Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators
Hoax Theories => The Double Theory => Topic started by: wiZZkIDD on April 05, 2010, 07:58:20 PM
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First installment of my series..follow me on this journey deeper inside the rabbit hole to unravel the illusion of Michael Jackson..not about June 25th but another theory that could tie in..Doubles, Decoys, Doppelgangers...there is more than one Michael that we have being seeing well over 20 years and this series will hopefully open the minds up to see what i see [youtube:1aa7fjh2]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdLHYlnpcrQ[/youtube:1aa7fjh2]
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When I saw this I wanted to say "is this from you Mo and Souza" :) Interesting video...thank you. It gives a lot to think about.
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well i sent it to Mo first lol to see what she thinks of it and it loved it..so i decided to create a video and im working on alot more and including Mo and Souza's Twin Theory also :) and yeah i created the video..thanks to Mo and Souza they inspired me
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Nice vid. There was one part that really piqued my interest. It was where the vid alluded to a possible conflict and problems with co-existence. That thought has crossed my mind when I think about the confidentiality agreement between MJ and the doubles.
Plus who is to say that at some point a double didn't ego trip and think that he could take over being MJ. Lots of other bizarre thoughts are running through my mind too regarding how the doubles may have inflated their self worth as they pretended to be MJ. :lol:
Offtopic: Not MJ or hoax related but just an example of how there can sometimes be problems with co-existence. One of my favorite movies is an old one starring Bette Davis entitled "Dead Ringer". It was the story of identical twin sisters. One was poor, shy and modest. The other was wealthy, loud and flamboyant. The wealthy sister treated the poor sister like crap. However the poor sister envied her rich sister and murdered her. Her goal was to live as her sister and in the style that she had dreamed of living. Unknown to the poor sister, the rich sister had committed a crime by murdering her own rich husband. Poor sister was arrested, went to trial and was convicted for the crime that her rich sister had committed.
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I have to admit....this video made my stomach hurt. It filled with with doubt and fear. I dont like that feeling at all. Do you suppose there is a happy ending to any of this???????????????????? :( :( :( :( :( :(
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ok that made me have doubts that i didnt want to have....
EDIT : well come to think, i knew he had used them before, but the thought of them bunking of the real thing..
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good job.
So, which double died? We are sure that Machel is alive,but there is autopcy of somebody...
Somebody died.
"Who is it? Is it a friend of mine/his?" Possible. If fans could commit suicide for MJ why would not one of his long time doubles?
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the doppleganger theory is ridiculos.... Michael doesn't have a good and bad side............. he just hired someone to take his place THAT'S IT.
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@ girlsaturday i will have to check out that movie and it sounds interesting :) :)...and to those who have doubts im not tryin to bring about fear just the possibility..heres my overall goal that i want to show is that (1.)michael had doubles maybe even one that was very prominent..that he himself trained to moved and act liked him (2.)All these years it hasnt been "all michael" as some would believe or say that there has been an illusion going on (3.) With the genious idea by Michael to use doubles or a doppelganger..it could have also had its down sides..and as i stated in my video.."conflict" could have risen out of using doubles and that Michael's best wishes wasnt carried out like they was suppose to (4.) that i truly believe we havent seen the REAL MJ for a long time and that maybe with all the doubles and doppelgangers something went wrong and that now maybe the real MJ has to show come out and show himself..because we dont know how Michael really looks now
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i dont think its ridiculous but its up for discussion and anything is possible..which im going to work hard on to show those that want to see :)..none of us know how this is all going to end happy or bad but im not a person that sugar coats the truth no matter how people look at..what i may present to you all may not look or sound good..but not all things come with good especially the truth and i think we all can agree on that :)
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SO WHAT ABOUT THE PHOTOS OF HIM WITH HIS KIDS??? ARE THOSE PHOTOS NOT HIM? ARE THOSE NOT HIS KIDS? GOD THIS IS MIND BLOWING!!! ooO(FRUSTRATED)Ooo i dont like this doubles idea and a double being nearly evil. :(
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to answer the question about is that Michael when hes out with his kids...heres my take on it..if you watch the Barbara Walters interview when he talks about Prince when he was first born..Michael talks about how much the paparazzi tried so much to see Prince and how he look and all the coverage Prince got..and Michael wanted to come up with ways on how to protect the kids so they wont have to go through with what he went through..and to me personally i dont think covering up the kids faces was going to stop that entirely..what if Michael used "decoys" or hired fake kids to stand in as Paris, Prince and Blanket??..think its far fetched not all think of the many commercials with child actors pretending to be the children of the parents of that particular commercial ;)..think about it serious if he used doubles to stand in for him why not use decoys for the children??
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I suppose thats why everyone is entitled to their own opinion. :) ;) A bit far fetched to me. But if thats what you think your allowed to think that then.
Think i'll move on :)
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Pretty Far Fetched :x :x
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i respect everyones opinion and you right it could be far fetched ..but i will say this just because neither one of us have seen it doesnt mean its not possible or real :) but i would like for you guys that say im being far fetched to continue to have a dialogue with me and watch the vids you may never it might be just something in it that might have you second guessing :)
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Sometimes things are outside of our realm so it is difficult to wrap our brain and understand. It doesn't have to be bad things either. Some people live differently and must adjust their lifestyles to their way of living. I'm not 100% on some aspects of the doubles theory. Some I accept while some I reject. However I don't block out possibilties. I am not a celebrity living in a fishbowl with constant threats toward me so it is a foreign concept to have to use doubles. I can walk down the street without being mobbed. Hence I take all of that for granted. What about the biggest celebrity in the world. What we take for granted he cannot enjoy. It may have been a survival and sanity tool to use the doubles. Survival and protection from well meaning fans and from dangerous stalkers. Plus it may have been done to give him a sense of normalcy and keep him stress free and grounded.
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well said GirlSaturday :D
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wow im speechless
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what if.... the O2 guy IS a doubble after all. and the real MJ indeed was ill as reported in late 2008 when we saw the pics of him in the wheelchair?
the family knowing Mj wont live for much longer and this person "fake mj" was to perform at O2 in order to restore MJ's legacy. ?? the real MJ passed before the shows and for some reason they (the family) didnt let fake mj perform and thats when tii the movie was created.... those last few days of rehearsal.
over the yers i have many times thougt to my self "that isnt mj" when he looked a bit off... but he did loose some weight and that does shange your apperance... so does age... and if he indeed was on drugs... well.... that changes your personality.....
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Maybe there is a double for MJ But I dont think there is someone who looks that close to Michael . Ok E Casanova is the closest to MJ but still you can see diffrence . And I do not believe that MJ use doubels in This is it and yeah MJ act a littlebit strange at the Conference in London but its him 100 % .
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:) :) well folks be ready for the beginning of a new type of theory..well who am i kidding to me its not even a theory :D but from the insight from my friend GirlSaturday two minds do think alike believe we have figured out or cracked this hoax with in a hoax..*WARNING MY VIDEOS MAY BE CONTROVERSIAL, OR EVEN SPARK SADNESS AND ANGER BUT REMEMBER IF THAT DOES EVER OCCUR IT WAS NOT MY INTENTION* BUT I DO ASK THAT YOU HAVE AN OPEN MIND AND FOLLOW ME ON THIS..TODAY I WILL BE MAKING A POST NOT A VIDEO JUST YET BUT STATING ME AND GIRLSATURDAY THEORY..HOPEFULLY FROM THE HELP OF SOUZA AND MO THAT WILL TURN THIS FORUM UPSIDE DOWN AND HOAX UPSIDE DOWN :D OH YES MICHEAL IS ALIVE. :D HEHE..JUST LOOK AT THE PICTURES FROM THE MEMORIAL AND FUNERAL...AND I MEAN REEEAALLLY LOOK AND YOU MIGHT JUST FIGURE IT OUT YOURSELF ;)
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Gosh, I watched this during my lunch break!! It scared the living daylights out of me! Really--he has changed his look so many times that it is really difficult to know who he really is. I believe that a decoy died (proof--ID established with driver's license) and that the real Michael is around and was at his Memorial and Funeral. Maybe his family knows are they suspect? Janet suspects...Jermaine....?
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:) :) well folks be ready for the beginning of a new type of theory..well who am i kidding to me its not even a theory :D but from the insight from my friend GirlSaturday two minds do think alike believe we have figured out or cracked this hoax with in a hoax..*WARNING MY VIDEOS MAY BE CONTROVERSIAL, OR EVEN SPARK SADNESS AND ANGER BUT REMEMBER IF THAT DOES EVER OCCUR IT WAS NOT MY INTENTION* BUT I DO ASK THAT YOU HAVE AN OPEN MIND AND FOLLOW ME ON THIS..TODAY I WILL BE MAKING A POST NOT A VIDEO JUST YET BUT STATING ME AND GIRLSATURDAY THEORY..HOPEFULLY FROM THE HELP OF SOUZA AND MO THAT WILL TURN THIS FORUM UPSIDE DOWN AND HOAX UPSIDE DOWN :D OH YES MICHEAL IS ALIVE. :D HEHE..JUST LOOK AT THE PICTURES FROM THE MEMORIAL AND FUNERAL...AND I MEAN REEEAALLLY LOOK AND YOU MIGHT JUST FIGURE IT OUT YOURSELF ;)
Please..not an other riddle!
What do you mean?
Is there something we did not see yet in de Memorial or Funeral?
I am with you an Mo an Souza in the there must be doubles.
Not that i saw absolute proof.
But over the years i am wondering..To many times i said What? How can he go from this to that and back again..Why do i have this od feeling looking at who?
Did he send somewone else to marry Debbie Rowe?
How can you not see this?
I certinaly can not say there is no double..and stil have a open mind about all of this!
One thing i am sure of..there is something strange going on in this!
Sorry for my English..i dont post often(because i find it difficult to express myself..i am Dutch)
But this puzzled me for a long time!
Greetings Mattie
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Thank You wiZZkIDD :!: I'm looking forward to your post.
I'm going to quote a post from loveratheart4mj and my reply to it, which are in the thread called "why are doubles so important to the hoax?" at viewtopic.php?f=59&t=8249&start=0 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=8249&start=0) Maybe this might make it a bit easier to understand and accept the existence of doubles...
I AGREE WITH YOU! I DONT WANT TO THINK INTERVIEWS WERE NOT HIM. IT WOULD MAKE ME FEEL ALMOST VIOLATED :( I ADORE THIS MAN. IF DOUBLES WERE USED IN SUCH UPCLOSE AND PERSONAL THINGS THEN I WOULD FEEL A FOOL TO HAVE SUCH ADORATION FOR SOMEONE THATS WASNT REALLY WHO I THOUGHT THEY WERE.
No offense, but I think you exactly described the main problem in the whole 'doubles issue' - people being afraid of their own feelings when they would admit the use of doubles. I know a lot of people won't like what I'm saying, but what you said is precisely what I have said before. Denying doubles because you would feel deceived won't make them go away.
Please, again, ask yourself WHY Mike has used doubles. Would you still feel deceived if he has done it to protect himself? Would you still feel violated if doubles were used as survival tactic? Would you still feel you're fooled if he used doubles when he was too sick to appear/perform? Remember how many times he said someone was poisoning him... Do you think Mike used doubles because he likes fooling around and playing with people's feelings? I really don't think so, at one point he might have had no other choice but to use doubles in order to keep himself safe.
If that is the case, would you still feel violated and fooled?
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WHEN DID THIS ALL STARTED ? MAYBE IT WAS JUST AFTER THE LIBERIANGIRL PERIODE ?, BECAUSE AT THE MEMORIAL AND FUNURAL THEY ONLY SHOWED THESE PICTURES OF HIM ,AND MAYBE WE MUST SEARCH FROM THERE TO FIND OUT WHO THE REAL MICHAEL JACKSON IS ? ITS MAYBE A CLUE FOR US ,JUST MY THOUGHT ABOUT IT :shock:
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THAT'S a VERY good vid! Thank you! :!:
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http://www.theinsider.com/news/1048805_ ... Wheelchair (http://www.theinsider.com/news/1048805_New_Photo_Michael_Jackson_in_Wheelchair)
Mike in wheelchair.
But I remember that someone on LKL (Miko?) said that Mike loved to pull sb's leg and that he did this with the wheelchair thing. That he wasn't ill at all!
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thanks more to come :D
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Make up and plastic surgery. End of. No doubles. All Michael.
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lol i use to think that too :) that it was all make up and plastic surgery..till i read between the lines and found out theres ALOT more to Michael that we all forgot about ;)
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I don't wanna knooooow. ;_____; Tell me when it's over...
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Nice vid. There was one part that really piqued my interest. It was where the vid alluded to a possible conflict and problems with co-existence. That thought has crossed my mind when I think about the confidentiality agreement between MJ and the doubles.
Plus who is to say that at some point a double didn't ego trip and think that he could take over being MJ. Lots of other bizarre thoughts are running through my mind too regarding how the doubles may have inflated their self worth as they pretended to be MJ. :lol:
Offtopic: Not MJ or hoax related but just an example of how there can sometimes be problems with co-existence. One of my favorite movies is an old one starring Bette Davis entitled "Dead Ringer". It was the story of identical twin sisters. One was poor, shy and modest. The other was wealthy, loud and flamboyant. The wealthy sister treated the poor sister like crap. However the poor sister envied her rich sister and murdered her. Her goal was to live as her sister and in the style that she had dreamed of living. Unknown to the poor sister, the rich sister had committed a crime by murdering her own rich husband. Poor sister was arrested, went to trial and was convicted for the crime that her rich sister had committed.
I have seen this movie a long time ago and it made me think about certain things in Mike's life if you get what I'm saying.
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:D lol Hey, Souza the non-believers they have no idea for whats in stored for this forum
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Make up and plastic surgery. End of. No doubles. All Michael.
I truely hope its all Michael. I hate the thought of watching whom i think is MJ and it turn out not to be him. That would disappoint me terribly. I love that guy. I know he needs doubles ocassionally for appearances and decoys and i completely understand.
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:D lol Hey, Souza the non-believers they have no idea for whats in stored for this forum
Well I am 1000% certain I have seen a lot of doubles. One of them is actually pretty good and confuses me sometimes. But indeed there we have the question: WHO is the real Michael Jackson? I think I will open a thread for that, I am curious as to what picture people would post.
Also it makes me think about the charachter of the doubles. Are they still on Mike's side? Did one turn against him? Did one die? It's a big mystery and it's impossible to unfold. Mo and I have been searching for ages. All we can see is that there are doubles, but that's about it...
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:D lol Hey, Souza the non-believers they have no idea for whats in stored for this forum
Well I am 1000% certain I have seen a lot of doubles. One of them is actually pretty good and confuses me sometimes. But indeed there we have the question: WHO is the real Michael Jackson? I think I will open a thread for that, I am curious as to what picture people would post.
Also it makes me think about the charachter of the doubles. Are they still on Mike's side? Did one turn against him? Did one die? It's a big mystery and it's impossible to unfold. Mo and I have been searching for ages. All we can see is that there are doubles, but that's about it...
Interesting theory which makes my head hurt.
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:D lol Hey, Souza the non-believers they have no idea for whats in stored for this forum
Well I am 1000% certain I have seen a lot of doubles. One of them is actually pretty good and confuses me sometimes. But indeed there we have the question: WHO is the real Michael Jackson? I think I will open a thread for that, I am curious as to what picture people would post.
Also it makes me think about the charachter of the doubles. Are they still on Mike's side? Did one turn against him? Did one die? It's a big mystery and it's impossible to unfold. Mo and I have been searching for ages. All we can see is that there are doubles, but that's about it...
Interesting theory which makes my head hurt.
my head hurts too... i dont get it.
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I'm looking forward to this series Wizzkid. Bring it on. I can already feel the anticipation. I'm thinking of all those little niggling thoughts I've had over the years whilst watching different tours such as History and that interview where Mike? says he wants to make inovative film . And then there is pictures of Mike with Omer as a little boy and Prince and Paris were babies where he just looks so so different. In the past I've just scratched my head about it and thought...to hard to fathom...won't go there. Now I need to know. Also How many dopplegangers do you think were in the batshit doco?
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WHEN DID THIS ALL STARTED ? MAYBE IT WAS JUST AFTER THE LIBERIANGIRL PERIODE ?, BECAUSE AT THE MEMORIAL AND FUNURAL THEY ONLY SHOWED THESE PICTURES OF HIM ,AND MAYBE WE MUST SEARCH FROM THERE TO FIND OUT WHO THE REAL MICHAEL JACKSON IS ? ITS MAYBE A CLUE FOR US ,JUST MY THOUGHT ABOUT IT :shock:
Brilliant!!!!!!!!
That's was a clue! OMG, this is exciting. That's why there were pictures only from that time. It's true, he did change tremendously afterwards. Also after 1999.
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I think it was the real MJ on the Oprah interview in 1994. When all those pics of him in obvious wigs started appearing, I believe that's when the doubles came into use.
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"jonathan" just popped up in my mind.
anybody remember that story?
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"jonathan" just popped up in my mind.
anybody remember that story?
Who's Jonathan?
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"jonathan" just popped up in my mind.
anybody remember that story?
Who's Jonathan?
somebody once showed up, long ago, cant remember the name,on the forum telling about jonathan in connection to doubles. and that we should start looking right around the beginning of the nineties.
anybody?
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Was that after the Jordan Chandler case?
I think he also changed a lot after 1999. It's hard to recognize him.
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I remember the Jonathan theory on the old forum..and many people dismissed the entire thing calling it far-fetched..but in truth and all honesty its not..got one word for you "RESEARCH" :D is the best teacher..now im not saying the doppelganger name is jonathan i dont know that for sure but i do know that somebody came along and was very prominent in Michael's life 8-) and yes just around late 80's early 90's
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"jonathan" just popped up in my mind.
anybody remember that story?
I remember it was a long time ago he said look back about twenty years.Thats all i can remember.Everything we have seen and herd over the past months seems not right.It`s like you know something wrong but you just can`t put your finger on it, i think that`s why none of us can give it up...we want to know the truth
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As I was typing that part of my post, I laughed and wondered..."Who will get it first...Souza or Mo?" You win!
Nice vid. There was one part that really piqued my interest. It was where the vid alluded to a possible conflict and problems with co-existence. That thought has crossed my mind when I think about the confidentiality agreement between MJ and the doubles.
Plus who is to say that at some point a double didn't ego trip and think that he could take over being MJ. Lots of other bizarre thoughts are running through my mind too regarding how the doubles may have inflated their self worth as they pretended to be MJ. :lol:
Offtopic: Not MJ or hoax related but just an example of how there can sometimes be problems with co-existence. One of my favorite movies is an old one starring Bette Davis entitled "Dead Ringer". It was the story of identical twin sisters. One was poor, shy and modest. The other was wealthy, loud and flamboyant. The wealthy sister treated the poor sister like crap. However the poor sister envied her rich sister and murdered her. Her goal was to live as her sister and in the style that she had dreamed of living. Unknown to the poor sister, the rich sister had committed a crime by murdering her own rich husband. Poor sister was arrested, went to trial and was convicted for the crime that her rich sister had committed.
I have seen this movie a long time ago and it made me think about certain things in Mike's life if you get what I'm saying.
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now ive seena few interviews with impersonators on Youtube and other video sites, and i seen one of navi a long time ago saying that michael hired him on a few occasions to be a distraction.... now navi doesnt even look like mike at all.... but he mentioned that he was used to walk out of hotels and hospitals before michael so he could clear the crowd and get rid of the paps.... but as far as people say that he had someone else on tour instead of him...... that i just cannot take........ and yes i know that Ecas was used in the Who is it video...
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now ive seena few interviews with impersonators on Youtube and other video sites, and i seen one of navi a long time ago saying that michael hired him on a few occasions to be a distraction.... now navi doesnt even look like mike at all.... but he mentioned that he was used to walk out of hotels and hospitals before michael so he could clear the crowd and get rid of the paps.... but as far as people say that he had someone else on tour instead of him...... that i just cannot take........ and yes i know that Ecas was used in the Who is it video...
As far as I know, E'cas is from 1978 or something like that, I remember reading that somewhere. Would mean he was around 13 years old when that video was shot, so I don't think it was E'cas, or I am mis informed.
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now ive seena few interviews with impersonators on Youtube and other video sites, and i seen one of navi a long time ago saying that michael hired him on a few occasions to be a distraction.... now navi doesnt even look like mike at all.... but he mentioned that he was used to walk out of hotels and hospitals before michael so he could clear the crowd and get rid of the paps.... but as far as people say that he had someone else on tour instead of him...... that i just cannot take........ and yes i know that Ecas was used in the Who is it video...
As far as I know, E'cas is from 1978 or something like that, I remember reading that somewhere. Would mean he was around 13 years old when that video was shot, so I don't think it was E'cas, or I am mis informed.
Well...... all i know it was someone else....as mike was on tour at the time.... dont know how Ecas came to mind :lol:
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didnt that girl that got banned talk about she was in a realtionship with joe (michael)?? maybe that was true! :shock:
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My next video should be up by Thursday...tomorrow i will post my theory and what to expect from my vids... time to get the ball rolling :)
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WHEN DID THIS ALL STARTED ? MAYBE IT WAS JUST AFTER THE LIBERIANGIRL PERIODE ?, BECAUSE AT THE MEMORIAL AND FUNURAL THEY ONLY SHOWED THESE PICTURES OF HIM ,AND MAYBE WE MUST SEARCH FROM THERE TO FIND OUT WHO THE REAL MICHAEL JACKSON IS ? ITS MAYBE A CLUE FOR US ,JUST MY THOUGHT ABOUT IT :shock:
Oh, yeah, if this is all true he just gave us the most helpful clues didn't he?? Oh, how easy that makes it.. I'm sorry, I thought I accepted everything about doubles, but I'm fighting tears right now.. I don't think this is interesting or something to get excited about at ALL.. I want to punch something so bad right now and I'm considering this Bad album cover.. I can understand needing to protect his life. But why does he have to play around with the people who actually love (or loved) him like that? Why can't he give more obvious clues? How does he expect anyone to trust him when you poor people are having such trouble deducing all of this? If you barely know how he looks or whatever and if he swaps around in interviews that are supposed to be insightful to who he truly is.. How much you wanna bet that he'll keep the explicit details of this to himself even on BAMS day like he's so fond of doing, leaving us to struggle in the dark like we've been..? Sorry but my mood sucks right now..
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WHEN DID THIS ALL STARTED ? MAYBE IT WAS JUST AFTER THE LIBERIANGIRL PERIODE ?, BECAUSE AT THE MEMORIAL AND FUNURAL THEY ONLY SHOWED THESE PICTURES OF HIM ,AND MAYBE WE MUST SEARCH FROM THERE TO FIND OUT WHO THE REAL MICHAEL JACKSON IS ? ITS MAYBE A CLUE FOR US ,JUST MY THOUGHT ABOUT IT :shock:
Oh, yeah, if this is all true he just gave us the most helpful clues didn't he?? Oh, how easy that makes it.. I'm sorry, I thought I accepted everything about doubles, but I'm fighting tears right now.. I don't think this is interesting or something to get excited about at ALL.. I want to punch something so bad right now and I'm considering this Bad album cover.. I can understand needing to protect his life. But why does he have to play around with the people who actually love (or loved) him like that? Why can't he give more obvious clues? How does he expect anyone to trust him when you poor people are having such trouble deducing all of this? If you barely know how he looks or whatever and if he swaps around in interviews that are supposed to be insightful to who he truly is.. How much you wanna bet that he'll keep the explicit details of this to himself even on BAMS day like he's so fond of doing, leaving us to struggle in the dark like we've been..? Sorry but my mood sucks right now..
PinkTopaz dont feel bad or down and in general these past 9 months have been hard on everybody..with all the BAM dates, Trial, Murray, TMZ and MJ sitings :| it does take a toll on you..but nobody ever said that what ever we discover or investigate will come with all smiles and joy thats truth of it..with the double theory i know many people will be upset..im a realist and im about truth and now is the time for everybody to put aside their feelings and emotions and think about the bigger picture here..follow me on this and you will see that Michael is still the person that you came to know and love
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WHEN DID THIS ALL STARTED ? MAYBE IT WAS JUST AFTER THE LIBERIANGIRL PERIODE ?, BECAUSE AT THE MEMORIAL AND FUNURAL THEY ONLY SHOWED THESE PICTURES OF HIM ,AND MAYBE WE MUST SEARCH FROM THERE TO FIND OUT WHO THE REAL MICHAEL JACKSON IS ? ITS MAYBE A CLUE FOR US ,JUST MY THOUGHT ABOUT IT :shock:
Oh, yeah, if this is all true he just gave us the most helpful clues didn't he?? Oh, how easy that makes it.. I'm sorry, I thought I accepted everything about doubles, but I'm fighting tears right now.. I don't think this is interesting or something to get excited about at ALL.. I want to punch something so bad right now and I'm considering this Bad album cover.. I can understand needing to protect his life. But why does he have to play around with the people who actually love (or loved) him like that? Why can't he give more obvious clues? How does he expect anyone to trust him when you poor people are having such trouble deducing all of this? If you barely know how he looks or whatever and if he swaps around in interviews that are supposed to be insightful to who he truly is.. How much you wanna bet that he'll keep the explicit details of this to himself even on BAMS day like he's so fond of doing, leaving us to struggle in the dark like we've been..? Sorry but my mood sucks right now..
