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Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 10:28:27 AM
I'm trying to follow the theory of Latoya, that Michael was being drugged and manipulated by people close to him. I thought this might have started several months before his "death." So, I drew pictures of 2008 to see if Michael was wrong, very skinny and looking drugged.
He was the anniversary of C. Audigier and was very beautiful and seemingly well.In may 2008:





And here 2008, october:



On this site you can browse photos of 50 days. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

So if he was being dominated by terrible people, should not have started in 2008. It would be in 2009, Mrs. Latoya?
But in 2009 he was well too, we have to TII in this show.  confused/  confused/

Moreover, these pictures he is not wearing bulletproof vests.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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"Tell the angels no... Heaven can wait"!

*

all4loveandbelieve

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 11:57:00 AM
Quote from: "Gema"
Quote from: "all4loveandbelieve"
Quote from: "Gema"
Imo, Michael is still alive but will not come back (or show up if he never left), so, in terms of proving that Michael is alive the only possible way to me is if he comes back in flesh and blood and since I don´t see that event happening, I can say that it does not matter how many logic theories we come up with to prove that he is not dead.

To the eyes of the rest of the world we are a bunch of deluded folks who can´t let Michael go and the worst part of it is that to this point after 2 years I am questioning myself as well and accepting that I belong to that pile for real.

May be is time to accept that Michael is dead, it´s the easiest option.

Gema, when the tough gets going everyone takes the easy way out. You shouldn't you have to persevere. Michael is alive and he will come back when the time is right for him. It can be this July, next year, in 10 yrs I have no clue, I am as much in the obscure as you are. I will never give up, I have faith that he will come back. The only thing is, I will not be in this forum for ever either, I love all you guys, even if we bickered, sometimes bickering makes us stronger among eachother.  Michael will not do like Elvis. Elvis is alive as well, but I think he has some restrictions to come back since he worked for the DEA. So Gema, and friends please do not give up on our Michael, it is not time to do so. If we do who will he come back to? We are his fans, and we are the only ones who believe in him. Blessings to all my hoax friends.

 bearhug

The easiest option is to "let it go" (talking about TS´s post of proving murder vs alive and viceversa) since I for instance can´t prove that this person is alive using the theories we have, even if they sound logic.

His family made an international memorial and funeral, the media reported the death and his family is still confirming how tragic the death was and there is a so called trial on the line...now for next year...because MJ was "murdered".

This is a tuff situation. WE, our theories, against everybody...even against his own family who up to some weeks back were very cryptic as well.

I am not gaining anything proving to the world that MJ is alive, so why bother?

IF MJ is really alive, he must help us out and "give us a sign" but not a cryptic one...after 2 years it becomes boring you know.


I understand what you are saying, it does become boring and frustrating.  He has been giving us clues, but vague clues. I guess Ts wants is to think together and find the answer. Sometimes the answer is right there in front of you that you don't see it. It is starring you in the face. When we are stressed nervous we do not think logically, so we need to be cool and collective, and maybe the clue will surface soone then we think. Gema in another words do the best you can and the rest leave it into God's hands. He will help us in finding the truth. This is for everyone in this hoax forum.. Blessings.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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I'm happy to be alive, I'm happy to be who I am.
Michael Jackson

*

bec

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 12:00:19 PM
The murder theory isn't plausible because the accompanying autopsy is inaccurate in regards to Propofol elimination rates.

I have compiled 3 medical journal sources that state the elimination rates of Propofol. They are unlinkable because of the nature of the source, but available as screenshots I made and posted to my blog here: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login These sources are also available upon Google search “Propofol half life”.

Source 1
Quote
After a single bolus dose, there is a fast distribution from blood into tissues (t1/2a: 1.8 to 8.3 min), high metabolic clearance (t1/2b: 34 to 66 min) and a terminal slow elimination from poorly perfused tissues (t1/2g: 184 to 480 min).

Source 2
Quote
…the distribution of the drug from the blood to the tissues after intravenous administration, is very short, perhaps 2 to 3 minutes. The [beta] half-life of the drug, which is basically the elimination half-life, ranges from 30-60 minutes. The half-life, or terminal half-life, during which the drug is eliminated from the third compartment, or tissue fat, ranges from 300 to 700 minutes.

