2 MJ's

Started by curls, September 21, 2013, 10:05:18 AM

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I'd like to talk and hear about 2 MJ's. Souza, if you'd rather this was a new thread, feel free to make it into one. I remember briefly coming across this idea when I was new here but I think it was information overload in those days and I admit to not giving it much serious thought. I've just read Souza's 'It Takes Two to Tango' blogs, with an open mind, I might add, as nothing surprises me where MJ is concerned, and these are my honest, as I read, thoughts.

Part 1: http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forum/index.php/page,two_1.html
Part 2: http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forum/index.php/page,two_2.html

QuoteWe have had help. We have been receiving information, photo's, video's, documents and clues for months that we could work with. These 'plants' as we call them, are legit, we have no doubt about that. Through this way we want to thank them all for their help and even the ones that were send to mislead us, because that kept us sharp. You all
know who you are

This implies the 2 MJ idea (and others) did not come directly from Souza but were 'planted' - this doesn't make them true or false, but I think it's worth bearing in mind.

Intelius threw up Michael J Jackson and Mike J Jackson, both aged 51 (at time of search), with some relatives in common. At this point I have to ask about some of those relatives' names - is there a Billie Jean Jackson??  Randy Steven and Steven Randall??  Many more who I haven't heard of, which means nothing - in the extended family there are bound to be members I've not heard of.  This led me to the thought that Michael and Jackson are both extremely common names, there are many Michael Jacksons (one, interestingly wrote Blame it on the Boogie!) and it's also not impossible that within the extended Jackson family there indeed IS another Michael. (I have two Matthew ---------'s in my extended family)

Unfortunately (or conveniently, depending on how you're looking at things), we don't have access to any Jackson birth certificates, but even if we did, unless there was definite proof there of a twin for Michael, they could not be used as conclusive proof. Not seeing (or being shown) a BC for a twin would not disprove his existence.

QuoteSo...according to the info we got, Michael Jackson is one of a twin... Michael has a TWIN BROTHER, named Mike J Jackson. We were speechless,
but at the same moment it made a LOT clear!
I think this is a huge leap. Souza, I'd love to hear more on why you found these Intelius records so conclusive. You obviously have seen something I haven't.

None of the pictures that are then shown on the blog prove a twin for me.  Knowing MJ's capacity for disguise and love of mystery and intrigue, and the fact that people can and do look different depending on health and mood before we even start on lighting and make up, I'm far more inclined to go with MJ himself being responsible for any differences seen, not a twin.

The glove, worn on different hands is, I think, a somewhat weak argument for a twin as well.

QuoteYou can see the brothers wear the gloves both right and left. At the memorial they have 2 gloves on the right, 3 on the left, at the
burial they have 3 gloves on the right and 2 on the left. Makes you
wonder...
Sorry, but all that makes me wonder is if they were saving money and only bought 3 pairs of gloves, to share between the 5 brothers!

So, I have a few basic questions about all this.

Why did we never hear of this twin while MJ was still young?  Were they pretending to be one person right from the outset of MJ's public performances?  Did no-one in Gary know about these twins, and ask questions?

If Katherine and Joseph had found out they had two equally talented identical twin boys, would they see that as an opportunity to 'lighten the load' of both of them by getting them to secretly share performances, and be prepared for a life of secrecy, deception and just plain old hassle forever ... or ... would they see it as double the 'cute' factor of a single little MJ, an entertainment 'gimic', with huge money making potential?

Why wouldn't they have just performed openly as individuals or together as twins?  Why would they need to pretend to be one person?

Or, did they look into the future and know life would get tough for one of their twins, so they kept one hidden, in reserve, ready to provide back-up and respite for the other?

Finally, surely no-one calls their twins the same name!  So if one was registered under a different name at birth (and only assumed Mike or Michael later), then is it even possible to track him down at all?

Ok. this has turned out much longer than I intended!  Well done if you've got this far!  I'd love to hear any comments.

EDIT: So, Souza, did one of them die on June 25th or is it a joint hoax?

  Link

RK

February 26, 2014, 09:31:14 AM #90 Last Edit: February 26, 2014, 10:43:37 AM by RK

Might be fun to rehash this......for starters, here is the Donald talking to Larry after June 25th.


sweetsunsetwithMJ

Quote from: curls on February 26, 2014, 02:24:56 AM

Hope it's ok to resurrect this thread - may as well talk about this as anything else I guess!

Anyway, prompted by the pic of MJ used on that Sony/Estate announcement thing and Souza saying it was the taller/older MJ, I'd like to put a fun challenge out to those who believe there are two MJs!