PinkTopaz dont feel bad or down and in general these past 9 months have been hard on everybody..with all the BAM dates, Trial, Murray, TMZ and MJ sitings :| it does take a toll on you..but nobody ever said that what ever we discover or investigate will come with all smiles and joy thats truth of it..with the double theory i know many people will be upset..im a realist and im about truth and now is the time for everybody to put aside their feelings and emotions and think about the bigger picture here..follow me on this and you will see that Michael is still the person that you came to know and love
And I never said I expected it to- believe me, since the 25th I've been an emotional wreck about every negative thing concerning him that comes along and I'm just so damn sick of negativity and depressing things- why can't anything EVER be positive? I wish I weren't so weak and sensitive I thought he'd made me stronger but maybe not.. And the last part: oh yeah, I'm sure I'll see that about Michael, Michael who apparently is nearly impossible to find among all these phony fake-asses and Michael who will explain it all so clearly.. How in Pete's name will he show me that? Because he's sure made me feel really really stupid..
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to answer the question about is that Michael when hes out with his kids...heres my take on it..if you watch the Barbara Walters interview when he talks about Prince when he was first born..Michael talks about how much the paparazzi tried so much to see Prince and how he look and all the coverage Prince got..and Michael wanted to come up with ways on how to protect the kids so they wont have to go through with what he went through..and to me personally i dont think covering up the kids faces was going to stop that entirely..what if Michael used "decoys" or hired fake kids to stand in as Paris, Prince and Blanket??..think its far fetched not all think of the many commercials with child actors pretending to be the children of the parents of that particular commercial ;)..think about it serious if he used doubles to stand in for him why not use decoys for the children??
my belief exactly. maybe the prince and paris and blanket today are decoys, hiding THE REAL kids.
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@WiZZkiDD
Hey, you just twisted my brain in a whole nudder direction! Just when the whole trial thing is getting kind of monotonous... then I am thinking about the Liberian pics, the disguise comments with the shoes from Marlon and his twin, the Marlon jackets on dancers at funeral... OK, so what I always thought of the HIStory tour... why did MJ lipsinc almost the entire show... was his double doing this tour, or was MJ really there and only did a portion of show, you know, the actual live singing parts and maybe the Billie Jean part? Geez!!! I just don't know who is who anymore! Well, you certainly have got my attention and awakened another part of my brain. Can't wait to hear your theory! :mrgreen:
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@WiZZkiDD
Hey, you just twisted my brain in a whole nudder direction! Just when the whole trial thing is getting kind of monotonous... then I am thinking about the Liberian pics, the disguise comments with the shoes from Marlon and his twin, the Marlon jackets on dancers at funeral... OK, so what I always thought of the HIStory tour... why did MJ lipsinc almost the entire show... was his double doing this tour, or was MJ really there and only did a portion of show, you know, the actual live singing parts and maybe the Billie Jean part? Geez!!! I just don't know who is who anymore! Well, you certainly have got my attention and awakened another part of my brain. Can't wait to hear your theory! :mrgreen:
you are definitely on the right track :D but go back and look at those pictures again..inlcuding the Bad Era..look study and say to yourself "this is Michael Jackson" seriously do it :) and if you get a weird feeling over you..you will then discover the truth of who is who over the past 2 decades
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we are the world double?(http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6134/wearetheworld.jpg)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI)[/url] (A,D)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xD9UxqDjp5g(B,C)http://
bad double[img]http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/7802/bada.jpg[/img][url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xbd0wxGH_Lw&feature=fvwwendst6 1:53 comes the other
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we are the world double?(http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6134/wearetheworld.jpg)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI)[/url] (A,D)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xD9UxqDjp5g(B,C)http://
bad double[img]http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/7802/bada.jpg[/img][url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xbd0wxGH_Lw&feature=fvwwendst6 1:53 comes the other
OMG! All these yrs! :shock:
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we are the world double?(http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6134/wearetheworld.jpg)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI)[/url] (A,D)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xD9UxqDjp5g(B,C)http://
bad double[img]http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/7802/bada.jpg[/img][url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xbd0wxGH_Lw&feature=fvwwendst6 1:53 comes the other
OMG! All these yrs! :shock:
yes all these years..the Jackson family showed you who was alive with the pics they showed at the memorial and funeral ;)
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I think the video has good points. BUT, why is everyone acting shocked?
We have been alluding to this for months, does no-one read the boards?
Myself, posted around Sept. that I had had strange discussion with gentleman
who had once worked for Elvis and HE alluded to the theory of 2 Michaels.
At that time, I wondered if he knew something, or just theorizing himself.
Of course there were doubles and decoys used, but this still doesn't answer
the question: WHO is the "brother" or the ONE other Michael if there is one?
It would not be who you think it is, it would not be a "face" already in public.
I have often mused on the following:
Michael went away and another took place after Thriller. Even Janet said she
"lost" him after Thriller.
Michael died in 2007 or 2008 and that is when he became an "institution" and
this other Michael is not the real Michael. or, Michael went away in 2007 or
2008 and this is not the real Michael.
Joe Jackson was looking for Michael in 2008 when he was in Las Vegas.
Why was he searching so hard, either Michael did not want to be found or
something happened.
I look and look at Michael and remember him since a boy, sometimes I see
Michael and sometimes I see a stranger. The tall one is the stranger.
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yes all these years..the Jackson family showed you who was alive with the pics they showed at the memorial and funeral ;)
If one subscribes to the theory, how do we know the ONE they showed at memorial and
funeral was the ALIVE one?
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What do you think of this myspace of the Real Michael Jackson?
Compare his pictures to the young MJ boy pictures.
[attachment=1:29nb44ny]realmichaeljackson_myspace.jpg[/attachment:29nb44ny]
[attachment=0:29nb44ny]realmichaeljackson_myspace_2.jpg[/attachment:29nb44ny]
Read the incredible statements there.
http://www.myspace.com/realmichaeljackson
Think outside of the box with what we know now.
Could it be that the MJ we know was planted for marketing purposes to keep the brand going?
Just asking your thoughts.
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I think the video has good points. BUT, why is everyone acting shocked?
We have been alluding to this for months, does no-one read the boards?
I was thinking the exact same think. Souz and I have been talking about doubles and doppelgangers for months. We posted our 'Twin Theory' on October 31st, so it's nothing new. It's not like we haven't posted pictures of doubles before, and it's not like we haven't tried to explain over and over again what we think might have happened.
I don't know exactly what caused the turn in WiZZkiDD's video, but I'm glad that finally, after all these months, people are at least starting to consider the possibilities.
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by Grace » Wed Apr 07, 2010 5:27 am
What do you think of this myspace of the Real Michael Jackson?
Compare his pictures to the young MJ boy pictures.
realmichaeljackson_myspace.jpg
I think it conceivable that Michel had a couple of nose jobs because look at
Janet and Latoya.
So, who is making this myspace page?
But do I think it can be a possibility that
Michael didn't want or couldn't take any more limelight as some point, and they
wanted to continue to market the brand? YES :!:
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I think the video has good points. BUT, why is everyone acting shocked?
We have been alluding to this for months, does no-one read the boards?
Myself, posted around Sept. that I had had strange discussion with gentleman
who had once worked for Elvis and HE alluded to the theory of 2 Michaels.
At that time, I wondered if he knew something, or just theorizing himself.
Of course there were doubles and decoys used, but this still doesn't answer
the question: WHO is the "brother" or the ONE other Michael if there is one?
It would not be who you think it is, it would not be a "face" already in public.
I have often mused on the following:
Michael went away and another took place after Thriller. Even Janet said she
"lost" him after Thriller.
Michael died in 2007 or 2008 and that is when he became an "institution" and
this other Michael is not the real Michael. or, Michael went away in 2007 or
2008 and this is not the real Michael.
Joe Jackson was looking for Michael in 2008 when he was in Las Vegas.
Why was he searching so hard, either Michael did not want to be found or
something happened.
I look and look at Michael and remember him since a boy, sometimes I see
Michael and sometimes I see a stranger. The tall one is the stranger.
YOU HAVE SOME VERY GOOD POINTS AND BELIEVE ME AND YOU I HAVE THOUGHT ABOUT THESE SAME HIGH POSSIBLITIES..THESE ARE QUESTIONS THAT JUST MAYBE CAN BE ANSWERED..WHAT I HAVE RESEARCHED FOR A WHILE NOW IS THE LOST INTERVIEWS OR RARE INTERVIEWS DONE BY MICHAEL BACK IN THE 80'S WHICH I WILL BE SHOWING IN MY FIRST VIDEO THAT GIVES YOU SOME INSIGHT BEFORE THE BIG SWITCH ;)
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I think the video has good points. BUT, why is everyone acting shocked?
We have been alluding to this for months, does no-one read the boards?
I was thinking the exact same think. Souz and I have been talking about doubles and doppelgangers for months. We posted our 'Twin Theory' on October 31st, so it's nothing new. It's not like we haven't posted pictures of doubles before, and it's not like we haven't tried to explain over and over again what we think might have happened.
I don't know exactly what caused the turn in WiZZkiDD's video, but I'm glad that finally, after all these months, people are at least starting to consider the possibilities.
LOL MO I AM JUST AS SURPRISED AS YOU ARE THAT THE VIDEO IS GETTING THE RESPONSES AS IT IS NOW HERE AND ON YOUTUBE ;) ..HOPEFULLY I CAN DO WHAT YOU AND SOUZA HAVE BEEN PREACHING ABOUT SOME JUSTICE :D
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I'm annoyed.
If Mo or Souza says something about doubles everyone moans and groans oooooh noooo thats soo crazy n silly n embarrassing.... but this poster comes here n says same thing and even some of the same names are here going huh yeah could be possible.
Wtf.
I swear to god there's a systematic smear campaign going on and has been for months. Ever since you guys exposed Dave Dave someone is very interested in discrediting you. I don't think it's a coincidence and I don't think its hoaxers either.
If you know what I mean.
And it annoys me that hoaxers are so easily influenced by this and don't see through it as WE should be the ones who go hey wait, we're being FUCKED with... by someone.
Paranoid? Maybe. but i don't think so.
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I think the video has good points. BUT, why is everyone acting shocked?
We have been alluding to this for months, does no-one read the boards?
I was thinking the exact same think. Souz and I have been talking about doubles and doppelgangers for months. We posted our 'Twin Theory' on October 31st, so it's nothing new. It's not like we haven't posted pictures of doubles before, and it's not like we haven't tried to explain over and over again what we think might have happened.
I don't know exactly what caused the turn in WiZZkiDD's video, but I'm glad that finally, after all these months, people are at least starting to consider the possibilities.
Well trust me, I wish the twin theory were true a thousand times over this.. I'm so angry right now.. I hope he realizes that so many people are going to feel as incredibly stupid as I do right now. I feel like only people who are smart like Mo, Souza and WizzKidd who have time to inspect photos and stuff "get" to see all of this, and everyone else, including all those poor non-believers, are given a "make-believe" thing to play with, and once BAMSday comes (that is IF he feels like sharing the details) and they find out.. Well guess what, you weren't smart enough ti see the truth, so too bad, you just got a pretend thing to play around with.. I don't know how anyone is supposed to empathasize with him if this is the case..like I said earlier:
wiZZkIDD wrote:
PinkTopaz wrote:
ni-co-le wrote:WHEN DID THIS ALL STARTED ? MAYBE IT WAS JUST AFTER THE LIBERIANGIRL PERIODE ?, BECAUSE AT THE MEMORIAL AND FUNURAL THEY ONLY SHOWED THESE PICTURES OF HIM ,AND MAYBE WE MUST SEARCH FROM THERE TO FIND OUT WHO THE REAL MICHAEL JACKSON IS ? ITS MAYBE A CLUE FOR US ,JUST MY THOUGHT ABOUT IT :shock:
Oh, yeah, if this is all true he just gave us the most helpful clues didn't he?? Oh, how easy that makes it.. I'm sorry, I thought I accepted everything about doubles, but I'm fighting tears right now.. I don't think this is interesting or something to get excited about at ALL.. I want to punch something so bad right now and I'm considering this Bad album cover.. I can understand needing to protect his life. But why does he have to play around with the people who actually love (or loved) him like that? Why can't he give more obvious clues? How does he expect anyone to trust him when you poor people are having such trouble deducing all of this? If you barely know how he looks or whatever and if he swaps around in interviews that are supposed to be insightful to who he truly is.. How much you wanna bet that he'll keep the explicit details of this to himself even on BAMS day like he's so fond of doing, leaving us to struggle in the dark like we've been..? Sorry but my mood sucks right now..
PinkTopaz dont feel bad or down and in general these past 9 months have been hard on everybody..with all the BAM dates, Trial, Murray, TMZ and MJ sitings :| it does take a toll on you..but nobody ever said that what ever we discover or investigate will come with all smiles and joy thats truth of it..with the double theory i know many people will be upset..im a realist and im about truth and now is the time for everybody to put aside their feelings and emotions and think about the bigger picture here..follow me on this and you will see that Michael is still the person that you came to know and love
And I never said I expected it to- believe me, since the 25th I've been an emotional wreck about every negative thing concerning him that comes along and I'm just so damn sick of negativity and depressing things- why can't anything EVER be positive? I wish I weren't so weak and sensitive I thought he'd made me stronger but maybe not.. And the last part: oh yeah, I'm sure I'll see that about Michael, Michael who apparently is nearly impossible to find among all these phony fake-asses and Michael who will explain it all so clearly.. How in Pete's name will he show me that? Because he's sure made me feel really really stupid..
I think my hormones are acting up or something..
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I think the video has good points. BUT, why is everyone acting shocked?
We have been alluding to this for months, does no-one read the boards?
I was thinking the exact same think. Souz and I have been talking about doubles and doppelgangers for months. We posted our 'Twin Theory' on October 31st, so it's nothing new. It's not like we haven't posted pictures of doubles before, and it's not like we haven't tried to explain over and over again what we think might have happened.
I don't know exactly what caused the turn in WiZZkiDD's video, but I'm glad that finally, after all these months, people are at least starting to consider the possibilities.
Well trust me, I wish the twin theory were true a thousand times over this.. I'm so angry right now.. I hope he realizes that so many people are going to feel as incredibly stupid as I do right now. I feel like only people who are smart like Mo, Souza and WizzKidd who have time to inspect photos and stuff "get" to see all of this, and everyone else, including all those poor non-believers, are given a "make-believe" thing to play with, and once BAMSday comes (that is IF he feels like sharing the details) and they find out.. Well guess what, you weren't smart enough ti see the truth, so too bad, you just got a pretend thing to play around with.. I don't know how anyone is supposed to empathasize with him if this is the case..
Why are you so angry..? There's no need to be angry or feel stupid at all, really. Please don't say "But why does he have to play around with the people who actually love (or loved) him like that?". He might have had no choice... First look into the WHY. As I have stated before, I see more than one MJ way back. The use of doubles might not have been Mike's choice during the early years, they could have been planted by those who controlled him. What if the only way to break free from those was to start using doubles of his own choice? What if those were used for a bigger purpose?
I honestly don't think doubles were used by Mike himself just to play around and fool his fans, I tend to believe he just HAD to do this to mislead those who were after him, trying to bring him down after he broke free.
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No offence, people, but this is ridiculous! It's called plastic surgery and fillers. Talking about taking conspiracy theories too far, really... :roll:
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No offence, people, but this is ridiculous! It's called plastic surgery and fillers. Talking about taking conspiracy theories too far, really... :roll:
Plastic surgery and fillers do not create differences in height, period.
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I wonder why media people and others haven't noticed the differences in height. Come to think of it, doesn't he look shorter when he was young?
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:) :) well folks be ready for the beginning of a new type of theory..well who am i kidding to me its not even a theory :D but from the insight from my friend GirlSaturday two minds do think alike believe we have figured out or cracked this hoax with in a hoax..*WARNING MY VIDEOS MAY BE CONTROVERSIAL, OR EVEN SPARK SADNESS AND ANGER BUT REMEMBER IF THAT DOES EVER OCCUR IT WAS NOT MY INTENTION* BUT I DO ASK THAT YOU HAVE AN OPEN MIND AND FOLLOW ME ON THIS..TODAY I WILL BE MAKING A POST NOT A VIDEO JUST YET BUT STATING ME AND GIRLSATURDAY THEORY..HOPEFULLY FROM THE HELP OF SOUZA AND MO THAT WILL TURN THIS FORUM UPSIDE DOWN AND HOAX UPSIDE DOWN :D OH YES MICHEAL IS ALIVE. :D HEHE..JUST LOOK AT THE PICTURES FROM THE MEMORIAL AND FUNERAL...AND I MEAN REEEAALLLY LOOK AND YOU MIGHT JUST FIGURE IT OUT YOURSELF ;)
I´m ready - and reaaally teased now!
It´s more than likely that Michael had stand-ins and/or doppelgangers.
Who says that is far-fetched? We´re talking about a hoaxed death after all!! :P
Please keep it comin´, wiZZkIDD! ;)
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I think the video has good points. BUT, why is everyone acting shocked?
We have been alluding to this for months, does no-one read the boards?
I was thinking the exact same think. Souz and I have been talking about doubles and doppelgangers for months. We posted our 'Twin Theory' on October 31st, so it's nothing new. It's not like we haven't posted pictures of doubles before, and it's not like we haven't tried to explain over and over again what we think might have happened.
I don't know exactly what caused the turn in WiZZkiDD's video, but I'm glad that finally, after all these months, people are at least starting to consider the possibilities.
Well trust me, I wish the twin theory were true a thousand times over this.. I'm so angry right now.. I hope he realizes that so many people are going to feel as incredibly stupid as I do right now. I feel like only people who are smart like Mo, Souza and WizzKidd who have time to inspect photos and stuff "get" to see all of this, and everyone else, including all those poor non-believers, are given a "make-believe" thing to play with, and once BAMSday comes (that is IF he feels like sharing the details) and they find out.. Well guess what, you weren't smart enough ti see the truth, so too bad, you just got a pretend thing to play around with.. I don't know how anyone is supposed to empathasize with him if this is the case..
Why are you so angry..? There's no need to be angry or feel stupid at all, really. Please don't say "But why does he have to play around with the people who actually love (or loved) him like that?". He might have had no choice... First look into the WHY. As I have stated before, I see more than one MJ way back. The use of doubles might not have been Mike's choice during the early years, they could have been planted by those who controlled him. What if the only way to break free from those was to start using doubles of his own choice? What if those were used for a bigger purpose?
I honestly don't think doubles were used by Mike himself just to play around and fool his fans, I tend to believe he just HAD to do this to mislead those who were after him, trying to bring him down after he broke free.
I understand that. But aren't you saying that there are like, tons that were on the verge of taking over his life for him and that took his place during concerts and interviews, things that are supposed to show his TRUE nature? And if the Illuminati are all about messing with his brain to make him do what they want, why hassle with hiring fakes? I just feel that Michael's entire indentity, persona and real, is being destroyed, I feel like I'm never sure who I'm seeing, and if I'm never sure who I'm seeing, how do I know that story he's telling about how he wrote Billie Jean is true? How do I know if that food he's saying is his favorite is really his favorite? Most of all, how do I know he really cares as much about poor, suffering children any more than the next Joe, orthe poor, poor woman he's dating or married or his kids..? Do you see what I mean? This makes me feel like everything is some kind of big act- I'm glad I haven't liked him all of my life now, I'd feel like I just wasted a lot of time.
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to answer the question about is that Michael when hes out with his kids...heres my take on it..if you watch the Barbara Walters interview when he talks about Prince when he was first born..Michael talks about how much the paparazzi tried so much to see Prince and how he look and all the coverage Prince got..and Michael wanted to come up with ways on how to protect the kids so they wont have to go through with what he went through..and to me personally i dont think covering up the kids faces was going to stop that entirely..what if Michael used "decoys" or hired fake kids to stand in as Paris, Prince and Blanket??..think its far fetched not all think of the many commercials with child actors pretending to be the children of the parents of that particular commercial ;)..think about it serious if he used doubles to stand in for him why not use decoys for the children??
my belief exactly. maybe the prince and paris and blanket today are decoys, hiding THE REAL kids.
Okay so have we ever seen the real kids ONCE then? What about all of those pictures from over the years, showing him with them, and it's obiviously the same kids as now? I've seen many stories from other singers he worked with or whatever where he brought the kids with him to the studio- how would they not speak out on how these aren't the same kids at all? How would not ONE picture of him with the real kids have surfaced since the 25th? Where would the real kids be if these that we see were out with him, and you can tell it's him? Personally, I think it's a bigger hassle to have to worry about extra kids living with you and getting used to you and probably caring at least a little about you nad vice-versa than it is to just worry about your own- and a little sick to just decide that other kids can be put in danger just because they're not yours..
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we are the world double?(http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6134/wearetheworld.jpg)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI)[/url] (A,D)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xD9UxqDjp5g(B,C)http://
bad double[img]http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/7802/bada.jpg[/img][url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xbd0wxGH_Lw&feature=fvwwendst6 1:53 comes the other
Wow, this is messing with my head. :lol: I wondered if there were more than one from the Bashit interview and then I was questioning it with Dangerous and HIStory tours but geez, this is taking it back. I never noticed it. I even saw these pics before on the old board but just couldn't see it. Now I do and now I'm confused. Which one is which? And don't get me started with what Grace posted. That is really blowing my mind (if it's true). Of course, I have to keep a critical eye on this but at this point, anything is possible.
EDIT: I think I figured it out. THE MJ with the longest face shape is the double and the one with the rounder face is the real one. And in the video, Liberian Girl, there was the one behind the camera (longer face) and the one in the mummy suit (the rounder face). Hmm...maybe my little theory is right after all that in the video, Liberian Girl, MJ was officially introducing his double in that video and has been the main MJ from that point on. Or maybe I need to be locked away in a padded room somewhere. :lol:
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I understand that. But aren't you saying that there are like, tons that were on the verge of taking over his life for him and that took his place during concerts and interviews, things that are supposed to show his TRUE nature? And if the Illuminati are all about messing with his brain to make him do what they want, why hassle with hiring fakes? I just feel that Michael's entire indentity, persona and real, is being destroyed, I feel like I'm never sure who I'm seeing, and if I'm never sure who I'm seeing, how do I know that story he's telling about how he wrote Billie Jean is true? How do I know if that food he's saying is his favorite is really his favorite? Most of all, how do I know he really cares as much about poor, suffering children any more than the next Joe, orthe poor, poor woman he's dating or married or his kids..? Do you see what I mean? This makes me feel like everything is some kind of big act- I'm glad I haven't liked him all of my life now, I'd feel like I just wasted a lot of time.
I'm sorry, I just had to do what I did with your post. I understand your feelings, but isn't it about time to put your feelings aside and try to look at all that has happened from HIS point of view..?
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Ok going backto Graces Pic....
(http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/136/l_ea8d29da61d74dc1936f6705500d368b.jpg)
ok this is starting to worry me..... why do i look at that pic and keep thinking thats michael...... :?
either that... or its a damn good photoshop...
but with the height difference thing.. didnt mike wear boots with heels ?..... and if a double was used on stage... it would have to be a god damn good copy... voice and all... and i havent spotted one that looks exactly like him... that close up.
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I've been reminded of something I read not too long after the events of 25th June. At the time I was unaware of hoax sites or even a death hoax for that matter and I had stumbled onto the site of This is not it. There was talk about the pressure of the 50 concert dates that supposedly " killed" MJ. But I remember reading a statement from somewhere else [ maybe aeg?] that brought up that MJ was only contracted to perform for so many minutes per night. At the time I dismissed this as a load of crap but now in light of these discussions maybe it was fact. Another thing playing on my mind is from Dangerous the short films DVD. In the clip for Gone Too Soon There is a quick shot of MJ at Ryan Whites funeral. There are def two different MJ's in this.
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The pic from Grace's post was from this crazy TV documentary that used computer generated images to "reveal" what Mike "really" looked like. :lol: There is a youtube video with this "face". I'll see if I can hunt down the original documentary. It was all pretty absurd.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE)
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I've been reminded of something I read not too long after the events of 25th June. At the time I was unaware of hoax sites or even a death hoax for that matter and I had stumbled onto the site of This is not it. There was talk about the pressure of the 50 concert dates that supposedly " killed" MJ. But I remember reading a statement from somewhere else [ maybe aeg?] that brought up that MJ was only contracted to perform for so many minutes per night. At the time I dismissed this as a load of crap but now in light of these discussions maybe it was fact. Another thing playing on my mind is from Dangerous the short films DVD. In the clip for Gone Too Soon There is a quick shot of MJ at Ryan Whites funeral. There are def two different MJ's in this.
i think it was ian harplin that said that about only contraced for a few mins.... but the actual contract says nothing of the sort.
