The Hebrew Israelites of the Old Testament. Could it be that there is some irony found in this crest. That Michael might be saying, though slavemasters sought to wipe our history and names from our knowledge, God can bypass all of that and give the true royalty their crest? He is saying he is the true descendant of David, not the British crown. Remember Michael's deep respect and sympathy for Princess Diana, caught in that whole affair of producing an heir. (True and counterfeit lines running parallel, leading to the ultimate joust.) JMO
MJonmind
If you look at the Jackson family, tree on Joe's side of the family, you see where the name "Jackson" originates.

The name "Jackson" is a a patronym, or patronymic, is a component of a personal name based on the name of one's father, grandfather or an even earlier male ancestor.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patronymic

"Jackson "literally means "Son of Jack"

(http://http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/download/file.php?id=10158)

Great Great Grandfather - Native American - "Jack" July Gale (Here is where it comes from)
Great Great Grandmother - Slave - Gina - (No last name)
Great Grandfather - Unknown (I don't know why there is no information here)
Great Grandmother - Mattie Daniel

Great Grandfather - "Nero" Israel Jackson - (The first time Jackson appears as a last name)
Great Grandmother - Emmaline Williams
Great Grandfather - Unknown
Great Grandmother - Unknown

Grandfather - Samuel Jackson
Grandmother - Crystal Lee King

Father - Joe Jackson
Mother - Katherine Scruse

Michael Jackson

Jack
Gender: Masculine
Usage: English
Derived from Jackin (earlier Jankin), a medieval diminutive of JOHN. It has long been regarded as an independent name. During the Middle Ages it was very common, and it became a slang word meaning "man".
http://http://www.behindthename.com/name/jack

John
Gender: Masculine
Usage: English, Biblical
English form of Iohannes, the Latin form of the Greek name Ioannes, itself derived from the Hebrew name Yochanan meaning "YAHWEH is gracious" or "God is gracious". This name owes its popularity to two New Testament characters, both highly revered saints. The first was John the Baptist, a Jewish ascetic who was considered the forerunner of Jesus Christ. The second was the apostle John, who was also traditionally regarded as the author of the fourth Gospel and Revelation.
http://http://www.behindthename.com/name/john
http://http://babynamesworld.parentsconnect.com/meaning_of_Jack.html

Jack
In English it is commonly used as the diminutive form of the name Jacob, though it is also often given as a proper name in its own right.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_%28name%29

Jacob
Gender: Masculine
Usage: English, Dutch, Scandinavian, Biblical
From the Latin Iacobus, which was from the Greek Iakobos, which was from the Hebrew name Ya'aqov. In the Old Testament, Jacob (later called Israel) was the son of Isaac and Rebecca and the father of the twelve founders of the twelve tribes of Israel. He was born holding his twin brother Esau's heel, and his name is explained as meaning "holder of the heel" or "supplanter". Other theories claim that it is in fact derived from a hypothetical name like Ya'aqov'el meaning "may God protect".

The English names Jacob and James derive from the same source, with James coming from Latin Iacomus, a later variant of Iacobus. Unlike English, many languages do not have separate spellings for the two names.

In England, Jacob was mainly regarded as a Jewish name during the Middle Ages, though the variant James was used among Christians. Jacob came into general use as a Christian name after the Protestant Reformation.
http://http://www.behindthename.com/name/jacob
http://http://babynamesworld.parentsconnect.com/meaning_of_Jacob.html

James
Gender: Masculine
Usage:English, Biblical
English form of the Late Latin name Iacomus which was derived from Iakobos, the New Testament Greek form of the Hebrew name Ya'aqov (see JACOB). This was the name of two apostles in the New Testament. The first was Saint James the Greater, the apostle John's brother, who was beheaded under Herod Agrippa in the Book of Acts. The second was James the Lesser, son of Alphaeus. Another James (known as James the Just) is also mentioned in the Bible as being the brother of Jesus.
http://http://www.behindthename.com/name/james
http://http://babynamesworld.parentsconnect.com/meaning_of_James.html

Michael's Crest, from the gates of Neverland, compared to Jackson Family Crests.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/JacksonCrestsCompare.jpg)

It isn't the Jackson Family Crest.

Michael's Crest, from the gates of Neverland, compared to the current Royal Family's Crest.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/JacksonCrestsCompare2.jpg)

They look very similar but there are significant differences too.
I can look at that if you would like, just let me know.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Supervision on January 21, 2011, 02:48:22 AM
Quote
by Serenitys_Dream » Thu Jan 20, 2011 9:37 pm

They look very similar but there are significant differences too.
I can look at that if you would like, just let me know.

Sorry to interrupt, but Serenity , if you have the time to spare, to do  a comparison , it would probably be very helpful,for future discussions about this angle/question etc. , since  I myself also  have been planning as you prob. read, to post about this very question.  ;)
My post keeps getting delayed,sorry, but I try to put it up  soon, at Visions from Michael as promised.
 My post or your comparison, if you do it.
Which ever one  comes first, I suppose,depending on your time.
I myself have had no time to spare for such a look into. ;)  .
but , I believe , it  would be good , if you can do it though?
Peace..
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 22, 2011, 08:12:24 AM
here is where you have missed somthing very important.The Bible says our King will be born of a virgin. Ok I'll break it down first AD stands for after death so its symbolic to say he is virgo. Or to put it, born unto a virgin. There is much more missing here there is an incredable link between most of these theories . I'v been working 25 years on this incredable "almost instinct" of joyous feelings, Michael is the light that guides us. If I can ever figure out how to post.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 22, 2011, 12:37:35 PM
Quote from: "Gewniveve"
here is where you have missed somthing very important.The Bible says our King will be born of a virgin. Ok I'll break it down first AD stands for after death so its symbolic to say he is virgo. Or to put it, born unto a virgin. There is much more missing here there is an incredable link between most of these theories . I'v been working 25 years on this incredable "almost instinct" of joyous feelings, Michael is the light that guides us. If I can ever figure out how to post.
Why send this to me in a PM and post it here?

I didn't miss that part at all. :D
I have already mentioned the Zodiac in this and several threads on the forum.
If you have something to share then do so.
If you have been studying this for 25 years then what have you discovered?
Your post hasn't actually hasn't added anything to this investigation or discussion.
I do look forward to a further elaboration, from you, if you are so inclined.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 23, 2011, 11:42:26 AM
food for thought
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 23, 2011, 11:45:46 AM
Gary Indiana birthplace of MJJ
Gary means;
A spear carrier is a nickname for a minor acting part. It generally pertains to a character that appears in several scenes, but mostly in the background.
The ancient greek term for spear carrier  to carry) originally meant a soldier armed with a spear acting as a bodyguard or ceremonial guard to noblemen. The modern meaning has its roots in classical Greek tragedy; as plays such as Antigone and Oedipus the King concerned the tragic fate of nobles, several nondescript soldiers or guards were required to appear in the background, and the term was used to describe the guards who just escorted the main characters.
The 1968 Nebula Award-winning novel Rite of Passage, by Alexei Panshin, mentions the protagonist's observations of the role of spear carriers in real life:
"A spear carrier is somebody who stands in the hall when Caesar passes, comes to attention and thumps his spear. A spear carrier is the anonymous character cut down by the hero as he advances to save the menaced heroine. A spear carrier is a character put in a story to be used like a piece of disposable tissue. In a story, spear carriers never suddenly assert themselves by throwing their spears aside and saying, ‘I resign. I don’t want to be used.’ They are there to be used, either for atmosphere or as minor obstacles in the path of the hero. The trouble is that each of us is his own hero, existing in a world of spear carriers. We take no joy in being used and discarded. I was finding then, that wet, chilly, unhappy night, that I took no joy in seeing other people used and discarded.

Neverland Valley Ranch (formerly the Sycamore Valley Ranch) is a developed property in Santa Barbara County, California, most famous for being a home of American entertainer Michael Jackson from 1988 to 2005. Jackson named the property after Neverland, the fantasy island in the story of Peter Pan, a boy who never grows up. The ranch is located about five miles (8 km) north of unincorporated Los Olivos, and about eight miles (13 km) north of the town of Santa Ynez. The Santa Barbara County Assessor's office says the ranch is approximately 3000 acres

The Mount of Olives (also Mount Olivet, is a mountain ridge in eastern Jerusalem with three peaks running from north to south. The highest, at-Tur, rises to 818 meters (2,683 ft). It is named for the olive groves that covers its slopes. The Mount of Olives is associated with Jewish and Christian traditions. The mount has been used as a Jewish cemetery for over 3,000 years and holds approximately 150,000 graves
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 23, 2011, 01:16:13 PM
Has the simalaritys between Thome Thome selling MJJ for 50 and Judas selling Jesus for 30 yet?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 23, 2011, 01:22:22 PM
Luke 11:29


Psalm 150 Praise the lord with music read it backwards

Cymbals loud with him Praise
flutes and insterments stringed with him praise
dancing and tambourines with him praise
lyres and harps with him praise
blasts trumpets with him praise
greatness his for him praise
strength his for him praise
heaven mighty his in him praise
temple his in God  praise
Lord the praise
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 23, 2011, 02:43:16 PM
:o  :shock: .
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 23, 2011, 02:44:04 PM
lyre
noun
a stringed instrument like a small U-shaped harp with strings fixed to a crossbar, used esp. in ancient Greece. Modern instruments of this type are found mainly in East Africa.
lyre
ORIGIN Middle English : via Old French lire and Latin lyra from Greek lura.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 23, 2011, 03:09:31 PM
notice that a stinged insterments are said 3 times what dose the Bible say about number 3 and the harp on his family crest
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 23, 2011, 03:33:50 PM
he passed at 50. 50+50+50=150. Psalm 150. numbers three say in short proof come in threes
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Gewniveve on January 23, 2011, 03:45:47 PM
Quote from: "Gewniveve"
Luke 11:29


Psalm 150 Praise the lord with music read it backwards
Lord the praise
lord the praise breaths that everything let cymbals crashing with him praise
Cymbals loud with him Praise
flutes and insterments stringed with him praise
dancing and tambourines with him praise
lyres and harps with him praise
blasts trumpets with him praise
greatness his for him praise
strength his for him praise
heaven mighty his in him praise
temple his in God  praise
Lord the praise
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on January 24, 2011, 01:05:31 AM
I was making videos recently and I always end my videos with this familiar crown that is connected to the movie "This Is It". I noticed something about it that hasn't been mentioned before (to my knowledge anyway). As we all have seen, many of the clues in this adventure have been multi-layered and this one may be too.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/believe.png)

Believe is written "beL I Eve"

It has been theorized that this is suggesting:
1. For us to believe
2. That we have been believing a lie
3. That to believe Michael is dead is a lie
4. etc.

All of these may be very true and that is very likely part of this message but there is something else.

Bel
Bel , signifying "lord" or "master", is a title rather than a genuine name, applied to various gods in Babylonian religion. Bel is represented in Greek as Belos and in Latin as Belus.

W. H. D. Rouse in 1940 wrote an ironic end note to Book 40 of his edition of Nonnus' Dionysiaca about a very syncretistic hymn sung by Dionysus to Tyrian Heracles, that is, to Ba‘al Melqart whom Dionysus identifies with Belus on the Euphrates and as a sun god:

    ... the Greeks were as firmly convinced as many modern Bible-readers that the Semites, or the Orientals generally, worshipped a god called Baal or Bel, the truth of course being that ba'al is a Semitic word for lord or master, and so applies to a multitude of gods. This "Bel," then, being an important deity, must be the sun, the more so as some of the gods bearing that title may have been really solar.

Bel is named in the Bible at Isaiah 46:1 and Jeremiah 50:2 and 51:4 (I am assuming this in Hebrew)
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bel_%28god%29

I
"I" can of course be just represent "I" as me, the singular person.

Goddess I
Goddess I is the Schellhas-Zimmermann-Taube letter designation for one of the most important Maya deities: a youthful woman to whom considerable parts of the post-Classic codices are dedicated, and who equally figures in Classic Period scenes. Based on her representation in codical almanacs, she is considered to represent vital functions of the fertile woman, and to preside over eroticism, human procreation, and marriage. Her aged form is associated with weaving. While being terrestrial herself, goddess I has a celestial counterpart in the Maya moon goddess. In important respects, she corresponds to Xochiquetzal among the Aztecs.

She is chiefly represented in the following ways:
* Carrying a bird on the shoulders
* Carrying a deity or a symbol in a carrying-strap on her back
* Holding a deity as a child on her lap
* Seated opposite another deity or animal
* Seated on the lap of another deity
Goddess I can be depicted with the maize child in a carrying-strap on her back. Her main functions seem largely to coincide with those of the Moon. In contemporary Maya religion generally, goddess I may possibly go under the cloak of the Virgin Mary, in the latter's various aspects and local manifestations, such as that of "guardian and embracer of the maize".
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goddess_I

Some of this sounds familiar as it is also how Isis and the Virgin Mary are depicted.

Isis
Isis is the goddess of motherhood, magic and fertility. Isis is also known as protector of the dead and goddess of children from whom all beginnings arose. Isis was likewise considered the goddess of rebirth and reincarnation, and as a protector of the dead.
Originally Isis was pictured as a woman wearing a long sheath dress and crowned with the hieroglyphic sign for a throne.
After she assimilated many of the roles of Hathor, Isis's headdress is replaced with that of Hathor: the horns of a cow on her head, with the solar disk between them. Sometimes she also was represented as a cow, or a cow's head.
Usually, Isis was depicted with her young child, Horus (the pharaoh), with a crown, and a vulture.
Sometimes she was depicted as holding a lotus, or, as a Sycamore tree.
Occasionally she was represented as a kite flying above the body of Osiris or with the dead Osiris across her lap as she worked her magic to bring him back to life.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isis#Depictions

Xochiquetzal
In Aztec mythology, Xochiquetzal  was a goddess associated with concepts of fertility, beauty, and female sexual power, serving as a protector of young mothers and a patroness of pregnancy, childbirth, and the crafts practised by women such as weaving and embroidery. Unlike several other figures in the complex of Aztec female earth deities connected with agricultural and sexual fecundity, Xochiquetzal is always depicted as an alluring and youthful woman, richly attired and symbolically associated with vegetation and in particular flowers. By connotation, Xochiquetzal is also representative of human desire, pleasure, and excess, appearing also as patroness of prostitutes and artisans involved in the manufacture of luxury items.
She was followed by a retinue consisting of birds and butterflies.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xochiquetzal

Eve
1. In the Bible the first woman and the wife of Adam
2. The evening or day preceding a special day, such as a holiday.
3. The period immediately preceding a certain event: the eve of war.
4. Evening.
http://http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Eve

The name Eve is taken from the Hebrew word, HAWAH, a verb which means "to live." "The man called his wife Eve, because she became the mother of all the living."(Gen. 3:20) Eve, the first woman, was a virgin at the time that she was tempted by the serpent in the garden. Thus, Eve, a virgin, conceived disobedience and death, whereas, Mary, a virgin, conceived the Word in obedience and brought forth Life. Jesus Christ is the New Adam, the Lord of the New Creation ( I Cor. 15:45-49 ) and Mary the New Eve who undid what the first Eve had done. The first Eve disobeyed God and thereby brought sin and death into the world. The New Eve, Mary, obeyed and believed God's message which was given to her at the Annunciation ( Lk .1 :26-38 ), and brought salvation and life to the world in her son.
http://http://campus.udayton.edu/mary//meditations/neweve.html

Hawah
Hebrew: To live.
Arabic: Love; The breath of life.
http://http://www.mybaby.net.au/baby-name-full-detail/hawah/53616/1

As I said, I think that there are many layers to everything in all of this but it is possible that "beL I Eve" could mean:

Lord I Live

or something along those lines and let's not forget that crown.  <!-- s:D --> :D <!-- s:D -->
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on January 24, 2011, 03:46:19 AM
[attachment=2:pv9sqilj]<!-- ia2 -->neverland.jpg<!-- ia2 -->[/attachment:pv9sqilj]
I don't know if anyone did a discussion on Neverland Ranch vicinity and meanings. So here's a start.
Originally it was called Sycamore Valley Ranch. (The following are all from Wiki)

Quote
At Jericho, Zacchaeus climbed a sycamore-tree to see Jesus as he passed by (Luke 19:4).

The ancient Egyptians cultivated this species "almost exclusively", according to Zohary and Hopf. Remains of F. sycomorus begin to appear in predynastic levels and in quantity from the start of the third millennium BC. It was the ancient Egyptian Tree of Life.[1] Zohary and Hopf note that "the fruit and the timber, and sometimes even the twigs, are richly represented in the tombs of Early, Middle and Late Kingdoms. In numerous cases the parched sycons bear characteristic gashing marks indicating that this art, which induces ripening, was practice in Egypt in ancient times."[2] Although this species of fig requires the presence of the symbiotic wasp Ceratosolen arabicus to reproduce sexually, and this insect is extinct in Egypt, Zohay and Hopf have no doubt that Egypt was "the principal area of sycamore fig development." Some of the caskets of mummies in Egypt are made from the wood of this tree.
King Solomon made cedar wood as common as sycamore trees during his reign given the value of cedar wood. (1 Kings 10:27).In the Mishnah, in chapter 9 of tractate Shevi'it of order Zera'im, the borders of the various districts of the Land of Israel are delineated. The Upper Galillee is defined as the area north of Kfar Hananya where the sycamore does not grow; the Lower Galillee is the area south of Kfar Hananya where the sycamore does grow.
Los Olivos
There had originally been a huge Olive orchard there planted by the Hayne brothers, but now they are gone. Jesus ascended into heaven from the Mount of Olives, and will return there.
Quote
http://ldolphin.org/Sadvent.html
Jesus of Nazareth was seen by his disciples and by groups as large as 500 persons (1 Cor. 15:6) during the 40 days between his resurrection from the dead and his ascension to the "right hand of the Majesty on High." Then instructing his disciples to wait for the promised arrival of the Holy Spirit, he departed this earth from the summit of the Mount of Olives, just East of the Temple Mount in Jerusalem. …
Two men [angels] stood by them in white robes, and said, 'Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven.' Then they returned to Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is near Jerusalem, a sabbath day's journey away. (Acts 1:4-12)…
A number of passages in the Bible describe the glorious second coming of the Messiah Jesus to save our beleaguered planet from total destruction, and to set up his kingdom on earth. Zechariah tells us that the place of Jesus' return to earth will not be Zion,… but the Mount of Olives in Jerusalem, Israel.
Santa Ynez (Saint Agnes)
Quote
Agnes of Rome (c. 291 – c. 304) is a virgin–martyr, venerated as a saint in the Roman Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox Church, and the Anglican Communion. She is one of seven women, excluding the Blessed Virgin, commemorated by name in the Canon of the Mass. She is the patron saint of chastity, gardeners, girls, engaged couples, rape victims, and virgins.
She is also known as Saint Agnes and Saint Ines. Her memorial, which commemorates her martyrdom, is 21 January in both the Roman Catholic calendar of saints and in the General Roman Calendar of 1962. The 1962 calendar includes a second feast on 28 January,[1] which commemorates her birthday. Agnes is depicted in art with a lamb, as her name resembles the Latin word for "lamb", agnus. The name "Agnes" is actually derived from the feminine Greek adjective "hagnē" (ἁγνή) meaning "chaste, pure, sacred".

A statue of Saint Agnes in a parish dedicated to her in Camarin, Caloocan City, Philippines. The parish is under the Roman Catholic Diocese of Novaliches.
According to tradition, Saint Agnes was a member of the Roman nobility born c. 291 and raised in a Christian family. She suffered martyrdom at the age of twelve[2] or thirteen during the reign of the Roman Emperor Diocletian, on 21 January 304.
The Prefect Sempronius wished Agnes to marry his son, and on Agnes' refusal he condemned her to death. As Roman law did not permit the execution of virgins, Sempronius had a naked Agnes dragged through the streets to a brothel. Various versions of the legend give different methods of escape from this predicament. In one, as she prayed, her hair grew and covered her body. It was also said that all of the men who attempted to rape her were immediately struck blind. In another the son of the prefect is struck dead, but revived after Agnes prayed for him, causing her release. There is then a trial from which Sempronius excuses himself, and another figure presides, sentencing her to death. When led out to die she was tied to a stake, but the bundle of wood would not burn, or the flames parted away from her, whereupon the officer in charge of the troops drew his sword and beheaded her, or, in some other texts, stabbed her in the throat. It is also said that the blood of Agnes poured to the stadium floor where other Christians soaked up the blood with cloths.
A few days after Agnes' death, her foster-sister, Saint Emerentiana was found praying by her tomb; she claimed to be the daughter of Agnes' wet nurse, and was stoned to death after refusing to leave the place and reprimanding the pagans for killing her foster sister. Emerentiana was also later canonized. The daughter of Constantine I, Saint Constance, was also said to have been cured of leprosy after praying at Agnes' tomb. Emerentiana and Constance appear in the scenes from the life of Agnes on the 14th-century Royal Gold Cup in the British Museum.
Agnes' bones are conserved beneath the high altar in the church of Sant'Agnese fuori le mura in Rome, built over the catacomb that housed Agnes' tomb. Her skull is preserved in a separate chapel in the church of Sant'Agnese in Agone in Rome's Piazza Navona.
An early account of Agnes' death, stressing her steadfastness and virginity, but not the legendary features of the tradition, is given by Saint Ambrose.[2]
[edit] In popular cultureSanta Inês (Saint Agnes)
by Francisco de Zurbarán.
An interesting custom is observed on her feast day. Two lambs are brought from the Trappist abbey of Tre Fontane in Rome to the Pope to be blessed. On Holy Thursday they are shorn, and from the wool is woven the pallium which the pope gives to a newly consecrated metropolitan archbishop as a sign of his jurisdiction and his union with the pope.
Saint Agnes is the patron saint of young girls. Folk custom called for them to practice rituals on Saint Agnes' Eve (20–21 January) with a view to discovering their future husbands. This superstition has been immortalized in John Keats's poem, "The Eve of Saint Agnes".
She is represented in art as a young girl in robes, holding a palm branch in her hand and a lamb at her feet or in her arms.
In the historical novel Fabiola or, the Church of the Catacombs, written by Cardinal Nicholas Wiseman in 1854, Agnes is the soft-spoken teenage cousin and confidant of the protagonist, the beautiful noblewoman Fabiola.
She is sometimes misconstrued to be the St Agnes referred to in the Christmas carol "Good King Wenceslas"; as the peasant who Wenceslas sees, lives, "Right against the forest fence, by Saint Agnes' fountain." The saint being referred to is actually St. Agnes of Bohemia.
Hrotsvitha, the tenth-century nun and poetess, wrote a play the subject of which was St. Agnes. Grace Andreacchi wrote a play based on the legends surrounding the martyrdom of St. Agnes.
[attachment=1:pv9sqilj]<!-- ia1 -->Saint Agnes.jpg<!-- ia1 -->[/attachment:pv9sqilj]
Notice the crown being placed on her head by a cherub (look familiar?), and the lamb at her feet.
Solvang
Quote
Solvang (Danish for "sunny fields"[1])
Sunflowers?
Ballard
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Ballard is an unincorporated town in California, with a population of less than 1,000. The town of Ballard is one of the communities that make up the Santa Ynez Valley. The nearest city is Solvang. The ZIP Code is 93463, and the community is inside area code 805.
Ballard was founded in 1880 at the location of a Wells Fargo stage line station, being named after the proprietor. In 1882 it was believed that Ballard would grow into the central metropolis of Santa Barbara County. The first school, Ballard's Little Red School House, was built in 1882 and is still in operation today, being the primary tourist attraction in what turned out to be a tiny village, bypassed as a city.
Today, Ballard is a combination of sleepy village and upscale bedroom community. Noted for its excellent elementary school, it is a prized residential area. The surrounding area is noted for its thriving and well-respected wine industry. The wine producing region around Ballard was featured in the Academy Award nominated film Sideways. A world-renowned equine hospital is located nearby. The only commercial establishment currently operating in the main village is The Ballard Inn, a four star restaurant and bed and breakfast inn in the heart of the village.
[attachment=0:pv9sqilj]<!-- ia0 -->ballard[1].jpg<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment:pv9sqilj]
I thought the schoolhouse was interesting, because in the movie Megamind, the character Megaman who portrayed Elvis was found to be hiding since his supposed death in a vast underground lair under the little red schoolhouse!! While Megamind or MJ's hideout was an Observatory--remember the Mirror Man (man in the mirror) walking around in front of the Observatory in LA?
Los Markos Pass
Was a stagecoach route. Remember that when MJ and Paul McCartney were shooting the film for Say, Say, Say, they stayed at the Sycamore Ranch and MJ liked it so much he decided to buy it.
On the disciple and writer Mark in the New Testament.
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Much confusion happened due to the mixing up of Mark the Evangelist with John Mark and Mark the Cousin of Barnabas. The mixing up of the three as one led to the downgrading of the character of Barnabas from truly a "Son of Comfort" to one who favored his blood relative over principles.[12] It was to the house of Mary the mother of John Mark that Peter returned on his release from prison; the house was a meeting-place for the brethren, "many" of whom were praying there on the night of Peter's release.(Acts 12:12-17).[13] Evidence for Mark the Evangelist's authorship of the Gospel that bears his name originates with Papias.[14][15]

 The martyrdom of Saint Mark. Très Riches Heures du duc de Berry (Musée Condé, Chantilly).The mixing up of Mark the Evangelist with John Mark led to these speculations: one identifying him as the man who carried water to the house where the Last Supper took place (Mark 14:13).[16]; another identifies him as the young man who ran away naked when Jesus was arrested (Mark 14:51-52).[17] Some of these could be true for John Mark, since his home was the Upper Room, but they are not likely related to Mark the Evangelist.

The Coptic Church holds the tradition that Mark the Evangelist was one of the Seventy Apostles sent out by Christ (Luke 10:1), as is confirmed by the list of Hippolytus [18]. However, the Coptic Church adopted the tradition of confusing Mark the Evangelist with John Mark. It believes that Mark the Evangelist is the one who hosted the disciples in his house after the death of Jesus, into whose house the resurrected Jesus Christ came (John 20), and into whose house the Holy Spirit descended on the disciples at Pentecost.[18].

Mark is also believed to be one of the servants at the Marriage at Cana who poured out the water that Jesus turned to wine (John 2:1-11),[18] These traditions have not solid proof either from the New Testament or from Church history.

According to the Coptic church, Saint Mark was born in Cyrene city in the Pentapolis of North Africa , Libya now . This tradition adds that he returned to Pentapolis later in life, after being sent by Saint Paul to Colossae (Colossians 4:10; Philemon 24; these actually refer to Mark the Cousin of Barnabas), and serving with him in Rome (2 Tim 4:11); from Pentapolis he made his way to Alexandria.[19] When Mark returned to Alexandria, the pagans of the city resented his efforts to turn the Alexandrians away from the worship of their traditional Hellenistic gods.[citation needed] In AD 68 they placed a rope around his neck and dragged him through the streets until he was dead.[20]

In AD 43, about 10 years after the ascension of Christ, Saint Mark traveled to Alexandria and founded the Church of Alexandria, which today is claimed by the Coptic Orthodox Church, the Greek Orthodox Church of Alexandria and the Coptic Catholic Church. Aspects of the Coptic liturgy can be traced back to Saint Mark himself. He became the first bishop of Alexandria and he is honored as the founder of Christianity in Africa.[5]

According to Eusebius (Eccl. Hist. 2.24.1), Mark was succeeded by Annianus as the bishop of Alexandria in the eighth year of Nero (AD 62/63), probably, but not definitely due to his coming death. Later Coptic tradition says that he was martyred in AD 68.[6][7][8][9][10] It is believed that on the night when Jesus was arrested in the garden of Gethsemane Mark had followed him there and the police saw him, he ran away and dropped his loin cloth. His feast day is celebrated on April 25, and his symbol is the lion.[11]
Mission Drive
Michael was all about mission. He had a purpose and destiny from God to fulfill. What that is we are all trying to figure out.
Quote
mis·sion   
1. a group or committee of persons sent to a foreign country to conduct negotiations, establish relations, provide scientific and technical assistance, or the like.
2. the business with which such a group is charged.
3. a permanent diplomatic establishment abroad; embassy; legation.
4. Military . an operational task, usually assigned by a higher headquarters: a mission to bomb the bridge.
5. Aerospace . an operation designed to carry out the goals of a specific program: a space mission.
6. a group of persons sent by a church to carry on religious work, esp. evangelization in foreign lands, and often to establish schools, hospitals, etc.
7. an establishment of missionaries in a foreign land; a missionary church or station.
8. a similar establishment in any region.
9. the district assigned to a missionary.
10. missionary duty or work.
11. an organization for carrying on missionary work.
12. Also called rescue mission. a shelter operated by a church or other organization offering food, lodging, and other assistance to needy persons.
13. missions, organized missionary work or activities in any country or region.
14. a church or a region dependent on a larger church or denomination.
15. a series of special religious services for increasing religious devotion and converting unbelievers: to preach a mission.
16. an assigned or self-imposed duty or task; calling; vocation.
17. a sending or being sent for some duty or purpose.
18. those sent.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on January 26, 2011, 04:01:02 PM
I came across this video series by Jameshetfield007, and didn't see that anyone had posted them. Let me know if it has, thanks.

It examines symbolism in Michael's life from a muslim perspective. I don't necessarily agree with everything, but he definately has a lot of good points and has done a good job.

These were some things I noticed in this first video.
Jermaine said it's as if MJ were Moses (meaning "draws out" or "he who draws out") and he was Aaron. Moses, once under Pharoah's power as adopted from Hebrews as a baby and raised in Pharoah's house, had set himself free and rose up against the Pharaoh. On the Dangerous album cover there is the little brown boy holding the skull standing in the white stone hand. He says it is the miracle where God turns Moses' hand white with leprosy (vitilago is a form of leprosy)
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Exodus 4:1-8 (King James Version)

 1And Moses answered and said, But, behold, they will not believe me, nor hearken unto my voice: for they will say, The LORD hath not appeared unto thee.

 2And the LORD said unto him, What is that in thine hand? And he said, A rod.

 3And he said, Cast it on the ground. And he cast it on the ground, and it became a serpent; and Moses fled from before it.

 4And the LORD said unto Moses, Put forth thine hand, and take it by the tail. And he put forth his hand, and caught it, and it became a rod in his hand:

 5That they may believe that the LORD God of their fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath appeared unto thee.

 6And the LORD said furthermore unto him, Put now thine hand into thy bosom. And he put his hand into his bosom: and when he took it out, behold, his hand was leprous as snow.

 7And he said, Put thine hand into thy bosom again. And he put his hand into his bosom again; and plucked it out of his bosom, and, behold, it was turned again as his other flesh.
 8And it shall come to pass, if they will not believe thee, neither hearken to the voice of the first sign, that they will believe the voice of the latter sign.

(I know we've talked about it being the hand of the stone giant of P.T. Barnum's creation, so could be everything has double meanings.) He says the skull is the dragon's (illuminati/anti-christ) skull. He says the Pharaoh's were the bloodline of the Mason's (Illuminati). He mentions that he thinks that it pictures Alister Crowley and we've discussed that it's P.T. Barnum, so again there's obviously double meanings behind everything. The depth is mind-blowing. If MJ truly a kind of Moses, then he has been sent by God to deliver mankind from slavery to the Power that currently control earth.
[youtube:2u8ncssh]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8VIDBs_TX4&feature=related[/youtube:2u8ncssh]
Just inserting my own connection theories. I've read that the greatest white Pharaoh's were said to come from the sky, as in ET's, and subsequently mixed with black Egyptians. Ancient groups from around the world have told stories of white men from the skies, relating to the 'sons of god' mating with mankind in Genesis 6, and also being involved with the supernatural element following the Old Testament Israelites, such as the Piller of Fire that followed by day and night.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on January 26, 2011, 04:26:12 PM
Typology of Moses and Jesus

MOSES  JESUS 
An evil king/Pharaoh tried to kill him as a baby: Exodus 1:22  King Herod tried to kill baby Jesus: Matthew 2:16 
He was hidden from the evil king/Pharaoh: Exodus 2:2  An angel said to hide the child from the evil King Herod: Matthew 2:13 
Moses was sent into Egypt to preserve his life: Exodus 2:3-4  Jesus was taken into Egypt to preserve His life: Matthew 2:13-15 
He was saved by women: his mother: Exodus 2:3; Miriam 2:4; Pharaoh's daughter 2:5-10  Saved and helped by His mother, Mary: Matthew 2:14 
Pharaoh's daughter adopted Moses: Exodus 2:10  Joseph adopted Jesus: Matthew 1:25 
Moses became a prince of Egypt: Exodus 2:10  Jesus is the Prince of Peace: Isaiah 9:5; Matthew 28:18; Luke 2:14 
Long period of silence from childhood to adulthood  Long period of silence from childhood to adulthood 
Moses had a secret identity  Messianic secret = Jesus the Son of God 
He tried to save a Hebrew kinsman: Exodus 2:11-12  Jesus came to save His Hebrew kinsman first: Mark 7:26-28 
Went from being a prince to a pauper: Exodus 2:15-19  Went from being God to being man: John 1:1-3; Mark 6:3 
Saved women at a well: Exodus 2:15-19  Saved a woman at a well: John chapter 4 
Became a shepherd: Exodus 3:1  He is the Good Shepherd: John 10:11 
Moses' mission was to redeem Israel from slavery to Egypt  Jesus' mission is to redeem mankind from slavery to sin 
Moses was loved and supported in his ministry by his sister Miriam [in Hebrew, Miryam]  Jesus was loved and supported in his ministry by His mother Mary [in Hebrew, Miryam] 
He was often rejected by his own people  Jesus was often rejected by His own people 
Moses will give God's law on the mountain of Sinai: Exodus 20:1-31:18; 34:1-35  Jesus will give the new law from the Mt. of Beatitudes: Matthew chapter 5 
Moses spent 40 days fasting on the mountain: 24:18;34:28  Jesus spent 40 days fasting in the desert wilderness: Matthew  4:2 
Moses performs signs/ miracles  Jesus performs signs/miracles 
Moses offered his life for the salvation of his people after the sin of the Golden Calf: Exodus 32:33-33  Jesus offered His life for the salvation of the world: Isaiah 53:12; Romans 5:12; 6:10; 2 Corinthians 5:15-21; Colossians 1:19-20; 2:14-15; 1 John 1:7; 2:2; etc. 
Moses is the prophet of the Old Covenant Church  Jesus is the prophet, priest, and King of a New and everlasting Covenant = the universal Catholic Church [note catholic means universal] 

Michal Hunt, Copyright © 2003, revised 2005 Agape Bible Study. Permissions All Rights Reserved.
http://www.agapebiblestudy.com/charts/T ... 0Jesus.htm (http://www.agapebiblestudy.com/charts/Typology%20of%20Moses%20and%20Jesus.htm)

There are also other very good studies on Moses and Christ, as well as studies on the many types of Christ in the Old Testament.
 http://www.learnthebible.org/like-unto- ... hrist.html (http://www.learnthebible.org/like-unto-me-moses-as-a-type-of-christ.html)
http://www.bible-topics.com/Types-of-Christ.html (http://www.bible-topics.com/Types-of-Christ.html)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Im_convincedmjalive on January 26, 2011, 09:30:16 PM
Quote from: Im_convincedmjalive
Quote
Americans and to the rest of the World,

DISCLAIMER:
1.) You are being lied to and we are selling ourselves out!!!
2.) Our rights / liberties / Freedom is going away. We are being enslaved.

Intro

Before you read any further, remember something, it doesn’t matter what YOU believe or even what I believe, it matters what the ELITE believe. I will present to you, their belief. Knowledge they have that you too must have. If you have an open mind, you two will have the ALL SEEING EYE. You will truly understand the meaning of “Knowledge is Power”. I believe this information is in a perspective that the majority do not have and I believe it is essential to be educated on in order to better humanity. To know and understand what to do or what NOT to do or allow to happen.

This blog enlightens humanity on the Illuminati (or the elite, who control all governements through "central banks"), their history, beliefs, members, organizations, and activities. It focuses on the New World Order, the 9/11 attacks, Big Brother, and how the political agendas of the elite are fulfilling Bible prophecy.

This is our Wake Up Project -

The deeper one goes down the rabbit hole, the more bizarre the information becomes. When one is new to this path, what appears to be a misunderstanding, an exaggeration, or a lie, often is found to be factual and thoroughly documented by reliable sources. After shifting through the volumes of information to get to the truth and the sources which lead to its discovery, we try to leave the fiction, distortions and lies by the wayside and not be fooled or distracted by them. As the cliché goes, the truth is stranger than fiction.

This elite, who have many puppets within the club who help run the machine, all the governments, etc. They all may SAY they are christian, muslim or mostly JEWS, but in reality, they are Zionist, Luciferian, Satanist, evil, worship & believing in Satan, the devil. The Evil God and not really anything holy from Jesus Christ. They support all the religions, the vatican & pope because they are all really based of Sun Worship, Paganism, Lucifer, Horus, the Sun God Ra and in reality, the true belief is its all a MOCKERY of Jesus Christ. An impersonation. And the greatest trick the devil ever pulled (or desires daily) is/was convincing the world that he doesn't exist!

The Elite's Ultimate Goal:

To remove God from your lives. Remove anything "HOLY" (which is why most individuals & religions have no clue about the holy bible & how this world is shaped around it). Their biggest manipulation is making you believe that God, Satan & evil do not exist. When in reality, it very well does exist! And we all together make it happen.

Remove God from your lives, end all Religions EXCEPT theirs. Conform everyone into their Luciferian Religion, into their beliefs. A One World Religion - One World Government (via the United Nations) - One World Currency - One World Economy - Everyone chipped & controlled!

It is a race between us and the elite. They and this system that we all comply too is our enemy. Who will win? They are constantly on the offense where we must defend, we must stop their evil plans. These people who constantly want to make this world worse, never take a day off and...

"The Only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for Good men do nothing!"

And let me tell you, there is a whole lot of you out there not doing a damn thing. Not talking about (that 500 pound gorilla in the room or elephant), nothing! Too busy watching Palin on Dancing with the Stars, American Idol, mindless Television programs, wasting your hard earned money on sports giving them millions, PORN, etc. Too afraid of not being politically correct?

Stay in line – Obey – Consume – Don’t question a thing. Stick your head in the sand to REALITY, not facing it at all and stick to your FAITH. Your FAITH in a system that feeds you darkness only. Keep believing their lies on TV, obey and do not question a thing, keep believing that it is unpatriotic to question and we will get what we deserve - enslavement.

High level
 
Look, I am not the smartest person in the world, though I have been privileged (which I don’t even know if I can call it that, I hate this to be honest with you) to come across important information. Before I share anything though I need to level set with one big thing I’ve discovered that I think we can all understand yet are ever real “conscious” of and that is that all human beings can be “programmed” or mind controlled, brainwashed. (Huge Secret: Jesus worked to break this mind control and SET YOU FREE - for the TRUTH will set you free). Basically, your beliefs shape your behavior and your beliefs are HIGHLY influenced by others in society – especially if you NEVER hear the word of God, from the bible. Your beliefs, your personality is always influenced and shaped based off what you experience in life from birth and the information that has been shared with you, information told to you, ordered to you, either by your parents, teachers, politicians or leaders since you’ve been born and this information forms the matrix that everyone calls “reality” for yourself. And what you need to understand is that it’s real easy to manipulate your reality with lies or misinformation with things via television & newspaper,  in order to change your reality into an illusion while reality is hidden or not informed or talked about. Even when its not the intent to do so, yet is w/o people realizing it & that is what we ALL must wake up too because even the "elite" may not realize how sinister they are being. With the type of power they have, only YOU can allow them to stear humanity into evil or into peace.

This has happened, there is a huge a problem where the majority of humanity is literally blinded from reality or the truth and what is worse, most of us are complacent with the information told to us & don't question it. You all are in a trance. Brainwashed, mind controlled. A trance that you need to snap out of and WAKE UP. You are asleep to the truth and need to wake up.
 
I’ll put it bluntly, we do not live in what we think and know as “America”, with freedoms & that everything will always be fine and can only get better. Most Americans live in what I call a "fantasy" world. We’ve lost our freedom and independence this world has ever known and we are literally living or damn near close again to living during the times of when Jesus was executed on the cross within the Roman Empire & their rule. Note: He was executed for his beliefs. Freedom of Consciousness. A revolutionary fighting for humanity and that all men were created EQUAL. American’s & our leaders have turned into Luciferian Roman Catholics & Jews, destroying what Jesus stood for!
 
Jesus NEVER advocated a Big Church or Religion – more information below on how Jesus and the Bible have nothing to do with Religion and why MOST people have been led astray from the true word of God, to which can only be found by reading or studying the Holy Bible. The most important book ever for at least "educational" purposes and 90% of humanity have never even read it. This is how UNeducated we are. So please keep reading because this whole world falls right in it.
 
Humanity is asleep (Uneducated) due to two major reasons – we don’t remember our history and have no clue to the contents within the Holy Bible. Nobody reads it.
 
What we call the elite, is the same elite that first ruled in Egypt( with the Pyramids) who then migrated to Europe to rule the Roman Empire and then resurfaced as the British Empire and then, in 1913 with the passing of the private central bank - the Federal Reserve (unconstitutional), they got their hands on America and turned it into the American (Roman) Empire – all to continue their agenda towards world domination (WW1, WW2, WW3?). The Rockefellers and The Rothschild’s (Jews) have the most power in pushing this agenda, along with the Priesthood, Vatican, Pope, an agenda that doesn’t serve the American people at all. They always fund both sides of the war and reek profits off the interest they loan to those government. The Rothschilds and Rockfellers funded WW2, the NAZIS and the Holocaust.

