Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators
Hoax Theories => The Double Theory => Topic started by: ~Souza~ on April 12, 2010, 04:23:25 PM
-
OK, so people asked us who we think is the real MJ, since we think O2 dude is not Mike.
We used Mike's picture from 1977 to compare the faces, because most of you want proof, instead of just us telling you what we think. It's a hell of a job, but here are some real ones from the BAD era (although we have doubts that the Come Together yellow shirt one is really from the BAD era, because it looks more recent, but that aside). Let's see if you all agree this is the real deal, because maybe we think the double is the real deal, you just never know.
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes.gif)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes2.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes2.gif)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes3.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes3.gif)
It's not on each pic an EXACT match, but that's because of the angles <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> but as you can see, "The Eyes Have It". Besides that, the mouth, nose, ears, chin are all in the right place, DESPITE the angle differences.
My question now is, is this the real deal?
-
@Souza I think it's all a double with a prosthetic mask on.
-
@Souza I think it's all a double with a prosthetic mask on.
You are seriously starting to annoy me Raven, I ask a serious question here. You can either answer in a normal way, or stay away from the double threads.
-
@Souza I think it's all a double with a prosthetic mask on.
You are seriously starting to annoy me Raven, I ask a serious question here. You can either answer in a normal way, or stay away from the double threads.
This is not a doubles thread.
Why is it annoying...as I'm doing the same you did.
When I said it was Michael himself you also replied it was a double with a mask on, and I also noted along the lines it started to become annoying. What's the difference?
-
I'm confused...are you saying that the pictures used above are not all MJ or that they are?
-
Wow!
The eyes are the mirror of the soul. Both pics ( 77-87) has the same eyes.
-
They're all Michael. PERIOD.
-
the last one looks to match the best.... ohh its hard...
-
@Souza I think it's all a double with a prosthetic mask on.
You are seriously starting to annoy me Raven, I ask a serious question here. You can either answer in a normal way, or stay away from the double threads.
This is not a double thread.
Why is it annoying...as I'm doing the same you did.
When I said it was Michael himself you also replied it was a double with a mask on, and I also noted along the lines it started to become annoying. What's the difference?
The difference is that I compare pics and you just say "It's Michael Jackson". O2 dude can't be compared, we have no eyes. If try to compare O2 dude's mouth is already too wide. A good comparison is impossible with the glasses on.
I am done with people like you just 'stating their opinion', ridiculing others without any arguments. I had the discussion with mykidsmum as well, but she at least posts her own comparisons. You are only stirring the threads up. If you don't think there were doubles and you will not contribute to the thread proving us wrong, just stay away from these threads.
'Nuff said...
-
They're all Michael. PERIOD.
Maybe I wasn't really clear in my post, I said we think all the above pics are INDEED Mike...
-
I'm confused...are you saying that the pictures used above are not all MJ or that they are?
I am saying we think all the above pictures are Mike.
-
I'm confused...are you saying that the pictures used above are not all MJ or that they are?
I am saying we think all the above pictures are Mike.
Alright, thanks for clarifying. This is random, but do you and Mo always refer in posts as "we" instead of "I". I just noticed it and was curious lol.
-
I'm confused...are you saying that the pictures used above are not all MJ or that they are?
I am saying we think all the above pictures are Mike.
Alright, thanks for clarifying. This is random, but do you and Mo always refer in posts as "we" instead of "I". I just noticed it and was curious lol.
We do when we share the same opinion. Then it's easier if one of us just writes "we", instead of us each posting a separate message saying "I".
-
@Souza I think it's all a double with a prosthetic mask on.
You are seriously starting to annoy me Raven, I ask a serious question here. You can either answer in a normal way, or stay away from the double threads.
This is not a double thread.
Why is it annoying...as I'm doing the same you did.
When I said it was Michael himself you also replied it was a double with a mask on, and I also noted along the lines it started to become annoying. What's the difference?
The difference is that I compare pics and you just say "It's Michael Jackson". O2 dude can't be compared, we have no eyes. If try to compare O2 dude's mouth is already too wide. A good comparison is impossible with the glasses on.
I am done with people like you just 'stating their opinion', ridiculing others without any arguments. I had the discussion with mykidsmum as well, but she at least posts her own comparisons. You are only stirring the threads up. If you don't think there were doubles and you will not contribute to the thread proving us wrong, just stay away from these threads.
'Nuff said...
Ow I've given enough arguments, it's not true what you say. I've mentioned the scar near his lower lip. I've mentioned scars on his chin. I've mentioned the scar on his cheek. I've reposted a picture of yours that you used for comparison in black and white you couldn't get to match because it was in mirror-image. But you've all done away with them as 'that can be artificially added' or 'it's a prosthetic mask'.
-
I'm confused...are you saying that the pictures used above are not all MJ or that they are?
I am saying we think all the above pictures are Mike.
Alright, thanks for clarifying. This is random, but do you and Mo always refer in posts as "we" instead of "I". I just noticed it and was curious lol.
No, not always.
-
You have done a great job souza the pics match very well
-
@Souza I think it's all a double with a prosthetic mask on.
You are seriously starting to annoy me Raven, I ask a serious question here. You can either answer in a normal way, or stay away from the double threads.
This is not a double thread.
Why is it annoying...as I'm doing the same you did.
When I said it was Michael himself you also replied it was a double with a mask on, and I also noted along the lines it started to become annoying. What's the difference?
The difference is that I compare pics and you just say "It's Michael Jackson". O2 dude can't be compared, we have no eyes. If try to compare O2 dude's mouth is already too wide. A good comparison is impossible with the glasses on.
I am done with people like you just 'stating their opinion', ridiculing others without any arguments. I had the discussion with mykidsmum as well, but she at least posts her own comparisons. You are only stirring the threads up. If you don't think there were doubles and you will not contribute to the thread proving us wrong, just stay away from these threads.
'Nuff said...
Ow I've given enough arguments, it's not true what you say. I've mentioned the scar near his lower lip. I've mentioned scars on his chin. I've mentioned the scar on his cheek. I've reposted a picture of yours that you used for comparison in black and white you couldn't get to match because it was in mirror-image. But you've all done away with them as 'that can be artificially added' or 'it's a prosthetic mask'.
Yes, because it's POSSIBLE nowadays, but you just ignored that and went on with sarcastic remarks. That's the last thing I will say about it, since this discussion is not the issue here. I am awaiting your comparisons...
-
Wow what a good job ! Yes "the eyes have it" all Michael !
-
"Maybe I wasn't really clear in my post, I said we think all the above pics are INDEED Mike..."
You where perfectly clear Souza, some people are just to ignorant or lazy to actualy read and look.
-
Yep, like TMZ recently pointed out "the eyes have it"!!
-
I love the morphing, great that some people know how to do that. I just wanted to add something about the chin cleft. My brother has at 57 a very marked cleft that was basicly invisible when he was a teen, but slowly grew. I'm wondering if that is the case with Michael. Katherine clearly has a cleft and it may be mostly a natural for MJ. Is there an interview where Michael clearly said he put in the cleft or is it hear-say?
-
yep can definatlety see it..... i take it your going to add Dangerous, HIStory, Invincible etc at a later date?
-
I love the morphing, great that some people know how to do that. I just wanted to add something about the chin cleft. My brother has at 57 a very marked cleft that was basicly invisible when he was a teen, but slowly grew. I'm wondering if that is the case with Michael. Katherine clearly has a cleft and it may be mostly a natural for MJ. Is there an interview where Michael clearly said he put in the cleft or is it hear-say?
I actually remember an interview where he said he had the cleft done, but would'nt know where to start looking for that interview...
-
And i totally believe that first pic comparison of Mj in yellow shirt is a more recent pic than we think it is
-
"Maybe I wasn't really clear in my post, I said we think all the above pics are INDEED Mike..."
You where perfectly clear Souza, some people are just to ignorant or lazy to actualy read and look.
No need to insult anyone. I wasn't clear on what she meant and I am neither ignorant nor lazy. So there! Hmph! :x
-
I love the morphing, great that some people know how to do that. I just wanted to add something about the chin cleft. My brother has at 57 a very marked cleft that was basicly invisible when he was a teen, but slowly grew. I'm wondering if that is the case with Michael. Katherine clearly has a cleft and it may be mostly a natural for MJ. Is there an interview where Michael clearly said he put in the cleft or is it hear-say?
I actually remember an interview where he said he had the cleft done, but would'nt know where to start looking for that interview...
In Moonwalker.
-
Ok, here's one from the HIStory era. I can't help but have doubts. Upper lip too low, chin too short, eyes don't match. I'll leave it up to you.
(http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes4.jpg)
(http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes4.gif)
-
Maybe the upper lip looks lower because the nose is different? I'm not sure, just throwin that out there...
I really, really am trying to be open minded about the possibility of doubles, but I'm not really convinced. In my opinion that is Michael, as well as the others discussed in this particular thread.
-
the lip issue could be, because in the first comparrison pic the mouth is open.... and the second the mouth is closed...
-
Maybe the upper lip looks lower because the nose is different? I'm not sure, just throwin that out there...
I really, really am trying to be open minded about the possibility of doubles, but I'm not really convinced. In my opinion that is Michael, as well as the others discussed in this particular thread.
Nope, the nose is already different in the BAD era, and they do match. They eyes are too big as well, the 'hang' more. Like I said, I have doubts, I am not 100% sure but to me it's not a match. And the others I posted in the first post, all match.
@awesome1, that would be right for the bottom lip, not the upper lip.
-
to me, and no disrespect to mike but it looks like he has had a lot of work done on his face
he was beautiful before and after
-
I know what this thread it's about, but would you mind posting some random pics of the man you say is not Michael (from all Eras you've found doubles), please? Not comparing, just the pics.
Thanks, it would be very much appreciated.
(Maybe is not a good idea post them here because people may get confused.)
-
the more i look at the upper lip i can see a tiny fraction of a difference its very slightly lower, but it may look that way because of the nose and other work that he would have had done, which would also explain the chin....
the eyes are kinda bugging me though.....
-
Maybe the upper lip looks lower because the nose is different? I'm not sure, just throwin that out there...
I really, really am trying to be open minded about the possibility of doubles, but I'm not really convinced. In my opinion that is Michael, as well as the others discussed in this particular thread.
Nope, the nose is already different in the BAD era, and they do match. They eyes are too big as well, the 'hang' more. Like I said, I have doubts, I am not 100% sure but to me it's not a match. And the others I posted in the first post, all match.
@awesome1, that would be right for the bottom lip, not the upper lip.
In the BAD era picture it looks like compared to the first picture, the upper lip is lower down than the first picture on page one as well. I also don't think that the noses look very similar even with the BAD era picture compared to this one.
-
I know what this thread it's about, but would you mind posting some random pics of the man you say is not Michael (from all Eras you've found doubles), please? Not comparing, just the pics.
Thanks, it would be very much appreciated.
(Maybe is not a good idea post them here because people may get confused.)
I'll get to that later on.
-
The difference in the eyes shape can occure after the eye lid (upper or lower) surgery.... It can be a real change in shape or only a visual one... please check the links below for more info...
http://www.realself.com/question/can-change-eye-shape (http://www.realself.com/question/can-change-eye-shape)
http://www.plasticsurgery90210.com/blep ... d-surgery/ (http://www.plasticsurgery90210.com/blepharoplasty-eyelid-surgery/)
But in general there are more then one Michael... some have wider smile, some smaller.. different ears, teeth etc.....
http://www.allure.com/magazine/2009/09/ ... =3#slide=3 (http://www.allure.com/magazine/2009/09/michael_jackson?slide=3#slide=3)
;)
-
hmmm... the pic in the yellow shirt..can you compare it to the one from the HIStory era? I would do it but I dnt know how :oops:
please and thank you...
... a lot to think about now
-
@Souza I think it's all a double with a prosthetic mask on.
You are seriously starting to annoy me Raven, I ask a serious question here. You can either answer in a normal way, or stay away from the double threads.
This is not a double thread.
Why is it annoying...as I'm doing the same you did.
When I said it was Michael himself you also replied it was a double with a mask on, and I also noted along the lines it started to become annoying. What's the difference?
The difference is that I compare pics and you just say "It's Michael Jackson". O2 dude can't be compared, we have no eyes. If try to compare O2 dude's mouth is already too wide. A good comparison is impossible with the glasses on.
I am done with people like you just 'stating their opinion', ridiculing others without any arguments. I had the discussion with mykidsmum as well, but she at least posts her own comparisons. You are only stirring the threads up. If you don't think there were doubles and you will not contribute to the thread proving us wrong, just stay away from these threads.
'Nuff said...
Ow I've given enough arguments, it's not true what you say. I've mentioned the scar near his lower lip. I've mentioned scars on his chin. I've mentioned the scar on his cheek. I've reposted a picture of yours that you used for comparison in black and white you couldn't get to match because it was in mirror-image. But you've all done away with them as 'that can be artificially added' or 'it's a prosthetic mask'.
Yes, because it's POSSIBLE nowadays, but you just ignored that and went on with sarcastic remarks. That's the last thing I will say about it, since this discussion is not the issue here. I am awaiting your comparisons...
I don't need to proof anything here. If you claim someone is not Michael, the burden of evidence is yours. I've also explained in the very beginning that IMO it's disrespectful towards Michael publically examining his face to the microscopic level the way you are doing, he would have HATED it, so that is another reason I won't do any comparisons. I've mentioned that plastic surgery is good nowadays (as is prosthetic make-up), but NOT to the detailed extent some people in here suggest.
Other contributions you've ignored: I've explained that if the jaw moves with the lips closed the chin appears longer. I've explained that if the head is tilted forward the length of the chin visually appears shorter and the forehead appears longer on photo due to the 3D effect. So that whole remark of yours "I am done with people like you just 'stating their opinion', ridiculing others without any arguments." is just totally untrue.
-
hmmm... the pic in the yellow shirt..can you compare it to the one from the HIStory era? I would do it but I dnt know how :oops:
please and thank you...
... a lot to think about now
I'll try or I'll think of something else. Hold on.
-
@Souza I think it's all a double with a prosthetic mask on.
You are seriously starting to annoy me Raven, I ask a serious question here. You can either answer in a normal way, or stay away from the double threads.
This is not a double thread.
Why is it annoying...as I'm doing the same you did.
When I said it was Michael himself you also replied it was a double with a mask on, and I also noted along the lines it started to become annoying. What's the difference?
The difference is that I compare pics and you just say "It's Michael Jackson". O2 dude can't be compared, we have no eyes. If try to compare O2 dude's mouth is already too wide. A good comparison is impossible with the glasses on.
I am done with people like you just 'stating their opinion', ridiculing others without any arguments. I had the discussion with mykidsmum as well, but she at least posts her own comparisons. You are only stirring the threads up. If you don't think there were doubles and you will not contribute to the thread proving us wrong, just stay away from these threads.
'Nuff said...
Ow I've given enough arguments, it's not true what you say. I've mentioned the scar near his lower lip. I've mentioned scars on his chin. I've mentioned the scar on his cheek. I've reposted a picture of yours that you used for comparison in black and white you couldn't get to match because it was in mirror-image. But you've all done away with them as 'that can be artificially added' or 'it's a prosthetic mask'.
Yes, because it's POSSIBLE nowadays, but you just ignored that and went on with sarcastic remarks. That's the last thing I will say about it, since this discussion is not the issue here. I am awaiting your comparisons...
