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Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 02:42:15 AM
I just thought of all the poor kitties and doggies they chip !!!  Well, they had to start somewhere....but kind of makes you wonder what kind of experimenting has been going on with our beloved four legged friends.    Now they "chip" our bank cards and have us convinced that it provides better security. 

The more reason to pray for Gods' Kingdom to come on EARTH as it is heaven.  That is my only hope anyways.
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"The righteous will possess the earth,
And they will live forever on it."
Psalm 37:29

*

MJonmind

Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 03:59:46 AM
On finding safety from even such a situation as the Big Brother chip to control us like robots, TS does mention that the truth of the Ark is our safety somehow, just like Noah's ark was safety for the 8. So I guess we will learn more with the other signs what we must do to protect ourselves. Also MJ/TS always remind us that we needn't fear or worry, only trust God and Michael.  Good point about the fact that the Christians just before 70 AD and Jerusalem being destroyed, were warned to flee, which they did, long before the Sabbath. 


The Sign
Quote (selected)
God wants us to see the ark by faith.But not blind faith, gullibly believing everything that anyone tells us; no, we should have intelligent faith that is based upon plenty of evidence. Also, video of the ark and the tables of stone will be made public in the near future, shortly after the mark of the beast law is passed.


Also we should not assume that he is ONLY meaning the "mark of the beast" to be the National Sunday Law. I think we only assumed this because Ron Wyatt was a Seventh Day Adventist and they believe that worshiping on Sunday IS the Mark of the Beast. I believe TS/The Sign is only endorsing Ron Wyatts discoveries, and not the particular SDA faith-group's teachings. Perhaps there will be a law passed that every human on earth has to receive the implanted chip, for national security, medical purposes and for our financial transactions. I can see the possibilities for both, but for practical purposes I think the chip is more realistic.  Although perhaps TSL may also be implemented somehow as well, who knows.  Usually things are far more complicated than we realize.


Paula-c, your post reminds me of the movie which I saw, "In Time", in which people had a large computer device under the skin of their wrist, but the currency was Time to live. For instance a meal might cost a week. Evil powers in the rich area, who had thousands of years to live, were ever raising the prices of things for those in the poor areas, so that the poor were living with often minutes to spare, stealing Time from each other, dying on the streets, and living basically in hell.  It was depressing and unrealistic, but it could give a picture of living with the micro-chip.
Last Edit: January 30, 2012, 04:02:49 AM by MJonmind
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Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 05:14:49 AM
I am actually far from reading all of the posts. I just started on page 8 where I left off but I saw some posts that really got my attention and I felt compelled to respond and make a reference to them. I will keep reading but I have a lot to catch up on.
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The 'thing' with Ron that I think is really 'tripping' me up/out...is that he just so happened to find everything he went looking for.  Stuff that people had searched forever for...and then this guy shows up...always at the right time, right place...and BAM  :lol: there it is.  Either he was truly led by God and had His help in locating these artifacts....or he's a scammer..

just to play devils advocate and no pun intended here, but just want to point out that evil side can make man accomplish, discover and achieve feats too (as per what we have all read in the bible) - ...

here are some examples, to refresh our memories:

-magic practicing priests in pharaohs time were able to duplicate some of gods miracles
-satan used a snake to talk to eve
-star that guided astrologers to baby jesus - stopped by herod first (the person out to kill baby jesus) and (unsure if i should open this can of worms)
-people under demonic influence can heal the sick
-some who practice satanism can fortell the future.

satan uses supernatural schemes and tactics to overcome his victim. he is a supernatural being with great power to deceive (Job 1:7)

the bible also indicates the antichrist and false prophet will also perform miracles. and the bible also speaks about counterfit signs and wonders...

revelation16:13-14  And I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs leap from the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. These miracle-working demons caused all the rulers of the world to gather for battle against the Lord on that great judgment day of God Almighty.

another interesting scripture is where Paul also wrote in the letter to the Corinthians that the miraculous gifts of God’s holy spirit would end. He said: “Whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with.”—1 Corinthians 13:8

powers, knowlege of god (one on one) and miracles ceased. meaning that those who continue to do such things or posess such gifts MAY be doing so NOT under the influence of god but the influence of evil, WITH THE motive of distracting people away from god - or with out motive as they could be being used by the devil (as per bible)

does someone being 'led by god' as in this case constitue a 'miracle' or 'prophecying' or 'knowledge' - ??? hmm, dont know. dont have the answer... just saying and putting it out there. interesting question for those that believe in god and read the bible... (incl me)

please note I AM NOT SAYING THAT THIS IS THE CASE, in this particular instance...

however for those who are 'god believers / bible readers - really the two possible scenarious in this situation that have been posted in this thread, being "chosen/sent/directed/influenced by god" or "scammer/fraud/faker" are not absolute, as there is a third possible explanation.

again, not saying i believe this IS the reason, just saying that if we credit the bible for what it says, we have to do so in this instance also and the third explanation is just as plausible as any other.

not trying to be contrary or cause debate, but just thought it would be food for thought... by the way - I HAVE no opinion of this particular situation we are looking at (not yet anyway, thats why i am on the sideline til i understand it better and before i can not only choose but understand what i choose to beleive)



any opinions or civil comments regarding the notion of my post?

