ambuance photo again!!

[iMJacksonfaN]

ah okay...so they mixed the  Chamber Picture with an 90's picture and an ambulance picture, did I get you right?

Could be. But you clearly see that it's the same equipment used in ambulance.. How is it possible otherwise?
I am also thinking about his "collapse" at the concert in 2001.

[lisap27]

@LadyMedic

interesting video, would all this stuff be done on a already dead person??? in your opinion..  :shock:

[ILuvUMoreMJ]

Backflow most commonly occurs when the IV bag is below the IV site. This is not always the cause of backflow, though. I don't know where the IV bag is positioned there, but the tubing is below the site, so it can definitely happen. The other thing I've found is that EJs seem to "bleed more" than the arms. I think it's just because the vein is very straight and usually huge as opposed to veins in the arms.

But the IV is placed in a vein in his neck called an EJ (external juglar). It's not a common IV placement, but in a cardiac arrest, it's appropriate. You just don't want to go sticking people in the neck with an IV who are talking to you.

And I wasn't going to post this before, but because there is still some confusion about what things are in the picture, I had made this video a few days ago:
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I tried to stay totally unbiased, and I'm not trying to tell you that he is dead, but because there are still so many questions about the picture, I really wanted to clarify, objectively, what you're seeing.

Thank you very much for the detailed information.  So I guess we can rule out MJ staging the photo then, since the tube was actually in his trachea, and they put the IV in his jugular which would mean he'd have to be unconscious, right?  I guess we'll have to hope it was a double, or else some extremely impressive photoshopping, but the reflection of the red car makes me think that's not very likely.

[the arabian nights]

Easy photoshop job. It's from the champer picture, mixed with other photos. How can the cable be exactly the same in the ambulance as in the chamber. Fake, easy to edit! Give me the time I need, and I can make it the same. But I don't bother, cause this is a easy photoshop job. Ask anyone that knows how to use it.

Which cable do you mean?

That with "blood" inside. Take a look at that, and the one with the chamber picture. I was thinking 7 pictures mixed, but that is too many.. Maybe three total.

That pointy > also.. What the hell is that?

yes i have seen this and i totally agree. the question is now, why, was it mike and his photographer friend doing it or the photographer just trying to m?ke a buck so he can start med school.

[Kuki72]

Just thought I'd share this with you all to lighten up the mood.

My 3 year old daughter Isobel is a big little MJ fan and a few moments ago she caught me looking at the photo. She doesn't pronounce his name correctly but this is phonetically what she said. "Is that Mikent Jacksent Mommy?  I said "Yes, baby, but he is asleep". She said "Ok but I like his eyebrouts! (referring to his eyebrows).

Yup, I like his eyebrouts too, and his eyes, and his lips and so on and so on..... :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

[LadyMedic]

@LadyMedic

interesting video, would all this stuff be done on a already dead person??? in your opinion..  :shock:

It depends on what you mean by already dead. I would do all of this only if the person was already dead. I wouldn't do it if the person had been dead for days or hours and they had signs incompatible with life.

[lisap27]

@LadyMedic

interesting video, would all this stuff be done on a already dead person??? in your opinion..  :shock:

It depends on what you mean by already dead. I would do all of this only if the person was already dead. I wouldn't do it if the person had been dead for days or hours and they had signs incompatible with life.

yeh thats the answer i was looking for.. cos speculation has it that Michael was dead already, so i was just seeing if you would do such things on someone who was already dead..

so what do you make of it all then? if you don't mind me asking.. do you think they could have saved his life through this? or not likely, just a chance they could have, thats why they go through these steps?? :shock:

[mjj29081958]

Backflow most commonly occurs when the IV bag is below the IV site. This is not always the cause of backflow, though. I don't know where the IV bag is positioned there, but the tubing is below the site, so it can definitely happen. The other thing I've found is that EJs seem to "bleed more" than the arms. I think it's just because the vein is very straight and usually huge as opposed to veins in the arms.

But the IV is placed in a vein in his neck called an EJ (external jugular). It's not a common IV placement, but in a cardiac arrest, it's appropriate. You just don't want to go sticking people in the neck with an IV who are talking to you.

And I wasn't going to post this before, but because there is still some confusion about what things are in the picture, I had made this video a few days ago:
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

I tried to stay totally unbiased, and I'm not trying to tell you that he is dead, but because there are still so many questions about the picture, I really wanted to clarify, objectively, what you're seeing.

Very clear and interesting video indeed, thanks for sharing.

So, I'm not saying that he's Michael nor the pic is a real one, but in conclusion about the "content" of the pic, we have a common scenario inside an ambulance with a patient who has had a cardiac arrest. The picture shows a real ambulance inside, with real & currently-used medical stuff. There is a real patient, being correctly/properly assisted by real paramedics. Nothing weird/wrong with the way they are using the medical stuff.

On the other hand, such procedures are not a common practice on a patient who has been "death" or without vital signs for some time.

[LadyMedic]

Backflow most commonly occurs when the IV bag is below the IV site. This is not always the cause of backflow, though. I don't know where the IV bag is positioned there, but the tubing is below the site, so it can definitely happen. The other thing I've found is that EJs seem to "bleed more" than the arms. I think it's just because the vein is very straight and usually huge as opposed to veins in the arms.