I don't need to proof anything here. If you claim someone is not Michael, the burden of evidence is yours. I've also explained in the very beginning that IMO it's disrespectful towards Michael publically examining his face to the microscopic level the way you are doing, he would have HATED it, so that is another reason I won't do any comparisons. I've mentioned that plastic surgery is good nowadays (as is prosthetic make-up), but NOT to the detailed extent some people in here suggest.
Other contributions you've ignored: I've explained that if the jaw moves with the lips closed the chin appears longer. I've explained that if the head is tilted forward the length of the chin visually appears shorter and the forehead appears longer on photo due to the 3D effect. So that whole remark of yours "I am done with people like you just 'stating their opinion', ridiculing others without any arguments." is just totally untrue.
I totally agree with you about it being disrespectful towards MJ.
Being a singer, dancer, and all around brilliant entertainer was MJ's job. And he worked very hard at his job. Yes, I'm sure he, like many other entertainers, had look a-likes to deter fans and allow him to safely exit various venues when the crowds were too large and stunt doubles to perform stunts that were too dangerous for him to do on his own (like flying over a concert crowd with a jet pack). But to suggest that it was not him performing at his own concerts is absolutely disrespectful. He worked hard to create the biggest selling album of all time. He worked hard to create music that actually had meaning. And he worked exceptionally hard to make sure that his concerts were perfect so that his fans would have the greatest experience possible. Don't try to take that away from him.
-
Real Deal, I think.
I made a new gif and put red lines at the chin line and bottom lip line - only very small discrepancies, imho due to different facial expression and make up.
(http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy15/herrjeminee/Mikes4_nina.gif)
-
for people that think that he wouldnt use a double at a concert and disappoint his fans... wouldnt you think he used a double so no to disappoint his fans if he wasnt able to perform... (not talking about TII)
-
To me it's really interesting how different people's perceptions of something can be, it's really fascinating. The YANA pic is def Michael (my opnion). Many have stated that "it's all in the eyes" and I agree (plus face expressions and more...). If you look at the actual shape of the eyes, and ignore the eyeliner (which can make eyes appear way different) and the fact that he's smiling in one pic and looking serious in the other, one can clearly see they're the same. We all know that smiling and laughing can make eyes look different, as well as other facial features, e.g. cheeks, nose, mouth etc.
Studying Michael's face is almost like studying one of my family member's face (slight exaggeration :lol: ) because he's been apart of my life for as long as I can remember. I think it's understandable that some people that are not actual fans or have only been fans for a short time would question if it is the same person because denying that his looks has changed would be like saying that Sweden is situated in Africa :lol: . Michael is beautiful in every era and to me it's not just because his Michael, it's also becasue of those unique features/characteristics of his face and body that are only his.
-
I am done. I think I have stated MULTIPLE times that this is a HAOX INVESTIGATION site and that I am not a fan. If you don't like that, I suggest a fanforum. I am here to unravel a mystery. That does not mean I am disrespectful, it means I want to know why he used doubles and what role doubles might have played in his life, the good way or the bad way. I think I have proved many times that I respect the man very much.
For those that still want to put a lot of work in this, good luck. I'm through.
-
You are absolutely correct..It is disrespectful to Michael. They are comparing pictures of him when he was 17 to 30 something or even older!!!!! Did you not change in appearence over the years? Plus he also had work done.! Give me a break :roll:
-
you do change in appearance but not that much in many cases..... like me for example i look at my baby pictures and i really changed a lot over 19 years :lol:
-
You are correct Souza, this is a Hoax Investigation of his DEATH....Not his PLastic Surgeries.
-
Very impressive morphing job, Souza, well done. The slides are not numbered so my comments are relative to the thread’s ‘page 1’ and ‘page 2’ series.
IMO, I see three different people on page 1..
Profile A
1) Michael’s energy field or aura is that of a soft, warm, intelligence, receptive-giving, pliant
1A) eyes are ‘old soul’, even as a child, deep, deep pools
2) note his slightly ‘rounded’, relaxed shoulders
3) note his earlobes, small lobe, note the V dip away from the facial skin then rounding into a single small lobe close to his head
4) draw an imaginary line from his ear lobe to his nose and note the ear lines up exactly to the tip of his nose
5) note his cranium size balanced size with width of his strong neck
6) note the forward’ tilt of his head
7) note that his nose, lips, jaw are about the same width
8) note the degree of protrusion of the nasal-mouth-jaw, the rise apex to his lips
9) draw an imaginary line from his outer lips to his eyes and the line would meet his eyes about mid-iris
10) note the proportion of his neck relative to his head and the distance between his head to his shoulders
11) frontal view no ‘adam’s apple’ visible
12) note that his neck ends in a pronounced V at his clavicle
13) note the tonal elasticity of the neck skin, no ski folds
Profile B-yellow shirt
1) the energy field or aura is different, the gentle ‘receptive-giving’ aura has changed into a harder, more worldly ‘assessor’, very self-possessed instead of pliant, strong, assured, a hint of arrogance not found in Profile A
1A) the eyes are harder, knowing
2) arms raised, so different posture, not good for comparison
3) ear lobes are different, 2 lobe bumps not seen in Profile A
4) Imaginary line, earlobes lower than tip of his nose
5) jaw line extends beyond neck, so neck appears smaller than Profile A
6) forward tilt matches
7) lips are smaller
8) nasal-lip-jaw protrusion apex is more pronounced
9) imaginary line from outer lip to eye, does not quite meet mid-iris
10) cranium seems elevated on neck stem compared to profile A
11) fontal view, adam’s apple visible
12) clavicle V not as pronounced
13) neck skin is looser, has more skin folds
Profile C-red shirt
1) the energy field is different, more party boy, effervesce, glee, lightness which is antithesis of ‘old soul’
1A) the eyes are elongated compared to Profile A and B
2) shoulders are straight
3) ear lobes are more pointy than rounded
4) ear lobes lower than nose
5) jawline extends beyond the neck
6) no forward tilt of head, more straight line
7) lips are elongated-Compare A and C teeth-two front teeth, then A smile (right side) shows 3 teeth, Profile C smile shows 4 teeth
8) pronounced nasal –lip-jaw apex in B is flattened out in A and C, C jaw more elongated and square than Profiles A or B
9) Imaginary line from lip to iris, line now extends to outside of iris!
10) Cranium definitely elevated on neck stem compared to A and B
11) Bigger, more pronounced adam’s apple than profiles A and B
12) Clavicle V unknown
13) Tight neck, no neck skin folds
Page 2, HIStory Profile D
HIStory matches Profile A perfectly. This is Michael Jackson, perfect match. The distances between lip-nose and eye rounder, etc are due to plastic surgery. Notice the aura-the ‘old soul’, the neck and cranium balance, chin perfect match.
:ugeek: D
-
You are correct Souza, this is a Hoax Investigation of his DEATH....Not his PLastic Surgeries.
Well lynn, the funny thing is that you fans all say he changed that much due to plastic surgeries, and Mo and I always said we think he didn't change that much at all, so what were you implying?
-
Real Deal, I think.
I made a new gif and put red lines at the chin line and bottom lip line - only very small discrepancies, imho due to different facial expression and make up.
(http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy15/herrjeminee/Mikes4_nina.gif)
I took the long way and shared my step by step analysis with everyone, but, I came to the same conclusion as you!
Exactly.
IMO, this was a useful exercise and settled questions. Thank you, Sousa.
-
I'm staying out of it this time, it's getting too crazy for me...I will say, Raven, you are correct in what you said about 3-d, prosthetics, plastic surgery, mirror image. I gotta get outa here soon, I just can't force myself to do it. This double's theory thing is getting out of control.
I got in touch with an old friend of mine, at risk of making myself sound like an obsessed idiot, I ran a few question about prosthetics...this is what she had to say. This is what she does.
-she said that unless the persons nose was smaller than MJ's to begin with...there is no way with prosthetics to make a "normal" nose smaller. There is no way to alter the width between the eyes. The eyes have to stay in their sockets and will always be the same.
-There is no way to closely match eye color on close up. Contacts will always appear colored on the surface in close ups and not "within" the eye.
-If you were to "match" a false pair of teeth, they would always be bigger (protrude) or sit lower in the face because of the need to "cover the original teeth"
I don't believe in a double as for the reason why MJ looks different tru the years or between pictures or days or years...I believe in addiction to surgical and not surgical body modification. And all of those of you who believe MJ when he said he "only had two nose jobs"... he also said he believed he could fly and that he is Peter Pan. People who are addicted to things like plastic surgery and drugs and alcohol, won't tell the truth if you say...ok, so how many drinks did you have today, or, what drugs did you do today, I'm sure they will tell you exactly what you wanna know. Come off it. (by the way, I'm not saying MJ is an alcoholic or a druggie, I'm using those addictions as an example) To use myself....if my hubby says how many times did you go to the chip bag last night...I'll say "once!" ba ha ha ha ha
-
You are correct Souza, this is a Hoax Investigation of his DEATH....Not his PLastic Surgeries.
Well lynn, the funny thing is that you fans all say he changed that much due to plastic surgeries, and Mo and I always said we think he didn't change that much at all, so what were you implying?
i think in essence we are actually prooving that michael didnt have all the surgeries that the media had said.......
and we aernt photo professionals... were just comparing the changes from a distance.... its not like microscopic anylasis and michael had hated the fact that he was getting older... so i think he has had a few tweaks over the years to stay young looking
-
I am done. I think I have stated MULTIPLE times that this is a HAOX INVESTIGATION site and that I am not a fan. If you don't like that, I suggest a fanforum. I am here to unravel a mystery. That does not mean I am disrespectful, it means I want to know why he used doubles and what role doubles might have played in his life, the good way or the bad way. I think I have proved many times that I respect the man very much.
For those that still want to put a lot of work in this, good luck. I'm through.
Please don't let this get you down. Grab a cup of coffee and continue with your thought. Some of us are interested in the outcome. Thanks.
-
I can see both sides. I was one of those fans that didn't want to hear anything about the doubles theory because I felt that no matter what Michael looked like he always had that "Michaelness" about him, lol. But I realize now how important it is to leave our feelings aside in order to think critically and see clearly. I realize now the real possibility of doubles. I don't, however, think it's completely necessary to disect every single photo of him. I think it is only important to acknowledge the possibility in case it is in fact an important part of the hoax.
I had asked Souza to post pics of what they believe to be the "real deal" - I only asked because it seems like everyone has a different idea of what Michael really looks like, so I thought it would help get everyone on the same page. Maybe there's no hope in getting everyone on the same page when it comes to Michael's face. And the more I think about it, the more I think maybe that was apart of his plan...doubles or not... making it hard for us to tell.
We should agree to disagree on things like this. None of us can prove anything, period. For those of you that get mad at Mo and Souza for trying to prove their point: don't get upset if you can't at least try to prove yours. They at least have valid reasons (evidence) of their theories. That doesn't mean your reasons aren't valid, but when you don't take the time to show them to the rest of us it doesn't do much good. You can't just give your opinion. Let's see some pictures!
...Or, let's just focus on other things. I don't blame Souza for being exhausted from all the ignorant ridicule. Her energy and effort is wasted when people refuse to read/see past their preconceived notions.
-
I know that you Mo and Souza, are not hired by Michael as part of this hoax, but I think you have done an excellent job of getting us all to examine Michael the real Michael so we know how to identify a fake counterfeit. Thank you so much for all you done (genuine)! I don't actually see it as disrespectful at all. Actually it's all this close close scrutiny that has convinced me that it's all Michael (mostly) except (for me) possibly not 02 guy (because of the camera guy behind), orange pant (I've always maintained that) and finally all the "obviously impersonator Michaels. I've changed my mind on there being someone who is identical to Michael that has been fooling us for years. "Bit by bit Michael will be revealed". It's all a part of the plan. Then Michael does the sign language saying he will reveal himself to us fans. I believe he is doing it partly through all these discussions. I'm lovin it! I agree with this just before me poster--let's see more pictures and dig deeper. This is thee man afterall--the focus of the hoax.
-
I am done. I think I have stated MULTIPLE times that this is a HAOX INVESTIGATION site and that I am not a fan. If you don't like that, I suggest a fanforum. I am here to unravel a mystery. That does not mean I am disrespectful, it means I want to know why he used doubles and what role doubles might have played in his life, the good way or the bad way. I think I have proved many times that I respect the man very much.
For those that still want to put a lot of work in this, good luck. I'm through.
Please don't let this get you down. Grab a cup of coffee and continue with your thought. Some of us are interested in the outcome. Thanks.
Problem here is that people fail to realize we have seen footage, photos that can be manipulated to make a double look more like the real deal.
Why were there restrictions for lenses at the gigs in Belgium in 1996?
Why are some of the pictures that make me go hmmmm of a crappy quality?
Since when is Mike talking to his fans with his glasses on?
Since when is Mike dancing (rehearsing) with glasses on?
Why do we see MJ's with different ears?
Why do fans rather believe he had 100 surgeries to alter his face than to even consider the possibility of a double?
If he feared his life, if he was planning this hoax, why is it so hard to believe he used doubles?
Why is it impossible to have someone look like him that much? People seem to think he can change facial structure and body height/shape all the time, yet it is impossible for someone that probably already looked like him, to have enough surgeries to walk around pretending to be him (of course with sunglasses on, otherwise people would have noticed).
How is it possible he changed his nose back and forth over the last 20 years? He didn't, because it's impossible, it ends somewhere.
And last but not least, why is it so hard to believe that he might have planned this for years and years, showing doubles ON PURPOSE for his own safety, because even his fans can't tell who is who.
Another thing, Donald Trump had an interesting thing about Mike(s):
[youtube:2g26vo4b]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=soXm_uLPSsg[/youtube:2g26vo4b]
And he says he spoke to Mike about a year ago. Yet here he says Mike told him he was excited about the O2 gigs and that he was sold out everywhere. So which Mike did he speak with and when?
[youtube:2g26vo4b]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3q96wexKWwo&feature=related[/youtube:2g26vo4b]
If you don't open your mind for other possibilities, you might never get a step closer to the truth. I am not a fan, but from what I have seen and heard the last 10 months: nothing is impossible when it comes to Michael Jackson.
-
It´s not that I´m not open, it´s just that I don´t see it that way, nor I see this is so important. I´m open to his plastic surgery... but I don´t think there´s that much.
We´ve seen thousands of people abussing from plastic surgery, they all become the same without expression. It´s not MJ´s case.
Please, don´t put the people who don´t think there are doubles in a common bag... we all are different and come to conclusions by different ways and means.
-
I'm staying out of it this time, it's getting too crazy for me...I will say, Raven, you are correct in what you said about 3-d, prosthetics, plastic surgery, mirror image. I gotta get outa here soon, I just can't force myself to do it. This double's theory thing is getting out of control.
I got in touch with an old friend of mine, at risk of making myself sound like an obsessed idiot, I ran a few question about prosthetics...this is what she had to say. This is what she does.
-she said that unless the persons nose was smaller than MJ's to begin with...there is no way with prosthetics to make a "normal" nose smaller. There is no way to alter the width between the eyes. The eyes have to stay in their sockets and will always be the same.
-There is no way to closely match eye color on close up. Contacts will always appear colored on the surface in close ups and not "within" the eye.