True about false prophets, but I do have comments on what you quoted.

Quote (selected)
"-people under demonic influence can heal the sick"

Not true. Only God can truly heal, or those appointed by Him (like the disciples). Satan only destroys. Do you have scriptural reference for this statement?

Quote (selected)
"-some who practice satanism can fortell the future."

Same for this: do you have scriptural reference?

Quote (selected)
"satan uses supernatural schemes and tactics to overcome his victim. he is a supernatural being with great power to deceive (Job 1:7)"

He is already doing that for hundreds of years. People throwing away God's Holy Sabbath as if it's not important and worshipping Sunday and 'strange gods'. The catholic church is the worst, but there are flaws in every denomination. Some examples:

"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."
Matthew 5:17-19

This verse CLEARLY states that ALL ten commandments should be kept, even the ones that might seem unimportant to people, till heaven and earth pass. We all know THAT didn't happen yet, lol. Yet the catholics are very much breaking a lot of them:

"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments."

So the catholics do this and break the second commandment:








And they worship this:







But some probably aren't even aware, because the catholic church is trying to get rid of the second commandment: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


Oh and they worship this too, which in my opinion is breaking the first commandment as well, since the papacy claims it can play God, forgive sins, change God's Holy Laws etc:




Then they work on Saturday or mown the lawn, and worship SUNday, breaking the fourth commandment.



Oh and for teaching false doctrine they break of course also the ninth commandment. Many are also breaking the 7th and the 10th, but I shall not go into that. So Satan is doing a VERY good job deceiving MILLIONS of catholics already.

The Jehova's Witnesses are doing a better job, but they somewhere forgot about the fourth commandment, because to them any day can be holy. Not true, only the Sabbath (seventh day) is holy, not just every day, or no day at all. By going door to door, teaching this (and more) false doctrines, they are also breaking the ninth.

The Jews seem have them all ten in order, but they have a little problem: they don't accept Jesus as their saviour which also makes them break the ninth every time they teach some one their religious beliefs.

I could go on and on, but you get my point. Satan IS already deceiving for hundreds or even thousands of years (Adam/Eve/Apple anyone?).


Quote (selected)
"the bible also indicates the antichrist and false prophet will also perform miracles. and the bible also speaks about counterfit signs and wonders...

revelation16:13-14  And I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs leap from the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. These miracle-working demons caused all the rulers of the world to gather for battle against the Lord on that great judgment day of God Almighty."

This verse refers to the beasts from Revelation 13 (5th and 6th beasts) and Revelation 17 (8th beast, which is the same as the 5th):

"And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority." (Revelation 13:1-2)


"And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon [FALSE PROPHET]. And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him [IMAGE OF FORMER BEAST], and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed." (Revelation 13:11-12)


"So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration. And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns. The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is." (Revelation 17:3-6)


So the false prophet mentioned in the verse you qouted from Revelation 16, is actually a beast (world power, USA), the sixth one that is the image of the fifth/eight beast (Vatican). Ron was not a world power, far from it. He might have been an American, but if he would have been a false prophet for the image of the beasts, we all would have know him and his discoveries. But hardly anyone does: he is ridiculed and attacked and his discoveries are mocked and done away with. Also, the false prophet in Revelation 16 deceives people during the plagues, AFTER the mark of the beast. Thus this verse can in no way refer to Ron Wyatt. Plus I agree with jono about 1 John 4:2.


Quote (selected)
"another interesting scripture is where Paul also wrote in the letter to the Corinthians that the miraculous gifts of God’s holy spirit would end. He said: “Whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with.”—1 Corinthians 13:8

powers, knowlege of god (one on one) and miracles ceased. meaning that those who continue to do such things or posess such gifts MAY be doing so NOT under the influence of god but the influence of evil, WITH THE motive of distracting people away from god - or with out motive as they could be being used by the devil (as per bible)

does someone being 'led by god' as in this case constitue a 'miracle' or 'prophecying' or 'knowledge' - ??? hmm, dont know. dont have the answer... just saying and putting it out there. interesting question for those that believe in god and read the bible... (incl me)"

Paul wrote this nearly 2000 years ago and he is talking about the time after Christ until the end of the 1335 days of Daniel 12. There will be no more miracles, no more prophets, no more scriptural knowledge (because Satan is doing his best to deceive the whole world):