But the IV is placed in a vein in his neck called an EJ (external jugular). It's not a common IV placement, but in a cardiac arrest, it's appropriate. You just don't want to go sticking people in the neck with an IV who are talking to you.

And I wasn't going to post this before, but because there is still some confusion about what things are in the picture, I had made this video a few days ago:
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

I tried to stay totally unbiased, and I'm not trying to tell you that he is dead, but because there are still so many questions about the picture, I really wanted to clarify, objectively, what you're seeing.

Very clear and interesting video indeed, thanks for sharing.

So, I'm not saying that he's Michael nor the pic is a real one, but in conclusion about the "content" of the pic, we have a common scenario inside an ambulance with a patient who has had a cardiac arrest. The picture shows a real ambulance inside, with real & currently-used medical stuff. There is a real patient, being correctly/properly assisted by real paramedics. Nothing weird/wrong with the way they are using the medical stuff.

On the other hand, such procedures are not a common practice on a patient who has been "death" or without vital signs for some time.

Correct. We would not continue or begin resucitative efforts if the patient was "very" dead. I'm sure every medic could agree that we've probably worked someone who has had some rigor. The theory is "they're not dead until they're warm and dead". So if they were found in a car, I see no lividity or obvious rigor, and we suspect they haven't been there long, we'll work them. However, I may find when I go to intubate that the jaw has some rigor. It seems to be the most common place for rigor to actually start. And if we've already begun CPR, we'll continue. You know the person is not going to make it, but you still try. I know the majority of patients I do CPR on are not going to make it. Even if they code right in front of me. Surival rates with CPR are not high, but there wouldn't be any surival rates if there was no CPR. So I can walk into a scene and know that the person is dead. I know that they are not going to make it. But that does not mean that I don't try.

Another thing is when you get ROSC (return of spontaneous circulation meaning the patient has pulses again) on a cardiac arrest, it can be a good sign, or a false sign. Cardiac arrests that are caused by heart attacks will benefit from ROSC because that may be enough time to cath them, remove the blockage, and keep the heart going. In other cases, ROSC could be obtained because I've pushed 8mg of Epi (epinephrine). There's a joke that if you give a steak enough epi it'll have a pulse. So while the patient does have a pulse, the body is still not going to be able to continue circulating on its own.

And the final thing I wanted to bring up is what people say about his skin color. You are more than welcome to believe whatever you want about the way he looks. But as a fact, in my experience, I have seen people 2 hours dead with CPR having been performed, and they have more color than I do. Not everyone who is dead is pale. You would be very, very suprised.

[Laura]

Well, Mj on pic is not MJ from TII.. Do we need more evidences?? His nose, his colour, his weight: He looked very thin last year...I do not give credit to that picture, and very much doubt that it is him and not a double

[Bee Bee]

if you look where i've put the single arrow the is discolouration on the face, like a purple colour, this indicates death, seen it a few times in my old job, and its to far out to be hair..

Where does this purple discoloration come from? I mean, on dead people. I'm just curious.

Anyway... What I have to say is... We all know MJ is a genius. And if he faked his death, he's even more of a genius. But keeping that in mind, don't you think that he would make sure we really believe he's dead? What I mean is that he wouldn't want a completely fake looking ambulance picture circulating through the world. How would that make sense? And if it wasn't for this photo, we're almost left with nothing. I think maybe even your average joe would start doubting he's dead. This picture is basically all we have. And I don't think we should worry about it too much. If it looks real to you, it does so, because it's supposed to look real. At least, that would make sense if MJ faked his death.

[lisap27]

another thing i noticed aswell about the picture is on his TII he was very skinny and had prominant cheek bones etc..

@LadyMedic

would the face swell to this degree making it look fuller on the picture..

sorry for all the questions..  :oops:

[Laura]

Just one more doubt: If it was not him in the ambu.. What about all that show with the heli and bodies exchange??

Nothing really makes sense..  :shock:  :?:

[AnnieIsNotOK]

Anyway... What I have to say is... We all know MJ is a genius. And if he faked his death, he's even more of a genius. But keeping that in mind, don't you think that he would make sure we really believe he's dead? What I mean is that he wouldn't want a completely fake looking ambulance picture circulating through the world. How would that make sense? And if it wasn't for this photo, we're almost left with nothing. I think maybe even your average joe would start doubting he's dead. This picture is basically all we have. And I don't think we should worry about it too much. If it looks real to you, it does so, because it's supposed to look real. At least, that would make sense if MJ faked his death.

Exactly!

[MissG]

May be this has been discussed already, but here why I think is fake:

As I understood, Propofol induces respiratoric failure.
If MJ died I find more logic that was for respiratoric failure firstleading to a cardiac arrest.

Also, The pic looks photoshopped to me. Somehow I doubt that the "real" pic would be leaked, honestly.
I doubt any paparazzi would have the "luck" of getting that shot tha day  :roll:  

The pic is fake, with MJ dead or alive, that pic seems fake 100%.