-If you were to "match" a false pair of teeth, they would always be bigger (protrude) or sit lower in the face because of the need to "cover the original teeth"
I don't believe in a double as for the reason why MJ looks different tru the years or between pictures or days or years...I believe in addiction to surgical and not surgical body modification. And all of those of you who believe MJ when he said he "only had two nose jobs"... he also said he believed he could fly and that he is Peter Pan. People who are addicted to things like plastic surgery and drugs and alcohol, won't tell the truth if you say...ok, so how many drinks did you have today, or, what drugs did you do today, I'm sure they will tell you exactly what you wanna know. Come off it. (by the way, I'm not saying MJ is an alcoholic or a druggie, I'm using those addictions as an example) To use myself....if my hubby says how many times did you go to the chip bag last night...I'll say "once!" ba ha ha ha ha
Just a quick note on your post: Michael stated that he would like to be able to fly, not that he could actually fly on his own. He also stated that he is Peter Pan in his heart:)
-
it's the eyes! they're all the same. a bit difference there on the mouth maybe due to the nose jobs. but it's all mike. the eyes proved it.
-
The only thing I am saying is: doubles, or no doubles, plastic surgeries or no surgeries, what does any of this have to do with Michael fakeing his death? We have all agreed that what Michael did in his personal life should be left alone, This is personal. Are we trying to make people believe that Michael deceived us? This in my opinion is where this is headed. No matter what, I will not believe for one minute that Michael would put an imposter on stage to take his place. I guess you have to really feel Michael in your heart to know what I feel. And by the way, I was not a die hard fan. I am 10 years older than Michael.
-
Just want to state my appreciation for the great work you do Sousa. We are onto the right track with this. All trails in this investigation seem to be bringing us back to this topic constantly. If we don't do these comparisons now, we will only run around in circles expending more time and energy with little or no progress. And then still be back at this topic at a later date. I'd rather find out now. Sending you much love, clarity and rhinocerous skin to withstand the critics
-
I am done. I think I have stated MULTIPLE times that this is a HAOX INVESTIGATION site and that I am not a fan. If you don't like that, I suggest a fanforum. I am here to unravel a mystery. That does not mean I am disrespectful, it means I want to know why he used doubles and what role doubles might have played in his life, the good way or the bad way. I think I have proved many times that I respect the man very much.
For those that still want to put a lot of work in this, good luck. I'm through.
i understand Souza. people are like this on my The Kids have Doubles thread....
-
i understand Souza. people are like this on my The Kids have Doubles thread....
I wonder why...
Sorry, no meant to be rude, but let me see if I understand: you are able to say that a little person under a green outfit, in a blurry screenshot is for sure Michael in disguise, but these kids are not the real ones because Paris has one of her ears a bit rounder than in other pics?...
Did you read your thread and then stopped to think why are you (almost) the only one whom see these kids are not the real ones? Seriously, don't you find it weird? I'm not bashing, it's just an advice.
Sometimes is wise to take an step back in order to see things clearly, and listen to what other members are trying to show you.
-
i understand Souza. people are like this on my The Kids have Doubles thread....
I wonder why...
Sorry, no meant to be rude, but let me see if I understand: you are able to say that a little person under a green outfit, in a blurry screenshot is for sure Michael in disguise, but these kids are not the real ones because Paris has one of her ears a bit rounder than in other pics?...
Did you read your thread and then stopped to think why are you (almost) the only one whom see these kids are not the real ones? Seriously, don't you find it weird? I'm not bashing, it's just an advice.
Sometimes is wise to take an step back in order to see things clearly, and listen to what other members are trying to show you.
well, like i mentioned on my thread IF YOU read all of it. it was a Possiblity. and also if YOU BEEN READING MY THREAD, people are kind of considering the possiblity. there still one the fence about it but they said it is possible... thank you very much......... :roll:
-
Again, I dont think the kids had doubles. As far as MJ goes,, Im still on the fence about it, but I do not think those kids had doubles.
I appreciate you for sharing your finding's though. L.O.V.E
-
I love the morphing, great that some people know how to do that. I just wanted to add something about the chin cleft. My brother has at 57 a very marked cleft that was basicly invisible when he was a teen, but slowly grew. I'm wondering if that is the case with Michael. Katherine clearly has a cleft and it may be mostly a natural for MJ. Is there an interview where Michael clearly said he put in the cleft or is it hear-say?
I actually remember an interview where he said he had the cleft done, but would'nt know where to start looking for that interview...
he also admits to having the cleft done in moonwalk. that book is amazing.
-
I am wondering - couldn't Michael just have false teeth or implants.
He is 50 years old and definitely has lost a few teeth. So what if the COOL MOOF guy was actually him without his teeth or him chewing gum without his teeth. That would also change the jaw line.
The changing teeth could also be explained. We have to remember that at 50 many people do not have all their teeth left. Especially anyone who has consumed lots of medication or drank lots of cola.
-
I am wondering - couldn't Michael just have false teeth or implants.
He is 50 years old and definitely has lost a few teeth. So what if the COOL MOOF guy was actually him without his teeth or him chewing gum without his teeth. That would also change the jaw line.
The changing teeth could also be explained. We have to remember that at 50 many people do not have all their teeth left. Especially anyone who has consumed lots of medication or drank lots of cola.
I'm not trying to bash your theory so please don't think so but omg I cringed so bad when I read the part about chewing gum without teeth.
Ohhhhhh god goosebumps ....... I hate that feeling when I lost a tooth and my gums are exposed a lil. :shock: :shock: :shock:
-
I am wondering - couldn't Michael just have false teeth or implants.
He is 50 years old and definitely has lost a few teeth. So what if the COOL MOOF guy was actually him without his teeth or him chewing gum without his teeth. That would also change the jaw line.
The changing teeth could also be explained. We have to remember that at 50 many people do not have all their teeth left. Especially anyone who has consumed lots of medication or drank lots of cola.
Ouch - you must not be close to 50 years old :) I get a good chuckle because some of you younger people think that when you turn 50 you have one foot in the grave :) :)
I know plenty of people who still have all of their teeth well past 50. In fact I have a friend who is 48 and just had her first cavity. Really, this is true. Have you seen the Jackson's teeth? They all look like they have healthy teeth and we know that Michael practiced good dental hygiene. I seriously doubt that Michael didn't have his real teeth (or most of them anyway) and isn't it just rumor about him drinking cola? Do we see any pictures of him consuming soda? It goes against the story of him drinking carrot and beet juice every morning right?
-
I am wondering - couldn't Michael just have false teeth or implants.
He is 50 years old and definitely has lost a few teeth. So what if the COOL MOOF guy was actually him without his teeth or him chewing gum without his teeth. That would also change the jaw line.
The changing teeth could also be explained. We have to remember that at 50 many people do not have all their teeth left. Especially anyone who has consumed lots of medication or drank lots of cola.
I'm not trying to bash your theory so please don't think so but omg I cringed so bad when I read the part about chewing gum without teeth.
Ohhhhhh god goosebumps ....... I hate that feeling when I lost a tooth and my gums are exposed a lil. :shock: :shock: :shock:
lol.... I actually don't know if there were teeth missing in the chewing gum video but I read an analysis by a hoxer who said there was just one upper tooth.
Michael has had a lot of dental work in the past - rumors are that is how he got addicted to propofol - cos he would not do any procedures unless he was completely under. Also in '96 during the disposition (video on youtube) he takes a tablet because his mouth hurts from having done some dental work. That shows that he has had quite a bit of dental work, could be implants as it is not root canals, he does not have visible caps.
-
I think all the pics are Michael 100 %. No matter how he's been looking over the years, his eyes NEWER CHANGED ! That's why,I have allways believed it was Michael all the way. In all the pics I have seen of him, his eyes never changed.
-
You are correct Souza, this is a Hoax Investigation of his DEATH....Not his PLastic Surgeries.
Well lynn, the funny thing is that you fans all say he changed that much due to plastic surgeries, and Mo and I always said we think he didn't change that much at all, so what were you implying?
Well, they prefer to think he had a lot of plastic surgeries instead of thinking that he used doubles for some important reason... :roll: :roll:
-
You are correct Souza, this is a Hoax Investigation of his DEATH....Not his PLastic Surgeries.
Well lynn, the funny thing is that you fans all say he changed that much due to plastic surgeries, and Mo and I always said we think he didn't change that much at all, so what were you implying?
Well, they prefer to think he had a lot of plastic surgeries instead of thinking that he used doubles for some important reason... :roll: :roll:
I'm not someone who thinks he has lots of surgery at all, and I've always maintained that he barely changed at all- however, I think understanding between hoaxers on this particular topic is kind of murky, not everyone can totally understand how someone else might feel about this doubles and fakes business, so seeing as we don't really understand what this "very important reason" is for sure yet, could you please try to be more understanding of other hoaxer's feelings on this.?
-
You are correct Souza, this is a Hoax Investigation of his DEATH....Not his PLastic Surgeries.
Well lynn, the funny thing is that you fans all say he changed that much due to plastic surgeries, and Mo and I always said we think he didn't change that much at all, so what were you implying?
Well, they prefer to think he had a lot of plastic surgeries instead of thinking that he used doubles for some important reason... :roll: :roll:
I'm not someone who thinks he has lots of surgery at all, and I've always maintained that he barely changed at all- however, I think understanding between hoaxers on this particular topic is kind of murky, not everyone can totally understand how someone else might feel about this doubles and fakes business, so seeing as we don't really understand what this "very important reason" is for sure yet, could you please try to be more understanding of other hoaxer's feelings on this.?
PinkTopaz, again: this is the Michael Jackson Death Hoax INVESTIGATORS website. An investigator is an individual who actually conducts a clinical investigation. You have written many times that you're very upset and hurt by the thought of doubles being used, and you were advised several times to take a break and skip these threads for a while. I am totally willing to try and see things from your side and believe me, I do understand what you must be feeling. That however does not mean we have to stop investigating a subject which is, in the eyes of many, very realistic, and I don't think that we have to very very carefully formulate the way we present our thoughts and be afraid that every word we write might hurt a person who reads it. You know very well that we don't write about the doubles in order to hurt people, we are investigating.
Again, please take a break, because this way you are torturing yourself...
-
i wonder if this topic is amusing micheal..????...............we all have our opinion,but he could tell us all the answers........so put us out of our misery micheal please...this is getting very stressful......xxx
-
You are correct Souza, this is a Hoax Investigation of his DEATH....Not his PLastic Surgeries.
Well lynn, the funny thing is that you fans all say he changed that much due to plastic surgeries, and Mo and I always said we think he didn't change that much at all, so what were you implying?
Well, they prefer to think he had a lot of plastic surgeries instead of thinking that he used doubles for some important reason... :roll: :roll:
I'm not someone who thinks he has lots of surgery at all, and I've always maintained that he barely changed at all- however, I think understanding between hoaxers on this particular topic is kind of murky, not everyone can totally understand how someone else might feel about this doubles and fakes business, so seeing as we don't really understand what this "very important reason" is for sure yet, could you please try to be more understanding of other hoaxer's feelings on this.?
PinkTopaz, again: this is the Michael Jackson Death Hoax INVESTIGATORS website. An investigator is an individual who actually conducts a clinical investigation. You have written many times that you're very upset and hurt by the thought of doubles being used, and you were advised several times to take a break and skip these threads for a while. I am totally willing to try and see things from your side and believe me, I do understand what you must be feeling. That however does not mean we have to stop investigating a subject which is, in the eyes of many, very realistic, and I don't think that we have to very very carefully formulate the way we present our thoughts and be afraid that every word we write might hurt a person who reads it. You know very well that we don't write about the doubles in order to hurt people, we are investigating.
Again, please take a break, because this way you are torturing yourself...
Well I was addressing Puff, not you, seeing as she was very sarcastic and put an eye-rolling Smiley. Also, no matter how this is to me, I need to know about it and research it. I just wish others wouldn't be so callous to those who struggle with it, but I'm not adressing you.
-
You are correct Souza, this is a Hoax Investigation of his DEATH....Not his PLastic Surgeries.
Well lynn, the funny thing is that you fans all say he changed that much due to plastic surgeries, and Mo and I always said we think he didn't change that much at all, so what were you implying?
Well, they prefer to think he had a lot of plastic surgeries instead of thinking that he used doubles for some important reason... :roll: :roll:
I'm not someone who thinks he has lots of surgery at all, and I've always maintained that he barely changed at all- however, I think understanding between hoaxers on this particular topic is kind of murky, not everyone can totally understand how someone else might feel about this doubles and fakes business, so seeing as we don't really understand what this "very important reason" is for sure yet, could you please try to be more understanding of other hoaxer's feelings on this.?
PinkTopaz, again: this is the Michael Jackson Death Hoax INVESTIGATORS website. An investigator is an individual who actually conducts a clinical investigation. You have written many times that you're very upset and hurt by the thought of doubles being used, and you were advised several times to take a break and skip these threads for a while. I am totally willing to try and see things from your side and believe me, I do understand what you must be feeling. That however does not mean we have to stop investigating a subject which is, in the eyes of many, very realistic, and I don't think that we have to very very carefully formulate the way we present our thoughts and be afraid that every word we write might hurt a person who reads it. You know very well that we don't write about the doubles in order to hurt people, we are investigating.
Again, please take a break, because this way you are torturing yourself...
Well I was addressing Puff, not you, seeing as she was very sarcastic and put an eye-rolling Smiley. Also, no matter how this is to me, I need to know about it and research it. I just wish others wouldn't be so callous to those who struggle with it, but I'm not adressing you.
Well, Pink Topaz.. there are two options:
a.) He had a lot of plastic surgeries, because he changed a lot during the years ( but he can't change height with plastic surgeries)
b.) he used doubles.
I've just expressed my point of view and yes there are people who prefer to think he had a lot of plastic surgeries. That's all.
-
Michael said it himself ( I hope was the real M )He only had 2 surgeries
-
Michael said it himself ( I hope was the real M )He only had 2 surgeries
He said that to Bashir, and I know for sure that it's not true. I mean, he admitted in Moonwalk that he had his nose and chin done, and that book is from 1988. So I'm convinced that he had more surgery after that.
-
@Souza
If he feared his life, if he was planning this hoax, why is it so hard to believe he used doubles?
If he feared his life, and used doubles all the time, what's the point of faking his death? Using doubles would have been better solution instead of faking his death, while he (the real Mike) could have been disappeared with his kids, or without them, to make the thing believable.
-
@Souza
If he feared his life, if he was planning this hoax, why is it so hard to believe he used doubles?
If he feared his life, and used doubles all the time, what's the point of faking his death? Using doubles would have been better solution instead of faking his death, while he (the real Mike) could have been disappeared with his kids, or without them, to make the thing believable.
Then the doubles life would have been in danger... I might be wrong, but I don't think Michael considers another life less valuable than his own.
-
I am done. I think I have stated MULTIPLE times that this is a HAOX INVESTIGATION site and that I am not a fan. If you don't like that, I suggest a fanforum. I am here to unravel a mystery. That does not mean I am disrespectful, it means I want to know why he used doubles and what role doubles might have played in his life, the good way or the bad way. I think I have proved many times that I respect the man very much.
For those that still want to put a lot of work in this, good luck. I'm through.
I hope that wasn't direceted at what I said because I meant that I understand even more why you want to compare different pictures of Michael since your not a fan. Hope you didn't misunderstand, I was not stating that you're being disrespectful.