"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book [NO UNDERSTANDING], even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased [KNOWLEDGE WILL RETURN]. Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders [WHEN WILL THERE BE UNDERSTANDING OF THIS PROPHECY]? And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half [3.5 YEARS ARE 1260 DAYS, WHICH IN BIBLE PROPHECY MEANS 1260 YEARS, BUT NO BEGINNING OR END IS GIVEN] ; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up [STARTING POINT GIVEN (PAPACY), SAME ENDING POINT], there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days [BECAUSE THESE 'WONDERS' WIL END THEN]."
Daniel 12:8-13

Those who did the math on Daniel know that these 1335 years are passed already about 150+ years ago. Why are those blessed who wait? Because that is when understanding of the scriptures returned; the book of Daniel was no longer sealed. And what happens at the time of the end: knowledge shall INCREASE so that the truth can prevail. So actually that verse of Paul you quoted verifies Ron and his discoveries even more. Paul was referring to the years BEFORE the end of the time prophecy in Daniel.




Souza: Great post about the Roman Catholic Church! I’m glad that people are finally discussing this subject. When I started my video series, I was not sure how people would take it. Since you have quoted from the book of Revelation and mentioned the ‘Whore of Babylon’ , I would like to post the first 3 episodes of my series dealing with Michael and his encoded message about this subject. I am definitely going to post my series on the new forum MichaelsArmyofLove. I would like to start a discussion about it on that other forum now that I am seeing more of us open up our minds to this information. But for now, here are the first 3 episodes of my series:

Important Note!
These videos may be blocked in some countries due to copyright issues. If you cannot see the episodes because they are blocked in your country, go to hidemyass.com and paste these links in the box and click ‘hide my ass’>>>>>>

Episode 1: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Episode 2: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Episode 3: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Episode 1
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bCs-Y1SkI-Q [/youtube]

Episode 2
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pt0A7vKMuw8[/youtube]

Episode 3
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw_Qm14CPdg[/youtube]

And Thanks again Souza for posting that info about the Sabbath. Now as for the seventh day, I have had a really hard time with my family on this one but I’m working on it. We were brought up to keep Sunday, the false Sabbath. I have been showing them the biblical proof along with a lot of the information that you posted about the Sabbath.

For those of you having issues with this particular subject:

The 10 Commandments are 10 Commandments! Nothing has changed. They are Gods laws and He is adamant that we follow them. Keeping His commandments was not meant to be easy or convenient. The choice is yours to follow them of not to follow them. But there is no in-between. There is no gray. It is either black or white. That sounds harsh but it’s the truth. God does not want us to be ‘lukewarm’! He will surely spit us out if we are! 

The Mark of the Beast LAW: WOAH! Thank you for posting this info Im_convincedmjalive!! That’s the info I was wondering about when I posted on the other forum asking TS to clarify. The mark of the beast IS NOT A RFID Chip!!!! It’s Sunday worship! All that BS circulating about that RFID Chip being the mark of the beast is propaganda that has been spread by the Jesuits.

And BTW...The belief that 'Sunday worship' is the mark of the beast is NOT a belief exclusively held by the SDA. There are non-SDAs that believe this to be the mark as well but I will not get in to that. My post is already long enough as it is. I'll let you all do your own research on the matter if you care enough to do so.


Here are the links that Im_convincedmjalive gave us again just so that people can check them out if they haven’t:
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All of you are making amazing posts and I will continue to read on until I can catch up. I’m just really enjoying this journey. It’s been amazing! I thank God for this everyday!

I send LOVE to all of you! <3
Last Edit: January 30, 2012, 05:46:38 AM by WhiteNight
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GINAFELICIA

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Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 06:39:49 AM
OK if I have to make a choise at this moment, I would find it easy to switch from keeping the Sunday to keeping the Saturday.  In fact for many years I wasn't sure about keeping the Sunday.  Some say the Old Testament is only for the jews, why would we keep the laws God made for them??
Still....Jesus was also a jew, wasn't he? And we still follow him, don't we?
Our ortodox church says we should obey the church because it has authority from Jesus (Mathew 18:18). I have a problem understanding if the authority was given only to the apostles or also to the priests who came after the apostles. Something doesn't sound right to me though in this picture.
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paula-c

Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 09:28:56 AM
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I am actually far from reading all of the posts. I just started on page 8 where I left off but I saw some posts that really got my attention and I felt compelled to respond and make a reference to them. I will keep reading but I have a lot to catch up on.
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The 'thing' with Ron that I think is really 'tripping' me up/out...is that he just so happened to find everything he went looking for.  Stuff that people had searched forever for...and then this guy shows up...always at the right time, right place...and BAM  :lol: there it is.  Either he was truly led by God and had His help in locating these artifacts....or he's a scammer..

just to play devils advocate and no pun intended here, but just want to point out that evil side can make man accomplish, discover and achieve feats too (as per what we have all read in the bible) - ...

here are some examples, to refresh our memories:

-magic practicing priests in pharaohs time were able to duplicate some of gods miracles
-satan used a snake to talk to eve
-star that guided astrologers to baby jesus - stopped by herod first (the person out to kill baby jesus) and (unsure if i should open this can of worms)
-people under demonic influence can heal the sick
-some who practice satanism can fortell the future.

satan uses supernatural schemes and tactics to overcome his victim. he is a supernatural being with great power to deceive (Job 1:7)

the bible also indicates the antichrist and false prophet will also perform miracles. and the bible also speaks about counterfit signs and wonders...

revelation16:13-14  And I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs leap from the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. These miracle-working demons caused all the rulers of the world to gather for battle against the Lord on that great judgment day of God Almighty.

another interesting scripture is where Paul also wrote in the letter to the Corinthians that the miraculous gifts of God’s holy spirit would end. He said: “Whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with.”—1 Corinthians 13:8

powers, knowlege of god (one on one) and miracles ceased. meaning that those who continue to do such things or posess such gifts MAY be doing so NOT under the influence of god but the influence of evil, WITH THE motive of distracting people away from god - or with out motive as they could be being used by the devil (as per bible)

does someone being 'led by god' as in this case constitue a 'miracle' or 'prophecying' or 'knowledge' - ??? hmm, dont know. dont have the answer... just saying and putting it out there. interesting question for those that believe in god and read the bible... (incl me)

please note I AM NOT SAYING THAT THIS IS THE CASE, in this particular instance...

however for those who are 'god believers / bible readers - really the two possible scenarious in this situation that have been posted in this thread, being "chosen/sent/directed/influenced by god" or "scammer/fraud/faker" are not absolute, as there is a third possible explanation.

again, not saying i believe this IS the reason, just saying that if we credit the bible for what it says, we have to do so in this instance also and the third explanation is just as plausible as any other.

not trying to be contrary or cause debate, but just thought it would be food for thought... by the way - I HAVE no opinion of this particular situation we are looking at (not yet anyway, thats why i am on the sideline til i understand it better and before i can not only choose but understand what i choose to beleive)



any opinions or civil comments regarding the notion of my post?

True about false prophets, but I do have comments on what you quoted.

Quote (selected)
"-people under demonic influence can heal the sick"

Not true. Only God can truly heal, or those appointed by Him (like the disciples). Satan only destroys. Do you have scriptural reference for this statement?

Quote (selected)
"-some who practice satanism can fortell the future."

Same for this: do you have scriptural reference?

Quote (selected)
"satan uses supernatural schemes and tactics to overcome his victim. he is a supernatural being with great power to deceive (Job 1:7)"

He is already doing that for hundreds of years. People throwing away God's Holy Sabbath as if it's not important and worshipping Sunday and 'strange gods'. The catholic church is the worst, but there are flaws in every denomination. Some examples:

"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."
Matthew 5:17-19

This verse CLEARLY states that ALL ten commandments should be kept, even the ones that might seem unimportant to people, till heaven and earth pass. We all know THAT didn't happen yet, lol. Yet the catholics are very much breaking a lot of them:

"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments."

So the catholics do this and break the second commandment:








And they worship this:







But some probably aren't even aware, because the catholic church is trying to get rid of the second commandment: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


Oh and they worship this too, which in my opinion is breaking the first commandment as well, since the papacy claims it can play God, forgive sins, change God's Holy Laws etc:




Then they work on Saturday or mown the lawn, and worship SUNday, breaking the fourth commandment.



Oh and for teaching false doctrine they break of course also the ninth commandment. Many are also breaking the 7th and the 10th, but I shall not go into that. So Satan is doing a VERY good job deceiving MILLIONS of catholics already.

The Jehova's Witnesses are doing a better job, but they somewhere forgot about the fourth commandment, because to them any day can be holy. Not true, only the Sabbath (seventh day) is holy, not just every day, or no day at all. By going door to door, teaching this (and more) false doctrines, they are also breaking the ninth.

The Jews seem have them all ten in order, but they have a little problem: they don't accept Jesus as their saviour which also makes them break the ninth every time they teach some one their religious beliefs.

I could go on and on, but you get my point. Satan IS already deceiving for hundreds or even thousands of years (Adam/Eve/Apple anyone?).


Quote (selected)
"the bible also indicates the antichrist and false prophet will also perform miracles. and the bible also speaks about counterfit signs and wonders...

revelation16:13-14  And I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs leap from the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. These miracle-working demons caused all the rulers of the world to gather for battle against the Lord on that great judgment day of God Almighty."