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The pic from Grace's post was from this crazy TV documentary that used computer generated images to "reveal" what Mike "really" looked like. :lol: There is a youtube video with this "face". I'll see if I can hunt down the original documentary. It was all pretty absurd.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE)
Oh great! There goes that theory. That actually makes me feel better. That was throwing me for a loop. I didn't even want to touch that. :lol:
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we are the world double?(http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6134/wearetheworld.jpg)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI)[/url] (A,D)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xD9UxqDjp5g(B,C)http://
bad double[img]http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/7802/bada.jpg[/img][url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xbd0wxGH_Lw&feature=fvwwendst6 1:53 comes the other
Wow, this is messing with my head. :lol: I wondered if there were more than one from the Bashit interview and then I was questioning it with Dangerous and HIStory tours but geez, this is taking it back. I never noticed it. I even saw these pics before on the old board but just couldn't see it. Now I do and now I'm confused. Which one is which? And don't get me started with what Grace posted. That is really blowing my mind (if it's true). Of course, I have to keep a critical eye on this but at this point, anything is possible.
EDIT: I think I figured it out. THE MJ with the longest face shape is the double and the one with the rounder face is the real one. And in the video, Liberian Girl, there was the one behind the camera (longer face) and the one in the mummy suit (the rounder face). Hmm...maybe my little theory is right after all that in the video, Liberian Girl, MJ was officially introducing his double in that video and has been the main MJ from that point on. Or maybe I need to be locked away in a padded room somewhere. :lol:
yeah i believe double MJ has a longer face and long chin like O2 michael.
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we are the world double?(http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6134/wearetheworld.jpg)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8dfwQEWDvI)[/url] (A,D)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xD9UxqDjp5g(B,C)http://
bad double[img]http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/7802/bada.jpg[/img][url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xbd0wxGH_Lw&feature=fvwwendst6 1:53 comes the other
Wow, this is messing with my head. :lol: I wondered if there were more than one from the Bashit interview and then I was questioning it with Dangerous and HIStory tours but geez, this is taking it back. I never noticed it. I even saw these pics before on the old board but just couldn't see it. Now I do and now I'm confused. Which one is which? And don't get me started with what Grace posted. That is really blowing my mind (if it's true). Of course, I have to keep a critical eye on this but at this point, anything is possible.
EDIT: I think I figured it out. THE MJ with the longest face shape is the double and the one with the rounder face is the real one. And in the video, Liberian Girl, there was the one behind the camera (longer face) and the one in the mummy suit (the rounder face). Hmm...maybe my little theory is right after all that in the video, Liberian Girl, MJ was officially introducing his double in that video and has been the main MJ from that point on. Or maybe I need to be locked away in a padded room somewhere. :lol:
yeah i believe double MJ has a longer face and long chin like O2 michael.
the only thing is that they are the worst pics to comapre..imo... the WATW ones are at different angles and different lighting...... so really hard to make a judgement... and the bad ones... well hes pulling different faces :lol: yet again i cant make any jusgements on it
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Long face is double, Small face Michael
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All double.
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Could be double, The long face, long chin, rough face features
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Got something to Hide, Long Face?
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this was a double, compare two pics
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compare both pics..... it's a double his name is Michael Kiss
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to answer the question about is that Michael when hes out with his kids...heres my take on it..if you watch the Barbara Walters interview when he talks about Prince when he was first born..Michael talks about how much the paparazzi tried so much to see Prince and how he look and all the coverage Prince got..and Michael wanted to come up with ways on how to protect the kids so they wont have to go through with what he went through..and to me personally i dont think covering up the kids faces was going to stop that entirely..what if Michael used "decoys" or hired fake kids to stand in as Paris, Prince and Blanket??..think its far fetched not all think of the many commercials with child actors pretending to be the children of the parents of that particular commercial ;)..think about it serious if he used doubles to stand in for him why not use decoys for the children??
my belief exactly. maybe the prince and paris and blanket today are decoys, hiding THE REAL kids.
Okay so have we ever seen the real kids ONCE then? What about all of those pictures from over the years, showing him with them, and it's obiviously the same kids as now? I've seen many stories from other singers he worked with or whatever where he brought the kids with him to the studio- how would they not speak out on how these aren't the same kids at all? How would not ONE picture of him with the real kids have surfaced since the 25th? Where would the real kids be if these that we see were out with him, and you can tell it's him? Personally, I think it's a bigger hassle to have to worry about extra kids living with you and getting used to you and probably caring at least a little about you nad vice-versa than it is to just worry about your own- and a little sick to just decide that other kids can be put in danger just because they're not yours..
IMHO those are his real kids. They are beautiful and look like his family and Debbie as well. I wish all those skeptical of his children woulld just stop :cry:
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What do you think of this myspace of the Real Michael Jackson?
Compare his pictures to the young MJ boy pictures.
[attachment=1:2jgsvucw]realmichaeljackson_myspace.jpg[/attachment:2jgsvucw]
[attachment=0:2jgsvucw]realmichaeljackson_myspace_2.jpg[/attachment:2jgsvucw]
Read the incredible statements there.
http://www.myspace.com/realmichaeljackson
Think outside of the box with what we know now.
Could it be that the MJ we know was planted for marketing purposes to keep the brand going?
Just asking your thoughts.
I read the "Exclusive Interview" on that myspace in which a cloning process is described which allegedly took place in 1972. According to that interview the real MJ was replaced with a clone.
In order to clone scientists transplant the genetic information from a specialized cell into an unfertilized egg cell whose genetic information has been destroyed or physically removed. If the egg begins to divide normally it is transferred into the uterus of the surrogate mother.
Therefor it would have taken almost 15 years to produce a clone of the then 14 years old Michael Jackson, so that debunks that theory for me. Next to that we have no idea if cloning could be done already in 1972 as, to our knowledge, Dolly the Sheep was the first mammal to have been successfully cloned from an adult cell in 1996.
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Ironically this guy also resembles Alfonso Ribeira (sp?), Carlton ... from Fresh Prince of Bel Air. :lol:
Ok going backto Graces Pic....
(http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/136/l_ea8d29da61d74dc1936f6705500d368b.jpg)
ok this is starting to worry me..... why do i look at that pic and keep thinking thats michael...... :?
either that... or its a damn good photoshop...
but with the height difference thing.. didnt mike wear boots with heels ?..... and if a double was used on stage... it would have to be a god damn good copy... voice and all... and i havent spotted one that looks exactly like him... that close up.
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Yes, he does resemble Alfonso Ribeiro
(http://api.ning.com/files/hYFXRFv1q7aydqLoUnekfmxNf2XitE1PQhfJFz6XCjU0F4bvZB*A2YMvh0QaSMFZElC31MPJStjjRyYpolJ0IbPXzcVl4zpN/AlfonsoRibeiro.jpg)
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_D1ZZyTOG7tQ/SkY9K03u0II/AAAAAAAAE9g/1YfUNOPWNZA/s400/Michael+Jackson+&++Alfonso+Ribeiro.jpg)
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alfonso and ''real michael'' have the same nose and ears, it may be photoshopped off of Alfonso.
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The pic from Grace's post was from this crazy TV documentary that used computer generated images to "reveal" what Mike "really" looked like. :lol: There is a youtube video with this "face". I'll see if I can hunt down the original documentary. It was all pretty absurd.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE)
Oh great! There goes that theory. That actually makes me feel better. That was throwing me for a loop. I didn't even want to touch that. :lol:
I don't see any ressemblance to Alfonso, sorry. Face shape is different.
I have seen some yellow press articles, youtube vids etc. on the imaginatory "future" faces of MJ if he had not turned into the person suffering from Vitiligo, having had nose jobs etc.
These two images however are the only somewhat natural pictures I came across.
I haven't seen them at any other place in the web though. And the forehead, eyes, nose and chin are far more matching young Michael from the Jackson5 than any other picture from the Michael we knew since Bad.
I would say the clone story is very far away but this guy does not go public nor seems eager for friends, log in, activity, publicity or anything that we know from MJ brand marketing.
Maybe the clone story is set up there to make him unbelievable and discredit him so he runs no risk to unveil the truth.
If he indeed resigned and let the place for some other, he for sure has signed some contract.
I have for the time being no indication that he is a wealthy billionaire by profiting from somebody. This makes me think that a closer look could be worthwhile.
Given that the known MJ is the "placed" doppelganger then also the kids are the decoy's kids and not real Michael's.
The doubles we have seen could then have been not the doubles of real MJ but of the doppelganger. And this would strenghten Mo's assumption that the doubles might have been forced into the plot in that way that no matter what there was always some person available to "play, dance, give interviews" for MJ in case of a dropout.
This would mean in the end that we were sold a "happy family" story when in fact the family was being abused, bought by $$$, silenced and - being happy to have escaped poverty as African Americans in times when this was not usual - did stick to their undisclosure agreements.
This could mean that the real MJ is happily and quietly married to a woman and has kids the world has never ever seen.
Strange?
There are thousands of families giving a child away for money. It happens every day.
It was usual for conservative Christians at times that the oldest son would become a monk to give "one son away to God" in order to secure blessings for the clan. Families do this.
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WOOOOW..........that "real" MJ pic blew me away. What if that really is him?
That pic REALLY looks like him. Im speechless right now. It doesnt look PS to me...can anyone tell if it is or not? I need to know. I think we all do. This is messed up.
Thanks Grace!!!! LOL!
I cant even believe this...I dont know what to say.
What about MJ is Thriller and Bad? I think it was him in all the vids. I really do.
OMG......... :o
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The pic from Grace's post was from this crazy TV documentary that used computer generated images to "reveal" what Mike "really" looked like. :lol: There is a youtube video with this "face". I'll see if I can hunt down the original documentary. It was all pretty absurd.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE)
I'm still trying to find the original TV special. It may not be available online. :?
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WOOOOW..........that "real" MJ pic blew me away. What if that really is him?
That pic REALLY looks like him. Im speechless right now. It doesnt look PS to me...can anyone tell if it is or not? I need to know. I think we all do. This is messed up.
You mean the pic that looks like Alfonso Ribiero? lol
Yeah, it's shopped.
1)The eyes, nose, and mouth are too large for the face - in person he would look like an alien. :lol:
2)There are clear lines of demarcation. I don't know how to draw on pictures, but there is a line that runs down the right side of the face that looks like it starts at the hat and runs down right next to the eyebrow and may end at the goatee. Then there is another line under the bottom lip but above the goatee that goes in a straight line across. I can see the lines because Michael's skin is lighter than the face that his features were photoshopped onto.
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Ok going backto Graces Pic....
(http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/136/l_ea8d29da61d74dc1936f6705500d368b.jpg)
I am posting some youth pictures to compare:
1972:
[attachment=3:1az36puj]1972_614117.jpg[/attachment:1az36puj]
1975:
[attachment=2:1az36puj]1975_614150.JPG[/attachment:1az36puj]
1976:
[attachment=1:1az36puj]1976_614152.jpg[/attachment:1az36puj]
In all the above you see the similarity to Joe and his brothers.
The change away from the "hanging" eyes and the strong eyebrows and the strong chin in combination with the first nose job starts here - and the chin change is significant:
1979:
[attachment=0:1az36puj]1979_614169.JPG[/attachment:1az36puj]
Could they have found some very talented young man happy to escape poverty as well and to get into MJ's pants? Of course. I imagine there were several.
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WOOOOW..........that "real" MJ pic blew me away. What if that really is him?
That pic REALLY looks like him. Im speechless right now. It doesnt look PS to me...can anyone tell if it is or not? I need to know. I think we all do. This is messed up.
You mean the pic that looks like Alfonso Ribiero? lol
Yeah, it's shopped.
1)The eyes, nose, and mouth are too large for the face - in person he would look like an alien. :lol:
2)There are clear lines of demarcation. I don't know how to draw on pictures, but there is a line that runs down the right side of the face that looks like it starts at the hat and runs down right next to the eyebrow and may end at the goatee. Then there is another line under the bottom lip but above the goatee that goes in a straight line across. I can see the lines because Michael's skin is lighter than the face that his features were photoshopped onto.
Thank God!!! Wow...I was sweatin there for a sec!! LOL~~~~ Thank you!
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You mean the pic that looks like Alfonso Ribiero? lol
Yeah, it's shopped.
1)The eyes, nose, and mouth are too large for the face - in person he would look like an alien. :lol:
2)There are clear lines of demarcation. I don't know how to draw on pictures, but there is a line that runs down the right side of the face that looks like it starts at the hat and runs down right next to the eyebrow and may end at the goatee. Then there is another line under the bottom lip but above the goatee that goes in a straight line across. I can see the lines because Michael's skin is lighter than the face that his features were photoshopped onto.
The picture is altered but I see no shop. The big and little pixels are all over.
Somebody did wipe but it's all over, the jacket, the face, the hat, even the ear that looks somewhat strange to me.
Maybe a photo expert will detect more.
If it turns out to be faked, the better. One question less.
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The pic from Grace's post was from this crazy TV documentary that used computer generated images to "reveal" what Mike "really" looked like. :lol: There is a youtube video with this "face". I'll see if I can hunt down the original documentary. It was all pretty absurd.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE)
Well, I found a portion of the documentary. Warning: It is very negative and anti-MJ. Frankly, their statements are appalling and makes me want to puke.
Video Description:
A British Documentary about Michael Jackson's Face. In early September 2002, the Five Channel in U.K. relaunched with a Documentary called MICHAEL JACKSON'S FACE. This Documentary programme was a serious study of how the singer's appearance had change throughout his life, since 1979 and focuses on the most famous man on the planet on his bizarre obsession with Plastic Surgery.
The programme attracted the highest audience ever to the U.K's fifth channel, quite a big achievement for a Documentary, over 5.5 Million viewers watched the Documentary. A talking point of the documentary was a Computer Generated Picture of how experts believe Michael Jackson would look like today, if he decided not to undergo Facial Surgery.
The film was serious study of how the singer's ever changing appearance had changed through out the years, since 1979.
[youtube:1bgc2xg7]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kujUWN1UStg[/youtube:1bgc2xg7]
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Theres alot of theories to consider and very believable ones to at..and im going to start from the way beginning to give people a directions to where im going with my Theory :)
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:mrgreen:
Kudos to you!!!
Do NOT get discouraged by the naysayers who think this is IMPOSSIBLE to fathom.
Anything is POSSIBLE!!!
Here is food for thought:
Dr. C.G. Jung and his book and theories.
Title:"The undiscovered self"
Quote from back cover:
In this challenging and provocative work, Dr. Carl Jung-one of history's greatest minds- argues that civilization's future depends on our ability as individuals to resist the collective forces of our society.
Only by gaining an AWARENESS and UNDERSTANDING of one's unconscious mind and true, inner nature-"the undiscovered self"- can we as individuals aquire the self-knowledge that is antithetical to ideological fanaticism.
But this requires that we face our FEAR of the DUALITY of the human psyche- the existence of GOOD and the capacity for EVIL in every individual.
This is "the sum total of individuals"
Peace
:geek:
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Have a look at the teeth and the sideburns.
http://[url=http][img]http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/6464/zhne1.jpg[/img][/url]
...and the nose.
http://[url=http][img]http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5355/198419891.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/581/199019981.jpg[/img][/url]
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Have a look at the teeth and the sideburns.
http://[url=http][img]http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/6464/zhne1.jpg[/img][/url]
...and the nose.
http://[url=http][img]http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5355/198419891.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/581/199019981.jpg[/img][/url]
hey you are one the people that inspired me from the way beginning to do what im doing now lol thanks :)
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Have a look at the teeth and the sideburns.
http://[url=http][img]http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/6464/zhne1.jpg[/img][/url]
...and the nose.
http://[url=http][img]http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5355/198419891.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/581/199019981.jpg[/img][/url]
hey you are one the people that inspired me from the way beginning to do what im doing now lol thanks :)
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Have a look at the teeth and the sideburns.
http://[url=http][img]http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/6464/zhne1.jpg[/img][/url]
...and the nose.
http://[url=http][img]http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5355/198419891.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/581/199019981.jpg[/img][/url]
obvious which 1s are doubles.
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Have a look of the nose.
Black or white
http://[url=http][img]http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/8238/blackorwhitew.jpg[/img][/url]
Blood on the Dancefloor
http://[url=http][img]http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/8849/bloodonthedancefloor.jpg[/img][/url]
Liberian Girl
http://[url=http][img]http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/619/lg1d.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/8928/lg2f.jpg[/img][/url]
Scream
http://[url=http][img]http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/1289/scream1.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/2343/scream2.jpg[/img][/url]
Remember the Time
http://[url=http][img]http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/670/rttd.jpg[/img][/url]
Whatzupwitu
http://[url=http][img]http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/4783/whatzupwitu2.jpg[/img][/url]
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Where were all these comparison pics the last 5 months...? Why weren't they posted earlier?
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Have a look of the nose.
Black or white
http://[url=http][img]http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/8238/blackorwhitew.jpg[/img][/url]
Blood on the Dancefloor
http://[url=http][img]http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/8849/bloodonthedancefloor.jpg[/img][/url]
Liberian Girl
http://[url=http][img]http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/619/lg1d.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/8928/lg2f.jpg[/img][/url]
Scream
http://[url=http][img]http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/1289/scream1.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/2343/scream2.jpg[/img][/url]
Remember the Time
http://[url=http][img]http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/670/rttd.jpg[/img][/url]
Whatzupwitu
http://[url=http][img]http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/4783/whatzupwitu2.jpg[/img][/url]
thanks for sharing these. i believe narrow noses are doubles wider ones are Michael.
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Have a look at the teeth and the sideburns.
http://[url=http][img]http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/6464/zhne1.jpg[/img][/url]
...and the nose.
http://[url=http][img]http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5355/198419891.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/581/199019981.jpg[/img][/url]
obvious which 1s are doubles.
Are u for real ? plz tell me u're just joking. Cuz i want to come on this site still, and posting things like these are really insulting my intelegence.
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Have a look at the teeth and the sideburns.
http://[url=http][img]http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/6464/zhne1.jpg[/img][/url]
...and the nose.
http://[url=http][img]http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5355/198419891.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/581/199019981.jpg[/img][/url]
obvious which 1s are doubles.
Are u for real ? plz tell me u're just joking. Cuz i want to come on this site still, and posting things like these are really insulting my intelegence.
start by looking at the Rock With You , Thriller, and Smooth Criminal. look at the differences. and it's not the angle/lighting bull crap. it's a reality. Michael used doubles...
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Where were all these comparison pics the last 5 months...? Why weren't they posted earlier?
Here you can see how many times I had already posted such pictures.
This Is It Doubles????
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=5812&start=75 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=5812&start=75)
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=6185&start=100 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=6185&start=100)
viewtopic.php?f=36&t=2203 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=2203)
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=7258&start=25 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=7258&start=25)
viewtopic.php?f=38&t=5292 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=5292)
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No offence, people, but this is ridiculous! It's called plastic surgery and fillers. Talking about taking conspiracy theories too far, really... :roll:
I agree !!!! Never heard such ridiculous theories as this. You are going WAY TOO FAR.
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Riddle me this... :lol:
How far is too far and by whose standards? I made the mistake of telling family members during Christmas dinner that I belong to a MJ hoax forum. I was laughed at mercilessly. They made jokes at every chance after that since they think that hoax believers are going too far. Since then some family members have even sent me condescending emails asking if I have seen MJ at Walmart yet. Despite our strong claims for understanding the inconsistencies and oddities of the hoax, people will roll their eyes and laugh at us for believing. We believe in a hoax so why do we place the same limitations as to what is acceptible within the hoax. C'mon ...it's a hoaxed death. Sure some theories stand close to the edge of the "reality cliff". However this is a hoax so many things are ...possible or maybe not possible.The answers lie in the investigation and the findings.
No offence, people, but this is ridiculous! It's called plastic surgery and fillers. Talking about taking conspiracy theories too far, really... :roll:
I agree !!!! Never heard such ridiculous theories as this. You are going WAY TOO FAR.
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Have a look at the teeth and the sideburns.
http://[url=http][img]http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/6464/zhne1.jpg[/img][/url]
...and the nose.
http://[url=http][img]http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5355/198419891.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/581/199019981.jpg[/img][/url]
obvious which 1s are doubles.
Are u for real ? plz tell me u're just joking. Cuz i want to come on this site still, and posting things like these are really insulting my intelegence.
start by looking at the Rock With You , Thriller, and Smooth Criminal. look at the differences. and it's not the angle/lighting bull crap. it's a reality. Michael used doubles...
ok im gonna bring a little reality into play here.... imo im only seeing one person at different angles..... and music videos AERNT shot in ONE DAY.... some take weeks to put together......
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No offence, people, but this is ridiculous! It's called plastic surgery and fillers. Talking about taking conspiracy theories too far, really... :roll:
I agree !!!! Never heard such ridiculous theories as this. You are going WAY TOO FAR.
explain to me what i have said that was "going too far" ;) ..people will say the whole hoax is going WAY TOO FAR and michael being alive is going WAY TOO FAR lol
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All Michael ... :D
(http://i46.tinypic.com/2ebaamu.jpg)
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All Michael ... :D
(http://i46.tinypic.com/2ebaamu.jpg)
ALL MICHAEL..DOUBLES :)
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Have a look at the teeth and the sideburns.
http://[url=http][img]http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/6464/zhne1.jpg[/img][/url]
...and the nose.
http://[url=http][img]http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5355/198419891.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/581/199019981.jpg[/img][/url]
obvious which 1s are doubles.
Are u for real ? plz tell me u're just joking. Cuz i want to come on this site still, and posting things like these are really insulting my intelegence.
start by looking at the Rock With You , Thriller, and Smooth Criminal. look at the differences. and it's not the angle/lighting bull crap. it's a reality. Michael used doubles...
ok im gonna bring a little reality into play here.... imo im only seeing one person at different angles..... and music videos AERNT shot in ONE DAY.... some take weeks to put together......
i agree with you
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"jonathan" just popped up in my mind.
anybody remember that story?
Who's Jonathan?
somebody once showed up, long ago, cant remember the name,on the forum telling about jonathan in connection to doubles. and that we should start looking right around the beginning of the nineties.
anybody?
The person you are referring to, I believe is, Jonathon Barra. I have linked him to Mediahypeagain on twitter. I wrote about him back in November 2009 in my blog which was deleted but I have recreated from the cache.
http://xxserenityxdreamsxx.blogspot.com/2010/04/not-michael-jackson-but-o2-guy-maybe.html
Is this thread you were thinking of?
http://mjkit.forumotion.net/michael-jackson-hoax-death-theories-f2/updated-informant-makes-2nd-contact-provides-more-clues-on-jonathan-t1066.htm
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I understand that. But aren't you saying that there are like, tons that were on the verge of taking over his life for him and that took his place during concerts and interviews, things that are supposed to show his TRUE nature? And if the Illuminati are all about messing with his brain to make him do what they want, why hassle with hiring fakes? I just feel that Michael's entire indentity, persona and real, is being destroyed, I feel like I'm never sure who I'm seeing, and if I'm never sure who I'm seeing, how do I know that story he's telling about how he wrote Billie Jean is true? How do I know if that food he's saying is his favorite is really his favorite? Most of all, how do I know he really cares as much about poor, suffering children any more than the next Joe, orthe poor, poor woman he's dating or married or his kids..? Do you see what I mean? This makes me feel like everything is some kind of big act- I'm glad I haven't liked him all of my life now, I'd feel like I just wasted a lot of time.
I'm sorry, I just had to do what I did with your post. I understand your feelings, but isn't it about time to put your feelings aside and try to look at all that has happened from HIS point of view..?
Like he's given us any kind of opportunity to do that.. Again, how am I supposed to know whose point of view is whose if there are so many fakes? I'm sure they don't care in the least- hell, they probably love it.. As for him.. I'm getting pretty confused as to when he really speaks his mind or not.. then again, I always suspected that all that kid-loving stuff was PR anyway..
-
I understand that. But aren't you saying that there are like, tons that were on the verge of taking over his life for him and that took his place during concerts and interviews, things that are supposed to show his TRUE nature? And if the Illuminati are all about messing with his brain to make him do what they want, why hassle with hiring fakes? I just feel that Michael's entire indentity, persona and real, is being destroyed, I feel like I'm never sure who I'm seeing, and if I'm never sure who I'm seeing, how do I know that story he's telling about how he wrote Billie Jean is true? How do I know if that food he's saying is his favorite is really his favorite? Most of all, how do I know he really cares as much about poor, suffering children any more than the next Joe, orthe poor, poor woman he's dating or married or his kids..? Do you see what I mean? This makes me feel like everything is some kind of big act- I'm glad I haven't liked him all of my life now, I'd feel like I just wasted a lot of time.
I'm sorry, I just had to do what I did with your post. I understand your feelings, but isn't it about time to put your feelings aside and try to look at all that has happened from HIS point of view..?
