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Re: NEW CHILD MOLESTATION CLAIM By Wade Robson
February 27, 2015, 07:26:54 PM
As a victim of sexual abuse myself; I can assure you that no amount of money or gifts would have lured me back into the situation again. I suffered abuse at the hands of 3 different males on entirely separate occasions. I was 4 at the first incident and knew without a doubt that it was wrong. I was told not to tell. And I didn't. But when I was made the offer to return to the home, I cried and told my mother that I didn't want to go back. The 2nd incident was when I was 5, and the last when I was 7. I am telling you that I avoided each home like the plague. I never told anyone.  :-\

My point is, I wouldn't have accepted money or bribes. I was very very nervous and physically ill in the presence of my abusers and couldn't stand to be around them. My body language spoke volumes if anyone was on the outside looking in. A psychologist could've read me like a book.  :smiley-vault-misc-150:

Theres no way I would testify on their behalf if these men were ever brought to court by another abuser. No way at all. I would gladly testify to what animals they are. I wouldn't participate in any types of tributes or be in a video if I would be paid a million dollars. So my point is that none of it adds up. I am a victim and I understand what we deal with. If what Robson and Safechuck says is true, imho, they would never ever have gone back. But they kept going back. No child would willingly put themselves in the way of an abuser. That child would pretend to be ill, make up an excuse not to go, there would be something that people could look back on and say they remembered the differences in the child.

There seems to be nothing here. Nothing. I do not believe their stories at all. I have even evaluated their claims by thinking outside the box and thinking not as a fan of MJ. Because its only right to take the time to listen to anyone that makes a claim of abuse. I am never quick to say that someone is lying. But under these circumstances, $$$$ is the main goal from what I can see. I have questioned whether I thought Mike was guilty or not. At one point, I wasn't sure. But after reading things over and over, looking at Robsons body language, his possible anger at not being hired as the choreographer by the estate and on and on; his testimony that MJ never harmed him,etc.  :judge-smiley:

My conclusion is that if it looks like fish and smells like fish; then it probably is fish. I don't believe it for one second. Not because MJ is supposedly the abuser, but because theres no evidence and the stories don't seem to make since. The stories are kinda "off the wall" tbh  :WTF:

So no I don't believe them at all. Why not come out and say these things in the height of MJ career?  :michael_jackson-1135:

From a lot of things that I have seen and read over the years, I really believe that there was a constant conspiracy against MJ. He did things that no man, white or black, had ever done. And Lord knows the world wasn't ready for a black man who was breaking boundaries and uniting races in the way that he was. To some, he was the enemy. I just don't buy it and I really believe that the truth will prevail. And no, I don't believe much of what comes out of Latoya or Jermaines mouth. The relatives that you have expected to talk have. And the ones that you have expected to stay quiet have.  :confused:

Latoya and Jermaine need money because of their lackluster careers and will say anything to get paid. Jermaine wrote "Word to the Badd" about his brother. His brother ::) Theres no way I could ever write such lyrics about my worst enemy; much less my brother. That family doesn't know the meaning of loyalty. So no, I take nothing at face value with Latoya and her claims about MJ or even Jack Gordon. In her book, "Starting Over", she makes soooo many claims and tells stories that I wouldn't believe if I were paid to believe it.  :argue:

From her wild claims about her taking MJ out of his coffin and sitting his corpse up in a seated position to her claims of showering with her Bible; the woman is absurd and cannot be taken seriously on 80% of things that she says. The one thing that I might be inclined to believe was when she said she was lying about Mike because Gordon threatened MJ life and Janets.  :'(
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RK

Re: NEW CHILD MOLESTATION CLAIM By Wade Robson
February 28, 2015, 01:11:12 AM
I don't discount those rumors and stories we've all read that MJ was abused as a child.  I think it was Jerms who said that Mike would be  sick for days after accompanying Joe on  late night meetings with some music execs and business men when he was just a little boy. Perhaps it is the emotional scars that were etched into his psyche at that tender age that made him identify with children so much.
And I don't believe that if one is abused that they are more likely to become an abuser themselves. On the contrary, it could make a person so empathic to childrens pain that you are willing to devote your life to helping those who are yet suffering.