This verse refers to the beasts from Revelation 13 (5th and 6th beasts) and Revelation 17 (8th beast, which is the same as the 5th):

"And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority." (Revelation 13:1-2)


"And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon [FALSE PROPHET]. And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him [IMAGE OF FORMER BEAST], and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed." (Revelation 13:11-12)


"So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration. And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns. The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is." (Revelation 17:3-6)


So the false prophet mentioned in the verse you qouted from Revelation 16, is actually a beast (world power, USA), the sixth one that is the image of the fifth/eight beast (Vatican). Ron was not a world power, far from it. He might have been an American, but if he would have been a false prophet for the image of the beasts, we all would have know him and his discoveries. But hardly anyone does: he is ridiculed and attacked and his discoveries are mocked and done away with. Also, the false prophet in Revelation 16 deceives people during the plagues, AFTER the mark of the beast. Thus this verse can in no way refer to Ron Wyatt. Plus I agree with jono about 1 John 4:2.


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"another interesting scripture is where Paul also wrote in the letter to the Corinthians that the miraculous gifts of God’s holy spirit would end. He said: “Whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with.”—1 Corinthians 13:8

powers, knowlege of god (one on one) and miracles ceased. meaning that those who continue to do such things or posess such gifts MAY be doing so NOT under the influence of god but the influence of evil, WITH THE motive of distracting people away from god - or with out motive as they could be being used by the devil (as per bible)

does someone being 'led by god' as in this case constitue a 'miracle' or 'prophecying' or 'knowledge' - ??? hmm, dont know. dont have the answer... just saying and putting it out there. interesting question for those that believe in god and read the bible... (incl me)"

Paul wrote this nearly 2000 years ago and he is talking about the time after Christ until the end of the 1335 days of Daniel 12. There will be no more miracles, no more prophets, no more scriptural knowledge (because Satan is doing his best to deceive the whole world):

"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book [NO UNDERSTANDING], even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased [KNOWLEDGE WILL RETURN]. Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders [WHEN WILL THERE BE UNDERSTANDING OF THIS PROPHECY]? And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half [3.5 YEARS ARE 1260 DAYS, WHICH IN BIBLE PROPHECY MEANS 1260 YEARS, BUT NO BEGINNING OR END IS GIVEN] ; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up [STARTING POINT GIVEN (PAPACY), SAME ENDING POINT], there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days [BECAUSE THESE 'WONDERS' WIL END THEN]."
Daniel 12:8-13

Those who did the math on Daniel know that these 1335 years are passed already about 150+ years ago. Why are those blessed who wait? Because that is when understanding of the scriptures returned; the book of Daniel was no longer sealed. And what happens at the time of the end: knowledge shall INCREASE so that the truth can prevail. So actually that verse of Paul you quoted verifies Ron and his discoveries even more. Paul was referring to the years BEFORE the end of the time prophecy in Daniel.




Souza: Great post about the Roman Catholic Church! I’m glad that people are finally discussing this subject. When I started my video series, I was not sure how people would take it. Since you have quoted from the book of Revelation and mentioned the ‘Whore of Babylon’ , I would like to post the first 3 episodes of my series dealing with Michael and his encoded message about this subject. I am definitely going to post my series on the new forum MichaelsArmyofLove. I would like to start a discussion about it on that other forum now that I am seeing more of us open up our minds to this information. But for now, here are the first 3 episodes of my series:

Important Note!
These videos may be blocked in some countries due to copyright issues. If you cannot see the episodes because they are blocked in your country, go to hidemyass.com and paste these links in the box and click ‘hide my ass’>>>>>>

Episode 1: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Episode 2: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
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Episode 1
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bCs-Y1SkI-Q [/youtube]

Episode 2
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pt0A7vKMuw8[/youtube]

Episode 3
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw_Qm14CPdg[/youtube]

And Thanks again Souza for posting that info about the Sabbath. Now as for the seventh day, I have had a really hard time with my family on this one but I’m working on it. We were brought up to keep Sunday, the false Sabbath. I have been showing them the biblical proof along with a lot of the information that you posted about the Sabbath.

For those of you having issues with this particular subject:

The 10 Commandments are 10 Commandments! Nothing has changed. They are Gods laws and He is adamant that we follow them. Keeping His commandments was not meant to be easy or convenient. The choice is yours to follow them of not to follow them. But there is no in-between. There is no gray. It is either black or white. That sounds harsh but it’s the truth. God does not want us to be ‘lukewarm’! He will surely spit us out if we are! 

The Mark of the Beast LAW: WOAH! Thank you for posting this info Im_convincedmjalive!! That’s the info I was wondering about when I posted on the other forum asking TS to clarify. The mark of the beast IS NOT A RFID Chip!!!! It’s Sunday worship! All that BS circulating about that RFID Chip being the mark of the beast is propaganda that has been spread by the Jesuits.

And BTW...The belief that 'Sunday worship' is the mark of the beast is NOT a belief exclusively held by the SDA. There are non-SDAs that believe this to be the mark as well but I will not get in to that. My post is already long enough as it is. I'll let you all do your own research on the matter if you care enough to do so.


Here are the links that Im_convincedmjalive gave us again just so that people can check them out if they haven’t:
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All of you are making amazing posts and I will continue to read on until I can catch up. I’m just really enjoying this journey. It’s been amazing! I thank God for this everyday!