Like he's given us any kind of opportunity to do that.. Again, how am I supposed to know whose point of view is whose if there are so many fakes? I'm sure they don't care in the least- hell, they probably love it.. As for him.. I'm getting pretty confused as to when he really speaks his mind or not.. then again, I always suspected that all that kid-loving stuff was PR anyway..
I don't want to speak for you Pink Topaz, but I think I get what you're saying.
As much as it would be nice for us to try to see things from Michael's point of view, just how do we know what HIS point of view is?
All we really have is our imagination and speculation as to what went into everything and how all of this came about.
We can put together our own ideas of why and how Michael would do certain things that we think he did(even though we still don't have 100% proof on ANYTHING!), but none of us know him personally.
And with all of this doubles stuff, the variations on what "his" point of view is, grows exponentially.
See, we don't know if "his" point of view was just part of a PR machine as suggested by Pink Topaz.
Part of "programming" if he was a victim of MK-Ultra.
If we're really seeing the different characters of Mike's doubles, or Mike's doubles if they were programmed, or Mike's doubles as instructed by a PR team, or Mike's doubles as instructed by Mike himself.
Heck, it could even be Michael pretending to be a double himself so that if/when stuff hits the fan, he can say, "that wasn't me, that was the other guy!" :?
My head hurts.
-
I understand that. But aren't you saying that there are like, tons that were on the verge of taking over his life for him and that took his place during concerts and interviews, things that are supposed to show his TRUE nature? And if the Illuminati are all about messing with his brain to make him do what they want, why hassle with hiring fakes? I just feel that Michael's entire indentity, persona and real, is being destroyed, I feel like I'm never sure who I'm seeing, and if I'm never sure who I'm seeing, how do I know that story he's telling about how he wrote Billie Jean is true? How do I know if that food he's saying is his favorite is really his favorite? Most of all, how do I know he really cares as much about poor, suffering children any more than the next Joe, orthe poor, poor woman he's dating or married or his kids..? Do you see what I mean? This makes me feel like everything is some kind of big act- I'm glad I haven't liked him all of my life now, I'd feel like I just wasted a lot of time.
I'm sorry, I just had to do what I did with your post. I understand your feelings, but isn't it about time to put your feelings aside and try to look at all that has happened from HIS point of view..?
Like he's given us any kind of opportunity to do that.. Again, how am I supposed to know whose point of view is whose if there are so many fakes? I'm sure they don't care in the least- hell, they probably love it.. As for him.. I'm getting pretty confused as to when he really speaks his mind or not.. then again, I always suspected that all that kid-loving stuff was PR anyway..
I don't want to speak for you Pink Topaz, but I think I get what you're saying.
As much as it would be nice for us to try to see things from Michael's point of view, just how do we know what HIS point of view is?
All we really have is our imagination and speculation as to what went into everything and how all of this came about.
We can put together our own ideas of why and how Michael would do certain things that we think he did(even though we still don't have 100% proof on ANYTHING!), but none of us know him personally.
And with all of this doubles stuff, the variations on what "his" point of view is, grows exponentially.
See, we don't know if "his" point of view was just part of a PR machine as suggested by Pink Topaz.
Part of "programming" if he was a victim of MK-Ultra.
If we're really seeing the different characters of Mike's doubles, or Mike's doubles if they were programmed, or Mike's doubles as instructed by a PR team, or Mike's doubles as instructed by Mike himself.
Heck, it could even be Michael pretending to be a double himself so that if/when stuff hits the fan, he can say, "that wasn't me, that was the other guy!" :?
My head hurts.
EDIT: Thanks for adding to what I said. I'm so sick and tired of always being confused and not knowing what to believe..I was fine until recently but now I feel like everything is spiraling out of control and I can't take it anymore.. I wish he would just make everything clear so that we could understand him.. Because I just realized something: ever since I learned about the hoax in late October I never fully doubted that he's alive, and the only times I've cried over him since then was December when I read the MK stuff, but now, I'm crying, and it's because I..I miss him.. I think I've been so angry these last few days because Easter was the only time I really, really expected to see him, but apparently not, and now I miss him so badly all of a sudden.. I'm sick of doubles, decoys, distractions, fakes, phonies- I want to understand him clearly, and I've been angry because it seems so hard to that now, yet I still care so much.. Even though he's infuriating and baffling I can't stop caring about him.. I've never known what it's like to miss someone I care about like this.. I'm so sorry for being so off-topic, but I just had to say this, as it just hit me now..
-
EDIT: Thanks for adding to what I said. I'm so sick and tired of always being confused and not knowing what to believe..I was fine until recently but now I feel like everything is spiraling out of control and I can't take it anymore.. I wish he would just make everything clear so that we could understand him.. Because I just realized something: ever since I learned about the hoax in late October I never fully doubted that he's alive, and the only times I've cried over him since then was December when I read the MK stuff, but now, I'm crying, and it's because I..I miss him.. I think I've been so angry these last few days because Easter was the only time I really, really expected to see him, but apparently not, and now I miss him so badly all of a sudden.. I'm sick of doubles, decoys, distractions, fakes, phonies- I want to understand him clearly, and I've been angry because it seems so hard to that now, yet I still care so much.. Even though he's infuriating and baffling I can't stop caring about him.. I've never known what it's like to miss someone I care about like this.. I'm so sorry for being so off-topic, but I just had to say this, as it just hit me now..
I wish I had words to help you, we all miss him. It is good to care about him but does not help
anyone to be obsessed. That is why all these stalker fans never gave Michael Jackson a break.
Maybe we can all learn something about ourselves through this.
The more reading I do and even old blogs, it seems everyone thought they knew him up until
Thriller era. Many that seem to be portrayed as friends of Michael, talk of this time past.
But ask yourself this: Would you rather THINK you knew the real Michael Jackson, or really
find out WHO the real Michael Jackson is?
If others who really knew him, read this forum, perhaps some will finally come forward with information,
that is one hope we can have. Perhaps rhetorical questions are being asked as the answer.
-
Have a look of the nose.
Black or white
http://[url=http][img]http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/8238/blackorwhitew.jpg[/img][/url]
Blood on the Dancefloor
http://[url=http][img]http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/8849/bloodonthedancefloor.jpg[/img][/url]
Liberian Girl
http://[url=http][img]http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/619/lg1d.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/8928/lg2f.jpg[/img][/url]
Scream
http://[url=http][img]http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/1289/scream1.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[url=http][img]http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/2343/scream2.jpg[/img][/url]
Remember the Time
http://[url=http][img]http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/670/rttd.jpg[/img][/url]
Whatzupwitu
http://[url=http][img]http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/4783/whatzupwitu2.jpg[/img][/url]
thanks for sharing these. i believe narrow noses are doubles wider ones are Michael.
I share the same belief as you. This is very interesting the say the least, I've never compared 2 different pics of the same thing. REally wow!!! Good finds. :D
-
I personally find this to be very interesting. There's so much about MJ that the public never knew about. I think it's high time that we find out what has been hidden from us all of these years. You did an awesome job. I would also like to say that I am not one to say Michael would never do that to his fans. Keep the Faith!
-
EDIT: Thanks for adding to what I said. I'm so sick and tired of always being confused and not knowing what to believe..I was fine until recently but now I feel like everything is spiraling out of control and I can't take it anymore.. I wish he would just make everything clear so that we could understand him.. Because I just realized something: ever since I learned about the hoax in late October I never fully doubted that he's alive, and the only times I've cried over him since then was December when I read the MK stuff, but now, I'm crying, and it's because I..I miss him.. I think I've been so angry these last few days because Easter was the only time I really, really expected to see him, but apparently not, and now I miss him so badly all of a sudden.. I'm sick of doubles, decoys, distractions, fakes, phonies- I want to understand him clearly, and I've been angry because it seems so hard to that now, yet I still care so much.. Even though he's infuriating and baffling I can't stop caring about him.. I've never known what it's like to miss someone I care about like this.. I'm so sorry for being so off-topic, but I just had to say this, as it just hit me now..
I wish I had words to help you, we all miss him. It is good to care about him but does not help
anyone to be obsessed. That is why all these stalker fans never gave Michael Jackson a break.
Maybe we can all learn something about ourselves through this.
The more reading I do and even old blogs, it seems everyone thought they knew him up until
Thriller era. Many that seem to be portrayed as friends of Michael, talk of this time past.
But ask yourself this: Would you rather THINK you knew the real Michael Jackson, or really
find out WHO the real Michael Jackson is?
If others who really knew him, read this forum, perhaps some will finally come forward with information,
that is one hope we can have. Perhaps rhetorical questions are being asked as the answer.
Thank you so much for your consideration..
I don't think I'm obsessed with him, in fact I very much resent fans that act that way, I can't stand them.. I said care, and I meant care. I hate hearing that so much of his life was ruined and wasted, I just absolutely hate it, because I want him to be happy all the time.. I want to know that he's had a good life so far, and anything otherwise upsets me. I've had a good life myself so far, but I've always been the type of person that is really sensitive to negative or depressing etc. situations.. I get mad and upset with those, situations, not the people in them, I think. I don't want Michael to suffer, I really don't, because he doesn't deserve it.. MK-Ultra and fakes and trials.. Here I go again..But then I get mad at him because this all makes it seem like instead of giving better hints or whatever that there's fakes around, he just hides it and goes along with it and hides it from us, when we only want to help him and understand..
-
:geek: LIFE LESSONS 101
How to put YOURSEF in MJ's shoes.. or anyone elses for that matter 101:
:idea: Empathy, which literally translates as in feeling, is the capability to share another being's emotions and feelings.:idea:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I understand that. But aren't you saying that there are like, tons that were on the verge of taking over his life for him and that took his place during concerts and interviews, things that are supposed to show his TRUE nature? And if the Illuminati are all about messing with his brain to make him do what they want, why hassle with hiring fakes? I just feel that Michael's entire indentity, persona and real, is being destroyed, I feel like I'm never sure who I'm seeing, and if I'm never sure who I'm seeing, how do I know that story he's telling about how he wrote Billie Jean is true? How do I know if that food he's saying is his favorite is really his favorite? Most of all, how do I know he really cares as much about poor, suffering children any more than the next Joe, orthe poor, poor woman he's dating or married or his kids..? Do you see what I mean? This makes me feel like everything is some kind of big act- I'm glad I haven't liked him all of my life now, I'd feel like I just wasted a lot of time.
I'm sorry, I just had to do what I did with your post. I understand your feelings, but isn't it about time to put your feelings aside and try to look at all that has happened from HIS point of view..?
Like he's given us any kind of opportunity to do that.. Again, how am I supposed to know whose point of view is whose if there are so many fakes? I'm sure they don't care in the least- hell, they probably love it.. As for him.. I'm getting pretty confused as to when he really speaks his mind or not.. then again, I always suspected that all that kid-loving stuff was PR anyway..
I don't want to speak for you Pink Topaz, but I think I get what you're saying.
As much as it would be nice for us to try to see things from Michael's point of view, just how do we know what HIS point of view is?
All we really have is our imagination and speculation as to what went into everything and how all of this came about.
We can put together our own ideas of why and how Michael would do certain things that we think he did(even though we still don't have 100% proof on ANYTHING!), but none of us know him personally.
And with all of this doubles stuff, the variations on what "his" point of view is, grows exponentially.
See, we don't know if "his" point of view was just part of a PR machine as suggested by Pink Topaz.
Part of "programming" if he was a victim of MK-Ultra.
If we're really seeing the different characters of Mike's doubles, or Mike's doubles if they were programmed, or Mike's doubles as instructed by a PR team, or Mike's doubles as instructed by Mike himself.
Heck, it could even be Michael pretending to be a double himself so that if/when stuff hits the fan, he can say, "that wasn't me, that was the other guy!" :?
My head hurts.
-
well, i'm no expert in this kind of stuff but.....i think the one that looks like putting a heavy make-up is the double...JMHO....
-
I understand that. But aren't you saying that there are like, tons that were on the verge of taking over his life for him and that took his place during concerts and interviews, things that are supposed to show his TRUE nature? And if the Illuminati are all about messing with his brain to make him do what they want, why hassle with hiring fakes? I just feel that Michael's entire indentity, persona and real, is being destroyed, I feel like I'm never sure who I'm seeing, and if I'm never sure who I'm seeing, how do I know that story he's telling about how he wrote Billie Jean is true? How do I know if that food he's saying is his favorite is really his favorite? Most of all, how do I know he really cares as much about poor, suffering children any more than the next Joe, orthe poor, poor woman he's dating or married or his kids..? Do you see what I mean? This makes me feel like everything is some kind of big act- I'm glad I haven't liked him all of my life now, I'd feel like I just wasted a lot of time.
I'm sorry, I just had to do what I did with your post. I understand your feelings, but isn't it about time to put your feelings aside and try to look at all that has happened from HIS point of view..?
Like he's given us any kind of opportunity to do that.. Again, how am I supposed to know whose point of view is whose if there are so many fakes? I'm sure they don't care in the least- hell, they probably love it.. As for him.. I'm getting pretty confused as to when he really speaks his mind or not.. then again, I always suspected that all that kid-loving stuff was PR anyway..
PinkTopaz, I'm talking about all the shit he had to go through. Aside from the doubles, remember that HIS name was dragged through the mud time after time. Michael Jackson was framed twice, and a huge part of the people on this planet still think he is guilty of those horrific false accusations. He was crucified, while there wasn't one single piece of evidence against him. His childhood, MK Ultra, people doggin' him around, all the shit presented by the media - THAT is what I meant by try to look at all that has happened from HIS point of view.
-
Well Mo, I suppose I explained myself:
EDIT: Thanks for adding to what I said. I'm so sick and tired of always being confused and not knowing what to believe..I was fine until recently but now I feel like everything is spiraling out of control and I can't take it anymore.. I wish he would just make everything clear so that we could understand him.. Because I just realized something: ever since I learned about the hoax in late October I never fully doubted that he's alive, and the only times I've cried over him since then was December when I read the MK stuff, but now, I'm crying, and it's because I..I miss him.. I think I've been so angry these last few days because Easter was the only time I really, really expected to see him, but apparently not, and now I miss him so badly all of a sudden.. I'm sick of doubles, decoys, distractions, fakes, phonies- I want to understand him clearly, and I've been angry because it seems so hard to that now, yet I still care so much.. Even though he's infuriating and baffling I can't stop caring about him.. I've never known what it's like to miss someone I care about like this.. I'm so sorry for being so off-topic, but I just had to say this, as it just hit me now..
I wish I had words to help you, we all miss him. It is good to care about him but does not help
anyone to be obsessed. That is why all these stalker fans never gave Michael Jackson a break.
Maybe we can all learn something about ourselves through this.
The more reading I do and even old blogs, it seems everyone thought they knew him up until
Thriller era. Many that seem to be portrayed as friends of Michael, talk of this time past.
But ask yourself this: Would you rather THINK you knew the real Michael Jackson, or really
find out WHO the real Michael Jackson is?
If others who really knew him, read this forum, perhaps some will finally come forward with information,
that is one hope we can have. Perhaps rhetorical questions are being asked as the answer.
Thank you so much for your consideration..
I don't think I'm obsessed with him, in fact I very much resent fans that act that way, I can't stand them.. I said care, and I meant care. I hate hearing that so much of his life was ruined and wasted, I just absolutely hate it, because I want him to be happy all the time.. I want to know that he's had a good life so far, and anything otherwise upsets me. I've had a good life myself so far, but I've always been the type of person that is really sensitive to negative or depressing etc. situations.. I get mad and upset with those, situations, not the people in them, I think. I don't want Michael to suffer, I really don't, because he doesn't deserve it.. MK-Ultra and fakes and trials.. Here I go again..But then I get mad at him because this all makes it seem like instead of giving better hints or whatever that there's fakes around, he just hides it and adds more and hides it from us, when we only want to help him and understand..
-
No matter how hard I try to see it like the people who believe in doubles: I don't see it....
And about the wide/narrow nose: When you laugh or whatever, your nose looks wider...
-
No matter how hard I try to see it like the people who believe in doubles: I don't see it....
And about the wide/narrow nose: When you laugh or whatever, your nose looks wider...
i am with you, I keep watching them over and over again and to me it's Michael every single time....
-
And about the wide/narrow nose: When you laugh or whatever, your nose looks wider...
Here he does not laugh, and yet the nose is different. And the fingers, thick and thin.
http://[url=http][img]http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/5731/hndeverschi1.jpg[/img][/url]
-
And about the wide/narrow nose: When you laugh or whatever, your nose looks wider...
Here he does not laugh, and yet the nose is different. And the fingers, thick and thin.
http://[url=http][img]http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/5731/hndeverschi1.jpg[/img][/url]
I'm sorry, but I don't see 2 different Michaels on your pictures.
The nose looks the same to me, his fingers also. On the second pic they look thin because of the angle.
-
I don't see any difference in the nose, nor in the fingers. In the bottom pic the hand is strechted and in the other the hand is a little bowed, so you don't look right on top of the hand. That makes the fingers look thicker, I think.
-
And about the wide/narrow nose: When you laugh or whatever, your nose looks wider...
Here he does not laugh, and yet the nose is different. And the fingers, thick and thin.
(http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/5731/hndeverschi1.jpg)
I think it's one and the same person. No double.
-
The pic from Grace's post was from this crazy TV documentary that used computer generated images to "reveal" what Mike "really" looked like. :lol: There is a youtube video with this "face". I'll see if I can hunt down the original documentary. It was all pretty absurd.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udjugTzEdRE)
Oh great! There goes that theory. That actually makes me feel better. That was throwing me for a loop. I didn't even want to touch that. :lol:
I don't see any ressemblance to Alfonso, sorry. Face shape is different.
I have seen some yellow press articles, youtube vids etc. on the imaginatory "future" faces of MJ if he had not turned into the person suffering from Vitiligo, having had nose jobs etc.
These two images however are the only somewhat natural pictures I came across.
I haven't seen them at any other place in the web though. And the forehead, eyes, nose and chin are far more matching young Michael from the Jackson5 than any other picture from the Michael we knew since Bad.
I would say the clone story is very far away but this guy does not go public nor seems eager for friends, log in, activity, publicity or anything that we know from MJ brand marketing.
Maybe the clone story is set up there to make him unbelievable and discredit him so he runs no risk to unveil the truth.
If he indeed resigned and let the place for some other, he for sure has signed some contract.
I have for the time being no indication that he is a wealthy billionaire by profiting from somebody. This makes me think that a closer look could be worthwhile.
Given that the known MJ is the "placed" doppelganger then also the kids are the decoy's kids and not real Michael's.
The doubles we have seen could then have been not the doubles of real MJ but of the doppelganger. And this would strenghten Mo's assumption that the doubles might have been forced into the plot in that way that no matter what there was always some person available to "play, dance, give interviews" for MJ in case of a dropout.
This would mean in the end that we were sold a "happy family" story when in fact the family was being abused, bought by $$$, silenced and - being happy to have escaped poverty as African Americans in times when this was not usual - did stick to their undisclosure agreements.
This could mean that the real MJ is happily and quietly married to a woman and has kids the world has never ever seen.
Strange?
There are thousands of families giving a child away for money. It happens every day.
It was usual for conservative Christians at times that the oldest son would become a monk to give "one son away to God" in order to secure blessings for the clan. Families do this.
Hmm, I´m just taking up to Grace´s and wizzkidd´s suggestions:
If the M.J. most of us merely knew from gazettes, TV, videos & interviews over the last 20 years wasn´t "the real one" -
not only a little different inside - but also a form of "collage" of several different persons in his public physical appearance -
who could presume a right to judge him?
Didn´t he give people what they expected in all these years - and much more?
The synthesis of his art and his self-creation as a part of it finally mediated the "vision of love" all over the world.
A vision doesn´t claim to be "real" as such - but it can touch off something real.
That´s not mutually exclusive, is it?...
So even if the iconic figure wasn´t real - I think the heart of it still is.
-
And about the wide/narrow nose: When you laugh or whatever, your nose looks wider...
Here he does not laugh, and yet the nose is different. And the fingers, thick and thin.
(http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/5731/hndeverschi1.jpg)
I think it's one and the same person. No double.
I think that it's the same person. His hands are swollen in the first picture. Remember he had lupus.
-
No matter how hard I try to see it like the people who believe in doubles: I don't see it....
And about the wide/narrow nose: When you laugh or whatever, your nose looks wider...
i am with you, I keep watching them over and over again and to me it's Michael every single time....
I agree girls ;)
-
My opinion is that Michael Jackson has since...hm...15 or more years a bigger head and looks higher but in that age a head dosn't grow and you don't get higher..
http://cdn.sheknows.com/articles/brooke ... morial.jpg (http://cdn.sheknows.com/articles/brooke-shields-michael-jackson-memorial.jpg)
His head was very small in the early years, but he was adult, so the head dosn't grow and when you lost wait and the straight hair dosn't make the head bigger...that whould make it smaller !
Here you see how much greater he became...
http://static.tvguide.com/MediaBin/Gall ... trial4.jpg (http://static.tvguide.com/MediaBin/Galleries/Editorial/090622/Michael_Jackson_Retrospective/MichaelJackson_trial4.jpg)
I don't know him so good, but i have tried to get a feeling for him.
I seems that we havn't seen him for a very long time and that could you made think that he was dead since years..i can't see the ...i say smaller Michael very very long time, but there was a feeling that i had when i saw DD at Larry King ! The great Michael was to big for this disgues...his head....no and his body language, no....but it was the aura from the smaller Michael !
Look, maybee i am totally wrong....but this interview reminds me to DD :, how he is moving his head....look ! Same kind he bow his head.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W70Y_CHn ... re=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W70Y_CHnJhQ&feature=related)
here Dave Dave :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=En5Q4syywcw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=En5Q4syywcw)
What's your opinion ?
-
I don't know him so good, but i have tried to get a feeling for him.
I seems that we havn't seen him for a very long time and that could you made think that he was dead since years..i can't see the ...i say smaller Michael very very long time, but there was a feeling that i had when i saw DD at Larry King ! The great Michael was to big for this disgues...his head....no and his body language, no....but it was the aura from the smaller Michael !
Yes, that's right, only would a double take the place of Michael in the family? I can not know this.
-
I don't know him so good, but i have tried to get a feeling for him.
I seems that we havn't seen him for a very long time and that could you made think that he was dead since years..i can't see the ...i say smaller Michael very very long time, but there was a feeling that i had when i saw DD at Larry King ! The great Michael was to big for this disgues...his head....no and his body language, no....but it was the aura from the smaller Michael !
Yes, that's right, only would a double take the place of Michael in the family? I can not know this.
He could have been, especially if there was a blood connection...
-
All these pics..........wow...Im trying SOOOOO hard to see that these could be doubles but I just cannot. However, I DO believe that orange pants in TII was NOT mj at all.
I see differences in all these pics, but I also see the same features. Its just hard for me to see a different person. In the last 2 pics, I think its him cus his thumbs are exactly the same, but I do see slight differences elsewhere....this is what happens every time I try and spot a double....it just doesnt work...my mind wont let me see it...His hair is different in both pics so maybe that allows some people to "see" a different person....
-
Can this perhaps an indication of a second Michael have been? Michael has, as we know, nothing left to chance.
http://[url=http][img]http://img697.imageshack.us/img697/115/michaeljacksondangerousl.jpg[/img][/url]
The pictures as a child are just one example.
But have a look of the number 7/7/9.
http://[url=http][img]http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/8560/twin1.jpg[/img][/url]
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I don't know him so good, but i have tried to get a feeling for him.
I seems that we havn't seen him for a very long time and that could you made think that he was dead since years..i can't see the ...i say smaller Michael very very long time, but there was a feeling that i had when i saw DD at Larry King ! The great Michael was to big for this disgues...his head....no and his body language, no....but it was the aura from the smaller Michael !
Yes, that's right, only would a double take the place of Michael in the family? I can not know this.
He could have been, especially if there was a blood connection...
Are you trying to say the twin theory? Or something else?
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I think not a twin....he would be same hight and not a smaller head and a bigger....no, not a twin.
Is it rearly possible that a man can change in this way...i was often told that he has done another operation...but look at the celebs who are doing surgency ( right written ?????ohoh....) ...you see it and it seems not natural at all...but Michael in every time look like he was born like this... not the nose, but all the other thinks...they put a family member to him, make a photo and the world beleave that it's Michael.
In my linked video's you could see DD with the Michael from the early years...have you ever saw the great Michael with him ? Or Marlon Brandon with him the last years ?
I wonder that there was not one picture from Michael with his kids and his parents....in all the years...not with his brothers and sisters and the kids...never....not one in 12 years ?
There are photos and videos with the younger Michael with his familiy, but noch from the past 15 years, also not with Diane Ross....only with Liz Taylor.
In the video from Michael from 198 ????, that i have linked, he speaks about the situation, that he was not very happy with all that...ppl scared him...not a normal life.
I could understand that he can't stand this any longer !