-
Too be honest I don't believe the double theory but I respect Mo and Souza for bringing this up though. I do believe that Michael had doubles but not as many as has been stated. For me it's pretty obvious he had doubles but not 10.000 doubles.
-
10000 doubles? Sorry I was just trying to imagine how the world would look like then... ;)
-
Thanks for the Donald Trump videos. I really appreciated the nice things he said about Michael. He said Michael was really, really smart and had suffered terribly in the last ten years. I think that anything is possible about the doubles. Only the people who really knew him could tell it was him. The really handsome photos are of him.
-
Michael said it himself ( I hope was the real M )He only had 2 surgeries
he also said he was Peter Pan and that he could fly. If you ask an alcoholic how many drinks they had today are they really gonna tell you? If you ask an over eater how many cookies they snuck last night, are they gonna tell you?
He told Bashir he had 2 NOSE surgeries...he didn't talk about the chin....
That's funny because his surgeon who fixed his nose using cartilage harvested from his ear, (reason why its "pointy" and reason for the incisions behind the ear) The nasal passages were collapsing and he had difficulty breathing. Maybe the better question to MJ would have been, "what do you consider a nose job?" Maybe fixing and maintenance don't count in his book?
-
Michael said it himself ( I hope was the real M )He only had 2 surgeries
he also said he was Peter Pan and that he could fly. If you ask an alcoholic how many drinks they had today are they really gonna tell you? If you ask an over eater how many cookies they snuck last night, are they gonna tell you?
He told Bashir he had 2 NOSE surgeries...he didn't talk about the chin....
That's funny because his surgeon who fixed his nose using cartilage harvested from his ear, (reason why its "pointy" and reason for the incisions behind the ear) The nasal passages were collapsing and he had difficulty breathing. Maybe the better question to MJ would have been, "what do you consider a nose job?" Maybe fixing and maintenance don't count in his book?
The difficulty breathing, was this in the invincible era ? cause he had a strange voice there, also when he was singing.
-
10000 doubles? Sorry I was just trying to imagine how the world would look like then... ;)
Hahaha :lol: Exactly. I was just saying that in general though.
-
Michael said it himself ( I hope was the real M )He only had 2 surgeries
he also said he was Peter Pan and that he could fly. If you ask an alcoholic how many drinks they had today are they really gonna tell you? If you ask an over eater how many cookies they snuck last night, are they gonna tell you?
He told Bashir he had 2 NOSE surgeries...he didn't talk about the chin....
That's funny because his surgeon who fixed his nose using cartilage harvested from his ear, (reason why its "pointy" and reason for the incisions behind the ear) The nasal passages were collapsing and he had difficulty breathing. Maybe the better question to MJ would have been, "what do you consider a nose job?" Maybe fixing and maintenance don't count in his book?[/quote]
thats what I always thought..he probably thought that since he was fixing something that was wrong not cosmetic...and maybe he only had 2 nose jobs that were strictly cosmetic!
-
Some people seem to feel that MJ could not have used doubles because that would have been an outright act of deception. Guess what? He is in the entertainment business and deception occurs all of the time. Action movies use stunt doubles. Does anyone really believe that a highly paid movie star is jumping out of planes or riding atop of a moving freight train?
It appears that many people take MJs acts of deception and his use of doubles very personal. If you attended a concert when a double was used the concert was still a good one. MJ or his double gave you your money's worth by putting on a great performance. Here's something to think about. I believe that many people are really upset that they may have been screaming at or dreaming about someone who wasn't MJ.That may be at the core of why so many people reject the idea of doubles. It is an uneasy and unnerving feeling to consider that the exciting man onstage was really some random guy who had surgeries and wore make up to give the illusion that he was MJ. Scary, aint it?
To use doubles, doesn't make MJ the boogie man or less of a person. He did what he had to do for his own reasons. The doubles theory can be accepted or rejected. However, there is very good reason to believe that doubles have played an important role in MJs career.
-
I'm not thinking heaps of doubles, but I'm convinced at least one .
-
Ok guys,.,,,,,,I think most of you know by now that Im on the fence about the doubles thing. BUT, I am very open minded and think it could be possible and I also think that some of us need to either stay away from these types of threads or if you MUST read them, then please dont say anything.
Mo and Souza work very hard on their research and I think we ALL owe them a little more respect then is being shown to them lately.
I personally find it VERY upsetting when I see someone has done some research and people who dont agree with it do nothing but bash and show aggressiveness towards other posters. How disrespectful can you be? Im not singleing anyone out, but I am speaking to a few of you.
I think its very interesting to learn of someone else's opinion and personal beliefs as to why they think something is the way it is. For example...the kids having doubles thread. I didnt bash Jacksonolgy for his/her research at all...I thought I was very respectful and I wasnt rude....as least I hope Jacksonolgy didnt think I was rude. I think I may have come off as being rude and Im sorry for that, but its only because I was surprised at the thread. So Jacksonology, Im sorry if I seemed nasty yesterday in your thread. I do not think the children have doubles...however I am very interested in why other people think they have doubles...
We need to start showing some respect people....cus frankly Im sick of all the fighting on here. Im sure you would appreciate respect as well, but you need to give it to recieve it.
-
Michael said it himself ( I hope was the real M )He only had 2 surgeries
he also said he was Peter Pan and that he could fly. If you ask an alcoholic how many drinks they had today are they really gonna tell you? If you ask an over eater how many cookies they snuck last night, are they gonna tell you?
He told Bashir he had 2 NOSE surgeries...he didn't talk about the chin....
Maybe fixing and maintenance don't count in his book?
No, as does not count for many people. He had 2 nose jobs, he is not liying.
-
Michael said it himself ( I hope was the real M )He only had 2 surgeries
he also said he was Peter Pan and that he could fly. If you ask an alcoholic how many drinks they had today are they really gonna tell you? If you ask an over eater how many cookies they snuck last night, are they gonna tell you?
He told Bashir he had 2 NOSE surgeries...he didn't talk about the chin....
Maybe fixing and maintenance don't count in his book?
No, as does not count for many people. He had 2 nose jobs, he is not liying.
Well... He had several nosejobs and the chin done before the '90's, so you think that he never had any surgery after that?
-
On the nose? 2 jobs, and the rest interventions not for cosmetic reasons, so cannot be caled nose jobs.
-
edit: called
-
On the nose? 2 jobs, and the rest interventions not for cosmetic reasons, so cannot be caled nose jobs.
Nose job for cosmetic reasons or surgery for other reasons.... They are surgery to me. And he definatly had more than 2, and not only his nose.
-
Well... He had several nosejobs and the chin done before the '90's, so you think that he never had any surgery after that?
No matter what kind of plastic surgery is performed, the distance between the inner corner of the eye and the top of the upper lip stays basically the same. Plastic surgery can't cause more than half an inch of extra length. That's IMPOSSIBLE.
Look at this comparison, the bottom layer is a pic of Mike at age 17, top layer is the mugshot. These pics are lines up by matching the inner and outer corners of the eyes. Before rejecting, note that it doesn't matter how many years are in between the pictures, the mouth never lowers like this due to aging:
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/mugshot01.jpg)
It's kinda strange that whatever Mike said his fans consider to be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, except when it comes to the procedures he underwent. When comparing photos of what Souza and I consider "The Real Deal" we don't see facial differences except for the nose and the added cleft.
-
And the morph.....
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes8.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes8.gif)
-
Amazing!
Didnt kow that Hoeflin could do that :mrgreen:
-
Amazing!
Didnt kow that Hoeflin could do that :mrgreen:
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
-
But he was 17, he wasn't full grown at that time? Boys have a longer grow period than girls, so imo his face grew a little after that picture.
-
But he was 17, he wasn't full grown at that time? Boys have a longer grow period than girls, so imo his face grew a little after that picture.
But he was 30 years old in the BAD era, I think you're full grown as a guy at that age (at least on the outside, we all know men never grow up). The BAD era pics do match, so how do you explain that.
-
I am glad the mug shot is not him. It was not flattering. He is much handsomer than that photo.
-
But he was 17, he wasn't full grown at that time? Boys have a longer grow period than girls, so imo his face grew a little after that picture.
But he was 30 years old in the BAD era, I think you're full grown as a guy at that age (at least on the outside, we all know men never grow up). The BAD era pics do match, so how do you explain that.
I was only talking about the pics that you posted above ;)
-
But he was 17, he wasn't full grown at that time? Boys have a longer grow period than girls, so imo his face grew a little after that picture.
But he was 30 years old in the BAD era, I think you're full grown as a guy at that age (at least on the outside, we all know men never grow up). The BAD era pics do match, so how do you explain that.
Next to that, humans are born with a relatively big head compared to the rest of their body and it stays in proportion while growing. A head doesn't grow as much as i.e. a leg does. A head reaches its final size around the age of 17-18. It's not that just your upper jaw all of a sudden starts growing bigger after the age of 17.
-
Moving the mouth to another place on the face...interesting :D
-
I am glad the mug shot is not him. It was not flattering. He is much handsomer than that photo.
The mugshot is him though
-
But he was 17, he wasn't full grown at that time? Boys have a longer grow period than girls, so imo his face grew a little after that picture.
But he was 30 years old in the BAD era, I think you're full grown as a guy at that age (at least on the outside, we all know men never grow up). The BAD era pics do match, so how do you explain that.
I was only talking about the pics that you posted above ;)
The pic used to compare the mugshot with is from the same shoot as the one we used to compare the "Liberian Girl/Come Together" pic with, and the others from the Bad era. Those MATCH, so if the mugshot is of the same person as the person on the pics of the 1977 shoot, they have to match also.
-
I am glad the mug shot is not him. It was not flattering. He is much handsomer than that photo.
The mugshot is him though
Since you're so sure of that, I'm sure you can tell me who's the guy on the other pics we compared and of which the faces DO match:
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes.gif)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes2.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes3.gif)
-
I am glad the mug shot is not him. It was not flattering. He is much handsomer than that photo.
The mugshot is him though
Since you're so sure of that, I'm sure you can tell me who's the guy on the other pics we compared and of which the faces DO match:
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes.gif)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes2.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes3.gif)
There all look like MJ to me
-
I am glad the mug shot is not him. It was not flattering. He is much handsomer than that photo.
The mugshot is him though
Since you're so sure of that, I'm sure you can tell me who's the guy on the other pics we compared and of which the faces DO match:
There all look like MJ to me
So all mighty Magical Mike can not only grow and shrink and change body shape, he can also move his mouth up and down........... Oh my, I already had a lot of respect for him, but this new feature really proves that when it comes to Michael Jackson, the sky isn't the limit.........
-
I am glad the mug shot is not him. It was not flattering. He is much handsomer than that photo.
The mugshot is him though
Since you're so sure of that, I'm sure you can tell me who's the guy on the other pics we compared and of which the faces DO match:
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes.gif)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes2.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/Mikes3.gif)
There all look like MJ to me
(http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e167/wondernat/shs_crazySmiley1.jpg)
-
Whatever
-
The mugshot is odd to me...the mouth? Hmmm.........thats a little strange. Im still 50-50...but Im now starting to see!!
-
Whatever
No way "whatever", that's the easy way out. Explain to me why his mouth in the mug shot is placed at least half an inch lower than in the other comparison pics we posted while layered up with pics from the same shoot, or post a matching comparison pic to prove your point. I'm done with the baseless comments.
-
Whatever
No way "whatever", that's the easy way out. Explain to me why his mouth in the mug shot is placed at least half an inch lower than in the other comparison pics we posted while layered up with pics from the same shoot, or post a matching comparison pic to prove your point. I'm done with the baseless comments.
I'm tired and can't be bothered to argue. Whatever you say, I'll agree with.
-
Mo , Souza ..Can u do the same with Dangerous era ?
-
Whatever
No way "whatever", that's the easy way out. Explain to me why his mouth in the mug shot is placed at least half an inch lower than in the other comparison pics we posted while layered up with pics from the same shoot, or post a matching comparison pic to prove your point. I'm done with the baseless comments.
I'm tired and can't be bothered to argue. Whatever you say, I'll agree with.
Unbelievable... :roll:
-
I still don't see it... I'm not very original now, but the eyes don't lie. They do it for me. People's faces can change, and I read somewhere that some people when they get older, their face gets longer too...
If I can find it, I will post it ofcourse.
Please take a look at this link, the pictures are not good quality, but who do you think are doubles? Because to me it's all Michael...
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html)
-
Mo , Souza ..Can u do the same with Dangerous era ?
We're working on that era, but please know that making these comparisons take up a lot of time so please be patient...
-
Mo , Souza ..Can u do the same with Dangerous era ?
We're working on that era, but please know that making these comparisons take up a lot of time so please be patient...
More moonwalking mouths coming up?
(http://www.businessjihad.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/denture.jpg)
-
I still don't see it... I'm not very original now, but the eyes don't lie. They do it for me. People's faces can change, and I read somewhere that some people when they get older, their face gets longer too...
If I can find it, I will post it ofcourse.
Please take a look at this link, the pictures are not good quality, but who do you think are doubles? Because to me it's all Michael...
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html)
OMG I guess you're right! I never noticed that but Brad Pitt's face got longer as well :o :
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/bp.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/bpold.jpg)
-
I still don't see it... I'm not very original now, but the eyes don't lie. They do it for me. People's faces can change, and I read somewhere that some people when they get older, their face gets longer too...
If I can find it, I will post it ofcourse.
Please take a look at this link, the pictures are not good quality, but who do you think are doubles? Because to me it's all Michael...
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html)
OMG I guess you're right! I never noticed that but Brad Pitt's face got longer as well :o :
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/bp.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/bpold.jpg)
I knew I was right!!!!
8-)
-
I still don't see it... I'm not very original now, but the eyes don't lie. They do it for me. People's faces can change, and I read somewhere that some people when they get older, their face gets longer too...
If I can find it, I will post it ofcourse.
Please take a look at this link, the pictures are not good quality, but who do you think are doubles? Because to me it's all Michael...
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html)
OMG I guess you're right! I never noticed that but Brad Pitt's face got longer as well :o :
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/bp.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/bpold.jpg)
I knew I was right!!!!
8-)
Ik hoop echt dat je een grapje maakt.....
-
I still don't see it... I'm not very original now, but the eyes don't lie. They do it for me. People's faces can change, and I read somewhere that some people when they get older, their face gets longer too...
If I can find it, I will post it ofcourse.
Please take a look at this link, the pictures are not good quality, but who do you think are doubles? Because to me it's all Michael...
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html)
OMG I guess you're right! I never noticed that but Brad Pitt's face got longer as well :o :
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/bp.jpg)
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/bpold.jpg)
I knew I was right!!!!
8-)
Ik hoop echt dat je een grapje maakt.....
Ik maak geen grapje hoor.......
:lol: Sorry Souza, tuurlijk was het mijn antwoord op jouw grap ;)
-
Back to earth, has anyone watched my link with pictures from different era's?
I'm curious what people think about them, who's the real MJ or not.
-
Back to earth, has anyone watched my link with pictures from different era's?
I'm curious what people think about them, who's the real MJ or not.
What link?
-
I know im being a lil pushy but can you put lines to the camoarisions.. it makes it easier to see.. :oops: :oops:
just for future ones..if your working on them..
-
I know im being a lil pushy but can you put lines to the camoarisions.. it makes it easier to see.. :oops: :oops:
just for future ones..if your working on them..