I send LOVE to all of you! <3







In this link there is information, true story of the catholic church and the Vatican, from the conquest of America, the inquisision until our days


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jono

Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 09:40:50 AM
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For those of you having issues with this particular subject:

The 10 Commandments are 10 Commandments! Nothing has changed. They are Gods laws and He is adamant that we follow them. Keeping His commandments was not meant to be easy or convenient. The choice is yours to follow them of not to follow them. But there is no in-between. There is no gray. It is either black or white. That sounds harsh but it’s the truth. God does not want us to be ‘lukewarm’! He will surely spit us out if we are! 

And how do we keep the 10 commandments? Through FAITH! Remember, it is impossible for man to keep the meaning of the 10 commandments -> to be as perfect as God (please refer to my last posts).

Quote (selected)
For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. – eph 2:8-9

Quote (selected)
“But now apart from the law the righteousness of God has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness is given through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference between Jew and Gentile, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood—to be received by faith. He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.

Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith. For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith. Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.” – Rom 3:21-31

There is NOTHING we can do to make things better or worse (talking about salvation here), salvation is a gift that we receive through faith! Not works..
Wasn't Jesus' sacrifice good enough for us? Of course it was!

Then my question is: What will we gain from living a legalistic life? Remember, that is exactly what the Pharisees did! And what did Jesus call the Pharisees?
“You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?” – Matt 23:33

There is a BIG difference between living your life out of LOVE (I am forgiven, grace) and FEAR (I got to keep his commandments or else…). If we live our lives out of LOVE we will keep his commandments:

Quote (selected)
Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” – Matt 22:37-40

Is keeping the Sabbath a matter of life and death/ salvation or "eternal fire"?.. Not at all. ;)
Last Edit: January 30, 2012, 09:43:46 AM by jono
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"Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance." - Albert Einstein

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GINAFELICIA

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Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 11:26:55 AM
Quote from Jono
Quote (selected)
Then my question is: What will we gain from living a legalistic life? Remember, that is exactly what the Pharisees did! And what did Jesus call the Pharisees?
“You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?” – Matt 23:33

There is a BIG difference between living your life out of LOVE (I am forgiven, grace) and FEAR (I got to keep his commandments or else…)

Yes you make a good point. Remember Maria Magdalena. It's true she repented later but her life was far from being "legal" before.
Anyway, none of us can live in perfect purity, following all the rules.
Most of us here are not honest about why we are here. For MJ we say...yes for MJ but the true reasons "why for MJ" - we don't dare to admit not even when we are alone with ourselves.

If keeping "pure" means becoming some sort of robots executing a routine just because they were programed that way....I really don't know if I want that. I don't know, I am not sure but I think God loves us enough to save us in spite of our imperfections. Love God and each other is the highest command and maybe if we have love in our souls it will be enough in the end.

edit: now that I think about it:
The Old Testament tells us to fear God
The New Testament tells us to love God

That's the big difference. And let's not forget the worst sinner can be saved by God when least expected, like the criminal who was with MJ Jesus on the cross on Golgota.

Luke 23:39-43

New International Version (NIV)

 39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”

 40 But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”

 42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]”

 43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”



What a gift!!!I must say Jesus rocked ...if I may say so.

Last Edit: January 30, 2012, 11:36:32 AM by GINAFELICIA
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GINAFELICIA

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Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 11:46:48 AM
My grandfather didn't go to church too much....he told me when I was a child: the church is in a man's heart.
I agree with him.
He also served in full the 4 years of the second world war and he used to tell me his story...he was newly married when the war started...those days the young men had to serve in the army for 3 years. When the 3 years were over the war started, so he was away from home for 7 years...can you imagine that?? sometimes I wonder what kind of material our grandparents were made of, to go through that hell and survive....
And he told me that before the final fight he was in, a fight mentioned in our history books as a true massacre, he prayed to God to give him an easy wound to be sent home........and believe it or not - that exact thing happened. He was hit by a bullet  in that metal cap they had, he fainted and ended into the hospital and then he was sent home a few months before the war ended.

I don't know why I felt like telling this story...it just impressed me how God gave him what he prayed for.
Last Edit: January 30, 2012, 11:50:03 AM by GINAFELICIA
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suspicious mind

Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 12:30:33 PM
chose to accept christ gift and you will not be judge according to the law.
don't chose him you will be judged by the law which is impossible to keep.
just the way i understand it.

you know when someone started the thread examining something we have gone over before in a new way , including the religion factor , it occured to me that we need to look at murrays trial again with that same pair of glasses on.
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"I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be shrewd as serpents and as innocent as doves."  You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login




Why not just tell people I'm an alien from Mars? Tell them I eat live chickens and do a voodoo dance at midnight. They'll believe anything you say, because you're a reporter. But if I, Michael Jackson, were to say, "I'm an alien from Mars and I eat live chickens and do a voodoo dance at midnight," people would say, "Oh, man, that Michael Jackson is nuts. He's cracked up. You can't believe a single word that comes out of his mouth."

Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 12:36:40 PM
Thank you for the beautiful story Gina  bearhug

I agree that it is impossible for us to not sin or at least near impossible. I believe it is more about loving God and accepting him into your heart. I just can't imagine that murderers can be saved and brought into heaven but someone who does not recognize the Sabbath isn't.
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"You can't do your best when you're doubting yourself. If you don't believe in yourself, who will?" - Michael Jackson...Moonwalk

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jono

Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 12:46:29 PM
@ Souza

As I understand it, you think that it is imperative (from the studies you have made) to keep the Sabbath even in the new covenant?

Do you believe this is a matter of “heaven or hell” or just that it is something that we ought to remember?

Have you talked to your bible teacher about this subject?

With the love   bearhug
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"Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance." - Albert Einstein

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Do

Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 01:44:33 PM
WhiteNight said:

Quote (selected)
The Mark of the Beast LAW: WOAH! Thank you for posting this info Im_convincedmjalive!! That’s the info I was wondering about when I posted on the other forum asking TS to clarify. The mark of the beast IS NOT A RFID Chip!!!! It’s Sunday worship! All that BS circulating about that RFID Chip being the mark of the beast is propaganda that has been spread by the Jesuits.



Like PaulaC in this thread and many others in the past already posted:


Quote (selected)
Revelation 13:16-18

New International Version (NIV)

 16 It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, 17 so that they could not buy or sell unless they had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of its name.
 18 This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man.[a] That number is 666.



I'm being honest here, I have little to none knowlegde of the bible (so I can't discuss with you on that), doesn't mean that I don't believe in God and I try to live my life as good as possible. Now tell me, after you read about the RFID chip and that law on that has passed already, AND after reading Revelation 13: 16-18, that it could NOT be about the chip??
We live in the 21 century, we have a 24/7 economy, many professions have to be exercised every day of the week.
We must be aware what is ahead of us, not what was common many many many years ago. You can't turn it back anymore I'm afraid.
A few members said this also (Gina and Michaelsangel among them), I don't think God will punish us when we don't live by a Sunday Law, but I do think we will be 'punished' through the 'elite' by accepting the chip. Darn, I'm having a hard time making myself clear on this!
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"Three passions, simple but overwhelmingly strong, have governed my life: the longing for love, the search for knowledge, and unbearable pity for the suffering of mankind."
Bertrand Russel

Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 02:12:18 PM
I, too, had been leaning towards the 'mark' being some sort of chip that would be mandated (made law)...but I've been reading up on different interpretations and came across this website that (for me) explained things really clearly.  I'm only going to post the section where they talk about the 'mark' possibly being a chip (which they disagree with)...but I've read every page on the website and I'm now seeing how the 'mark' could very well be about following the Roman Catholic Church (which includes making SUNday the Sabbath---one of God's laws that they have changed and which the Bible clearly states NO MAN is above God or His laws).  For those interested, they go into detail about the history of the church, of 666, of SUNday worship, the Papalcy (which they interpret as 'the beast'), etc.  VERY interesting stuff.

I'm still unsure about God's 'wrath' or the extent of it for those who DO have faith in Him but have been or will be somehow deceived in getting the 'mark of the beast' (which I agree is a symbolic mark).  There are just so many Bible verses that point to God's grace, forgiveness, mercy and love....the most prominent being Jesus having died for our sins (which I'd think would include 'falling for' the mark or not keeping the Sabbath).  But then there are verses that are clear on breaking just ONE of the 10 'laws' resulting in having broken all ten in His eyes.  It's just so contradictory....God's wrath versus His grace, forgiveness, love, etc....that I'm confused by the whole thing.  Or maybe I'm just making it more difficult than it needs to be  :?

Anyhow...here's the part about the chip but I would recommend reading the other pages on the site as well:

Quote (selected)
Is the Mark of the Beast Technology?We just read how Revelation 19:20 says, “He deceived them that had received the mark of the beast” so we know that 666 and the mark of the beast has to involve some sort of subtle deception or be something we are already deceived on. If the mark was some form of technology that the entire world already seems to think is the obvious answer, then how could almost the entire world be misled? Jesus warned us that Satan’s deceptions are so deceptive they can “deceive, if possible, even the elect.” Matthew 24:24.

Microchip Technology - Biochip, Verichip or Barcode etc?
How deceptive would it be for someone to command everyone to accept a computerized microchip in their forehead or hands? The Bible does not specifically say it will be a microchip such as a “miniature biochip or verichip” or that it will even involve any form of technology. These modern words, “biochip,” “verichip,” “bar code,” “computer” and “technology” do not appear in Revelation. People just assume that it will happen this way but it is nothing but pure speculation. How many people do you know that would accept the government implanting microchip technology inside their heads?