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What when the Michael from the past 15 years is rearly white ? And he don't wear a wig ? A white men has straight hair, not the curls.
If Michael rearly have used the bleach cremes for the hole body for so much years...that was so dangerous...he must be very very sick from that.
At the TII rehersals the big Michael with the straight hair ...it lookes like....( i normaly use a translation programm, but now not, so i miss so much words...) this hair was long time not washed ?
Can a wig ever look like this ?
Why was the " Heal the world " foundation closed in the early 2000 ( i think 2002 ?). It was so importend for the real Michael and i can't find a reason that this was happend when he has a hand on it.
No new released songs, no creative working, it seems like he was made himself down....spends to much money and so on.
All the earlier Michael has build up, the new break down....can you understand...i have less time and have to leave....
Have a nice evening !
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In the many pictures of MJ adult there are two types of MJ: small chin and strong chin.
The aura is different as well.
Small chin seems more female, more shy, more sensitive. I called him the "roe eyed" once.
Strong chin and jaw bones seems more male, more convinced, more energetic.
This is a video of the male MJ:
[youtube:2ukqd30p]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odaIG1eu840&feature=related[/youtube:2ukqd30p]
(listen to the speech, his objectives and where he wanted to be heading - interesting in today's light.)
Who is this?
[attachment=1:2ukqd30p]1992_614204.JPG[/attachment:2ukqd30p]
[attachment=4:2ukqd30p]1994_614206.JPG[/attachment:2ukqd30p]
[attachment=0:2ukqd30p]1996_614223.JPG[/attachment:2ukqd30p]
This is the male, strong one:
[attachment=2:2ukqd30p]1988_039.jpg[/attachment:2ukqd30p]
[attachment=3:2ukqd30p]1995_614222.JPG[/attachment:2ukqd30p]
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This is "roe eye":
[attachment=4:1gq90ifn]300,http _a323.yahoofs.com_ymg_allgemein_allgemein-85949930-1246020747.jpg[/attachment:1gq90ifn]
[attachment=2:1gq90ifn]5311d89ea86702f835d1e5cf0785-grande.jpg[/attachment:1gq90ifn]
[attachment=1:1gq90ifn]invincible.jpg[/attachment:1gq90ifn]
[attachment=0:1gq90ifn]cut_027.jpg[/attachment:1gq90ifn]
[attachment=3:1gq90ifn]4237949720a147796296o.jpg[/attachment:1gq90ifn]
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[attachment=2:2tfea3u5]michaeljacksonnotdead_wordpress_com_michael_jackson_ill.jpg[/attachment:2tfea3u5]
And this is convincing MJ leaving the hotel room on March 5, 2009 and all fuddled behind:
[attachment=1:2tfea3u5]o2_original_before_photoshopping_article-1161879-03E28492000005DC-199_468x728.jpg[/attachment:2tfea3u5]
and at London cinema:
[attachment=0:2tfea3u5]012.jpg[/attachment:2tfea3u5]
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what are you trying to show in all these pics? :?
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We have seen two Michaels in parallel singing, performing, dancing, giving interviews.
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We have seen two Michaels in parallel singing, performing, dancing, giving interviews.
Oh pretty much same person, dual personalities? (double)?
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There's a difference between seeing doubles and there being doubles
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Whatever you like more:
1 person 2 personalities
(split personalities as witnesses stated, making a huge difference betwenn stage / performance and "normal" life
2 persons 2 personalities
(two different people with face jobs, hired double, twin, brother, cousin, nephew... )
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Whatever you like more:
1 person 2 personalities
(split personalities as witnesses stated, making a huge difference betwenn stage / performance and "normal" life
2 persons 2 personalities
(two different people with face jobs, hired double, twin, brother, cousin, nephew... )
Oh ok, got ya.
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No matter how hard I try to see it like the people who believe in doubles: I don't see it....
And about the wide/narrow nose: When you laugh or whatever, your nose looks wider...
i am with you, I keep watching them over and over again and to me it's Michael every single time....
I agree girls ;)
I agree with you as well. It is Michael. The ONE and ONLY Michael. He has used decoys and such in the past but I am not buying this Twin or Doppleganger theory at all.
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Why there are two signatures from MJ, and then different. This is the contract for TII.
http://[url=http][img]http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/6888/aegvertragjpg1.jpg[/img][/url]
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There's a difference between seeing doubles and there being doubles
NO twin, NO doubles or anything else funny here
It's all Michael 100%
As for the signature...I had posted on another thread i noticed that they were different...that to me i cannot explain...why would he sign it twice? I dont know much about legal stuff
However everyone can write their signatures different.
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There's a difference between seeing doubles and there being doubles
NO twin, NO doubles or anything else funny here
It's all Michael 100%
As for the signature...I had posted on another thread i noticed that they were different...that to me i cannot explain...why would he sign it twice? I dont know much about legal stuff
However everyone can write their signatures different.
Agree :)
Also, the signature to the right looks more like Michael's signature than the left one does.
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These theories are possible, the further down the rabbit hole we go we will realize that our minds create our own realities. This is why so many theories regarding MJ and just plain life in general can be true. ;)
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There are two signatures as one is for the Company MJCC and one for Michael himself.
The signatures are almost similar but he may have tried to keep them separate. Depends on what he submitted as specimen when he incorporated the Company. There is just an extra twirl in there - not much of a difference.
All the above pics are MJ, as a user online here said - he has a weak lower lip which shows more of his left teeth when he smiles. You can see that all of the above pics show more teeth on the lower left side whenever he smiles. That means that all those are MJ - a double would not be able to do that all the time.
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What do you think of this myspace of the Real Michael Jackson?
Compare his pictures to the young MJ boy pictures.
[attachment=1:28pz7ko0]realmichaeljackson_myspace.jpg[/attachment:28pz7ko0]
[attachment=0:28pz7ko0]realmichaeljackson_myspace_2.jpg[/attachment:28pz7ko0]
Read the incredible statements there.
http://www.myspace.com/realmichaeljackson
Think outside of the box with what we know now.
Could it be that the MJ we know was planted for marketing purposes to keep the brand going?
Just asking your thoughts.
While this may be true. How do you explain the white Michael with the magnetic charisma and the moves and even the ability to sing live - for eg: at the President's gala. Also if there were doubles, would he not fulfill more commitments and not back out every now and then.
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Why there are two signatures from MJ, and then different. This is the contract for TII.
(http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/6888/aegvertragjpg1.jpg)
:geek:
Ok,
First I am stating for the RECORD I do NOT ever like to make comments on these types of matters, IE: MJ's contracts, or anything to do with his children, or estate, anything to do with his personal finances.
But, I feel I need to address this name signing issue so it doesn't get carried away.
When you are a brand name/company entity Michael Jackson Company LLC and then the person (human being) MJ you sign them as two different characters.
One signature is for his Company MICHAEL JACKSON COMPANY LLC and one for him as the entertainer Michael Jackson.
Ok
Peace
:geek:
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@wisskidd
Is the 2nd vid out yet? I'm anxious to see it!! :D
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@wisskidd
Is the 2nd vid out yet? I'm anxious to see it!! :D
It will definitely be up tomorrow :) i know people on here on the forum and on youtube is ready to go deeper inside the rabbit hole lol ;)
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No matter how hard I try to see it like the people who believe in doubles: I don't see it....
And about the wide/narrow nose: When you laugh or whatever, your nose looks wider...
i am with you, I keep watching them over and over again and to me it's Michael every single time....
I agree girls ;)
I agree with you as well. It is Michael. The ONE and ONLY Michael. He has used decoys and such in the past but I am not buying this Twin or Doppleganger theory at all.
I also agree with you.
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I think people are afraid to accept the possibility that they have been deceived for 25 years. It's a dark place to go to in your mind but it is extremely plausible no matter how you look at it.
Those who staunchly deny the doubles theory as plausible are in denial.
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I think people are afraid to accept the possibility that they have been deceived for 25 years. It's a dark place to go to in your mind but it is extremely plausible no matter how you look at it.
Those who staunchly deny the doubles theory as plausible are in denial.
i agree totally agree with you..and its time to get out of wonderland and face reality of that possiblility
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I think people are afraid to accept the possibility that they have been deceived for 25 years. It's a dark place to go to in your mind but it is extremely plausible no matter how you look at it.
Those who staunchly deny the doubles theory as plausible are in denial.
i agree totally agree with you..and its time to get out of wonderland and face reality of that possiblility
"get out of wonderland"?!?! Because people believed they were actually seeing what they were SUPPOSED to be seeing for 20+ goshdarn years?! Before you all lay into me, I do NOT deny this theory and I know how plausible it is. But I can also see that it's one of the sickest, twisted-up things I've ever heard of, excluding MK-Ultra, of course, which has its own planet of repulsiveness.. A lot of people don't have a soul of steel like you, Bec, Mo, Souza, etc, and to learn that all this time was WASTED on fakes.. God. This hoax has showed me some of the most sick ideas on Earth, and knowing that practically Michael's whole life is a total waste.. That person here named Hopeless is a pretty good summary, since reading this nothing about "Michael" brings me joy anymore, just worry and depression..anyone who cares even a little will have a piece of their heart smashed by this, what else would you think?
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A lot of people don't have a soul of steel like you, Bec, Mo, Souza, etc, and to learn that all this time was WASTED on fakes.. God. This hoax has showed me some of the most sick ideas on Earth, and knowing that practically Michael's whole life is a total waste.. That person here named Hopeless is a pretty good summary, since reading this nothing about "Michael" brings me joy anymore, just worry and depression..anyone who cares even a little will have a piece of their heart smashed by this, what else would you think?
That is quite something you state here PinkTopaz. Soul of steel? No, I don't have a soul of steal, I'm just being realistic, down to earth. We have compared hundreds of photos over the last months, as we noticed different facial features in the beginning of the hoax already. Maybe the fact that Souza and I are not fans made it easier for us to realize quite quickly that there has been more than one MJ for years, but that doesn't mean we have souls of steel. Believe me, we had a very rough time researching MK Ultra and some of the other subjects we wrote theories about, those didn't leave us untouched. It has been an emotional roller-coaster for me as well.
I wouldn't say Mike's whole life is a total waste, quite the contrary. I'm sorry to hear that you feel that way. Try to take some distance from your personal feelings, it will be easier to look at the big picture when you're not so emotionally involved.
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A lot of people don't have a soul of steel like you, Bec, Mo, Souza, etc, and to learn that all this time was WASTED on fakes.. God. This hoax has showed me some of the most sick ideas on Earth, and knowing that practically Michael's whole life is a total waste.. That person here named Hopeless is a pretty good summary, since reading this nothing about "Michael" brings me joy anymore, just worry and depression..anyone who cares even a little will have a piece of their heart smashed by this, what else would you think?
That is quite something you state here PinkTopaz. Soul of steel? No, I don't have a soul of steal, I'm just being realistic, down to earth. We have compared hundreds of photos over the last months, as we noticed different facial features in the beginning of the hoax already. Maybe the fact that Souza and I are not fans made it easier for us to realize quite quickly that there has been more than one MJ for years, but that doesn't mean we have souls of steel. Believe me, we had a very rough time researching MK Ultra and some of the other subjects we wrote theories about, those didn't leave us untouched. It has been an emotional roller-coaster for me as well.
I wouldn't say Mike's whole life is a total waste, quite the contrary. I'm sorry to hear that you feel that way. Try to take some distance from your personal feelings, it will be easier to look at the big picture when you're not so emotionally involved.
I know you guys were affected by MK because you'd have to be inhuman not to. However, I am a very weak person emotionally, and I guess it just feels like everyone else is able to bear everything so much better.. I've never taken distance from my feelings before, and I don't know how.. I'm just so afraid that I'll come out of this seeing Michael as a total stranger, physically, outside, and on the inside, I know it's selfish and stupid but I just can't deny that it will break my heart completely.. and I say it's been a waste because he's had SUCH an impact on this world, and so many, many poor people love and respect.. well, a lie, really.. His genius, his personality don't have an ounce of authentic soul in them anymore, who knows who said or did this or that..
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Pink,
I appreciate your expression of your feelings. I am sorry that you are hurting. All of us have been through ups and downs. Some got even so ill about MJ that they had to go to hospital.
It is very difficult to find an illusion bubble to burst. It happens to everybody being in love.
It feels like "I lost my son" when the son confesses he's gay and most likely the desired grandchildren are just kicked out of a mother's life.
Dying illusions are indeed a loss and all mourning it is justified.
HOWEVER: there is always something new starting when old clothes burn.
Remember TII the burning of the jacket?
I appreciate this board for one reason:
there are fans and non-fans and all are striving for truth.
This exceptional constellation has a very huge advantage compared to the fan-only boards:
The fans will contribute what they know and love and treasured over decennies of being a fan - from photos to movies to performances to articles.
The non-fans will keep a cool head sorting things out.
This may sound somewhat harsh once in a while to a bleeding heart but it is NOT meant that way and it is not steel-cold. It is helpful.
We have true treasures from both point of views to share.
We are not here to hurt each other - on the contrary.
Thank you for your openness. I hope I could give you a hug back. :)
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All the above pics are MJ, as a user online here said - he has a weak lower lip which shows more of his left teeth when he smiles. You can see that all of the above pics show more teeth on the lower left side whenever he smiles. That means that all those are MJ - a double would not be able to do that all the time.
I agree!
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I think people are afraid to accept the possibility that they have been deceived for 25 years. It's a dark place to go to in your mind but it is extremely plausible no matter how you look at it.
Those who staunchly deny the doubles theory as plausible are in denial.
i agree totally agree with you..and its time to get out of wonderland and face reality of that possiblility
I guess a little vial of Jabberwocky blood is nowhere near enough here... :lol:
So let´s say M.J. had a permanent doppelganger over a long time period / 20 years+ .
That would mean everyone of us ( under 30) is all the same familar with "Mr.X" appearance as with Michaels.
I never met Michael Jackson in my life - so I really can´t set myself up as an expert in his looks or mannerism.
What we allegedly know about him is what was broadcasted in public. I wouldn´t define those things as "facts".
Well, whoever it might be here on this picture - he better stays in hiding - for his own and my safety...
42 mins. CPR won´t do it for me! :P
http://i33.tinypic.com/2ld86lf.jpg (http://i33.tinypic.com/2ld86lf.jpg)
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I've asked it in the other double thread but I'm going to ask it again. I have the feeling that most of the people who believe in doubles are no fans, am I right?
I'm a fan for almost 20 years now, and I don't see the differences.
It seems strange to me that the people who are long time fans never noticed the differences...
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In answer to your question. I am a fan and I do believe in doubles. I have been a fan since I was 12 years old. The first concert I ever went to was Jackson5 when they toured here in the 70's . My mom made my big sister take me cause I was too little to go by myself. To get to the reason why I believe in doubles, I have always scratched my head over the many changes I have witnessed over the years and I have dismissed the gut feelings and intuitions as being wrong because it just seemed too out there to believe. But it all came to the forefront again while watching the O2 anouncment on the TV. Straight away my radar was going off telling me something was not right. I was making plans to go see the concert in London while I was visitting my daughter in the UK. It was to be my 50th birthday present. What I'm trying to say is that I have been a fan from my childhood. And through out my adult life. I have stood up to people and put them in their place whenever anyone has made disparaging remarks and vulgar jokes about Mike. I have even asked on of my husband's friends to leave a BBQ we were hosting because he made a bad joke about MJ. And I really love Mike for his genious talent and the wonderful years of entertainment he has given me all of my life. He truly is the last of the great song and dance men. He doesn't however have to be perfect for me to continue to love him. He could never let me down and He doesn't owe me anything. I know that if I had the means to do it, I would have someone go to work and do the parts of my job that I don't enjoy so much. I don't view the use of a double as a deception at all. His message is still the same, so retains authenticity. There have been times I have been so busy raising children, going to work, keeping my husband fed and watered, ect, that I have said I wish there were two of me to cope. The 02 anouncement was the beginning of finally listening to what my intuition had been leaning me towards for all these years. ....just the ramblings of an older fan here.
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I've asked it in the other double thread but I'm going to ask it again. I have the feeling that most of the people who believe in doubles are no fans, am I right?
I'm a fan for almost 20 years now, and I don't see the differences.
It seems strange to me that the people who are long time fans never noticed the differences...
Hi MJJ1982,
I have been a MJ fan from the 1970 till now.
Also visited a lot of concerts.
Like the one in Oostende after the passing of Lady Di.
And even the pictures of that concert are from a MJ that i believe is not the real one.
I have been comparing 1000 of pictures from september with Souza and Mo and we are still wondering who the real Michael Jackson is.
And as far for the O2 announcement, that was really ringing my bells because the first time it was on tv I was going:
WHO THE FUCK IS THAT GUY??????
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In answer to your question. I am a fan and I do believe in doubles. I have been a fan since I was 12 years old. The first concert I ever went to was Jackson5 when they toured here in the 70's . My mom made my big sister take me cause I was too little to go by myself. To get to the reason why I believe in doubles, I have always scratched my head over the many changes I have witnessed over the years and I have dismissed the gut feelings and intuitions as being wrong because it just seemed too out there to believe. But it all came to the forefront again while watching the O2 anouncment on the TV. Straight away my radar was going off telling me something was not right. I was making plans to go see the concert in London while I was visitting my daughter in the UK. It was to be my 50th birthday present. What I'm trying to say is that I have been a fan from my childhood. And through out my adult life. I have stood up to people and put them in their place whenever anyone has made disparaging remarks and vulgar jokes about Mike. I have even asked on of my husband's friends to leave a BBQ we were hosting because he made a bad joke about MJ. And I really love Mike for his genious talent and the wonderful years of entertainment he has given me all of my life. He truly is the last of the great song and dance men. He doesn't however have to be perfect for me to continue to love him. He could never let me down and He doesn't owe me anything. I know that if I had the means to do it, I would have someone go to work and do the parts of my job that I don't enjoy so much. I don't view the use of a double as a deception at all. His message is still the same, so retains authenticity. There have been times I have been so busy raising children, going to work, keeping my husband fed and watered, ect, that I have said I wish there were two of me to cope. The 02 anouncement was the beginning of finally listening to what my intuition had been leaning me towards for all these years. ....just the ramblings of an older fan here.
Well I'm sorry, but if there is one to the horrible extent that Rag Doll described up there, there are a lot of fans and people who admire him who are going to feel differently. My eyes are swollen and look absolutely ridiculous right now, as a matter of fact.. People have griped since the Dangerous era, I've seen, about how much Michael's sound changed (for the worse) and how his career started to go downhill then, and there's a whole LA Times article with some famous music critic where he says that he used to know Michael, but fell ou of touch with him in 1995 or '6 because he was trying to tell him how HIStory was flopping and how he could make his sound more like the way people knew it and loved it or something.. I think many people, especially longtime fans, will be as grief-stricken as I am if worst comes to one of the worst BAMSDay scenarios and a stranger shows up.. and I know that no random person in the public has really known Michael all of these years, but they at least that they were getting to know him the way fans of other celebrities do, for gosh's sake, and Michael seemed to be such an extremely lovable person, too.. I don't know, if it turns out to be like Rag Doll says (I pray pray pray it's not to that extent with the fakes) I can safely assume a lot of people will be very, very upset..
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PinkTopaz wrote:
Well I'm sorry, but if there is one to the horrible extent that Rag Doll described up there, there are a lot of fans and people who admire him who are going to feel differently. My eyes are swollen and look absolutely ridiculous right now, as a matter of fact.. People have griped since the Dangerous era, I've seen, about how much Michael's sound changed (for the worse) and how his career started to go downhill then, and there's a whole LA Times article with some famous music critic where he says that he used to know Michael, but fell ou of touch with him in 1995 or '6 because he was trying to tell him how HIStory was flopping and how he could make his sound more like the way people knew it and loved it or something.. I think many people, especially longtime fans, will be as grief-stricken as I am if worst comes to one of the worst BAMSDay scenarios and a stranger shows up.. and I know that no random person in the public has really known Michael all of these years, but they at least that they were getting to know him the way fans of other celebrities do, for gosh's sake, and Michael seemed to be such an extremely lovable person, too.. I don't know, if it turns out to be like Rag Doll says (I pray pray pray it's not to that extent with the fakes) I can safely assume a lot of people will be very, very upset..
Hi PinkTopaz,
I can almost feel your pain coming out of my computer. Please, don't be so upset. I watched many pictures and vids myself and I still don't believe that there are 2 Michaels. I'm a fan since I was 10 years old (I'm almost 42 right now!!) so I have seen a lot. I can not believe that Michael used doubles for interviews and concerts and let someone else live his life for more than 20 years!!!! Maybe he used doubles sometimes to distract people when he had to go into crowded places. In my honest opinion this theory goes way to far. I agree with many posters that Michael changed alot through the years but his voice, eyes and smile don't lie. They seem different because of different make up but they're Michaels.
If I'm wrong in the end I'll apologise to the ones who were right on this one, but for now I don't believe in this theory. Again, please don't be sad, because I don't think it's true.
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I think many people, especially longtime fans, will be as grief-stricken as I am if worst comes to one of the worst BAMSDay scenarios and a stranger shows up.. and I know that no random person in the public has really known Michael all of these years, but they at least that they were getting to know him the way fans of other celebrities do, for gosh's sake, and Michael seemed to be such an extremely lovable person, too.. I don't know, if it turns out to be like Rag Doll says (I pray pray pray it's not to that extent with the fakes) I can safely assume a lot of people will be very, very upset..
Do you think this was done just to fool around? I think that when he explains WHY, the reactions won't be too bad at all. Maybe you really should give it some time first, and try to find answers, instead of getting all upset now...
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Are you guys (the ones who believe) really serious? Please, don't answer that, I really don't want to know.
Here is my take:
During the trial, the REAL MJ couldn't afford to give up his sci fi secret, so he decided to waste his money and his reputation to clear his and his "double's" name. If the "real MJ" was convicted...that's OK..."the real MJ" would just send the "Double" off to jail. Heck...he just sends his double to do all the things he doesn't like to do any way...maybe this explains why Jordy thought MJ was circumsized...maybe the "double" was!
Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!
Is it possible to get back on once you've fallen off? The rocker that is.
LOL...This is my oppinion stated with LOVE :)
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Are you guys (the ones who believe) really serious? Please, don't answer that, I really don't want to know.
Here is my take:
During the trial, the REAL MJ couldn't afford to give up his sci fi secret, so he decided to waste his money and his reputation to clear his and his "double's" name. If the "real MJ" was convicted...that's OK..."the real MJ" would just send the "Double" off to jail. Heck...he just sends his double to do all the things he doesn't like to do any way...maybe this explains why Jordy thought MJ was circumsized...maybe the "double" was!
Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!
Is it possible to get back on once you've fallen off? The rocker that is.
LOL...This is my oppinion stated with LOVE :)
You are forgetting something - there was not one single piece of evidence of all those accusations, nothing, nada, zero.
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Are you guys (the ones who believe) really serious? Please, don't answer that, I really don't want to know.
Here is my take:
During the trial, the REAL MJ couldn't afford to give up his sci fi secret, so he decided to waste his money and his reputation to clear his and his "double's" name. If the "real MJ" was convicted...that's OK..."the real MJ" would just send the "Double" off to jail. Heck...he just sends his double to do all the things he doesn't like to do any way...maybe this explains why Jordy thought MJ was circumsized...maybe the "double" was!
Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!
Is it possible to get back on once you've fallen off? The rocker that is.
LOL...This is my oppinion stated with LOVE :)
You are forgetting something - there was not one single piece of evidence of all those accusations, nothing, nada, zero.
No, except the fact that some think there are 3 different MJ's in the Bashir Documentary. Funny how none of those "doubles" testified on Mike's behalf, considering the prosecution used the Documentary as evidence against MJ.... I think MJ would rather lose his good name and reputation and spend the remainder of his life living like a vagabond, rather than give up that info...
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Are you guys (the ones who believe) really serious? Please, don't answer that, I really don't want to know.
Here is my take:
During the trial, the REAL MJ couldn't afford to give up his sci fi secret, so he decided to waste his money and his reputation to clear his and his "double's" name. If the "real MJ" was convicted...that's OK..."the real MJ" would just send the "Double" off to jail. Heck...he just sends his double to do all the things he doesn't like to do any way...maybe this explains why Jordy thought MJ was circumsized...maybe the "double" was!
Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!
Is it possible to get back on once you've fallen off? The rocker that is.
LOL...This is my oppinion stated with LOVE :)
You are forgetting something - there was not one single piece of evidence of all those accusations, nothing, nada, zero.
No, except the fact that some think there are 3 different MJ's in the Bashir Documentary. Funny how none of those "doubles" testified on Mike's behalf, considering the prosecution used the Documentary as evidence against MJ.... I think MJ would rather lose his good name and reputation and spend the remainder of his life living like a vagabond, rather than give up that info...
May I suggest you take another look at all those trial pics..?
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You are forgetting something - there was not one single piece of evidence of all those accusations, nothing, nada, zero.