These allegations, all of them, from jordan through to the present ,IMO are the  visible part of a deep and horrific conspiracy against Michael.  What we have seen through the media is the part above the surface, but how much more is concealed in the murkey depths below. How dare this black man get off message and have so much influence over people of all races and cultures. Then he had the audacity to buy  the Beatles catalogue.  His late night phone calls with Princess Diana while her phone was being tapped, what was it that they talked about? What did she tell him?  It goes on and on. TPTB wanted to keep this black boy in his place. I have toyed with the idea that the latest allegations are designed to keep Michael in his place of being 'dead' as well. His career has been reinvented since he 'died' and the estate has made mega bucks. I think that there would be many who would like this gravy train to continue without him reappearing. So throw some more fabricated bullshit out there and give him the option of stay gone, where they can't reach you and let us deal with this, or go back and face a repeat of 2005 with the added surprise element of having faked your death thrown in there for added effect. 
I think he has chosen option 1. He is a father who has the well being of his children to take into account.
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Do

Re: NEW CHILD MOLESTATION CLAIM By Wade Robson
February 28, 2015, 03:22:43 PM
Hi Michaelslady, I'm so sorry to hear what happenend to you. It must have been really hard, especially because it started when you were such a little girl. I hope you are okay now?
I only wanted to say in my posts that every situation is unique, and therefore it is hard to tell when someone is lying/telling the truth. When victims react in a different way than we expect, that doesn't have to mean he/she is lying. When you are gradually being groomed, then maybe you don't (or less) experience the anguish and disgust you  experience when you are overpowered at an unexpectant time, at an unexpectant manner, in an unexpectant situation, by an unexpectant person.
Again, I hope all is well for you now :bearhug:
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"Three passions, simple but overwhelmingly strong, have governed my life: the longing for love, the search for knowledge, and unbearable pity for the suffering of mankind."
Bertrand Russel

i feel sorry for you Michaelslady, and hope you have found a way to live the life the way you want.

Wade explicitly talked about what MJ did to him, and also tells he didn't know it was sex. abuse, just like Michaelslady said you know nomatter how old you are that it isn't a natural thing. you don't want to be around them.

My concern goes out to the people who really have been abused , people like Wade , safechuck,do ruin it for people who really had this expiriences.

HI @Do, we are not  talking about a little boy here, we speak about a grown man of 20 years old who was a key wittnes in the 2005 trial. Who after that waited for 10 years to discover  that he was also sex. abused by MJ. :icon_eek: he said he always knew, but didnt know it was sex. abuse. but thought it was love , again, 20 years old!

Not in 1.62 Billion years

P.s@ DO it is not my intention to disrespect you or anyone else, i hope i haven't done this in my post.
Last Edit: March 01, 2015, 03:32:44 PM by ShyBleuEyes
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“In a world filled with hate, we must still dare to hope. In a world filled with anger, we must still dare to comfort. In a world filled with despair, we must still dare to dream. And in a world filled with distrust, we must still dare to believe.”
― Michael Jackson

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Do

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Quote
My concern goes out to the people who really have been abused , people like Wade , safechuck,do ruin it for people who really had this expiriences.

Yes, very true, that's what I fear as well...

Quote
HI @Do, we are not  talking about a little boy here, we speak about a grown man of 20 years old who was a key wittnes in the 2005 trial. Who after that waited for 10 years to discover  that he was also sex. abused by MJ. :icon_eek: he said he always knew, but didnt know it was sex. abuse. but thought it was love , again, 20 years old!

Not in 1.62 Billion years

P.s@ DO it is not my intention to disrespect you or anyone else, i hope i haven't done this in my post.