Just put the arrow of your mouse on the highest part of the upper lip on the 1977 photo. When the photo has morphed into the mug shot look at where your mouse then points at. That'll do the same as adding lines.
-
Hoi Mo and Souza, when I look at the first picture of Mike I see that he has the scarve on his cheek but also a tiny birthmark on the same side of his face just on the edge of his upperlip. You can see it better on the morphed picture. Did you take that also in consideration to find a picture of the real Mike. I found some pictures with the birthmark on young Mike, Mike the same age as the picture you used, Mike in the bad era and one from 2008. I show you one example to show you what I mean. I think that the pictures that you choose are Mike.
(http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/563/004vf.jpg)
-
I know im being a lil pushy but can you put lines to the camoarisions.. it makes it easier to see.. :oops: :oops:
just for future ones..if your working on them..
Just put the arrow of your mouse on the highest part of the upper lip on the 1977 photo. When the photo has morphed into the mug shot look at where your mouse then points at. That'll do the same as adding lines.
Thanks... I also mean distances between eyes and such things just for future pictures you'll use, I know you are working on more, so just to make things a lil clearer, if you could :oops:
thanks in advance...you do amazing work and research
-
arnie said he did work on his face and had been working on his face all the time, with his problem spots etc
-
arnie said he did work on his face and had been working on his face all the time, with his problem spots etc
AGAIN: No matter what kind of plastic surgery is performed, the distance between the inner corner of the eye and the top of the upper lip stays basically the same. Plastic surgery can't cause more than half an inch of extra length in between the eyes and the upper lip. That's IMPOSSIBLE.
-
Thinking about the mugshot. Surely they must have arrested the real Michael because they'd have to take his fingerprints as well, if that isn't the real Michael how do we explain that? I do agree that the pic seems a bit odd but the eyes are exactly the same to me which is the most important thing (to me at least). About the mouth being lower, I personally think that's due to the plastic surgery he had on his nose (a pointier nose makes the distance appear bigger) and his facial expression. He looked surprised, if you know what I mean? I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.
Note that I'm not trying to discredit your research I'm just stating my opinion and explainig why.
-
To people interested on the double thing I recomend this book:
The mask and the face - E.H. Gombrich:
The perception of physiognomic likeness in life and art.
Very interesting thoughts from this genius arts historian, on faces perception, psychology of perception, and the interpretation of images. From my old college days...
-
Thinking about the mugshot. Surely they must have arrested the real Michael because they'd have to take his fingerprints as well, if that isn't the real Michael how do we explain that? I do agree that the pic seems a bit odd but the eyes are exactly the same to me which is the most important thing (to me at least). About the mouth being lower, I personally think that's due to the plastic surgery he had on his nose (a pointier nose makes the distance appear bigger) and his facial expression. He looked surprised, if you know what I mean? I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.
Note that I'm not trying to discredit your research I'm just stating my opinion and explainig why.
"I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.". You got that right alovesmichael - it made the BOTTOM PART part of your face appear longer. I'm not talking about the bottom part, but the part as from the upper lip all the way up to the eyes. That distance does not change due to surgery, you would have to add bone to achieve that. It may appear differently, but when layering up two pictures taken from the same angle, they have to match. If it's not a match, then it's not the same person.
-
I just wondered if someone could compare the mj in the final part of bashir interview with
the mj holding hands with gavin.There just seems something different about those two. I would do it myself but i am hopeless with computers.
-
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html)
Souza, I mean that link.
-
Thinking about the mugshot. Surely they must have arrested the real Michael because they'd have to take his fingerprints as well, if that isn't the real Michael how do we explain that? I do agree that the pic seems a bit odd but the eyes are exactly the same to me which is the most important thing (to me at least). About the mouth being lower, I personally think that's due to the plastic surgery he had on his nose (a pointier nose makes the distance appear bigger) and his facial expression. He looked surprised, if you know what I mean? I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.
Note that I'm not trying to discredit your research I'm just stating my opinion and explainig why.
"I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.". You got that right alovesmichael - it made the BOTTOM PART part of your face appear longer. I'm not talking about the bottom part, but the part as from the upper lip all the way up to the eyes. That distance does not change due to surgery, you would have to add bone to achieve that. It may appear differently, but when layering up two pictures taken from the same angle, they have to match. If it's not a match, then it's not the same person.
I see what your saying, however I include the lips in being lower as well due to the facial expression (in my observation). I also think it's difficult to just compare pictures because it's easy (for those who know how to do it :D ) to match faces of different people and adjust it to make it look like a match (not saying you did just that it´s possible). Idk, to me it's de Michael but trying to keep an open mind...
-
Thinking about the mugshot. Surely they must have arrested the real Michael because they'd have to take his fingerprints as well, if that isn't the real Michael how do we explain that? I do agree that the pic seems a bit odd but the eyes are exactly the same to me which is the most important thing (to me at least). About the mouth being lower, I personally think that's due to the plastic surgery he had on his nose (a pointier nose makes the distance appear bigger) and his facial expression. He looked surprised, if you know what I mean? I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.
Note that I'm not trying to discredit your research I'm just stating my opinion and explainig why.
"I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.". You got that right alovesmichael - it made the BOTTOM PART part of your face appear longer. I'm not talking about the bottom part, but the part as from the upper lip all the way up to the eyes. That distance does not change due to surgery, you would have to add bone to achieve that. It may appear differently, but when layering up two pictures taken from the same angle, they have to match. If it's not a match, then it's not the same person.
I see what your saying, however I include the lips in being lower as well due to the facial expression (in my observation). I also think it's difficult to just compare pictures because it's easy (for those who know how to do it :D ) to match faces of different people and adjust it to make it look like a match (not saying you did just that it´s possible). Idk, to me it's de Michael but trying to keep an open mind...
Well, I'm pretty much sure that Mo and Souza didn't alter the pics, they only compared them ;)
-
{ Jackson 5 Era } ( 1969-1975 )
{ The Jacksons Era } ( 1976-1979 )
{ Off The Wall Era } ( 1979-1981 )
{ Thriller Era } ( 1982-1985 )
{ Bad Era } ( 1987-1989 )
{ Dangerous Era } ( 1991-1993 )
{ History Era } ( 1994-1997 )
{ Invincible Era } ( 2001-2003 )
{ This Is It Era } ( 2009-2010 )
The History era EARS are normal...but the EARS in other eras are pointy or mangled. Would it be too much trouble to ask one of the computer Geniuses for an EAR comparative by era???
I'm an Excel spreadsheet queen but otherwise, my computer skills aren't so great.
:oops:
-
No, I don't believe they did just saying that it's possible and that it's difficult to rely on picture comparisons. And not just because of alterations but also just the fact that the same person could look like another person in a different picture anyway, especially if there's 40 years between the pictures.
-
{ Jackson 5 Era } ( 1969-1975 )
{ The Jacksons Era } ( 1976-1979 )
{ Off The Wall Era } ( 1979-1981 )
{ Thriller Era } ( 1982-1985 )
{ Bad Era } ( 1987-1989 )
{ Dangerous Era } ( 1991-1993 )
{ History Era } ( 1994-1997 )
{ Invincible Era } ( 2001-2003 )
{ This Is It Era } ( 2009-2010 )
The History era EARS are normal...but the EARS in other eras are pointy or mangled. Would it be too much trouble to ask one of the computer Geniuses for an EAR comparative by era???
I'm an Excel spreadsheet queen but otherwise, my computer skills aren't so great.
:oops:
In case no one has time to make an EAR chart, Souza's Michael Morph pictures prove that his EARS lobes changed over the years...yet his HIStory EAR lobes are identical to the 17 year old Michael.
Michael's eyes are mesmerizing. We see those MJ eyes and we beLIEve that we are looking at Michael.
Like the Ghosts make-up, I think that special MJ contact lens were made. I think that the success of the MJ doubles can be attributed to his doubles having plastic surgery, special contact lens, facial masks, dance lessons, etc....
Doubles would explain many contradictions like eye glasses, no eye glasses, signature memory problems, being in two different places on the same date, etc...
I wondered if a double signed his Will appointing Branca as Co-Executor???
Your thoughts?
:ugeek:
-
{ Jackson 5 Era } ( 1969-1975 )
{ The Jacksons Era } ( 1976-1979 )
{ Off The Wall Era } ( 1979-1981 )
{ Thriller Era } ( 1982-1985 )
{ Bad Era } ( 1987-1989 )
{ Dangerous Era } ( 1991-1993 )
{ History Era } ( 1994-1997 )
{ Invincible Era } ( 2001-2003 )
{ This Is It Era } ( 2009-2010 )
The History era EARS are normal...but the EARS in other eras are pointy or mangled. Would it be too much trouble to ask one of the computer Geniuses for an EAR comparative by era???
I'm an Excel spreadsheet queen but otherwise, my computer skills aren't so great.
:oops:
In case no one has time to make an EAR chart, Souza's Michael Morph pictures prove that his EARS lobes changed over the years...yet his HIStory EAR lobes are identical to the 17 year old Michael.
Michael's eyes are mesmerizing. We see those MJ eyes and we beLIEve that we are looking at Michael.
Like the Ghosts make-up, I think that special MJ contact lens were made. I think that the success of the MJ doubles can be attributed to his doubles having plastic surgery, special contact lens, facial masks, dance lessons, etc....
Doubles would explain many contradictions like eye glasses, no eye glasses, signature memory problems, being in two different places on the same date, etc...
I wondered if a double signed his Will appointing Branca as Co-Executor???
Your thoughts?
:ugeek:
nuts
-
What year was there capability to photoshop and distort pictures? Could there have been deliberate distortion of MJ's mugshot to increase his bizarre appearance for the courts and public? The LAPD had already stooped to dishonest means. Michael's day before visitors attest the shot didn't look like him. I still think it's Michael and that he is making a "face".
-
{ Jackson 5 Era } ( 1969-1975 )
{ The Jacksons Era } ( 1976-1979 )
{ Off The Wall Era } ( 1979-1981 )
{ Thriller Era } ( 1982-1985 )
{ Bad Era } ( 1987-1989 )
{ Dangerous Era } ( 1991-1993 )
{ History Era } ( 1994-1997 )
{ Invincible Era } ( 2001-2003 )
{ This Is It Era } ( 2009-2010 )
The History era EARS are normal...but the EARS in other eras are pointy or mangled. Would it be too much trouble to ask one of the computer Geniuses for an EAR comparative by era???
I'm an Excel spreadsheet queen but otherwise, my computer skills aren't so great.
:oops:
In case no one has time to make an EAR chart, Souza's Michael Morph pictures prove that his EARS lobes changed over the years...yet his HIStory EAR lobes are identical to the 17 year old Michael.
Michael's eyes are mesmerizing. We see those MJ eyes and we beLIEve that we are looking at Michael.
Like the Ghosts make-up, I think that special MJ contact lens were made. I think that the success of the MJ doubles can be attributed to his doubles having plastic surgery, special contact lens, facial masks, dance lessons, etc....
Doubles would explain many contradictions like eye glasses, no eye glasses, signature memory problems, being in two different places on the same date, etc...
I wondered if a double signed his Will appointing Branca as Co-Executor???
Your thoughts?
:ugeek:
I think those are very good thoughts, especially when it comes to signatures. The other day I posted a file containing 14 signatures taken from official documents and letters. In my opinion, these signatures are not of one and the same person, as there are too many differences in them.
Link: viewtopic.php?f=99&t=8297&p=140337#p140337 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=99&t=8297&p=140337#p140337)
This brings up the thought "did all doubles have good intentions?".
-
{ Jackson 5 Era } ( 1969-1975 )
{ The Jacksons Era } ( 1976-1979 )
{ Off The Wall Era } ( 1979-1981 )
{ Thriller Era } ( 1982-1985 )
{ Bad Era } ( 1987-1989 )
{ Dangerous Era } ( 1991-1993 )
{ History Era } ( 1994-1997 )
{ Invincible Era } ( 2001-2003 )
{ This Is It Era } ( 2009-2010 )
The History era EARS are normal...but the EARS in other eras are pointy or mangled. Would it be too much trouble to ask one of the computer Geniuses for an EAR comparative by era???
I'm an Excel spreadsheet queen but otherwise, my computer skills aren't so great.
:oops:
In case no one has time to make an EAR chart, Souza's Michael Morph pictures prove that his EARS lobes changed over the years...yet his HIStory EAR lobes are identical to the 17 year old Michael.
Michael's eyes are mesmerizing. We see those MJ eyes and we beLIEve that we are looking at Michael.
Like the Ghosts make-up, I think that special MJ contact lens were made. I think that the success of the MJ doubles can be attributed to his doubles having plastic surgery, special contact lens, facial masks, dance lessons, etc....
Doubles would explain many contradictions like eye glasses, no eye glasses, signature memory problems, being in two different places on the same date, etc...
I wondered if a double signed his Will appointing Branca as Co-Executor???
Your thoughts?
:ugeek:
I think those are very good thoughts, especially when it comes to signatures. The other day I posted a file containing 14 signatures taken from official documents and letters. In my opinion, these signatures are not of one and the same person, as there are too many differences in them.
Link: viewtopic.php?f=99&t=8297&p=140337#p140337 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=99&t=8297&p=140337#p140337)
This brings up the thought "did all doubles have good intentions?".
Thank you, I had not read that thread and was shocked by your signature comparative. Like the EARS, those signatures are different. I was reminded of Michael’s genuine surprise at his signature on some paperwork.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ssyxkxvHhE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ssyxkxvHhE)
The various signatures beg the ‘intention’ question and opens a whole new chapter. Michael was panicked and scared for reason. Did a ‘doubles revolt’ contribute to his financial ‘troubles’? Did a ‘terminally ill double’ go vindictive before he passed? Did a double sign his Will?
Your ‘twin theory’ would work better as a ‘doubles theory’. Michael married DR shortly after his divorce LMP. Ever wonder if the ‘same’ Michael married DR and LMP? Was Grace Rwaramba constantly re-hired because of what she knew? The Eyes Wide Open court case will be interesting.
I find solace in the fact that Katherine asked for a third autopsy for a reason and then suddenly stopped contesting the Will. The true Michael lives.
Michael is the Cheshire Cat…appear…disappear…appear…disappear…
:?:
-
{ Jackson 5 Era } ( 1969-1975 )
{ The Jacksons Era } ( 1976-1979 )
{ Off The Wall Era } ( 1979-1981 )
{ Thriller Era } ( 1982-1985 )
{ Bad Era } ( 1987-1989 )
{ Dangerous Era } ( 1991-1993 )
{ History Era } ( 1994-1997 )
{ Invincible Era } ( 2001-2003 )
{ This Is It Era } ( 2009-2010 )
The History era EARS are normal...but the EARS in other eras are pointy or mangled. Would it be too much trouble to ask one of the computer Geniuses for an EAR comparative by era???
I'm an Excel spreadsheet queen but otherwise, my computer skills aren't so great.
:oops:
In case no one has time to make an EAR chart, Souza's Michael Morph pictures prove that his EARS lobes changed over the years...yet his HIStory EAR lobes are identical to the 17 year old Michael.
Michael's eyes are mesmerizing. We see those MJ eyes and we beLIEve that we are looking at Michael.