To continue reading go here:  <!-- m -->http://truthknowledge.com/<!-- m -->
I originally posted this in the redirect for TIAI January 24th but it does apply here as well. The website above has info regarding The Arrivals Series. The website for wakeupproject.com is still under construction.

This website has alot of good info on it about Giants from the bible. <!-- m -->http://stevequayle.com/Giants/index2.html<!-- m -->

Fallen Angels, etc. <!-- m -->http://stevequayle.com/index1.html<!-- m -->

Peace

Quote
MJonmind wrote:
Just inserting my own connection theories. I've read that the greatest white Pharaoh's were said to come from the sky, as in ET's, and subsequently mixed with black Egyptians. Ancient groups from around the world have told stories of white men from the skies, relating to the 'sons of god' mating with mankind in Genesis 6, and also being involved with the supernatural element following the Old Testament Israelites, such as the Piller of Fire that followed by day and night.
[youtube:1s2i841b]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8VIDBs_TX4&feature=related[/youtube:1s2i841b]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 09, 2011, 10:09:30 PM
Quote from: Gewniveve
here is where you have missed somthing very important.The Bible says our King will be born of a virgin. Ok I'll break it down first AD stands for after death so its symbolic to say he is virgo. Or to put it, born unto a virgin. There is much more missing here there is an incredable link between most of these theories . I'v been working 25 years on this incredable "almost instinct" of joyous feelings, Michael is the light that guides us. If I can ever figure out how to post.

I haven't missed that  actually.

Virgin
1. A person who has not experienced sexual intercourse.
2. An unmarried woman; a maiden.
3. An unmarried woman who has taken religious vows of chastity
4. Virgin The Virgin Mary
5. An individual born under the sign of Virgo

A Virgin Birth
parthenogenesis
1. (Life Sciences & Allied Applications / Biology) a type of reproduction, occurring in some insects and flowers, in which the unfertilized ovum develops directly into a new individual
2. (Christian Religious Writings / Theology) human conception without fertilization by a male; virgin birth

A Virgin Birth
1. Conception without sexual intercourse (In Vitro Fertilization; IVF)
Michael's children?

I am not going to speculate on whether Joe is or isn't Michael's natural father, whether or not there was an immaculate conception involved, or if because in modern astrology, Ophiuchus has been left out of the charts and therefore Michael is a Virgin because of his birth date.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 09, 2011, 10:15:31 PM
Okay, so I don't why I decided to look at the lineage of the Egyptians Kings but I did. I just clicked through the wiki pages of each king back to when Egypt was separated into lower and upper Egypt with 2 different rulers. Before I get into that though I just want to refresh the myth of of Isis & Osiris and  some parallels. I will show where this goes in my next post.

Myth of Osiris and Isis
he Myth of Osiris and Isis, concerning the deities of Egyptian mythology Osiris, Isis, Horus, and Set, became one of the most important and powerful in Egyptian mythology during the New Kingdom. The myth concerns the death of Osiris and the birth of Horus.

The coffin and 14 parts
The original form of the myth states that Osiris was killed by a wooden sarcophagus secretly being made to his measurements by Set, who was jealous of Osiris's position as king, and so plotted to kill him and take his place. A party had been held where the coffin was offered to whoever could fit inside. A few people tried to fit in, but to no avail. Osiris was encouraged to try, but as soon as he lay back, the lid slammed on him and was locked. It was then sealed with lead and thrown into the Nile. Upon hearing that Osiris was gone, Isis set out to look for him. She was afraid without proper ceremonies and burial Osiris would not be able to go to the place of the dead. She later learned that the coffin had floated down the Nile river up to the coast of Byblos (now in modern day Lebanon) and got embedded in the trunk of a cedar tree. She also learned that the cedar tree had been taken and used as a pillar to support a palace for the king of Byblos. When traveling back, along the Nile River, she left the coffin in an area of marshland. Set, while hunting, finds Osiris' coffin and dismembered him into 14 parts, scattering them across the land of Egypt. Each part represented one of the 14 full moons (each year has 12 to 14 full moons).

Once again Isis set out to look for the pieces and she was able to find 13 of the 14 parts, with the help of Nephthys, Set's sister-wife, but was unable to find the 14th, as it had been eaten by a fish. Instead, she fashioned a phallus out of gold and sang a song around Osiris until he came back to life.
Osiris was resurrected. He could have proper ceremonies and burial.
Due to this experience, Osiris became Lord of the Dead, and the Afterlife.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_Osiris_and_Isis
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 09, 2011, 10:45:04 PM
Isis - The Virgin Mary
Throughout history, Isis and various forms of goddess worship has palyed a significant role ion our world's religions and cultural makeup. Inscribed in the temple of Isis: " I, Isis,am all that has been, that is or shall be: No mortal man hath ever me unveiled. The fruit which I have brought forth is the SUN.

Isis is the "divine mother" of ancient Egypt. She is known as the great goddess of magic and "universal nature". Using her powers to raise her dead (and dismembered)husband Osiris. As "Virgin of the World, Isis gave birth to Horus, the Egyptian God of the Sun and Moon, day and Night, Metaphorically, Isis is the celestial mother of the Son of God. According to legend, Isis mother of all remains eternally a virgin. She is often portrayed as the "Virgin with Child".

Goddess veneration of the "Virgin with Child" has been a central belief for various societies throughout history,including Christianity. Catholicism hold Mary to be eternally virginal just as Isis was and contends that Mary is without sin, making her a type of "God". In fact, some scholars claim that Mary is the "fourth person" within the Trinity. this belief is linked to the claim that Mary has a direct say in mankind's salvation through her (Catholic) role of co-redemption and mediation. Hence, with this the elevated status of Mary, she becomes a "Goddess" within the Catholic faith, just as Isis was a goddess in Egyptian beliefs. And just s Isis was and still is called the "Mother of the World" and "Queen of heaven" so too is Mary exalted with these same titles.
http://www.crossroad.to/articles2/2002/carl-teichrib/5isis.htm

Horus - Jesus
COMPARISON OF THE LIVES OF HORUS AND JESUS: COINCIDENCE?
There is too much information in this chart to copy so click the link to take a look
http://paganizingfaithofyeshua.netfirms.com/comparsison_horus_jesus_chart.htm

Set - Satan
Temple of Set
The Temple of Set is an initiatory occult society claiming to be the world's leading left-hand path religious organization. It was established in 1975 by Michael A. Aquino and certain members of the priesthood of the Church of Satan, who left because of administrative and philosophical disagreements. The philosophy of the Temple of Set may be summed up as "enlightened individualism" - enhancement and improvement of oneself by personal education, experiment, and initiation. This process is necessarily different and distinctive for each individual. Some people who are not members of the Temple of Set find spiritual inspiration in the Egyptian god Set, and may share some beliefs with the organization. The belief system in general is referred to as Setianism.

Setianism, in theory, is similar to theistic Satanism. The principle adored deity of Setianism is the ancient Egyptian god Set, or Seth, the god of adversary. Set supposedly is the Dark Lord behind the Hebrew entity Satan. Set, as the first principle of consciousness, is emulated by Setians, who symbolize the concept of individual, subjective intelligence distinct from the natural order as the "Black Flame."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism#Temple_of_Set (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism#Temple_of_Set)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 09, 2011, 11:35:56 PM
Egypt has been divided several times throughout the country's history. The last two rulers of a divided Egypt, for the period I am looking at, were:

Kamose (Upper Egypt)
Khamudi (Lower Egypt) - was the last pharaoh of the Hyksos fifteenth dynasty of Egypt,

The Hyksos
The Hyksos (Egyptian "foreign rulers") were an Asiatic people who took over the eastern Nile Delta in the Twelfth dynasty of Egypt, initiating the Second Intermediate Period of Ancient Egypt.

Was there a Hyksos invasion?
Manetho's account, as recorded by Josephus, of the appearance of the Hyksos in Egypt describes it as an armed invasion by a horde of foreign barbarians who met little resistance and who subdued the country by military force. He records that the Hyksos burnt their cities, destroyed temples and led women and children into slavery.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyksos

The next Pharaoh was Ahmose I

Ahmose I
Ahmose I (sometimes written Amosis I, "Amenes" and "Aahmes" and meaning Born of the Moon) was a pharaoh of ancient Egypt and the founder of the Eighteenth dynasty. He was a member of the Theban royal house, the son of pharaoh Tao II Seqenenre and brother of the last pharaoh of the Seventeenth dynasty, King Kamose.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmose_I

If you click through all the Pharaohs, you will see that they are related or believed to be related up to and including King Tutankhamun (King Tut).
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tutankhamun

After King Tut died he was succeeded by Ay

Ay
Ay was the penultimate Pharaoh of Ancient Egypt's 18th dynasty. He held the throne of Egypt for a brief four-year period, although he was a close advisor to two and perhaps three of the pharaohs who ruled before him and was the power behind the throne during Tutankhamun's reign.

Ay is usually believed to be a native Egyptian from Akhmim. During his short reign, he built a rock cut chapel in Akhmim and dedicated it to the local deity there: Min. He may have been the son of Yuya, who served as a member of the priesthood of Min at Akhmin as well as superintendent of herds in this city, and wife Tjuyu. If so, Ay could have been of partial non-Egyptian, perhaps Syrian blood since the name Yuya was uncommon in Egypt and is suggestive of a foreign background. Yuya was an influential nobleman at the royal court of Amenhotep III who was given the rare privilege of having a tomb built for his use in the royal Valley of the Kings presumably because he was the father of Tiye, Amenhotep's chief Queen. There are also noted similarities in the physical likenesses of monuments attributed to Ay and those of the mummy of Yuya, and both held similar names and titles.

Okay, so pharaoh Ay isn't related to the former royal bloodline and he isn't of royal lineage. Some scholars also believe that he murdered King Tut so he could take the throne.

Read about that at the link if interested: http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ay

Horemheb
Horemheb (sometimes spelled Horemhab or Haremhab and meaning Horus is in Jubilation) was the last Pharaoh of the 18th Dynasty from 1319 BC to late 1292 BC, although he was not related to the preceding royal family and is believed to have been of common birth. Before he became pharaoh, Horemheb was the commander in chief of the army under the reigns of Tutankamun and Ay. After his accession to the throne he reformed the state and it was under his reign that official action against the preceding Amarna rulers began.

Horemheb demolished monuments of Akhenaten (Who establish One God Worship), reusing their remains in his own building projects, and usurped monuments of Tutankhamun and Ay. Horemheb presumably remained childless and he appointed his vizier Paramesse as his successor, who would assume the throne as Ramesses I.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horemheb

Vizier (Ancient Egypt)
The vizier was the highest official in Ancient Egypt to serve the king, or pharaoh during the Old, Middle, and New Kingdoms. The viziers were appointed by the pharaohs, but often belonged to a vizierial family. The vizier's paramount duty was to supervise the running of the country, such as a prime minister, at times even small details of it. All other lesser supervisors and officials, such as tax collectors and scribes, would report to the vizier. The judiciary was part of the civil administration and the vizier also sat in the High Court. However at any time, the king could exert his own control over any aspect of government, overriding the vizier's decisions. The vizier also supervised the security of the pharaoh and the palace. The viziers often acted as the pharaoh's seal bearer as well, and the vizier would record trade.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vizier_%28Ancient_Egypt%29

Ramesses I
Originally called Pa-ra-mes-su, Ramesses I was of non-royal birth, being born into a noble military family from the Nile delta region, perhaps near the former Hyksos capital of Avaris, or from Tanis. He was a son of a troop commander called Seti.

The next Pharoah is Seti I

Seti I
Seti I (also called Sethos I after the Greeks) was a Pharaoh of Ancient Egypt (Nineteenth dynasty of Egypt), the son of Ramesses I and Queen Sitre, and the father of Ramesses II. The name Seti means "of Set", which indicates that he was consecrated (made or declared or believed to be holy; devoted to a deity) to the god Set. As with most Pharaohs, Seti had several names. Upon his ascension, he took the Menmaatre in Egyptian, meaning "Eternal is the Justice of Re." His better known nomen, or birth name is technically transliterated as Sety Merenptah, meaning "Man of Set, beloved of Ptah" (Ptah - risen land). Manetho incorrectly considered him to be the founder of the 19th dynasty.

Okay, so this new bloodline has taken the throne of Egypt. They are not from a Royal Bloodline and they have dedicated themselves to the God Set (Satan).

The next Pharaoh Ramesses II

Ramesses II
Ramesses II, known as Ramesses the Great, was the third Egyptian pharaoh of the Nineteenth dynasty. He is often regarded as the greatest, most celebrated, and most powerful pharaoh of the Egyptian Empire. His successors and later Egyptians called him the "Great Ancestor". Ramesses II led several military expeditions into the Levant, re-asserting Egyptian control over Canaan. He also led expeditions to the south, into Nubia, commemorated in inscriptions at Beit el-Wali and Gerf Hussein.

At age fourteen, Ramesses was appointed Prince Regent by his father Seti I. The early part of his reign was focused on building cities, temples and monuments. He established the city of Pi-Ramesses in the Nile Delta as his new capital and main base for his campaigns in Syria. This city was built on the remains of the city of Avaris, the capital of the Hyksos when they took over, and was the location of the main Temple of Set.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramesses_II

His most beloved wife was Nefertari

Nefertari
Nefertari also known as Nefertari Merytmut was one of the Great Royal Wives (or principal wives) of Ramesses the Great. Nefertari means 'Beautiful Companion' and Meritmut means 'Beloved of [the Goddess] Mut'. She is one of the best known Egyptian queens, next to Cleopatra, Nefertiti and Hatshepsut. Her lavishly decorated tomb, QV66, is the largest and most spectacular in the Valley of the Queens. Ramesses also constructed a temple for her at Abu Simbel next to his colossal monument here.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nefertari

Okay, please watch my first video on Michael and Egypt starting at 1:06 in the video.

[youtube:10kbcm5y]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bt8yB1GDUnA[/youtube:10kbcm5y]

Now the start of Michael's video for "Remember the Time."

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/RTT1.png)

(http://http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Qe1wgxDiEdU/THkyZ5jL8iI/AAAAAAAAB2M/z9jJH3-YPv0/s1600/eg_ramses_II_luxor.jpg)
Ramses II at Luxor

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/RTT2.png)

(http://http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42893000/jpg/_42893355_nefertiti_story300.jpg)
Nefertti

[youtube:10kbcm5y]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LeiFF0gvqcc[/youtube:10kbcm5y]

The Zodiac and Michael Jackson

There are actually 13 signs in the zodiac.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/file.png)

 August 29th...Michael Jackson is actually a Leo.

Leo is represented by the Lion.
(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Leo.jpg)

The Sphinx
The Sphinx in Egypt is facing it's mirror image in the night sky as it looks directly at the constellation Leo. (Man in the Mirror?)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/SphinxintheMirror.jpg)

The Sphinx was built by Pharaoh Khafre (aka Kafra, Khefren).
Khafre was an Egyptian pharaoh of the Fourth dynasty, who had his capital at Memphis. Khafre built the second largest pyramid at Giza. The Egyptian name of the pyramid was Wer(en)-Khafre which means "Khafre is Great". He is also credited with the building of the Sphinx.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khafra

(http://http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TKZdU-Ie-EI/AAAAAAAAAIA/JSv4aCHpOp8/s640/Khafre+2.jpg)
Statue of Khafre from the Cairo Museum

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TU5VVy0GGGI/AAAAAAAAAJw/ouGqEjbXrBo/s1600/p.png)
Michael recreated himself as the statue of Khafre in the HIStory CD Booklet.

More on Ramses II
In 1974, Egyptologists visiting his tomb noticed that the mummy's condition was rapidly deteriorating. They decided to fly Ramesses II's mummy to Paris for examination. Ramesses II was issued an Egyptian passport that listed his occupation as "King (deceased)". The mummy was received at Le Bourget airport, just outside Paris, with the full military honours befitting a king. (A King of France?)

Microscopic inspection of the roots of Ramesses II's hair proved that the original color of the king's hair was once red which suggests that he came from a family of redheads. This has more than just cosmetic significance; in ancient Egypt, people with red hair were associated with the god Seth, the slayer of Osiris, and the name of Ramesses II's father, Seti I, means "follower of Seth."
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramesses_II#Mummy
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 09, 2011, 11:42:39 PM
The Windsor-Bush Bloodline
by David Icke

I have recently been sent a series of genealogical charts which detail a bloodline and its off shoots...it reads like an index of the book and most, if not all, of the major players in the advancing agenda of global control over thousands of years. These charts are stunning confirmation that the same bloodlines have expanded their power out of the Near and Middle East of the ancient world to control the planet today...

This bloodline and its offshoots includes a long line of pharaohs in ancient Egypt, including Rameses II (1295-1228 BC), who is considered to be the greatest pharaoh of all. He was his country's master architect (sacred geometry) and his name can be found on almost every ancient shrine. The gold mines of Nubia made him rich beyond the imagination. This bloodline also includes the extraterrestrial-human hybrids who ruled Sumer, Babylon, Greece, and Troy, and which, today, rule the world.

One common link in this bloodline is Philip of Macedonia (382-336BC),who married Olympias, and their son was Alexander the Great (356-323BC), a tyrant who plundered that key region of Greece, Persia, Syria, Phoenicia, Egypt, Babylon, the former lands of Sumer, and across into India before dying in Babylon at the age of 33. During his rule of Egypt he founded the city of Alexandria, one the greatest centers for esoteric knowledge in the ancient world. Alexander was taught by the Greek philosopher, Aristotle, who in turn was taught by Plato and he by Socrates. The bloodline and the hidden advanced knowledge have always gone together.

This key bloodline comes down through the most famous Egyptian queen, Cleopatra (60-30BC), who married the most famous Roman Emperor, Julius Caesar, and bore him a son, who became Ptolemy XIV. She also bore twins with Mark Anthony, who has his own connections to this line and its many offshoots; this bloodline also connects to Herod the Great, the "Herod" of the Jesus stories, and continues to the Roman Piso family who, as I explain in The Biggest Secret, wrote the Gospel stories and invented the mythical figure called Jesus!!; the same bloodline includes Constantine the Great, the Roman Emperor who, in 325AD, turned Christianity, based on his ancestors' stories, into the religion we know today, and King Ferdinand of Spain and Queen Isabella of Castile, the sponsors of Christopher Columbus, who instigated the horrific Spanish Inquisition (1478-1834) in which people were tortured and burned at the stake for in any way questioning the basis of the religion their various ancestors had created.

More than that, the most used version of the Bible was commissioned and sponsored by another strand in the same bloodline, King James 1st of England. Just a coincidence, nothing to worry about! The line of James, according to genealogy sources listed below, can be traced back to 1550 BC and beyond and includes many Egyptian pharaohs, including Rameses II.

The bloodline moved into France and northern Europe through the Franks and Meroveus or Merovee, who gave his name to the Merovingian bloodline, and it continues with the rest of the Merovingian clan like Clovis and the Dagoberts who connect into the elite secret society, the Priory of Sion and the Rennes-le-Chateau "mystery" in Languedoc [Provence], Southern France. Many books have been written recently which claim that the Merovingians are the bloodline of "Jesus".

Some of these authors have just been mistaken, others have blatantly sought to confuse and mislead. The Merovingians are a key bloodline, yes, but it has nothing to do with Jesus,
who was invented by an earlier family in the same line, the Pisos. Authors like Sir Laurence Gardner (Bloodline of the Holy Grail and a favorite of Nexus Magazine and its owner, Duncan Roads) MUST know this and yet they still connect the Merovingians to "Jesus". Why??

The Merovingians were Goddess Diana worshippers, as are so many in this line to the present day. They founded the city we call Paris and on one of their former sites of Diana ritual, Princess Diana was murdered in the Pont d'Alma tunnel (meaning "bridge or passage of the Moon Goddess") on August 31st, 1997. As The Biggest Secret points out, the Windsors, another Merovingian bloodline, were very much involved in this ritual murder.

From the Merovingians, this bloodline's connections to the present day include: Charlemagne (742-814), who ruled as Emperor of the West in the Holy Roman Empire; a stream of French kings, including Robert II, Philip Ist, II and III, and Louis Ist, II, VI, VII, VIII, VIIII, XIII, IX, XV, and XVI. The latter married Marie Antoinette of this same bloodline and both were executed in the French Revolution. But they produced the son who became Daniel Payseur, who, as The Biggest Secret explains, was taken to the United States where he became the secret force behind the Morgan and Carnegie empires and owned vast amounts of real estate, banking, and industrial holdings.

This bloodline also connects to the de Medici family which supported Christopher Columbus and produced Catherine de Medici, the Queen of France who died in 1589. Her doctor was Nostradamus: It includes Rene d'Anjou, Duke of Lorraine, and the House of Lorraine which employed Nostradamus and Christopher Columbus. The bloodline relatives of the de Medicis and the House of Lorraine, Queen Isabella of Castile and King Ferdinand of Spain, were also sponsors of Columbus when he "discovered" the Americas.

This bloodline also includes the Habsburgs, the most powerful family in Europe under the Holy Roman Empire; Geoffrey Plantagenet and the Plantagenet royal dynasty in England; King John, who signed the Magna Carta; King Henry Ist, II, and III, who were extremely close to the Knights Templar, as was King John; Mary Stuart and the Stuart Dynasty, including King James Ist of England, sponsor of the King James version of the Bible; King George Ist, II, and III; Edward Ist, II, and III, Queen Victoria; Edward VII; George V and VI; Queen Elizabeth II; Prince Charles and Elizabeth's other offspring, Anne, Andrew and Edward; Princes William and Harry from Charles' "marriage" to Princess Diana; US Presidents, George Washington, John Adams, John Quincy Adams, Thomas Jefferson, Franklin Delano Roosevelt, and George Bush are all named in the charts as strands of this bloodline; it was passed on to the year 2000 US presidential favorite, George W. Bush Jr., and his brother, Jeb Bush, the Governor of Florida.

In fact if you go deeply enough into the genealogical research you will find that ALL the presidents are from this line. Genealogical sources, like the New England Historical Genealogical Society and Burkes Peerage, have shown that 33 of the 42 presidents to Clinton are related to Charlemagne and 19 are related to England's Edward III, both of whom are of this bloodline. A spokesman for Burkes Peerage, the bible of royal and aristocratic genealogy based in London, has said that every presidential election since and including George Washington in 1789 has been won by the candidate with the most royal genes. Now we can see how and why. United States presidents are not chosen by ballot, they are chosen by blood!

This same bloodline also includes key Scottish families like the Lords of Galloway and the Comyns; Marie-Louise of Austria, who married Napoleon Bonaparte; Kaiser Wilhelm II, the king of Germany at the time of the First World War; and Maximilian, the Habsburg emperor of Mexico, who died in 1867. On and on it goes into country after country. This bloodline connects into every surviving royal family in Europe, including King Juan Carlos of Spain and the Dutch, Swedish, and Danish royal lines.

And this is just ONE of the reptilian bloodlines and just SOME of its offshoots.
http://www.redicecreations.com/specialreports/windsorbushblood.html

I do not believe that this "Reptilian Bloodline" is literally reptilian people. I think that has been created to make this all seem ridiculous and in actuality this is a reference to the "reptile" because the Egyptian God Set was often depicted as a reptile and this is actually referring to those "Royal" (not really royal) families that worship Set (or Satan).

Animals of Ancient Egypt
Turtle
The turtle was associated with Set, and so with the enemies of Ra who tried to stop the solar barque as it traveled through the underworld. This was because the turtle was associated with night, and so came to symbolize darkness and evil.
http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/animalgods.htm

Snakes
Snakes typically represented evil. The snake god Set, or Seth, was often known as the God of Chaos. He is generally associated with war or brute physical strength.
Many species of snakes common in Egypt are venomous, thus alluding to the nefarious reputation of snakes and the god who represents them. (though the snake also represents Annubis)
http://www.ehow.com/list_6597524_animals-ancient-egypt.html

Another animals of interest related to representations of Set.

Hippopotamus - Set was thought to have turned into a hippopotamus during his fight with Horus, where he was harpooned by the falcon god. The male hippopotamus was Set's animal, and an evil animal
http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/animalgods.htm

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Hippo.jpg)
Murray's Arraignment

[youtube:qwwazaov]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQGvPSmhm2U[/youtube:qwwazaov]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 09, 2011, 11:44:49 PM
And just to clarify a bit because it may seem that I have gotten the two queens mixed up here but I actually  haven't. Ramses' II wife was Nefertari not Nefertiti but the statue at the beginning and Iman's character in the "Remember The Time" video is Nefertiti. It seems that showing Nefertiti as Ramses' II wife has been done intentionally, even though this is not correct...

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/RTT2.png)

(http://http://content9.flixster.com/question/40/20/94/4020943_std.jpg)

(http://http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42893000/jpg/_42893355_nefertiti_story300.jpg)

Nefertiti
Nefertiti was the Great Royal Wife (chief consort) of the Egyptian Pharaoh Akhenaten. Nefertiti and her husband were known for a religious revolution, in which they started to worship one god only. This was Aten, or the sun disc. Some scholars believe that Nefertiti ruled briefly after her husband's death and before the accession of Tutankhamun as Neferneferuaten, although this identification is a matter of ongoing debate.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nefertiti

Before Michael appears in the video we hear the pharaoh introduced as "The Great Pharaoh Ramses" which would be Ramses II

In the video for "Remember The Time" we have:

Eddie Murphy as Ramses II (The God Set)
Iman as Nefertari (resembling Nefertiti)

(http://http://music-facts.ru/pictures/songs/Michael_Jackson/Remember_The_Time.jpg)

Michael as The God Horus.

(http://http://membres.lycos.fr/invinciblejackson/hpbimg/rememberpics.jpg)

Michael has the falcon on his chest which represents Horus (Jesus/Messiah)

(http://http://lostandlit.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/shen-ring1.jpg)

(http://http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e0/Horus_as_falcon.svg/450px-Horus_as_falcon.svg.png)

Horus
The earliest recorded form is Horus the Falcon who was the patron deity of Nekhen in Upper Egypt and who is the first known national god, specifically related to the king who in time came to be regarded as a manifestation of Horus in life and Osiris in death.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horus

Michael is all dressed in Gold and in Egypt Gold represents a God and when he reappears he is literally made of Gold.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/MJGold.png)

Gold was considered a divine metal, it was thought to be the flesh of the gods
http://http://www.egyptartsite.com/symlst.html

So we have Michael portraying Horus trying to lure Nefertari/Nefertiti away from Set (Ramses II). The Messiah trying to get this woman out of Satan's grasp. He is suggesting that she remember a time when only one God was worshipped and the true royal bloodline held the throne.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 09, 2011, 11:53:28 PM
And on further reflection, I believe that Michael chose Nefertiti to represent Ramses II wife, even though she wasn't actually his wife, for 3 reasons:

1. Because of her connection to King Tut, the last of the true bloodline Pharaohs.

2. Because she was part of the movement, the driving force, which changed Egypt's beliefs from serving many Gods to serving one God. This belief incorporated all the other previous Gods, into the ultimate God and suggested these other Gods were actually all parts of this one single God. This is similar to the modern Christian idea of "the father, the son, and the holy ghost"; a single God, with separate parts but still one god.

3. Who is the woman? She is Ramses' wife (or Satan's wife).
What is a wife? She is the bride.
So in this instance she is a metaphorical wife.
What is she representing then? She represents the Church.

Michael is trying to show us that there is a lie (lies) within our beliefs (beLIEve). This is symbolizing that the current religions and beliefs, have strayed from their original meanings. The God that was originally being worshipped, has been replaced with Set (or Satan) and though congregations are unintentionally worshipping Set because of this deception, this is whom is really being revered. Michael is symbolizing bringing "the bride", the church, the believers, back to the true God.

What is the Bride of Christ?

The Bride of Christ
The Bride of Christ or bride, the Lamb's wife is one of the metaphors used in the New Testament. Ephesians 5:22-33 It compares the union of husband and wife to that of Christ and the church. It is a favorite ecclesial image. It also draws upon Revelation 21:9-10

The central theme of the whole Ephesians letter is reconciliation of the alienated within the unity of the church. Ephesians 5 begins by calling on Christians to imitate God and Christ, who gave himself up for us with love. It contains a rather strong warning against foolishness and letting down one's guard against evil. Rather, the author encourages the readers to constantly give thanks with song in their hearts because of what God has done for all of us in Christ. That prelude to the subject's text takes up again the theme of loving submission that began with the example of Christ in where all are called upon to "Be submissive to one another out of reverence for Christ."

It implies, but is not specific, that the "Bride" is the body of believers that comprise the universal Christian ekklesia (the "called-out ones"). In that verse the "New Jerusalem" is explicitly "the bride, the wife of the Lamb," almost universally considered to refer to Christ (Messiah) and his church.

It illustrates the closeness of Christ's relationship with his followers, (FANS?) and the depth of love and service that he holds for the Church as the body of believers. They are variously described in the New Testament as the ekklesia (meaning "church"), the body of Christ, the koinonia of the Spirit, flock, Israel of God, elect race, royal priesthood, holy nation, God's own people, temple of God, seed of Abraham, and otherwise.

The ekklesia is never explicitly called the bride of Christ in the New Testament. That is approached in Ephesians 5:22-33 and in Revelation 21:9. A major analogy is that of the body. Just as husband and wife are to be "one flesh,"[Eph. 5:31] this analogy for the writer describes the relationship of Christ and ekklesia (v. 32). Husbands were exhorted to love their wives "just as Christ loved the ekklesia and gave himself for it (v. 25). When Christ nourishes and cherishes the ekklesia, he nourishes and cherishes his own flesh. Members of the ekklesia are "members of his own body" (vv. 29-30).[3]

As one metaphor for the Church, the "Bride of Christ" reflects that any relationship between humans and God can only be hinted at and poorly described using any earthly terms. Although the role of bride and bridegroom captures some aspects of our relationship with God, demonstrating the strength of God's love for us and His eternal commitment to those who chose Him, many other aspects of our relationship with God cannot be described using this metaphor (or any other human concept).
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bride_of_Christ

"I'm married to my fans. I'm married to God, to my children and to life"
~Michael Jackson
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 09, 2011, 11:56:36 PM
Was Jesus' Resurrection a Sequel?
By David Van Biema / New York and Tim McGirk / Jerusalem Monday, Jul. 07, 2008

(http://http://img.timeinc.net/time/daily/2008/0807/tablet_0709.jpg)
A first-century BC tablet, thought to originate from the Jordanian bank of the Dead Sea, that tells the story of a Messiah who rose again after three days from the grave

A 3 footthigh tablet romantically dubbed "Gabriel's Revelation" could challenge the uniqueness of the idea of the Christian Resurrection. The tablet appears to date authentically to the years just before the birth of Jesus and yet, at least according to one Israeli scholar, it announces the raising of a messiah after three days in the grave. If true, this could mean that Jesus' followers had access to a well-established paradigm when they decreed that Christ himself rose on the third day, and it might even hint that they they could have applied it in their grief after their master was crucified. However, such a contentious reading of the 87-line tablet depends on creative interpretation of a smudged passage, making it the latest entry in the woulda/coulda/shoulda category of possible New Testament artifacts; they are useful to prove less-spectacular points and to stir discussion on the big ones, but probably not to settle them nor shake anyone's faith.
More at the link:http://http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1820685,00.html

Photos at National Geographic:http://http://natgeotv.com/ca/ancient-secrets/galleries/the-first-jesus
and video:http://http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/series/expedition-week/4290/Overview#tab-Videos/07367_00

Wiki page:
Gabriel's Revelation
Gabriel's Revelation (also named Hazon Gabriel the Vision of Gabriel) or the Jeselsohn Stone, is a three-foot-tall (one metre) stone tablet with 87 lines of Hebrew text written in ink, containing a collection of short prophecies written in the first person and dated to the late 1st century BCE. One of the stories allegedly tells of a man who was killed by the Romans and resurrected in three days. It is a tablet described as a "Dead Sea scroll in stone".
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabriel%27s_Revelation
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 09, 2011, 11:59:16 PM
The Lost Tomb of Jesus
The Lost Tomb of Jesus is a documentary co-produced and first broadcast on the Discovery Channel and Vision TV in Canada on March 4, 2007, covering the discovery of the Talpiot Tomb. It was directed by Canadian documentary and film maker Simcha Jacobovici and produced by Felix Golubev and Ric Esther Bienstock, while James Cameron (creator of the movie Titanic) served as executive producer. The film was released in conjunction with a book about the same subject, The Jesus Family Tomb, issued in late February 2007 and co-authored by Jacobovici and Charles R. Pellegrino. The documentary and book's claims are the subject of controversy within the archaeological and theological fields, as well as among linguistic and biblical scholars.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lost_Tomb_of_Jesus

The Lost Tomb of Jesus  Part 1/10

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHBQz6GWJAI[/youtube]

This is a still, from the video, of the Entrance to the tomb:

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Chevron2.png)

This same image is found on ancient coins depicting Jewish Ruler King Herod (Herod the Great) who rebuilt King Solomon's Temple (The Second Temple) in Jerusalem.

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_O3dXyVqV9Mo/Re0LfF-gp9I/AAAAAAAAABE/4log2YHhb0g/s320/HerodPhillip.jpg)
Coin of Herod Phillip, 4 BC-AD 34

The "Chevron and Circle" pattern is clearly visible as a depiction of the facade of the Nicanor gate of the Temple of God in Jerusalem.

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_O3dXyVqV9Mo/Rex5TL_PrtI/AAAAAAAAAAk/-nB-u9EHWTw/s320/coin_philip_bm.jpg)
Coin depicting the Temple of God (The British Museum)

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_O3dXyVqV9Mo/Rezja1-gp7I/AAAAAAAAAA0/hIDZz1Jbhs4/s320/temple.jpg)
Nicanor gate facade with the Temple in the background
http://confirmedword.blogspot.com/2007/03/so-called-jesus-family-tomb-mysterious.html

This Chevron is also called the "carat sign" and indicates the tabernacle or tent (suqa) of David (King David).
Second, the 'tent' is also a 'lazy' dalet (lazy meaning leaning), which is corrected in the second image. Dalet is the abbreviation for David.  This is the tomb of the Davidids (or the decedents of King David)

(http://jacksonsnyder.com/arc/2010/pics/jesus-tomb-entrance.jpg)(http://jacksonsnyder.com/arc/2010/pics/jesus-tomb-entrance-lazy-dalet.jpg)

A circle inside of a tent would indicates "a presence in the tent", in other words the descendants of King David are inside this tomb.
http://jacksonsnyder.com/arc/2010/jesus-family-tomb-dalet.htm

The 6/10 ossuaries (bone boxes) that were found inside had names on them:

Yeshua bar Yosef - inscription in Aramaic, meaning "Jesus son of Joseph."

"Mariamne, also known as Mara", an inscription in Greek. "Mara" the Aramaic word for "Lord" or "Master" and a unique version of the name we know as Mary. This is believed to be Mary Magdalene.

Maria - a name apparently in Latin, but written in Hebrew letters.This is the Virgin Mary's real name which modernized is Mary.

Yosa - believed to be the same as Ioses or Joses, the name of one of the brothers of Jesus listed in the New Testament's book of Mark (6:3). Yosa is the diminutive of Yosef similar to Joey being the diminutive of Joseph in English. Such a name has not been found in any ossuary other than this and it is noteworthy that the ossuary was that of an adult. Hence, this would be a strong indication that Yosa would be the son of Yosef, or Yeshua's brother ("Yeshua bar Yosef") just as in Mark.

Yehuda bar Yeshua - "Judah, son of Jesus." (Inscription in Aramaic). Also called Jude, known also as Thomas, the "Twin." Possibly the son of Jesus, but he was publicly presented as the brother of Jesus, in order to save him from being executed as a pretender to the throne of Israel. He was known as "Twin" (Thomas, Didymus, etc.).

Matiah - a name in Hebrew, the original form of the names of the apostles Matthew and Matthias. His presence in the family tomb implies he was also a relative of Jesus. He may be the apostle Mathew or a relative of the Virgin Mary who has several Mathews related to her royal, priestly lineage.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Jesus_Family_Tomb

This symbol is therefore indicating that this is the burial tomb of the descendants of King David, royal lineage...Jesus.
http://jacksonsnyder.com/arc/2010/jesus-family-tomb-dalet.htm

King David
King David was the second ruler of Israel, he wrote the Psalms in the Bible, and he is David from the story "David and Goliath". In Christianity David is known as an ancestor of Jesus' adoptive father Joseph, and in Islam, he is known as Dawood, considered to be a prophet and the king of a nation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_david

Please recall the photograph of the scale model of some sort of building that was posted at TMZ. These pictures are from when Oprah interviewed Katherine and the children at the Encino home. The scale model was on top of the piano.

(http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/10/IMG_3658_full.jpg)

(http://cdn.photos.tmz.com/gallery_images/images/2010/10/dano101010a_15_full.jpg)
http://photos.tmz.com/galleries/oprah_visits_jackson_family_home#tab=most_recent&id=79326

I have created the following comparison:

(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/ChevronComparison.jpg)

Please also note that this Tomb was discovered in 1980 BUT nothing was published about this until 2007. This information was hidden away and/or dismissed by the Israeli government. I don't know when the photo of Michael was taken or what year that scale model was created but I would bet it was BEFORE 2007.

So how did he know about this symbol?

But even if the photograph and the model were created after 2007 there is still a message here.

This symbol does not represent anything else but that the descendants of King David (the messianic bloodline) are inside the building/tomb. A statue of Michael is inside that scale model under the "Chevron and Circle" symbol. By using this symbol Michael is saying that he is a descendant of King David...related to Jesus.
 
Or is it that he is the reincarnation/incarnation of Jesus; the messiah?


I would like to give credit to and thank TouchedByAnAngel for her awesome memory and for sending me the pictures/links after I sent her the video. We make a great team! Without her input, I probably would never have noticed that Michael has used this symbol himself.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 10, 2011, 12:00:19 AM
On June 25, 2009 it was first reported that Michael had been taken to LA`s Cedar Sinai Medical Centre. Police had blocked the roads in this area and there were reports that family members had actually gone to this hospital first.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Cedars.jpg)

We know that this wasn`t the case so why was that reported?

Egyptian Isis, Osiris & Set Myth
Set tricks Osiris into getting into a coffin and then throws the coffin into the Nile; Osiris drowns. This coffin travels down the Nile to Lebanon and gets lodged in a Cedar Tree. This tree is later used as a pillar to support a Great Palace for the king (Solomons Temple maybe? but in the wrong location). Isis later retrieves the coffin from the temple and the story continues.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_Osiris_and_Isis

History of Cedars-Sinai Medical Center
Cedars-Sinai was established as the Kaspare Cohn Hospital in 1902. At the time, Cohn donated a two-story Victorian home located at 1441 Carroll Avenue Los Angeles. In 1910, the hospital relocated and expanded to Stephenson Avenue (now Whittier Boulevard). The hospital relocated again in 1930 to 4833 Fountain Avenue, where it was renamed Cedars of Lebanon after the religiously significant Lebanon Cedar, used to build King Solomon's Temple in Jerusalem in the Bible.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cedars-Sinai_Medical_Center

Solomon
Solomon  was, according to the Hebrew Bible, a King of Israel and in the Qur'an, a Prophet, son of Dawood and known as Sulaiman. The biblical accounts identify Solomon as the son of David. He is also called Jedidiah in 2 Samuel 12:25, and is described as the third king of the United Monarchy, and the final king before the northern Kingdom of Israel and the southern Kingdom of Judah split; following the split his patrilineal descendants ruled over Judah alone.

The Hebrew Bible credits Solomon as the builder of the First Temple in Jerusalem, and portrays him as great in wisdom, wealth, and power, but ultimately as a king whose sin, including idolatry and turning away from God, leads to the kingdom being torn in two during the reign of his son Rehoboam. Solomon is the subject of many other later references and legends.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solomon

From my previous post about the Tomb of Jesus:

King David
King David was the second ruler of Israel, he wrote the Psalms in the Bible, and he is David from the story "David and Goliath". In Christianity David is known as an ancestor of Jesus' adoptive father Joseph, and in Islam, he is known as Dawood, considered to be a prophet and the king of a nation.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_david
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 10, 2011, 12:01:58 AM
In the autopsy report, on pages 32 & 33, a cervical rib is mentioned.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/CervicalribPage33.jpg)

A cervical rib is an extra rib and is a congenital condition, which means it is present at birth. This condition is present in only about 1 in 500 (0.2%) of people and it appears more frequently in women than in men.
http://http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-cervical-rib.htm
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cervical_rib

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Cervicalrib.jpg)

I am not sure that Michael actually has an extra rib or not but of course it is possible. I believe the autopsy is a creation and not an actual examination that was literally performed on Michael's body, after all he isn't dead.

In the Bible, in Genesis, it says:

Genesis 2:21-23
21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
http://http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%202:21-23&version=KJV

Okay, so God created man, Adam, in his image and he would have been a representation of a perfect man. But Adam is lonely so God takes a rib from Adam and creates a woman from it, Eve. A perfect man, which is what Jesus/Messiah is described as, would therefore have an extra rib.

But there is more significance to this extra rib. A cervical rib is also referred to as a clavicle rib because of ligaments that may attach the clavicle and the cervical rib together.

