Whats stopping you from believing Katherine?

[PureLove]

What all of you are saying makes so much sense. So, the probability that Michael was in danger
could be the reason that Katherine is able to lie. Makes lots of sense but here is what bothers me...
If Michael was in such danger than maybe he won't be coming back? Does anyone ever return from
the witness protection plan??  So many questions.

I do not think Michael is in WPP because when you get in that program, you can never go back to see your family or friends. You get a brand new name and a brand new location and you can bring your close family like kids with you. But Michael didn't bring them with him. I do not believe he wouldn't go to see his parents, kids and family never. He did a deal with the FBI called Sting Operation. Sting Operation perfectly fits with this issue. I believe that after he comes back he will be protected by the FBI or by more bodygouards.

In the witness protection, once the person has been apprehanded they can go back as their normal self. As we all know Michael can disguise himself and go see his children when ever he wants. If he left with his children, this would have been obvious, if some one is after him they would know that he did not die, but is hiding somewhere. The FBI wanted these murderers to think that Michael has died..
That's why the children stayed behind with the grandmother, so it wouldn't be so obvious into their eyes.

No, you're wrong about WPP. Here it is about Witness Protection Program. The last paragraph is important. I wrote it on TS' thread before. WPP has very strict rules. That is the reason why I wrote, it is more possible that he is in a Sting Operation. He is definitely not in WPP. For further info about the Sting Operation and Entrapment which were also mentioned by TS, here is the link where I gave info about them.

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Witness Protection Program

The Witness Protection Program is a service provided by the United States Government which protects witnesses in major criminal cases from physical harm and intimidation. Among law enforcement, the program is better known as the Witness Security Program, or WITSEC. Under the Witness Protection Program, someone will be provided with physical security as well as a new identity and a place to live. The program applies to witnesses and close family members who may also be under threat. Some Americans are surprised to learn that many of the people in the Witness Protection Program are former criminals, who made a bargain with the State to avoid prosecution.

In order to be eligible for the Witness Protection Program, the witness must be providing major evidence relating to a grave felony. Witnesses in organized crime, drug running, and terrorism cases may be offered protection if they qualify. If the life of the witness is considered to be at risk because of his or her testimony, protection will be offered. Frequently, family members are included as well. The threat of death or intimidation must be substantial, as protecting a witness is very expensive.

In addition to providing physical security, the Witness Protection Program also relocates witnesses after the trial, and provides them with new identities. A small living stipend is offered until the witness finds a new job, and other assistance may be provided on an as-needed basis. When the witness is relocated, local law enforcement are informed if he or she was a criminal, so that they can keep an eye on the witness as well.

The program also includes restrictions. The witness is not allowed to return to his or her former hometown, and is not supposed to contact former friends and acquaintances. Every witness who has complied with the terms of the Witness Protection Program has been successfully protected, although witnesses who broke with the terms have been killed.

[hesouttamylife]

I also belive that Michael is in a witness protection program and the much of the reason that he has given over so much power to Branca and McClain is because he is restricted from associating with anyone except family very discreetly.  I feel that through his family members his wishes are being made known to the executors.  This is also the reason I have never believed there will be a comeback.  That life is over. He will not because he cannot go back to that life.  I don't even believe he will ever come back to the states.  I could be wrong on all of the above, but that is my gut feeling.  To go public I believe would place him still and possibly forever in harm's way.

[Miss.Peppers]

. Ok. Miss Peppers how would you react if your son or daughter would die? Would you go out the next day to buy a sleeping bag? She has people who can do things for her, why did she go out? She should have stayed with the grandchildren, and console eachother. Who was with the grandchildren when she was out? You have your opinion, and I have mine. I do respect it, but I still feel she is a very good actrice. Blessings.

I cannot answer that question, as grief is unique.

You cannot judge someone on their actions when something has happened so recently.

I understand why you may think that going shopping was innapropriate, but how do you know she wasnt in shock and denial at that point?  Maybe going shopping and doing something "normal" was her way to mentally cope with the stress.

Sometimes, when people are in extreme states emotion and in extreme situations, the mind can think in funny ways and people can act in the oddest of ways.

There is no "right" or "wrong" way to grief...  this is my only point...  and i dont think the fact that KJ went shopping either proves or disproves anything.

[PureLove]

I also belive that Michael is in a witness protection program and the much of the reason that he has given over so much power to Branca and McClain is because he is restricted from associating with anyone except family very discreetly.  I feel that through his family members his wishes are being made known to the executors.  This is also the reason I have never believed there will be a comeback.  That life is over. He will not because he cannot go back to that life.  I don't even believe he will ever come back to the states.  I could be wrong on all of the above, but that is my gut feeling.  To go public I believe would place him still and possibly forever in harm's way.