Like the Ghosts make-up, I think that special MJ contact lens were made. I think that the success of the MJ doubles can be attributed to his doubles having plastic surgery, special contact lens, facial masks, dance lessons, etc....
Doubles would explain many contradictions like eye glasses, no eye glasses, signature memory problems, being in two different places on the same date, etc...
I wondered if a double signed his Will appointing Branca as Co-Executor???
Your thoughts?
:ugeek:
I think those are very good thoughts, especially when it comes to signatures. The other day I posted a file containing 14 signatures taken from official documents and letters. In my opinion, these signatures are not of one and the same person, as there are too many differences in them.
Link: viewtopic.php?f=99&t=8297&p=140337#p140337 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=99&t=8297&p=140337#p140337)
This brings up the thought "did all doubles have good intentions?".
Thank you, I had not read that thread and was shocked by your signature comparative. Like the EARS, those signatures are different. I was reminded of Michael’s genuine surprise at his signature on some paperwork.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ssyxkxvHhE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ssyxkxvHhE)
The various signatures beg the ‘intention’ question and opens a whole new chapter. Michael was panicked and scared for reason. Did a ‘doubles revolt’ contribute to his financial ‘troubles’? Did a ‘terminally ill double’ go vindictive before he passed? Did a double sign his Will?
Your ‘twin theory’ would work better as a ‘doubles theory’. Michael married DR shortly after his divorce LMP. Ever wonder if the ‘same’ Michael married DR and LMP? Was Grace Rwaramba constantly re-hired because of what she knew? The Eyes Wide Open court case will be interesting.
I find solace in the fact that Katherine asked for a third autopsy for a reason and then suddenly stopped contesting the Will. The true Michael lives.
Michael is the Cheshire Cat…appear…disappear…appear…disappear…
:?:
This is exactly why we think the double issue is so important, thank you. I think the real deal is alive and kicking as well.
-
{ Jackson 5 Era } ( 1969-1975 )
{ The Jacksons Era } ( 1976-1979 )
{ Off The Wall Era } ( 1979-1981 )
{ Thriller Era } ( 1982-1985 )
{ Bad Era } ( 1987-1989 )
{ Dangerous Era } ( 1991-1993 )
{ History Era } ( 1994-1997 )
{ Invincible Era } ( 2001-2003 )
{ This Is It Era } ( 2009-2010 )
The History era EARS are normal...but the EARS in other eras are pointy or mangled. Would it be too much trouble to ask one of the computer Geniuses for an EAR comparative by era???
I'm an Excel spreadsheet queen but otherwise, my computer skills aren't so great.
:oops:
In case no one has time to make an EAR chart, Souza's Michael Morph pictures prove that his EARS lobes changed over the years...yet his HIStory EAR lobes are identical to the 17 year old Michael.
Michael's eyes are mesmerizing. We see those MJ eyes and we beLIEve that we are looking at Michael.
Like the Ghosts make-up, I think that special MJ contact lens were made. I think that the success of the MJ doubles can be attributed to his doubles having plastic surgery, special contact lens, facial masks, dance lessons, etc....
Doubles would explain many contradictions like eye glasses, no eye glasses, signature memory problems, being in two different places on the same date, etc...
I wondered if a double signed his Will appointing Branca as Co-Executor???
Your thoughts?
:ugeek:
I think those are very good thoughts, especially when it comes to signatures. The other day I posted a file containing 14 signatures taken from official documents and letters. In my opinion, these signatures are not of one and the same person, as there are too many differences in them.
Link: http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpb ... 37#p140337 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=99&t=8297&p=140337#p140337)
This brings up the thought "did all doubles have good intentions?".
Thank you, I had not read that thread and was shocked by your signature comparative. Like the EARS, those signatures are different. I was reminded of Michael’s genuine surprise at his signature on some paperwork.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ssyxkxvHhE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ssyxkxvHhE)
The various signatures beg the ‘intention’ question and opens a whole new chapter. Michael was panicked and scared for reason. Did a ‘doubles revolt’ contribute to his financial ‘troubles’? Did a ‘terminally ill double’ go vindictive before he passed? Did a double sign his Will?
Your ‘twin theory’ would work better as a ‘doubles theory’. Michael married DR shortly after his divorce LMP. Ever wonder if the ‘same’ Michael married DR and LMP? Was Grace Rwaramba constantly re-hired because of what she knew? The Eyes Wide Open court case will be interesting.
I find solace in the fact that Katherine asked for a third autopsy for a reason and then suddenly stopped contesting the Will. The true Michael lives.
Michael is the Cheshire Cat…appear…disappear…appear…disappear…
:?:
This is exactly why we think the double issue is so important, thank you. I think the real deal is alive and kicking as well.
What do you mean by that court case?
-
@PinkTopaz
LMP and DR won't risk perjury so their testimony will be interesting.
:!:
-
White Orchid, You mentioned if LMP and Debbie were married to the same MJ. I'm so interested in that . I don't believethat they were. My opinion, and I admit it is only an opinion, the real deal was married to LMP. And a double who seemed to have a somewhat feminine aura or atmosphere about him was married to Debbie.
-
White Orchid, You mentioned if LMP and Debbie were married to the same MJ. I'm so interested in that . I don't believethat they were. My opinion, and I admit it is only an opinion, the real deal was married to LMP. And a double who seemed to have a somewhat feminine aura or atmosphere about him was married to Debbie.
100%, I agree with you!
Aside from the differences in appearance, did you notice that the LMP 'real deal' never wore masks....yet the DR-MJ always wore a mask.....
I think there are at least 3 or 4 doubles....wondering if one of the doubles had a December revolt...?
:D
-
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v314/damby/mjnlisa.jpg)
(http://www.independent.ie/multimedia/archive/00346/Michael-35_Getty_346162s.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3401/3673277346_14987c545b.jpg)
He did use the surgical mask when he was with LMP, unless she liked to hang out with the impostor also?
-
those pics are of lisa and mike. no doubt.
-
(http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/02_01/debirowe5R_468x551.jpg)
looks like Michael's nails...
-
Sure they look like his nails, because it's him...
People, think about the children... If a fake Michael married to Debbie, that would mean that the children are from the fake guy too....
-
Sure they look like his nails, because it's him...
People, think about the children... If a fake Michael married to Debbie, that would mean that the children are from the fake guy too....
Yeah I def believe it's Michael just posted it for others to see Michael not wearing a mask when with Debbie.
-
Remember the birth certificates ! Michael Joseph Jackson was the father and when the real Michael was Michael Joe.....
I was so sure that there where more then one doubles and today i surch about pictures at mjjpictures from the early years untill the end....so diffenrent faces, auras, height....but i am so scared....the same handlines....i had the inside of his left hand....it was so weird that this all have to be one person ?
My eyes hurts....maybee i cant watch and i am wrong....untill then i would say doubles, sure, but now...i am speechless and sometimes it all seems like a big big fake to make us all nuts.
The last oictures from mjjpictures are from the 16.June. You can see nothing from Michael, only his hands with so bad looking fingernails...long and not manicured....why has he always so long nails ? He was so perfect styled, but not the nails....
-
Remember the birth certificates ! Michael Joseph Jackson was the father and when the real Michael was Michael Joe.....
Ofcourse I remember them, but who says that they are real?
And who was responsible for them to leak out?
-
LOL, thank you so much for posting the mask pictures! I wrote 'never' based on my memory so the fault was mine! You keep me on my toes, thank you!
There is a school of thought that Elvis used doubles so I do not discount that LMP had opinions or input about MJ's use of doubles. And yes, I believe that LMP would support MJ's use of doubles.
I use the EARS as a guide to identify MJ because of the plastic surgery confusions, contact lens could be made to replicate his eyes, and fingernails can be stained.
With due respect as I don't want to offend anyone, but I think these pictures are MJ doubles because the EARS don't match the 17 year old/History MJ ears.
To respond to another post, I believe that Prince, Paris, and Blanket are MJ's children.
Like many others, I feel very strongly that Michael is alive and is in total control.
:ugeek:
-
I still don't see it... I'm not very original now, but the eyes don't lie. They do it for me. People's faces can change, and I read somewhere that some people when they get older, their face gets longer too...
If I can find it, I will post it ofcourse.
Please take a look at this link, the pictures are not good quality, but who do you think are doubles? Because to me it's all Michael...
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html)
I wonder about the picture from November 2002, Trial Avram/Jackson.
In November Michael came to Berlin to the Bambi award, from 18.-22.November.
Bashit was there too.... :evil:
In this few days in Berlin Michael looks very different....one higher with longer hair.
(http://www.bild.de/BILD/unterhaltung/leute/fotos/j/jackson-michael/2009-06-26-wandlung-black-to-white/2002-bambi-jackson-231282-hoch,templateId=renderScaled,property=Bild,height=349.jpg)
(http://www.arcor.de/iimages/58/art_440x330_WlSCZquwZorArIRVhmGq8mKClKWEiQ==.jpg)
(http://arjunpuri.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/24.jpg)
http://static.rp-online.de/layout/showb ... 0Bambi.jpg (http://static.rp-online.de/layout/showbilder/45689-Michael%20Jackson%202002%20Bambi.jpg)
and one smaller with shorter hair :
(http://www.jackson.ch/Bilder00er/berlin_bambi8.jpg)
(http://www.derwesten.de/omg/26550-648001012/530_530_0024450718-0054227314.JPG.jpg)
(http://www.noows.de/gallery/Bildergalerie/Leben_08/MIchael_Jackson/500/michael06.jpg)
Pictires from the Avram trial :
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_qUFDMUpk9jE/SkdP69BK22I/AAAAAAAAVgQ/kyIFsxnGK0A/s400/44-283uNsF.jpg)
(http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/jun2009/1/1/image-7-for-michael-jackson-s-story-wilderness-years-gallery-122263309.jpg)
very swollen fingers
I don't know what ...i am speechless.
The children are in germany only seen with the long hair Michael...who was also the only one who was interviewed by Bashit !
In the Bashit documentary was very much showed from germany...from a charity and a visit to a zo, but the Bambi wasn't mentioned...weired ?????????? :geek:
-
Remember the birth certificates ! Michael Joseph Jackson was the father and when the real Michael was Michael Joe.....
Ofcourse I remember them, but who says that they are real?
And who was responsible for them to leak out?
I think the same, but we always had what the media hs given us.....any article is more shit than true, any pictures can be photoshopped...
We don't know if we see Michael or a double.
We know nothing....it's all possibilities....entertainment ? :shock:
-
I still don't see it... I'm not very original now, but the eyes don't lie. They do it for me. People's faces can change, and I read somewhere that some people when they get older, their face gets longer too...
If I can find it, I will post it ofcourse.
Please take a look at this link, the pictures are not good quality, but who do you think are doubles? Because to me it's all Michael...
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html)
I wonder about the picture from November 2002, Trial Avram/Jackson.
In November Michael came to Berlin to the Bambi award, from 18.-22.November.
Bashit was there too.... :evil:
In this few days in Berlin Michael looks very different....one higher with longer hair.
(http://www.bild.de/BILD/unterhaltung/leute/fotos/j/jackson-michael/2009-06-26-wandlung-black-to-white/2002-bambi-jackson-231282-hoch,templateId=renderScaled,property=Bild,height=349.jpg)
(http://www.arcor.de/iimages/58/art_440x330_WlSCZquwZorArIRVhmGq8mKClKWEiQ==.jpg)
(http://arjunpuri.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/24.jpg)
http://static.rp-online.de/layout/showb ... 0Bambi.jpg (http://static.rp-online.de/layout/showbilder/45689-Michael%20Jackson%202002%20Bambi.jpg)
and one smaller with shorter hair :
(http://www.jackson.ch/Bilder00er/berlin_bambi8.jpg)
(http://www.derwesten.de/omg/26550-648001012/530_530_0024450718-0054227314.JPG.jpg)
(http://www.noows.de/gallery/Bildergalerie/Leben_08/MIchael_Jackson/500/michael06.jpg)
Pictires from the Avram trial :
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_qUFDMUpk9jE/SkdP69BK22I/AAAAAAAAVgQ/kyIFsxnGK0A/s400/44-283uNsF.jpg)
(http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/jun2009/1/1/image-7-for-michael-jackson-s-story-wilderness-years-gallery-122263309.jpg)
very swollen fingers
I don't know what ...i am speechless.
The children are in germany only seen with the long hair Michael...who was also the only one who was interviewed by Bashit !
In the Bashit documentary was very much showed from germany...from a charity and a visit to a zo, but the Bambi wasn't mentioned...weired ?????????? :geek:
I was thinking the same that his hands looked swollen.
-
Lupus
-
Also take into consideration that we see MJ with alot of different hairstyles (wigs)....
-
Lupus
Yes.. and arthiritis in his hands. :cry:
-
I still don't see it... I'm not very original now, but the eyes don't lie. They do it for me. People's faces can change, and I read somewhere that some people when they get older, their face gets longer too...
If I can find it, I will post it ofcourse.
Please take a look at this link, the pictures are not good quality, but who do you think are doubles? Because to me it's all Michael...
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Jackson.html)
I wonder about the picture from November 2002, Trial Avram/Jackson.
In November Michael came to Berlin to the Bambi award, from 18.-22.November.
Bashit was there too.... :evil:
In this few days in Berlin Michael looks very different....one higher with longer hair.
(http://www.bild.de/BILD/unterhaltung/leute/fotos/j/jackson-michael/2009-06-26-wandlung-black-to-white/2002-bambi-jackson-231282-hoch,templateId=renderScaled,property=Bild,height=349.jpg)
(http://www.arcor.de/iimages/58/art_440x330_WlSCZquwZorArIRVhmGq8mKClKWEiQ==.jpg)
(http://arjunpuri.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/24.jpg)
http://static.rp-online.de/layout/showb ... 0Bambi.jpg (http://static.rp-online.de/layout/showbilder/45689-Michael%20Jackson%202002%20Bambi.jpg)
and one smaller with shorter hair :
(http://www.jackson.ch/Bilder00er/berlin_bambi8.jpg)
(http://www.derwesten.de/omg/26550-648001012/530_530_0024450718-0054227314.JPG.jpg)
(http://www.noows.de/gallery/Bildergalerie/Leben_08/MIchael_Jackson/500/michael06.jpg)
Pictires from the Avram trial :
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_qUFDMUpk9jE/SkdP69BK22I/AAAAAAAAVgQ/kyIFsxnGK0A/s400/44-283uNsF.jpg)
(http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/jun2009/1/1/image-7-for-michael-jackson-s-story-wilderness-years-gallery-122263309.jpg)
very swollen fingers
I don't know what ...i am speechless.
The children are in germany only seen with the long hair Michael...who was also the only one who was interviewed by Bashit !
In the Bashit documentary was very much showed from germany...from a charity and a visit to a zo, but the Bambi wasn't mentioned...weired ?????????? :geek:
I was thinking the same that his hands looked swollen.
The Bambi award WAS in the Bashir documentary ! actually it shows Michael when he recieves it. I can remember this, cause Michael was about to go on the stage 5 minuttes to early, and then they stopped him. This was the evening before he dangled Blanket out over the balcony, if I remember correct.
-
The Bambi award WAS in the Bashir documentary ! actually it shows Michael when he recieves it. I can remember this, cause Michael was about to go on the stage 5 minuttes to early, and then they stopped him. This was the evening before he dangled Blanket out over the balcony, if I remember correct.