The Clavicle of Solomon
The Key of Solomon, in Latin Clavis Salomonis or Clavicula Salomonis, Hebrew Mafteah Shelomoh, is a grimoire, or book on magic, attributed to King Solomon, probably dating to the 14th to 15th century Italian Renaissance and presenting a typical example of Renaissance magic.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Key_of_Solomon

From the previous post about Cedars Sinai Hospital:

Solomon
Solomon was, according to the Hebrew Bible, a King of Israel and in the Qur'an, a Prophet, son of Dawood and known as Sulaiman. The biblical accounts identify Solomon as the son of David. He is also called Jedidiah in 2 Samuel 12:25, and is described as the third king of the United Monarchy, and the final king before the northern Kingdom of Israel and the southern Kingdom of Judah split; following the split his patrilineal descendants ruled over Judah alone.

The Hebrew Bible credits Solomon as the builder of the First Temple in Jerusalem, and portrays him as great in wisdom, wealth, and power, but ultimately as a king whose sin, including idolatry and turning away from God, leads to the kingdom being torn in two during the reign of his son Rehoboam. Solomon is the subject of many other later references and legends.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solomon

From my previous post about the Tomb of Jesus:

King David
King David was the second ruler of Israel, he wrote the Psalms in the Bible, and he is David from the story "David and Goliath". In Christianity David is known as an ancestor of Jesus' adoptive father Joseph, and in Islam, he is known as Dawood, considered to be a prophet and the king of a nation.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_david

In this painting, entitled "The Book", Michael is dressed in Royal Attire and there are many symbols in this painting, but for this post, please note that he is seated with a book on his lap and this book has a KEY on the cover. This is the also the only confirmed painting that Michael ever actually sat for. Therefore, Michael must have requested that he be painted in this way. The title of the painting, "The Book", reveals that this book is central to the meaning behind this painting.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Solomonskeypainting.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/solomonskeypaintingclose-up-1.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/VaticanCityKey.jpg)
Layout of Rome/Vatican

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/V-ManVatican.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/phpPgdmkyPM.jpg)
Da Vinci's Vitruvian Man

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/phpUkVLa6PM.jpg)
Michael from the video for "Scream"

Vitruvian Man
The Vitruvian Man is a world-renowned drawing created by Leonardo da Vinci around the year 1487. It is accompanied by notes based on the work of the famed architect, Vitruvius. The drawing, which is in pen and ink on paper, depicts a male figure in two superimposed positions with his arms and legs apart and simultaneously inscribed in a circle and square. The drawing and text are sometimes called the Canon of Proportions or, less often, Proportions of Man. The drawing is based on the correlations of ideal human proportions with geometry described by the ancient Roman architect Vitruvius in Book III of his treatise De Architectura. Vitruvius described the human figure as being the principal source of proportion among the Classical orders of architecture.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitruvian_Man

Origins of Vitruvian Man
A collection Sketches and Trial Pieces in British Museum, contains a strange piece under the catalogue number EGYPT-5601. The official description is:
"Wooden board overlaid with gesso which was used by an artist either for teaching purposes or for making a preliminary drawing which would subsequently be reproduced on a larger scale as a carved relief on the wall of a temple. Both in order to facilitate enlargement and to ensure that be observed canonical proportions."

(http://http://www.aiwaz.net/uploads/gallery/202.gif)

MORE at the link: http://http://www.aiwaz.net/origins-of-vitruvian-man/a7

So  Da Vinci recreated his drawing from the work of Vitruvius but Vitruvius based his work on the drawings of the Egyptians. This drawing is often referred to a "Perfected Man" but there is another Perfected or Perfect Man.

Natures of Jesus
Jesus possesses fully the nature of a man, He has a human body and soul. Furthermore, His human soul, like ours, has intellect and will. (He is like man in all things but sin). But Jesus has the infinite intellect and will of God as well as the intellect and will of a man. He is one divine person having two natures, the human and the divine.

Fifth Century Athanasian Creed
"He is perfect God; and He is perfect man, with a rational soul and human flesh. He is equal to the Father in His divinity but he is inferior to the Father in His humanity. Although He is God and man, He is not two but one Christ. And He is one, not because His divinity was changed into flesh, but because His humanity was assumed into God. He is one, not at all because of a mingling of substances, but because He is one person."
http://http://www.ewtn.com/faith/teachings/incaa3.htm

Hebrews 5:8-9
8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;

9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
http://http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Hebrews%205:8-9&version=KJV

The Key of Solomon
From the book, The Key of Solomon, is an image of the "Sacred Cross". This sacred cross is found in churches, on the Catholic Pope's religious outfits and throughout many different religious items.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Solomonskey.png)

The image in the centre of the cross is called the Chi-Rho and it is a representation of the name/title "Christ".

Chi Rho

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/ChiRho1.jpg)

The Chi Rho is one of the earliest forms of christogram, and is used by Christians. It is formed by superimposing the first two letters in the Greek spelling of the word Christ, chi = ch and rho = r, in such a way to produce the monogram . Although not technically a cross, the Chi Rho invokes the crucifixion of Jesus as well as symbolizing his status as the Christ.

The use of a wreath around the Chi Rho symbolizes the victory of the Resurrection over death, and is an early visual representations of the connection between the Crucifixion of Jesus and his triumphal resurrection.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chi_Rho

The Chi-rho was created by Constantine I after he had a dream of being ordered to put a "heavenly divine symbol"  on the shields of his soldiers. But it also matches up with stars in the Orion Constellation, resembles the Egyptian ankh, is relevant to the layout of the Vatican, The Pyramids in Egypt and other religious significant locations. In the "This Is It" album's CD booklet there is a symbol on the floor in the green lighted photo.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/pyramidscloseup.jpg)
Giza Pyramids

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Orionpyramidscloseup.jpg)
Orion Constellation

The Ankh

(http://http://www.touregypt.net/images/touregypt/ankh9.jpg)

The Ankh was, for the ancient Egyptians, the symbol (the actual Hieroglyphic sign) of life but it is an enduring icon that remains with us even today as a Christian cross. It is one of the most potent symbols represented in Egyptian art. The ankh was symbolic of the sunrise, with the loop representing the Sun rising above the horizon, which is represented by the crossbar. The vertical section below the crossbar would then be the path of the sun. The ankh sign is not only a symbol of worldly life, but of life in the netherworld. Therefore, we also find the dead being referred to as ankhu, and a term for a sarcophagus was neb-ankh, meaning possessor of life. Many mirrors were shaped in the form of an ankh sign. Life and death mirror each other, and in any number of ancient religions, mirrors were used for  purposes of divination. As the Christian era eclipsed Egypt's pharaonic pagan religion, the sign was adapted by the Coptic church as their unique form of a cross, known as the crux ansata.
http://http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/ankh.htm

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/ankhsun2.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/ankhjacket2.jpg)
Ankh on Michael's jacket from the film "This Is It"

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/AnkhJacket1.jpg)
Ankh on Michael's jacket from the film "This Is It"

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/AnkhShirt.jpg)
Upside down Ankh on Michael's shirt in pictures taken in the weeks just before the hoax began.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/ChirhoontheTIIstage.jpg)
"This Is It" album CD Booklet

Just a note: The colour Green represents Osiris and Resurrection.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/ChiRhoTIIankhcompare.jpg)

There is much more detailed information on this and the connections to the Church, the Egyptian Pyramids and the stars etc, in the video series I created,  "All Roads Lead To Egypt". The videos are not complete and I have posted some information in this thread which is not in those videos but if you are interested, here is a link to the play list:
http://http://www.youtube.com/user/xSerenityxDreamsx?feature=mhum#g/c/EB4B073A6E64EF96
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 10, 2011, 12:41:30 AM
I don't watch TV very often but 2 nights ago, I had an urge to watch it. I turned on the TV and was looking through the guide to see if there was anything on I might be interested in watching. There was a program on The History Channel called "Ancient Secrets: The Sphinx." I  can not link anything, from the show, except still pictures because it seems that this is a current episode and recent investigation. But I did watch it and I find the whole me turning on the TV (which I hardly ever do) just before this program was about to begin, very coincidental and spooky.  <!-- s:shock: --> :shock: <!-- s:shock: -->
http://http://natgeotv.com/ca/ancient-secrets/galleries/the-sphinx

Anyways, this program discussed the evidence that supports that Pharaoh Khafre was the builder of the sphinx, how it was built, what it looked like, what it represents and why.

I know that I am repeating some photos etc but there are multiple connections between things and I am trying to show how these things are related, plus I am discovering new information daily.  <!-- s:) --> :) <!-- s:) -->

(http://http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TKZdU-Ie-EI/AAAAAAAAAIA/JSv4aCHpOp8/s640/Khafre+2.jpg)
This is one of the statues of Pharoah Khafre that is in the Cairo museum.

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TU5VVy0GGGI/AAAAAAAAAJw/ouGqEjbXrBo/s1600/p.png)
And Michael from the HIStory Cd Booklet.

What is it believed that the Sphinx represents and why?
There are several different versions of what we call the Sphinx, the most well known one is the famous huge statue  found at Giza.

Sphinx
Sphinx were often placed at entrances to palaces or temples of antiquity. This positioning implied power, authority and protection. The bodily form of the sphinx combines two to four animals, a lion, bull or eagle with the head of a human.

(http://http://www.mt.net/%7Ewatcher/sphinxcherub.jpg)
A Sphinx

Cherubim
Cherubim are said to have components of Man, Eagle, Bull, Lion. The combination of all four creatures in one constitutes what is described in Ezekiel and elsewhere in the Bible as a type of angel.

(http://http://www.mt.net/%7Ewatcher/ezekielwheelcherubim.jpg)

The word Cherubim means "one who prays", or "one who intercedes." Cherubim are an order of angel described in the Bible and ancient texts as a combination of two, or more often, four creatures, including that of a human. Both the mythical Sphinx and the scriptural cherubim are "hybrid" beings combining two to four creatures. The meaning of these creatures can be found in the zodiac narrative.

The infamous account of Ezekiel 's wheels, often misinterpreted as a primitive description of a UFO encounter, is actually a vision of the hybrid living creatures who populate the celestial narrative.  Ezekiel saw four-faced cherubim and the wheels which were assigned to them, the four faces of the cardinal points of the zodiac, and a reference to their movement through the heavens.

(http://http://www.mt.net/%7Ewatcher/cherubim.jpg)

Leo, the great lion. "The conquering lion of Judah", Jesus Christ, who will come again. The king that the apostle John traced back to that tribe of Israel. In his heart is the star called Regulus. This is the whole story of God's atonement work on earth, its beginning and ending are symbolized by the sphinx; combining Virgo and Leo.
(Michael is a Virgo in Modern astrology and a Leo in Ancient astrology)

Ophiuchus & Orion Myth
Ophiuchus, the Serpent Bearer, may well be an alternative form of Hercules, for the giant frequently had to deal with snakes, beginning in infancy when he strangled the serpent in his crib. Ophiuchus bears Serpens, the Serpent, in his hands, and his right foot is almost touching the stinger of the Scorpion". The offspring of Adam & Eve, the prophesied Messiah, "Bears the Serpent" as a representation of sin, and redeems all man through his crucifixion and resurrection. Ophiuchusis the resurrected Asclepius also, Esculapius , the healer whose symbolis the serpent staff. The learned Greek hero Asclepius was killed because he was able to raise the dead.

(http://http://www.mt.net/%7Ewatcher/ophiuchus.jpg)

Orion, the blinded demigod who had regained his eyesight, journeyed to the island of Crete. There he met the beautiful Artemis, goddess of the Moon, also called Kynthia because she and her twin brother, Apollo, were born on Mount Kynthos. Apollo disapproved of the union between his sister the Moon Goddess and Orion.  His sister was so involved with Orion that she forgot to carry the Moon across the sky.  Apollo was disgusted with his sister and thought the only way to solve this problem was to kill Orion.

One day Apollo sent Orion to the sea to catch some fish. When Orion waded through the sea,his head just above water, Apollo called his sister and pointed out the unrecognizable black dot far away. He tauntingly told her that although she was good with her bow, even she had her limits, and it was highly unlikely that she could hit the tiny target. Artemis felt insulted, immediately fit an arrow to her bow, and shot the target. Her aim was perfect, as always.The arrow pierced Orion's head, killing him instantly.  Artemis was horrified to discover her mistake.  She took Orion's body to her nephew Esculapius (son of Apollo & Coronis), begging him to resurrect Orion. Before Esculapius could act, a thunderbolt from Zeus destroyed Orion's body, but killed Esculapius as well. Artemis the Moon Goddess set Orion in the heavens, and Zues, realizing that Apollo's son Esculapius didn't deserve his fate, set him in the stars as the constellation Ophiuchus.

Another reference to the man who is victorious over one the many manifestations of the rebel cherub is found in the typology of Orion. According to Bullinger's The Witness of the Stars: His name is given as Ha-ga-t, which means this is he who triumphs. The hieroglyphic characters below read Oar. Orion was anciently spelled Oarion, from the Hebrew root, which means light. So that Orion means coming forth as light. The ancient Akkadian was Ur-ana, the light of heaven.

The constellation is mentioned by name, as being perfectly well known both by name and appearance, in the time of Job; and as being an object of familiar knowledge at that early period of the world's history. See Job 9:9; 38:31, and Amos 5:8 (Heb.Chesil, which means a strong one, a hero, or giant).

(http://http://www.mt.net/%7Ewatcher/29orion.gif)
The constellation Lepus depicted as a Rabbit/Hare

Lepus
Lepus is a constellation lying just south of the celestial equator, immediately south of Orion. Its name is Latin for hare.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lepus_%28constellation%29

The picture presents us with "the Light of the world." His left foot is significantly placed upon the head of the enemy. He is girded with a glorious girdle, studded with three brilliant stars; and upon this girdle is hung a sharp sword. Its handle proves that this mighty Prince is come forth in a new character. He is again proved to be "the Lamb that was slain," for the hilt of this sword is in the form of the head and body of a lamb. In his right hand he lifts on high his mighty club; while in his left he holds forth the token of his victory -- the head and skin of the "roaring lion"  he has been victorious over the rebel cherub/sphinx. We ask in wonder,"Who is this?" and the names of the stars give us the answer.

The brightest, in the right shoulder, is named Betelgeuz, which means the coming (Mal 3:2) of the branch.

The next, in the left foot, is named Rigel, or Rigol, which means the foot that crusheth.The foot is lifted up, and placed immediately over the head of the enemy, as though in the very act of crushing it. Thus, the name of the star bespeaks the act.

The next star, in the left shoulder, is called Bellatrix, which means quickly coming, or swiftly destroying.

The name of the fourth star, one of the three in the belt, carries us back to the old, old story, that this glorious One was once humbled; that His heel was once bruised. Its name is Al Nitak, the wounded One. * Similarly the star, in the right leg, is called Saiph, bruised, which is the very word used in Genesis 3:15, thus connecting Orion with the primeval prophecy. Like Ophiuchus, he has one leg bruised; while, with the other, he is crushing the enemy under foot.

It is no mere coincidence that the constellations and star names echo the messianic prophecy of the "man" with the wounded foot, who crushes the enemy.
And it is also no surprise that the narrative in the heavens would be twisted by those cherubs who, pre-rebellion,  were present at the creation of the heavens.
More at the link: http://http://www.mt.net/~watcher/newun.html

Michael Jackson: This Is It Lyrics snippet
This is it, Here I stand
I'm the light of the world
I'll feel grand
Got this love, I can feel
And I know, Yes for sure
It is real

This is it
I can feel
I'm the light of the world
This is real
http://http://www.metrolyrics.com/this-is-it-lyrics-michael-jackson.html

The Ark of the Covenant

(http://http://jesswright.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/ark_of_covanent.jpg)

The Ark of the Covenant is a biblical vessel, solely containing the Tablets of Stone on which the Ten Commandments were inscribed.  The Ark also contained Aaron's rod and a jar of manna. The ark is a symbol of God's permanent covenant(s) with the Jewish people and others who believe in accord with the Judaic scriptures (Christianity, Islam etc.)

According to the Pentateuch, the Ark was built at the command of God, in accord with Moses' prophetic vision on Mount Sinai.  God was said to have communicated with Moses "from between the two cherubim" on the Ark's cover. The Ark and its sanctuary were considered "the beauty of Israel". Rashi and some Midrashim suggest that there were two arks; a temporary one made by Moses himself, and a later one constructed by Bezalel.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ark_of_the_Covenant

Holy Ark Announcement Due on Friday
by Hillel Fendel Published: 06/25/09

An Ethiopian church leader says Friday, June 26, marks the right time to unveil the Biblical Ark of the Covenant, which he says has been hidden in his church for centuries. Abuna Pauolos, Patriarch of the Ethiopian Orthodox Church, was in Rome this week to meet with Pope Benedict XVI. While there, he told reporters that the time had come to reveal before the world the Holy Ark. He said that the holy container has been in the custody of his church for hundreds of years.

Pauolos told the news outlet, "Soon the world will be able to admire the Ark of the Covenant described in the Bible as the container of the tablets of the law that G-d delivered to Moses, and the center of searches and studies for centuries." Pauolos said "The Ark of the Covenant has been in Ethiopia for many centuries. As Patriarch, I have seen it with my own eyes, and only a few, highly-qualified persons could do the same - until now.
http://http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/132067

After meeting with the Pope, it was announced that The Ark of the Covenant" would not be revealed.

Ethiopia - Ark of the Covenant Not To Be Revealed After All
06/26/09
"I am not here to give proofs that the Ark is in Ethiopia, but I am here to say what I saw, what I know and I can attest to. I didn't say that the Ark would be revealed to the world. It is a mystery, an object of veneration." ~Abuna Pauolos
http://http://nazret.com/blog/index.php/2009/06/26/ethiopia_ark_of_the_covenant_not_to_be_r

South Park
This episode is very unkind to Michael but is it just a coincidence?
South Park ran an episode in 2004 - Season 8 Episode 7 entitled "The Jeffersons". In this South Park episode a cartoon of Michael Jackson appears with the Ark of the Covenant.

(http://http://www.rumormillnews.com/pix5/jackson_ark.jpg)

Justice4MJ Has Gift4MJ ... But Will They GiveIt2MJ?
6/21/2010 12:45 AM PDT by TMZ Staff

(http://http://ll-media.tmz.com/2010/06/19/0619-justice4mj-trunk-ex.jpg)
http://http://www.tmz.com/2010/06/20/michael-jackson-anniversary-death-forest-lawn-cemetery-fans-memorial/

So could the announcement of Michael's "death" have been the actual revealing of a type of "Ark" a new covenant being of some type; the revealing of the long awaited Messiah?

But what does Khafre's version of the Sphinx represent?

Narmer
The first Pharaoh of Egypt was Narmer also known as Menes.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narmer

In his underground tomb (not a pyramid), there were 26 other burial chambers. Thirty-five of the chambers held the bodies of young people who had been sacrificed in order to serve him in the afterlife. The thirty-sixth chamber held a collection of bones, these were bones were investigated and it turned out that they were Lion bones.

In Egypt the Pharaoh was considered a God incarnate and which god they associated themselves with was often used in statuary and/or in their names. Kafre associated himself with Horus (maybe others) and Michael recreated himself as Khafre and has the falcon, which represents Horus, on his chest in the video "Remember The Time".

(http://http://membres.lycos.fr/invinciblejackson/hpbimg/rememberpics.jpg)

(http://http://lostandlit.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/shen-ring1.jpg)

The God that was worshipped during Narmer's lifetime was Aker (also known as Ruti).

Aker
In Egyptian mythology, Aker (or Akar) was one of the earliest gods worshipped, and was the deification of the horizon. There are strong indications that Aker was worshipped before other known Egyptian gods of the earth, such as Geb. In particular, the Pyramid texts make a sinister statement that the Akeru (plural of Aker) will not seize the pharaoh, as if this were something that might have happened, and was something of which to be afraid. Aker itself translates as (one who) bends, and thus Akeru translates as benders, though in what sense this is meant is not fully understood.

As the horizon, Aker was also seen as symbolic of the borders between each day, and so was originally depicted as a narrow strip of land, with heads on either side, facing away from one another, a symbol of borders. Since the sun reaches its peak (its solstice) in the zodiac of Leo, these heads were usually those of lions. Over time, the heads became full figures of lions (still facing away from each other), one representing the concept of yesterday and the other the concept of tomorrow.

Consequently, Aker often became referred to as Ruti, the Egyptian word meaning two lions. Between them would often appear the hieroglyph for horizon, which was the sun's disc placed between two mountains. Sometimes the lions were depicted as being covered with leopard-like spots, leading some to think it a depiction of the extinct Barbary lion, which, unlike African species, had a spotted coat.

Since the horizon was where night became day, Aker was said to guard the entrance and exit to the underworld, opening them for the sun to pass through during the night. As the guard, it was said that the dead had to request Aker to open the underworld's gates, so that they might enter. Also, as all who had died had to pass Aker, it was said that Aker annulled the causes of death, such as extracting the poison from any snakes that had bitten the deceased, or from any scorpions that had stung them.

As the Egyptians believed that the gates of the morning and evening were guarded by Aker, they sometimes placed twin statues of lions at the doors of their palaces and tombs. This was to guard the households and tombs from evil spirits and other malevolent beings. This practice was adopted by the Greeks and Romans, and is still unknowingly followed by some today. Unlike most of the other Egyptian deities, the worship of Aker remained popular well into the Greco-Roman era. Aker had no temples of his own like the main gods in the Egyptian religion, since he was more connected to the primeval concepts of the very old earth powers.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aker_%28god%29

(http://http://www.ladyoftheflame.co.uk/gfx/aker.jpg)
God Aker (Ruti)

For Namer, the lion represented both the God Aker but also the pharaohs strength. The sphinx that Khafre created represented the strength of the pharaoh through the use of the lions body but the intelligence of a man represented by the human head (a reproduction of Khafre's face).

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Sphinx1.png)
An Artist's historical recreation of what the Sphinx originally looked liked and how it was painted

There are actually 13 signs in the zodiac, Ophiuchus has been omitted.

New signs may lead to identity crisis
A "new" 13th zodiac sign, Ophiuchus, that the general public wasn't aware of, means not only some signs, but the advice that comes with it, have changed. Professor Parke Kunkle, an astronomy professor at Minneapolis Community and Technical College, piqued a reporter's interest in Ophiuchus, pronounced Ooh-FEE-yew-kus.

Kunkle didn't discover anything new, but the reporter focused on it, creating a buzz all over newspapers and the Internet. Ophiuchus is a constellation of a man holding a serpent, representative of a healer with a knowledge of medicine. Ophiuchus is the only sign associated with a real person, known to the Greeks as Serpentarius, the god Asclepius, son of Apollo.

Although many think Ophiuchus is a new sign, it has always been a part of the zodiac. "It's always been there, and I don't know why they are just bringing this up now," Astronomy Professor Alfred Alaniz said. The moon's gravitational pull has caused the Earth and the Sun's alignment to change and will continue to do so for the approximately 26,000 years it takes the sun to transit the entire zodiac, he said. The Babylonians discarded Ophiuchus from the zodiac to keep it to 12 signs. The transit across the constellations Scorpio and Leo are also short, but they made the Babylonians' cut.

Some zodiac dates overlap. For example, someone born Dec. 17 falls under Ophiuchus and Sagittarius. This overlap, a cusp, is when the Sun's path is exiting from one sign, but entering another. In astrology terms, it means you share the characteristics of both signs, maybe one sign more than the other.
http://http://www.theranger.org/mobile/new-signs-may-lead-to-identity-crisis-1.2449859

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/file.png)

August 29th...Michael Jackson is actually a Leo.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Leo.jpg)
Leo is represented by the Lion.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/SphinxintheMirror.jpg)
Sphinx gazing, across the Milky way, at the Lion in the constellation of Leo. Man in the Mirror.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Milyway.jpg)
Milky way from the Memorial during the performance of "Will You Be There", spoken prayer portion.

Revelation 5:1-5
1 And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals.

2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?

3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.

5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.
http://http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=revelations%205:1-5&version=KJV

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Solomonskeypainting.jpg)
The painting of Michael entitled "The Book".
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 10, 2011, 11:43:47 AM
The Dangerous Album Cover Autograph
The dangerous code may not be mathematical equation or could be multi-layerd. I have been thinking about this quite a bit because so many people seem to think that they "are no good at math" and every clue has had multiple and sometimes equivalent meanings, even when looking at it from another perspective.

Michael signed his signature in a similar but different fashion starting in 1988 but he signed the year as 1998 repeatedly (even in 1988).

In 1988 Michael was 30 years old the same age that Jesus was when he started his ministry.

This may not be an equation that requires a mathematical calculation at all but statements using the numbers and mathematical symbols instead of words.
Perhaps there is a dual meaning; numerological and/or a statement with a similar meaning for these signature configurations.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/dangerous-code.jpg)

An arrow pointing downwards = Decreasing

The numbers in this one are different than the rest and may be 666 in a vertical row = Satan and the Evil he does.

/ or inverted "v" = the wedge product of vectors u and v. This generalizes the cross product to higher dimensions.
In plain English this mean a number to a power, such as 10 to the power of 2 or 10x10

The division sign = divide by

The number 4 = Represents the union of the three Persons of the Saint Trinity in only one.
The Father (1) + The Son (1) + The Holy Spirit (1) + All One (1) = 4
4 = God

Starting in 1998 or take note of 1998; Decreasing Satan's Power by Dividing them through God

The Other Signatures

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/mj-fedora21.jpg)

(http://http://celebrityautographsthroughthemail.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/-25422206708581330.jpg)

Signature ending with a Star, 1998, Increasing arrow, 3 circles in a horizontal row

5 Points, Upright Star = A reference to divinity; the Sun, Jesus/Messiah, symbol of God (Isis' symbol is also a star).

An Arrow going upward = Increasing

Three Circles = A circle can represent God, it can also represent love (think wedding ring)
3 circles represents the trinity: God

Michael Jackson, The Son, starting in or take note of 1998; Increasing the Love of God (or God's Love or L.O.V.E.)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on February 10, 2011, 01:16:39 PM
Quote
Kunkle didn't discover anything new, but the reporter focused on it, creating a buzz all over newspapers and the Internet. Ophiuchus is a constellation of a man holding a serpent, representative of a healer with a knowledge of medicine. Ophiuchus is the only sign associated with a real person, known to the Greeks as Serpentarius, the god Asclepius, son of Apollo

Ophiuchus is "Rod of Asclepius", a rod with an intertwined snake, used today as a symbol of medicine. In this way, those born under the sign of Ophiuchus would be very intuitive people and would have some capacity to heal others.

(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ8_xfwtS0R2rqgTb0y9hlkkgJHJJUlvLWAl2XWYEp3p2FvEMAImg&t=1)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on February 10, 2011, 02:21:52 PM
Quote
Paula-c, "Ophiuchus is "Rod of Asclepius",

Is that the rod of an age where the Christ will rule with a rod of iron? Hmm...

SD, thanks for being so methodical with the deep heavy research needed for this topic that no one out there is even looking into. Yet this is so solid and clear. They're so distracted with many religious themes.

Just went back to an old fav site of mine. (Wordy but he has credentials). He mentions how the verses right before the "time shall Michael stand up", are talking about Egypt, which is where the world is focused right now. Timing?

Egypt in turmoil.
<!-- m -->http://www.askelm.com/news/n110201.pdf<!-- m -->

Daniel 11:40-12:3 (King James Version)
40And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.
41He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.
42He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape.
43But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps.
44But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many.
45And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.
Daniel 12
1And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
3And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. (This is all pictured in TII)

Universal Salvation of all mankind through Christ
Melchizedek and  Benedict the 16th
<!-- m -->http://www.askelm.com/news/n110101.pdf<!-- m -->

That was very interesting about the castle picturing sybols of David's tomb on the Encino piano. Amazing!
The Location and Future Discovery of King David's Tomb (long, skim to the end)
<!-- m -->http://www.askelm.com/temple/t061001.htm<!-- m -->
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Sarahli on February 11, 2011, 04:52:33 AM
Just want to add something about Salomon ... in the Quran he is not considered as a sinner on the contrary God states that he was a steadfast believer and never practiced witchcraft.

[2:102] They pursued what the devils taught concerning Solomon's kingdom. Solomon, however, was not a disbeliever, but the devils were disbelievers. They taught the people sorcery, and that which was sent down through the two angels of Babel, Haroot and Maroot. These two did not divulge such knowledge without pointing out: "This is a test. You shall not abuse such knowledge." But the people used it in such evil schemes as the breaking up of marriages. They can never harm anyone against the will of GOD. They thus learn what hurts them, not what benefits them, and they know full well that whoever practices witchcraft will have no share in the Hereafter. Miserable indeed is what they sell their souls for, if they only knew.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 11, 2011, 12:38:12 PM
Quote from: paula-c
Quote
Kunkle didn't discover anything new, but the reporter focused on it, creating a buzz all over newspapers and the Internet. Ophiuchus is a constellation of a man holding a serpent, representative of a healer with a knowledge of medicine. Ophiuchus is the only sign associated with a real person, known to the Greeks as Serpentarius, the god Asclepius, son of Apollo

Ophiuchus is "Rod of Asclepius", a rod with an intertwined snake, used today as a symbol of medicine. In this way, those born under the sign of Ophiuchus would be very intuitive people and would have some capacity to heal others.

(http://http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ8_xfwtS0R2rqgTb0y9hlkkgJHJJUlvLWAl2XWYEp3p2FvEMAImg&t=1)
I am going to split my response to your post Paula into separate posts because it is quite lengthy.

The Caduceus
The caduceus (Greek "herald's staff) is the staff carried by Hermes in Greek mythology. It is a short staff entwined by two serpents, sometimes surmounted by wings. In Roman iconography it was often depicted being carried in the left hand of Mercury, the messenger of the gods, guide of the dead and protector of merchants, shepherds, gamblers, liars and thieves.

(http://http://mysticmedusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/hermes.jpg)

The same staff was also borne by heralds in general, for example by Iris, the messenger of Hera.

(http://http://www.theoi.com/image/P21.4Iris.jpg)
Goddess Iris with Caduceus and nursing the infant Heremes

As a symbolic object it represents Hermes (or the Roman Mercury), and by extension trades, occupations or undertakings associated with the god. In addition to representing the god Mercury it also denotes the metal of the same name. Similarly, in later Antiquity the caduceus provided the basis for the astrological symbol representing the planet Mercury.

By extension of its association with Mercury/Hermes, the caduceus is also a recognized symbol of commerce and negotiation, two realms in which balanced exchange and reciprocity are recognized as ideals. This association is ancient, and consistent from the Classical period to modern times. The caduceus is also used as a symbol representing printing, again by extension of the attributes of Mercury (in this case associated with writing and eloquence).

The caduceus is sometimes mistakenly used as a symbol of medicine and/or medical practice, especially in North America, because of widespread confusion with the traditional medical symbol, the rod of Asclepius, which has only a single snake and no wings.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caduceus

Or is it that "Medicine" is not mainly about healing anymore but is instead focused on making MONEY. Think about doctor shopping and the number of people being over prescribed medications. Think about the Pharmaceutical industry and how drugs are pushed on us, there is a drug for everything and then another drug for the side effects of that drug and so on and so on. There are also drugs to numb our emotional pain, anti-depressants, so we don't have FEEL ANYTHING; we are numbed.

CDC: Antidepressants most prescribed drugs in U.S.
July 09, 2007|By Elizabeth Cohen CNN
Dr. Ronald Dworkin tells the story of a woman who didn't like the way her husband was handling the family finances. She wanted to start keeping the books herself but didn't want to insult her husband. The doctor suggested she try an antidepressant to make herself feel better. She got the antidepressant, and she did feel better, said Dr. Dworkin, a Maryland anesthesiologist and senior fellow at Washington's Hudson Institute, who told the story in his book "Artificial Unhappiness: The Dark Side of the New Happy Class." But in the meantime, Dworkin says, the woman's husband led the family into financial ruin.

"Doctors are now medicating unhappiness," said Dworkin. "Too many people take drugs when they really need to be making changes in their lives." n its study, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention looked at 2.4 billion drugs prescribed in visits to doctors and hospitals in 2005. Of those, 118 million were for antidepressants. (Topping the List) The use of antidepressants and other psychotropic drugs -- those that affect brain chemistry -- has skyrocketed over the last decade. Adult use of antidepressants almost tripled between the periods 1988-1994 and 1999-2000. Between 1995 and 2002, the most recent year for which statistics are available, the use of these drugs rose 48 percent, the CDC reported.
http://http://articles.cnn.com/2007-07-09/health/antidepressants_1_antidepressants-high-blood-pressure-drugs-psychotropic-drugs?_s=PM:HEALTH

Pharmaceutical Industry Revenues
For the first time ever, in 2006, global spending on prescription drugs topped $643 billion, even as growth slowed somewhat in Europe and North America. The United States accounts for almost half of the global pharmaceutical market, with $289 billion in annual sales followed by the EU and Japan. Emerging markets such as China, Russia, South Korea and Mexico outpaced that market, growing a huge 81 percent.

US profit growth was maintained even whilst other top industries saw little or no growth. Despite this, "..the pharmaceutical industry is — and has been for years — the most profitable of all businesses in the U.S. In the annual Fortune 500 survey, the pharmaceutical industry topped the list of the most profitable industries, with a return of 17% on revenue."
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pharmaceutical_industry#Industry_revenues
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 11, 2011, 12:42:35 PM
Hermes
Hermes is the great messenger of the gods in Greek mythology and additionally a guide to the Underworld. An Olympian god, he is also the patron of boundaries and of the travelers who cross them, of shepherds and cowherds, of the cunning of thieves, of orators and wit, of literature and poets, of athletics and sports, of weights and measures, of invention, and of commerce in general. His symbols include the tortoise, the rooster, the winged sandals, the winged hat, and the caduceus.

In the Roman adaptation of the Greek religion, Hermes was identified with the Roman god Mercury, who, though inherited from the Etruscans, developed many similar characteristics, such as being the patron of commerce.

The Homeric hymn to Hermes invokes him as the one "of many shifts (polytropos), blandly cunning, a robber, a cattle driver, a bringer of dreams, a watcher by night, a thief at the gates, one who was soon to show forth wonderful deeds among the deathless gods." He protects and takes care of all the travelers, miscreants, harlots, old crones and thieves that pray to him or cross his path. He is athletic and is always looking out for runners, or any athletes with injuries who need his help.

Hermes is a messenger from the gods to humans, sharing this role with Iris. An interpreter who bridges the boundaries with strangers is a hermeneus. Hermes gives us our word "hermeneutics", the study and theory of interpretation. In Greek a lucky find was a hermaion. Hermes delivered messages from Olympus to the mortal world. He wears shoes with wings on them and uses them to fly freely between the mortal and immortal world.  Hermes was the second youngest of the Olympian gods, being born before Dionysus. The satyr-like Greek god of nature, shepherds and flocks, Pan, was often said to be the son of Hermes through the nymph Dryope. In the Homeric Hymn to Pan, Pan's mother ran away from the newborn god in fright from his goat-like appearance.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermes

Ancient Olympics
The Ancient Olympic Games was a series of competitions held between representatives of several city-states and kingdoms from Ancient Greece, which featured mainly athletic but also combat and chariot racing events. The ancient Olympics grew out of religious festivals that many Greek cities held to honor their gods. As Greece became a bigger and more important country, the cities started holding a large festival as a sign of unity. They eventually chose a place called Olympia to hold the festival, partly because of its many religious temples. Every four years, all wars were stopped as the country came together to honor the god Zeus.

Although the ancient games were staged in Olympia, Greece, from 776 BC through 393 AD, it took 1,503 years for the Olympics to return. A Frenchman by the name of Baron Pierre de Coubertin had an idea to bring the games back. Coubertin presented his idea in 1894, and at first many had no interest in the revival of the games, but later it was voted unanimously to bring the games back. Coubertin went on to form the International Olympic Committee in 1896. It was first agreed the games were to be held in Paris in 1900, but delegates were so excited they couldn’t wait that long, and they decided to change the venue to Athens, the capital of Greece, and the date to 1896. The Olympics returned to the land of it’s birth and was a great success.

The victors of these early games were crowned with wreaths from a sacred olive tree that grew behind the temple of Zeus. According to tradition this tree was planted by Hercules (Heracles), founder of the games. The winners marched around the grove to the accompaniment of a flute while admirers chanted songs written by a prominent poet.
http://http://janecky.com/olympics/ancient.html
http://http://www.nostos.com/olympics/
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympic_Games

Dionysus  is a parallel God to the Egyptian God Osiris.

Osiris-Dionysus
Osiris-Dionysus refers to a group of deities worshipped in the Mediterranean Sea-area in the centuries prior to the birth of Jesus Christ. Many scholars believe that these deities are closely related and share many characteristics, such as that they are male and both part-human and part-divine, and that these characteristics are also shared by Christ himself, thus implying that Christ, and Christianity, is the result of normal religious evolution instead of historical fact. Detractors point out that many characteristics do not apply to Christ; however Dionysus, for example, was a bacchanalian and hedonistic god, yet he shared interesting similarities with Christ.
http://http://www.knowledgerush.com/kr/encyclopedia/Osiris-Dionysus/

 Dionysus is also known as Bacchus.

Dionysus
Dionysus  was the god of the grape harvest, winemaking and wine, of ritual madness and ecstasy in Greek mythology. His origins are uncertain, and his cults took many forms; some are described by ancient sources as Thracian, others as Greek. In some cults, he arrives from the east, as an Asiatic foreigner; and in others, from Ethiopia in the South. He is a god of epiphany, "the god that comes", and his "foreignness" as an arriving outsider-god may be inherent and essential to his cults. He is a major, popular figure of Greek mythology and religion, and is included in some lists of the twelve Olympians. His festivals were the driving force behind the development of Greek theater. He was also known as Bacchus.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dionysus

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Bacchus.jpg)

Pan
Pan in Greek religion and mythology, is the god of shepherds and flocks, of mountain wilds, hunting and rustic music, as well as the companion of the nymphs. His name originates within the Greek language, from the word paein, meaning "to pasture." He has the hindquarters, legs, and horns of a goat, in the same manner as a faun or satyr. With his homeland in rustic Arcadia, he is recognized as the god of fields, groves, and wooded glens; because of this,  Pan is connected to fertility and the season of spring. The ancient Greeks also considered Pan to be the god of theatrical criticism. One of the famous myths of Pan involves the origin of his pan flute, fashioned from lengths of hollow reed.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_%28god%29

Dionysus/Bacchus. Osiris, Pan, and Jesus (as well as Peter Pan & Robin Hood) are ALL "Green Man"Green man is a symbol of rebirth and resurrection.

Green Man
Parallels have been drawn between the Green Man and various deities. Many see him as being connected to the Mesopotamian Tammuz who is thought to symbolize the triumph of Life over Death (and Winter), Osiris, Odin, and even Jesus. Mythical figures such as Cernunnos, Sylvanus, Derg Corra, Green George, Jack in the green, John Barleycorn, Robin Goodfellow, Puck, and the Green Knight all partake of the Green Man's nature; it has also been suggested that the story of Robin Hood was born of the same mythology. A more modern embodiment is found in Peter Pan, who enters the civilized world from Neverland, clothed in green leaves. Even Father Christmas, who was often shown wreathed in ivy in early depictions, has been suggested as a similar woodland spirit.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Man

"I am Peter Pan" ~Michael Jackson or in other words "I am Green Man".
Audio Clip: http://http://www.zshare.net/audio/86427169270a6947/

(http://http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3593/3479150878_f85775b2f5.jpg)
Image on Golf Cart from Neverland

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Prince-and-Blanket.jpg)

'We are the World' to get Olympic debut
Published: Feb. 2, 2010 at 1:04 PM
The premiere of "We are the World: 25 for Haiti" is to air during NBC's coverage of the opening ceremony of the Vancouver Winter Olympics. The song's producers said it will have its television debut Feb. 12.
http://http://www.upi.com/Entertainment_News/Music/2010/02/02/We-are-the-World-to-get-Olympic-debut/UPI-98901265133868/

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/phpLwiU9FPM.jpg)
Michael as "Green Man" in the video for "We are The World" which debuted at the 2010 Olympics in Vancouver.

[youtube:11nhnmls]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Glny4jSciVI[/youtube:11nhnmls]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 11, 2011, 01:51:24 PM
The Goddess Iris
In Greek mythology, Iris is the personification of the rainbow and messenger of the gods. As the sun unites Earth and heaven, Iris links the gods to humanity. She travels with the speed of wind from one end of the world to the other, and into the depths of the sea and the underworld.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iris_%28mythology%29

(http://http://www.howarddavidjohnson.com/Iris_goddess_of_the_Rainbow.jpg)

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJ3_DUmVsFI/AAAAAAAAAHE/5eE5Jy8f3OY/s400/Fleur-de-lis.jpg)
The Fleur-de-lis on the gate sof Neverland. It represents the Iris and is associated with the Kings of France and is also used on the British Coat of Arms.

(http://http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcLSnvAbhI/AAAAAAAAAE4/CIeA7hkcsw8/s400/michael-jackson-reaches-his--final-resting-place--lrg.png)
Michael holds an Iris in the previously unseen "Liberian Girl" photograph used at the funeral.

(http://http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:eYMiCY_biWNcMM:http://parodyfiles.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/full_michael_jackson_funeral_011_wenn5346404.jpg&t=1)
Irises mixed in with Lilies on the casket at the funeral

In the interview with Oprah, Prince mentions "Skittles" when asked about his favourite memory of his father.
At about 8:46 in the video.

[youtube:grk04ggm]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcAFCF3z-bQ[/youtube:grk04ggm]

(http://http://images.sodahead.com/polls/000158241/polls_sk_paper2_3349_981007_answer_1_xlarge.jpeg)

Paris also talks about "Snickers".  Snickers was one of the paying advertisers (sponsors) of the 2010 Olympics. Both Snickers and the Olympics had a "Believe" theme.