You can have all the make up, surgery, wigs, clothes etc etc in the world to make you look as identical as possible to someone else - but you can't change your wrinkles and creases!  That pic clearly shows (what I've noticed many times with 'MJ') that when he frowns or screws his eyes up, he has horizontal creases at the top of his nose between his eyes. I have the most horrendous vertical frown lines between my eyes when I frown, and there's nothing I can do to frown any differently!  So, my challenge to anyone who cares to take it on, is to find pics of 'MJ' with a different type of creasing!

That would be pretty convincing evidence of two MJs IMO!

These are the pictures of MJ frowing I have found so far, in any of them I've been able to find the supposed MJ with different creases than those you Curls are talking about, I mean all MJs (assuming there are more than one) have the horizontal creases when they frowns = THERE IS ONLY "ONE" MJ:





I WANNA BE WHERE YOU ARE!!

sweetsunsetwithMJ

February 26, 2014, 11:15:08 AM #92 Last Edit: February 26, 2014, 11:18:50 AM by sweetsunsetwithMJ

Now...I know there's only one MJ because the skeleton in every MJ I have seen so far is EXACTLY the same, he has the right shoulder (if you look at the picture then is his left) slightly lower than the other and I've never seen another MJ without this feature, take a look:







Another feature of his face is that he has his lower lip is slightly fallen towards his left side that you can notice when he smiles (if you look at his picture is his right side), take a look of the pictures:








This is the supposed Barry Shaw:

And this is the supposed O2 Arena guy:



I WANNA BE WHERE YOU ARE!!

curlsTopic starter

Quote from: ~Souza~ on February 26, 2014, 06:49:11 AM

Hey curls,

I did look, but the problem here is that you assume they both wrinkle there. I could not really see that. That frown you mention is indeed typical for one, not so much for the other. .....

No, no, no, Souza, I'm not assuming that at all!  Quite the opposite in fact.  I'm saying that if there are two of them, it's highly unlikely that they both have the same creases when they frown or screw up their eyes.

You say 'the other one' doesn't show the horizontal line frown so much.  So I want pics!  Does he just never frown at all so we never get to compare (botox maybe?) or does he have a different frown, in which case there should be pics!

While we're at it - which MJ had the mole on his left cheek (which was later removed but the scar is still visible)?

@sweetsunset, nice pics - almost as if you had them all ready and waiting for a debate such as this!!


~Souza~

Quote from: curls on February 26, 2014, 12:24:15 PM

Quote from: ~Souza~ on February 26, 2014, 06:49:11 AM

Hey curls,

I did look, but the problem here is that you assume they both wrinkle there. I could not really see that. That frown you mention is indeed typical for one, not so much for the other. .....

No, no, no, Souza, I'm not assuming that at all!  Quite the opposite in fact.  I'm saying that if there are two of them, it's highly unlikely that they both have the same creases when they frown or screw up their eyes.

You say 'the other one' doesn't show the horizontal line frown so much.  So I want pics!  Does he just never frown at all so we never get to compare (botox maybe?) or does he have a different frown, in which case there should be pics!

While we're at it - which MJ had the mole on his left cheek (which was later removed but the scar is still visible)?

@sweetsunset, nice pics - almost as if you had them all ready and waiting for a debate such as this!!

He doesn't frown as much. I will see if I can find some pics tomorrow if I don't forget. I have looked at tons of pictures and it frustrates me greatly that I can't really find something new to show. All I posted before wasn't convincing enough for many.

The one with the removed mole is the one with the bigger chin, the older one. So you DID notice one has no scar? Ha! I love this discussion. I am so certain of it and I see some kinda see it but don't want to admit it yet and there are the people that will never want to believe it. Thanks RK for the video, that is the one I meant.


curlsTopic starter

I love this discussion too Souza!  Even though I'm one who doesn't believe it (yet).  Not a question of not wanting to believe it, just haven't seen anything I'd call proof.

'No scar' means nothing - we all know how heavily many of MJ's pics are touched-up/airbrushed to give a flawless finish.

Have you also noticed how some photos are 'reversed'?  That too gives a very different look to a person.


applehead250609

Quote from: curls on February 26, 2014, 04:26:25 PM

I love this discussion too Souza!  Even though I'm one who doesn't believe it (yet).  Not a question of not wanting to believe it, just haven't seen anything I'd call proof.

'No scar' means nothing - we all know how heavily many of MJ's pics are touched-up/airbrushed to give a flawless finish.

Have you also noticed how some photos are 'reversed'?  That too gives a very different look to a person.

Oh Curly boy,beLIEve me that I noticed.....the pictureS are reversed as "hell",lol....and that gives a very different look to a person,yes,yes.

Mirror,mirror on the world,who's the most beautiful GIRL....sorry  :icon_mrgreen: BOY in the world?? Think like a MAN......act like a WOMAN,he he !!! That This is it Drill confused me as "hell",but not anymore he he  :icon_pale:   :Crash:.


RK

The "always great to sing with my brother" line from the TII album is  something to consider when we are examining this topic also. 