Source 3
Quote
The decline in Propofol concentrations following a bolus dose of following the termination of an infusion can be described by a three compartment open model. The first phase is characterized by a very rapid distribution (half-life 2-4 minutes) followed by rapid elimination (half-life 30-60 minutes) and a slower final phase, representative of redistribution of propofol from poorly perfused tissue.

Now the problem that this presents when compared to the autopsy in light of this new information that UCLA docs had Michael heart going for approximately 64 minutes as illustrated by the article’s timeline [http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/news/765565/Docs-got-brief-heartbeat-1hr-after-superstar-collapsed.html] is that so long as the blood is circulating in the body, the drug is being eliminated.

So if Michael’s blood is circulating for 62 minutes at UCLA, Propofol should ONLY have been present in the fatty tissue upon autopsy and IT IS NOT AT ALL POSSIBLE FOR PROPOFOL TO HAVE BEEN PRESENT IN THE BLOODSTREAM. Recall the autopsy reports of Propofol present within the blood vessels of the eyes. This is simply factually impossible with the properties of this drug.  This is a scientific FACT… one of those very rare things that we encounter in the course of this hoax.

…On a side note, CPR will also circulate blood by manually pumping the heart. Blood circulation drives metabolic elimination and CPR alone will account for elimination rates of any drug. Even without this new report of Michael returning from the dead, lifesaving efforts performed at the scene and en route to UCLA should have eliminated all traces of Propofol AT LEAST from the bloodstream, if not surrounding tissue (considering multiple reports that CPR was maintained for over an hour), so this information is not really new… it simply has become particularly damning by making it really really clear… the autopsy simply CANNOT be genuine.

Seems very convenient to me that the time line reported alludes to cardiac activity for 64 minutes, considering the longest period of time from the 3 sources that Propofol will be detectable anywhere other then fatty tissue is 66 minutes.  Now assuming Michael received greater then 2 minutes of CPR prior to being admitted to UCLA ER, well, you catch my drift.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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bec

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 12:13:20 PM
Meaning, and point being, if MJ was murdered, and he were dead, the autopsy should be accurate... no reason for it not to be... and it's clearly not the case as outlined above.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 01:35:09 PM
Quote from: "bec"
Meaning, and point being, if MJ was murdered, and he were dead, the autopsy should be accurate... no reason for it not to be... and it's clearly not the case as outlined above.

I have often wondered about the whole Propofol thing. Why that medication, why not something else. The only conclusion that I can come up with is that if it was any other drug it would be harder to debunk. Let's say it was Valium, Percocet, or Oxicodone; people overdose on those drugs all of the time. We being the general public would think nothing of it and chances are we would of accepted that as being his cause of death.

I've often wondered about the autopsy report as well. I started a thread (before my computer crashed months ago) asking what it said about MJ's chest, specifically his ribs. Since I didn't get a response I still wonder. Being with the fire department it is mandatory that we get re-certified every year for CPR. It is always talked about through all of the FF and even us Associates that if the ribs aren't cracked or broken it's not done right. It is actually not the ribs breaking but the rib cage breaking from the sternum. Now, it can be argued that that's not a correct statement, and if that's the case then I better notify the entire department as well as the Rescue Squad! Either way I've always wondered about that on the autopsy report and since I don't know where I can find it, I'm stuck asking you wonderful people to search your brains if your able.  :oops:
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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~Mish~

"Breathe in waves of doubt, bitter in your mouth" - Toad The Wet Sprocket

*

Grace

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 03:18:34 PM
In the first place the drug was identified as Diprivan.
Two days later news switched to Propofol and that was it to date. Was a nice twist to watch.
Propofol wasn't a controlled drug at that moment - is it now? DEA stepped in, right?
Some product recalls had to be executed as finished products were contaminated with bacteria.
Propofol is widely being used at dentists and that links the story to James Brown's death.
Propofol has a history of known abuse and addiction among hospital staff. Makes the story believable.
Propofol has a nice name to play with. Makes the product an object of twist.
Propofol has a restricted use - in hospitals or in presence of anaestetics specialist with monitoring equipment - opens a wide field of phantasies about injections, infusions, IV-bags, IV-stands, "milk"... "IV" opens a whole world of phantasy itself. (You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login)
All of the above make Propofol a widely variable object of discussions and emotional involvement.
It's a quite impressive catalyst.