(http://http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_kv0rstd3Q61qzasqko1_500.jpg)

(http://http://www.kimkalynphotographyblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/IMG_5188-ps.jpg)

And they both mentioned Coke/Soda.

[youtube:grk04ggm]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfU17niXOG8[/youtube:grk04ggm]

Heremeticism
Hermeticism or the Western Hermetic Tradition is a set of philosophical and religious beliefs or gnosis based primarily upon the Hellenistic Egyptian pseudepigraphical writings attributed to Hermes Trismegistus who is the representation of the conflation of the Egyptian god Thoth with the Greek Hermes. These beliefs have heavily influenced the Western Esoteric Tradition and were considered to be of great importance during the Renaissance.

In Late Antiquity, Hermetism emerged in parallel with Gnosticism, Neoplatonism and early Christianity, "characterized by a resistance to the dominance of either pure rationality or doctrinal faith". The books now known as the Corpus Hermeticum were part of a renaissance of syncretistic and intellectualized pagan thought that took place around the 2nd century. Other examples of this cultural movement would include Neoplatonist philosophy, the Chaldaean Oracles, late Orphic and Pythagorean literature, as well as much of Gnosticism.

The numerology that Elvis is reported as using is Chaladean, modern numerology favours the Pythagorean form. many of the texts of Gnosticism as been deemed heretical by the Christian church including the gospels of Mary Magdalene, and apostles Thomas and Phillip.

The extant Greek texts dwell upon the oneness and goodness of God, urge purification of the soul, and defend pagan religious practices, such as the veneration of images. Many lost Greek texts, and many of the surviving vulgate books, contained discussions of alchemy clothed in philosophical metaphor. And one text, the Asclepius, partially preserved in Latin, contained a bloody prophecy of the end of Roman rule in Egypt and the resurgence of pagan Egyptian power. The predominant literary form is the dialogue: Hermes Trismegistus instructs a perplexed disciple on some point of hidden wisdom.

Hermeticism as a Religion
"the Hermetic tradition was both moderate and flexible, offering a tolerant philosophical religion, a religion of the (omnipresent) mind, a purified perception of God, the cosmos, and the self, and much positive encouragement for the spiritual seeker, all of which the student could take anywhere".

Hermeticists commonly accept there to have been forty-two books to credited to Hermes Trismegistus. However, most of these books are reported to have been destroyed when the Great Library of Alexandria was razed.There are three major works which are widely known texts for Hermetic beliefs: The Corpus Hermeticum, The Emerald Tablet of Hermes Trismegistus, The Kybalion: Hermetic Philosophy

(http://http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/Mann_mit_Sonnenkopf_auf_Sonne_stehend.jpg)

The three parts of the wisdom of the whole universe
Astrology—The Operation of the Moon: Hermes claims that Zoroaster discovered this part of the wisdom of the whole universe, astrology, and taught it to man. In Hermetic thought, it is likely that the movements of the planets have meaning beyond the laws of physics and actually holding metaphorical value as symbols in the mind of The All, or God. Astrology has influences upon the Earth, but does not dictate our actions, and wisdom is gained when we know what these influences are and how to deal with them.

Theurgy—The Operation of the Stars: There are two different types of magic, according to Giovanni Pico della Mirandola's Apology, completely opposite of each other. The first is γοητεια, Goëtia, black magic reliant upon an alliance with evil spirits (i.e. demons). The second is Theurgy, divine magic reliant upon an alliance with divine spirits (i.e. angels, archangels, gods).

Theurgy translates to "The Science or art of Divine Works" and is the practical aspect of the Hermetic art of alchemy. Furthermore, alchemy is seen as the "key" to theurgy, the ultimate goal of which is to become united with higher counterparts, leading to the attainment of Divine Consciousness

Alchemy - The Operation of the Sun—is not simply the changing of physical lead into physical gold. It is an investigation into the spiritual constitution, or life of matter and material existence through an application of the mysteries of birth, death and resurrection. The various stages of chemical distillation and fermentation, among them, are aspects of these mysteries, that, when applied quicken Nature's processes in order to bring a natural body to perfection. This perfection is the accomplishment of the Magnum opus (Latin for Great Work).
 So the alchemist is in trying to turn other metals into gold because they believe that that through this ability  and knowledge, they will be able to transform their own and bodies and themselves into "Perfected Man"; literally change themselves into Gods.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermeticism

Gold was considered a divine metal to the Egyptians, it was believed to be the flesh of the gods
http://http://www.egyptartsite.com/symlst.html

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/MJGold.png)
Michael reappearing literally made of Gold in the video for "Remember The Time".

Audio clip: Michael saying "You want to show them "TIME", like you've never seen before" from the movie "This Is It"
http://http://www.zshare.net/audio/81007333ae95e3a4/

Modern uses of Alchmey
Persian alchemy was a forerunner of modern scientific chemistry. Up to the 16th century, alchemy was practiced by scientists such as Isaac Newton, who devoted considerably more of his writing to the study of alchemy than he did to either optics or physics, for which he is famous. Other eminent alchemists of the Western world are Roger Bacon, Saint Thomas Aquinas, Tycho Brahe, Thomas Browne, and Parmigianino. The decline of alchemy continued in the 18th century with the birth of modern chemistry, which provided a more precise and reliable framework for matter transmutations and medicine, within a new grand design of the universe based on rational materialism.

Alchemy in Traditional Medicine
Traditional medicines involve transmutation by alchemy, using pharmacological or a combination of pharmacological and spiritual techniques. In Chinese medicine the alchemical traditions of pao zhi will transform the nature of the temperature, taste, body part accessed or toxicity. In Ayurveda the samskaras are used to transform heavy metals and toxic herbs in a way that removes their toxicity. These processes are actively used to the present day.

Nuclear Transmutation
In 1919, Ernest Rutherford used artificial disintegration to convert nitrogen into oxygen. From then on, this sort of scientific transmutation has been routinely performed in many nuclear physics-related laboratories and facilities, like particle accelerators, nuclear power stations and nuclear weapons as a by-product of fission and other physical processes. A patent for a process to create gold and platinum from other elements using cold fusion has been filed.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alchemy#Modern_connections_to_alchemy

The Emerald Tablet (or Emerald Stela/Stele)
The Emerald Tablet of Hermes Trismegistos is a very brief text written in a symbolically rich form common to Alchemical and apocalyptic vision texts. Its legendary provenance is as the text of an ancient Stele inscribed by the antediluvian Master Hermes Trismegistos, and discovered in the tomb of Hermes by Apollonios of Tyana. The Emerald Tablet has for centuries held the status of Holy Book or Scripture for many Hermetists and Alchemists.
http://http://www.hermeticfellowship.org/Collectanea/Hermetica/TabulaSmaragdina.html

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Greentablet.jpg)

This Stela/Stele was translated by Sir Isaac Newton (c. 1680)

Sir Isaac Newton
Sir Isaac Newton was an English physicist, mathematician, astronomer, natural philosopher, alchemist, and theologian, and is considered by many scholars and members of the general public to be one of the most influential people in human history. His Philosophiae Naturalis Principia Mathematica (Latin for "Mathematical Principles of Natural Philosophy"; usually called the Principia), published in 1687, is one of the most important scientific books ever written. It lays the groundwork for most of classical mechanics. In this work, Newton described universal gravitation and the three laws of motion, which dominated the scientific view of the physical universe for the next three centuries. Newton showed that the motions of objects on Earth and of celestial bodies are governed by the same set of natural laws, by demonstrating the consistency between Kepler's laws of planetary motion and his theory of gravitation; thus removing the last doubts about heliocentrism and advancing the Scientific Revolution.

Newton was also highly religious. He was an unorthodox Christian, and during his lifetime actually wrote more on Biblical hermeneutics and occult studies than on science and mathematics, the subjects he is mainly associated with.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Newton

Newton is responsible for conceiving The Law of Gravity.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/php0Rs7uTPM.jpg)
Sign from the video for the song "Scream"

Up next the "The Emerald Tablet" and further connections...stay tuned!  <!-- s:D --> :D <!-- s:D -->
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 11, 2011, 03:03:15 PM
The Emerald Tablet (Stela/Stele) Translation
Newton's translation
One translation, by Isaac Newton, found among his alchemical papers, in modern spelling:

   1. Tis true without lying, certain most true.
   2. That which is below is like that which is above that which is above is like that which is below to do the miracles of one only thing.
   3. And as all things have been arose from one by the mediation of one: so all things have their birth from this one thing by adaptation.
   4. The Sun is its father, the moon its mother,
   5. the wind hath carried it in its belly, the earth its nurse.
   6. The father of all perfection in the whole world is here.
   7. Its force or power is entire if it be converted into earth.
          * Separate thou the earth from the fire, the subtle from the gross sweetly with great industry.
   8. It ascends from the earth to the heaven again it descends to the earth and receives the force of things superior and inferior.
   9. By this means ye shall have the glory of the whole world thereby all obscurity shall fly from you.
  10. Its force is above all force. for it vanquishes every subtle thing and penetrates every solid thing.
          * So was the world created.
  11. From this are and do come admirable adaptations whereof the means (Or process) is here in this.
  12. Hence I am called Hermes Trismegist, having the three parts of the philosophy of the whole world.
  13. That which I have said of the operation of the Sun is accomplished and ended.

Arabic translation
A new translation bypassing the Latin has just been published by Nineveh Shadrach from the original Arabic of Book of Causes attributed to Apollonius of Tyana.

   1. It contains an accurate commentary that can't be doubted.
   2. It states: What is the above is from the below and the below is from the above. The work of wonders is from one.
   3. And all things sprang from this essence through a single projection. How marvelous is its work! It is the principle [sic] part of the world and its custodian.
   4. Its father is the sun and its mother is the moon. Thus the wind bore it within it and the earth nourished it.
   5. Father of talismans and keeper of wonders.
   6. Perfect in power that reveals the lights.
   7. It is a fire that became our earth. Separate the earth from the fire and you shall adhere more to that which is subtle than that which is coarse, through care and wisdom.
   8. It ascends from the earth to the heaven. It extracts the lights from the heights and descends to the earth containing the power of the above and the below for it is with the light of the lights. Therefore the darkness flees from it.
   9. The greatest power overcomes everything that is subtle and it penetrates all that is coarse.
  10. The formation of the microcosm is in accordance with the formation of the macrocosm.
  11. The scholars made this their path.
  12. This is why Thrice Hermes was exalted with wisdom.
  13. This is his last book that he hid in the catacomb.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emerald_Tablet

The Egyptian Pyramids
The Egyptians built the pyramids to align with the stars.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Starmap2.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Map21.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Map32.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Abusir.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/3Map.jpg)

Wayne Hershel, who has studied this in depth, believes that the Egyptian pyramids where not only built to honour the Gods and house the remains of the pharaoh (God incarnated) until his resurrection... but also point the way to the star from which the Gods came. Wayne Herschel is also a survivor of a "Near Death Experience (NDE) and he states that he received this information while he was "dead".

Satanism
(http://http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTzK3QKJHopWtR6ReY5Bh7ww-_rUxKwOfAq32oy2PsEtqICiTEc&t=1)
baphomet

The Freemasons also use "As Above, So Below"
(http://http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSTnQBmj-u0N3r32eks552G9i7LJF-7-5cIzA9jC8HNJRlD2LsHqg&t=1)

The Tarot
(http://http://www.laetusinpraesens.org/docs10s/images/lifedise_files/As_above_so_below.jpg)

Modern films which depict the "Messiah" such as "The Matrix"
(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Matrix1.jpg)
Morpheus

Lady Gaga
(http://http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_ElQ6uj_xmu0/SwZNoeZvIxI/AAAAAAAAAtw/-c1WF27SEiU/s1600/3696.jpg)

Government Figures Statuary
(http://http://whatisthepyramid.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/washington_statue.jpg)
George Washington

Michael Jackson in the performance of "They Don't Care About Us" from the movie "This Is It"
(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/AsAboveSoBelow.jpg)

And it is even in a well known Christian Prayer which Jesus Christ taught to His disciples

Our Father
Our Father, Who art in heaven
Hallowed be Thy Name;
Thy kingdom come,
Thy will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread,
and forgive us our trespasses,
as we forgive those who trespass against us;
and lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil.
Amen.
http://http://www.catholicplanet.com/catholic/our.htm

And when we end an a prayer with "Amen", we are actually directing that prayer to an Egyptian God, with various forms of the his name:  Amen, Amon, Amun, Ammon and Amounra. Just google it...
READ MORE: http://http://www.seiyaku.com/customs/amen.html
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 11, 2011, 10:35:07 PM
Please note in the highlighted items in the map I previously posted.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Starmapedit.jpg)

In 1798-1799 Napoleon undertook an expedition to Egypt and he visited the Sphinx.

(http://http://pymd.com/Napoleon-meets-Sphinx-Gerome-1862.jpg)
Napoleon Bonaparte Before the Sphinx - Jean-Léon Gérôme (1867)

After Napoleon returned from Egypt in 1799, he commissioned this spectacular sculpted and jeweled piece of artwork.  This was Napoleon’s “talisman” or “good luck charm” as we might call it today.  Napoleon spent a considerable amount of time planning the intricate design of the jewels that compose the base of this sphinx. The jewels are arranged in a secret code that reflects Napoleon’s love for his wife, Josephine, and his successful military and political career.

(http://http://napoleonsphinx.com/images/DSC_1054-1.jpg)
http://http://napoleonsphinx.com/

Sirius is Isis Star. It appears along with Isis herself on the PARIS Coat of Arms Created by French ruler Napoleon.

(http://http://napoleonsphinx.com/images/ParisIsisboat.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/HIStoryStar1.jpg)
Star from teaser trailer for "HIStory"

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/HIStoryStar.jpg)
Star from teaser trailer for "HIStory"

The City of Paris is actually named after the goddess Isis.
Please recall from a previous post:
Ramesses II was issued an Egyptian passport that listed his occupation as "King (deceased)". The mummy was received at Le Bourget airport, just outside Paris, with the full military honours befitting a king.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramesses_II#Mummy

Paris
As early as the 15th century AD, many Parisian historians believed that the city of Paris owed its name to the Egyptian goddess Isis. There are various manuscripts from around 1402 AD at the Bibliotheque Nationale in Paris which contain drawings of the goddess Isis garbed as a medieval noblewoman seen arriving by boat to Paris and where she is greeted by nobles and clergymen under the caption ‘The very ancient Isis, goddess and queen of the Egyptians’.

(http://http://homepage.ntlworld.com/fusniak/talisman/images_articles/plate1b.jpg)
Plate 1. French Manuscript dated 1403 AD (Bibliotheque Nationale, Paris)

The idea of a 'boat' symbol come partly from the shape of the 'Ile de la Cite' (where stands Notre Dame Cathedral) which is boat-shaped, and also because ancient 'mariners' known as 'Nauts' populated the region."

(http://http://homepage.ntlworld.com/fusniak/talisman/images_articles/plate2c.jpg)
Plate 2. Official Seal of Paris, 1415 & 1406 AD.

As to why the name of the city was thought to have come from this Egyptian goddess, we have, for instance, the writings of a 14th century Augustine monk, Jacques le Grant, who claimed that: “In the days of Charlemagne (8th century AD)… there was a city named Iseos, so named because of the goddess Isis who was venerated there. Now it is called Melun. Paris owes its name to the same circumstances, Parisius is said to be similar to Iseos (quasi par Iseos), because it is located on the River Seine in the same manner as Melun.”

In 1512, the French historian Lemaire de Belge reported that an idol of the goddess Isis had been worshipped in the Abbey of St. Germain-des-Pres in Paris . The same curious belief was also reported by contemporaries, notably Gilles Corrozet, the first historian to produce a comprehensive guide for the city. In 1550 Corrozet published a history of Paris titled Les Antiquitez, Histoire et Singularitez de Paris, in which he wrote: “…coming to the imposition of the name (of Paris), it is said that there, where stands St. Germain-des-Pres was a temple of Isis of whom it is said was the wife of the great Osiris or Jupiter the Just. The statue (of Isis) having come in our times, of which we recall… This place is called the Temple of Isis and, for the nearby city, this was called Paris is… meaning near the temple of Isis.”

In 1608 the editors Pierre Bonfons and Jacques du Breul republished Corrozet’s book under their own names and retitled it Les Antiquitez et choses plus remarkables de Paris, recuillies par M. Pierre Bonfons et augmentees par Frere Jacques du Breul. Jacques du Breul was a Jesuit monk from St. Germain-des-Pres, and thus presumably conversant with the records kept at that Abbey. He wrote: “at the place where king Childebert (5th century AD) had constructed the church of St. Vincent now called St. Germain, and to which he donated his fief of Issy, the consensus was that there was there a temple of Isis, wife of Osiris, also known as Jupiter the Just, and from whom the village of Issy got its name, and where can still be seen an ancient edifice and murals which are believed to be from the castle of Cildebert.”

A few years later, in 1612, the historian Andre Favyn reported that the cathedral of Notre Dame des Champs had an idol of Isis similar to the one found in the nearby Abbey of St. Germain-des-Pres: “I believe this was due to another idol, for the proximity that there is with (Notre Dame) and the Abbey of St. Germain-des-Pres where was venerated Isis, called by the Romans Ceres…”

After his return from Egypt in 1799, Napoleon was to develop a curious interest for the Egyptian goddess Isis, and eventually set up a special commission headed by the scholar Louis Petit-Radel in order to verify whether or not the claims made by Gilles Corrozet and others that Isis was the true tutelary goddess of Paris was tenable.

After sometime, Radel reported to Napoleon that the evidence he had examined supported the claim that the ‘Boat of Isis’ was the very same as the ‘Boat of Paris’. Impressed by Radel’s report, Napoleon issued written instructions on the 20 January 1811 to the effect that the Egyptian goddess and her star be included on the coat-of-arms of the French capital city: “We have previously authorized and do also authorize now by these present signed document by our hand, that our good city of Paris will bear the coat-of-arms as shown and coloured on the attached drawing, at the front of the ancient ship, the prow loaded with a statue of Isis, seated, in silver on a sea of the same, and lead by a star also of silver.”

(http://http://homepage.ntlworld.com/fusniak/talisman/images_articles/plate3b.jpg)

Napoleon also constructed the the Arc de Triomphe in 1806, which stands on the western end of the avenue of the Champs Elysees. The name of the plaza upon which the Arc stands bears the name ‘Place de l’Etoile’ meaning:
‘The Place of the Star’.

(http://http://homepage.ntlworld.com/fusniak/talisman/images_articles/plate4b.jpg)
Plate 4. The Arc de Triomphe, Paris.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/TheArchOfTriumphHIStory.jpg)
Arch from the HIStory Teaser Trailer

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Arch-TIIMovie.png)
Arch from "They Don't Care About Us - The Drill" portion of the movie "This Is It"

On the left side of the Arc de Triomphe facing east, is depicted a scene of the ‘triumph’ of Napoleon in classical terms. Napoleon is seen standing, dressed like a Roman general, while a naked woman places a wreath upon his head. On his left can also be seen a Roman lady wearing a sort of tower on her head and kneeling in submission at the feet of the emperor. This lady is, in fact, the goddess Cybele, a very popular deity who was venerated throughout ancient Rome and Gaul.

(http://http://homepage.ntlworld.com/fusniak/talisman/images_articles/plate5b.jpg)
Plate 5. The Triumph of Napoleon, east façade of the Arc de Triomphe

The image of Cybele used for the Arc de Triomphe, however, was clearly borrowed from a bronze female head found in Paris in 1675 when the foundations of the church of St. Eustache were being excavated. According to Claude du Molinet, the bishop of St. Genevieve who first published the find in 1683, the head was of the goddess that, “…the Greek called Io and the Egyptians called Isis, and is the same as the one the Romans honored under the same of Cybele, being the Earth or Nature that the Egyptians married to Osiris who was the Sun, in order to make it fertile and mother of all productions that form within her breasts…”

(http://http://homepage.ntlworld.com/fusniak/talisman/images_articles/plate6ab.jpg)
Plate 6. The ‘Cybele’ head found in Paris in 1685
http://http://homepage.ntlworld.com/fusniak/talisman/articles/isisofparis.html

Michael named his daughter Paris and Debbie Rowe stated that they agreed on this name because she had been conceived in Paris...but is that the only reason?

Debbie Rowe Interview II (November 25, 1997)
KNBC (Channel 4) TV News in Los Angeles

Chuck Henry: So you're expecting?

Debbie: Yes, a little girl in May. And we are going to name her Paris-Michael Katherine. I wanted to just name her Michael after Michael but he said no. So we decided Paris because that's where she was conceived. Michael, because I really want Michael's name in her name; and Katherine after his mom.
http://http://www.mjfanclub.net/home/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=313:debbie-rowe-interview-ii-november-25-1997&catid=114:they-said&Itemid=110

(http://http://i709.photobucket.com/albums/ww91/princeparisblanket/Paris/ParisJackson.jpg)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on February 12, 2011, 04:17:53 AM
This is all so interconnected. Amazing!
Here's some Scriptures with constellations mentioned.
Quote
Job 38:31-33 (King James Version)
31Canst thou bind the sweet influences of Pleiades, or loose the bands of Orion?
32Canst thou bring forth Mazzaroth in his season? or canst thou guide Arcturus with his sons?
33Knowest thou the ordinances of heaven? canst thou set the dominion thereof in the earth?
Quote
Amos 5:8 (King James Version)
8Seek him that maketh the seven stars(Pleiades again) and Orion, and turneth the shadow of death into the morning, and maketh the day dark with night: that calleth for the waters of the sea, and poureth them out upon the face of the earth: The LORD is his name:
Here's an study on the Bible implying the 12 constellations are to point to the Messiah's role and purpose.
Quote
The Incarnate Son (Virgo) Isaiah 7:14
The Redeemer (Libra) 1 Cor. 6:20
The Sufferer (Scorpio) 1 Cor. 15:55-56
The Conqueror (Sagittarius) Rev. 6:2
The Sacrifice (Capricornus) Romans 3:25
The Living Water (Aquarius) John 7:38
The Liberator (Pisces) Gen. 48:19; Mark 1:17
The Crowned Lamb (Aries) Rev. 5:6
The Judge (Taurus) John 5:22
The King (Gemini) Romans 1:3
The Protector (Cancer) Isaiah 4:5-6
The Victor (Leo) Rev. 5:5
and more at  <!-- m -->http://www.horizonenergycorp.com/hpo/co ... /bible.htm<!-- m -->

Perhaps it is more than just pointing the the attributes of the Messiah, but possibly pointing to where the highest "heaven" or home of the Sons of God, the Elohim of the various juristictions of the Old Testament, where Yahweh was the specific Elohim of the Hebrew Israelites. Perhaps the Creator God Himself resides there although I feel He is more a force/spirit without a body.

Michael has many themes with UFO's, aliens, etc. in the movie ET and Moonwalker, music videos Scream, and the one I'd like to mention here is the Disney movie, Captain EO. This has been sitting on my mind for some time. Here's some info from Wiki, and after that I will give some of my thoughts.[attachment=0:smnobh84]<!-- ia0 -->800px-Captain_EO_Sign[1].jpg<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment:smnobh84]

Quote
The attraction, now entitled Captain EO Tribute, re-opened at Disneyland Park on February 23, 2010.[8] The attraction returned to Discoveryland at Disneyland Park (Paris) on June 12, 2010, returned to Epcot at Walt Disney World on July 2[9] and to Tokyo Disneyland on July 1. The attraction in fact returned to Epcot for a "soft opening" (actual opening to the public prior to the official opening) on June 30, 2010, two days prior to its official re-opening.
Quote
The story
The movie tells the story of Captain EO and the ragtag crew of his spaceship on a mission to deliver a gift to "The Supreme Leader", of a world of rotting, twisted metal and steaming vents. Captain EO's alien crew consists of his small flying sidekick Fuzzball, the double-headed navigator and pilot Idey (Debbie Lee Carrington) and Ody (Cindy Sorenson), robotic security officer Major Domo (Gary Depew), a small robot Minor Domo (who fits like a module into Major Domo), and the clumsy elephant-like shipmate Hooter (Tony Cox) who always manages to upset the crew's missions. Dick Shawn plays Captain EO's boss, Commander Bog.
Upon arriving on the planet, the crew is captured by the henchmen of the Supreme Leader, and brought before her. She sentences the crew to be turned into trash cans, and Captain EO to 100 years of torture in her deepest, darkest dungeon. Before being sent away, Captain EO tells the Supreme Leader that he sees the beauty hidden within her, and that he brings her the key to unlock it: his song, "We Are Here To Change The World".
The two robot members of the crew transform into musical instruments and the crew members begin to play the various instruments. As Hooter runs toward his instrument, he trips over EO's cape and breaks it, stopping the music. The spell broken, the Supreme Leader orders her guards to capture Captain EO and his crew.
Hooter manages to repair his instrument and sends out a blast of music, providing EO with the power to throw off the guards. He uses his power to transform the dark hulking guards into agile dancers who fall into step behind him for a dance number. As EO presses forward toward the Supreme Leader she unleashes her Whip Warriors, two cybernetic defenders each with a whip and shield that can deflect EO's power.
The others all run away leaving Captain EO to fight the Whip Warriors alone. EO is trapped by a closing gate and is preparing for a last stand as both the whip warriors draw their whips back for a final blow. Fuzzball drops his instrument and speedily flies over to tie the two whips together, causing the Whip Warriors to be thrown off balance giving EO an opportunity to transform them as well. With no further obstacles, EO uses his power to transform the Supreme Leader into a beautiful woman, her lair into a peaceful Greek temple and the planet into a verdant paradise.
A celebration breaks out to "Another Part of Me", as EO and his crew triumphantly exit and fly off into space.
I believe Michael's mission is to literally be the instrument of God to turn back the curse of sin that God has placed on our planet Earth, and turn the evil side to good, transforming the world back to the Eden state as described in Revelation 21-22. Remember he said that he could even have turned Hitler to the good side. The silly animal shipmates represent his helpers on earth to carry out the program. I really believe the movie EO describes God's ultimate plan for the planet Earth's complete regeneration, a magical breaking of the evil hold on mankind's heart. The Bible says that one day, "EVERY knee shall bow and EVERY tongue confess that Jesus is Lord". Every person who ever lived will have the veil taken away from their eyes and their heart given the capacity to believe. Satan, the adversary God created, wants to turn every human to "trash cans" or have them thrown in "hell" but God sends a liberator. I think there needs to be a full analysis of the movie EO in the MJ religious symbolism comparison. Michael was very young when he made this movie, but I'm sure he knew what he was doing, hoax-wise and message-wise fitting with his calling from God as he said, "An Instrument of Nature (God)". Details can be silly or child-like but still carry profound serious teaching.

Quote
The regeneration of all creation
<!-- m -->http://pjcockrell.wordpress.com/2009/01 ... -creation/<!-- m -->
“Our renewal is tied to the eschatological renewal of the creation. We cannot separate our present spiritual regeneration from cosmic regeneration because our present restoration to life is the first stage in the eschatological restoration of all creation to its proper vitality and relationship to God. We are the firstfruits.
The goal of redemption is nothing less the restoration of the entire cosmos. The scope of redemption is truly cosmic. Through Christ, God determined ‘to reconcile to himself all things’ (Col 1:20). Matthew 19:28 speaks of the renewal (the word is ‘regeneration’) of all things. Acts 3:21 also indicates a cosmic regeneration when it says that Jesus must remain in heaven ‘until the time comes for God to restore everything.’
Why must God regenerate, give new life and direction to, all things? Because the entire creation has been drawn into the mutiny of the human race (Rom. 8:19-24). Because man’s fall affected not only himself but also the rest of creation, redemption must involve God’s entire creation.”
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 12, 2011, 12:18:17 PM
@Sarahli Thank you for that information, I appreciate everyone's contribution. The material itself and the vast amounts of things can seem overwhelming at times. I am sure that I may miss many things. Your input is greatly appreciated.

@MJonmind
I am not ignoring you but I will get to your posts in a little bit. I have so much more information to post. I have known most of this for months. Some of it appears in th evideos "all Roads Lead to Egypt" but not all of it. I have discovered other connections since I made those videos, this is the reason I decided to make these posts and try to tie everything together.

I believe that this is the "why" behind the entire hoax and the other things that don't fit, the court case etc. are a means to draw people into the idea that Michael isn't dead and in the hopes that they will eventually discover the messianic connections and the true reasons behind all of this. There is a real group behind the "Illuminati" , there really is an effort for global dominance and control through a "New World Order" but it is all related to what I have been presenting in this thread.

I thank you for your patience, diligence, and for considering this information from an open minded perspective.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 12, 2011, 12:18:40 PM
(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Starmap3.jpg)

Ancient wall paintings found in a cave in France

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/CaveStarMap1.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/wallpainting2.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/StarMapCave.jpg)

The Egyptians weren't the only ones to erect their monuments to align with the stars.

The Sumarians
(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Dubai.jpg)

The United States
(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Washington.jpg)

The Washington Monument which is an obelisk. Obelisks are found all over Egypt, there is one in the center of St. Peter's square at the Vatican and several in the city of Paris.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/July4washingtonDC.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Sept15WashingtonDC.jpg)

The controversial face and pyramids on Mars
(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Mars.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Marsoverwashington.jpg)
The pyramids on Mars over-layed on Washington and the monuments line up

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Pentagon.jpg)

Why not just tell people I'm an alien from Mars. Tell them I eat live chickens and do a voodoo dance at midnight. They'll believe anything you say, because you're a reporter. But if I, Michael Jackson, were to say, "I'm an alien from Mars and I eat live chickens and do a voodoo dance at midnight," people would say, "Oh, man, that Michael Jackson is nuts. He's cracked up. You can't believe a single word that comes out of his mouth. ~Michael Jackson
http://http://ayenithegreat.wordpress.com/2009/06/26/michael-the-magic-the-mystery-the-madness/

I am not trying to say, that Michael is suggesting he actually is from Mars, but this statement may be more than just a criticism of the media's portrayal of Michael.

This is the view the Pope has from the balcony at the Vatican as related to landmarks and the stars
(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Starmaps2.jpg)

There is still more to come, as "Back" would say..."Keep Watching!"  <!-- s;) --> ;) <!-- s;) -->
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MissG on February 12, 2011, 12:35:08 PM
Reminder to read.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 12, 2011, 04:23:36 PM
Marked on this Map is also Pleiades.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Starmapedit.jpg)

Pleiades
In astronomy, the Pleiades, or Seven Sisters, is an open star cluster containing middle-aged hot B-type stars located in the constellation of Taurus. It is among the nearest star clusters to Earth and is the cluster most obvious to the naked eye in the night sky. Pleiades has several meanings in different cultures and traditions. The Pleiades are a prominent sight in winter in the Northern Hemisphere and in summer in the Southern Hemisphere, and have been known since antiquity to cultures all around the world.

The earliest known depiction of the Pleiades is likely a bronze age artifact known as the Nebra sky disk, dated to approximately 1600 BC. Some Greek astronomers considered them to be a distinct constellation, and they are mentioned by Hesiod, and in Homer's Iliad and Odyssey. Pleiades is mentioned three times in the Bible (Job 9:9 and 38:31, as well as Amos 5: 8) . The Pleiades (Krittika) are particularly revered in Hindu mythology as the six mothers of the war god Skanda, who developed six faces, one for each of them. Some scholars of Islam suggested that the Pleiades (Ats-tsuraiya) are the Star in Najm which is mentioned in the Quran.

They have long been known to be a physically related group of stars rather than any chance alignment. The Reverend John Michell calculated in 1767 that the probability of a chance alignment of so many bright stars was only 1 in 500,000, and so correctly surmised that the Pleiades and many other clusters of stars must be physically related. When studies were first made of the stars' proper motions, it was found that they are all moving in the same direction across the sky, at the same rate, further demonstrating that they were related.

Brightest stars in Pleiades
The nine brightest stars of the Pleiades are named for the Seven Sisters of Greek mythology: Sterope, Merope, Electra, Maia, Taygeta, Celaeno, and Alcyone, along with their parents Atlas and Pleione. As daughters of Atlas, the Hyades were sisters of the Pleiades. The English name of the cluster itself is of Greek origin, though of uncertain etymology. Suggested derivations include: plein, to sail, making the Pleiades the "sailing ones"; from pleos, full or many; or from peleiades, flock of doves.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Pleiades.jpg)
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleiades_%28star_cluster%29

The Egyptian God Ra - The Sun (The Son?)
To the Egyptians, the sun represented light, warmth, and growth. This made the sun deity very important as the sun was seen as the ruler of all that he created. The sun disk was either seen as the body or eye of Ra.

Ra was thought to travel on two solar boats called the Mandjet (the Boat of Millions of Years), or morning boat and the Mesektet, or evening boat. These boats took him on his journey through the sky and the underworld. When Ra traveled in his sun boat he was accompanied by various other deities including Sia (perception) and Hu (command) as well as Heka (magic power). Sometimes members of the Ennead helped him on his journey, including Set who overcame the serpent Apophis and Mehen who defended against the monsters of the underworld. Apophis, an enormous serpent tried to stop the sun boat's journey every night by consuming it or by stopping it in its tracks with a hypnotic stare. In the evening the Egyptians believed that Ra set as Atum or in the form of a ram. The Mesektet or Night boat would carry him through the underworld and back towards the east in preparation for his rebirth.These myths of Ra represent the sunrise as the rebirth of the sun by the sky goddess Nut, thus attributing the concept of rebirth and renewal to Ra and strengthening his role as a creator god. 

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/RabargeSnake.jpg)

During the New Kingdom, the worship of Ra became more complicated and grander. The walls of tombs were dedicated to extremely detailed texts that told of Ra's journey through the underworld. Ra was said to carry the prayers and blessings of the living with the souls of the dead on the sun boat.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra

The Egyptians also believed that the dead travelled to the underworld in these barges, boats or ships.

The funerary boat, which transported a mummy to its final resting place or, if buried with the deceased, took soul of the dead on its eternal journey.
http://http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/aboat.htm

(http://http://napoleonsphinx.com/images/ParisIsisboat.jpg)
Coat of Arms of Paris created by Napoleon

What is an Obelisk?
An obelisk (from Greek - obeliskos, diminutive of - obelos, "spit, nail, pointed pillar") is a tall, narrow, four-sided, tapering monument which ends in a pyramid-like shape at the top, said to resemble a 'petrified ray' of the sundisk. Obelisks were prominent in the architecture of the ancient Egyptians, who placed them in pairs at the entrance of temples. The obelisk symbolized the sun god Ra, and during the brief religious reformation of Akhenaten was said to be a petrified ray of the Aten, the sundisk. It was also thought that the god existed within the structure. The Ancient Romans were strongly influenced by the obelisk form, to the extent that there are now more than twice as many obelisks standing in Rome as remain in Egypt. All fell after the Roman period except for the Vatican obelisk and were re-erected in different locations.The tallest Egyptian obelisk is in the square in front of the Lateran Basilica in Rome at 105.6 feet tall and a weight of 455 tons
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obelisk

The Egyptian Obelisks of Rome
Saint Peter's Square
(Italian: Piazza San Pietro) is located directly in front of St. Peter's Basilica in Vatican City, the papal enclave within Rome. The open space which lies before the basilica was redesigned by Gian Lorenzo Bernini from 1656 to 1667, under the direction of Pope Alexander VII.

At the center of the ellipse stands an Egyptian obelisk of red granite, 25.5 meters tall, supported on bronze lions and surmounted by the Chigi arms in bronze, in all 41 meters to the cross on its top. It was originally erected at Heliopolis by an unknown pharaoh of the Fifth dynasty of Egypt. The Emperor Augustus had it moved to the Julian Forum of Alexandria, where it stood until year 37 A.D., when Caligula ordered the forum demolished and the obelisk transferred to Rome. He placed it in the center of the Circus, where it would preside over Nero's countless brutal games and Christian executions. It was moved to its current site in 1586 by the engineer-architect Domenico Fontana under the direction of Pope Sixtus V; the engineering feat of re-erecting its vast weight was memorialized in a suite of engravings. The Vatican Obelisk is the only obelisk in Rome that has not toppled since ancient Roman times. During the Middle Ages, the gilt ball on top of the obelisk was believed to contain the ashes of Julius Caesar. Fontana later removed the ancient metal ball, now in a Rome museum, that stood atop the obelisk and found only dust. Though Bernini had no influence in the erection of the obelisk, he did use it as the centerpiece of his magnificent piazza.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/st-peters-square_627.jpg)
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Peter%27s_Square

Fountain of the Four Rivers Obelisk
The Fontana dei Quattro Fiumi or "Fountain of the Four Rivers" is a fountain in Rome, Italy, located in the Piazza Navona. Designed by Gianlorenzo Bernini. The four gods on the corners of the fountain represent the four major rivers of the world known at the time: the Nile, Danube, Ganges, and Plate. The design of each god figure has symbolic importance. The great obelisk, which had been buried for a long time at Capo di Bove for the adornment of a magnificent fountain, was brought to Rome by the Emperor Caracalla. Pope Innocent X, had designs made by the leading architects of Rome.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/FourRiversobelisk.jpg)
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fontana_dei_Quattro_Fiumi

Piazza del Popolo
Piazza del Popolo is a large square in Rome, Italy. The name in modern Italian literally means "People's Square", but historically it derives from the poplars (populus in Latin, pioppo in Italian) after which the church of Santa Maria del Popolo, in the northeast corner of the piazza, takes its name.

The Piazza lies inside the northern gate in the Aurelian Walls, once the Porta Flaminia of ancient Rome, and now called Porta del Popolo. This was the starting point of the Via Flaminia, the road to Ariminum (modern Rimini) and the most important route to the north. At the same time, before the age of railroads, it was the traveller's first view of Rome upon arrival. For centuries, the Piazza del Popolo was a place for public executions, the last of which took place in 1826.

An Egyptian obelisk of Sety I (later erected by Rameses II) from Heliopolis stands in the centre of the Piazza. 3 sides of the obelisk are carved by Sety I and the fourth side, carved by Ramesses II. The obelisk, known as the obelisco Flaminio or the Popolo Obelisk, is the second oldest and one of the tallest obelisks in Rome (some 24 m high, or 36 m including its plinth). The obelisk was brought to Rome in 10 BC by order of Augustus and originally set up in the Circus Maximus. It was re-erected here in the Piazza by the architect-engineer Domenico Fontana in 1589 as part of the urban plan of Pope Sixtus V. The Piazza also formerly contained a central fountain, which was moved to the Piazza Nicosia in 1818, when fountains in the form of Egyptian-style lions were added around the base of the obelisk. This obelisk was originally a set of two but the 'mate' has not been found with a degree of certainty.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Piazza_Del_Popolo_obelisk_Rome1.jpg)
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piazza_del_Popolo

On top of the church of Santa Maria del Popolo located in this piazza, is a carving of "The Seven Hills of Rome". It is topped by a Star.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/7Hillscarving.jpg)

The Seven Hills of Rome
The Seven Hills of Rome east of the river Tiber form the geographical heart of Rome, within the walls of the ancient city. The original city was held by tradition to have been founded by Romulus on the Palatine Hill. It is sometimes stated that Revelation 17:9 refers to Rome as the 'Whore of Babylon". It reads: "This calls for a mind with wisdom. The seven heads are seven hills on which the woman sits."
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_hills_of_Rome

These Seven Hills of Rome align with the Seven Sisters of Pleiades.

The Pleiades appear to be an accurate orientation match with the Seven Hills of Rome’.
http://http://www.thehiddenrecords.com/vatican_page3.htm

Another piazza in Rome that is significant is an has a church, a fountain, an obelisk, and another interesting feature is "Piazza della Rotonda"

Piazza della Rotonda
Fontana della Rotonda (1711). The fountain setting for the Egyptian obelisk that faces the Pantheon was commissioned by the Albani Pope Clement XI; Barigioni was commissioned to re-erect an Egyptian obelisk (the Obelisco Macuteo) in the place of the central vase of Giacomo Della Porta's fountain (1575) in the centre of Piazza della Rotonda.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Piazza_della_Rotonda.jpg)
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filippo_Barigioni

Inside the Church, located at the Piazza della Rotonda, on the marble floor are 3 circles this line up with the Egyptian obelisk outside and the square and align with the 3 Stars in the constellation of Orion called "Orion's Belt".

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/PiazzaDellarotundamarblefloor.jpg)

At the "Place de la Concorde", where Napolean built the The Arc de Triomphe in Paris, there are two fountains. One of them is the "Fountain of River Commerce and Navigation" Next to the fountain is an Egyptian obelisk.

Place de la Concorde in Paris
After the 1830 July Revolution, the new King, Louis-Philippe, renamed the square Place de la Concorde and rejected the earlier project for the Place. In 1831, when the viceroy of Egypt, Mohammed Ali, gave the King the gift of an obelisk dating from the time of Ramses II from Luxor, Louis-Philippe selected Hittorff to design a setting for the obelisk in time for the 1833 July festival, intended to commemorate the anniversary of his rule. Shortly afterwards Louis-Philippe gave him a commission to redesign the entire square.

The principal influence on his fountain designs were the twin fountains in Piazza San Pietro in Rome, which also are placed on either side on an obelisk, and which Hittdorff had seen on a visit to Rome in the 1820s. Another influence was Piazza Navona in Rome, where two fountains were placed on either side of an obelisk. Like the fountains of Piazza Navona, the Fontaines de la Concorde were placed on an axis that connected the Church of the Madeleine and the Rue Royale to the north and the bridge to the Palais Bourbon to the south.

The Maritime Fountain, to the south, closer to the River Seine, represents the maritime spirit of France. Large semi-nude figures supporting the vasque represent the Mediterranean Sea and the Atlantic Ocean. Other figures beneath the vasque represent the industries of the sea; Coral, Fish, Shells and Pearls.