Hi Shy, don't worry, I don't feel disrespected at all! I'm very glad that we can talk about this without arguing! And I totally understand were you're coming from. It's cristal clear for you, but I'm still strugling with it a bit. I do understand when you (and Michaelslady) are saying that a child don't want to go back to someone who is doing these things. I can't say much more about it, like I said, I'm trying to stay neutral on this.
P.s. Ben je klaar met het klussen in je huis :)
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"Three passions, simple but overwhelmingly strong, have governed my life: the longing for love, the search for knowledge, and unbearable pity for the suffering of mankind."
Bertrand Russel

Thanks ladies. I am fine. truly.  :icon_razz:

Some people used to say that the abused become abusers. Thats not true in every situation; definitely not in mine. But the abuse that I suffered taught me to be more cautious with whom I let my children be around. I am more protective of them.

Yes, I agree that Robson and Safechuck make it very hard for real victims of abuse. :(

And I fail to believe that Robson didn't know that what he claims happened to him was sex at the age of 20; when that's the time that he was sleeping with Britney Spears and caused her and Justin Timberlake to split.  ::)
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Amazing how Robson spoke so highly of MJ and talked about what a great father and person he was in 2011. hmmm. Very interesting video

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curls

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.... I have toyed with the idea that the latest allegations are designed to keep Michael in his place of being 'dead' as well. His career has been reinvented since he 'died' and the estate has made mega bucks. I think that there would be many who would like this gravy train to continue without him reappearing. So throw some more fabricated bullshit out there and give him the option of stay gone, where they can't reach you and let us deal with this, or go back and face a repeat of 2005 with the added surprise element of having faked your death thrown in there for added effect. 
I think he has chosen option 1. He is a father who has the well being of his children to take into account.

This could be the sad and terrible truth ... that MJ is still not 'free' and in control. I posted a similar idea a few days ago and asked the question of whether legally he'd be in sticky waters if he later resurfaced, having stayed dead knowing there were these allegations being made against him. Has he missed the window of opportunity to come back and face this head on and is now forced to stay dead?

But, RK, who are you suggesting threw the 'fabricated bullshit'?

Horrible if the whole hoax idea that was meant to be such an adventure for all concerned, has monumentally backfired in such an ugly way.
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.... I have toyed with the idea that the latest allegations are designed to keep Michael in his place of being 'dead' as well. His career has been reinvented since he 'died' and the estate has made mega bucks. I think that there would be many who would like this gravy train to continue without him reappearing. So throw some more fabricated bullshit out there and give him the option of stay gone, where they can't reach you and let us deal with this, or go back and face a repeat of 2005 with the added surprise element of having faked your death thrown in there for added effect. 
I think he has chosen option 1. He is a father who has the well being of his children to take into account.

This could be the sad and terrible truth ... that MJ is still not 'free' and in control. I posted a similar idea a few days ago and asked the question of whether legally he'd be in sticky waters if he later resurfaced, having stayed dead knowing there were these allegations being made against him. Has he missed the window of opportunity to come back and face this head on and is now forced to stay dead?

But, RK, who are you suggesting threw the 'fabricated bullshit'?

Horrible if the whole hoax idea that was meant to be such an adventure for all concerned, has monumentally backfired in such an ugly way.


I’ve thought about this a lot as well, Curls and RK—wondered if these new allegations are being presented, as well as consequent suggestion of guilt regarding old allegations being maintained, in an effort to paint MJ as an unreliable source regarding something more sinister if and when he ever does choose to come back, i.e., like a just in case . . . let’s keep the fabrications rolling as a monumental distraction (and destroyer of credibility) from anything significant he might want to reveal. IDK  :icon_e_confused:                       

But yes, it seems the bottom line question regards the who and why. I’ve never been one to believe the hoax was primarily conducted as an adventure but have rather always seen the “adventure” part as a side activity. However, I thought I read somewhere that a person has seven years from the alleged date of death to return without suffering legal loss/repercussion (?).
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It's all for L.O.V.E.



Hi Shy, don't worry, I don't feel disrespected at all! I'm very glad that we can talk about this without arguing! And I totally understand were you're coming from. It's cristal clear for you, but I'm still strugling with it a bit. I do understand when you (and Michaelslady) are saying that a child don't want to go back to someone who is doing these things. I can't say much more about it, like I said, I'm trying to stay neutral on this.
P.s. Ben je klaar met het klussen in je huis :)
[/quote]
[/quote]

Hi Do,m happy to read your post, and i love the discussion, but i guess you know that.