The program also includes restrictions. The witness is not allowed to return to his or her former hometown, and is not supposed to contact former friends and acquaintances.

[/size]

WPP means that you can never ever contact with any of your friends or acquaintances. And you can never go back to your former hometown. You can not see your family either. Do you still believe that he is in WPP? I do not. And well, I never ever, not in a second believed that he did the hoax to run away. That also makes me sure that he is not in WPP.

[hesouttamylife]

During the period of time the case is open (I don't know the number of years) I thought the protected person was able to communicate through the FBI with mother, father, spouse, children.  Is that not the case? Correct me if I'm wrong.

[scorpionchik]

I, also, have struggled with this very question. Here are some reasons I have doubt.

1) Mother Katherine goes shopping for sleeping bags the day or two after Michael's death.
2) She does not break down in interviews while talking about Michael's death but she does when talking about the 2005 trial.
3) Katherine flying around the country and not even being at Forest Lawn on the anniversary of Michael's death. She was in Gary, Indiana doing the tribute thing.
4) Katherine writing the book wasn't odd for me - I think she's wanting people to understand the "real" Michael and not the one that the media has portrayed. This was the perfect chance to reach people's open hearts.
5) Wearing the blue suit to Murray's court hearings. To me it was too coincidental.
6) Oprah interviews.
7) No name on the crypt even to this day.

All is right. I juswant to add that when Katherine after all this weird behavior still repeats on the interviews that Michael is dead, right there I think it is because Michael is not planning to come back.
Don't forget to consider also her lawsuit against AEG for wrongful death . This not a joke. If Michael comes back, the consequesnces will be harsh for Katherine and Michael with AEG that will sue them back for defamation, uless before then, will be revealed and proved that AEG had direct connection with attempt to murder Michael.

[scorpionchik]

During the period of time the case is open (I don't know the number of years) I thought the protected person was able to communicate through the FBI with mother, father, spouse, children.  Is that not the case? Correct me if I'm wrong.

If person is in WPP, he/she cannot contact anyone, especially close family members. It would jeopardize their safety and that person. Criminal keeps eye on siblings to make sure victim is not conacting his loved ones and is really dead. FBI does not get involve in connecting them. Those people sent maybe even out of the country where there is no FBI.

[PureLove]

During the period of time the case is open (I don't know the number of years) I thought the protected person was able to communicate through the FBI with mother, father, spouse, children.  Is that not the case? Correct me if I'm wrong.

In Witness Protection Program that is not possible. You can take them with you though but you can not go to visit them. Here is what a Sting Operation is which sounds more plausible to me.

Sting operation

In law enforcement, a sting operation is a deceptive operation designed to catch a person committing a crime. A typical sting will have a law-enforcement officer or cooperative member of the public play a role as criminal partner or potential victim and go along with a suspect's actions to gather evidence of the suspect's wrongdoing.

Examples

* Deploying a bait car (also called a honey trap) to catch an auto thief
* Setting up a seemingly vulnerable honeypot computer to lure and gain information about hackers
* Arranging someone under the legal drinking age to ask an adult to buy an alcoholic beverage or tobacco products for them.[1]
* Posing as someone who is seeking illegal drugs, contraband or child pornography to catch a supplier; or as a supplier to catch a customer.
* Passing off explosives to a would-be terror bomber.
* Posing as a child in a chat room to lure a child molester
* An undercover officer posing as a potential customer to raid illegal prostitution.
* An undercover officer posing as a prostitute to raid illegal patronage.

Ethical and legal concerns

Sting operations are fraught with ethical concerns over whether they constitute entrapment. Law-enforcement may have to be careful not to provoke the commission of a crime by someone who would not normally be inclined to do so. Additionally, in the process of such operations, the police often engage in the same crimes, such as buying or selling contraband, soliciting prostitutes, etc. In common law jurisdictions, the defendant may invoke the defense of entrapment.

Contrary to popular misconceptions, however, entrapment does not prohibit undercover police officers from posing as criminals or denying that they are police. Entrapment is typically only a defense if a suspect is pressured into committing a crime they would probably not have committed otherwise, though the legal definition of this pressure varies greatly from country to country. For example, if undercover officers coerced a potential suspect into manufacturing illegal drugs to sell them, then the accused could use entrapment as a defense. However, if a suspect is already manufacturing drugs and police pose as buyers to catch him, then entrapment usually has not occurred.

[sandythyme]

Scorpionchik I agree with you.

  " I juswant to add that when Katherine after all this weird behavior still repeats on the interviews that Michael is dead, right there I think it is because Michael is not planning to come back"

I have always thought when all is said and done that Michael would not return to us.  His old life is gone.  My hope is that where ever he is that he is safe. I would settle for that.   :|  :cry:

[fordtocarr]

yes, I think what you are saying her makes us feel he is not returning...but what of the continuing new clues?  I'm sure we will become even more lost as this trial comes and goes, but we have to be able to brush it off...and have faith in our hearts because this is going to be painful.