The figures are seated in the prow of a ship, the symbol of the City of Paris, and they are surrounded by dolphins spraying water through their nostrils. Above the vasque, supporting the mushroom-shaped cap, are figures representing the spirits of Maritime Navigation, Astronomy and Commerce. Next to them are swans which spout water into the basin below. In the basin, tritons and nereids hold fish which spout water upwards to the rim of the vasque.

The Fountain of the Rivers, to the north, closer to the Madeleine church, has large figures supporting the vasque who represent the Rhone River and the Rhine River. The other major figures represent the main harvests of France; Wheat and Grapes, Flowers and Fruit. The figures above the vasque who support the cap represent the spirits of River Navigation, Agriculture and Industry.
<!-- m -->http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fontaines_de_la_Concorde<!-- m -->

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/phpkMyLdIPM.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/phpF3Hw6QPM.jpg)

La disparition de Michael Jackson - The disappearance of Michael Jackson
Jermaine Jackson: "Michael wants us to continue" Jermaine Jackson, older brother of the King of Pop, will award the winners tonight of "In Search of Michael Jackson on W9.
http://http://www.leparisien.fr/michael-jackson/jermaine-jackson-michael-voudrait-qu-on-continue-23-11-2010-1162029.php

(http://http://www.leparisien.fr/images/2010/11/23/1162029_b994b816-f68d-11df-870d-001517810df0.jpg)
Jermaine Jackson poses at The Fountain of the Rivers, Place de la Concorde in Paris

In the Oprah interview, Paris Jackson said that one of her most favourite memories of her father was going up to the roof and looking at the lights of the Luxor Hotel, when they lived in Las Vegas...
At about 9:00 in the video

[youtube:35yjekg2]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcAFCF3z-bQ[/youtube:35yjekg2]

(http://http://www.visitingdc.com/images/luxor-hotel-address.jpg)
The Luxor Hotel in Las Vegas
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 12, 2011, 04:44:23 PM
I can't edit my last post and I forgot something:

Cris Angel's "Believe" show is also at the Luxor Hotel in Las Vegas

(http://cirquetribune.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10039/normal_crissangel_visual.jpg)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: paula-c on February 13, 2011, 12:37:56 PM
Quote
Serenitys_Dream wrote:

paula-c wrote:
Kunkle didn't discover anything new, but the reporter focused on it, creating a buzz all over newspapers and the Internet. Ophiuchus is a constellation of a man holding a serpent, representative of a healer with a knowledge of medicine. Ophiuchus is the only sign associated with a real person, known to the Greeks as Serpentarius, the god Asclepius, son of Apollo

Ophiuchus is "Rod of Asclepius", a rod with an intertwined snake, used today as a symbol of medicine. In this way, those born under the sign of Ophiuchus would be very intuitive people and would have some capacity to heal others.


I am going to split my response to your post Paula into separate posts because it is quite lengthy. ;)



Thank you for the explanation and throughout the investigation, in truth all this gives much  for thought.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 13, 2011, 02:42:37 PM
So the layout of Vatican/Rome is shaped like a key.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/VaticanCityKey.jpg)

The end of the Key is in the shape of a Pentagram.

(http://http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7f/Pentagram_green.svg/200px-Pentagram_green.svg.png)
An Upright Pentagram

The pentagram is used as a Christian symbol for the five senses, and if the letters S, A, L, V, and S are inscribed in the points, it can be taken as a symbol of health (from Latin salus). Medieval Christians believed that the "pentalpha" symbolizes the five wounds of Christ.

Michael has worn and used the upright Pentagram in various videos such "HIStory".

(http://http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/HIStoryStar.jpg)

Vitruvian Man proportionally fits into this Star at the end of the key configuration.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/V-ManVatican.jpg)

Please notice that the  RIGHT foot of the Star is on land and the LEFT on Water. This is in direct opposition to the description of given in Revelations 10 of the Bible. Please also remember that we are talking about the "Holy City of Rome and the Vatican". What does this say about the christian church as we know it today? I know what I am thinking but it isn't up to me to decide for you.

Revelation 10: 1-4
1 And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, clothed with a cloud: and a rainbow was upon his head, and his face was as it were the sun, and his feet as pillars of fire:

2 And he had in his hand a little book open: and he set his right foot upon the sea, and his left foot on the earth,

3 And cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roareth: and when he had cried, seven thunders uttered their voices.

4 And when the seven thunders had uttered their voices, I was about to write: and I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Seal up those things which the seven thunders uttered, and write them not.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/phpPgdmkyPM.jpg)
Da Vinci's drawing of Vitruvian Man - "perfect proportions"

Vitruvian Man's actually originates from the Egyptians and their ideas on proportions and architecture.

(http://http://www.aiwaz.net/uploads/gallery/202.gif)

Vitruvian Man is Perfected or Perfect Man and Jesus/messiah is considered to be "Perfect Man". In Christian imagery, Jesus has been previously depicted in a similar way as Vitruvian Man and over-layed on a pentagram.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/ts.jpg)
Christ as a Pentagram, from Valeriano Bolzani's Hieroglyphica (Basel, 1556)

Just a note: Since I originally posted the above drawing, it has been removed from wikipedia and therefore from the other sites that linked it directly. I retrieved it from the archives by searching for the actual image itself.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/phpUkVLa6PM.jpg)
Michael from the video for "Scream"

Alchemy's goal is to transform man into a perfect man, a God and Alchemy is one of the basis of Heremticism. Alchemy is still used today ans is referred to a "Scientific Transmutation" in the realm of PHYSICS regarding Nuclear Energy. Nuclear Energy, results from particle collision; smashing atoms. Particle physics is the study of smashing theses atoms and the particles that are result from the collisions. Particle physics has evolved out of its parent field of nuclear physics and the dynamics of particle physics are governed by Quantum Mechanics.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alchemy#Modern_connections_to_alchemy
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Particle_physics
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_mechanics

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/MJGold.png)
Michael reappearing literally made of Gold (The Flesh of The Gods) in the video for "Remember The Time".

Inside the Pentagram in Rome is an Ancient Castle,  "Castel Sant'Angelo".

In Dan Brown's book, "Angels & Demons", this building is referred to as the "STAR FORTRESS".

Castel Sant'Angelo
The Mausoleum of Hadrian, usually known as the Castel Sant'Angelo, is a towering cylindrical building in Rome. It was initially commissioned by the Roman Emperor Hadrian as a mausoleum for himself and his family. The building was later used by the popes as a fortress and castle, and is now a museum.

Papal fortress, residence and prison
The popes converted the structure into a castle, from the 14th century; Pope Nicholas III connected the castle to St. Peter's Basilica by a covered fortified corridor called the Passetto di Borgo. The fortress was the refuge of Pope Clement VII from the siege of Charles V's Landsknechte during the Sack of Rome (1527), in which Benvenuto Cellini describes strolling the ramparts and shooting enemy soldiers.

Leo X built a chapel with a fine Madonna by Raffaello da Montelupo. In 1536 Montelupo also created a marble statue of Saint Michael (Archangel Michael) holding his sword after the 590 plague to surmount the Castel.] Later Paul III built a rich apartment, to ensure that in any future siege the Pope had an appropriate place to stay.

Montelupo's statue was replaced by a bronze statue of the same subject, executed by the Flemish sculptor Peter Anton von Verschaffelt, in 1753. Verschaffelt's is still in place, though Montelupo's can be seen in an open court in the interior of the Castle.

The Papal state also used Sant'Angelo as a prison; Giordano Bruno, for example, was imprisoned there for six years. Executions were made in the small interior square. As a prison, it was also the setting for the third act of Giacomo Puccini's Tosca from whose ramparts the eponymous heroine of the opera leaps to her death.

The Castel Sant'Angelo appeared in Dan Brown's 2000 novel Angels & Demons. The location was the secret lair for the Hassassin and was seen as the last existing church of the Illuminati. The book also emphasized the Passetto di Borgo as a secret way of getting from the Vatican to the castle. It also appears in the 2009 motion picture, Angels & Demons, as one of the locations where a clue that leads to the papal assassin resides.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castel_Sant%27Angelo

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/CastelSantAngelo.jpg)
Castel Sant'Angelo the statue depicts the Archangel Michael from whom the building derives its name.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/ArchangelMichaelCastelSantAngelo.jpg)
Archangel Michael with his Sword which stands atop Castel Sant'Angelo

In this depiction of Archangel Michael he has a sword pointed up to the heavens.

Michael has worn a fencing outfit before. This signifies someone who wields a sword.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Fencing1.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Fencing2a.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Fencing3.jpg)
HIStory Tour. Please note that he uses the "Devils Horns" hand sign but he inverts it in a gesture meaning F...U.

Revelation 10:5-11
5 And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven,

6 And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:
(Newton: Gravity, Einstein: Special Relativity - Gravity, Space, Time, Time-Travel, Quantum Physics)

Audio clip: Michael saying "You want to show them "TIME", like you've never seen before" from the movie "This Is It"
http://http://www.zshare.net/audio/81007333ae95e3a4/

7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
(Could the Seventh Angel be Archangel Michael? Afterall, Seven is the number of Divinity combining the numbers 3 -the spiritual, the trinity or God with the number 4 the material, the earth)

8 And the voice which I heard from heaven spake unto me again, and said, Go and take the little book which is open in the hand of the angel which standeth upon the sea and upon the earth.

9 And I went unto the angel, and said unto him, Give me the little book. And he said unto me, Take it, and eat it up; and it shall make thy belly bitter, but it shall be in thy mouth sweet as honey.

10 And I took the little book out of the angel's hand, and ate it up; and it was in my mouth sweet as honey: and as soon as I had eaten it, my belly was bitter.

11 And he said unto me, Thou must prophesy again before many peoples, and nations, and tongues, and kings.

This leads  back to the painting of Michael entitled "The Book, in which Michael is dressed as Royalty and has a book in his lap and Revelations 5.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Solomonskeypainting.jpg)

Revelation 5:1-5
1 And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals.

2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?
(Archangel Michael proclaiming that only he, himself, is worthy to open "The Book"?)

3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.

5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.
(A descendent of King David shall open "The Book" and his symbol is the Lion)
http://http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=revelations%205:1-5&version=KJV

Continued in the next post...
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 13, 2011, 02:45:13 PM
Archangel Michael
Michael is an archangel in Jewish, Christian, and Islamic tradition. He is viewed as the field commander of the Army of God.
God = Love; Michael's Army of Love

He is mentioned by name in the Book of Daniel, the Book of Jude, and the Book of Revelation, in which he leads God's armies against Satan's forces during his uprising.
"We only have 4 years to get this right";...to bring about a "change"  ~ MJ in the Film "This Is It"

In the book of Daniel, Michael appears as "one of the chief princes" who in Daniel's vision comes to Gabriel's aid in his contest with the angel of Persia (Dobiel). Michael is also described there as the advocate of the Children of Israel and as a "great prince who stands up for the children of your people".

In Hebrew, Michael means "who is like God"
He who is God incarnated in human form? "I'm Only Human" ~ MJ,
which in Talmudic tradition is interpreted as a rhetorical question: "Who is like God?" (which expects an answer in the negative) to imply that no one is like God. In this way, Michael is reinterpreted as a symbol of humility before God. hmm...Are they sure it is a rhetorical question?

Much of the late Midrashic detail about Michael was transmitted to Christianity through the Book of Enoch, whence it was taken up and further elaborated. Christian cultus devoted to the archangel Michael was first initiated in the East, as a healer, at Chonae near Colossae in Phrygia and in the West, at the end of the fifth century, as a patron in war, at Monte Sant'Angelo sul Gargano. In late medieval Christianity, Michael, together with Saint George, became the patron saint of chivalry. Jean Molinet was one who glorified the primordial feat of arms of the archangel Michael as "the first deed of knighthood and chivalrous prowess that was ever achieved."  Thus Michael was the natural patron of the first chivalric order of France, the Order of Saint Michael of 1469. In the British honours system, a chivalric order founded in 1818 is also named for these two saints, the Order of St Michael and St George. Michael is also considered in many Christian circles as the patron saint of the warrior. Police officers and soldiers, particularly paratroopers and fighter pilots, regard him as their patron. He is the Patron of the Catholic Police Guild. He is also a patron of Germany, the City of Brussels, and Kiev.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Knight1.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Knight4.jpg)
King Arthur, who pulled the Sword from the Stone.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Camelot2.jpg)
Michael as King Arthur from Camelot and the Knights of the Round Table.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Knight3.jpg)
Michael being Knighted and crowned as King

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Knight2.jpg)
Michael sent photos and messages to the artist about his depiction in this painting, which was released after June 25, 2009.

Michael, is mentioned by name in the Qur'an and is revered in Islam. Islamic tradition holds that God has made Michael in charge of providing rain and thunder. Roman Catholics, Anglicans, and Lutherans refer to him as Saint Michael the Archangel and also simply as Saint Michael. Orthodox Christians refer to him as the Taxiarch Archangel Michael or simply Archangel Michael. Jehovah's Witnesses, Seventh-day Adventists, and certain New Age Christian denominations refer to Michael as the Christ Michael, or Christ before he became man. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints teaches that Michael is the heavenly form of Adam from the Book of Genesis.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_%28archangel%29

Carlos Santana Pays Tribute To Michael Jackson
OCTOBER 7, 2010
At his recent concert at London's O2 Arena, Carlos Santana dedicated the show to Michael Jackson, calling the King of Pop an "Archangel," according to reports by Bloomberg News and the London Evening Standard newspaper. Santana, one of the world's greatest guitarists, is one of many artists who have paid respect to Michael in concert tours during the past year. Michael had been scheduled to perform in residency at the O2 Arena for the "This Is It" concerts, making Santana's dedication all the more poignant.
http://http://www.michaeljackson.com/us/news/carlos-santana-pays-tribute-michael-jackson

Joe Jackson Blings MJ Back from the Dead
10/22/2010 2:00 PM PDT by TMZ Staff 

(http://http://ll-media.tmz.com/2010/10/22/1022-joe-jackson-necklace-credit.jpg)
http://www.tmz.com/2010/10/22/joe-jackson-michael-jackson-bling-chain-necklace/

Symbolizing Archangel Michael Jackson
(http://http://www.michaeljacksonbelts.com/sites/default/files/mj-necklace.jpg)

Michael also claimed to be a Healer (Rabbi Shmuley tapes of Michael, Michael recorded and sent healing messages to people such as Sony head Morita, Gavin Arvizo, the 2005 molestation case, miraculously healed of cancer) just as Archangel is described as being a healer. Elvis also reported that he had the ability to heal and Princess Diana was reputed to also be healer

What does a surgical mask signify?
A Doctor.

What does a Doctor signify?
A Healer.

(http://http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/en/doc/2003-11/28/xin_ffd1a24e28fc43bf99fb05f917ace7e6_odd.jpg)

And who else was a healer?
Jesus, who healed the sick, restored sight to the blind, and resurrected the dead (Lazarus).
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 14, 2011, 09:48:00 PM
Egyptians and Medicine
There have been several ancient papyrus found which show the Egyptians had medical knowledge, wrote prscriptions and also had extensive knowledge of Mathematics. These include the Kahun Papyrus, the Ebers Papyrus and Smith Papyrus.
http://http://www.crystalinks.com/egyptmedicine.html
http://http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/kahun.htm
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kahun_Papyri
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ebers_Papyrus
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwin_Smith_Papyrus

The modern Rx symbol, which is associated with prescriptions, has actually evolved from the Eye of Horus symbol.

(http://http://www.endomail.com/images/adrx03.jpg)

(http://http://www.endomail.com/images/adrx02.jpg)

(http://http://www.free-tattoo.com/tattoo/tribal-tattoo-eye-of-horus.jpg)

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/invincible.jpg)

(http://http://www.mjtmc.com/images/invincible.jpg)

Take This Medicine: The Story of the Sign 'Rx'
How a special sign came to mean a doctor’s prescription.
 
The story for today is very old. It goes back about five-thousand years. It is about a sign that is used to represent some words.  We see this sign on drug stores and whenever we visit a doctor to get an order for medicine. It also appears on bottles of pills and other medicines.The sign is formed by a line across the right foot of the letter "R."  It represents the word "prescription." It has come to mean "take this medicine."The sign has its beginnings five thousand years ago in Egypt. At that time, people prayed to Horus, the god of the Sun. It was said that when Horus was a child, he was attacked by Seth, the demon of evil.

The evil Seth put out the eye of the young Horus. The mother of Horus called for help.  Her cry was answered by Thoth, the god of learning and magic.  Thoth, with his wisdom and special powers, healed the eye of Horus. And the child was able to see again.

The ancient Egyptians used a drawing of the eye of Horus as a magic sign to protect themselves from disease, suffering and evil. They cut this sign in the stones they used for buildings. And it was painted on the papyrus rolls used for writing about medicine and doctors. For thousands of years, the eye of Horus remained as a sign of the god's help to the suffering and sick.

Long after the fall of the ancient Egyptian civilization, doctors and alchemists in Europe continued the custom of showing a sign of the gods' help and protection. But over the years, the sign changed from the eye of Horus to the sign for Jupiter, the chief god of the Romans. Jupiter's sign looked much like the printed number "four."

That sign changed, also. Today, it is the easily-recognized capital "R" with a line across its foot. The sign no longer offers heavenly assistance to the sick. It now means "take this medicine."
http://http://www.voanews.com/learningenglish/home/a-23-2009-03-21-voa3-83143007.html

The Eyes of Horus
"Let the Eye of Horus come forth from the god and shine outside his mouth." The Pyramid Texts

(http://http://www.sangraal.com/library/images/eyesof1.jpg)
Horus "who rules with two eyes"

(http://http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/TheRightEyeHIStory.jpg)
HIStory Teaser Trailer - Right Eye

(http://http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/droopinghalo/TheLeftEye.jpg)
HIStory Teaser Trailer - Left Eye

Utchat
The word utchat, sometimes spelled udjat, refers to Egypt's sacred eye symbol. The right eye is called the Eye of Ra, symbolizing the sun. The left is called the Eye of Thoth, symbolizing the moon. Both eyes together are the Two Eyes Of . The eye is the part of the body able to perceive light, and is therefore the symbol for spiritual ability.

(http://http://www.sangraal.com/library/images/eyesof2.jpg)
The Right Eye of Horus represents concrete factual information controlled by the left brain. It deals with words, letters, and numbers and those things which are describable in terms of sentences or complete thoughts. It approaches the universe in terms of male oriented ideation.

(http://http://www.sangraal.com/library/images/eyesof3.jpg)
The Left Eye of Horus represents abstract aesthetic information controlled by the right brain. It deals with esoteric thoughts and feelings and is responsible for intuition. It approaches the universe in terms of female oriented ideation. We use the Left Eye, female oriented, right side of our brain for feeling and intuition.
http://http://www.sangraal.com/library/eyesofhorus.htm

Horus The Elder
Is one of the oldest gods of Egypt. He was a sky god, whose face was visualized as the face of the sun. As a result his name ("Heru") was sometimes translated as "face", rather than "distant one", and was sometimes modified to "Herut" ("sky").

He was originally considered to be the counterpart and enemy of Set. While Horus represented Lower Egypt, Set represented Upper Egypt, and the two were locked in a battle which would not be won or lost until the world ended and everything slipped back into chaos. This myth evolved and soon it was thought that Horus and Set fought for eighty years before the Council of the Gods ruled that Horus should rule Egypt. It may seem strange that Horus was associated with Lower Egypt and yet he is associated with Nekhen, in Upper Egypt. It has been suggested that Horus actually originated in Upper Egypt (as  Horus Behedet in Behedet) and that his cult spread north with the unification of the country under Narmer or Hor Aha

He was the son or husband of Hathor and was considered to be a creator god and the archetypal king. His right eye was the sun and his left eye was the moon and images of the "Eyes of Horus" were considered to be powerful protective amulets. His speckled feathers formed the stars and his wings created the wind.
http://www.ancientegyptonline.co.uk/heruur.html

The Healer - Michael Jackson

(http://http://media.mnginteractive.com/media/paper36/0228jackson.jpg)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6kY5Fy2LbM[/youtube]

And just one of the many "Healing Tapes" he has sent to us all...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_oC5FE5cxs[/youtube]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on February 15, 2011, 12:06:34 AM
Quote from: Serenitys_Dream
The Goddess Iris
In Greek mythology, Iris is the personification of the rainbow and messenger of the gods. As the sun unites Earth and heaven, Iris links the gods to humanity. She travels with the speed of wind from one end of the world to the other, and into the depths of the sea and the underworld.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iris_%28mythology%29

(http://http://www.howarddavidjohnson.com/Iris_goddess_of_the_Rainbow.jpg)

(http://http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJ3_DUmVsFI/AAAAAAAAAHE/5eE5Jy8f3OY/s400/Fleur-de-lis.jpg)
The Fleur-de-lis on the gate sof Neverland. It represents the Iris and is associated with the Kings of France and is also used on the British Coat of Arms.

(http://http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcLSnvAbhI/AAAAAAAAAE4/CIeA7hkcsw8/s400/michael-jackson-reaches-his--final-resting-place--lrg.png)
Michael holds an Iris in the previously unseen "Liberian Girl" photograph used at the funeral.

(http://http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:eYMiCY_biWNcMM:http://parodyfiles.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/full_michael_jackson_funeral_011_wenn5346404.jpg&t=1)
Irises mixed in with Lilies on the casket at the funeral

In the interview with Oprah, Prince mentions "Skittles" when asked about his favourite memory of his father.
At about 8:46 in the video.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcAFCF3z-bQ[/youtube]

(http://http://images.sodahead.com/polls/000158241/polls_sk_paper2_3349_981007_answer_1_xlarge.jpeg)

Paris also talks about "Snickers".  Snickers was one of the paying advertisers (sponsors) of the 2010 Olympics. Both Snickers and the Olympics had a "Believe" theme.

(http://http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_kv0rstd3Q61qzasqko1_500.jpg)

(http://http://www.kimkalynphotographyblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/IMG_5188-ps.jpg)

And they both mentioned Coke/Soda.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfU17niXOG8[/youtube]

Heremeticism
Hermeticism or the Western Hermetic Tradition is a set of philosophical and religious beliefs or gnosis based primarily upon the Hellenistic Egyptian pseudepigraphical writings attributed to Hermes Trismegistus who is the representation of the conflation of the Egyptian god Thoth with the Greek Hermes. These beliefs have heavily influenced the Western Esoteric Tradition and were considered to be of great importance during the Renaissance.

In Late Antiquity, Hermetism emerged in parallel with Gnosticism, Neoplatonism and early Christianity, "characterized by a resistance to the dominance of either pure rationality or doctrinal faith". The books now known as the Corpus Hermeticum were part of a renaissance of syncretistic and intellectualized pagan thought that took place around the 2nd century. Other examples of this cultural movement would include Neoplatonist philosophy, the Chaldaean Oracles, late Orphic and Pythagorean literature, as well as much of Gnosticism.

The numerology that Elvis is reported as using is Chaladean, modern numerology favours the Pythagorean form. many of the texts of Gnosticism as been deemed heretical by the Christian church including the gospels of Mary Magdalene, and apostles Thomas and Phillip.

The extant Greek texts dwell upon the oneness and goodness of God, urge purification of the soul, and defend pagan religious practices, such as the veneration of images. Many lost Greek texts, and many of the surviving vulgate books, contained discussions of alchemy clothed in philosophical metaphor. And one text, the Asclepius, partially preserved in Latin, contained a bloody prophecy of the end of Roman rule in Egypt and the resurgence of pagan Egyptian power. The predominant literary form is the dialogue: Hermes Trismegistus instructs a perplexed disciple on some point of hidden wisdom.

Hermeticism as a Religion
"the Hermetic tradition was both moderate and flexible, offering a tolerant philosophical religion, a religion of the (omnipresent) mind, a purified perception of God, the cosmos, and the self, and much positive encouragement for the spiritual seeker, all of which the student could take anywhere".

Hermeticists commonly accept there to have been forty-two books to credited to Hermes Trismegistus. However, most of these books are reported to have been destroyed when the Great Library of Alexandria was razed.There are three major works which are widely known texts for Hermetic beliefs: The Corpus Hermeticum, The Emerald Tablet of Hermes Trismegistus, The Kybalion: Hermetic Philosophy

(http://http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/Mann_mit_Sonnenkopf_auf_Sonne_stehend.jpg)

The three parts of the wisdom of the whole universe
Astrology—The Operation of the Moon: Hermes claims that Zoroaster discovered this part of the wisdom of the whole universe, astrology, and taught it to man. In Hermetic thought, it is likely that the movements of the planets have meaning beyond the laws of physics and actually holding metaphorical value as symbols in the mind of The All, or God. Astrology has influences upon the Earth, but does not dictate our actions, and wisdom is gained when we know what these influences are and how to deal with them.

Theurgy—The Operation of the Stars: There are two different types of magic, according to Giovanni Pico della Mirandola's Apology, completely opposite of each other. The first is γοητεια, Goëtia, black magic reliant upon an alliance with evil spirits (i.e. demons). The second is Theurgy, divine magic reliant upon an alliance with divine spirits (i.e. angels, archangels, gods).

Theurgy translates to "The Science or art of Divine Works" and is the practical aspect of the Hermetic art of alchemy. Furthermore, alchemy is seen as the "key" to theurgy, the ultimate goal of which is to become united with higher counterparts, leading to the attainment of Divine Consciousness

Alchemy - The Operation of the Sun—is not simply the changing of physical lead into physical gold. It is an investigation into the spiritual constitution, or life of matter and material existence through an application of the mysteries of birth, death and resurrection. The various stages of chemical distillation and fermentation, among them, are aspects of these mysteries, that, when applied quicken Nature's processes in order to bring a natural body to perfection. This perfection is the accomplishment of the Magnum opus (Latin for Great Work).
 So the alchemist is in trying to turn other metals into gold because they believe that that through this ability  and knowledge, they will be able to transform their own and bodies and themselves into "Perfected Man"; literally change themselves into Gods.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermeticism

Gold was considered a divine metal to the Egyptians, it was believed to be the flesh of the gods
http://http://www.egyptartsite.com/symlst.html

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/MJGold.png)
Michael reappearing literally made of Gold in the video for "Remember The Time".

Audio clip: Michael saying "You want to show them "TIME", like you've never seen before" from the movie "This Is It"
http://http://www.zshare.net/audio/81007333ae95e3a4/

Modern uses of Alchmey
Persian alchemy was a forerunner of modern scientific chemistry. Up to the 16th century, alchemy was practiced by scientists such as Isaac Newton, who devoted considerably more of his writing to the study of alchemy than he did to either optics or physics, for which he is famous. Other eminent alchemists of the Western world are Roger Bacon, Saint Thomas Aquinas, Tycho Brahe, Thomas Browne, and Parmigianino. The decline of alchemy continued in the 18th century with the birth of modern chemistry, which provided a more precise and reliable framework for matter transmutations and medicine, within a new grand design of the universe based on rational materialism.

Alchemy in Traditional Medicine
Traditional medicines involve transmutation by alchemy, using pharmacological or a combination of pharmacological and spiritual techniques. In Chinese medicine the alchemical traditions of pao zhi will transform the nature of the temperature, taste, body part accessed or toxicity. In Ayurveda the samskaras are used to transform heavy metals and toxic herbs in a way that removes their toxicity. These processes are actively used to the present day.

Nuclear Transmutation
In 1919, Ernest Rutherford used artificial disintegration to convert nitrogen into oxygen. From then on, this sort of scientific transmutation has been routinely performed in many nuclear physics-related laboratories and facilities, like particle accelerators, nuclear power stations and nuclear weapons as a by-product of fission and other physical processes. A patent for a process to create gold and platinum from other elements using cold fusion has been filed.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alchemy#Modern_connections_to_alchemy

The Emerald Tablet (or Emerald Stela/Stele)
The Emerald Tablet of Hermes Trismegistos is a very brief text written in a symbolically rich form common to Alchemical and apocalyptic vision texts. Its legendary provenance is as the text of an ancient Stele inscribed by the antediluvian Master Hermes Trismegistos, and discovered in the tomb of Hermes by Apollonios of Tyana. The Emerald Tablet has for centuries held the status of Holy Book or Scripture for many Hermetists and Alchemists.
http://http://www.hermeticfellowship.org/Collectanea/Hermetica/TabulaSmaragdina.html

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/Greentablet.jpg)

This Stela/Stele was translated by Sir Isaac Newton (c. 1680)

Sir Isaac Newton
Sir Isaac Newton was an English physicist, mathematician, astronomer, natural philosopher, alchemist, and theologian, and is considered by many scholars and members of the general public to be one of the most influential people in human history. His Philosophiae Naturalis Principia Mathematica (Latin for "Mathematical Principles of Natural Philosophy"; usually called the Principia), published in 1687, is one of the most important scientific books ever written. It lays the groundwork for most of classical mechanics. In this work, Newton described universal gravitation and the three laws of motion, which dominated the scientific view of the physical universe for the next three centuries. Newton showed that the motions of objects on Earth and of celestial bodies are governed by the same set of natural laws, by demonstrating the consistency between Kepler's laws of planetary motion and his theory of gravitation; thus removing the last doubts about heliocentrism and advancing the Scientific Revolution.

Newton was also highly religious. He was an unorthodox Christian, and during his lifetime actually wrote more on Biblical hermeneutics and occult studies than on science and mathematics, the subjects he is mainly associated with.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Newton

Newton is responsible for conceiving The Law of Gravity.

(http://http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f264/IndigoDreams0007/php0Rs7uTPM.jpg)
Sign from the video for the song "Scream"

Up next the "The Emerald Tablet" and further connections...stay tuned!   :D

Hello Serenitys  !!!!

Wow I like all your posts here,you are e excellent researcher!!
If you will let me I will post something this days also.I think it will help to your research.
But I hope you will not be upset on me because I noticed a little mistake here.

Audio clip: Michael saying "You want to show them "TIME", like you've never seen before" from the movie "This Is It"
http://www.zshare.net/audio/81007333ae95e3a4/

It's not time is TALENT.I'm sure because I watched the movie last night again and in the subtitle It say also TALENT.And I've always knew its Talent so don't be upset,ok???



LOVE you!!!!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on February 15, 2011, 12:08:14 AM
delete
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Serenitys_Dream on February 15, 2011, 01:23:49 AM
Quote from: "applehead250609"
It's not time is TALENT.I'm sure because I watched the movie last night again and in the subtitle It say also TALENT.And I've always knew its Talent so don't be upset,ok???

Thank you.
But this is not a mistake. I am fully aware of the subtitles say in the movie and I have captured this audio from the "This Is It" movie trailer. You may hear "talent" but I clearly hear "TIME". Since I have done quite a bit of reserach and there is still more to come, I am not going to argue with anyone about this. I heard this word as "TIME" the very first time I ever watched and listened to the trailer. I transcribed it that way before the movie had even come out (many months ago now). If you hear talent then this is what you believe you hear but I hear "TIME". And time now fits into everything I have discovered and researched after I originally heard it.

It is at about 0:50 in the trailer.

[youtube:dbfqfty1]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUniG6F_RzY[/youtube:dbfqfty1]

This clip is just me having isolated it and I clearly hear time and always have.
Audio clip: Michael saying "You want to show them "TIME", like you've never seen before"
http://www.zshare.net/audio/81007333ae95e3a4
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on February 15, 2011, 04:46:26 PM
Quote from: Serenitys_Dream
What is a Virtual Easter Egg?

A virtual Easter egg is an intentionally hidden message, in-joke or feature in an object such as a movie, book, CD, DVD, computer program, music/movie file, web page or video game.

Quote
dontmakeitfactual wrote:
Ok, this will probably have a very simple explanation, but...here is something very odd I came across while syncronising my MJ songs in my computer.

So I have all albums added to my iTunes library, but yesterday I got a new phone and so I transferred all tracks to 'kies', which is the software I'm using for the new device. Now, you know how this software gets you all track details, right? As I was browsing through all new added tracks, I came across one that wasn't related to MJ at all -in fact, which I don't recognize at all as ever having downloaded it, or it even being in my computer as one of those dodgy music samples that come with windows player, etc.

The info about this particular track reads:

Joseph Haydn, Die sieben letzten Worte unseres Erlösers am Kreuze, Le Concert des Nations, Jordi Savall

(http://http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TKY-xKtxQ4I/AAAAAAAAAHQ/2v04If4qWD0/s400/PlanetEarthInfo1.JPG)

This translates from German to English to: 
'Seven Last Words of Christ on the Cross'
http://http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=14407

The Seven Last Words of Christ

1. Father forgive them, for they know not what they do (Luke 23:34).
2. Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in paradise (Luke 23:43).
3. Woman, behold your son: behold your mother (John 19:26-27).
4. My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?, (Matthew 27:46and Mark 15:34).
5. I thirst (John 19:28).
6. It is finished (John 19:30).
7. Father, into your hands I commit my spirit (Luke 23:46)

Die sieben letzten Worte unseres Erlösers am Kreuze
The Seven Last Words of Christ (German: Die sieben letzten Worte unseres Erlösers am Kreuze, "The Seven Last Words of Our Saviour on the Cross") is a composition by Joseph Haydn, featuring seven meditations on the last words of Jesus Christ, commissioned in 1787 for the Good Friday service at the Grotto Santa Cueva near Cádiz in southern Spain. The work exists in several versions, including the original for orchestra, an oratorio with vocal forces, and a transcription for string quartet.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Last_Words_of_Christ

[youtube:e3dixl5o]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGszT6Z2PWE[/youtube:e3dixl5o]

Joseph Haydn
Franz Joseph Haydn (31 March 1732 – 31 May 1809), known as Joseph Haydn was an Austrian composer, one of the most prolific and prominent composers of the classical period. He is often called the "Father of the Symphony" and "Father of the String Quartet" because of his important contributions to these genres. He was also instrumental in the development of the piano trio and in the evolution of sonata form.

A life-long resident of Austria, Haydn spent much of his career as a court musician for the wealthy Hungarian aristocratic Esterházy family on their remote estate. Isolated from other composers and trends in music until the later part of his long life, he was, as he put it, "forced to become original". At the time of his death, he was one of the most celebrated composers in Europe.

Joseph Haydn was the brother of Michael Haydn, himself a highly regarded composer, and Johann Evangelist Haydn, a tenor. He was also a close friend of Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart and a teacher of Ludwig van Beethoven.
<!-- m -->http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Haydn<!-- m -->

Le Concert des Nations
Le Concert des Nations is an orchestra with period instruments, able to perform the orchestral and symphonic repertoire from the Baroque to Romanticism: 1600 - 1850. The orchestra was created in 1989, the youngest of the groups conducted by the Catalan maestro and viola da gamba virtuoso Jordi Savall. Le Concert des Nations is the first orchestra of its kind made up of musicians who originate mainly from Latin countries (Spain, South America, Italy, Portugal, France as well as many other countries). The name Le Concert des Nations refers to the work by François Couperin as an assembly of "tastes" and bears the mark of the Age of Enlightenment ). Le Concert des Nations is the orchestra of La Capella Reial de Catalunya.
<!-- m -->http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Concert_des_Nations<!-- m -->

François Couperin
François Couperin was a French Baroque composer, organist and harpsichordist. He was known as Couperin le Grand ("Couperin the Great") to distinguish him from other members of the musically talented Couperin family.

Couperin was born in Paris. He was taught by his father, Charles Couperin, who died when François was 10, and by Jacques Thomelin. In 1685 he became the organist at the church of Saint-Gervais, Paris, a post he inherited from his father and that he would pass on to his cousin, Nicolas Couperin. Other members of the family also later held the same position. In 1693 Couperin succeeded his teacher Thomelin as organist at the Chapelle Royale (Royal Chapel) with the title organiste du Roi, organist by appointment to Louis XIV.

In 1717 Couperin became court organist and composer, with the title ordinaire de la musique de la chambre du Roi. With his colleagues, Couperin gave a weekly concert, typically on Sunday. Many of these concerts were in the form of suites for violin, viol, oboe, bassoon and harpsichord, on which he was a virtuoso player.
<!-- m -->http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fran%C3%A7ois_Couperin<!-- m -->

Age of Enlightenment
The Age of Enlightenment (or simply the Enlightenment) is the era in Western philosophy and intellectual, scientific, and cultural life, centered upon the 18th century, in which reason was advocated as the primary source for legitimacy and authority.

Developing simultaneously in France, Great Britain, Germany, the Netherlands, Italy, Spain, the American colonies, and Portugal, the movement was buoyed by Atlantic Revolutions, especially the success of the American Revolution, in breaking free of the British Empire. Most of Europe was caught up, including the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, Russia, and Scandinavia, along with Latin America in instigating the Haitian Revolution. The authors of the American Declaration of Independence, the United States Bill of Rights, the French Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen, and the Polish-Lithuanian Constitution of May 3, 1791, were motivated by Enlightenment principles.

The "Enlightenment" was not a single movement or school of thought, for these philosophies were often mutually contradictory or divergent. The Enlightenment was less a set of ideas than it was a set of values. At its core was a critical questioning of traditional institutions, customs, and morals, and a strong belief in rationality and science. Thus, there was still a considerable degree of similarity between competing philosophies. Some historians also include the late 17th century, which is typically known as the Age of Reason or Age of Rationalism, as part of the Enlightenment; however, most historians consider the Age of Reason to be a prelude to the ideas of the Enlightenment. Modernity, by contrast, is used to refer to the period after The Enlightenment; albeit generally emphasizing social conditions rather than specific philosophies.
<!-- m -->http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment<!-- m -->

Jordi Savall
Jordi Savall i Bernadet (born 1941, in Igualada, Catalonia, Spain) is a Spanish Catalan viol player, conductor, and composer. He has been one of the major figures in the field of early music since the 1970s, largely responsible for bringing the viol (viola da gamba) back to life on the stage. His characteristic repertory ranges from Medieval to Renaissance and Baroque music, though he has occasionally ventured into the classical or even the romantic period.
<!-- m -->http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jordi_Savall<!-- m -->

The Song "Scream" Lyrics
Michael sings "Father, please have mercy, I just can't take it anymore"
4. My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?, (Matthew 27:46and Mark 15:34)

The Song "Will You Be There" Lyrics
"I'm Only Human"
"5. I thirst (John 19:28). - A human craving, a necessity of physical life.

And just a note here in the song "Will You Be There" the lyrics are also:

"Lift Me Up Slowly", "lift me up, lift me up" & "lift me"

This is a reference to the crucifixion, the "lifting" of Jesus

John 3:14 (King James Version)
14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up (Physically Killed, The Crucifixion)

John 12:32-33 (King James Version)
32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
33 This he said, signifying what death he should die. (The Crucifixion)



(http://http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TJcXjGi7yrI/AAAAAAAAAFw/9o8aljGUouI/s400/Apple+head+painting.jpg)

Michael's nickname "Apple Head""This is It"
6. It is finished (John 19:30)
Michael's Crucifixion was completed and he announced this during the O2 Press conference, he then "died" and now we await his Resurrection.

The Song "This Is It"
Michael sings "I am the Light of the World, this is real".
The light of the world is another name for Jesus and/or the Messiah.

Hello again Serenity!!!

I wanted to post this along time ago but I was busy  <!-- s:( --> :( <!-- s:( --> .
It's about the Son os Man painting wich was on Scream video.I rememebr that some time ago I saw a movie called Mr.Magorium Wonder Imporium.You will not believe this but the final part was exactly like This is it.Who watches the movie will have to wait for the end of the credits to see the final,lol 
 <!-- s:D --> :D <!-- s:D --> .In the end Mr.Magorium appears ALIVE again (he in the end of the movie dies) painting The Son of man paint,lol <!-- s:shock: --> :shock: <!-- s:shock: --> .Ok now the big problem is the youtube removed all the free parts of movie(I wonder why  <!-- s:idea: --> :idea: <!-- s:idea: --> ).In this movie are alot of things related to Michael (magic,believe,toys,amusemet parks,ambulance,etc).But Ifound a way to show if  you go on this site of the movie,you will se the paint THE SON OF MAN in the left of the screen  <!-- s:D --> :D <!-- s:D -->

http://http://www.magorium.co.uk/

 YOU HAVE TO BELIEVE IT TO SEE IT!!!!
LOVE you
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on February 17, 2011, 03:36:46 AM
Hi applehead250609!
I'm happy to read what you wrote, and I responded on this other thread.

viewtopic.php?f=253&t=6784&p=305901#p305901 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=253&t=6784&p=305901#p305901)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on February 20, 2011, 03:57:36 AM
Quote from: MJonmind
Hi applehead250609!
I'm happy to read what you wrote, and I responded on this other thread.

viewtopic.php?f=253&t=6784&p=305901#p305901 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=253&t=6784&p=305901#p305901)


Hello again Mjonmind!!!!

I'm sorry for answering so late but I have big problems with my computer,it's almost kaput  :cry: .You know because of the investigation I didn't had time to clean my computer and now it's not working as it should.The hoax is very complex ,and I have less time,because I have a family also  :D .So I hope one of this days to be able to do,what I had to a year ago, :lol: .
Anyway it's very strange that the movie its not available on youtube now,because it was some time ago 
:? .After a long searching now I can tell you that in the end Mr.Magorium appears alive ,and he is the one who paints the Son of man painting.More than that,near him is the boy who's name is AppleBaum and they are both talking  :D

LOVE You
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MsTrinity333 on February 22, 2011, 12:25:01 PM
Revelation 5:1-5
1 And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals.

2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?
(Archangel Michael proclaiming that only he, himself, is worthy to open "The Book"?)

3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.

5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.
(A descendent of King David shall open "The Book" and his symbol is the Lion)

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se ... ersion=KJV (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=revelations%205:1-5&version=KJV)

Continued in the next post...