The King James Bible is partially to blame for some thinking it is a chip implant as Revelation 13:16; 14:9 and 20:4 have incorrectly translated the Greek word “Epi” as “in” instead of “on” or “upon.” The KJV Bible is correct only once in Revelation 20:4 where it says, “upon their foreheads.” Thus the correct translation of all these verses is “on” or “upon” the hand or forehead and not in.

Most also seem to overlook the mark of God that also goes on our forehead. What factors define those who get the seal or mark of God on their forehead versus those who get the mark of the beast? And what is God’s mark? Is it going to be a tattoo, barcode or microchip? I think most would agree that the seal of God is symbolic and is not literal and therefore stands to reason that the same symbology also applies to the mark of the beast since they are in competition to each other. You cannot get both as you either receive the mark of God or the mark of the Beast. See Revelation 7:3 and Revelation 9:4.

We know Satan counterfeits most things of God and the mark of the Beast is the counterfeit to the mark of God. For instance, there is the true gift of tongues and a counterfeit speaking in tongues. Establishing what God’s mark is will point you to what the counterfeit is. How could technology be a counterfeit to the Seal of God? Is God into technology such as microchips etc?

2 Peter 1:20 says, “Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.”

Bearing in mind that the Bible has no reasonable reference to microchips or other technology, so this can only be considered as “private interpretation” and is neither allowed nor necessary. This would also be considered as adding to the book of Revelation, which also carries an extremely severe warning.

Revelation 22:18-19 “For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: 19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.”

Why do some think the Mark of the Beast is Technology?
The speculation that 666 or the mark of the beast is technology originated from error as those responsible did not even notice that 666 and the MARK are two separate symbols. Even today most still assume that 666 is the mark of the beast because they do not carefully read what the Bible does say. So when barcodes first appeared, some bright spark figured that those enforcing the mark were going to hide 666 in a barcode and so paranoia ensued. Of course this was based on incorrect knowledge of the Word anyway as 666 is NOT the mark! The technology theory has just snowballed from there and has continued to gain momentum over time. Further speculation comes from the following verse but where does this verse state in any way that it will be microchips or technology? As you can see, it does not.

Revelation 13:17 “And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, OR the name of the beast, OR the number of his name.”

Technology cannot be the Mark of the Beast
It was assumed that if one cannot buy or sell then it must be controlled by some form of technology, and while Satan could use this to play a deceptive role, it is not 666 or the mark of the beast. Look at the above passage very closely. Note it says that you cannot buy or sell unless you have the MARK or the NAME or the NUMBER of his name. If the MARK was a computer chip and you did not have the MARK but you had the NAME or the NUMBER, you would still be able to buy and sell and yet you would not have the MARK. So what good would it be if the mark of the beast was technology? None whatsoever!

So technology being the mark of the beast is found to be impossible and does not fit the context of the passages on the mark or the entire Bible. So careful exegesis on what the Bible does say ends another unbiblical assumption. We must follow the Bible alone and strive to be like the Berean Christians who read the Word daily to see if what they were told was true. (Acts 17:11)

Note that the mark of the beast must be something that is a free will decision as one would not receive the full wrath of God for something that was forced upon you. Why would God pour out His most fiercest wrath upon you based on an implanted microchip anyway, which could be forced? Some claim because the mark of the beast is the mark of the devil but even if this were true, the free will issue remains the same. When we cover the origins of 666 later, you will be left with no doubt about it not being technology.
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With L.O.V.E. always.
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The beauty of Michael Jackson is found in his heart and soul...his enormous talent is a bonus and what a bonus it is.

~PLAY the moments...PAUSE the memories...STOP the pain...REWIND the happiness~

Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 02:58:32 PM
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Some say we keep Sunday instead of Sabbath because Jesus raised from the dead on a Sunday.

Yes, but that's totally made up hundreds of years later and nowhere in the Bible does Jesus say we should observe Sunday to remember his resurrection. Actually, Jesus raised from the dead on Sunday, because he RESTED on the Sabbath, even AFTER the cross, which is another indication that the Sabbath was not done away with by Jesus´ death.

Actually, and not meaning to start anything, it DOES mention Sunday gathering (breaking bread aka communion/sacrament) in Acts 20:7

Quote (selected)
"And on the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul began talking to them, intending to depart the next day, and he prolonged his message until midnight,"

People have been meeting on Sundays since the days of the apostles (shortly after Jesus ascended into Heaven). The reason people did that, was because Jesus has resurrected on a Sunday and they were doing it in honor of him.

But I do agree with you that the Sabbath day was NOT done away with, unlike what some believe.
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SimPattyK

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Re: TIAI January 21
January 30, 2012, 04:09:44 PM






Last Edit: January 30, 2012, 04:31:10 PM by SimPattyK
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