[hesouttamylife]

I do not think that Michael will come back for a long time if ever, and that is what allows for the tears and the sadness that we occasionally see from his family.  I don’t believe that Michael would do this unless he had to.  And I cannot imagine that he is happy with this arrangement, especially if he cannot see his children.  Not one bit :?   I guess now it’s just wait and see.  I only hope that he is okay

[PureLove]

I do not think that Michael will come back for a long time if ever, and that is what allows for the tears and the sadness that we occasionally see from his family.  I don’t believe that Michael would do this unless he had to.  And I cannot imagine that he is happy with this arrangement, especially if he cannot see his children.  Not one bit :?   I guess now it’s just wait and see.  I only hope that he is okay

I agree with you that he wouldn't do it without seeing his kids. That's the reason why I say he is not in WPP. As for the return, I do believe he will come back and I do believe it is going to happen this summer. With the clues we have found, a return is a must.

[all4loveandbelieve]

What all of you are saying makes so much sense. So, the probability that Michael was in danger
could be the reason that Katherine is able to lie. Makes lots of sense but here is what bothers me...
If Michael was in such danger than maybe he won't be coming back? Does anyone ever return from
the witness protection plan??  So many questions.

I do not think Michael is in WPP because when you get in that program, you can never go back to see your family or friends. You get a brand new name and a brand new location and you can bring your close family like kids with you. But Michael didn't bring them with him. I do not believe he wouldn't go to see his parents, kids and family never. He did a deal with the FBI called Sting Operation. Sting Operation perfectly fits with this issue. I believe that after he comes back he will be protected by the FBI or by more bodygouards.

In the witness protection, once the person has been apprehanded they can go back as their normal self. As we all know Michael can disguise himself and go see his children when ever he wants. If he left with his children, this would have been obvious, if some one is after him they would know that he did not die, but is hiding somewhere. The FBI wanted these murderers to think that Michael has died..
That's why the children stayed behind with the grandmother, so it wouldn't be so obvious into their eyes.

No, you're wrong about WPP. Here it is about Witness Protection Program. The last paragraph is important. I wrote it on TS' thread before. WPP has very strict rules. That is the reason why I wrote, it is more possible that he is in a Sting Operation. He is definitely not in WPP. For further info about the Sting Operation and Entrapment which were also mentioned by TS, here is the link where I gave info about them.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Witness Protection Program

The Witness Protection Program is a service provided by the United States Government which protects witnesses in major criminal cases from physical harm and intimidation. Among law enforcement, the program is better known as the Witness Security Program, or WITSEC. Under the Witness Protection Program, someone will be provided with physical security as well as a new identity and a place to live. The program applies to witnesses and close family members who may also be under threat. Some Americans are surprised to learn that many of the people in the Witness Protection Program are former criminals, who made a bargain with the State to avoid prosecution.

In order to be eligible for the Witness Protection Program, the witness must be providing major evidence relating to a grave felony. Witnesses in organized crime, drug running, and terrorism cases may be offered protection if they qualify. If the life of the witness is considered to be at risk because of his or her testimony, protection will be offered. Frequently, family members are included as well. The threat of death or intimidation must be substantial, as protecting a witness is very expensive.

In addition to providing physical security, the Witness Protection Program also relocates witnesses after the trial, and provides them with new identities. A small living stipend is offered until the witness finds a new job, and other assistance may be provided on an as-needed basis. When the witness is relocated, local law enforcement are informed if he or she was a criminal, so that they can keep an eye on the witness as well.

The program also includes restrictions. The witness is not allowed to return to his or her former hometown, and is not supposed to contact former friends and acquaintances. Every witness who has complied with the terms of the Witness Protection Program has been successfully protected, although witnesses who broke with the terms have been killed.

Yes I agree, I said if they aprehand the people who is trying to kill the person, that person can go back to his regular life. They caught the people. they are in jail and they threw the key away. (figure of speech) Now this is the law in Canada as for the US It could be it is different.

[suspicious mind]

seems like everything will come down to who has been behind all of this. if it is a large powerful organization or if it is just a few mangey mutes working alone.

[sandythyme]

I keep going back in forth....If Michael were "dead" we wouldn't have clues.  If Michael is alive, hiding and didn't want to be found we wouldn't have clues.  We have clues, so I believe Michael is alive.  I am hoping for a return.  I guess what makes me feel better on frustrated days is that we have clues, clues from Michael to let us know he's ok which makes me hope for a return.  Oh I sound CRAZY tonight...sorry guys, long day!