Still working on this Serenity... It's a lot to digest. But from what I remember studying the book of Revelation the ONE worthy to open the Book, the Lion of The Tribe of Judah is Jesus Christ in heaven; not an angel, not Michael. I don't hold the belief Jesus and the Archangel Michael are the same person...but I am checking into it. MJ said many times he wasn't Jesus; but always tried to imitate Jesus, and we see a lot of this in his artwork...what beautiful stuff.  I know Jesus has shown himself (appeared pre-incarnate) to man on earth in the Old Testament in various ways so this does raise an interesting question.

Anyway, I wanted to give you some additional info on the Symbols of The Book painting you might find useful:  :)

Michael literately “sees” himself (two images) as a Renaissance man. The “key” to understanding him is knowledge (book).  Key is a symbol of authority, power to bind, lock or unlock knowledge.  Books = divine revelation & human thought.  The sheer curtain (veil) is pulled back to “reveal” (show us) part of him.  A veil is that which divides, a screen.  What he’s wearing is Crimson/Scarlet = symbol of suffering, sacrifice, it’s the color of Sacrifice for sin.  The marble floor is a symbolic of beauty. Here's a breakdown:

BOOK: divine revelation & human thought. Writing, reading, eating of the book. God’s Book---The Bible.  
Eze. 3; Rev. 10
KEY:  Key is a symbol of authority, power to bind, lock or unlock knowledge.
Mt 16:19  And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”
Lk 11:52  “Woe to you lawyers! For you have taken away the key of knowledge. You did not enter in yourselves, and those who were entering in you hindered.”
CRIMSON/SCARLET: Symbol of suffering, sacrifice, the color of Sacrifice for sin.                              
Isa 1: 18,19  “ Though your sins are like scarlet, They shall be as white as snow; Though they are red like crimson, They shall be as wool. If you are willing and obedient, You shall eat the good of the land.                                                  Nahum 2:3  The shields of his mighty men are made red, The valiant men are in scarlet.              
Jer. 4:30  “ And when you are plundered, What will you do? Though you clothe yourself with crimson, Though you adorn yourself with ornaments of gold, Though you enlarge your eyes with paint, In vain you will make yourself fair; lovers will despise you; They will seek your life.
MARBLE FLOOR:  is a symbolic of beauty.                                                                                              
1 Ch 29:2  Now for the house of my God I have prepared with all my might: gold for things to be made of gold, silver for things of silver, bronze for things of bronze, iron for things of iron, wood for things of wood, onyx stones, stones to be set, glistening stones of various colors, all kinds of precious stones, and marble slabs in abundance.                          
Est 1:5-6  And when these days were completed, the king made a feast… in the court of the garden of the king’s palace. There were white and blue linen curtains fastened with cords of fine linen and purple on silver rods and marble pillars; and the couches were of gold and silver on a mosaic pavement of alabaster, turquoise, and white and black marble.
PALACE:  Symb. Of heaven, God’s dwelling place.                                                                              
Jn 14:1,2  “Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you
VEIL:  A veil is that which divides, a screen.  Separation from God.                                                          
Ex 26:33  And you shall hang the veil from the clasps. Then you shall bring the ark of the Testimony in there, behind the veil. The veil shall be a divider for you between the holy place and the Most Holy.
PILLARS:  Symb. Of strength firmness and support.                                                                          
Rev. 3:12  He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.                                                                                                
1 Ti 3:15  but if I am delayed, I write so that you may know how you ought to conduct yourself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
ROSE: Symb. Of Christ and his church. Rose of Sharon

---Interpreting Symbols and Types by Kevin J Conner.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MsTrinity333 on December 05, 2011, 10:33:20 AM
I L.O.V.E. Michael as much as anyone but he is NOT THE CHRIST, JESUS OR THE MESSIAH.

MICHAEL the Archangel IS NOT Jesus nor is Michael Jackson Michael the Archangel.  That is incorrect Theology. 
MJ NEVER said he was Jesus; as a matter of fact he stated the opposite in the Oprah interview for one.  He said he's not Jesus but he tries to IMITATE Jesus. Meaning he tries to follow Jesus and his teachings like all Christians should.[/u]
[/color]

Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.  1 John 4:1-3[/b]

IS JESUS CHRIST THE ARCHANGEL MICHAEL?

The Watchtower Society teaches that Jesus existed as Michael the archangel prior to coming to earth and became Michael again at His resurrection. They claim that Jesus was only a man when He was on earth and when He died, the "man" Jesus ceased to exist,1. being raised as a "spirit creature" the archangel Michael:

    "So the evidence indicates that the Son of God was known as Michael before he came to earth and is known also by that name since his return to heaven where he resides as the glorified spirit Son of God."—Reasoning from the Scriptures, 1985, Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, p. 218

In order to try to prove that Jesus is Michael the archangel, Jehovah's Witnesses often point to passages like Daniel 10:13 where Michael is seen as " one of the chief princes." The fact that Michael is "one of the chief princes," however, indicates that Michael is not unique. Jesus is more than just a "Prince" or "Ruler." The Bible calls Jesus "King of Kings" and "Lord of Lords." (Revelation 17:14; 19:16) This title indicates absolute sovereignty and authority and is a far cry from being "one of the chief princes" who is one among a group of equals.

1 Thessalonians 4:16 states, "For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet of God...." Jehovah's Wittnesses use this verse to try to prove that Jesus is Michael the archangel because He comes "with the voice of the archangel." However, the fact that Jesus is coming with the archangel's voice doesn't mean that He is the archangel. Notice that this verse also says that this verse also says that Jesus is coming with God's trumpet, but one wouldn't argue that Jesus is God simply because He is coming with God's trumpet. In 2 Thessalonians 1:7, we read that “the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire.” Thus, it appears that Jesus will come with the archangel who issues the shout. In Zechariah 14:5-6, we read that Jehovah God “will come, and all the holy ones with Him! And it will come about in that day that there will be no light.” When one compares this passage of Jehovah’s coming with the coming of Christ as described in 2 Thessalonians 1:7 and Matthew 24:29-31, it is obvious that the Jehovah who is coming in Zechariah is the Jesus who is coming with “His angels” in Matthew 24 and 2 Thessalonians.

In order to try to prove that when Jesus was claiming to be the “Son of God,” He was claiming to be one of God’s angels, Jehovah’s Witnesses often point to Job 38:7 where angels are called sons of God. However, Hebrews 1:5 states, “For to which of the angels did He ever say, ‘THOU ART MY SON, TODAY I HAVE BEGOTTEN THEE’ And again, ‘I WILL BE A FATHER TO HIM, AND HE SHALL BE A SON TO ME’?” Since the Bible doesn’t contradict itself, it is obvious that Jesus is called the “Son of God” in a different sense than angels are called God’s sons.

Historically, the Jews understood the term “son of...” to mean “of the order of...” (see 1 Kings 20:35; Nehemiah 12:28) Therefore, when Jesus claimed to be the “Son of God” (John 19:7), the Jews tried to stone Him for blasphemy (Leviticus 24:16) for they understood Him to be claiming to be “of the order of God”, hence, claiming to be Jehovah God. (John 5:18) In Isaiah 46:9, God declares, “I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is no one like Me.”

The term “only begotten” does not necessarily mean that Jesus was created. When Jesus is called the “only begotten God” in John 1:18, this term is used to refer to Christ’s uniqueness as God. Originally, it was thought that the term monogenese came from monos meaning “only” and gennao meaning “begotten.” However, further research has determined that the term genese is derived not from gennao, but rather from genos which means “kind” or “type.” Therefore, when the Bible refers to Jesus as the “only begotten God,” it is literally saying that Jesus is the “one and only unique God.” (see John 1:18, NIV)

Indeed, Jesus was never Michael the archangel before He came to earth, nor did He raise as “a spirit creature”-- the archangel Michael. The Bible testifies: “For He did not subject to angels the world to come, concerning which we are speaking.” — Hebrews 2:5

WHO IS JESUS?
Numerous titles and attributes of Jehovah found in the Hebrew Scriptures are applied directly to Jesus in the Christian Greek Scriptures.

    Jehovah knows “all things.” (1 John 3:20; Psalm 147:5) Jesus knows “all things.” (John 16:30)
    Jehovah is the only one who knows the hearts of all men. (1 Kings 8:39; Jeremiah 17:9-10) Jesus knows the hearts of all men. (John 2:24-25; Rev. 2:18, 23)
    Jehovah is our sanctifier. (Exodus 31:13) Jesus sanctifies us. (Hebrews 10:10)
    Jehovah is our peace. (Judges 6:23) Jesus is our peace. (Ephesians 2:14)
    Jehovah is our righteousness. (Jeremiah 23:6) Jesus is our righteousness. ( 1 Corinthians 1:30)
    Jehovah is our healer. (Exodus 15:26) Jesus heals us. (Acts 9:34)
    Jehovah God dwells in us. (2 Corinthians 6:16) Jesus is in us. (Romans 8:10)2.
    Jehovah is the giver of life who will not allow His people to be “snatched” out of His hand. (Deuteronomy 32:39) Jesus is the giver of life who will not allow His people to be “snatched” out of His hand. (John 10:28)
    Jehovah’s voice is “like the roar of rushing waters.” (Ezekiel 43:2) Jesus’ “voice was like the sound of rushing waters.” (Revelation 1:15)
    Jehovah is present everywhere. (Proverbs 15:3; Jeremiah 23:24; I Kings 8:27) Jesus is omnipresent. (John 1:48; Matthew 18:20; 28:20)
    Jehovah’s nature does not change. (Malachi 3:6) Jesus’ nature does not change. (Hebrews 13:8)3.
    Jehovah is the only God we are to “serve.”
    (2 Kings 17:35) Jesus is to be served. (Col. 3:24)
    Jehovah is the only God to be “worshipped.” (Exodus 34:14) Jesus receives the same honor and “worship” that the Father receives. (John 5:23; Revelation 5:11-14 compare with Rev. 4:10-11)4. No angel can receive “worship.” (Revelation 22:8-9)
    Jehovah the Lord is to be set apart as holy. (Isaiah 8:12b-13) Jesus as Jehovah is to be set apart as holy. (1 Peter 3:14b-15a)5.
    Jehovah’s glory is not to be given to another.
    (Isaiah 42:8) Jesus shares Jehovah’s glory. (Jn. 17:5)
    God’s name is Jehovah (or Yahweh--YHWH). (Isaiah 42:8) Jesus has Jehovah’s name. (John 17:11; John 16:14-15)
    Jehovah is the only God to be mentioned in prayer. (Exodus 23:13) Christians are to pray to Jesus.6.
    (John 14:14)
    Calling upon Jehovah (Joel 2:32) is the same as calling upon Jesus. (Acts 2:21; Romans 10:9-13)7.
    Jehovah “the true God” is called “eternal life.” (1 John 5:20) Jesus is called “the eternal life.” (1 John 1:2)
    Jehovah is the “mighty God.” (Jeremiah 32:17-18; Isaiah 10:20-21) Jesus is the “mighty God”
    (Isaiah 9:6) who is “Almighty.” (Revelation 1:7-8)8. THERE IS ONLY ONE GOD. (1 Timothy 1:17; Isaiah 44:8)
    Jehovah is an “everlasting light.” (Psalm 27:1; Isaiah 60:19-20) Jesus is the light of men and the everlasting light of the future city. (John 1:4-9; Revelation 21:23)
    Jehovah is “the first and the last.” (Isaiah 44:6; 48:12) Jesus is the “first and the last.”
    (Revelation 1:17-18; 22:12-13, 20)
    Jehovah is the “Alpha and the Omega.” (Revelation 1:8; Revelation 21:6-7) Jesus is the “Alpha and the Omega.” (Revelation 22:12-13, 20)
    Jehovah’s title is “the Holy One.” (Isaiah 47:4) Jesus is “the Holy One.” (Acts 3:14; John 6:69)
    Jehovah is the “stumbling stone” of Israel.
    (Isaiah 8:13-15) Jesus is the “stumbling stone” of Israel. (1 Peter 2:6-8)
    John the Baptist was to prepare the way for Jehovah. (Isaiah 40:3) The Jehovah who came was Jesus.
    (Mark 1:1-4; John 1:6-7, 23)
    Jehovah is the one who was “pierced.” (Zechariah 12:10)9. Jesus is the pierced Jehovah. (John 19:34; Revelation 1:7-8)
    The Jehovah who was sold for 30 pieces of silver (Zechariah 11:13) is Jesus. (Matthew 27:2-6)
    Jehovah is Lord of the elements. (Psalm 89:8-9) Jesus is Lord of the elements. (Matthew 8:26-27; John 2:7-9)
    Jehovah is the great Judge who gives life to whom he wishes and who renders to each man “according” to his “deeds.” (Psalm 98:9; Deuteronomy 32:39; Jeremiah 17:9-10) Jesus is the only judge who gives life to whom he wishes and renders to each man “according” to his “deeds.” (John 5:21-22; Revelation 2:18, 23)
    Jehovah is the only one who can forgive sins. (Mark 2:7; Daniel 9:9) Jesus forgives sins. (Mark 2:10-11; Luke 24:46-47)
    Jehovah is the great “shepherd” who leads his people to “the spring of the water of life.” (Psalm 23:1-2; Revelation 21:6-7) Jesus as the “shepherd” of His people, leads them “to springs of the water of life.” (John 10:11-18; Revelation 7:17) THERE IS ONLY ONE SHEPHERD --John 10:16.
    Jehovah is “Lord of Lords.” (Deuteronomy 10:17) Jesus is “Lord of Lords.” (Revelation 17:14; 19:16) The Father is Lord of all. (Matthew 11:25;
    Acts 17:24) Jesus is “Lord of all.” (Acts 10:36) THERE IS ONLY ONE LORD. (Jude 4)
    Jehovah is the Savior. (Isaiah 45:21-22) Jesus is the Savior. (Titus 2:13; 2 Peter 1:1) THERE IS ONLY ONE SAVIOR. (Isaiah 43:11)
    Jehovah created the universe. (Psalm 102:25-27) Jesus created the universe. (John 1:3; Colossians 1:15-19;10. Hebrews 1:10-12).11. THERE IS ONLY ONE CREATOR. (Isaiah 44:24)
    Isaiah saw Jehovah. (Isaiah 6:1-5) The Jehovah that Isaiah saw was Jesus. (John 12:41)

Could it be that Jehovah gave Jesus all these qualities, and therefore, Jesus is a “lesser God” under Jehovah? No! For Jehovah declares:

    “For I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is no one like Me.”—Isaiah 46:9

    “You are My witnesses…Before Me there was no God formed, and there will be none after Me.…there is no savior besides Me.”—Isaiah 43:10-11

For more information see:

    bullets How can anyone believe Jesus is God?
    bullets Is the Trinity a Biblical Concept?
    bullets Did Jesus Resurrect from the Dead in an Invisible Spirit-body?

==========

1. The Atonement Between God and Man, Studies in the Scriptures, vol. 5, p. 454
2. Every place where Jesus is said to dwell “in” someone, the Watchtower Society’s New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures mistranslates it to read “Christ is in union with you.” However, note that the correct translation of “in you” can be found in Romans 8:10 of the Society’s Greek/English Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the Greek Scriptures.
3. In the incarnation, Jesus took on an addition nature -- a human nature (John 1:14; Philippians 2:7-8), but he still possessed and continues to posses God’s nature (Philippians 2:6) “For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form." --Colossians 2:9
4. Also Compare Isaiah 45:23 with Philippians 2:10-11.
5. Compare the Hebrew Scripture Greek Septuagint’s rendering of Isaiah 8:12-13 with 1 Peter 3:14-15. Peter quotes this passage of Jehovah and applies it directly to Jesus.
6. The Society’s New World Translation mistranslates this verse to read “ask anything” rather than “ask me anything.” Note the correct rendering can be found under John 14:14 in the Society’s Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the Greek Scriptures.
7. The New World Translation inserts the word “Jehovah” for “Lord” 237 times into their Christian Scriptures without the support of a single Greek manuscript of the Christian Scriptures. This is the case with Acts 2:21 and Romans 10:13. Note, however, the correct translation of “Lord” can be found in the Society’s Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the Greek Scriptures.
8. The Society translates “Lord God” in Rev. 1:8 as “Jehovah God.” Notice that in this verse, Jehovah the Lord is called “Alpha and Omega.” At Revelation 22:12-13, 20, Jesus is called the “Alpha and Omega,” therefore, Jesus is the “Almighty” God of Revelation 1:8.
9. While the best Hebrew manuscripts available render Zechariah 12:10 as, “look upon Me whom they have pierced,” the New World Translation mistranslates it to read, “look to the One whom they have pierced.”
10. In this passage of Colossians, the New World Translation, adds the word “other” four times against all Greek manuscripts available. Note the correct translation of this passage can be found in the Society’s Kingdom Interlinear Translation.
11. Paul quotes Psalm 102:25-27 which speaks of Jehovah and applies this passage directly to Christ in Hebrews 1:10-12.

http://4jehovah.org/jehovahs-witness-archangel.php
Modify message
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 05, 2011, 04:55:16 PM
just want to note down that the official JW website it www.watchtower.org.

the website sited above is a website that is not affiliated with JWs.
it is a website for the purpose of ex jehovahs witnesses and used to rebuttle beliefs and counteract JW teaching.
not judging, just explaining the purpose of that website.

its not a credible website for research on what JWs believe.
if one really would like to know what JWs believe, the best thing is to go to the correct source,
www.watchtower.org - so one can be assured they are getting the complete and correct information about what JWs believe.

i guess you can look at it this way. if you are interested in getting to know someone, would you approach them, or would you
ask someone who vaguely knows them and is possibly misinformed about the person.

so too, going to JW official website is the best way to ensure you are being told the truth in
what they believe.


love to all.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 05, 2011, 05:56:01 PM
Great Information.  Thankyou for posting because it is good to read different perspectives.

For me, it doesn't matter what "name" you give or what you wish to call it.  My feeling is that Michael is somehow connected to god and the spiritual world somehow.  He seems to be enlightened and is trying to tell us in a way that we believe.  If we figure things out on our own we would understand and believe it.  I don't know what you call it because I am not an expert on all these things either.  I don't know what the difference is between an angel, a prophet, a messiah, a christ or I heard about christ consciousness, angelic humans, people who are lightworkers, or starseeds, people who can channel, angelic humans.  It's confusing to me right now.  Any ideas ?

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: fordtocarr on December 05, 2011, 06:54:03 PM
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just want to note down that the official JW website it www.watchtower.org.

the website sited above is a website that is not affiliated with JWs.
it is a website for the purpose of ex jehovahs witnesses and used to rebuttle beliefs and counteract JW teaching.
not judging, just explaining the purpose of that website.

its not a credible website for research on what JWs believe.
if one really would like to know what JWs believe, the best thing is to go to the correct source,
www.watchtower.org - so one can be assured they are getting the complete and correct information about what JWs believe.

i guess you can look at it this way. if you are interested in getting to know someone, would you approach them, or would you
ask someone who vaguely knows them and is possibly misinformed about the person.

so too, going to JW official website is the best way to ensure you are being told the truth in
what they believe.


love to all.


Of course I agree!!  It's like asking a disgruntled employee if they like the job they just got fired from LOL
We don't seem to have problems writing about what the JW"s believe on here..or what everyone don't agree with, I wonder why it's this religion we keep focusing on?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 05, 2011, 08:01:34 PM
yes Fordtocar,  I am with you on that.  We don't have to worry about different religions.  What is the message ?  That's what important.  Maybe we should concentrate on the messages and how it relates to the bible and other things.  Not on certain religions.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MsTrinity333 on December 06, 2011, 03:05:33 PM
Maybe so... but this thread is about whether or not MJ is the Archangel Michael; the answer is no.  That is incorrect theology according to the Bible.  JW's are considered a Cult by Bible believing Born Again Christians therefore their teaching that Jesus is the Archangel Michael is not Biblical, and not accepted as truth in mainstream Christianity; that's why I shared that site. You need to see the other side why the theology is off. I have both JW's and Born Again Christians in my family. But Love is always the most important message.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 06, 2011, 04:57:57 PM
well i can tell you that saying that fellow forum members who love and respect the bible are part of a cult is
highly offensive and indeed NOT showing L.O.V.E.

cult is such a throw around word. here is what it actually means, just so people are aware, as per wiki:
the word cult in current popular usage usually refers to a group whose beliefs or practices are considered abnormal or bizarre

now lets look at jehovahs witnesses, their beliefs are based on the bible - that is not bizzarre or abnormal.
in terms of practices, i can tell you that there are public seminars focused on bible discussion that are listened to by
audience, songs to god, a prayer and the task of bible education across the world via international bible students.
nothing bizzarre or abnormal about that. there is no mass suicide, healings, sacrifice, incest, drinking of blood, idol worship,
and other things associated with the connotation of the word cult.

in a cult, there is difficulty leaving when one wants 'out' - this does not exist amongst JW's. free will is our greatest freedom.
you can join or dissaociate on your own perogative. cults also usually have one dellusional leader, with JW's there is no such leader
as God is the authority. mind control and potential harm is also associated with cults. again, not so with JW's.

therefore your statement that JW's are a cult is unfounded, unproven and ultimately incorrect. you also said that JW's are viewed
as a cult by Born Agains, well, Born Agains are percieved a certain way by JW's, yet dont see JW's here saying, JWs are right and
Born Agains are >>>fill in the blanks>>>  (not going to say what JWs feel abt talking in tongues as it is not relative to the discussion)

this thread IS NOT about michael being the archangel, that it what it has been turned into. it is about MJ and religious symbolism.
this thread IS ALSO NOT about proving that one religion is greater over the other, or 'truer' (not a word i know)

also, the comment about seeing the other side of theology as JW viewpoint is off. i am pretty sure that JWs have made an informed
decision about becoming a JW which includes reading and understand the scriptues. it is obvious that born agains and JWs see things
differently. so instead of saying people are wrong, the graceful thing would be to agree to disagree.

its not fair. also JW's (me being one) can spend hours bebunking and reasoning from the scriptures (any version of the bible) any
accusations, misconceptions, misunderstandings and questions. but would it be appropriate in a forum where the purpose is a) not
to discredit other religions and b) an environment / or community that is focused on MJDH and therefore religious differences
need to be out aside?

our common denominator here is MJ. not religion. there are people here of many religions. and respect needs to be shown. disagree
with their religion? fine. but here is not the place as we are an international community and therefore religious beliefs overlap.

honestly, i am really tired of the JW bashing. if the 'sexually diverse' can say, we want to ensure this forum is free from gay bashing,
and those sensitive to racial comments can say, we want this forum free from, racial hatred, then I motion, to souza to implement a
"no religious bashing" policy on the forum. it is actually also in line with MJ's message of love.

we are an international team of MJ fans. our religions are going to cross paths. i think more sensitivity is required and i think that
being derrogatory about peoples religions is so circa 1970!

a JW would never do that to someone of another faith. i promise you.


souza if you are reading, can you please create and lock a new thread with things that are not allowed here. bible discussion is one
thing, but using the forum to discredit other peoples religions, especially when spoken out of ignorance and influencing others with
missinformation, is not cool


THAT is more, circa 2011 and also showing LOVE to fellow MJDH members...
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: fordtocarr on December 06, 2011, 06:27:03 PM
I completely agree with you Aussie!!
Ms Trinity I think that post of yours was very mean.  Just because YOU state what YOU believe DOES NOT MAKE IT FACT!!
YOU are not the end all authority.  I am 55 years old and have studied the bible in VERY many religions to end up with
the Witnesses.  I tried to prove them wrong and was actually shown how to use ONLY the bible to find God's will.
I would never consider coming in our home here with all of you I love through Michael and God, and condemn your
religion, although I studied it and found it myself to be incorrect.  But, because I have said that...DO YOU BELIEVE ME??
Yet, you think you are correct and should be believed and that I am wrong and shouldn't be believed.
I will say, that is not christian love, nor the love we feel Michael would want.
I would like to know that just because born-agains don't believe something does that mean it's not correct???
(and I WAS one of them once before I learned the truth)
WhO made these born-again's  right or the authority?? YOU DID.
Some of us disagree, and I would say, that if I was not a follower of Jehovah and Jesus, and had no beliefs,
I'd still know what you believe is not right because the bible teaches love and understanding and your message
was one of pride and authority and THAT sure does not originate with GOD.
LOVE to you and I hope this can once again turn into a discussion of Michael, and I think that we have
THOROUGHLY gave opinions on what we each feel about the archangel business, and it should just be left to smolder.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: bindupbrokenhearted on December 06, 2011, 06:56:31 PM
I have a question for JWs here.  Not trying to start a fight at all: I am really just curious.

JW is one religion I haven't studied much, even though I have to various degrees studied other world religions so I just want to know about the JW:

Do the JW believe Jesus is God in the flesh? 

I do believe Jesus is God in the flesh based on (but not limited to), these Scriptures:

John 8:24 and 8:58

http://bible.cc/john/8-24.htm
http://bible.cc/john/8-58.htm

But that is the conclusion I came to a while ago with my faith walk (I don't really believe necessarily in religion but in FAITH), but I do want to hear the other side.

I just want to know more about JW's because I know there is likely a lot of false info out there and rumors/assumptions which may nor may not be true and I would like to hear the other side of the coin on this doctrine. 

Thanks in advance!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 06, 2011, 07:07:00 PM
the following thread has a discussion already regarding JW viewpoint on jesus / god, so i am not going to repost it here. the thread is:

http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=20454.msg355169#msg355169

if you have specific questions regarding JWs, please send me a PM i am happy to answer them.

i just dont want to be seen as using this forum as a soap box for JWs as that is not my intention. however, am happy to answer
questions privately. for the reason a) i dont think everyone wants to hear it, and we dont force our information on those that dont
really want to listen to it and b) i dont want to be attacked for explaining what we believe, which seems to happen to JWs who
explain what we believe.

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 06, 2011, 07:37:16 PM
Wow Serenity.  You have excellent research.  Thankyou for all your hard work.    I have only skimmed over everything but I will get back to it.  There are soooooo many clues for many years and they are all connected.  It's amazing. 

I really want to see what you have regarding the emerald tablets.  And that goes along with the wizard of oz theme and emerald city !!!!   

Thank you so much.  I love all of your stuff.  There is definitely something stupendous and miraculous going on !!!!!   


Love,      bearhug
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: bindupbrokenhearted on December 06, 2011, 07:48:20 PM
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the following thread has a discussion already regarding JW viewpoint on jesus / god, so i am not going to repost it here. the thread is:

http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=20454.msg355169#msg355169

if you have specific questions regarding JWs, please send me a PM i am happy to answer them.

i just dont want to be seen as using this forum as a soap box for JWs as that is not my intention. however, am happy to answer
questions privately. for the reason a) i dont think everyone wants to hear it, and we dont force our information on those that dont
really want to listen to it and b) i dont want to be attacked for explaining what we believe, which seems to happen to JWs who
explain what we believe.



Thanks Aussie!

I just wanted to know because I hear from different sources: Jesus is the archangel Michael, then I hear Jesus is not the archangel Michael, then I hear Jesus is God, then I hear Jesus is not God regarding what the JW believe.  I went to the WTS website and am still confused.

I will re-read that thread and see if I can't understand better.  It will be worth a second read for sure.  If I don't get an answer I will PM you if that is okay.

Thanks!
Title: AAAA
Post by: MJonmind on December 06, 2011, 09:04:03 PM

I'm glad there's a variety of beliefs represented here.  Each one thinks they are right, and they have the proof to back it up.  It's been like this for all of history.  Herein lies the true challenge of love.


IMO, at no time has MJ ever said he was a Christian. Unless I've not seen that video or transcript of his words. I've read lots of speculation online, that he may have said the sinner's prayer and all that.  Muslims would like to claim that he converted to their faith, but even Jermaine has said he didn't.  At no time has he ever said someone should believe/trust in Jesus Christ to be saved and go to heaven. He has never said he was pointing to Jesus Christ in everything he did, so that his millions of fans would become Christians, be saved from hell and go to heaven.  Never, ever! 


He believes in God, reads his Bible, wants to spread love to all the world, love people of every color and faith. He clearly interprets Scripture his own way, not according to theologians.  His actions, symbols, pictures, paintings clearly show he thinks of himself as a special chosen one of some kind, a channel for God. He says many times, he is trying to be like Jesus. 


He acted like Jesus all right on stage for the Brit Awards, having people come to him to touch him, especially the children just as we see paintings of Jesus holding and blessing children. His clothes were blazing white.  Why don’t we see preachers or typical born-again Christians acting like this?  Because it is not the same thing.  In his song with Barry Gibb, "All in His Name", he sings, "There is ONE religion of love."  To me that says it all.


TS said that both he and Michael still believe in some of the JW teaching but not all, and it seems he doesn't want to divulge which ones (I believe TS is MJ.). Good move because I don't believe this hoax is about theology at all, although EOW relates to Revelations in the Bible. MJ also sees and uses the Bible as part of a larger vision and future truth for mankind and the planet, including ancient Egyptian  and Mayan teaching. Perspective changes everything.   We're here for Michael and what he believes and wants.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: bindupbrokenhearted on December 06, 2011, 10:14:05 PM
Hey MJonmind!

I hope I am not pushing beliefs on anyone here, as I believe faith is a personal choice and personal walk, because at the end of the day the person needs to come to his/her own conclusion and thus I don't feel I need to defend what the Bible says because it can do that on its own since I believe it is supernatural and God given in its very essence. 

Just to clear up: I am just trying to further understand what the JW believe because I don't feel like I know enough about them, so hopefully I don't come across as trying to push my beliefs on anyone.   bearhug

Anyways, I also wanted to respond to the comment that we are here for Michael.  That is true.  Also, I would never have found out about this except for a dream I had a few months ago (I was not an MJ fan before this and whether I am now or not I am not sure-but I am always here to support and help him however I can).  I can't explain this dream except that I had it for a reason.  And that is in part why I am here: because I am trying to figure out why I had that dream in the first place and what needs to come out of it.

I do appreciate what MJ has done, and therefore, yes, I want to be there for him and support him because I do believe he has an important mission from God Himself and I want to help.  That is the reason why I am here, plus to clear MJ's name because I know he is innocent.  Plus I care about the state of the world and the oppression that people are taking right now which is wrong.

I do appreciate hearing differing viewpoints for sure. 
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 06, 2011, 11:14:30 PM
bindupbrokenhearted, I love hearing MJ dreams!  I wished I had some... :cry:  Here's 2 threads you could put yours if you like.


http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=100.msg61432#msg61432 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=100.msg61432#msg61432)


http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=8954.msg151462#msg151462 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=8954.msg151462#msg151462)


Also I hope I didn't offend any of you --Australian MJ Believer, Fordtocarr, or MsTrinity333. You each have your beliefs and experiences as I have mine.
 respect/ bearhug
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 07, 2011, 12:17:12 AM
mjonmind - no you didnt offend me.

love and peace.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MsTrinity333 on December 07, 2011, 10:04:18 AM
I did not attack anyone personally or bash JW's; I pointed out their teaching that Jesus is NOT God, but a created being & Michael the Archangel is not correct theology and has confused many believers & unbelievers alike.  As I said; I have JW's in my family, and we try to focus on the things we believe in common.  But I am also stating a fact held by mainstream Christianity that JW is a cult...  this is not my personal opinion; but a world wide one. The main reason they are considered so by others in the faith is they deny the Deity of Christ.  They have their own version of the Bible which removes ALL deity from Christ expressed in the original Greek & Hebrew. This is what leads to their doctrine that Jesus is not God/Michael & the Trinity does not exist. It's important that people know this & why other Christians address it.

Welcome Witnesses for Jehovah!  Who are Jehovah's Witnesses? / What is the Truth? / Is the Watchtower Society Faithful and Discreet?
http://4jehovah.org/ (http://4jehovah.org/)

While many in the Christian community label religious groups “cults” if they do not adhere to the basic, fundamental doctrines of the Christian faith, our ministry is much more cautious about the methods we use in labeling groups “cults.” We agree that doctrine plays a significant part in determining if a group qualifies to be called “Christian,” but not every group that holds heretical doctrine is to be regarded as a cult.  Thus, we choose to label “cults” based not on doctrine, but whether or not the group exercises the mental and sociological control elements common in cults and recognized by secular counter-cult experts...
http://4witness.org/jehovahs_witness/jw_lds_cults.php (http://4witness.org/jehovahs_witness/jw_lds_cults.php)

The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society is known as a religion that denies the Deity of Jesus Christ. To this end, when they produced their own translation of the Bible (The New World Translation), they went to great lengths to make it appear that the Scriptures do not support the idea that Jesus Christ is God (Jehovah)...
http://4jehovah.org/jehovahs-witness-nwt-errors.php (http://4jehovah.org/jehovahs-witness-nwt-errors.php)


As to Michael's faith; here is an excellent site:

http://www.reflectionsonthedance.com/His-Faith.html (http://www.reflectionsonthedance.com/His-Faith.html)

Jesus is God; John 1.1 and Genesis 1.1 are geometrically integrated, with John 1.1 forming a trapezoidal base to the Triangle of Genesis (detailed in the previous page) with their sum resulting in the 112th Triangular number (recall the formula T(n) = n(n+1)/2): http://www.biblewheel.com/GR/GR_Creation_John1.asp
http://www.biblewheel.com/GR/GR_LogosStar_Genesis.asp
http://www.biblewheel.com/GR/GR_LogosStar_Derivation.asp[/color]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHEwB-KAkoA[/youtube]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: luchy on December 07, 2011, 02:10:18 PM
I´m  former atheist, I thought that religion is a human invention
In my school, I believed that the theory of evolution explains the variety of life on Earth.

I changed my mind in college while studying physiotherapy on physiology of muscles when the agonist muscle contracts the antagonist has inhibited its action in order to flex the arm. example biceps and triceps

  Who invented this system was an intelligent designer that you call God

I have two friends a Jehovah's Witness I'm following on twitter and the other I am studying Bible

one question: is Jesus in Revelation 1:8?

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 07, 2011, 02:36:41 PM
it's very long to read it all but I tried to see the main idea in the original post and I agree with it, though I still have my doubts.
Lyrics in his songs could show Michael felt he was more than just an entertainer and clearly reveals a very close relationship with God.
If he's Archangel Michael or not I can not say yet, I know he's a very special human being yet, if he was to be Archangel Michael, we should be able to locate in the Bible some prediction about Archangel Michael coming back to Earth in our times.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 07, 2011, 03:04:36 PM
It happened to any of you to pray to Michael under the impulse of the moments and then to realize it's crazy to pray to Michael Jackson and laugh about it?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MsTrinity333 on December 07, 2011, 03:33:37 PM
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I´m  former atheist, I thought that religion is a human invention
In my school, I believed that the theory of evolution explains the variety of life on Earth.

I changed my mind in college while studying physiotherapy on physiology of muscles when the agonist muscle contracts the antagonist has inhibited its action in order to flex the arm. example biceps and triceps

  Who invented this system was an intelligent designer that you call God

I have two friends a Jehovah's Witness I'm following on twitter and the other I am studying Bible

one question: is Jesus in Revelation 1:8?



Yes. The whole book is about Jesus. In the video I posted above Mark talks about Jesus being the middle of the Menorah (candlestick) in Revelation.  Rev. 1:1, "The Revelation of Jesus Christ." In the Greek the initial word THE does not occur, so the exact title would be "A Revelation of Jesus Christ."  Jesus says in Rev 22:13 "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

Here is one of the best teachers out there; nobody breaks it down better. I hope this helps you.  God Bless.  bearhug

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_q02OOZJhf0[/youtube]
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 07, 2011, 04:55:21 PM

MsTrinity333, thanks for posting the video of Mark Biltz. Stuff like that always amazes me.  He's very knowledgable in ancient Hebrew and Bible codes, where every original letter must be placed exactly to enable hidden words to be seen running in different directions like a word search puzzle. It is quite amazing what can be seen. He did say, "Yeshua is the first fruits of creation."  He said that scholars say there is, "70 layers of meaning to every truth." Adam didn't know what Moses knew, who didn't know what Peter knew, who didn't know what scholars like this Mark know. Progressive knowledge. It is still his interpretation that this means that Jesus is God himself and not a first creation, such as Archangel. Even Jesus saying, "I and the Father are one", can be interpreted that they are one in unity and purpose. 


Similarly, it can also be proved that we will be seated with Christ (brothers, adopted sons, heirs, etc.) and also be Gods/gods in the future which is interesting considering God has planned this from the beginning.  If certain groups claim that JW's have changed certain  verses to imply that Jesus is not equal to God, then there is also plenty of proof that many many other verses have been altered by orthodox translators over the years, because of the difficulty of the panel to know how to put it from original manuscripts.  Also, there have indeed been additions and subtractions from God's Word, such as the 2 New Testament verses which include the trinity concept were added later for church doctrine. Matt. 28:19 and 1 John 5:7.    http://www.yrm.org/trinity-fact-fiction.htm (http://www.yrm.org/trinity-fact-fiction.htm) 


As much as I love God and His Word, and have loved to study it all my life, I will say that we absolutely do not know everything that is going on with what He, the Creator of Universe, is doing with mankind, or is doing in the spirit world, or elsewhere in space, or distant past/future.  We only know what He chooses to reveal to us, and VERY much remains mysterious, paradoxical, and often condradictory. And MANY MANY people have left the church because of the arguing, the egos, the lack of real discussion/debate.  The Bible codes themselves show the cryptic layers of the Bible, and I believe there are many more less visible cryptic layers withheld on purpose until the right time of revealing, and they may not be revealed or understood by Hebrew Bible scholars at all, just like humble shepherds were told the Good News of Jesus' birth.   Also, in those codes, the scholars select the words they want to see, and the software program finds them for them in the near vicinity of the Hebrew verses that is appropriate. There could be other important words hidden there but they don't think to look for them.   


I think one should always remain open, but study, compare, analyze, think about all things in the world available to us.  There have been many equally knowledgabe people over these 2000 years that have researched and found other things that would disagree with orthodoxy, but there always tends to be some stronger ones than others who prevail.  Does that mean stronger/smarter are always more inspired by God and closer to the truth?  Just reading church history of 2000 years tells one that is not true.  Generally each person, such as you and me, comes to have a certain position or statement of belief, and then they will defend it, using information that backs it up, and ignoring anything that would disprove it.  So here we all are!  :lol:  IDK.  I love God, I love truth, I love His Plan, I love all people and all His creation!  Oh, I almost forgot, I love MJ! /woohoo/
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 07, 2011, 07:43:01 PM
Thanks MsTrinity333 for the videos about the Book of Revelations.  I watched 1-8.    Is this "The Book" they are talking about in the painting "The Book" that Michael did where he is holding a book ?     Then it seems like "the book" was written for the time we are in right now !!!!!     

All the sevens in the book of revelations is very interesting.  There are hundreds of things that are in groups of 7.  Seven Angels, Seven Seals, Seven Trumpets and it goes on and on.  Also, he said there are over a thousand references to the second coming of christ and hundreds of references that he will reign on earth.  He will reign on earth for 1000 years and that is the end of Satan's reign.

I haven't read the whole book of revelations but only parts of it.  I am going to read it all now !!!!!! 


Love

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 07, 2011, 11:50:50 PM

just thought i'd clarify, Ms trinity this message isnt to you, its to others who are reading this thread. so no need to reply and try to rebuttle. to others, isnt it better to hear from an actual JW what we believe rather than someone who is not a JW and is also misinformed and incorrect abt JW beleifs. take it from me people, i am a JW and I think i am in a better position to say what we believe. Ms trinity is a born again christian. I would not sit here and take it upon myself to tell you what they do and do not believe, i leave that to Ms trinity, as i am not a born again and she is the expert in her own religion. again, i am a credible source as to what JWs actually believe, as i am a practicing JW familiar with teaching and doctrine. please see my responses to the post below. my answers are in red.


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But I am also stating a fact held by mainstream Christianity that JW is a cult...  wrong. NOT viewed as a cult, viewed as a non trinitarian christian faith. this is not my personal opinion; but a world wide one. um, no not saying its her opinion, but it certainly isnt the opinion of the world. The main reason they are considered so by others in the faith is they deny the Deity of Christ. WRONG again, we do accept Christ Jesus, it is why every JW family each day will pray to god for strength and guidance to emulate christlike qualities and ensure we are walking in line with the example he set for us. its also why we pray to God for salvation through Jesus Christ. it is why we thank and praise god for the provision of sacraficial death of Jesus Christ. It is why we close our prayer to God through Christ Jesus' name and finally, it is why we do a worldwide preaching work and bible education work to teach people about christianity and encourage people to walk with christ in their lives as it is the way to God and hence salvation. therefore the statement that we do not accept the christ is not only INCORRECT but it slanderous, offensive and an attempt to discredit JWs. They have their own version of the Bible which removes ALL deity from Christ expressed in the original Greek & Hebrew. Again Incorrect. We are encouraged when we go preaching from house to house to use the householders version of the bible. we bring our own as often people dont have one. Any JW will be happy to use your copy of the bible to show you the scriptures. This is what leads to their doctrine that Jesus is not God/Michael & the Trinity does not exist. It's important that people know this & why other Christians address it. actually, it is important that people seek truth rather than listen to information from people who have a preconcieved opinion about JWs, as their information that they often provide is NOT neutral



if you read this post, thank you for taking the time to read and understand that JWs are VERY often not only misunderstood but misinterpreted

i am done with this thread. i think i know what we believe. thats it

peace and love to all, please lets agree to disagree as THIS CONVERSATION is not constructive and was NOT the intended subject for this thread.

please can we all move on. thank you.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 08, 2011, 12:59:18 AM
You guys know who is Archangel Michael the Bible tells us about?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 08, 2011, 01:53:18 AM

Quote
In 1992, Michael Jackson was crowned “King Sani”  and given the royal title of Prince Michael Jackson Amalaman Anoh. Jackson was crowned prince of the Anyi people (aka as the Agni), of the Kingdom of Sanwi, after visiting the Capital of Krindjabo, located deep in the tropical rain forest in the southeast of Ivory Coast.