~Souza~

Quote from: RK on February 27, 2014, 08:27:44 AM

The "always great to sing with my brother" line from the TII album is  something to consider when we are examining this topic also. 

Who is it? Is it a friend of mine? Who is it? Is it my brother?

mattie

Quote from: applehead250609 on February 27, 2014, 03:42:15 AM

Quote from: curls on February 26, 2014, 04:26:25 PM

I love this discussion too Souza!  Even though I'm one who doesn't believe it (yet).  Not a question of not wanting to believe it, just haven't seen anything I'd call proof.

'No scar' means nothing - we all know how heavily many of MJ's pics are touched-up/airbrushed to give a flawless finish.

Have you also noticed how some photos are 'reversed'?  That too gives a very different look to a person.

Oh Curly boy,beLIEve me that I noticed.....the pictureS are reversed as "hell",lol....and that gives a very different look to a person,yes,yes.

Mirror,mirror on the world,who's the most beautiful GIRL....sorry  :icon_mrgreen: BOY in the world?? Think like a MAN......act like a WOMAN,he he !!! That This is it Drill confused me as "hell",but not anymore he he  :icon_pale:   :Crash:.

Did i mis something? what is mend by this?? That Travis Payne and shawn holley are one and the same??
Or am i asking a stupid question now?
Or

~Souza~

I don't get it either....


Australian MJ BeLIEver

note to self. reread this thread

People laugh when I explain. And though they may laugh, that doesn't change the fact that it's still the truth.


Michael is Alive
The end of evil is nigh
Trust in God
The righteous will prevail

goat

The way we are taught to process information means it is absolutely very difficult to comprehend 2 michaels.However,i for one have no problem believing it could be plausible.Amazing how quick people are to dismiss certain ideas yet allow themselves to be taken in by others.So good to be back here,but of course ive been here every week since 2009.Family problems meant I couldn't dedicate my time as I would have liked.


iamhere4mj

September 07, 2014, 04:57:02 PM #103 Last Edit: September 07, 2014, 04:59:07 PM by iamhere4mj

I do believe there have been multiple Michael's over the years, but when the Michael cd came out and we were given that huge mural to look through, I started to believe that perhaps there was a twin involved.

Who's twin? I think Marlon's twin, Brandon.

On the Michael mural there is this:

This depicts 10 children, with Brandon being depicted as being between 10 and 12. Why would he be depicted at that age if he died at child birth? I can't say for sure which one is Marlon and which one is Brandon, but one of them looks like they are hiding. Or is this person Michael's twin?

There is also a transcript from CNN with this:

http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0909/03/lkl.01.html
CNN LARRY KING LIVE
Michael Jackson Laid to Rest
Aired September 3, 2009 - 21:00   ET

KING: Who's putting this all together?
MANNING: The whole family. Everybody is involved (INAUDIBLE)...
ROWE: (INAUDIBLE) has spearheaded it.
MANNING: Yes, right. Yes.
ROWE: Brandon Jackson.
MANNING: Yes.
ROWE: He's doing a great job.
MANNING: Yes.
KING: He's the man, huh?
ROWE: Brandon's the man.
MANNING: Yes, he is. And, you know, Leonard...
ROWE: He's a (INAUDIBLE) guy.

Brandon Jackson? Odd.......

There was discussion on this thread about the scar on his cheek; I totally agree with that - sometimes you can see it and sometimes you can't. Michael also has a scar (or raised skin) on his right index finger - sometimes you can see it and sometimes you can't:

Love you Michael!


micasjas

Quote from: 2good2btrue on September 26, 2013, 05:36:54 AM

I just came across this on Arnold Klein's Facebook page 2hrs ago.  Arnold Klein is on a roll with confirming it WAS
NOT Michael at the London announcement, but rather an impersonator.......

Arnold W. Klein
the problem with AEG....during the London interview this was not Michael ...look at the chin!

https://www.facebook.com/#!/arnold.klein?hc_location=stream

Arnold W. Klein
the impersonator had a cleft in the bottom of his chin like a tooth. When /i rebuilt Michael's face there was no cleft!!! look at the width of the impersonator's mouth.Like ·  · Share · 3 hours ago · 10 people like this..

Lesley Anthony http://michaeljacksonnotdead.wordpress.com/tag/imposter/

Lesley Anthony... latex MJ moulded mask  Ines Parrain.. What do mean Arnold ? I mean, Michael had a chin's cleft for ages.... Look at the 2005' pictures... Anyway, there was an impersonator in TII, I agree with that.

Lesley Anthony ..Arnold W. Klein can you please comment on this blog / article that claims, that you were reonstructing his face so he could get away unrecognized? http://michaeljacksonnotdead.wordpress.com/.../

I keep telling people that you can hear the audience chanting "Get Michael" or at least that is what it sounds like.