Connecting the TS's bills to album "Michael" - Burning money (on "Michael" cover)
Quote
Money burning or burning money is the purposeful act of destroying money. In the prototypical example, banknotes are destroyed by literally setting them on fire. Burning money decreases the wealth of the owner without directly enriching any particular party. However, since it reduces the supply of money, it increases the value of the remaining money, increasing (by roughly the same amount as the money burnt) the collective wealth of everyone else who holds money.

Money is usually burned to communicate a message, either for artistic effect, as a form of protest, or as a signal. In some games, a player can sometimes benefit from the ability to burn money (Battle of the sexes). Burning money is illegal in some jurisdictions.
[...]
Symbolism
Pile of paper items on fire; a hand reaches to add money-like bills
Joss paper burned around the Ghost Festival

Publicly burning money can be an act of protest or a kind of artistic statement. Often the point is to emphasize money's intrinsic worthlessness.[1] In 1984, Serge Gainsbourg burned a 500 French franc note on television to protest against heavy taxation.[10]

On 23 August 1994, the K Foundation (an art duo consisting of Bill Drummond and Jimmy Cauty) burned one million pounds sterling in cash on the Scottish island of Jura. This money represented the bulk of the K Foundation's funds, earned by Drummond and Cauty as The KLF, one of the United Kingdom's most successful pop groups of the early 1990s. The duo have never fully explained their motivations for the burning.[11]

In the 1995 film Dead Presidents, the title sequence directed by Kyle Cooper features close shots of burning U.S. bills; it took two days of shooting and experimenting with the paper to get the effect right.[12]

In the early 18th century, New York City courts would publicly burn the counterfeit bills they gathered, in order to show that they were both dangerous and worthless.[13]

In traditional Chinese ancestor veneration, imitation money in the form of joss paper are ceremonially burned, with the aspiration that the dead may use the money to finance a more comfortable afterlife.
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Connecting level 4 "sting" to Michael in a different perspective.
Don't forget the spider. Spiders bite.
It was a black widow.


TII spider:
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"Spiderman 4" will be coming to theaters in July 2012. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Michael is said to have wanted to be "Spiderman"
[BBvideo 425,350:2v9pzawk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ID3XfgEcIA&NR=1[/BBvideo:2v9pzawk]
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[BBvideo 425,350:2v9pzawk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BICoImNdlwM[/BBvideo:2v9pzawk]
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[BBvideo 425,350:2v9pzawk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2bu6aE-yQw&feature=related[/BBvideo:2v9pzawk]
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[BBvideo 425,350:2v9pzawk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_xlWxhZvVI&feature=player_embedded[/BBvideo:2v9pzawk]
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In TII, Michael is "Spiderman" - just in his own orchestration.
Waiting for the prey to enter his cobweb.

Michael murdered? Nah. MJJ? Maybe. M Joseph J? As we knew him, yep.
Silenced? Not yet.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Create your day. Create the most astounding year of your life. Be the change you want to see in the world! L.O.V.E.
***********************************************************************************************
"I am tired, I am really tired of manipulation." Michael Jackson, Harlem, New York, NY, July 6, 2002
***********************************************************************************************
******* Let's tear the walls in the brains of this world down.*******

Time to BE.

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 04:01:32 PM
Thank you for the clarification on Propofol Grace perhaps I hadn't thought about all of that. It still doesn't make sense though. If it weren't a hoax and it really was a murder other drugs would be more convincing.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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~Mish~

"Breathe in waves of doubt, bitter in your mouth" - Toad The Wet Sprocket

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 04:21:53 PM
This was depressing.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 04:33:22 PM
Only if you let it my friend. Actually I find this thread very comforting. Unless something astonishing comes out, it just proves more that what everyone on all hoax sites have been working for. We have more evidence that this is a hoax then there being a murder!