(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-JvQ8xp2-G0A/Tj8ASr8VryI/AAAAAAAAAT4/_FQkU1iRMrc/s400/Ebony+Jet+cover.jpg)



This was a token symbol of something much grander historically and of Biblical proportions.  I simply can't explain it as well as Serenity Dreams has on her site.


  http://xxserenityxdreamsxx.blogspot.com/2011/08/michael-jackson-african-king.html (http://xxserenityxdreamsxx.blogspot.com/2011/08/michael-jackson-african-king.html)



I whole-heartedly verify what she says on this topic because of much of my own intensive research into this and related issues on ancient and modern history for at least 10 years before MJ's "death".  There is a vast amount of documented evidence to add to what she has written, to verify this for doubters.  This is indeed part of the HUGE lie we have been fed in the church.


Michael Jackson IS the coming Messiah, the Archangel Michael,  the annointed One, the bonafide descendant of King David who will rule with a rod of iron, as promised in the Old Testament.  Africans WERE the writers of the Old and New Testaments. The Jewish people we know today are another group of people that had nothing to do with the Bible until after those days, even though it seems they know it so well. That's another huge story, rabbit-hole. It relates to the imposter Messiah, who may be Prince William.  The modern state of Israel is where the Jews will set up the false third temple.  This is the roots of the Whore of Babylon, the Illuminati, TPTB.  2012 anyone?


Australian MJ BeLIEver, and Fordtocarr, isn't it interesting and exciting that God chose for him to be born and raised in the JW faith?  No accident I believe.


It is for this reason and a few others, that very soon after June 25,09, and my digging into MJ's songs, words, videos and history, that Heaven opened to me, and I KNEW that he was the One we have been waiting for.  When MJ got the DNA verification linking him to that tribe, he would have known then, then he was a descendant of King David.  That's why June Gatlin said God said to her that MJ was the Prince of Peace, a name for the Messiah.  I felt God had been guiding me in searching out the Black Hebrew Israelites, the true writers of the Bible, and the skin color and heritage of those famous people including Yahshua (Jesus).   If you are interested in digging deep into this historical fact about one of the biggest lies of two thousand years, start at this huge site, which totally relates to Michael Jackson though he is not discussed there:


http://www.hebrewisraelites.org/ (http://www.hebrewisraelites.org/)  ,  as well as  http://stewartsynopsis.com/ (http://stewartsynopsis.com/)


This "lie" or withheld truth, has been part of God's plan of history, for all the drama to unfold the way it did.  It is a layer in understanding God's Word, that is hidden from the wise scholars and given to the simple and the oppressed (especially those who were slaves).  Now is the time, "This Is It!"
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 08, 2011, 02:13:23 AM
"Michael Jackson IS the coming Messiah, the Archangel Michael,  the annointed One, the bonafide descendant of King David "

 :shock:

I don't say he isn't but I'm not sure
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: ibelieveinmj on December 08, 2011, 03:24:35 AM
Aussie, thank you for the clarification.  I don't know, as much as this is not the place, the truth needs to be told. 

It is really unfortunate there are many misinformed people in this world and some who have an agenda to spread lies about JWs.

One should go to The Source as to what JW's believe and talk to one that is !!!! 

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 08, 2011, 05:20:47 AM
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You guys know who is Archangel Michael the Bible tells us about?

there are two differing opinions, see a few pages back for the two possible answers.
i believe according to scripture that it is Jesus. i have noted down specific scriptures to support this.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: gwynned on December 08, 2011, 08:05:59 AM
MJonmind wrote: 

Quote
It is for this reason and a few others, that very soon after June 25,09, and my digging into MJ's songs, words, videos and history, that Heaven opened to me, and I KNEW that he was the One we have been waiting for.

Thank you so much for this!!  I had an experience which I could describe as 'heaven opening up to me' shortly after seeing TII and spent 2 weeks nearly constantly in tears as I watched hours of Michael every day.  I came to the same conclusion you did and have not been able to let go this thought despite everything that's going on in the world and the pushback from nearly every one of my friends.

I wasn't aware of the geneology so I'm anxious to read your links but wanted to send out a big  bearhug in the meantime!!!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 08, 2011, 09:11:27 AM
Quote
.... isn't it interesting and exciting that God chose for him to be born and raised in the JW faith?  No accident I believe.

I feel very happy that Michael is a religious man, that Michael believes in God.
I don't understand why there has to be a division between different Christian faiths. They are all basically the same, those theological details really mean that much?

To me not.
As long as we place God in the core of our faith, the rest is insignificant.


As about the JW, I've never rejected them like other people do. I like to read their magazines, I never refuse one and since I've learned Michael was a JW I always stop to talk to them if they want to talk to me. But they must understand one thing that they should not try to change the faith people were born in, for example I am born an orthodox christian and I see no reason why I should change this. We share the same values anyway. We should unite instead of staying divided.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MsTrinity333 on December 08, 2011, 01:02:21 PM
1. I don't have my own "religion."  Jehovah witnesses ARE considered by the majority of Christians out there in the world to be a type of cult.  Just do a Google search. 
It's important to research BOTH SIDES OF THE STORY as to WHY that is.  Yes; they are basically the same. But here is how they differ from mainstream Christianity; they deny the Trinity, the deity of Christ (they call him a perfect man), the personhood of the Holy Spirit, Jesus' physical resurrection, and salvation by grace through faith.  Read several Christian resources on these topics, what/why the differences and be informed.  Then make up your own mind.

2. I didn't say JW's don't accept Christ.  Thank God they do, but not his Deity as an equal part of the Godhead Trinity. 

3. There is no hate in me, the websites or resources I have posted.  They are true stories from those that have been there done that, and were left wanting. I have seen this in the JW's of my own family.  Isn't it a fair question to find out why from the ones who lived it?  They are reaching out in LOVE; ministering to those who have doubts, questions or have been abused by what ever system they may have been in. You don't have to agree.  THINK FOR YOURSELF... Investigate both sides of the argument without prejudice so you can make an informed decision; don't kill the messenger or the message just because you don't like it or have a different point of view.  The other side as to the WHYS of the questions presented HAS in all fairness to be explored. Don't take my word on it; do your own research, make up your own mind, follow your heart.

http://tinyurl.com/7rx77fh

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 08, 2011, 02:13:15 PM
I'm lost in this thread  /white flag/.
The concept of Trinity was never very clear to me, The Father, The Son and the Holy Ghost. I find it difficult to understand. Is it mentioned in the Bible?


Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 08, 2011, 03:28:28 PM
Wow, MJonMind.  I'm jumping for joy in the USA !!!!!   You said Michael Jackson is the Messiah, the anointed one, the archangel Michael.  Yes, I could believe it !!!!  I have been reading and studying and thinking for about 1.5 years.   There are tons of clues, and current events, and predictions that seem to be coming true and it's all starting to make sense. 

This seems like a life mission and HUGE task and project.  It must have a higher purpose.  I don't think they would be giving us clues leading us to this for no reason.  They're not playing !!!!!  This is serious !

Also, MJonMind it is interesting what you said about the Black Hebrews.  On one of the Spirit Science videos I saw they said they thought the Hebrews were not originally from earth.  The came and settled in the ancient civilization of Atlantis.  I forget which video it is on.  Probably the one about the History of the earth.  They are on Youtube.   Also,  Michael's video "You are not Alone" is a copy of a painting "Atlantis".    Maybe we should investigate this ????????

Love 

     
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 08, 2011, 04:36:33 PM
whatever....


do you ask a disgruntled employee who has just been fired if they like the company that they work in...

who not better to ask than someone who lives it? well again, I LIVE IT - everyday!

we dont believe in trinity. doesnt make us a cult.

therefore i repeat.... whatever....

this mud slinging match is over!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MsTrinity333 on December 08, 2011, 05:21:00 PM
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Thanks MsTrinity333 for the videos about the Book of Revelations.  I watched 1-8.    Is this "The Book" they are talking about in the painting "The Book" that Michael did where he is holding a book ?     Then it seems like "the book" was written for the time we are in right now !!!!!     

All the sevens in the book of revelations is very interesting.  There are hundreds of things that are in groups of 7.  Seven Angels, Seven Seals, Seven Trumpets and it goes on and on.  Also, he said there are over a thousand references to the second coming of christ and hundreds of references that he will reign on earth.  He will reign on earth for 1000 years and that is the end of Satan's reign.

I haven't read the whole book of revelations but only parts of it.  I am going to read it all now !!!!!! 


Love



It's a great painting but I don't think there's any indication of which "book" MJ has; just that it has a key on it... it would be interesting to know wouldn't it?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MsTrinity333 on December 08, 2011, 05:28:48 PM
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MsTrinity333, thanks for posting the video of Mark Biltz. Stuff like that always amazes me.  He's very knowledgable in ancient Hebrew and Bible codes, where every original letter must be placed exactly to enable hidden words to be seen running in different directions like a word search puzzle. It is quite amazing what can be seen. He did say, "Yeshua is the first fruits of creation."  He said that scholars say there is, "70 layers of meaning to every truth." Adam didn't know what Moses knew, who didn't know what Peter knew, who didn't know what scholars like this Mark know. Progressive knowledge. It is still his interpretation that this means that Jesus is God himself and not a first creation, such as Archangel. Even Jesus saying, "I and the Father are one", can be interpreted that they are one in unity and purpose. 


Similarly, it can also be proved that we will be seated with Christ (brothers, adopted sons, heirs, etc.) and also be Gods/gods in the future which is interesting considering God has planned this from the beginning.  If certain groups claim that JW's have changed certain  verses to imply that Jesus is not equal to God, then there is also plenty of proof that many many other verses have been altered by orthodox translators over the years, because of the difficulty of the panel to know how to put it from original manuscripts.  Also, there have indeed been additions and subtractions from God's Word, such as the 2 New Testament verses which include the trinity concept were added later for church doctrine. Matt. 28:19 and 1 John 5:7.    http://www.yrm.org/trinity-fact-fiction.htm (http://www.yrm.org/trinity-fact-fiction.htm) 

On that subject this may be helpful, here is part 1/3:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqErqTt7KLg[/b][/color][/youtube]

 bearhug

Oh; and here is part of a site TS linked to in one of his posts.  This is pretty cool & sent me down a whole other rabbit hole of study.

http://www.biblewheel.com/GR/GR_Creation_JJ.asp
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: ForstAMoon on December 08, 2011, 05:52:10 PM
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I'm lost in this thread  /white flag/ .
The concept of Trinity was never very clear to me, The Father, The Son and the Holy Ghost. I find it difficult to understand. Is it mentioned in the Bible?

yes, it is

e.g.
     Matthew 28:19-20  Go, therefore, and make disciples  of all nations,  baptizing  them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,teaching them to observe everything I have commanded you. And remember, I am with you always, to the end of the age."

as I understand, Trinity is a dogma, meaning it is a doctrine that is proclaimed as true without proof (other dogmas being inter alia: immaculate conception of Mary and Jesus resurrection)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Starchild on December 08, 2011, 08:17:56 PM
Just had to jump into this conversation. 

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Michael Jackson IS the coming Messiah, the Archangel Michael,  the annointed One, the bonafide descendant of King David who will rule with a rod of iron, as promised in the Old Testament.  Africans WERE the writers of the Old and New Testaments. The Jewish people we know today are another group of people that had nothing to do with the Bible until after those days, even though it seems they know it so well. That's another huge story, rabbit-hole. It relates to the imposter Messiah, who may be Prince William.  The modern state of Israel is where the Jews will set up the false third temple.  This is the roots of the Whore of Babylon, the Illuminati, TPTB.  2012 anyone?

This line of thinking raises a basic question and it is asked here in all due respect and with no intention to offend.  If the idea quoted above, particularly the underlined section, is accepted as truth, what is to be done with the information?  For example, many believe that Jesus is the (or a) Messiah and consequently worship, pray to him, view his behavior as guidance regarding correct living, view him as their savior, and so on (again, not judging the beliefs, just stating fact).  And also keeping in mind an expression of MJ's that is often repeated around the forum, in general, that "if something is heard often enough, it's eventually believed to be the truth" and is in turn spread [taught] to others as such.  In short, if the aforementioned idea--that Michael Jackson is the coming Messiah--is accepted as truth, how are people to treat Michael Jackson?  And although it's second-guessing, how might Michael feel knowing that people think of him as the Messiah? 
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: BeTheChange on December 08, 2011, 08:42:21 PM
@MJonmind...another great post.  Thanks for the links...I've been looking for another 'rabbit hole' to jump into (lol) and this one is very intriguing.  Especially since I began digging that 'hole' awhile back.

We share a lot of the same thoughts.

With L.O.V.E. always.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 08, 2011, 09:40:19 PM
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Just had to jump into this conversation. 

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Michael Jackson IS the coming Messiah, the Archangel Michael,  the annointed One, the bonafide descendant of King David who will rule with a rod of iron, as promised in the Old Testament.  Africans WERE the writers of the Old and New Testaments. The Jewish people we know today are another group of people that had nothing to do with the Bible until after those days, even though it seems they know it so well. That's another huge story, rabbit-hole. It relates to the imposter Messiah, who may be Prince William.  The modern state of Israel is where the Jews will set up the false third temple.  This is the roots of the Whore of Babylon, the Illuminati, TPTB.  2012 anyone?

This line of thinking raises a basic question and it is asked here in all due respect and with no intention to offend.  If the idea quoted above, particularly the underlined section, is accepted as truth, what is to be done with the information?  For example, many believe that Jesus is the (or a) Messiah and consequently worship, pray to him, view his behavior as guidance regarding correct living, view him as their savior, and so on (again, not judging the beliefs, just stating fact).  And also keeping in mind an expression of MJ's that is often repeated around the forum, in general, that "if something is heard often enough, it's eventually believed to be the truth" and is in turn spread [taught] to others as such.  In short, if the aforementioned idea--that Michael Jackson is the coming Messiah--is accepted as truth, how are people to treat Michael Jackson?  And although it's second-guessing, how might Michael feel knowing that people think of him as the Messiah? 

@STARCHILD

thank you for posting starchild. i really appreciated your post.

one who is religiously inclined and also looks to MJ as a 'saviour' may call him michael the archangel or messiah. this statement may satisfy, console and give that person somekind of hope (though false hope) - and yet that same very statement may be highly offensive to MJ himself.

MJ is a believer in God and Jesus. He holds them sacred, prays and reads everyday. i am sure that if he were to hear fans say that he is the messiah he would consider it blashpemous and be uncomfortable that people are giving glory, honor, worship to MJ instead of God.

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 09, 2011, 12:52:07 AM
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I'm lost in this thread  /white flag/ .
The concept of Trinity was never very clear to me, The Father, The Son and the Holy Ghost. I find it difficult to understand. Is it mentioned in the Bible?

yes, it is

e.g.
     Matthew 28:19-20  Go, therefore, and make disciples  of all nations,  baptizing  them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,teaching them to observe everything I have commanded you. And remember, I am with you always, to the end of the age."

as I understand, Trinity is a dogma, meaning it is a doctrine that is proclaimed as true without proof (other dogmas being inter alia: immaculate conception of Mary and Jesus resurrection)
Oh thank you.
OK a dogma but what it really means? That there are 3 Gods or there is only one God  with 3 manifestations or 3 attributes?
As I see it, The Son is the same with The Father but the Holy Ghost is ...what ?! I don't understand.
Maybe there is something that escapes the human logic here.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 09, 2011, 03:12:11 AM
Here's 2 articles on the adding to Matthew of verse 28:19 by other than the original writers, and later.  I guess it's read as much as you can and decide for yourself.
http://jesus-messiah.com/apologetics/catholic/matthew-proof.html (http://jesus-messiah.com/apologetics/catholic/matthew-proof.html)
http://www.everlastingkingdom.info/article/128/constantine-wrote-matthew-2819-into-your-bible.html (http://www.everlastingkingdom.info/article/128/constantine-wrote-matthew-2819-into-your-bible.html)

Australian MJ BeLIEver
Quote
one who is religiously inclined and also looks to MJ as a 'saviour' may call him michael the archangel or messiah. this statement may satisfy, console and give that person somekind of hope (though false hope) - and yet that same very statement may be highly offensive to MJ himself.MJ is a believer in God and Jesus. He holds them sacred, prays and reads everyday. i am sure that if he were to hear fans say that he is the messiah he would consider it blashpemous and be uncomfortable that people are giving glory, honor, worship to MJ instead of God.
This is a very good question.  I of course can't speak for Michael, but can only guess from videos, etc.
I am not speaking with 100% confidence at all, but only from what my previous digging and heart tells me.
Would MJ be upset or uncomfortable if people were to worship him.
Well worship means,
       
Quote
  1. The primary Hebrew word for worship.          a. Shachah - "to depress, i.e. prostrate (in homage to royalty or God): bow (self) down, crouch, fall down (flat), humbly beseech, do (make) obeisance, do reverence, make to stoop, worship."
I've mostly only seen Moslems do that for Allah.
Quote
3. The word in the English language.[font='times new roman']>[/font][font='times new roman']a. Literally means to ascribe worth to something.[/font]

4. True worship begins with a deep respect or reverence for God, a frame of heart, an attitude. This must be fixed in one's mind before we go further. An "act" of worship is an act proceeding from or the result of that attitude.
Even an earthly king or queen would require protocol in their presence. MJ is similar to an king, because of the prestige and honor given him, adoring crowds wanting just to touch or see him.  Asking him to do something without him being physically there, is not anything I'm thinking or suggesting.


In the TII trailer, who are they praying to at :27?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-NFzKUoO-w (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-NFzKUoO-w)


In MJ’s memorial when they are singing “Soon and very soon we are going to see the King”, I’m pretty sure they’re not singing about Jesus, but are inferring that soon we will see King Michael.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSTwdbvLVeg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSTwdbvLVeg)

Before 6:40, there is near worship, and after MJ is clearly slipping off his usual clothes/covering to reveal his “Jesus” blazing white clothes, where he is blessing children and adults. There’s no mention of Jesus at all, or ever in his concerts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJqIEU6RfUo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJqIEU6RfUo)



There has been much more on this topic way back, so I don’t really want to go into it. Many deeper pics and hints and links in other threads.

http://animalnewyork.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/study-for-field-of-dreams_0.jpg (http://animalnewyork.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/study-for-field-of-dreams_0.jpg)



What's the halo for?

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_5S5GJ1Hfc-M/TKZHxPFMvYI/AAAAAAAAAHY/zge7Pssfu0Y/s640/MJ+Meditating+Scream+Video.jpg)

(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSjkdZ2-XDr3bXAEgZpj8jYCOJfmRJYDwQ0v7Utmlhy8peBx9Uy)


(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/data:image/jpeg;base64,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)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 09, 2011, 03:58:51 AM
Quote
In the TII trailer, who are they praying to at :27?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-NFzKUoO-w

that moment at 0:27 is one of my  first big  WTF?? ...I guess they may be praying for the man, not necessarilly to the man ....but I can be wrong.

In fact I wish I am wrong because I want an explanation for my need to worship Michael bow/ another one than obsession.

Quote
Before 6:40, there is near worship, and after MJ is clearly slipping off his usual clothes/covering to reveal his “Jesus” blazing white clothes, where he is blessing children and adults. There’s no mention of Jesus at all, or ever in his concerts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJqIEU6RfUo

OMG the girl in yellow dress is kissing Michael's hand and Michael is kissing the rabi on the his head. This scene is indeed raising some questions.

A skeptical one would say they only made a show scene, MJ playing the role of Jesus.
An optimistic one would say he reveals his true identity through his performances.
I don't know what to believe but clearly Michael placed himself times and times again in Jesus's role.
Maybe he just wanted to suggest to people that they should all try to be more God-like, how the Bible teaches us. In fact Jesus is telling us in one of the Gospels that we have to try to be perfect like God.


Matthew 5:48

New International Version (NIV)

48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 09, 2011, 04:14:48 AM
And after seeing again the halo I must say - it's very confusing. makes one wonder if he was in his right mind or maybe he indeed is Archangel Michael...this is very confusing.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 09, 2011, 04:22:49 AM
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Quote
In the TII trailer, who are they praying to at :27?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-NFzKUoO-w (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-NFzKUoO-w)

that moment at 0:27 is one of my  first big  WTF?? ...I guess they may be praying for the man, not necessarilly to the man ....but I can be wrong.

In fact I wish I am wrong because I want an explanation for my need to worship Michael bow/

People have said about Jesus, that he was either a madman, mistaken/deluded, lying or truthful.
Could Michael be self-deluded? IDK.  I'm just showing what I see him doing, not being the regular ordinary Christian as members claim.

There is only about 3 occasions where it is said people worshipped Jesus, not because he asked them to, but they felt awe at him, and he didn't tell them to stop.
But an angel and Paul told people to stop who were worshipping them.

I don't think MJ's had to deal with that, though he's always loved the way his crowds adore him.  What about videos of fans going bonkers--jumping, crying, fainting.  If the History video doesn't show worship of MJ, I give up.  :lol:   However, mostly the issue is people ridiculing and despising him.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 09, 2011, 04:29:40 AM
Why you say Michael didn't have to deal with that?
There are moments when I worship him but I don't want to worship him, it's just I feel the need to. And I don't know why.
I thought it was because of the forbidden subject LOL.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 09, 2011, 05:36:16 AM
Christians do this.


(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQTVjLIWecFhcPahjkXRNXAKUhL56ib7v83jnLwUdPOCCg00_nq2A)


Moslems do this.


(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT5cnNtA9DviLJC1qze6GSiP84w6DeWr13j6tgazhAnwLrvbV2L_w)


Michael fans do this.




(http://www.virginmedia.com/images/quotes-michael-jackson-women.jpg) :lol:
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 09, 2011, 06:27:03 AM
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Christians do this.


(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQTVjLIWecFhcPahjkXRNXAKUhL56ib7v83jnLwUdPOCCg00_nq2A)


Moslems do this.


(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT5cnNtA9DviLJC1qze6GSiP84w6DeWr13j6tgazhAnwLrvbV2L_w)


Michael fans do this.




(http://www.virginmedia.com/images/quotes-michael-jackson-women.jpg) :lol:

I keep staring at these photos like there's something more to understand of them than just laugh.
Damn I don't dare to speak a lot of things that cross my mind.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: mimi248 on December 09, 2011, 08:43:39 AM
ok, so what i'd like to say is please FORGET all religions!! because the 3 religions known all  result to ONE and only ONE religion .
this sacred book, is the only one who has been truly written by GOD and where egyptian religions and stuff come from .. and did you know that, the mythic Jesus remains of  The horus greek god, who also resurected, and had the same life as christ . i'm not saying that Jesus christ is a MYTH!! i'd never say anything like that BUT bible  coud be a remake of others egyptian religions / because when i read bible, any person can notice how much it doesn't show us the reality but only aa fantaisist history or a reflection of reality ; so, to me i think that Bible Islam and judaism are all connected to ONE religion!. i truly think that the 3 monotheism religions are "plagiat"  had only  been created to manipulate us and maintain us into IGNORANCE . i mean think about it, why would god send 3 religions where in one, he says jesus is his son, and in other says the contrary!!! it doesn't add up!! and remember all people  who were killed for religion, all millions of people assassinated for religions , all war that religions created you know?
GOD of religions is only A MAN who want WAR . represented as a man also where the only thing he wants is MONEY!!!
the true god, the real god doesn't send people to hell you know? because he is only LOVE. not  a warrior or stuff!!! and doesn't have this kind of mentality LOL
GOD is LOVE. and i'm suprise seeing believers agree with religions, whereas their god is sending bad people burn into fire, destroys planet, kills people, and   even MORE!!!  christians believe that if a man doesn't believe in Jesus christ, even if he  has been a good person in his life he would be sent to hell al the same !! and then i scream WTF???
several  months ago, i used to be a christian, and i noticed how much i lived in FEAR! how much i payed attention to all words i said, to all acts i did!!! i also noticed that when i have been interested in NWO, the 3de war world, illuminati, and the return of jesus christ very soon and the kidnapping) of the church, and the  GREAT TRIBULATION, i would cry, and i cried so much  you can't even imagine how much i was scared to death . i was scared to not be taken away, i was afraid to be obligated to live the great tribulation and be killed, i was so afraid, i wept to much i prayed so much. and i finally got that the religion's purpose were only to leave us to manipulate us  into FEAR!!!!  BECAUSE fear reduces the  vibratory frequence, of our soul, and our spirit. you know, this aura about human being, is related to the power of life, and connected to the whole universe , all illuminati want is to keep us away of  this energy to leave us  into fear, and questions because of religion, because of society, because of this superficial world .  and that's why Michael had a SO powerfull aura that surrounded him. because he didn't live into fear, he accepted all religions all beliefs, and that what we have to do, we have to follow him to  realy enter into light . becaue religions say, pray god, and you will safe, you will be in paradise and THI T IS NOT IT.  to enter in paradise our soul has to be unclettered, our soul has to shine, to love LOVE and BE LOVE, when i see children i feel their powerful energy, they are ony LOVE and a child shines because he is connected to the SOURCE, that is GOD you know? and let me ask you something, be honest, do you feel the same enery about believers this same light that surround them? do you actually feel it? i don't.. nevertheless, they believe in god don't they? so why don't they have this aura as children have?
because they leave in fear. believe in god is NOT enough! IT IS NOT ENOUGH!!
so, when i see Michael, i feel this same powerfull aura about him, maybe more powerfull than children's aura. because he is free. he touches god, he is in god UNITY!! i'd like to tell you  something that impressioned me and scared me too  .
When I used to be christian, i almost believed that MJ was the antichrist predicted in bible! then , I noticed that almost all chistians can't accept Michael in paradise and believe the same . DO YOU HEAR THAT??? i watched some christians's  videos on yt saying that Michael  Jackson is the antichrist, and this shocked me to hell !!! and I believed this f*ck .  and now, I'm so sad for this christian , because he is persuaded to know the truth  wheareas he is totally OUT . Christian, believe in christ return and believe again! They believe that jesus will descend to sky on a cloud and will show himself to the whole world like 'hey i'm Jesus! i come to take my church jump on the cloud shom'on  !!  i'm sorry but I laugh .

so, do you understand now when i say that religions lead us into LIES!!!! the god religion don't lead us to Paradise, or light, but only shadow and darkness, I don't know if this claimed Antichrist, is real or not, but what I do for sure is this Antichrist is NOT Michael Jackson. it just can't be !!

So now, I think that MJ has always known unconsciously his faite.
because, when you watch moonwalker movie, you see exactly 3 children SOOOOOOOO similaar as MJ children ! and I mean this movie was recorded 25 years ago!!! also, when Michael was younger he used to say " i will create the most sold  album of the world .
and he did it. and when you notice how this pespi accident is the perfect middle of his life !! and CUT his whole life into two parts equal (day for day) you must think this can't be a coincidence. so, here we are, i think that on 25 june 2009, MJ  ascended .
yes, some people can ascend with his own body but it is so rare ..i think he has been recalled to God. and now, he is going to return with an OTHER body as jesus did. and will show him to the whole word during the Olympc games . yes there is some coincidences about MJ and OG  that lead me to this event . and also this coudl explain the This is it Quote saying " MJ like you 've NEVER SEEN HIM BEFOOORE!!!" do you understand now? and also why his children and his family cried but there is  still a hoax .
and so many others thing that i won't add on this post that is  already long enough :)

I'm sorry for my english, that was very difficult to write this post ^^'


 
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: BeTheChange on December 09, 2011, 09:12:11 AM
Just to 'lighten' the mood a bit...an 'adapted' joke (and definitely not meant to offend anyone):

Katherine Jackson is having tea one afternoon with 3 other women.  The first woman pipes up and proudly says, "My son is a priest.   When he walks into a room, people call him 'Father'".

The second woman chirps in and says, "My son is a Bishop.  Whenever he walks into a room, people say, 'Your Grace'".

The third woman, not to be outdone, says smugly, "My son is a Cardinal.  Whenever he walks into a room, people say, 'Your Eminence'".

Katherine just keeps sipping her tea in silence.

The other 3 women give her this subtle "Well....?"

She replies:

"My son is Michael Jackson.  When he walks into a room, people say, 'Oh. My. GOD!'"

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

With L.O.V.E. always.

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: gwynned on December 09, 2011, 10:22:01 AM
That is sooooo funny!  I know this is a difficult subject and Michael has repeatedly said he is not Jesus but tries to live like Jesus.  In the same way, he tries to mirror the divine so that we can see the potential divine inside ourselves.  Michael has served as a living example.  He passed all the tests and remained innocent, always maintaining God in his heart, always believing that, in the end, God would protect him. 

As I've progressed through this hoax and come to know 'the Man,' I've also come to learn more about the nature of the Divine.  It has been a challenge to relinquish the traditional notion of the vindictive God of the Old Testament and trust a different image....one filled with tenderness for his creation, who mourns with us and LOVEs to laugh.  Imagine the world if each of us, in every moment, just naturally felt and reflected the God that dwells within our hearts.  As Michael said to Orianthe in TII, It's your (OUR!) moment to shine.  The divine wears many faces.

There has been much about these 'tributes' which all turn out to be rather empty.  Perhaps it's because the REAL tribute would be for his Army of Love to embrace the divine within ourselves and spread some of that LOVE like fairy dust on a sleeping planet. 
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 09, 2011, 10:34:41 AM
I think when it comes to God nobody knows anything for sure.

Not even the priests.
God is accessible only through revelation, I think. Logic has little to do with it.

I also think we should focus on God and not on religions.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 09, 2011, 02:33:01 PM
That's why I keep on saying, "Progressive Revelation". History is time, and God is in both.  He has an ultimate plan which may at times not make sense or seem harsh (converts by the sword or the seeming threat of burning punishment), but slowly it becomes clearer what his love for his creation really means. All, and I mean every human ever born, loved and destined for glory!  There is so much written on that --Bible studies.


Isaiah 45:7
Quote
I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the LORD, do all these things.
I create the light and make the darkness. I send good times and bad times. I, the LORD, am the one who does these things.
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil. I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things.
The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating calamity; I am the LORD who does all these.


There is coming the Restitution of ALL things, where ALL will return to God and praise Him.  There is no "free will."


The story ain't done yet. You can't say you understand everything in the middle of the book.


Mimi248
Quote
They believe that jesus will descend to sky on a cloud and will show himself to the whole world like 'hey i'm Jesus! i come to take my church jump on the cloud shom'on  !!  i'm sorry but I laugh .
Hey, you stole my MJ BAM theory, I believe it said it first a while back. :lol: 
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: luchy on December 09, 2011, 02:45:08 PM
Be the scriptures as the main and only source of faith, rule and practice, it is because it contains the words of the Savior.
The one true Shepherd  (Jesus) did not build temples of stone, nor has ordam to build up.
Himself said (John 14: 2)  I think MJ is're doing the same thing

The rest is created by Constantine Christianity, full of doctrines and pagan practices.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 10, 2011, 01:44:32 AM
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I think when it comes to God nobody knows anything for sure.

Not even the priests.
God is accessible only through revelation, I think. Logic has little to do with it.

I also think we should focus on God and not on religions.

@gina


my favorite post of yours ever!!!

every word is true.

the last sentence especially resonated with me.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 10, 2011, 03:03:32 AM

I decided to put the post I just put up for about 10 minutes, into the TIAI November 11 (11-11-11) thead because maybe it relates to 7c.

http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=21319.msg378445#msg378445 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=21319.msg378445#msg378445)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: gwynned on December 10, 2011, 09:19:52 AM
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Be the scriptures as the main and only source of faith, rule and practice, it is because it contains the words of the Savior.
The one true Shepherd  (Jesus) did not build temples of stone, nor has ordam to build up.
Himself said (John 14: 2)  I think MJ is're doing the same thing

The rest is created by Constantine Christianity, full of doctrines and pagan practices.

I'm more and more convinced that Michael was refering primarily to Martin Luther and NOT Martin Luther King with his reference in TDCAU. 
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 10, 2011, 09:27:44 AM
Yes I agree with you GinaFelicia,MJonMind,Mimi248.

  Let's focus on God, and research and learning new things and not on religion.  No one really knows the truth and that is why we are searching and learning.  This is a new episode in history and unless you are a time traveler or something you will not know.  I'm not saying that I know anything either but I am still searching and learning.  We should help each other out.  What is happening to me is that things that I thought were fantasy could be real and what I thought was reality is fake.  The whole world is different to me now.    We need someone we can trust because there is conflicting information.    I'm trusting Michael to lead us to the truth because he seems to have put in a major effort and suffered himself for us to do this.

Love

 

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Starchild on December 10, 2011, 11:34:32 AM
@MJonmind

Regarding your questions and comments in the thread mentioned below, particularly the underlined portions quoted further down, I'll offer my opinion, and of course, that's all it is--JMO.  Others undoubtedly have their own to share.

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I decided to put the post I just put up for about 10 minutes, into the TIAI November 11 (11-11-11) thead because maybe it relates to 7c.

http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=21319.msg378445#msg378445 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=21319.msg378445#msg378445)

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Why would TS choose this passage about Jesus being tempted by the devil?  Was MJ being tempted by the devil?  Even the threat of MJ having the meeting on the top of the trade centre on the morning of 9/11, could be compared to Jesus being taken to the pinnacle of the temple.
If TS is Michael, is he saying he is the same as, or the Christ or what??
Can someone else explain this away?  Maybe I'm seeing too much in this.

If one believes in the devil, then we are all tempted by the devil, not just MJ.  If MJ is "the Christ," then we are all the Christ, as we are all from the same Source regardless of our respective levels of awareness (awakeness) at the moment.

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Here is the whole temptation story.  http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Mat&c=4&v=1&t=KJV#1 (http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Mat&c=4&v=1&t=KJV#1)  Could MJ have been so very thin at the rehearsals because he had been fasting 40 days on water, like Dick Gregory had said http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,529131,00.html (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,529131,00.html).  Had Satan tempted Michael to give him all the kingdoms of the world if he would bow down and worship the devil, but MJ refused, resulting in the 2 allegations and trial of 05?  Farrakhan called it a crucifixion.  But perhaps BAM will be God giving MJ true victory because he fought the devil and won, and he will receive ALL the kingdoms of the world.  BAM!  The End Of the World, followed by Someone ruling the earth with a rod of iron.  Front posted the verse, "Michael faught against the dragon and prevailed."  http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=5167.msg335650#msg335650 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=5167.msg335650#msg335650)

Regarding the underlined portion above, there is a biblical verse that provides something to consider:  "For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own Soul [Self]?" (Matthew 16:26).  Also, and this is asked gently, what is the point in pondering or believing (in the potential distraction) that MJ is the Messiah or the Christ?

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Is this 7c?

Possibly.  A possible aspect of it, anyway, as awareness of the historical "truth" regarding our potential human distraction by, susceptibility to, and consequent unconscious manipulation by religious ideas and teachings could benefit us now.  In that sense, an aspect of understanding the Truth (as TS emphasized 7c is about) is indeed coming out.  :)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Starchild on December 10, 2011, 11:38:33 AM
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Yes I agree with you GinaFelicia,MJonMind,Mimi248.

  Let's focus on God, and research and learning new things and not on religion.  No one really knows the truth and that is why we are searching and learning.  This is a new episode in history and unless you are a time traveler or something you will not know.  I'm not saying that I know anything either but I am still searching and learning.  We should help each other out.  What is happening to me is that things that I thought were fantasy could be real and what I thought was reality is fake.  The whole world is different to me now.    We need someone we can trust because there is conflicting information.    I'm trusting Michael to lead us to the truth because he seems to have put in a major effort and suffered himself for us to do this.

Love

Not even Michael really knows the truth.  So why not just trust yourself?  :)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 10, 2011, 12:53:50 PM
Starchild,  It isn't that I don't trust myself.  It's that things are confusing.  I was thinking that he is someone who could help because it seems he/they know things that we don't.  It seems he/they can be trusted to lead us the right way because he/they are following God's way.  These are just my opinions/feelings.    Others may not be following God or the laws of the universe and they will try to lead us the wrong way.  There are people/parties who just want money,power, control etc.   

Love
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on December 10, 2011, 12:57:41 PM
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ok, so what i'd like to say is please FORGET all religions!! because the 3 religions known all  result to ONE and only ONE religion .
this sacred book, is the only one who has been truly written by GOD and where egyptian religions and stuff come from .. and did you know that, the mythic Jesus remains of  The horus greek god, who also resurected, and had the same life as christ . i'm not saying that Jesus christ is a MYTH  :shock:  geek/ !! i'd never say anything like that BUT bible  coud be a remake of others egyptian religions / because when i read bible, any person can notice how much it doesn't show us the reality but only aa fantaisist history or a reflection of reality ; so, to me i think that Bible Islam and judaism are all connected to ONE religion!. i truly think that the 3 monotheism religions are "plagiat"  had only  been created to manipulate us and maintain us into IGNORANCE . i mean think about it, why would god send 3 religions where in one, he says jesus is his son, and in other says the contrary!!! it doesn't add up!! and remember all people  who were killed for religion, all millions of people assassinated for religions , all war that religions created you know?
GOD of religions is only A MAN who want WAR . represented as a man also where the only thing he wants is MONEY!!!
the true god, the real god doesn't send people to hell you know? because he is only LOVE. not  a warrior or stuff!!! and doesn't have this kind of mentality LOL

GOD is LOVE. and i'm suprise seeing believers agree with religions, whereas their god is sending bad people burn into fire, destroys planet, kills people, and   even MORE!!!  christians believe that if a man doesn't believe in Jesus christ, even if he  has been a good person in his life he would be sent to hell al the same !! and then i scream WTF???
several  months ago, i used to be a christian, and i noticed how much i lived in FEAR! how much i payed attention to all words i said, to all acts i did!!! i also noticed that when i have been interested in NWO, the 3de war world, illuminati, and the return of jesus christ very soon and the kidnapping) of the church, and the  GREAT TRIBULATION, i would cry, and i cried so much  you can't even imagine how much i was scared to death . i was scared to not be taken away, i was afraid to be obligated to live the great tribulation and be killed, i was so afraid, i wept to much i prayed so much. and i finally got that the religion's purpose were only to leave us to manipulate us  into FEAR!!!!  BECAUSE fear reduces the  vibratory frequence, of our soul, and our spirit. you know, this aura about human being, is related to the power of life, and connected to the whole universe , all illuminati want is to keep us away of  this energy to leave us  into fear, and questions because of religion, because of society, because of this superficial world .  and that's why Michael had a SO powerfull aura that surrounded him. because he didn't live into fear, he accepted all religions all beliefs, and that what we have to do, we have to follow him to  realy enter into light . becaue religions say, pray god, and you will safe, you will be in paradise and THI T IS NOT IT.  to enter in paradise our soul has to be unclettered, our soul has to shine, to love LOVE and BE LOVE, when i see children i feel their powerful energy, they are ony LOVE and a child shines because he is connected to the SOURCE, that is GOD you know? and let me ask you something, be honest, do you feel the same enery about believers this same light that surround them? do you actually feel it? i don't.. nevertheless, they believe in god don't they? so why don't they have this aura as children have?
because they leave in fear. believe in god is NOT enough! IT IS NOT ENOUGH!!
so, when i see Michael, i feel this same powerfull aura about him, maybe more powerfull than children's aura. because he is free. he touches god, he is in god UNITY!! i'd like to tell you  something that impressioned me and scared me too  .
When I used to be christian, i almost believed that MJ was the antichrist predicted in bible! then , I noticed that almost all chistians can't accept Michael in paradise and believe the same . DO YOU HEAR THAT??? i watched some christians's  videos on yt saying that Michael  Jackson is the antichrist, and this shocked me to hell !!! and I believed this f*ck .  and now, I'm so sad for this christian , because he is persuaded to know the truth  wheareas he is totally OUT . Christian, believe in christ return and believe again! They believe that jesus will descend to sky on a cloud and will show himself to the whole world like 'hey i'm Jesus! i come to take my church jump on the cloud shom'on  !!  i'm sorry but I laugh   :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol: .


so, do you understand now when i say that religions lead us into LIES!!!! the god religion don't lead us to Paradise, or light, but only shadow and darkness, I don't know if this claimed Antichrist, is real or not, but what I do for sure is this Antichrist is NOT Michael Jackson  afraid/  :lol: . it just can't be !![/b]


MIMI thank you,THANK you  :) !!!! All you said above is so true,thank you,this is what I think also.GOD of religions is only A MAN who want WAR and MONEY,nothing more.The religion's purpose were only to leave us to manipulate us  into FEAR!!!!  BECAUSE fear reduces the  vibratory frequence, of our soul, and our spirit.
Donte Jackson posteda week ago,this picture on his site "We are all Masters" .Please look at this picture and tell me what you think  :mrgreen: .Take care  :) .


(http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lvgoqbFavM1qjp3yqo1_500.jpg)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 10, 2011, 01:10:22 PM
Thanks for posting the picture Applehead250609.  And Thankyou DonteJackson for that cartoon/illustration.  It made me laugh but also think.  This story of Jesus is similar to the story of Horus and others.  It makes you think about where this all comes from.  Did the christian church just copy the egyptians ?????  Where did the Egyptians get it from ?   What parts are true ?  What parts are a myth ?     Could this happen again in future history ???     