The baby dangling incident was the evening before the Bambi awards.
Michael was very upset on this day and in tears, apparently. He couldnt get out of doing the Bambi awards as it was pre-planned. He didnt want to do it and if you watch the video, he is shaking.
Watch him when he walks on and tries to put his reading glasses on. He is shaking like a leaf, poor love.
[youtube:xmdpxaop]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ev8WS87Ix7M[/youtube:xmdpxaop]
-
The Bambi award WAS in the Bashir documentary ! actually it shows Michael when he recieves it. I can remember this, cause Michael was about to go on the stage 5 minuttes to early, and then they stopped him. This was the evening before he dangled Blanket out over the balcony, if I remember correct.
The baby dangling incident was the evening before the Bambi awards.
Michael was very upset on this day and in tears, apparently. He couldnt get out of doing the Bambi awards as it was pre-planned. He didnt want to do it and if you watch the video, he is shaking.
Watch him when he walks on and tries to put his reading glasses on. He is shaking like a leaf, poor love.
[youtube:7guwprq9]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ev8WS87Ix7M[/youtube:7guwprq9]
ok, the evening before then ;) but it was in the bashir documentary. Yes he looks very nervous and uncomfortable. But I do think, ( and no I dont like Bashir, it's not that ) in the documentary, when Michael is feeding baby Blanket, something is very wrong with Michael :( either he is so freaked out from being nervous, OR he really is on ...something. Sorry. It dosen't change my mind about Michael at all, I still love him, but this really made me think.
-
Thank you for posting. The real deal, I think. Why was he so nervous, do you know?
-
Poor baby, so nervous... He looks gorgeous though.
-
Oh, sorry. I think I understand. I have lived in the EU too long and without a television set. So I do not know what is going on. The day before he was filmed dangling Blanket. That's why he's so nervous. I wonder why he did that. He looks great. I think the Germans were trying to be nice to him. They gave him a standing ovation.
-
Wow, so much info!
On a funny note just to say that when I see a pic,if my heart bites fast, I know is Michael ;)
-
He looks so beautiful, but he's so nervous I wish I could comfort and hug him. Thanks for sharing this!
-
The Bambi award WAS in the Bashir documentary ! actually it shows Michael when he recieves it. I can remember this, cause Michael was about to go on the stage 5 minuttes to early, and then they stopped him. This was the evening before he dangled Blanket out over the balcony, if I remember correct.
The baby dangling incident was the evening before the Bambi awards.
Michael was very upset on this day and in tears, apparently. He couldnt get out of doing the Bambi awards as it was pre-planned. He didnt want to do it and if you watch the video, he is shaking.
Watch him when he walks on and tries to put his reading glasses on. He is shaking like a leaf, poor love.
[youtube:e2crsraf]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ev8WS87Ix7M[/youtube:e2crsraf]
ok, the evening before then ;) but it was in the bashir documentary. Yes he looks very nervous and uncomfortable. But I do think, ( and no I dont like Bashir, it's not that ) in the documentary, when Michael is feeding baby Blanket, something is very wrong with Michael :( either he is so freaked out from being nervous, OR he really is on ...something. Sorry. It dosen't change my mind about Michael at all, I still love him, but this really made me think.
could it be that michael was paranoid at some points.... whe he feeds blanket he acts like someone who would be paranoid.... hes shaking..... he may have been on something...noting heavy... maybe something to calm the nerves
-
could it be that michael was paranoid at some points.... whe he feeds blanket he acts like someone who would be paranoid.... hes shaking..... he may have been on something...noting heavy... maybe something to calm the nerves
I don't like the word "paranoid". When he was feeding his little baby son Blanket, he was like a caring mother to me, would be great, if all parents treated their babies in such a tender way.
He is showing emotions, because he is more sensitive than many others.
If it was the day, when he was showing his baby proudly to the crowd in front of his window, it is understandable how his reaction would be, considering the bad press concerning this incident. He was nervous, and his nervousness reminds me of Prince Michael's speech at the Grammy Awards. He was extremely nervous, too, but such a cutie.
Michael would have certainly preferred staying in his hotel room, instead of appearing in the show that day.
So he didn't send a double on that occasion, an easy task for him, if he had wanted it.
The question remains, why did he send a double to the O2-conference? What did he do behind the curtain?
Just compare the double's behavior to Michael ,getting the Bambi award - what a difference.
The shy, nervous Michael, and the sometimes even arrogant, fist-shaking double.
Their faces don't even match.
-
Thinking about the mugshot. Surely they must have arrested the real Michael because they'd have to take his fingerprints as well, if that isn't the real Michael how do we explain that? I do agree that the pic seems a bit odd but the eyes are exactly the same to me which is the most important thing (to me at least). About the mouth being lower, I personally think that's due to the plastic surgery he had on his nose (a pointier nose makes the distance appear bigger) and his facial expression. He looked surprised, if you know what I mean? I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.
Note that I'm not trying to discredit your research I'm just stating my opinion and explainig why.
"I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.". You got that right alovesmichael - it made the BOTTOM PART part of your face appear longer. I'm not talking about the bottom part, but the part as from the upper lip all the way up to the eyes. That distance does not change due to surgery, you would have to add bone to achieve that. It may appear differently, but when layering up two pictures taken from the same angle, they have to match. If it's not a match, then it's not the same person.
Mo, that is absolutely not true. The only true measurement in this case is to measure the center of the pupil to the edge of the upper teeth, that is assuming that the teeth are not dentures or have not been moved or replaced in any way. The upper teeth are set in bone that can not move and the eyes are set into a socket that can not move. As for the lip...there are many many things that can increase the length of it.
-Botox injection in the upper lip can paralyze the upper lip function for up to six months, most Doctors won't do it...(anyone notice that lots of times he doesn't move his upper lip when he talks just look at him at the 30th anniversary special and that album signing...the one where he has short hair and is wearing that bright blue outfit, and look at him on the home moves special...very little upper lip movement.) and in doing that, it drops the upper lip due to loss of muscle tone.
-repeated nose surgery or facial surgery can permanently paralyze the upper lip function causing it to lose muscle tone and to lengthen and causing the upper lip to drop down and cover more of the teeth due to loss of muscle tone.
-stroke can do the same thing
-surgery to cover protruding or gummy smile. They cut inside the lip, bring it down on the gum line and reattach, this allows the person not to show as much gums when smiling or as much teeth when not smiling.
all of the above are possibilities, as you can see in some video footage of MJ when he has the longer upper lip, he also has no movement of it which points to paralysis...permanent or not, who knows? The fact is, there is surgery called "upper lip shortening procedure" which is for people who grow long in the upper lip due to age. They take a slice of lip out under the nose and stitch back up. The effect makes the person look more youthful. I have no doubt MJ had this done at some point before O2.
-To sum it up...you can't rely measurement on flesh. You must match up eyes and upper teeth of the upper jaw. These are unmovable. (assuming person had no braces or tooth replacement, but still, even if they did, it will still give a pretty accurate measurement)
here is the home video movie...he has little movement of upper lip and it affects his speech as well.[youtube:27d85zgs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhK1cKBut_o[/youtube:27d85zgs]
-
arnie said he did work on his face and had been working on his face all the time, with his problem spots etc
AGAIN: No matter what kind of plastic surgery is performed, the distance between the inner corner of the eye and the top of the upper lip stays basically the same. Plastic surgery can't cause more than half an inch of extra length in between the eyes and the upper lip. That's IMPOSSIBLE.
I'm sorry, that's not true. Read my above post.
-
could it be that michael was paranoid at some points.... whe he feeds blanket he acts like someone who would be paranoid.... hes shaking..... he may have been on something...noting heavy... maybe something to calm the nerves
I don't like the word "paranoid". When he was feeding his little baby son Blanket, he was like a caring mother to me, would be great, if all parents treated their babies in such a tender way.
He is showing emotions, because he is more sensitive than many others.
If it was the day, when he was showing his baby proudly to the crowd in front of his window, it is understandable how his reaction would be, considering the bad press concerning this incident. He was nervous, and his nervousness reminds me of Prince Michael's speech at the Grammy Awards. He was extremely nervous, too, but such a cutie.
Michael would have certainly preferred staying in his hotel room, instead of appearing in the show that day.
So he didn't send a double on that occasion, an easy task for him, if he had wanted it.
The question remains, why did he send a double to the O2-conference? What did he do behind the curtain?
Just compare the double's behavior to Michael ,getting the Bambi award - what a difference.
The shy, nervous Michael, and the sometimes even arrogant, fist-shaking double.
Their faces don't even match.
I really dont think it was just cause he was nervous..... It was not an normal behavior.Whether he was on something or not, it was not normal.And I'm sure he knows, that when he acts that way, the baby (Blanket ) get's nervous too. The baby seemed very uncomfortable.Poor Michael, I really think he had problems at that time.
-
Thinking about the mugshot. Surely they must have arrested the real Michael because they'd have to take his fingerprints as well, if that isn't the real Michael how do we explain that? I do agree that the pic seems a bit odd but the eyes are exactly the same to me which is the most important thing (to me at least). About the mouth being lower, I personally think that's due to the plastic surgery he had on his nose (a pointier nose makes the distance appear bigger) and his facial expression. He looked surprised, if you know what I mean? I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.
Note that I'm not trying to discredit your research I'm just stating my opinion and explainig why.
"I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.". You got that right alovesmichael - it made the BOTTOM PART part of your face appear longer. I'm not talking about the bottom part, but the part as from the upper lip all the way up to the eyes. That distance does not change due to surgery, you would have to add bone to achieve that. It may appear differently, but when layering up two pictures taken from the same angle, they have to match. If it's not a match, then it's not the same person.
Mo, that is absolutely not true. The only true measurement in this case is to measure the center of the pupil to the edge of the upper teeth, that is assuming that the teeth are not dentures or have not been moved or replaced in any way. The upper teeth are set in bone that can not move and the eyes are set into a socket that can not move. As for the lip...there are many many things that can increase the length of it.
-Botox injection in the upper lip can paralyze the upper lip function for up to six months, most Doctors won't do it...(anyone notice that lots of times he doesn't move his upper lip when he talks just look at him at the 30th anniversary special and that album signing...the one where he has short hair and is wearing that bright blue outfit, and look at him on the home moves special...very little upper lip movement.) and in doing that, it drops the upper lip due to loss of muscle tone.
-repeated nose surgery or facial surgery can permanently paralyze the upper lip function causing it to lose muscle tone and to lengthen and causing the upper lip to drop down and cover more of the teeth due to loss of muscle tone.
-stroke can do the same thing
-surgery to cover protruding or gummy smile. They cut inside the lip, bring it down on the gum line and reattach, this allows the person not to show as much gums when smiling or as much teeth when not smiling.
all of the above are possibilities, as you can see in some video footage of MJ when he has the longer upper lip, he also has no movement of it which points to paralysis...permanent or not, who knows? The fact is, there is surgery called "upper lip shortening procedure" which is for people who grow long in the upper lip due to age. They take a slice of lip out under the nose and stitch back up. The effect makes the person look more youthful. I have no doubt MJ had this done at some point before O2.
-To sum it up...you can't rely measurement on flesh. You must match up eyes and upper teeth of the upper jaw. These are unmovable. (assuming person had no braces or tooth replacement, but still, even if they did, it will still give a pretty accurate measurement)
here is the home video movie...he has little movement of upper lip and it affects his speech as well.[youtube:j9ose4p0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhK1cKBut_o[/youtube:j9ose4p0]
I agree, it's possible, except you shouldn't measure from the center of the pupils - if he looks into another direction, this will mess up the comparison... I guess the inner corner of the eye would make it pretty accurate.
Also, if I smile (as in the youth pic of Michael), my upper lip moves up - not that much though.
I also think he used Botox - not only his upper lip didn't move much while speaking, also there's no forhead/eyebrows movement.
I really didn't like that.
-
Thinking about the mugshot. Surely they must have arrested the real Michael because they'd have to take his fingerprints as well, if that isn't the real Michael how do we explain that? I do agree that the pic seems a bit odd but the eyes are exactly the same to me which is the most important thing (to me at least). About the mouth being lower, I personally think that's due to the plastic surgery he had on his nose (a pointier nose makes the distance appear bigger) and his facial expression. He looked surprised, if you know what I mean? I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.
Note that I'm not trying to discredit your research I'm just stating my opinion and explainig why.
"I did the same expression in front of the mirror and it made the bottom part of my face appear longer.". You got that right alovesmichael - it made the BOTTOM PART part of your face appear longer. I'm not talking about the bottom part, but the part as from the upper lip all the way up to the eyes. That distance does not change due to surgery, you would have to add bone to achieve that. It may appear differently, but when layering up two pictures taken from the same angle, they have to match. If it's not a match, then it's not the same person.
Mo, that is absolutely not true. The only true measurement in this case is to measure the center of the pupil to the edge of the upper teeth, that is assuming that the teeth are not dentures or have not been moved or replaced in any way. The upper teeth are set in bone that can not move and the eyes are set into a socket that can not move. As for the lip...there are many many things that can increase the length of it.
-Botox injection in the upper lip can paralyze the upper lip function for up to six months, most Doctors won't do it...(anyone notice that lots of times he doesn't move his upper lip when he talks just look at him at the 30th anniversary special and that album signing...the one where he has short hair and is wearing that bright blue outfit, and look at him on the home moves special...very little upper lip movement.) and in doing that, it drops the upper lip due to loss of muscle tone.
-repeated nose surgery or facial surgery can permanently paralyze the upper lip function causing it to lose muscle tone and to lengthen and causing the upper lip to drop down and cover more of the teeth due to loss of muscle tone.
-stroke can do the same thing
-surgery to cover protruding or gummy smile. They cut inside the lip, bring it down on the gum line and reattach, this allows the person not to show as much gums when smiling or as much teeth when not smiling.
all of the above are possibilities, as you can see in some video footage of MJ when he has the longer upper lip, he also has no movement of it which points to paralysis...permanent or not, who knows? The fact is, there is surgery called "upper lip shortening procedure" which is for people who grow long in the upper lip due to age. They take a slice of lip out under the nose and stitch back up. The effect makes the person look more youthful. I have no doubt MJ had this done at some point before O2.
-To sum it up...you can't rely measurement on flesh. You must match up eyes and upper teeth of the upper jaw. These are unmovable. (assuming person had no braces or tooth replacement, but still, even if they did, it will still give a pretty accurate measurement)
here is the home video movie...he has little movement of upper lip and it affects his speech as well.[youtube:2x7gdbhp]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhK1cKBut_o[/youtube:2x7gdbhp]
I agree, it's possible, except you shouldn't measure from the center of the pupils - if he looks into another direction, this will mess up the comparison... I guess the inner corner of the eye would make it pretty accurate.
Also, if I smile (as in the youth pic of Michael), my upper lip moves up - not that much though.
I also think he used Botox - not only his upper lip didn't move much while speaking, also there's no forhead/eyebrows movement.
I really didn't like that.
I meant roughly center of pupil...sorry. I should have said the center of the eye socket. but I think yours would work too. Most people when they smile, the upper lip moves up exposing the teeth. MJ's did when he was younger and not so much when he was older.