Of course this is just my thought.

Chin up!  bearhug
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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~Mish~

"Breathe in waves of doubt, bitter in your mouth" - Toad The Wet Sprocket

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 04:37:53 PM
Quote from: "Grace"
In the first place the drug was identified as Diprivan.
Two days later news switched to Propofol and that was it to date. Was a nice twist to watch.

Nothing switched ...Diprivan IS Propofol.

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"Propofol (INN, marketed as Diprivan by AstraZeneca) is a short-acting, intravenously administered hypnotic agent."
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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*

~Souza~

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 05:17:39 PM
Quote from: "Sarah31"
Quote from: "Grace"
In the first place the drug was identified as Diprivan.
Two days later news switched to Propofol and that was it to date. Was a nice twist to watch.

Nothing switched ...Diprivan IS Propofol.

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"Propofol (INN, marketed as Diprivan by AstraZeneca) is a short-acting, intravenously administered hypnotic agent."

I think Grace meant Demerol, because that was what we first heard: Demerol OD.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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liegi

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 05:28:10 PM
Quote from: "RK"
Hey TS. It's me again. I have debated myself out of many an urge to post in the last few days by trying to debunk my musings from the pro murder side of thinking. You can debate [and rightly so] that much of what we are sure are clues are our own unique interpretation of slip ups, such as Jermaine's airport slip and the likes.
However, the timing of hoax events is the strongest proof that this is a planned death hoax. Could TPB have pulled such timing off? Maybe there might be a slim chance of that possibility, but it is highly unlikely that they would have had the footage to the pepsi fire released for the first time to the public on the 16th July,2009.....and we have here another 7 when adding that date.
If it was 9282 days from Michael's birth to the pepsi incident and another 9282 days to his fake death on the 25th June 2009, I can't see the illuminati releasing the footage and putting their hand up and going yeah, look world, we did this.
It looks more like Michael worked this out to perfection to draw attention to the pepsi incident at the exact center of his life and then finger them for it.
Thanks for bringing this up again.  This is, in my mind, one of the most important "clues" in existence.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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PureLove

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  • To die would be an awfully big adventure.
Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 06:22:57 PM
Quote from: "MJonmind"
PureLove, if MJ only returns next year, he will be 3 and a half years older, so will he have changed enough for us to wonder if it's really him. Maybe he'll have gained some weight again like he has in the past. I can bet there's going to be millions of doubting Thomases who will need to see and hear him speaking, singing, dancing, writing and whatever else to proove its really him, and  :oops: because they can't get enough of seeing him. :D

Michael didn't change at all during the past 20-30 years. Here are pictures from 90s and 2009 for us to compare. So I do not think he will be changed in 3 years time. But of course it would be amazing to see him singing again. :)

Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 06:49:49 PM
I dont think the concerts were ever intended to happen, or even that Michael was going to go to London. One of the things that always bothered me was the hiring of Dr. Murray in the first place for the O2 concerts (regardless of who hired him). Does the fact that Murray was Michael's personal (traveling) physician make it legal for him to practice medicine in London? Because I'm pretty sure he isn't licensed to practice there.
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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paula-c

Re: TIAI June 25
July 01, 2011, 08:36:47 PM
Quote
bec wrote:

Meaning, and point being, if MJ was murdered, and he were dead, the autopsy should be accurate... no reason for it not to be... and it's clearly not the case as outlined above



interesting videos of the autopsy, but there are several to watch them


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNf54sftjPM[/youtube]






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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6_j4yeixNU[/youtube]












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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92znxCwTMRA[/youtube]












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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvDwPsGUqwU[/youtube]











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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XxJZ0Hr_KA[/youtube]













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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXbr4kVYz5Q[/youtube]










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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrzQAGLA05E[/youtube]












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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6wLRJitXiY[/youtube]









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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVnFUzANWHA[/youtube]









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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ze2-zEdPuFQ[/youtube]







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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTCYePvekpU[/youtube]








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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sK6oq9098Dk[/youtube]








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Last Edit: July 25, 2011, 10:35:18 PM by ~Souza~
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