EXACTLY! That is perhaps the MOST important aspect of everything. THEY HAD NO EVIDENCE, just the made-up stories of money hungry people. That is why he didn't go to jail. No evidence = No crime.
I think that is why TIAI redirected to my post yesterday about made up stories in the media and how MJ's trial is so much like Murray's.
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Are you guys (the ones who believe) really serious? Please, don't answer that, I really don't want to know.
Here is my take:
During the trial, the REAL MJ couldn't afford to give up his sci fi secret, so he decided to waste his money and his reputation to clear his and his "double's" name. If the "real MJ" was convicted...that's OK..."the real MJ" would just send the "Double" off to jail. Heck...he just sends his double to do all the things he doesn't like to do any way...maybe this explains why Jordy thought MJ was circumsized...maybe the "double" was!
Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!
Is it possible to get back on once you've fallen off? The rocker that is.
LOL...This is my oppinion stated with LOVE :)
You are forgetting something - there was not one single piece of evidence of all those accusations, nothing, nada, zero.
No, except the fact that some think there are 3 different MJ's in the Bashir Documentary. Funny how none of those "doubles" testified on Mike's behalf, considering the prosecution used the Documentary as evidence against MJ.... I think MJ would rather lose his good name and reputation and spend the remainder of his life living like a vagabond, rather than give up that info...
May I suggest you take another look at all those trial pics..?
look for what? 3 MJ's coming in on rotation? I guess someone should have told MJ number 2 to cover for MJ number 3 when MJ number 3 got a spider bite, or MJ number 1 should have covered for MJ number 2 when he fell in the shower and hurt his back. ?
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Seems like every time the doubles theory is about to be looked into, the shit literally hits the fan. WizzKid, don't be discouraged, just keep going.
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Seems like every time the doubles theory is about to be looked into, the shit literally hits the fan. WizzKid, don't be discouraged, just keep going.
Don't worry, WizzKiDD is not discouraged at all! :D
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Are you guys (the ones who believe) really serious? Please, don't answer that, I really don't want to know.
Here is my take:
During the trial, the REAL MJ couldn't afford to give up his sci fi secret, so he decided to waste his money and his reputation to clear his and his "double's" name. If the "real MJ" was convicted...that's OK..."the real MJ" would just send the "Double" off to jail. Heck...he just sends his double to do all the things he doesn't like to do any way...maybe this explains why Jordy thought MJ was circumsized...maybe the "double" was!
Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!
Is it possible to get back on once you've fallen off? The rocker that is.
LOL...This is my oppinion stated with LOVE :)
You are forgetting something - there was not one single piece of evidence of all those accusations, nothing, nada, zero.
No, except the fact that some think there are 3 different MJ's in the Bashir Documentary. Funny how none of those "doubles" testified on Mike's behalf, considering the prosecution used the Documentary as evidence against MJ.... I think MJ would rather lose his good name and reputation and spend the remainder of his life living like a vagabond, rather than give up that info...
May I suggest you take another look at all those trial pics..?
look for what? 3 MJ's coming in on rotation? I guess someone should have told MJ number 2 to cover for MJ number 3 when MJ number 3 got a spider bite, or MJ number 1 should have covered for MJ number 2 when he fell in the shower and hurt his back. ?
don't be sarcastic please... just take a closer look at the Bashir documentary and the trial pics... maybe you will have a big surprise...
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Are you guys (the ones who believe) really serious? Please, don't answer that, I really don't want to know.
Here is my take:
During the trial, the REAL MJ couldn't afford to give up his sci fi secret, so he decided to waste his money and his reputation to clear his and his "double's" name. If the "real MJ" was convicted...that's OK..."the real MJ" would just send the "Double" off to jail. Heck...he just sends his double to do all the things he doesn't like to do any way...maybe this explains why Jordy thought MJ was circumsized...maybe the "double" was!
Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!
Is it possible to get back on once you've fallen off? The rocker that is.
LOL...This is my oppinion stated with LOVE :)
You are forgetting something - there was not one single piece of evidence of all those accusations, nothing, nada, zero.
No, except the fact that some think there are 3 different MJ's in the Bashir Documentary. Funny how none of those "doubles" testified on Mike's behalf, considering the prosecution used the Documentary as evidence against MJ.... I think MJ would rather lose his good name and reputation and spend the remainder of his life living like a vagabond, rather than give up that info...
May I suggest you take another look at all those trial pics..?
look for what? 3 MJ's coming in on rotation? I guess someone should have told MJ number 2 to cover for MJ number 3 when MJ number 3 got a spider bite, or MJ number 1 should have covered for MJ number 2 when he fell in the shower and hurt his back. ?
don't be sarcastic please... just take a closer look at the Bashir documentary and the trial pics... maybe you will have a big surprise...
LOL, I'm not being sarcastic...that is part of my evidence. As for looking at the trial pics...I have seen them and the documentary. What is it exactly that you want me to see? 3 of them? I'm sorry, I don't. If you have something specific that you would care to point out to me, I would be happy to take a look.
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Maybe I would be wise to wait for the series, but I've always thought that MJ who married LMP was not MJ who married Debbie. It was here in Aus that last wedding and at the time I thought he was a different person. Never was game to tell anyone at the time, but since this hoax, everyone thinks I'm nuts [cept my wonderful husband] anyway, so I may as well say it.
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I don't believe in the doppelganger theory, sorry. I believe he used a variety of doubles for decoy purposes and safety purposes. I don't believe he had a "twin".
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Maybe I would be wise to wait for the series, but I've always thought that MJ who married LMP was not MJ who married Debbie. It was here in Aus that last wedding and at the time I thought he was a different person. Never was game to tell anyone at the time, but since this hoax, everyone thinks I'm nuts [cept my wonderful husband] anyway, so I may as well say it.
Nope, you're not nuts at all. We also thought those MJs were different, and Souza & Chappie tried very hard, but could not match the MJs on those wedding pics.
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I just wanted to say...MJ tinkered with his face a lot. Botox injections can change the look of a face, especially from the onset of the injection compared to the end when it starts to wear off. Sometimes MJ would allow his brows to grow, sometimes he would have them thin and sometimes none at all, only the tatoos. MJ also played around with position of his wigs on his hairline as well...sometimes letting the whole tatooed hairline area show (Bashir documentary Purple shirt) Not only that, but weight gain and loss on MJ is very noticeable. Sometimes his jaw is chiseled and sometimes puffy...this could also be caused by medications that cause fluid retention. Not only that, but MJ played around with lighting. Lighting is a career because people in the arts need lighting! They know how Lighting can change the way a person is presented on camera! This is something people STUDY! We have all shined the flash light under our chins while we tell ghost stories...we know how it makes us look scary. Lighting changes features.
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Maybe I would be wise to wait for the series, but I've always thought that MJ who married LMP was not MJ who married Debbie. It was here in Aus that last wedding and at the time I thought he was a different person. Never was game to tell anyone at the time, but since this hoax, everyone thinks I'm nuts [cept my wonderful husband] anyway, so I may as well say it.
Nope, you're not nuts at all. We also thought those MJs were different, and Souza & Chappie tried very hard, but could not match the MJs on those wedding pics.
I would love to see those pictures.
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Maybe I would be wise to wait for the series, but I've always thought that MJ who married LMP was not MJ who married Debbie. It was here in Aus that last wedding and at the time I thought he was a different person. Never was game to tell anyone at the time, but since this hoax, everyone thinks I'm nuts [cept my wonderful husband] anyway, so I may as well say it.
Nope, you're not nuts at all. We also thought those MJs were different, and Souza & Chappie tried very hard, but could not match the MJs on those wedding pics.
I would love to see those pictures.
i dont know those exact pics.. but mj sure looked much happier with LM than debbie
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debbie_rowe_michael_jackson.jpg
sort of looks like navi: (http://www.light-zone.com/images/Navi-World%20Number%201%20Tribute%20to%20Michael%20Jackson.jpg)
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Bashir Interview
http://[url=http][img]http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/8889/bashit555e.jpg[/img][/url]
And LMP and Debbie
http://[url=http][img]http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/7112/drandlmp1.jpg[/img][/url]
Different Michael.
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I've asked it in the other double thread but I'm going to ask it again. I have the feeling that most of the people who believe in doubles are no fans, am I right?
I'm a fan for almost 20 years now, and I don't see the differences.
It seems strange to me that the people who are long time fans never noticed the differences...
Don't tell me you didn't notice the difference between Thriller MJ and Bad MJ. Of course you did. The whole world did.
Thanks to two factors: skin color change and MJ being on top of the world at that time, any expression of the obvious in 1984 would have been considered insensitive or even racist so our social stigmas and MJs massive popularity prevented us all from pointing out that the emperor is wearing no clothes.
We have been "trained" for 25 years to accept that this man changes his appearance dramatically and suddenly and perceive it as normal.
The expression that "there are two MJs" has been successfully catagorized as cliche and a bad joke at this point. Mission accomplished. Back clues planted. The stage has been set for a long time.
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Bashir Interview
Different Michael.
most definitly some doubles
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watch this vid from 3.05 till 4.19.
[youtube:2ubmwjyb]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfFKyuSjiHA[/youtube:2ubmwjyb]
And I think that the Michael in the blue clothes at 2.43 is not the real Michael.
This is another vid of Michael in blue clothes when Invincible is released end of 2001.
[youtube:2ubmwjyb]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NskwbUPCEDo[/youtube:2ubmwjyb].
watch vid from 1.15 Madison Square september 2001
[youtube:2ubmwjyb]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4AAhQzOtDM[/youtube:2ubmwjyb]
Album Invinceble oktober 2001
[youtube:2ubmwjyb]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjpXOF_LwlU[/youtube:2ubmwjyb]
The Michaels from the last 3 vids are skinny. The blue Michael is so to say: taller
The last 3 vid's are from 2001. He performed also with his brothers.
[youtube:2ubmwjyb]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSyF387T_q4[/youtube:2ubmwjyb]
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There is NO such thing as doubles or doppelgangers!
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There is NO such thing as doubles or doppelgangers!
beLIEve that....
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I have always thought the mj in the picture with debbie looks like a impersonator ,he just looks different.I am so confused over all this.
I must say you have got to hand it to the man , if there has been two mj`s for the last twenty years they have done a good job between them.
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There is NO such thing as doubles or doppelgangers!
beLIEve that....
I will...
(who's changed my post, it looked better before :lol: )
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at 4:09 in the video the guy says that michael has his own clone and the sad part about it is he needs it. so what are the possibilties of an actual clone?
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I have always thought the mj in the picture with debbie looks like a impersonator ,he just looks different.I am so confused over all this.
I must say you have got to hand it to the man , if there has been two mj`s for the last twenty years they have done a good job between them.
i think that MJ with Debbie... he doesnt look that happy to be with her... he just looks bored :lol:
as with LMP he was just in love
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at 4:09 in the video the guy says that michael has his own clone and the sad part about it is he needs it. so what are the possibilties of an actual clone?
The first animal that was cloned was in 1996. But you never know what the sceintist did what not reached the press.
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I only know about the impersanators/decoys, but I don't believe in doubles at all.
If I look at a lot of photo's of myself I see myself different in every single photo.
For example your nose can look different if you just have your head a little bit more up, down, to the left ore to the right. The same story for the lips etc. On one photo I look gorgeous :) and on another photo I look ugly :roll:
So the Michael we saw with his children was also a double? ... :roll:
The Michael we saw in Dangerous and History-concerts was a double? ... :roll:
(Well not to me .. :D )
(http://i46.tinypic.com/2ebaamu.jpg)
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at 4:09 in the video the guy says that michael has his own clone and the sad part about it is he needs it. so what are the possibilties of an actual clone?
Ok which video are you talking about here? I have to see this.
It sounds far fetched. But wouldn't it be crazy if it really were possible? I don't think anything is impossible at this point! :lol:
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Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!
In your rattle here you actually bring up a very good point: "Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!"
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Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!
In your rattle here you actually bring up a very good point: "Maybe this explains how the will got signed while Michael was not even there!"
Go with it...it's yours. I'm washing my hands of it.
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but now you have to factor in that the "double" is against the real MJ and working with the people named in the will.
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but now you have to factor in that the "double" is against the real MJ and working with the people named in the will.
mykidsmum, you are on a roll. I'd say sleep on it and think about it. I don't have to 'go with it', Mo and I are not talking faces if we discuss the doubles, we are talking intentions and contracts and signatures. I am just pointing out that you just stated something very interesting regarding the double(s), it's just food for thought.
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This can be a new theory... what another angle? Just when I was grasping everything else! This could be called the "evil blackmailing doppleganger" ... I am sure, if he did most of the work during the years, he probably wants a "big cut"... OK, my mind is very open to this... just like a movie here! :shock: :?
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but now you have to factor in that the "double" is against the real MJ and working with the people named in the will.
mykidsmum, you are on a roll. I'd say sleep on it and think about it. I don't have to 'go with it', Mo and I are not talking faces if we discuss the doubles, we are talking intentions and contracts and signatures. I am just pointing out that you just stated something very interesting regarding the double(s), it's just food for thought.
now lets take those points into play here if we are dealing with a double that had forged legal documents, and is working against the real michael.... whatever the case may be aerbt we looking at the possibility thqt maybe ...just maybe whoever had the idea to turn against mike and get everything that he owns, then aernt we looking at the fact that maybe the had to "bunk-off" michael to do this...... ????.
or we look at that mike is alive and that he is watching everyone around him scavenge for all his money and the catalogue etc. if this thing that the doubles forged the docs then why isnt michael stopping it? wouldnt it really be classed as fraud and when mike comes back hiw is he going to proove this to anyone???
just a few thoughts.....
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but now you have to factor in that the "double" is against the real MJ and working with the people named in the will.
mykidsmum, you are on a roll. I'd say sleep on it and think about it. I don't have to 'go with it', Mo and I are not talking faces if we discuss the doubles, we are talking intentions and contracts and signatures. I am just pointing out that you just stated something very interesting regarding the double(s), it's just food for thought.
by "go with it" I meant feel free to do with the idea what you want. I'm sorry, I'm just not in the boat on this one. But here is another one for you.
Some fans reported seeing MJ at the gate on the morning of his death, his father said so as well. Some people reported seeing MJ leaving the premisis...what if "the double" who was upset that day with the "real" MJ, waited until Murray was out of the room, and finally, sweet revenge!...he would never have to be in MJ's shadow again or do the crap work MJ didn't like to do, the cards were already in play...the will had been signed...by him...he would lie low...wait it out...find the right time...and BAM No one would know the difference!
For me...it's a story.
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If Debbie Rowe married Mr. X, then who is the mother and father of the children Katherine Jackson is taking care of? Why did she testify in the Michael Jackson trial? (remember she married Mr. X) Why would she want to see Michael Jackson's kids? Why did Michael Jackson pay her $8 million in exchange of full custody? Why did she retain visitation rights? Why would Michael Jackson would go through so much hassle, just to keep his little secret covered? And yeah, I agree with mykidsmum here, why didnt one of these doubles in the Bashir documentary testify on Michael's behalf?
Why are the doubles so important anyways? Does the doubles theory prove Michael Jackson is alive? How do we fit the doubles into HOW did Michael Jackson hoaxed his death? Did he use any of the doubles on June 25th? I want to know how doubles were of his benefit on June 25th. The world believes he's dead, and saying there were doubles in TII movie is like saying: "yeah, Michael Jackson died, and we needed doubles to continue making money out of his name." IMO, to say that MJ sent a double to the o2 arena is like saying he was sick, frail and unable to even make a speech. If this is true...then he might as well be dead.
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but now you have to factor in that the "double" is against the real MJ and working with the people named in the will.
mykidsmum, you are on a roll. I'd say sleep on it and think about it. I don't have to 'go with it', Mo and I are not talking faces if we discuss the doubles, we are talking intentions and contracts and signatures. I am just pointing out that you just stated something very interesting regarding the double(s), it's just food for thought.
by "go with it" I meant feel free to do with the idea what you want. I'm sorry, I'm just not in the boat on this one. But here is another one for you.
Some fans reported seeing MJ at the gate on the morning of his death, his father said so as well. Some people reported seeing MJ leaving the premisis...what if "the double" who was upset that day with the "real" MJ, waited until Murray was out of the room, and finally, sweet revenge!...he would never have to be in MJ's shadow again or do the crap work MJ didn't like to do, the cards were already in play...the will had been signed...by him...he would lie low...wait it out...find the right time...and BAM No one would know the difference!
For me...it's a story.
In that case we would have a real murder and that is not very likely in this circus. I will get back to you after my brain reboot, it's 5:00am here....
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but now you have to factor in that the "double" is against the real MJ and working with the people named in the will.
mykidsmum, you are on a roll. I'd say sleep on it and think about it. I don't have to 'go with it', Mo and I are not talking faces if we discuss the doubles, we are talking intentions and contracts and signatures. I am just pointing out that you just stated something very interesting regarding the double(s), it's just food for thought.
by "go with it" I meant feel free to do with the idea what you want. I'm sorry, I'm just not in the boat on this one. But here is another one for you.
Some fans reported seeing MJ at the gate on the morning of his death, his father said so as well. Some people reported seeing MJ leaving the premisis...what if "the double" who was upset that day with the "real" MJ, waited until Murray was out of the room, and finally, sweet revenge!...he would never have to be in MJ's shadow again or do the crap work MJ didn't like to do, the cards were already in play...the will had been signed...by him...he would lie low...wait it out...find the right time...and BAM No one would know the difference!
For me...it's a story.
In that case we would have a real murder and that is not very likely in this circus. I will get back to you after my brain reboot, it's 5:00am here....
Ok this sounds interesting. And though I'm not into the double theory, I would like to see how this story unfolds...
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It is undeniable that there are differences in all the photos, another subject to think and investigate .. with all that that implies. :?:
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Oh and Do, thank you for your compassion! I appreciate it.
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Man I didn't realize all this till his "death".
But I truly believe Mike fooled us for years!!!!!!!!
We ALL have fell for it at it some point in time.
I don't blame you for one moment MIKE!
You had to what you had to do, to try to live a normal life. :D
Some where out there everybody has a twin (s).
And one of mine happen to be Michelle Obama.
Which I don't mind one bit.
It freaks me out a bit, when i get weird double-looks, lol.
I can even easily blend in with the Jacksons, too. :)
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IMO, to say that MJ sent a double to the o2 arena is like saying he was sick, frail and unable to even make a speech. If this is true...then he might as well be dead.
Did you miss the guy behind the curtain? He looked pretty fine to me
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at 4:09 in the video the guy says that michael has his own clone and the sad part about it is he needs it. so what are the possibilties of an actual clone?
Ok which video are you talking about here? I have to see this.
It sounds far fetched. But wouldn't it be crazy if it really were possible? I don't think anything is impossible at this point! :lol:
in the video the fabulous life of michael
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at 4:09 in the video the guy says that michael has his own clone and the sad part about it is he needs it. so what are the possibilties of an actual clone?
Ok which video are you talking about here? I have to see this.
It sounds far fetched. But wouldn't it be crazy if it really were possible? I don't think anything is impossible at this point! :lol:
in the video the fabulous life of michael
That's fake. Come on.... That clone story is not even possible. MJ was replaced at 14 when they made a clone of him. They forget to mention that even IF it would have been possible back then, a clone needs to be born and grow for 14 years, before he is that person at that age. Did MJ stay 14 for 14 years? I guess not.
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at 4:09 in the video the guy says that michael has his own clone and the sad part about it is he needs it. so what are the possibilties of an actual clone?
Ok which video are you talking about here? I have to see this.
It sounds far fetched. But wouldn't it be crazy if it really were possible? I don't think anything is impossible at this point! :lol:
in the video the fabulous life of michael
That's fake. Come on.... That clone story is not even possible. MJ was replaced at 14 when they made a clone of him. They forget to mention that even IF it would have been possible back then, a clone needs to be born and grow for 14 years, before he is that person at that age. Did MJ stay 14 for 14 years? I guess not.
Um...I don't think she means that. There is a video from VH1 I think that talks about MJ having doubles.
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IMO, to say that MJ sent a double to the o2 arena is like saying he was sick, frail and unable to even make a speech. If this is true...then he might as well be dead.
Did you miss the guy behind the curtain? He looked pretty fine to me
I want to see a clear picture of "o2 guy" speaking while the real deal's behind the curtain.
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IMO, to say that MJ sent a double to the o2 arena is like saying he was sick, frail and unable to even make a speech. If this is true...then he might as well be dead.
Did you miss the guy behind the curtain? He looked pretty fine to me
I want to see a clear picture of "o2 guy" speaking while the real deal's behind the curtain.
Sure, let me see if there is a picture on MJJpictures where we can see then side to side..
:?
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I have to make one more comment for the evening.
First off, we are all not under 30! :)
Second, it hurts everyone who has been a fan of Michael
Jackson for 5 or 30 years. Please, those who keep saying
there is no feeling or empathy if one EXPLORES the possibility
of a double theory.
We did ALL see it over the years. If this is true, I am not sure
it was Michael's idea. There are a myriad of reasons this would
or could have been necessary.
Michael Jackson fans over the years have been staunch in their
support for him and everyone feels the need to protect him or
something like that. He seem to bring out that quality in a lot
of female fans and some male. The little brother.
Because of the staunch support, it has conveyed the attitude that
NOTHING can be said that would be conceived in a negative light,
but who is saying this is negative?
If Michael is alive, he did indeed HOAX us, if he had a double, we
have been HOAXED. If he has died, we can understand him and
his life and we do that out of LOVE, not disrespect.
Nobody is more hurt than I am, though I share that same amount of
hurt with you all, along with the fear, and sadness, and the cause for
hope and understanding of Michael Jackson.
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First off, we are all not under 30! :)
Lol! By a hair´s breadth - but I am! :D
MJs massive popularity prevented us all from pointing out that the emperor is wearing no clothes.
Mmmh, how I like your choice of words! :D -and I dare to say it´s figuratively quite likely correct... :roll:
All I´m saying is IF there has been more than one Michael Jackson over a longer era, MAYBE a permanent one who was on hand,
shouldn´t we not at least come to know him and give him credit if we have the chance?
Would this POSSIBILITY change any of the positive feelings we all experienced through Michael Jacksons art + music over the years?
I´ll answer that for myself - no, it wouldn´t change my admiration.
And WOULDn´t it make Michael not much more than the "King of Pop"? He WOULD have created the ultimate illusion.
An illusion that brought people in the world closer together - in peace & in love. I can´t see what´s wrong with that.
IF it is so, I´d like to hear his point of view. Maybe he´s going to explain it to us?...
So I´m just happy to listen and learn.
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First off, we are all not under 30! :)
Lol! By a hair´s breadth - but I am! :D
MJs massive popularity prevented us all from pointing out that the emperor is wearing no clothes.
Mmmh, how I like your choice of words! :D -and I dare to say it´s figuratively quite likely correct... :roll:
All I´m saying is IF there has been more than one Michael Jackson over a longer era, MAYBE a permanent one who was on hand,
shouldn´t we not at least come to know him and give him credit if we have the chance?
Would this POSSIBILITY change any of the positive feelings we all experienced through Michael Jacksons art + music over the years?
I´ll answer that for myself - no, it wouldn´t change my admiration.
And WOULDn´t it make Michael not much more than the "King of Pop"? He WOULD have created the ultimate illusion.
An illusion that brought people in the world closer together - in peace & in love. I can´t see what´s wrong with that.
IF it is so, I´d like to hear his point of view. Maybe he´s going to explain it to us?...
So I´m just happy to listen and learn.
First of all, the only logical reason for him to have had a permanent fake like that is because of extremely dangerous, life-or-death reasons, and there is nothing positive about that, especially when you consider the fact that it sounds like he would have had these other people pretty much live his life for him and be in that danger for him, and I'm sorry, but that is ugly and I don't know if Michael would do something like that. Next of all, it would NOT make him the King of Pop- it would make him someone who chose to opt out of everything, to give all of his burdens to someone else, which is extremely selfish. It would make the FAKE(s) the King of whatever you want to say, and the only reason I can think of for that is life or death, because we are talking about Illuminati here. If they weren't in the picture at all, why would Michael even have to create an illusion at all? Isn't there enough manipulation in the world? If the life-or-death situations created by the Illuminati didn't exist at all, then Michael wouldn't have to use others to broadcast the things that come from his own soul. Letting fakes do everything for him is an ugly idea, and it WOULD change the positive feelings we've gotten from him in the past to know that it's not coming directly from him, it's coming from multiple people who are taking on the responsibilites of someone else's life..That's my stance on these ideas..
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IMO, to say that MJ sent a double to the o2 arena is like saying he was sick, frail and unable to even make a speech. If this is true...then he might as well be dead.