-
@mykidsmum
Excellent points! Just a question out of curiousity, what would be the reason for botox injections in the upper lip? I mean is it supposed to make people look younger or are there other reasons? Just thinking about why one would want the upper lip to "drop". During his 30th anniversary performances Michael covered his mouth a lot while singing, it appears as he's singing the songs live so I don't think he was trying to cover that he was miming. Some have said (read it somewhere, therefore no reliable source but still...) that he wasn't happy with his lips and therefore self-conscious about it. Perhaps cosmetic procedure wasn't the reason or it was and michael wasn't happy with the result...
-
@mykidsmum
Excellent points! Just a question out of curiousity, what would be the reason for botox injections in the upper lip? I mean is it supposed to make people look younger or are there other reasons? Just thinking about why one would want the upper lip to "drop". During his 30th anniversary performances Michael covered his mouth a lot while singing, it appears as he's singing the songs live so I don't think he was trying to cover that he was miming. Some have said (read it somewhere, therefore no reliable source but still...) that he wasn't happy with his lips and therefore self-conscious about it. Perhaps cosmetic procedure wasn't the reason or it was and michael wasn't happy with the result...
well, if you look at him at that time, especially of him going in with Elizabeth taylor...his lip has no movement and it looks puffy. Maybe he had some recent mouth work (teeth) or maybe it was a side effect not intended, but I agree, he looked very self concious. As for botox in upper lip, to help with the little purse lines around lips and the two lines that are on either side of your mouth. The paraylisis of the upper lip is something that may happen and that is why most docs avoid that area. Only MJ knows what happened to make his lip stop working right. Wish we knew.
-
This is the real deal, too, right? I absolutely love this picture, that's the real sweet deal!
(http://www.michaeljacksonspictures.com/wp-content/gallery/mj-world-music-awards-2006/Michael%20Jackson%20World%20Music%20Awards%20%2855%29.jpg)
-
This is the real deal, too, right? I absolutely love this picture, that's the real sweet deal!
(http://www.michaeljacksonspictures.com/wp-content/gallery/mj-world-music-awards-2006/Michael%20Jackson%20World%20Music%20Awards%20%2855%29.jpg)
I think I have some comparisons of that shot...lemee see what I can find....
-
check out how the bodies match up... Check out the creases in the one with all the belts...I love it
-
check out how the bodies match up... Check out the creases in the one with all the belts...I love it
Mm, those are sexy all right- but what creases?
-
if you click on the picture of MJ, the one with 3 of them...where he's wearing the belt...you can see the whole picture and you can see how his thigh matches the O2 guy and even the crease in the pants near his...uh hem...
-
What I am about to post, I have talked about to few others, but have posted on a twitter account, only to be ridiculed, because a few people that like to mislead others and force their theories on others, whether they be right or they are wrong. The twitter account was taken down because people would rather believe a lie than see the truth.
This thread is on the right track, as well as video someone on this forum posted about doubles and dopplegangesr or such. However, it is nowhere as sinister as a doppleganger, if you are speaking of such an entity in a supernatural sense. There is nothing supernatural about it.
As Michael's 30th birthday approached, after devoting nearly all of his life to performing, he had decided he did not want to tour anymore, he wanted to live as normal a life as he possibly could. This was met with much disdain from his "people". The "brand" of MICHAEL JACKSON was much too lucrative for him to end it. Coupled with the fact that if he did retire at 30, he would still have been harassed and hounded by the the public, the paps the fans. So the thought came to him of using doubles, and such an idea led to a search for them. Just prior to this, Michael had begun to have some problems with anxiety and had always had a fear of flying and now it was becoming traumatic emotionally. The first effects were after his injury in the pepsi commercial.
He had also met someone that he wanted to share his life with and start a family. So this became very urgent. I could go on and on about the ins and outs of it, but to make a long story short. They found a man looking very similar to Michael,in fact, there were 3, it was a process of transititioning original Michael to the 1st double, then the 1st to the 2nd, and later on after the 2nd one caused some legal issues for our beloved, he was removed, and now lives in India.
The surgeries were made to make Michael to look more like this gentleman, and he was made to look more like Michael. And subsequently #1 into #2. Taking us further and further from the the actual face of Michael. So many surgeries to confuse the public as to what he looked like anymore. So if we saw him and he looked different, we would just assume he had had more work done.
The craniometry and physical anthropology of a negro skull is markedly different from that of a caucasian
skull. so a mere nose job would not be sufficient. Chin implants and cheek implants were added to try to simulate Michael's features. His hair being worn hanging in his face was meant to hide some of this. Although, if you pay careful attention and freeze his videos you will see the double playing the part of Michael does not have the facial projection.
Example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwvix7uE ... re=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwvix7uEQg0&feature=related)
freeze it at 2:18 seconds.
Here is an article as well and although it's on Wiki it will give you the differences in the facial profiles. I'm sure if you want to read more about it you will know how to take it from there.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific ... thropology (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_racism#Craniometry_.26_physical_anthropology).
Then once this was in place and these gentlemen were compensated and very well I might add. Michael was free to live his life, directing from "behind the curtain" The problem arose when #2 began to actually believe he was Michael and his ego was blown out of proportion, causing many problems and was the source of Michael's legal issues. When you give a man everything on earth and he believes he is untouchable, unless he is of pure heart such as the real Michael, corruption can take over his soul, if any of you have watched the movie Dorian Gray, there are a lot of parallels. Here is the trailer:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9h9a3Sx6 ... re=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9h9a3Sx6220&feature=related)
So this is when he (# 2 ) was sent to India. enter # 3 who after a few years discovered he was ill. He also suffered from pulmonary fibrosis, which was hinted at in the AR. The physical he had to pass for the AEG insurance was an "illusion" our real Michael took the physical. Not #3 . # 3 's illness which was terminal and painful, began to accelerate. Murray was called in, and yes it is true he is not in the national registry of board certified physicians, this serves several purposes. Murray a man that was in desperate financial need, took the job, basically as a trade off. He would be taken care of, but he may do a few years. The operative word here is few. It was a trade off. Many have done far more for far less. Could you do a "few" years for a few million?
So that brings us to the assisted suicide, Murray set everything up for #3, left the room. As a physician, he knew well how long it would take. So he waited the length of time it took before coming back in to find # 3 in a state of demise. #3 did not "push" syringe after syringe of propofol, he would have passed out almost immediately. Here is a picture of the device Dr. Kevorkian used:
http://img.wonkette.com/assets/resource ... rkian1.jpg (http://img.wonkette.com/assets/resources/2008/03/kevorkian1.jpg)
Remember there was an IV pole in the bedroom. A condom catheter was used, and when it was applied the bladder was drained, hence the jar of urine near the bed.
All # 3 had to do was roll open the roller clamp and the propofol flowed in. Propofol was used because it is not a controlled substance. The room as you may recall was described as "swelteringly hot" this was done in order to keep the body warm so as to confuse the time of death.
Real Michael was nowhere near any of this. He was and is where he has been since the late 80s.
He does not plan to come back. He had considered it. But, much like Dorian Gray he does not want to grow old in the public eye. He wants to be remembered the way you all portray him here. Young and vibrant.
Well, I have to go now. But, I promise you he is fine. You guys can believe me or not. It doesn't make what I have told you untrue if you all wish to ridicule me, sobeit. But, I had to tell someone.
-
Hello Britney7,
thank you for your post....it's long and not easy for me because i don't understand it all.....but most !
It sound so logical and i have this thoughs a long time that he was alive and someone else was at his place....that was a big risk, because all this double does comes back to the name Michael Jackson....all ! He has much power to make all done.
Stop him and he tells the whole story the media....Michael was in his hands...
For me is looks rearly like one of them tries to brake all down what Michael has build up.
In one video i found from the early years Michael said in an interview that he was afraid of the fans and people...he looks very sad and uncomfortable....i believe him...
For me, who comes after the 25.June it looks clearer, because i 'm not in love ;)
I wondered that most of the fans used pictueres from Michael that where 15-20 years old....they loved him like he was before 20 years....the concerts must be a desillusion....because now he was a 50 year old man
it would sound so logical....even there was such a big BUT :
Why was the death not in a logical way ? No clues , no DD at Larry King ? Why all this that let us come here together ?
They know the ways how it all go...they had made a normal statement from the UCLA, one autopsie report, no clues at all...so nobody would come on the idea that it is a hoax...
Why not one single word of his death in the TII Movie ? That's not normal !
Why ?
-
@ Britney7
I do not wish to ridicule you, however what are your sources for all this information?
-
Hello Britney7,
a fascinating theory! Including the part on the assisted suicide.
-
Britney7: I'm sorry but I don't believe you, everyone can come here and claim they know things for sure.
-
Hi Britney7....you definitely grabbed my attention with that post. Sorry to read the part about MJ not coming back. Makes me question why there were so many loose ends and trails left to speculate on and why not just make it clean and believable if that was his intention all along.
-
People, all I can say is: Don't believe everything you read... As I said before, everyone can come on this board and say they know things for sure...
-
People, all I can say is: Don't believe everything you read... As I said before, everyone can come on this board and say they know things for sure...
Well even if she is being untruthful, her story kinda seems like it could be legit. Here we have been trying for months and months to figure out what happened.
And the reason why everything is messed up and nothing makes sense is because someone DID die on June 25th...just not MJ. The will, the AR, all the court docs. Nothing was prepared to make it LOOK like MJ died because there was no time. This other person died and MJ ran with it. He may have had to and it was kind of a blessing in disguise for him that this double died. Mj wanted out. He wanted out for a long time and this WAS it. This was his chance.
The happiness of the family's faces and the absence of friends at the memorial and funeral explain ALL of this. They are happy that their brother, son, father, friend was finally free. Not dead of course but free from his life he loved so much, yet hated at the same time.
-
My sources are straight from the horses mouth. All I can tell you is, I know these things to be true . I know where he is and have known him and his "new" family, since he first came to town, I grew up with his wife. It is a small town, not too many wealthy people here. If you figure it out, and think you might have an idea. All you have to do is find a map of the town you think he's in. Change it to a satellite view. You will see there are no other mansions, or houses with pools, circular drives with fountains and a house built in the same Tudor Revival Style of archetecture as Hayvenhurst and Neverland oh yeah, and let's not forget a helicopter pad as well. He says if you find him come and get him. And though this may sound sarcastic, I can assure you it is not meant to be so. When you knock, in order for him to come out, you must shout, "Ollie Ollie oxen free!"
Ollie, ollie oxen free?
Most people don't understand how wonderfully appropriate that child's call is How could they, since very few people even realize what the words mean! Children have been shouting, "Ollie, ollie oxen free" for centuries. Generation after generation of children have learned it from other children, not caring in the least what it means. Originally from German, the German cry went like this: "Alle Alle auch sind frei." It means, "All! All! (You) are also free!" and served as the call to all the children still in hiding that that particular round of the game had ended and they could all come out of hiding.
http://ollieollieoxenfreee.webs.com/ (http://ollieollieoxenfreee.webs.com/)
I/we/he will post answers there.
-
Britney7, this seems like a plausible theory, though I dont believe in the doubles. I will not question your sources, nor will I "ridicule" you, as I respect the effort and hard work you've put into it. However, I must ask why is the family participating in the funeral as if the real Michael had passed? I am 50/50 on the whole hoax theory. The only reason I believe Michael could have performed this hoax is because his life was in danger. And I cannot see Katherine or Rebbie participating in her brother's hoaxed funeral, unless there was a good reason, say he was threatened. I dont know the family, and again, this is only my point of view.
I understand Michael could not live a normal life where he could go out in peace. I understand the "brand" (hate to say it) Michael Jackson was a money-making machine, and he would be harassed if he'd stop producing music and performances, but I can't see how he would share his glory with someone else. Michael's changes weren't produced from one day to another, like we tend to see them. His facial feature changes are explainable, and there is proof of his vitiligo since the Thriller era.
You say Michael has been somewhere else since the 80's and still is. Why would the family interact publicly with a double? Who made the Scream video with Janet? Who was talking about the punishment he received as a child in the Bashir documentary? Who was dancing with the J5 in Madison Square Garden? Who was framed in 1993 and 2005? Why was the family backing this person up if the real Michael has been away since the 80's? And more important why is Katherine taking care of those children if the real Michael has been away and those are not his children? And please people, dont tell me the children are doubles also.
-
My sources are straight from the horses mouth. All I can tell you is, I know these things to be true . I know where he is and have known him and his "new" family, since he first came to town, I grew up with his wife. It is a small town, not too many wealthy people here. If you figure it out, and think you might have an idea. All you have to do is find a map of the town you think he's in. Change it to a satellite view. You will see there are no other mansions, or houses with pools, circular drives with fountains and a house built in the same Tudor Revival Style of archetecture as Hayvenhurst and Neverland oh yeah, and let's not forget a helicopter pad as well. He says if you find him come and get him. And though this may sound sarcastic, I can assure you it is not meant to be so. When you knock, in order for him to come out, you must shout, "Ollie Ollie oxen free!"
Ollie, ollie oxen free?
Most people don't understand how wonderfully appropriate that child's call is How could they, since very few people even realize what the words mean! Children have been shouting, "Ollie, ollie oxen free" for centuries. Generation after generation of children have learned it from other children, not caring in the least what it means. Originally from German, the German cry went like this: "Alle Alle auch sind frei." It means, "All! All! (You) are also free!" and served as the call to all the children still in hiding that that particular round of the game had ended and they could all come out of hiding.
http://ollieollieoxenfreee.webs.com/ (http://ollieollieoxenfreee.webs.com/)
I/we/he will post answers there.
Nevermind the questions in my other post, Brittany. You just have answered them :roll:
-
Is he in Montgomery, Alabama perhaps?
-
You say Michael has been somewhere else since the 80's and still is. Why would the family interact publicly with a double? Who made the Scream video with Janet? Who was talking about the punishment he received as a child in the Bashir documentary? Who was dancing with the J5 in Madison Square Garden? Who was framed in 1993 and 2005? Why was the family backing this person up if the real Michael has been away since the 80's? And more important why is Katherine taking care of those children if the real Michael has been away and those are not his children? And please people, dont tell me the children are doubles also.
Yes ,my thought exactly .. I don't have the right to dismiss you or ridicule you either britney ,but the things you say don't make sense in any way . and don't fit the whole thing ... And it contradicts every other possible theory . Its like hiring someone to ''live'' your whole life for 20 years .... :
-
I dont have a problem with the name change, but I do have a problem with the fact that you are using the will, i suppose as part of the stipulation? Ok, so then Joe and Katherine also adopted this double, since one of the stipulations says " If any of my children are minors at the time of my death, I nominate MY MOTHER, KATHERINE JACKSON, as guardian of the persons and estates of the children" .
And I also suppose Michael approves of you publicly giving out his whereabouts through a hoax forum. Hmm, poor guy... 20 years of "secret-keeping" went down the drain in the time it took you to type his location and post a satellite map of his home...
-
Britney7,
Although we appreciate your contributions to our boards the aim of this forum has never been to haunt Michael Jackson down. We deleted your post with the screenshot. First of all there are a lot of people on this board that claim to know stuff, who says you are reliable?
The people that might live in this house, might not be too pleased with a screenshot of their house published on our boards, accompanied by a message to go there and 'get' Michael Jackson.
Even if your story IS true, you first state he doesn't want to come back, then you tell fans to go haunt him down. We're sorry, but in that case we don't think he would appreciate this.
This website is to investigate the hoax, not his whereabouts, please do not post these kind of things anymore.
Mo & Souza