Love               /cook/                  bangbang
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on December 10, 2011, 02:18:29 PM
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Thanks for posting the picture Applehead250609.  And Thank you DonteJackson for that cartoon/illustration.  It made me laugh but also think.  This story of Jesus is similar to the story of Horus and others.  It makes you think about where this all comes from.  Did the christian church just copy the egyptians ?????  Where did the Egyptians get it from ?  What parts are true ?  What parts are a myth ?     Could this happen again in future history ???     

Love               /cook/                  bangbang

Dontwalk thank you for your kind words  :). What I write is what I think,and I don't force anyone to believe what I believe,PERIOD. Michael had an intresting jacket on him in THIS IS IT movie and also he wore some egiptian clothes in Remember the time video  8-)!!!

(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRRPecWyv2uRlaDMixQ5n_C3V7b8g2iQUvz22lYIDpVEhkagHuyDmDo7Ecj)(http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQcihEAkGpS_Nbd_0FlykfPgIalbQuQtOg-9KJDC1KxuVn1eAq9S0fzuPWo)

(http://images.sodahead.com/profiles/0/0/1/8/5/7/1/2/1/Michael-Jackson-This-Is-It-2009-43265053963.jpeg)(http://www.alomoda.ro/photos/2lk70n9.jpg)

(http://vallieegirl67.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/2011-07-05-rushka_michael.jpg?w=539&h=384)

(http://i42.tinypic.com/2md2gdv.jpg)

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_tcp2WL5Yjis/TDH9nCmGj_I/AAAAAAAAAWo/5NuwcM8dogc/s1600/Eddie-Murphy_galeriaBig.jpg)

(http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/14100000/Remember-The-Time-michael-jackson-14169596-822-1172.jpg)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: bindupbrokenhearted on December 10, 2011, 02:35:32 PM
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bindupbrokenhearted, I love hearing MJ dreams!  I wished I had some... :cry:  Here's 2 threads you could put yours if you like.


http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=100.msg61432#msg61432 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=100.msg61432#msg61432)


http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=8954.msg151462#msg151462 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=8954.msg151462#msg151462)


Also I hope I didn't offend any of you --Australian MJ Believer, Fordtocarr, or MsTrinity333. You each have your beliefs and experiences as I have mine.
 respect/ bearhug

Sorry about the delay MJonmind, I have been sick all week and trying to deal with that. 

My dream was posted here: http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=19468.msg336976#msg336976 during my introduction, as I didn't know the dream threads existed when I introduced myself.  BTW: I got a very warm welcome from this family here  bearhug

I personally believe God gives dreams and there have been quite a few dreams that people have had on this board regarding the hoax that I believe are God-given.  And eerily similar to mine seems like.  Also, don't be afraid to ask God for dreams, as He can reveal a lot in them I believe.  As we are heading towards the EOW, I believe these God-given dreams will increase: http://bible.cc/joel/2-28.htm

Anyways, the dream I had regarding Michael's return was a sense of euphoria, excitement, defeat (of TPTB and evil forces and triumph of good), along with mixed in a sense of showmanship with pranksterism and 'you can't catch me' senses as well as humor (gee that might sound like someone huh ;)  ).  I hope the dream comes true because those feelings were so awesome, I hope everyone experiences them, since it was so awesome.  And I wasn't even a fan nor did I know anything about this hoax-I really did think the Illuminati killed him before that, so what will the fans feel if the dream comes true?  I hope the dream does come true, not for me at all, but because this would be so great if everyone could experience this, and I sincerely hope they do.

Sorry everyone if I got off topic

Regardless, I think the reasons for the hoax are not only physical but very much spiritual as well. 

Back on topic: I hope everyone takes TS's advice and Study (I extend that to reading the Bible for themselves), and thinks and decides for themselves what is truth after all avenues have been explored, instead of just taking at face value what one preacher, book or whomever tells you (and this also applies to other things in life-ie. media).  The Bible says to be a Berean: http://bible.cc/acts/17-11.htm  so we are to read, study, and meditate on Scriptures to get to know truth.  Thanks TS for the advice, as I have learned a lot from you.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 10, 2011, 03:03:06 PM
Thankyou Applehead for the photos.  I've seen some of them before, but the question is "What is he trying to say ?"

What do you think ?   This is what I found out.  He is posing as the egyptian pharoan Khafre.  Khafre built the sphinx which is half lion.  The lion is the symbol for the tribe of Judah.  This is the bloodline of Judah and King David and Jesus.  It is a royal bloodline.  Michael had a DNA test and is related to this royal bloodline.  He was crowned royalty in Ethiopia.  This makes sense because all of this is in Africa.  The sphinx is also aligned with the constellation of leo.

The cross is derived from the Ankh and the ChiRho.  They are aligned with constellations or stars.  I want to say Orion but I'm not sure.  Sirius is the star the three wise men followed to find Jesus when he was born.  The phoenix symbolizes rebirth.  The pyramids were also aligned with the stars.  They were associated with resurrection and using light.

Peace and love
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 10, 2011, 03:55:32 PM
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(http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/14100000/Remember-The-Time-michael-jackson-14169596-822-1172.jpg)
This outfit is very interesting...I've seen it many times before but today seeing it made me think of the ark because of those "golden" wings over the "golden" shirt...
I remember someone said what if the ark is now a person?
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 10, 2011, 04:06:11 PM
Quote
I personally believe God gives dreams

Actually yesterday, because of this religious "stream" lately here, I took the Bible to read again after a long time.
Joseph is told in a dream that Maria is with child from the Holly Spirit.
The Magi were told in a dream to not go back to Herod after seeing baby Jesus.
Joseph is told in a dream to take the child and Maria and run to Egipt and he also was told in a dream when to come back.

Well it doesn't mean all dreams have a meaning.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 10, 2011, 09:42:19 PM
Gina and Applehead250609.  I really don't know about the gold shirt and the gold wings.  I saw on one of the hoax video websites that it was a phoenix.  Just like the phoenix on the statue of Khafre with the phoenix.    I forget which one because it was a while ago.  It might have been on Jackieblue64 or SerenityxDreams Youtube channel.     I didn't think about the ark.  You're right the ark has angel's on it with wings hmm............   

It's all so mysterious isn't it ?



Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 11, 2011, 01:08:26 AM
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Gina and Applehead250609.  I really don't know about the gold shirt and the gold wings.  I saw on one of the hoax video websites that it was a phoenix.  Just like the phoenix on the statue of Khafre with the phoenix.    I forget which one because it was a while ago.  It might have been on Jackieblue64 or SerenityxDreams Youtube channel.     I didn't think about the ark.  You're right the ark has angel's on it with wings hmm............   

It's all so mysterious isn't it ?




Maybe it's mysterious or maybe it's just for the show.
 remember reading somewhere that people should keep God's law within themselves. The "ark" idea you know. After all the ark contains the law, but we should all have God's law inside of us all the time.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 11, 2011, 04:14:09 AM
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Thanks for posting the picture Applehead250609.  And Thankyou DonteJackson for that cartoon/illustration.  It made me laugh but also think.  This story of Jesus is similar to the story of Horus and others.  It makes you think about where this all comes from.  Did the christian church just copy the egyptians ?????  Where did the Egyptians get it from ?   What parts are true ?  What parts are a myth ?     Could this happen again in future history ???     

Love               /cook/                  bangbang


Are you thinking a repeating pattern or image?


Here's Michael singing, If'n I was God.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhkG1loPSrs&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhkG1loPSrs&feature=related)





Applehead
Quote
Donte Jackson posteda week ago,this picture on his site "We are all Masters" .Please look at this picture and tell me what you think   .Take care   .


(http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lvgoqbFavM1qjp3yqo1_500.jpg)


Love it; it's all perspective. Our human arrogant pride.


These have to be two of the most beautiful videos of Michael, that make you wonder, who REALLY is this man? 


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8vfldeKsbw&feature=fvwrel (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8vfldeKsbw&feature=fvwrel)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmJailUSZvU&feature=endscreen&NR=1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmJailUSZvU&feature=endscreen&NR=1)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 11, 2011, 06:43:05 AM
@MJonmind - after seeing your videos above it is so clear why he had to be terminated one year later. THEY had to take him down, along with his message of Peace and Love because for THEM peace is not lucrative enough, WAR brings more profit crash/ crash/ crash/ human beings dying are just collateral victims they don't give a damn about.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on December 11, 2011, 11:17:13 AM
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Thanks for posting the picture Applehead250609.  And Thankyou DonteJackson for that cartoon/illustration.  It made me laugh but also think.  This story of Jesus is similar to the story of Horus and others.  It makes you think about where this all comes from.  Did the christian church just copy the egyptians ?????  Where did the Egyptians get it from ?   What parts are true ?  What parts are a myth ?     Could this happen again in future history ???     

Love               /cook/                  bangbang


Are you thinking a repeating pattern or image?


Here's Michael singing, If'n I was God.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhkG1loPSrs&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhkG1loPSrs&feature=related)





Applehead
Quote
Donte Jackson posteda week ago,this picture on his site "We are all Masters" .Please look at this picture and tell me what you think   .Take care   .


(http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lvgoqbFavM1qjp3yqo1_500.jpg)


Love it; it's all perspective. Our human arrogant pride.


These have to be two of the most beautiful videos of Michael, that make you wonder, who REALLY is this man? 


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8vfldeKsbw&feature=fvwrel (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8vfldeKsbw&feature=fvwrel)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmJailUSZvU&feature=endscreen&NR=1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmJailUSZvU&feature=endscreen&NR=1)
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Thanks for posting the picture Applehead250609.  And Thankyou DonteJackson for that cartoon/illustration.  It made me laugh but also think.  This story of Jesus is similar to the story of Horus and others.  It makes you think about where this all comes from.  Did the christian church just copy the egyptians ?????  Where did the Egyptians get it from ?   What parts are true ?  What parts are a myth ?     Could this happen again in future history ???     

Love               /cook/                  bangbang


Are you thinking a repeating pattern or image?


Here's Michael singing, If'n I was God.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhkG1loPSrs&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhkG1loPSrs&feature=related)





Applehead
Quote
Donte Jackson posteda week ago,this picture on his site "We are all Masters" .Please look at this picture and tell me what you think   .Take care   .


(http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lvgoqbFavM1qjp3yqo1_500.jpg)


Love it; it's all perspective. Our human arrogant pride.


These have to be two of the most beautiful videos of Michael, that make you wonder, who REALLY is this man? 


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8vfldeKsbw&feature=fvwrel (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8vfldeKsbw&feature=fvwrel)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmJailUSZvU&feature=endscreen&NR=1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmJailUSZvU&feature=endscreen&NR=1)

Thank you Mjonmind for those videos,I had already saw them  :) !!! If you ask ME who this man ,meaning Michael is,I will tell you : Michael is a human being,a very beautiful one ,inside and outside.Michael is a genius in music,dance (along with his croch grab ofcourse   :shock:  :lol: ) and movies.Michael is a man,a father,a brother and a child to his mother Katherine.Michael is a very generous,sensitive but,he is also not perfect this mean HUMAN.We his fans and the people who loves his music and art,don't know everything about him,we know just what he wanted us to know.Michael is a very gifted person,who from a very early age knew what fame and MONEY are,unfortunately .He like Elvis and many others super-stars became very, very popular and his life changed FOREVER.Now I will try to be honest with you Mjonmind because I see that many people try to put Michael on a pedestal and call him JESUS or some kinda GOD  :? .I'm sorry but I don't think that way,ofcourse this is just my opinion.Let's not forget why we are here in the FIRST PLACE,ok????? Michael Jackson ,the legendary KING OF POP like Jermaine called him ,on that faitfull day at hospital,FAKED HIS DEATH,!!!!! Now I don't want to be mean,but I'm asking myself,what in the world fakeing one's death has to do with JESUS  :???? Because as far as I know,from my study ,Jesus was arrested,tried, and sentenced by Pontius Pilate to be scourged, and finally executed on a cross. Ofcourse if I have another opinion about the execution of Jesus is my bussines and I will not tell here.
Again I will say that to my humble opinion Michael is not Jesus,nor God,he is/was a very gifted and talented ENTERTAINER.He is not perfect,just like we are not,and nobody is PERIOD.I'm very sure that he was never afaid of anyone,otherwise he would never be in the position is today.One more thing before I end my boring post  :lol: please don't forget that Michael LOVES CONTROVERSY  :lol:  geek/  and that's ENOUGH FOR ME to understand someTHINGS from his LIFE and career.He was never AFRAID to tell what he thinks ,even if that THING created CONTROVERSY.Michael did EVERYTHING IN HIS WAY and absolutely NO one and ANYthing stood in HIS WAY   8-) ,not even THE ILLUMINATI CRAP  albino/  8-) .
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: mimi248 on December 11, 2011, 12:27:08 PM

Quote
Thank you Mjonmind for those videos,I had already saw them  :) !!! If you ask ME who this man ,meaning Michael is,I will tell you : Michael is a human being,a very beautiful one ,inside and outside.Michael is a genius in music,dance (along with his croch grab ofcourse   :shock: :lol: ) and movies.Michael is a man,a father,a brother and a child to his mother Katherine.Michael is a very generous,sensitive but,he is also not perfect this mean HUMAN.We his fans and the people who loves his music and art,don't know everything about him,we know just what he wanted us to know.Michael is a very gifted person,who from a very early age knew what fame and MONEY are,unfortunately .He like Elvis and many others super-stars became very, very popular and his life changed FOREVER.Now I will try to be honest with you Mjonmind because I see that many people try to put Michael on a pedestal and call him JESUS or some kinda GOD  :? .I'm sorry but I don't think that way,ofcourse this is just my opinion.Let's not forget why we are here in the FIRST PLACE,ok????? Michael Jackson ,the legendary KING OF POP like Jermaine called him ,on that faitfull day at hospital,FAKED HIS DEATH,!!!!! Now I don't want to be mean,but I'm asking myself,what in the world fakeing one's death has to do with JESUS  :? ??? Because as far as I know,from my study ,Jesus was arrested,tried, and sentenced by Pontius Pilate to be scourged, and finally executed on a cross. Ofcourse if I have another opinion about the execution of Jesus is my bussines and I will not tell here.
Again I will say that to my humble opinion Michael is not Jesus,nor God,he is/was a very gifted and talented ENTERTAINER.He is not perfect,just like we are not,and nobody is PERIOD.I'm very sure that he was never afaid of anyone,otherwise he would never be in the position is today.One more thing before I end my boring post  :lol: please don't forget that Michael LOVES CONTROVERSY  :lol: geek/  and that's ENOUGH FOR ME to understand someTHINGS from his LIFE and career.He was never AFRAID to tell what he thinks ,even if that THING created CONTROVERSY.Michael did EVERYTHING IN HIS WAY and absolutely NO one and ANYthing stood in HIS WAY   8-) ,not even THE ILLUMINATI CRAP  albino/ 8-) .



I'm sorry but i don't agree with you. MJ is WAY MORE than just " a humain being." Of course he is a human being, but this fact doesn't mean he wasn't sent by God too!
His spirit is on a totally other level than all of us, even if  we only  know  what he wanted us to know! and i don't say that because I'm a fan ! I say it because it IS a FACT !
Is there an other person of this world, who has had a such huge fame for 40 years???!!!!!!!!!!
who create a so huge mass hysteria everywhere he goes? You can say yes Elvis, The Beatles..then i'll say you NO.
EP; the beatles or any one else  had never  been on the same level as Michael, never ever!! To USA,Japan, France, England, Egypt, Australia, China,  I mean EVERY corner of this world, whenever he went the whole city stopped only to see Michael Jackson, people ran, accross the city to see MJ, and then, Went totally crazy.
Just Imagine how powerfull a charisma has to be to STOP a whole city .Even presidents with their own governement and political men can't do that!! The world has never seen that before, again this is a fact. Have you ever seen people going crazy and loose all control of themselves when they see Bush, the king of england  or even Obama? I don't see it. Michael is famous EVERYWHERE. people became crazy everywhere, He was too loved, too powerfull. and he is only a MAN!!! A man who has taken the  world in his entire globality and spread his own politic trouhout the world that was  only LOVE.  do you hear that? he was a Single man!! and did what all politcs had never did in 100 decades !!
So, if we was juste a "simply human being" all this hysteria, all this fame, all this celebrity, all HIStory would never have been possible.
 MJ is beyond this world.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on December 11, 2011, 12:42:34 PM
Quote
Posted by: mimi248
« on: Today at 02:27:08 AM »

    Insert Quote

So, if we was juste a "simply human being" all this hysteria  /scream/, all this fame, all this celebrity, all HIStory would never have been possible.

OMG I'm sure Michael liked very much THAT HYSTERIA and the CROWD going wild like animals on him  :shock: !!!! Poor him,all that crazy girls trowing and scream in his ears. To me what you just wrote  about hysteria  /pull hair/ scream  /scream/ ,fame and celebrity sounds like a POP ADULATION ,lol and has nothing to do with God ar Jesus.I'm sorry but this is my opinion .PERIOD
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 11, 2011, 02:09:20 PM
MJonMind,  I was thinking that history repeats.  The story of Jesus is similar to several others at different times around the world.  There is Horus and several others.   

Mimi248,  I am like you because I think there is more to the "spiritual side" of this story.  I don't know exactly what because I am still learning about all of it.    Humanity's true spirituality was lost through the ages due to the dark forces of power, greed, manipulating the media, corruption, separate religions, etc.etc.etc.    The truth about where we came from, and what happened to us, and what we can be capable of doing was kept from us, To Control Us   We can break free from this.  It's all in our minds.  They are using mind control, propoganda, and fear.  Fear is a method of mind control.    It's an illusion and the illusion is being dissolved.

So when Michael said "I went to bring awareness and awakening and hope to people" in the movie TII, I think that was what he was talking about.  If you look back at all his "stuff", you see clues about this.

Anyway, I'm certainly not an expert on any of this but have been reading and searching.  I've seen things about people achieving different levels of spirituality.  There are different levels of evolving of being connected with god, or source or the creator.  There is information on ascended masters, enlightened people, lightworkers, star seeds,people who are psychic, can channel, different ranks of angels and a lot more.    Trust me when I first saw all this I thought it was all fake.  Now I don't think it's all fake.  I don't know what is fantasy and what is not but I no longer think it's all a fantasy.  You have to research for yourself.   More and more information, books, and videos keep coming out from more and more people as time goes on.   

Anyway, so I think Michael is connected in some way.  I think he has achieved a higher spirituality some how.  There are a lot of dimensions to the universe and he is connected some way.  It's just my opinion because of all the clues and events.    I am still confused about the differences between angelic humans, angels, galactic humans, ascended masters, lightworkers, crystal and indigo children and prophets etc. etc.  There is a lot of information and it is confusing.  I'm still in the process of looking at it.  They want to help earth evolve.

Some websites,  alienleaks.com,  Galactic Federation of Light, Spirit Science (Youtube), David Wilcock, Research the Pleidians, Sirians,
Ascension, DNA repair, light bodies.    I just found a new series of videos on Youtube "The Pleidians, Keys to the living library) and a lot more.

If you think I'm a little crazy, that's okay.  I'm trying to help and spread information because "It's all for Love", with the L.O.V.E."

If we all come together as one, and see the truth we wil be okay.      bearhug       

 

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: fordtocarr on December 11, 2011, 02:25:47 PM
[

Thank you Mjonmind for those videos,I had already saw them  :) !!! If you ask ME who this man ,meaning Michael is,I will tell you : Michael is a human being,a very beautiful one ,inside and outside.Michael is a genius in music,dance (along with his croch grab ofcourse   :shock:  :lol: ) and movies.Michael is a man,a father,a brother and a child to his mother Katherine.Michael is a very generous,sensitive but,he is also not perfect this mean HUMAN.We his fans and the people who loves his music and art,don't know everything about him,we know just what he wanted us to know.Michael is a very gifted person,who from a very early age knew what fame and MONEY are,unfortunately .He like Elvis and many others super-stars became very, very popular and his life changed FOREVER.Now I will try to be honest with you Mjonmind because I see that many people try to put Michael on a pedestal and call him JESUS or some kinda GOD  :? .I'm sorry but I don't think that way,ofcourse this is just my opinion.Let's not forget why we are here in the FIRST PLACE,ok????? Michael Jackson ,the legendary KING OF POP like Jermaine called him ,on that faitfull day at hospital,FAKED HIS DEATH,!!!!! Now I don't want to be mean,but I'm asking myself,what in the world fakeing one's death has to do with JESUS  :???? Because as far as I know,from my study ,Jesus was arrested,tried, and sentenced by Pontius Pilate to be scourged, and finally executed on a cross. Ofcourse if I have another opinion about the execution of Jesus is my bussines and I will not tell here.
Again I will say that to my humble opinion Michael is not Jesus,nor God,he is/was a very gifted and talented ENTERTAINER.He is not perfect,just like we are not,and nobody is PERIOD.I'm very sure that he was never afaid of anyone,otherwise he would never be in the position is today.One more thing before I end my boring post  :lol: please don't forget that Michael LOVES CONTROVERSY  :lol:  geek/  and that's ENOUGH FOR ME to understand someTHINGS from his LIFE and career.He was never AFRAID to tell what he thinks ,even if that THING created CONTROVERSY.Michael did EVERYTHING IN HIS WAY and absolutely NO one and ANYthing stood in HIS WAY   8-) ,not even THE ILLUMINATI CRAP  albino/  8-) .

[/quote]

 :) /bravo/ :) /bravo/ :)

That is the best and one of THE most important posts I've read ALMOST since this hoax began!!!!
I don't mean to offend, and you all state your opinions, and here I will too.  I'm tired to Michael being compared with religion.  We've totally lost what this entire site is for and about.  Michael never claimed to be anything other than what he was ... just a man trying to be a good JW and live as they believe.  Even after he made the decision to leave, he still believed in Jehovah and his kids are now studying to know HIM also.
But, does that make them gods now too because this archangel/god has kids??? 
I rarely post anymore...I rarely read much of the forum anymore...it's all just not even real to me any longer with all the guessing.  It's probably just all of our boredom, but, I sure hope we can get back to the HOAX and leave religion in the bible.
LOVE YOUR POST!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 11, 2011, 02:44:14 PM
But, in my opinion, that's putting things in boxes/catagories. Life is fluid, interconnected, multi-dimensional, not rigid.
My favorite quote: The more I know, the more I realize how little I know.
I guess we'll all have to agree to disagree, and continue to love.
Fordtocarr, for me the site gets boring, if it gets too surface and shallow.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on December 11, 2011, 03:04:48 PM
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MJonMind,  I was thinking that history repeats.  The story of Jesus is similar to several others at different times around the world.  There is Horus and several others.   

Mimi248,  I am like you because I think there is more to the "spiritual side" of this story.  I don't know exactly what because I am still learning about all of it.    Humanity's true spirituality was lost through the ages due to the dark forces of power, greed, manipulating the media, corruption, separate religions, etc.etc.etc.    The truth about where we came from, and what happened to us, and what we can be capable of doing was kept from us, To Control Us   We can break free from this.  It's all in our minds.  They are using mind control, propoganda, and fear.  Fear is a method of mind control.    It's an illusion and the illusion is being dissolved.

So when Michael said "I went to bring awareness and awakening and hope to people" in the movie TII, I think that was what he was talking about.  If you look back at all his "stuff", you see clues about this.

Anyway, I'm certainly not an expert on any of this but have been reading and searching.  I've seen things about people achieving different levels of spirituality.  There are different levels of evolving of being connected with god, or source or the creator.  There is information on ascended masters, enlightened people, lightworkers, star seeds,people who are psychic, can channel, different ranks of angels and a lot more.    Trust me when I first saw all this I thought it was all fake.  Now I don't think it's all fake.  I don't know what is fantasy and what is not but I no longer think it's all a fantasy.  You have to research for yourself.   More and more information, books, and videos keep coming out from more and more people as time goes on.   

Anyway, so I think Michael is connected in some way.  I think he has achieved a higher spirituality some how.  There are a lot of dimensions to the universe and he is connected some way.  It's just my opinion because of all the clues and events.    I am still confused about the differences between angelic humans, angels, galactic humans, ascended masters, lightworkers, crystal and indigo children and prophets etc. etc.  There is a lot of information and it is confusing.  I'm still in the process of looking at it.  They want to help earth evolve.

Some websites,  alienleaks.com,  Galactic Federation of Light, Spirit Science (Youtube), David Wilcock, Research the Pleidians, Sirians,
Ascension, DNA repair, light bodies.    I just found a new series of videos on Youtube "The Pleidians, Keys to the living library) and a lot more.

If you think I'm a little crazy, that's okay.  I'm trying to help and spread information because "It's all for Love", with the L.O.V.E."

If we all come together as one, and see the truth we wil be okay.      bearhug       

Dontwalk my friend I'm sorry but I don't think you are crazy.In fact I think you are super duper,you are beautiful and I'm glad that you wrote about is very important for this hoax,especially this part:

Quote
Propoganda, and fear.  Fear is a method of mind control. It's an illusion and the illusion is being dissolved.

I'm telling you,that after all THIS BIG FEAR will go away you,I and the rest will se the Light at the End of the Tunnel .The FEAR is inside of us all from a long time now  :cry:  :cry: ,just like V told Evey,when she realised that it was all AN ILLUSION created by V himself.This ILLUSION was created for us by Michael also,but also by THE SYSTEM.WE ARE RULED BY FEAR,we are afraid to really LIVE OUR LIFES because of RULES that the SYSTEM requires.THE RULES OF THE SYSTEM are bullshit and you and I know this.THE SYSTEM also use RELIGION mixed with FEAR of SOMEthing or SOMEone,they create this BIG ILLUSION to control us all.Remember what Evey told V when she discovered what HE did to HER????
She said:"SHUT UP,LEAVE ME ALONE,I HATE you,you're SICK,you're EVIL,shut up I don't what to hear your LIES" .
Do you know what all this RED WORDS means or I have to say it????? Do you know why this words were even mentioned in movie and in ILLUSION also,or I have to say it ????
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 11, 2011, 03:25:09 PM
Thankyou for your kind words and support applehead250609.   I'm trying to share information here where I live by saying things little by little but it's going very slowly.  I keep trying.

lOVE YOU !!!!!         penguin/       mj_dance/

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: applehead250609 on December 11, 2011, 03:29:48 PM
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But, in my opinion, that's putting things in boxes/catagories. Life is fluid, interconnected, multi-dimensional, not rigid.
My favorite quote: The more I know, the more I realize how little I know.
I guess we'll all have to agree to disagree, and continue to love.
Fordtocarr, for me the site gets boring, if it gets too surface and shallow.

Mjonmind I'm very sorry you feel that way  :( .I'm sorry that you are bored,but I'm not,in fact I'm more intrigued now,that TS or whatever his name was is gone.For me it's only the begining,and I decided to not give up,not now .Today some beautiful things happened to me and that is no coincidence.On my way to a very special event in my father's life a saw again something that I saw last year  :shock:  :cry: .Last year we disscused about Mozart's life being related to Michael's life and after some time I saw this very,very BIG POSTER on a wall in the center of my city :

(http://qualdesign.net/qualfolio/upload/images/20110111140758.jpg)

Today when I went to my fater's event ,on my way there I saw again a similar poster,OMG this event about Mozart will be again before Christmas  :cry: !!! I was so happy when I saw again this HUGE poster,if you only knew how much.Again I will say that I will not give up on this ,just becasue TS left.I even said before that I don't need TS or any other hero or SUPE hero to come and guide me lol  lolol/ .THE SOLUTION is inside every one of us PERIOD.

(http://www.ziarulfaclia.ro/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/festival-Mozart-238x300.jpg)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 11, 2011, 11:11:31 PM
Applehead, I didn't say I was bored at all, only "IF." ;D
On the contrary I love coming here every day!

I love it most of all when all things are explored!


Love the Mozart poster!



Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: gwynned on December 12, 2011, 12:12:09 AM
Mozart???  How strange.  Just yesterday I was thinking of how Michael reminded me of the guy who played Mozart in Amadeus and how Soleri, who was considered great at the time was jealous of him.  In ghosts he talks about Jealousy and looks a bit like we might picture Mozart.  In Amadeus, Mozart was disinterested in the rich and famous and was completely at home with the common man.  He had a childlike innocence as well.  It's one of my favorite movies as it demonstrates that, as someone said earlier, God is not logical.  He grants gifts to whom he pleases.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 12, 2011, 02:22:51 AM
I think it is a big mistake to try to separate the hoax from the religious side of Michael Jackson. We ALL know how much GOD and FAITH mean to Michael. This is the main reasons I am so proud of him, so proud to be his fan. He is about spiritual things first of all, I would dare to say I think GOD comes first to Michael, before his music, before his fans, his family.

He told us so many times, in his music and in interviews, what spirituality/God means to him so I do not believe for a second this hoax doesn't have a religious side/purpose, I also see it as an attempt to "promote"/remind people of God, God's laws, God's love.

And if it's true that Michael was concerned about the mayan end of the world in 12/21/2012 it makes even much more sense, because I believe Michael wanted us to research even more, to study the Bible even more, so we can be saved when the end will come.

I was just reading Chorintians where it says when that time will come we will be changed in a flash, can you imagine that ?! From mortal bodies to immortal... but only those who are faithful/righteous. What if Michael  wanted to warn us to prepare ourselves better so we are saved? He loves us and it's all for love.

1 Corinthians 15
The Resurrection of Christ

"51 Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. "

There are so many things to talk about...





Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 12, 2011, 03:42:47 AM
gwynned, I loved that movie, Amadaeus! His laugh--oh boy, that was a crazy cackle!   In the music video Ghost, Michael is considered the Maestro living alone in the mansion.
"Maestro means "master." It's normally used with conductors, composers, etc. It signifies respect for someone's talent (usually in music)."



Gina, good post!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: sigh on December 12, 2011, 04:39:27 AM
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And if it's true that Michael was concerned about the mayan end of the world in 12/21/2012 it makes even much more sense, because I believe Michael wanted us to research even more, to study the Bible even more, so we can be saved when the end will come.


If he really had 12/21/2012 in mind as one/a reason for the hoax, I think that would be naive of him to think that the world will end next year,  because the Mayans 'said so'.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 12, 2011, 04:58:12 AM
It would mean he has inside information that the rest of us are not privy to.
So that's the billion dollar question, does he or doesn't he?


I think he does. And there is enough proof to back that up, that we have seen in 2+ years here.
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: gwynned on December 12, 2011, 06:30:44 AM
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gwynned, I loved that movie, Amadaeus! His laugh--oh boy, that was a crazy cackle!   In the music video Ghost, Michael is considered the Maestro living alone in the mansion.
"Maestro means "master." It's normally used with conductors, composers, etc. It signifies respect for someone's talent (usually in music)."



I love that laugh, too.  And I hate to brag, but I can imitate that laugh perfectly, as my kids will attest.  They will often ask me to perform it to the amusement  of their friends.  Carry on, Maestro!
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 12, 2011, 07:37:14 AM
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And if it's true that Michael was concerned about the mayan end of the world in 12/21/2012 it makes even much more sense, because I believe Michael wanted us to research even more, to study the Bible even more, so we can be saved when the end will come.


If he really had 12/21/2012 in mind as one/a reason for the hoax, I think that would be naive of him to think that the world will end next year,  because the Mayans 'said so'.

Maybe he did it "just in case" - you know, just in case the Mayan calendar means something. Maybe it looked like a good occasion to him to convey a message that was so important to him.Nobody knows for sure the world will end on 12/21/2012, but also nobody knows for sure the world won't end on 12/21/2012. MJ said we have 4 years to get it right.  He  talked about the planet...seemingly.
But Michael also spoke about bringing love back into the world. Love, as old fashioned as it seems, IS actually the most important, as it was written in the Bible:

1 Corinthians 13

 1 If I speak in the tongues[a] of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast, but do not have love, I gain nothing.

 4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

 8 Love never fails.

13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

And also it is written in the Bible that God is love.

1 John 4:8

New International Version (NIV)

8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.


Maybe It's all for LOVE = It's all for GOD  ?

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcDmTPtjz34[/youtube]



Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on December 12, 2011, 07:53:38 AM
Now after listening again to his short but powerful speech in TII I've noticed something:

He is involving OTHERS in his production in an interactive way  - in the beginning

He is stating the entertainment side of this "production"

Then he's talking about bringing love back into the world - the religious side of his production.

And then he's talking about saving the planet - the ecological side.

And finally he's talking about those 4 years to get it right, seemingly pointing to the planet, but maybe in fact he was pointing to a possible end of the world in 2012. Can someone explain why he said it will be irreversible? He knew something we don't know?
Anyone knows what is it about the planet that will become irreversible if we don't get it right?

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 12, 2011, 05:32:50 PM
Gina,  I don't know for sure what he is talking about when he said we have four years to get it right or else it's irreversible.  I've been trying to figure it too !!!

1.  It's not the end of the world just the end of the world as we know it.  It's just the end of an era.  The new golden age or the age of aquarius starts on 12/21/11 according to the Mayans and others.  It's the next step in the earth's evolution.

2.  The illuminati or TPTB, military-industrial complex, want to keep their power, wealth and control.  They don't want us to know about the age of peace and love. 

4.  The earth is getting waves of radiation or photon light to bring us to a higher vibration.  This changes everything including DNA molecules etc.  The next step in evolution we will have 12 strands of DNA and not 3.  A lot more ability and ability to connect with information from the light/cosmos.  More connected to universe/god.  Everything is connected by a shared conciousness.  We are all one.  You have to read about ascension, light bodies, DNA repair, light codes, everything is made of light,vibration. 

5.  The illuminati don't want us to evolve.  They may have hid information from us concerning everything including our true history, aliens, UFO's, etc.  They might have advanced alien technology.  I heard about an ancient box that can do similar things that HAARP does, like Tsunami's and earthquakes.  It was in Iraq.  Maybe one of the real reasons for the U.S. War in Iraq ?   Iraq is their ancient homeland.  This is where the ancient civilization of Sumeria was.   They are planning evil things in order to keep their power. 

6.  I heard about them thinking that the Annunaki are coming back on 12/21/12.    The annunaki are aliens.  Maybe from Nibiru a planet that comes near our orbit every 26,000 years or something.   Or I also heard they were from Mars, but destroyed Mars and came here ??   Maybe the Annunaki are the reptilians that people are talking about ?   They are evil and don't care about humans.
I'm not saying that I know that any of this is true.  This is just what I read/heard.

7.  There are friendly groups  of extraterrestrials who have visited and are watching earth.  They want to help us evolve to the next age.  We are supposed to evolve to the fourth or fifth dimension and have joy,love, and peace on earth.  They can't do this until we are ready and have love and will accept them.  We have to have a certain amount of the population ready and then it will be spread.  There is a shared consciousness in the engery field which can spread the love vibration.  That's why we need Love back in the world and love is important.    The evil ones know that by spreading fear we won't have love.

8.  So, there here (invisible due to cloaking), or there coming on 12/21/12 or during 2013 ???????   Anyway, they are sending information such as "The Crop Circles"

9.  The last chance to set up their (illuminati) new world order is now.  They think they have until 12/21/12. 

I'm not saying that I know about any of this being true.  To be honest with you when I first saw it about a year ago I thought it was all fake.  Now I think some of it is true.  There is so much on the internet and I don't know what is real or fake anymore.  But you know that we are not being told the truth, there are UFO's, we did get information from them, they were here in Egypt, Atlantis, and other ancient places.    Lately I've been seeing more and more on Youtube.  And it's not all people who channel, selling books, and drawings.
There are interviews with former CIA and NASA employees, people who were visited by ET's, and also scientists that have proof.  They all can't be lying and some of them are not interested in selling something.

10.   But, I also heard that the illuminati is planning a fake alien invasion just to scare us.   

We'll be okay.  All we have to do is spread love.  It's simple.   

Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on December 12, 2011, 06:40:40 PM
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We'll be okay.  All we have to do is spread love.  It's simple.   


actually, just look to god and you will be ok...

i believe that the illuminati is not a board of cloak wearing, covert, secret sociotey members (though i do believe SS's exist) made up of powerful, rich, well dressed middle aged men. i believe the word illuminati (hate the word actually) or TPTB actually refers to the evil in this world described in the bible in revelation.

they are: babylon the great - which is a world wide empire of false religion. (babylon in bible times was a city full of false and various religions) babylon the great, is false religion of modern day) babylon the great is depicted in the book of revelation as a harlot or prositute that has relaitons with the "kings of the earth" - modern times we know kings of the earth as "political parties" and the "merchants" (also mentioned in the book of revelation) modern day term is corrupt corporation.   (if you want the scriptual references to these please let me know. also if you want it explained the reasoning on how this conclusion was arrived at, please advise and i will post in the revelation thread as it is lengthy)
 
the book of revelation prohecied that god will destroy these three evil forces. interesting.... three.... makes me think of a certain triangle that we have iconised and associated with evil... dont ya think?

anyhow, these three powers, religion, politics & corrupt corporation are incredibly powerful. but not nearly as powerful as god. their days are numbered.

humankind needs to find itself on the right side before the day of destruction. i am not talking end of the world in 2012. i am talking end of these evil powers in preparation for righteous rule by god & jesus that will take over after armageddon and bring true peace and ane end to suffering to all mankind.

for those who are with god, this day is not one to be scared of. this will be a glorious day. gods name will be sanctified and his will shall take place.

we are soooo close to the end. bible prohecy is being fulfiled on a daily basis to validate this. (again, if you want more information, please advise and i will explain in the revelation thread)

i personally believe mj is alive and using every bit of his energy ensuring he is on the right side. worshiping god the way he knows and giving full attention to his god. i als think that he is hoping to turn the attention of millions of people to GOD, LOVE and TRUTH as this system is going down and that BAM is associated with this!


Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 12, 2011, 07:38:33 PM
AustralianMJBeliever,  Now you and others got me interested in reading the book of revelations.  I am going to read it and the thread about it.  It does seem to me also that these prophecies are being fulfilled now. 

Love
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MsTrinity333 on December 14, 2011, 11:18:23 AM
Wow... so many topics you guys are trying to explore; I applaud your search for knowledge.  /bravo/

@ Dontwalkaway;  You brought up a lot of interesting topics.  respect/ Here are some videos/radio shows addressing some of your topics; many have 10-12 parts so to save space from this being too long I will only post the first of each series, those that are interested can then follow the rest on YouTube.

The Nature of Light: (There are four days worth)  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42tUmoZn1EI

Streatching out the Heavens Part 1/9:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-KzR0hcSDc

Genesis, Quantum Physics, Hyper Dimensions Ect:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6nzc2Dcswo

Mysteries of the Planet Mars Part1/10:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwTDo1YC45w&list=PL858927EEA844AE9F

Aliens/Return of the Nephilim Part 1/12: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Odfsxlm5Fp0

Rapture and Tribulation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlvvNL4WsHo

Pyramids, Planets & the Bible Part 1/6:   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLylnY2WIMg 

God Bless
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 15, 2011, 07:02:45 PM
Dontwalkaway
Quote
6.  I heard about them thinking that the Annunaki are coming back on 12/21/12.    The annunaki are aliens.  Maybe from Nibiru a planet that comes near our orbit every 26,000 years or something.   Or I also heard they were from Mars, but destroyed Mars and came here ??   Maybe the Annunaki are the reptilians that people are talking about ?   They are evil and don't care about humans.
I'm not saying that I know that any of this is true.  This is just what I read/heard.

You like to bring up such interesting topics! What did you think of my post on this?
http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=21682.msg379184#msg379184 (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=21682.msg379184#msg379184)

Plus did you watch “Thrive” yet, similar to what you write?
http://www.megavideo.com/?v=T144HL4V (http://www.megavideo.com/?v=T144HL4V)
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on December 15, 2011, 08:29:36 PM
MJonMind, yes I did watch "Thrive", but I don't remember information on planet X or Nibiru.  Do you have anything else about it ?   Thanks, Ms Trinity for all those links you posted.  Looks interesting.  I will watch some each day.


Love
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: MJonmind on December 15, 2011, 08:44:43 PM
Oh sorry, the Thrive video talks about crop circles and alien messages which was on your list.
There's so much info out there on those topics, with varying/opposing opinions, that we have to sift through, and try to come to our own best bigger picture.  Best to just keeping reading as broad a range as possible, keeping an open mind, because if we don't we might get tunnel-vision and can be way off.  Everything has an effect/relates to everything.  I'm so glad God, at least knows!  Leave no stone-unturned! :D
Title: Re: Michael Jackson and Religious Symbolism
Post by: melody on December 28, 2011, 08:00:10 AM
You know how Michael was always saying Shamone/C'mon? (well at least to our ears anyway). There's a tribe mentioned in the bible, the tribe of Simeon, and when I looked into the concordance to see what their name meant, I couldn't help but wonder if this is what Michael was trying to say:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v145/Aymii/shimone1.png)
http://concordances.org/hebrew/8095.htm

Scrolling down further...

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v145/Aymii/shimone2.png)


... I clicked on the root word "shama" & saw the ways they applied the word all through-out scripture:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v145/Aymii/shimone3.png)

http://concordances.org/hebrew/8085.htm


I highlighted the most frequent uses, but the rest are appropriate as well.
Knowing this, that would mean that every time Michael said "Shamone/Shimone"
he was trying to convey "listen attentively", "hear my words", "heed what I say".

Or maybe this is just wishful thinking on my part (http://kaoani.ikilote.net/Les_Anges_(4)/007.gif)

but it would make sense because people really didn't heed the messages in his lyrics.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v145/Aymii/shimone4.png)
http://twitter.com/#!/pariisjaxn/statuses/80381763427385344

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v145/Aymii/shimone5.png)
http://twitter.com/#!/pariisjaxn/status/111443033769259008


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