Did you miss the guy behind the curtain? He looked pretty fine to me
but can we be sure that that wasnt added in after the initial speech ??? the figure just looks too small for it to be another mike behind the curtain..... and i think theres a pic of michael walking up the steps and one on the podeum and they look different... well totally different people..... which is bringing me towards a thought..... that possiby michael recorded the confrence as it was been broadcasted live.... but how do you explain the 2 hours lateness ??... maybe editing......?
but the although now im looking and coming around to the idea of a double... i think that the possible scenario to come out of this was that michael was murdered.....either a double added the lethal dose, or michael clicked on and switched... so that the double was on the bed and he added the lethal dose ?? :lol: ( that last one is kinda far-fetched :lol: )
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That's fake. Come on.... That clone story is not even possible. MJ was replaced at 14 when they made a clone of him. They forget to mention that even IF it would have been possible back then, a clone needs to be born and grow for 14 years, before he is that person at that age. Did MJ stay 14 for 14 years? I guess not.
A clone from egg is unlikely.
A clone from an existing boy in the family clan with ressembliing body features is not unlikely.
If Joe really did force MJ to dance on a hot stove in order to train the right dance steps, can you imagine how Joe reacted when MJ potentially wanted to drop out during puberty?
Just when carreer was taking up pace and escape from poverty was right at hands?
What if they found a cousin (or another Joe's escapade half brother of MJ) and trained them in parallel?
What if the family / PR consultants invented the "artificial" nose as a publicity stunt that was as of then giving unique brand identity no matter how the face changed and that was even rebuilt into several faces on request of MJ impersonators proud to look more like MJ?
Would that explain why there were different talents presented to public during concerts, on tour and in between? Different dance moves, charisma, aura, voices, appearances in interviews and now in TII?
I think it is very plausible that in the huge Jackson / Screws / Scruse / Upshaw clan there is a trace to be found to real MJ and to the doppelganger.
In order to structure better what we are looking at, I set up this overview of theories.
Maybe this gives some clearer view on the huge picture we are trying to examine since June and where many aspects have been added with time.
[attachment=0:3k402z56]Theories_Overview_Grace.pdf[/attachment:3k402z56]
(you may need free Adobe Reader that you may download from here: http://get.adobe.com/reader/ (http://get.adobe.com/reader/))
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Oh and Do, thank you for your compassion! I appreciate it.
You're very welcome! Relax, because NOBODY knows the REAL truth untill we hear it from Michael himself!!
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Since we're reached the point of thinking about the intentions of the double(s) I'd like you to take a look at the following image. This image contains signatures, supposedly Mike's, on official documents and letters. I numbered them, and made a list showing which signature appears on which document/letter:
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/signatures01.jpg)
Full size image here: http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/ ... ures02.jpg (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/signatures02.jpg)
1: Marriage license Lisa Marie Presley
2: The Chandler settlement
3: Letter concerning participation in project "The Way of the Unicorn/The Endangered Ones"
4: The will
5: Moonwalk
6: Passport issued in 1987
7: Letter firing John Branca
8: Letter to Diane Williams, cease and desist from signing for his certified mail
9: Letter to Judge Melville substitution of Tom Mesereau in place of Geragos
10: Passport issued in 1993
11: Drivers license
12: AEG contract signature "Michael Jackson"
13: AEG contract signature "The Michael Jackson Company LLC, Name: Michael Jackson"
14: Contract mayor city of Gary concerning The Michael J Jackson Performing Arts Center
After comparing these signatures, of which some differ significantly from others, the question rises:
WHO SIGNED WHICH DOCUMENT/LETTER, AND WITH WHICH INTENTIONS?
Food for thought...
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That's fake. Come on.... That clone story is not even possible. MJ was replaced at 14 when they made a clone of him. They forget to mention that even IF it would have been possible back then, a clone needs to be born and grow for 14 years, before he is that person at that age. Did MJ stay 14 for 14 years? I guess not.
A clone from egg is unlikely.
A clone from an existing boy in the family clan with ressembliing body features is not unlikely.
If Joe really did force MJ to dance on a hot stove in order to train the right dance steps, can you imagine how Joe reacted when MJ potentially wanted to drop out during puberty?
Just when carreer was taking up pace and escape from poverty was right at hands?
What if they found a cousin (or another Joe's escapade half brother of MJ) and trained them in parallel?
What if the family / PR consultants invented the "artificial" nose as a publicity stunt that was as of then giving unique brand identity no matter how the face changed and that was even rebuilt into several faces on request of MJ impersonators proud to look more like MJ?
Would that explain why there were different talents presented to public during concerts, on tour and in between? Different dance moves, charisma, aura, voices, appearances in interviews and now in TII?
I think it is very plausible that in the huge Jackson / Screws / Scruse / Upshaw clan there is a trace to be found to real MJ and to the doppelganger.
In order to structure better what we are looking at, I set up this overview of theories.
Maybe this gives some clearer view on the huge picture we are trying to examine since June and where many aspects have been added with time.
[attachment=0:19nr69sp]Theories_Overview_Grace.pdf[/attachment:19nr69sp]
(you may need free Adobe Reader that you may download from here: http://get.adobe.com/reader/ (http://get.adobe.com/reader/))
yes, different talents and dance moves are all attributed to his cousin or anyone else who they got to fill in. MJ really isn't responsible for his growing and changing talent. I don't understand? Do you want to see him the same? Maybe he should have stuck to the Mowtown sound and dance moves...Can you immagine? Part of the reason for his longevity is his ability to change.
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i might have something to explain the signatures.....
Now think about it.... If like michael and you were constantly signing things, the first signature would be perfect then after time it would change....e.g f he was signing autographs, all the signatures aernt going to be as perfect as the first.... i know if ive to sign things a few times my signature is different than the first one.
try signing your name 10 times and see if you signature stays the same as the first one......
and another thing about the contract..... forgive me if i am totally wrong, but wouldnt there have to be an impartial witness present at the signing of any legal document or agreement... e.g ive seen a few loan forms that require a signature from a witness.... and there doesnt seem to be any sign of that on the contract from AEG
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I think people are afraid to accept the possibility that they have been deceived for 25 years. It's a dark place to go to in your mind but it is extremely plausible no matter how you look at it.
Those who staunchly deny the doubles theory as plausible are in denial.
Not at all afraid of anything i just dont believe for a second in this silly theory. There is no deception at all.
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i might have something to explain the signatures.....
Now think about it.... If like michael and you were constantly signing things, the first signature would be perfect then after time it would change....e.g f he was signing autographs, all the signatures aernt going to be as perfect as the first.... i know if ive to sign things a few times my signature is different than the first one.
try signing your name 10 times and see if you signature stays the same as the first one......
and another thing about the contract..... forgive me if i am totally wrong, but wouldnt there have to be an impartial witness present at the signing of any legal document or agreement... e.g ive seen a few loan forms that require a signature from a witness.... and there doesnt seem to be any sign of that on the contract from AEG
This is a very good post. Similar what i said. You worded it bang on however.
I agree with all this!!! Some great points. It clears it all up for me. Only Michael signed it
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Signatures change all the time... the only signature I would think was not his was the one that signed his will on July 7, 2002. I think a double signed that will. However, like I said before, I think he rarely ever used "doubles" until 2006, when his life was being more seriously threatened. I don't think he used doubles during the Bad era, the differences in his appearance during that could easily be explained by make up, lighting and his progressive vitiligo. I know you're all speculating, but most of this seems like distraction. In my opinion, Michael Jackson was Michael Jackson 95% of the time. I don't think his doubles lived his life for him. I feel doubles were used on rare occasions to carry out specific tasks.
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I think handwriting depends on your current state of mind too and that would change even your signature. A handwriting expert could probably be able to tell Michael's state of mind from his signatures.
I also think that when he signed for MJCC the company, he did not have that extra curl in the signature.
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i might have something to explain the signatures.....
Now think about it.... If like michael and you were constantly signing things, the first signature would be perfect then after time it would change....e.g f he was signing autographs, all the signatures aernt going to be as perfect as the first.... i know if ive to sign things a few times my signature is different than the first one.
Your explanation is a NO GO for the different signatures on the files I used. These documents/letters were not signed on the same day, this has nothing to do with signing autographs.
Come on...take a look...
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/sigcomp01.jpg)
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I can tell it's obviously a very confident individual who signed these documents as their signature carries over onto the pre printed text. Absolutely no effort in saving ink. ;)
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and another thing about the contract..... forgive me if i am totally wrong, but wouldnt there have to be an impartial witness present at the signing of any legal document or agreement... e.g ive seen a few loan forms that require a signature from a witness.... and there doesnt seem to be any sign of that on the contract from AEG
Thank you for bringing that up.
According to the AEG contract it's signed by Michael Jackson for The Michael Jackson Company LLC, and by Michael Jackson for Michael Jackson.
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/aeg_contract.jpg)
I outlined the name of the persons who signed, both times Michael Jackson. That leaves us with four options:
1: Michael Jackson has two totally different signatures, which I find highly unlikely.
2: There are 2 Michael Jacksons - one is the 'real deal' and the other one is a double.
3: Michael Jackson did not sign this contract at all, both signatures were forged by other people which automatically makes this contract invalid as forgery is committed.
4: One of the signatures was placed by Michael Jackson and one by a third person. That automatically makes this contract invalid as forgery is committed because it doesn't list the name of the person who actually signed.
I do know that in California a contract has to be signed by 3 different persons in order to legalize it. If less than 3 persons sign it, it has to be notarized.
For the time being, let's forget about the absence of a signed rider which already means that there was no contract at all, and let's just focus on who could have signed this piece of paper.
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Completely different signatures at all.
The AEG contract is invalid for many reasons..
NO rider, no witness, different "Michael Jackson" signatures..
Invalid contract = No gigs...
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ooohhhh that michael jackson is a crafty one....... :lol:
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and another thing about the contract..... forgive me if i am totally wrong, but wouldnt there have to be an impartial witness present at the signing of any legal document or agreement... e.g ive seen a few loan forms that require a signature from a witness.... and there doesnt seem to be any sign of that on the contract from AEG
Thank you for bringing that up.
According to the AEG contract it's signed by Michael Jackson for The Michael Jackson Company LLC, and by Michael Jackson for Michael Jackson.
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/aeg_contract.jpg)
I outlined the name of the persons who signed, both times Michael Jackson. That leaves us with four options:
1: Michael Jackson has two totally different signatures, which I find highly unlikely.
2: There are 2 Michael Jacksons - one is the 'real deal' and the other one is a double.
3: Michael Jackson did not sign this contract at all, both signatures were forged by other people which automatically makes this contract invalid as forgery is committed.
4: One of the signatures was placed by Michael Jackson and one by a third person. That automatically makes this contract invalid as forgery is committed because it doesn't list the name of the person who actually signed.
I do know that in California a contract has to be signed by 3 different persons in order to legalize it. If less than 3 persons sign it, it has to be notarized.
For the time being, let's forget about the absence of a signed rider which already means that there was no contract at all, and let's just focus on who could have signed this piece of paper.
So, do you have an example of a signature that you believe is Michael's "real' signature?
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So, do you have an example of a signature that you believe is Michael's "real' signature?
Well, that's the $64.000 question in the 'signature issue'!
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There are people who are specialized in handwriting and autographes, so if someone doubs it's not Michael's it good be send to someone professional te research it.
IMO it's all Michaels.
One is quickly/shortly done (the left) the other is the normal.
I tried to copy his autograph but didn't even come close to both.
It's all so far fetched IMO, but no disrespect ... ;)
(http://i46.tinypic.com/2ebaamu.jpg)
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So, do you have an example of a signature that you believe is Michael's "real' signature?
Well, that's the $64.000 question in the 'signature issue'!
MAYBE we have a real signature example.. IF we believe that the REAL Mike married LMP, he signed the marriage license.. SO, pic n°1 could be the REAL signature..
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So, do you have an example of a signature that you believe is Michael's "real' signature?
Well, that's the $64.000 question in the 'signature issue'!
MAYBE we have a real signature example.. IF we believe that the REAL Mike married LMP, so he signed the marriage license.. SO, pic n°1 could be the REAL signature.
Oh, P, I was gonna say that, LOL! I think that is him.
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nynyro wrote; So, do you have an example of a signature that you believe is Michael's "real' signature?
Well, I think his real signature of Michael should be in their legal identification documents, passport, driver's license.. :geek:
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nynyro wrote; So, do you have an example of a signature that you believe is Michael's "real' signature?
Well, I think his real signature of Michael should be in their legal identification documents, passport, driver's license.. :geek:
Okay, pick one! That is, if you're convinced it's all the same person on the document pics of course...
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/pp_dl.jpg)
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That's fake. Come on.... That clone story is not even possible. MJ was replaced at 14 when they made a clone of him. They forget to mention that even IF it would have been possible back then, a clone needs to be born and grow for 14 years, before he is that person at that age. Did MJ stay 14 for 14 years? I guess not.
A clone from egg is unlikely.
A clone from an existing boy in the family clan with ressembliing body features is not unlikely.
If Joe really did force MJ to dance on a hot stove in order to train the right dance steps, can you imagine how Joe reacted when MJ potentially wanted to drop out during puberty?
Just when carreer was taking up pace and escape from poverty was right at hands?
What if they found a cousin (or another Joe's escapade half brother of MJ) and trained them in parallel?
What if the family / PR consultants invented the "artificial" nose as a publicity stunt that was as of then giving unique brand identity no matter how the face changed and that was even rebuilt into several faces on request of MJ impersonators proud to look more like MJ?
Would that explain why there were different talents presented to public during concerts, on tour and in between? Different dance moves, charisma, aura, voices, appearances in interviews and now in TII?
I think it is very plausible that in the huge Jackson / Screws / Scruse / Upshaw clan there is a trace to be found to real MJ and to the doppelganger.
In order to structure better what we are looking at, I set up this overview of theories.
Maybe this gives some clearer view on the huge picture we are trying to examine since June and where many aspects have been added with time.
[attachment=0:1bm9mqr1]Theories_Overview_Grace.pdf[/attachment:1bm9mqr1]
(you may need free Adobe Reader that you may download from here: http://get.adobe.com/reader/ (http://get.adobe.com/reader/))
thank you grace this is exactly what i was referring to. thanks for laying it out for me :D
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No Mo, I do not think it's the same person, in fact when I read your blog for the double I think I was the only person who did not make fun of him, but it would be logical to think that his firm is in those documents, this matter I which is the same everywhere, my signature has to be equal in my passport, my driver's license in my identity card, when I do a particular procedure in the bank, Sunto .. this is very confusing ;)
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at 4:09 in the video the guy says that michael has his own clone and the sad part about it is he needs it. so what are the possibilties of an actual clone?
Ok which video are you talking about here? I have to see this.
It sounds far fetched. But wouldn't it be crazy if it really were possible? I don't think anything is impossible at this point! :lol:
in the video the fabulous life of michael
That's fake. Come on.... That clone story is not even possible. MJ was replaced at 14 when they made a clone of him. They forget to mention that even IF it would have been possible back then, a clone needs to be born and grow for 14 years, before he is that person at that age. Did MJ stay 14 for 14 years? I guess not.
Um...I don't think she means that. There is a video from VH1 I think that talks about MJ having doubles.
I posted this vid because it's about Navi saying that he was working for MJ in Japan. At the end of this part you hear saying that MJ has his own clone. I think that he means that Navi is the clone. In another part of the same video you see MJ in blue clothes at the time that Invincible is released. He looks different than the MJ's in the other video's. Than I posted 4 videos.
MJ in blue clothes at the time that invincible was released
You rock my world; the official video, oktober 2001,
live at Madison Square september 2001
Also live at Madison Square but with his brothers. the reason I posted this video is, should Mj used a double while performing with his brothers.
But maybe you think it's all the same MJ.
watch this vid from 3.05 till 4.19.
[youtube:3j1uis5c]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfFKyuSjiHA[/youtube:3j1uis5c]
[youtube:3j1uis5c]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NskwbUPCEDo[/youtube:3j1uis5c]
[youtube:3j1uis5c]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4AAhQzOtDM[/youtube:3j1uis5c]
[youtube:3j1uis5c]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjpXOF_LwlU[/youtube:3j1uis5c]
[youtube:3j1uis5c]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSyF387T_q4[/youtube:3j1uis5c]
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this thought just came to me.... i dont think its that important... but we have been told several times that Michael is a perfectionist..... and IF he used a double to perform...... which one was the perfectionist??? was it the real MJ or the Double ?
yes... random... i know :lol:
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Seems using body doubles was common even earlier.
From the movie Mahogony
In addition, Gordy and Ross clashed during filming, with Ross leaving the production before shooting was completed, forcing Gordy to use secretary Edna Anderson as a body double for Ross.
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That's fake. Come on.... That clone story is not even possible. MJ was replaced at 14 when they made a clone of him. They forget to mention that even IF it would have been possible back then, a clone needs to be born and grow for 14 years, before he is that person at that age. Did MJ stay 14 for 14 years? I guess not.
A clone from egg is unlikely.
A clone from an existing boy in the family clan with ressembliing body features is not unlikely.
If Joe really did force MJ to dance on a hot stove in order to train the right dance steps, can you imagine how Joe reacted when MJ potentially wanted to drop out during puberty?
Just when carreer was taking up pace and escape from poverty was right at hands?
What if they found a cousin (or another Joe's escapade half brother of MJ) and trained them in parallel?
What if the family / PR consultants invented the "artificial" nose as a publicity stunt that was as of then giving unique brand identity no matter how the face changed and that was even rebuilt into several faces on request of MJ impersonators proud to look more like MJ?
Would that explain why there were different talents presented to public during concerts, on tour and in between? Different dance moves, charisma, aura, voices, appearances in interviews and now in TII?
I think it is very plausible that in the huge Jackson / Screws / Scruse / Upshaw clan there is a trace to be found to real MJ and to the doppelganger.
In order to structure better what we are looking at, I set up this overview of theories.
Maybe this gives some clearer view on the huge picture we are trying to examine since June and where many aspects have been added with time.
[attachment=0:jugvzol6]Theories_Overview_Grace.pdf[/attachment:jugvzol6]
(you may need free Adobe Reader that you may download from here: http://get.adobe.com/reader/ (http://get.adobe.com/reader/))
Nice Grace ;)
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@Grace ;
thank you for that summary, keep em coming if you enjoy making them as they are valuable tools. :D
@awesome1 ;
I think the perfectionnist would have been michael himself cause very early on there were signs of his perfectionnism.
As for the signature thingy, yes our signature will vary and is almost impossible to even have 2 identical ones but there are still basics that dont change. Life if your letters are rounded, you will never sign a document with straight square letters unless you are doing it on purpose. IMO
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this thought just came to me.... i dont think its that important... but we have been told several times that Michael is a perfectionist..... and IF he used a double to perform...... which one was the perfectionist??? was it the real MJ or the Double ?
yes... random... i know :lol:
no no its not random, its a good thought ... and another is who was the one who was bad with money.. fake MJ or real mj??
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True, no two people are exactly alike, there is always something that gives them away, gestures, tone of voice, the way you walk, how to express themselves, even in people who are twins there are differences, can be the voice, personality .. Finally, in all those photos that have been published are physical differences and now is that we realize in detail. :)
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Bashir Interview
http://[url=http][img]http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/8889/bashit555e.jpg[/img][/url]
And LMP and Debbie
http://[url=http][img]http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/7112/drandlmp1.jpg[/img][/url]
Different Michael.
I have just re watched some of the bashir tapes and i must admit that i really think their is something different with the mj holding hands with gavin and the mj at the end in the final programme.The face just seems different.The mouth ,lips , smile just don`t seem to match.I also find it odd that mj did not know that prince had been poked in the eye on the trip to the zoo until bashir told him later in the day.If there are two mj`s i can`t see it ever coming out as it would open a whole can of worms regarding the trial as people would wonder who really attended.The mj holding hands with gavin has the same smile as the O2 mj.Also the mj on the home movies shows his bottom teeth more as he talks but the one in the final bashir tape does not show them as much.
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http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/Mic ... id=7978250 (http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/MichaelJackson/popup?id=7978250)
Please look at the ear specifically in 1, 9, 11 and towards the end the ear in the smooth criminal photo. These are different ears and I don't think there is any mistaking it. All of these pics are interesting. I have seen them before but not side by side. I was shocked at a couple but the ears are just not the same camera angles and lighting aside.
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:shock: :shock: I can't tell you how much in shock I am over these comments. Where is the LOVE and respect to this man? 45 freakin years, and you are trying to take this away from him? What has this become? sounds to me its no better than tabloid trash. What happen to trying to find out if Michael is alive? Michael didn't do this, and it wasn't Michael there, and his ears, his jaw, his nose, What the hell? Michael didn't spend his whole life for us, just to have us in the end say, OH, thats not him !!!!! All those years, do you think he would risk his hard work to have someone else do it for him? I'm in aww that people are believing this. Look at Michael's face, look in his eyes, ITS HIM, FOR GOD SAKE. Stop trying to take his legacy from him. He did it all, no one else. It makes me really sad to realize what this has come down to. :( :(
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Bashir Interview
http://[url=http][img]http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/8889/bashit555e.jpg[/img][/url]
And LMP and Debbie
http://[url=http][img]http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/7112/drandlmp1.jpg[/img][/url]
Different Michael.
I have just re watched some of the bashir tapes and i must admit that i really think their is something different with the mj holding hands with gavin and the mj at the end in the final programme.The face just seems different.The mouth ,lips , smile just don`t seem to match.I also find it odd that mj did not know that prince had been poked in the eye on the trip to the zoo until bashir told him later in the day.If there are two mj`s i can`t see it ever coming out as it would open a whole can of worms regarding the trial as people would wonder who really attended.The mj holding hands with gavin has the same smile as the O2 mj.Also the mj on the home movies shows his bottom teeth more as he talks but the one in the final bashir tape does not show them as much.
I come to the same result. "There is something different about this boy"
-anyone else who is willing to reconsider things from a neutral point of view will very likely realize the same.
Only a fool thinks he cannot be fooled. I am a fool - but I know that much... ;)
The tipsy one is charming - whether it´s him or not... :P
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:shock: :shock: I can't tell you how much in shock I am over these comments. Where is the LOVE and respect to this man? 45 freakin years, and you are trying to take this away from him? What has this become? sounds to me its no better than tabloid trash. What happen to trying to find out if Michael is alive? Michael didn't do this, and it wasn't Michael there, and his ears, his jaw, his nose, What the hell? Michael didn't spend his whole life for us, just to have us in the end say, OH, thats not him !!!!! All those years, do you think he would risk his hard work to have someone else do it for him? I'm in aww that people are believing this. Look at Michael's face, look in his eyes, ITS HIM, FOR GOD SAKE. Stop trying to take his legacy from him. He did it all, no one else. It makes me really sad to realize what this has come down to. :( :(
lynnandsofee, this website is called Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators. It was set up as one in which people were invited to forensically examine the obviously strange and discordant events of June 25th and beyond. Although every moment of Mike's life is scrutinized, it is done with respect.
More and more people are convinced that doubles were used, and I'm sure this won't be the last thread in which doubles are discussed. It's not about taking Mike's legacy away from him, it's looking at the big picture and trying to solve the enormous puzzle. If it hurts you to see what's discussed in threads like this one I think you better skip them. If you think that it's all Mike in those pictures then I respect that, but let us discuss our ideas.
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I think that´s what we all did (me included) during the years:
(http://th03.deviantart.net/fs50/300W/f/2009/263/b/e/ariel_by_palnk.jpg)
It might be that we´ll find a whole new world on the surface of the sea.
Maybe a livelier, more multidimensional truth?...
Maybe something that´s completely different from what we´ve dreamed of?...
Or more brilliant than we´ve ever imagined?...
To break the surface is at any rate more interesting than to fancy someone from "out of the cave".
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lynnandsofee, this website is called Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators. It was set up as one in which people were invited to forensically examine the obviously strange and discordant events of June 25th and beyond. Although every moment of Mike's life is scrutinized, it is done with respect.
More and more people are convinced that doubles were used, and I'm sure this won't be the last thread in which doubles are discussed. It's not about taking Mike's legacy away from him, it's looking at the big picture and trying to solve the enormous puzzle. If it hurts you to see what's discussed in threads like this one I think you better skip them. If you think that it's all Mike in those pictures then I respect that, but let us discuss our ideas.
You're absolutely right. ;)
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I´m sorry if this was discussed before in this context.
But this video came to my mind while thinking about the whole "double" subject.
[youtube:u09nb5l6]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0SBTBcTDHo[/youtube:u09nb5l6]
Leaving aside the funny aspect for a moment - wouldn´t this be reason enough?...
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
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I know the MJ doubbles are more sophisticated and harder to spot than an ordinary impersonator or tribute artist.... but anyway i made this little video of impersonators ... enjoy!
[youtube:1gzag922]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8kcgpi5MEQ[/youtube:1gzag922]
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I think that´s what we all did (me included) during the years:
(http://th03.deviantart.net/fs50/300W/f/2009/263/b/e/ariel_by_palnk.jpg)
It might be that we´ll find a whole new world on the surface of the sea.
Maybe a livelier, more multidimensional truth?...
Maybe something that´s completely different from what we´ve dreamed of?...
Or more brilliant than we´ve ever imagined?...