Nog steeds aan het klussen Do, maar het einde komt wel al in zicht, het is het leukste werk van de wereld( voor mij althans) lol, maar het ontbrak mij vaak aan tijd. btw.....dat je het nog weet, ben jaloers op je geheugen.
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“In a world filled with hate, we must still dare to hope. In a world filled with anger, we must still dare to comfort. In a world filled with despair, we must still dare to dream. And in a world filled with distrust, we must still dare to believe.”
― Michael Jackson

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.... I have toyed with the idea that the latest allegations are designed to keep Michael in his place of being 'dead' as well. His career has been reinvented since he 'died' and the estate has made mega bucks. I think that there would be many who would like this gravy train to continue without him reappearing. So throw some more fabricated bullshit out there and give him the option of stay gone, where they can't reach you and let us deal with this, or go back and face a repeat of 2005 with the added surprise element of having faked your death thrown in there for added effect. 
I think he has chosen option 1. He is a father who has the well being of his children to take into account.

This could be the sad and terrible truth ... that MJ is still not 'free' and in control. I posted a similar idea a few days ago and asked the question of whether legally he'd be in sticky waters if he later resurfaced, having stayed dead knowing there were these allegations being made against him. Has he missed the window of opportunity to come back and face this head on and is now forced to stay dead?

But, RK, who are you suggesting threw the 'fabricated bullshit'?

Horrible if the whole hoax idea that was meant to be such an adventure for all concerned, has monumentally backfired in such an ugly way.


I’ve thought about this a lot as well, Curls and RK—wondered if these new allegations are being presented, as well as consequent suggestion of guilt regarding old allegations being maintained, in an effort to paint MJ as an unreliable source regarding something more sinister if and when he ever does choose to come back, i.e., like a just in case . . . let’s keep the fabrications rolling as a monumental distraction (and destroyer of credibility) from anything significant he might want to reveal. IDK  :icon_e_confused:                       

But yes, it seems the bottom line question regards the who and why. I’ve never been one to believe the hoax was primarily conducted as an adventure but have rather always seen the “adventure” part as a side activity. However, I thought I read somewhere that a person has seven years from the alleged date of death to return without suffering legal loss/repercussion (?).

agree, wow i never heard of that starchild, but it gives new perspectives , i already had let go of the thought MJ would ever come back. but never lose hope.
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“In a world filled with hate, we must still dare to hope. In a world filled with anger, we must still dare to comfort. In a world filled with despair, we must still dare to dream. And in a world filled with distrust, we must still dare to believe.”
― Michael Jackson

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.... I have toyed with the idea that the latest allegations are designed to keep Michael in his place of being 'dead' as well. His career has been reinvented since he 'died' and the estate has made mega bucks. I think that there would be many who would like this gravy train to continue without him reappearing. So throw some more fabricated bullshit out there and give him the option of stay gone, where they can't reach you and let us deal with this, or go back and face a repeat of 2005 with the added surprise element of having faked your death thrown in there for added effect. 
I think he has chosen option 1. He is a father who has the well being of his children to take into account.

 RK, it's a great thought and totally makes sense to me.
This could be the sad and terrible truth ... that MJ is still not 'free' and in control. I posted a similar idea a few days ago and asked the question of whether legally he'd be in sticky waters if he later resurfaced, having stayed dead knowing there were these allegations being made against him. Has he missed the window of opportunity to come back and face this head on and is now forced to stay dead?

But, RK, who are you suggesting threw the 'fabricated bullshit'?

Horrible if the whole hoax idea that was meant to be such an adventure for all concerned, has monumentally backfired in such an ugly way.


I’ve thought about this a lot as well, Curls and RK—wondered if these new allegations are being presented, as well as consequent suggestion of guilt regarding old allegations being maintained, in an effort to paint MJ as an unreliable source regarding something more sinister if and when he ever does choose to come back, i.e., like a just in case . . . let’s keep the fabrications rolling as a monumental distraction (and destroyer of credibility) from anything significant he might want to reveal. IDK  :icon_e_confused:                       

But yes, it seems the bottom line question regards the who and why. I’ve never been one to believe the hoax was primarily conducted as an adventure but have rather always seen the “adventure” part as a side activity. However, I thought I read somewhere that a person has seven years from the alleged date of death to return without suffering legal loss/repercussion (?).

agree, wow i never heard of that starchild, but it gives new perspectives , i already had let go of the thought MJ would ever come back. but never lose hope.
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“In a world filled with hate, we must still dare to hope. In a world filled with anger, we must still dare to comfort. In a world filled with despair, we must still dare to dream. And in a world filled with distrust, we must still dare to believe.”
― Michael Jackson

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curls

Starchild, I'm not 100% sure, but isn't that 7 year thing to do with people who have gone missing, and after 7 years they are declared legally dead, their estate can be settled and their spouse is free to remarry. MJ has not 'gone missing'.

While I'm pretty certain MJ did nothing fraudulent or legally wrong at the time he faked his death, I really don't know, but am concerned, with how he would stand regarding 'avoidance of law enforcement', in cases such as Robson and Safechuck's allegations, that have arisen since June 2009.  I haven't been able to find any information on this as yet - seems like a unique, one-off case.
Last Edit: March 03, 2015, 03:57:35 PM by curls
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Thanks, Curls.
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It's all for L.O.V.E.

In my opinion these claims have more than one side to them.

Robson and Safechuck could have spoken up earlier and stated the truth but chose not to. Why? Repressed memory? I don't think so.

I think the claims do have something to do with both allegations brought against Michael and somewhere inside the claim filings by Robson and Safechuck lies the answers.

It was brought up that Robsons father committed suicide in 2002 but yet this didn't shake Wade up enough to come forward with the truth about Michael at that time? I think that would have shaken anyone to the core.

I went looking for the 7 year legally dead thing that curls was talking about and I put a spin on it from the hoax side of it:

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Most countries have a set period of time (seven years in many common law jurisdictions) after which an individual is presumed dead if there is no evidence to the contrary. However, if the missing individual is the owner of a significant estate, the court may delay ordering the issuing of a death certificate if there has been no real effort to locate the missing person. If the death is thought to have taken place in international waters or in a location without a centralized and reliable police force or vital statistics registration system, other laws may apply. From the hoax side there really isn't true evidence that Michael is dead. Just what appears to be facts. There is no marking on the tomb, the family has not told the believers we are delusional, the family has stated that they believe more than just Murray is involved in this but yet Murray was the only one investigated.


Facts, circumstances, and the "balance of probabilities"[edit]

In most common law and civil code jurisdictions, it is usually necessary to obtain a court order directing the registrar to issue a death certificate in the absence of a physician's certification that an identified individual has died. Murray didn’t sign the death certificate!

Legal aspects[edit]

United States[edit]

The law calls people who disappear missing or absent. Several criteria affect declaring someone dead by assumption:

A person's being missing from their home or usual residence for, typically, seven years (the period varies from state to state) In this case 100 North Carolwood Drive or the Hayvenhurst compound

Such absences being continuous and without explanation The believers keep wondering when is this going to end? There has been no explanation on anything since the family needs to maintain that Michael is dead but yet everything that has been said or implied leads to him being alive which means he is missing.

Such absences being accompanied by a lack of long-distance communication with those most likely to hear from them Since we are not privy to this type of information we have no idea if the immediate family has been contacted or not. We don’t even know if Michael is in plain sight.

Diligent but unsuccessful search for that person and inquiry into their whereabouts This belongs to the believers who have been extremely diligent in ‘searching’ but unsuccessful

Professor Jeanne Carriere, author of “The Rights of the Living Dead: Absent Persons in Civil Law” (published in the Louisiana Law Review), stated that as of 1990, the number of such cases in the United States was estimated at between 60,000 and 100,000.[7] Often the missing person's bank accounts are checked for activity, and possible sightings investigated.[citation needed] Michaels bank accounts are now overseen by the Estate  which would cover any activity needed to get money to Michael and the possible sighting were never investigated because everyone thinks Michael is dead.


Love you Michael!
Last Edit: March 07, 2015, 11:53:35 AM by iamhere4mj
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