To break the surface is at any rate more interesting than to fancy someone from "out of the cave".
I really don't see what there is to look forward to concerning this- the only thing that wouldn't totally suck is if the MAIN double we've seen is closely tied by family blood to him. Finding a lot of totally non-related people in his place would a very make-you-feel-like-an-idiot experience- After all, Miss Ariel there still pretty much got what she wanted with ol' Eric..and no doubles.
You know, I pretty much always noticed the differences in Living With. I can't see how he would trust doubles with the kids, ESPECIALLY baby Blanket, yet, that part where he's feeding him he seems weird and like, phony or something.. I wonder if there are still fakes in it, but any time we see him with the kids, it is the real him, but he acts weird because one of his "alters" is activated, like Mo and Souza wrote in that blog..?
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I wonder if there are still fakes in it, but any time we see him with the kids, it is the real him, but he acts weird because one of his "alters" is activated, like Mo and Souza wrote in that blog..?
But most of the time we can see Michael with the wider nose, with the children.
http://[url=http][img]http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/5857/daddyo.jpg[/img][/url]
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
The vehemence of his refusal caught my eye.
What comes off to me from the clip is not "I don´t want to tour because it´s a little uncomfortable" -
He says: IT´S HELL....he repeats it, he means it.
But this statement is obviously not "Mainstream-& Fan-suitable" so his true feelings get censored. Sad. :(
What do you think?...
Pink Topaz: Learn Observe Vision Embrace. I can´t add more to that. Period.
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lynnandsofee, do not take it that way, do not think it's a lack of respect, in fact we all know that there are double, and this site is to investigate and comment, always respecting his opinion and everyone. ;)
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I think that´s what we all did (me included) during the years:
(http://th03.deviantart.net/fs50/300W/f/2009/263/b/e/ariel_by_palnk.jpg)
It might be that we´ll find a whole new world on the surface of the sea.
Maybe a livelier, more multidimensional truth?...
Maybe something that´s completely different from what we´ve dreamed of?...
Or more brilliant than we´ve ever imagined?...
To break the surface is at any rate more interesting than to fancy someone from "out of the cave".
I really don't see what there is to look forward to concerning this- the only thing that wouldn't totally suck is if the MAIN double we've seen is closely tied by family blood to him. Finding a lot of totally non-related people in his place would a very make-you-feel-like-an-idiot experience- After all, Miss Ariel there still pretty much got what she wanted with ol' Eric..and no doubles.
You know, I pretty much always noticed the differences in Living With. I can't see how he would trust doubles with the kids, ESPECIALLY baby Blanket, yet, that part where he's feeding him he seems weird and like, phony or something.. I wonder if there are still fakes in it, but any time we see him with the kids, it is the real him, but he acts weird because one of his "alters" is activated, like Mo and Souza wrote in that blog..?
Pink, like I said: take a break! You are angry at someone that isn't able to defend himself now. We are only speculating here.
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
He didn't like the different timezones.
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
He didn't like the different timezones.
he also used doubles in his Music Videos. like E'Cas was the Michael on the Rocket in the ''Leave Me Alone'' Video. Because of schedule conflicts.
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
He didn't like the different timezones.
he also used doubles in his Music Videos. like E'Cas was the Michael on the Rocket in the ''Leave Me Alone'' Video. Because of schedule conflicts.
I am sorry, but does anyone know E'cas' age? I think he is way to young to have played that. And altough he is one of the best impersonaters, he doesn't look that much like him.
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
He didn't like the different timezones.
he also used doubles in his Music Videos. like E'Cas was the Michael on the Rocket in the ''Leave Me Alone'' Video. Because of schedule conflicts.
I am sorry, but does anyone know E'cas' age? I think he is way to young to have played that. And altough he is one of the best impersonaters, he doesn't look that much like him.
im not 100% sure but i think he is in his mid 30's
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
He didn't like the different timezones.
he also used doubles in his Music Videos. like E'Cas was the Michael on the Rocket in the ''Leave Me Alone'' Video. Because of schedule conflicts.
I am sorry, but does anyone know E'cas' age? I think he is way to young to have played that. And altough he is one of the best impersonaters, he doesn't look that much like him.
I can remember something that he was around 5 years younger than Michael...
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
He didn't like the different timezones.
he also used doubles in his Music Videos. like E'Cas was the Michael on the Rocket in the ''Leave Me Alone'' Video. Because of schedule conflicts.
I am sorry, but does anyone know E'cas' age? I think he is way to young to have played that. And altough he is one of the best impersonaters, he doesn't look that much like him.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0262721/resume (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0262721/resume)
This page is old, but I think E'Cas is born in 1975..
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watch this vid from 3.05 till 4.19.
[youtube:1xw90rph]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfFKyuSjiHA[/youtube:1xw90rph]
I don´t think this video is fair to MJ.
During the funeral was said that he was quite simple when came to food, also Uri said that he was ok just ordering indian takeaway food from the corner restaurant.
Michael was in My country in 88. The chef of the hotel where Michael stayed was my neighbour and he informed me about his drinking/ food habits. He asked for watermelon juices, water and nothing fancy to eat at all.
When Touring he also had a very humble room in his bus.
Up to this point, media has shown an extravagant image of Michael which I think is far from reality.
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Coming back to doubles, the Alabama theory has been the most shoking to me.
MJ being happily married since many years, has twins, lives in Alabama with his family.
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Coming back to doubles, the Alabama theory has been the most shoking to me.
MJ being happily married since many years, has twins, lives in Alabama with his family.
Hmmm, I read that and I don't believe it. I can't believe his family speaking out on anything, most definitely not about this. And the person was not very nice at the end as well. I debunked that for a few reasons, although I think that there might be some truths in it.
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Born in Los Angeles, he became fascinated with the Jackson Five family (especially the then 8-year'old Michael) while still a toddler. "Jackson Five was a young, positive group and my morn thought they would be good role models for me,' he says.”I began mimicking Michael when I was 3 years old and became obsessed with imitating him.
That's what I found about E'Cas.
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
He didn't like the different timezones.
he also used doubles in his Music Videos. like E'Cas was the Michael on the Rocket in the ''Leave Me Alone'' Video. Because of schedule conflicts.
I am sorry, but does anyone know E'cas' age? I think he is way to young to have played that. And altough he is one of the best impersonaters, he doesn't look that much like him.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0262721/resume (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0262721/resume)
This page is old, but I think E'Cas is born in 1975..
That's what I thought as well, means he was 12 during Leave me Alone, and 16 or 17 around Who is it. So in that case it could not have been him.
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That's what I thought as well, means he was 12 during Leave me Alone, and 16 or 17 around Who is it. So in that case it could not have been him.
But what about what I posted above? That he seemed to be 3 years old when Michael was 8 years old? It's so confusing, because I can't find the exact birth date of E'Cas...
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Coming back to doubles, the Alabama theory has been the most shoking to me.
MJ being happily married since many years, has twins, lives in Alabama with his family.
Hmmm, I read that and I don't believe it. I can't believe his family speaking out on anything, most definitely not about this. And the person was not very nice at the end as well. I debunked that for a few reasons, although I think that there might be some truths in it.
What truths do you think?
Shocking in deed that someone goes on twitter and claims to be a family member of Michael and tells that story.
By chance I found more accounts making references to the Alabama theory on myspace and twitter, ie comeback777 or cas.
I do understand having a decoy for certain situations but I have a hard time to believe the Alabama theory, but I am not surprised either. Some women are convinced that they are carriying MJ´s baby soul being reincarnated after death, and some groups supports that idea. There is a probabilty that the person who thinks that MJ is married in Alabama was convinced about it by the rumor.
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I found this on E'casanova:
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0262721/resume (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0262721/resume)
That is strange....
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That's what I thought as well, means he was 12 during Leave me Alone, and 16 or 17 around Who is it. So in that case it could not have been him.
But what about what I posted above? That he seemed to be 3 years old when Michael was 8 years old? It's so confusing, because I can't find the exact birth date of E'Cas...
(http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/18/agem.png)
If in 2001 his age range was 19-27, in 2010 his age range is 28-36
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That's what I thought as well, means he was 12 during Leave me Alone, and 16 or 17 around Who is it. So in that case it could not have been him.
But what about what I posted above? That he seemed to be 3 years old when Michael was 8 years old? It's so confusing, because I can't find the exact birth date of E'Cas...
(http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/18/agem.png)
If in 2001 his age range was 19-27, in 2010 his age range is 28-36
I don't know what's true... On different websites you can read that he was a toddler during the J5 era...
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I have never heard of ECas in the Leave Me Alone video and I just checked the official threads and it does not mention it.
Sony used ECas in Who Is It because of Michael's schedules. They show Ecas in the car where he covers his face and also blurred when he is at the airport. Michael was upset about that and so the video was banned in the US.
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
He didn't like the different timezones.
he also used doubles in his Music Videos. like E'Cas was the Michael on the Rocket in the ''Leave Me Alone'' Video. Because of schedule conflicts.
I am sorry, but does anyone know E'cas' age? I think he is way to young to have played that. And altough he is one of the best impersonaters, he doesn't look that much like him.
IMO, I find E-Cass is the one with the closest eyes to MJ.
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Rag doll, do you mean that he used doubles because he hated to tour?
I don´t know - could be part of the root.
Why did he hate to tour?
He didn't like the different timezones.
he also used doubles in his Music Videos. like E'Cas was the Michael on the Rocket in the ''Leave Me Alone'' Video. Because of schedule conflicts.
I am sorry, but does anyone know E'cas' age? I think he is way to young to have played that. And altough he is one of the best impersonaters, he doesn't look that much like him.
IMO, I find E-Cass is the one with the closest eyes to MJ.
From what I see on pictures ECas is also a very attractive man without the make-over.
But beyond that: it´s probably not hard to find a good make-up artist in Hollywood who´s able to lend a hand, some shades and a wig to style even someone who only has a vague resemblance for a picture or a video scene.
I think to find someone who´s able to act throughout a whole concert in front of a live-audience -incl. dancing, talking, gestures, etc - would be a more challenging project.
So if there has been someone who met those particular requirements and took care of business by jumping in now and then: Respect! 8-)
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Since we're reached the point of thinking about the intentions of the double(s) I'd like you to take a look at the following image. This image contains signatures, supposedly Mike's, on official documents and letters. I numbered them, and made a list showing which signature appears on which document/letter:
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/signatures01.jpg)
Full size image here: http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/ ... ures02.jpg (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/signatures02.jpg)
1: Marriage license Lisa Marie Presley
2: The Chandler settlement
3: Letter concerning participation in project "The Way of the Unicorn/The Endangered Ones"
4: The will
5: Moonwalk
6: Passport issued in 1987
7: Letter firing John Branca
8: Letter to Diane Williams, cease and desist from signing for his certified mail
9: Letter to Judge Melville substitution of Tom Mesereau in place of Geragos
10: Passport issued in 1993
11: Drivers license
12: AEG contract signature "Michael Jackson"
13: AEG contract signature "The Michael Jackson Company LLC, Name: Michael Jackson"
14: Contract mayor city of Gary concerning The Michael J Jackson Performing Arts Center
After comparing these signatures, of which some differ significantly from others, the question rises:
WHO SIGNED WHICH DOCUMENT/LETTER, AND WITH WHICH INTENTIONS?
Food for thought...
good job Mo! ;)
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Since we're reached the point of thinking about the intentions of the double(s) I'd like you to take a look at the following image. This image contains signatures, supposedly Mike's, on official documents and letters. I numbered them, and made a list showing which signature appears on which document/letter:
(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/signatures01.jpg)
Full size image here: http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/ ... ures02.jpg (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forumpics/signatures02.jpg)
1: Marriage license Lisa Marie Presley
2: The Chandler settlement
3: Letter concerning participation in project "The Way of the Unicorn/The Endangered Ones"
4: The will
5: Moonwalk
6: Passport issued in 1987
7: Letter firing John Branca
8: Letter to Diane Williams, cease and desist from signing for his certified mail
9: Letter to Judge Melville substitution of Tom Mesereau in place of Geragos
10: Passport issued in 1993
11: Drivers license
12: AEG contract signature "Michael Jackson"
13: AEG contract signature "The Michael Jackson Company LLC, Name: Michael Jackson"
14: Contract mayor city of Gary concerning The Michael J Jackson Performing Arts Center
After comparing these signatures, of which some differ significantly from others, the question rises:
WHO SIGNED WHICH DOCUMENT/LETTER, AND WITH WHICH INTENTIONS?
Food for thought...
good job Mo! ;)
here is another one..
and: Epperson offers a few authentication tips:
1. Steer clear of signatures that look like they’re signed slowly and carefully, that don’t flow. Jackson signed his whole life, and signed quickly. And they shouldn’t be shaky.
2. Jackson held the pen near the cap so he didn’t get ink on his hands. That means he couldn’t “dig in.” Look for lighter strokes on the tall letters, where the pen started to rise from the paper.
3. When forgers attempt to copy the “bumps” that make up the smaller letters in Jackson’s name, they’re often too exact, like they’re drawn, not signed. The real signature has higher and lower peaks, and irregular spacing
and Jackson was always a generous signer and probably signed well over 100,000 autographs over his career, but in the last months of his life he took it to a new level. “He was signing like a madman in L.A. and Las Vegas since October,” Epperson said. “If you caught him leaving tour rehearsals at Staples Center you could hand him 50 things and he’d sign them all.”
A professional collector reported, “It was the best kept secret among the pros. They really exploited the guy. Some got hundreds of items signed. They’re selling them now for $1,000-$2,000 each.
http://autographmagazine.com/2010/01/michael-jackson-remembered-in-autographs/
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Okay, my thought on doubles is that i will never be 100% convinced as i am rarely 100% convinced of ANYTHING. But since this is moving fast now i feel the need to post. As a watcher for a long time, tons and tons of pictures have been posted, comparisons made, ears checked and checked again, morphing videos posted etc etc People have argued and laughed and been shocked and hurt, so.. what does that leave us with? Questions. Lots of questions. Lets say for example that the people reading this post are the ones who need no more pictures of ears to believe that there are multiple doubles- then shall we address the following questions?
When did doubles start getting used?
When was the last 'era' of pictures that all seemed to be MJ?
Was there ever a 'real' MJ? or just a collection of doubles?
Was there an 'original' MJ? and when was the last time we saw him?
(sorry for this one) Might the 'real' guy have died a long time ago? could it be possible they replaced him with a double to keep the money coming?
Where does this leave the death investigation? since we're not really sure who the 'real' MJ is and even if he existed at all? What if Michael Jackson was just an idea, using a collection of people all changed surgically to achieve a look of the same person? And if that is true and we find out about this then the IDEA has DIED.. therefore this is not a hoax death at all.
If there was an original MJ, for what reasons did he start using doubles? Was it his choice?
Who were these 'doubles' did they have lives before this? or were they bred for purpose?
all ideas to ponder on our quest for truth. Please feel free to add your own questions about this, i am sure i have just touched the surface on these things.
I apologise if any of the above have already been discussed in previous threads/posts.
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Okay, my thought on doubles is that i will never be 100% convinced as i am rarely 100% convinced of ANYTHING. But since this is moving fast now i feel the need to post. As a watcher for a long time, tons and tons of pictures have been posted, comparisons made, ears checked and checked again, morphing videos posted etc etc People have argued and laughed and been shocked and hurt, so.. what does that leave us with? Questions. Lots of questions. Lets say for example that the people reading this post are the ones who need no more pictures of ears to believe that there are multiple doubles- then shall we address the following questions?
When did doubles start getting used?
When was the last 'era' of pictures that all seemed to be MJ?
Was there ever a 'real' MJ? or just a collection of doubles?
Was there an 'original' MJ? and when was the last time we saw him?
(sorry for this one) Might the 'real' guy have died a long time ago? could it be possible they replaced him with a double to keep the money coming?
Where does this leave the death investigation? since we're not really sure who the 'real' MJ is and even if he existed at all? What if Michael Jackson was just an idea, using a collection of people all changed surgically to achieve a look of the same person? And if that is true and we find out about this then the IDEA has DIED.. therefore this is not a hoax death at all.
If there was an original MJ, for what reasons did he start using doubles? Was it his choice?
Who were these 'doubles' did they have lives before this? or were they bred for purpose?
all ideas to ponder on our quest for truth. Please feel free to add your own questions about this, i am sure i have just touched the surface on these things.
I apologise if any of the above have already been discussed in previous threads/posts.
Well, it's good to think outside the box into any possibility and be optimistic. especially with this Death Hoax Investigation you have to be.
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Okay, my thought on doubles is that i will never be 100% convinced as i am rarely 100% convinced of ANYTHING. But since this is moving fast now i feel the need to post. As a watcher for a long time, tons and tons of pictures have been posted, comparisons made, ears checked and checked again, morphing videos posted etc etc People have argued and laughed and been shocked and hurt, so.. what does that leave us with? Questions. Lots of questions. Lets say for example that the people reading this post are the ones who need no more pictures of ears to believe that there are multiple doubles- then shall we address the following questions?
When did doubles start getting used?
When was the last 'era' of pictures that all seemed to be MJ?
Was there ever a 'real' MJ? or just a collection of doubles?
Was there an 'original' MJ? and when was the last time we saw him?
(sorry for this one) Might the 'real' guy have died a long time ago? could it be possible they replaced him with a double to keep the money coming?
Where does this leave the death investigation? since we're not really sure who the 'real' MJ is and even if he existed at all? What if Michael Jackson was just an idea, using a collection of people all changed surgically to achieve a look of the same person? And if that is true and we find out about this then the IDEA has DIED.. therefore this is not a hoax death at all.
If there was an original MJ, for what reasons did he start using doubles? Was it his choice?
Who were these 'doubles' did they have lives before this? or were they bred for purpose?
all ideas to ponder on our quest for truth. Please feel free to add your own questions about this, i am sure i have just touched the surface on these things.
I apologise if any of the above have already been discussed in previous threads/posts.
Well, it's good to think outside the box into any possibility and be optimistic. especially with this Death Hoax Investigation you have to be.
Yes.. everything is possible. I agree. What has optimism got to do with it? This is an investigation right? We have to remain impartial. What good does hoping for the best do? The worse already happened a long time ago, June 25th 2009? For most Michael Jackson 'fans' (sorry using the F word) that was Armageddon, we're now waiting for the fall out to clear. Are we trying to find some hope here? or the TRUTH? :)
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Okay, my thought on doubles is that i will never be 100% convinced as i am rarely 100% convinced of ANYTHING. But since this is moving fast now i feel the need to post. As a watcher for a long time, tons and tons of pictures have been posted, comparisons made, ears checked and checked again, morphing videos posted etc etc People have argued and laughed and been shocked and hurt, so.. what does that leave us with? Questions. Lots of questions. Lets say for example that the people reading this post are the ones who need no more pictures of ears to believe that there are multiple doubles- then shall we address the following questions?
When did doubles start getting used?
When was the last 'era' of pictures that all seemed to be MJ?
Was there ever a 'real' MJ? or just a collection of doubles?
Was there an 'original' MJ? and when was the last time we saw him?
(sorry for this one) Might the 'real' guy have died a long time ago? could it be possible they replaced him with a double to keep the money coming?
Where does this leave the death investigation? since we're not really sure who the 'real' MJ is and even if he existed at all? What if Michael Jackson was just an idea, using a collection of people all changed surgically to achieve a look of the same person? And if that is true and we find out about this then the IDEA has DIED.. therefore this is not a hoax death at all.
If there was an original MJ, for what reasons did he start using doubles? Was it his choice?
Who were these 'doubles' did they have lives before this? or were they bred for purpose?
all ideas to ponder on our quest for truth. Please feel free to add your own questions about this, i am sure i have just touched the surface on these things.
I apologise if any of the above have already been discussed in previous threads/posts.
Well, it's good to think outside the box into any possibility and be optimistic. especially with this Death Hoax Investigation you have to be.
Yes.. everything is possible. I agree. What has optimism got to do with it? This is an investigation right? We have to remain impartial. What good does hoping for the best do? The worse already happened a long time ago, June 25th 2009? For most Michael Jackson 'fans' (sorry using the F word) that was Armageddon, we're now waiting for the fall out to clear. Are we trying to find some hope here? or the TRUTH? :)
Well as bad as this may sound...Im now hoping for the TRUTH. If MJ is alive (and he is)then I will be ecstatic of course, but I would like to know the TRUTH on why he did it. If he is dead, then I am prepared to deal with that, but I would like to know the TRUTH into what really happened...
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The White Rabbit, I also do some of the questions, I think his is a real MJ, when was the last time we saw him?, I definitely do not know.
That the real MJ died and is being replaced by a double, this would be a case where the family would be involved.
MJ and I think maybe it is true there is a lot of people changed surgically, but I think this issue is that the so decided
The Hoax death investigation should continue, not to forget the many strange things have been discovered in this forum and others, and it is because I refused the option of MJ may have died, is that it is easier show that this live show otherwise. When you enter this forum has been with the intention of knowing the truth, one thing that all humans have insurance, and that is death. :geek:
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I realize that a lot of time and effort has been put in to the idea of doubles or a doppleganger but I honestly and firmly believe that it is all Michael. I did an experiment and took pictures of myself and in each picture I look very different. These pictures where taken indoors, outdoors, in the sun, in the shade etc. I did nothing unusual at all. Depending on the light, how I held myself, the angle at which the camera was held etc. I do look different. In some pictures I almost look like a different person yet these pictures where only taken seconds and minutes apart. I had a friend look at them, without telling them why, and their comment was "WOW! You sure look different in each pic ...lol". So yes, it is possible for Michael to appear "different" in each and every picture ever taken of him.
Jackson was always a generous signer and probably signed well over 100,000 autographs over his career, but in the last months of his life he took it to a new level. “He was signing like a madman in L.A. and Las Vegas since October,” Epperson said. “If you caught him leaving tour rehearsals at Staples Center you could hand him 50 things and he’d sign them all.”
A professional collector reported, “It was the best kept secret among the pros. They really exploited the guy. Some got hundreds of items signed. They’re selling them now for $1,000-$2,000 each.
http://autographmagazine.com/2010/01/michael-jackson-remembered-in-autographs/
I think that this is significant that he wanted lots of copies of his signature circulating out there. Perhaps so his signature could be compared to that FAKE will that is in probate court and the estate of a living dead man being represented by a FIRED and corrupt lawyer.
As far as doubles go, I don't think Michael used them beyond stunt work, illusions/distractions and decoys.
I do think there is something going on with the concept of DUALITY and it has become confused with the idea of doubles having a greater role than intended.
I am currently researching this:
Dualism is the doctrine that the world (or reality) consists of two basic, opposed, and irreducible principles that account for all that exists. It has played an important role in the history of thought and of religion.
http://www.cyberspacei.com/jesusi/inlight/religion/belief/dualism.htm
Dualism
Dualism denotes a state of two parts. The word's origin is the Latin duo, "two" . The term 'dualism' was originally coined to denote co-eternal binary opposition, a meaning that is preserved in metaphysical and philosophical duality discourse but has been diluted in general or common usages.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dualism
Anyways, that is my position on this and I will continue researching this philosophy but I thought I would share as it seems relevant to me with all the "Two's" of everything and maybe we are looking in the wrong place concerning this.
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I've been reading and reading carefully the past days all the posts concerning "The Double Theory'' , ''Michael Jackson and Doppelganger'' and ALL stuff related. I respect all the contradicting theories and opinions expressed even though some of them confused me...I feel sorry for the fans who find it difficult to accept the fact that Michael indeed used doubles. :? I understand fully how you feel but as it has already been mentioned and as the name of the site itself reveales what we all mean to do here is INVESTIGATE so theories are part of the investigation. To me the ''Double Theory'' is not just a ''theory'' it's reality cause Michael has been using doubles for years and years. I believe that he did not do it aiming to hurt the feelings of his fans or to deceive them; he had to do it on many occassions cause if he chose not to he would be in danger.. :!: so instead of judging someone who cannot speak for himself right now please try to understand ''WHY'' he did all these.
Proceeding, I would like to state my opinion. I do believe that Michael undoubtedly used, uses and will keep using doubles probably to avoid putting himself in danger. What confuses me the most is the ''Joe- Joseph'' thing. I have no idea what is going on in here. I appreciate the hard work of the admins to put the ''Twin Theory'' together, it's just doesn't seem possible to me for a number of reasons:
[- Since the group '' The Jackson 5'' immerged, Michael was too young when he joined his brothers.. noone could be sure back then whether the band would have a success or not so if Michael had a twin brother I don't see why the family would have to hide him back then.
- With paparazzi hunting the Jackson family for years at least we would have a shot of the 10th member of the family...I mean shamone....where has this human been hiding all these years?? (Originally the kids of the Jackson family were 9, including Marlon's twin who died at birth. Michael was born after Marlon. Michael was the 7th child. I'm sure most of you know this facts.)
- Back in 1958 when Michael and his supposed twin were born there was no reason for the twin to be kept a secret.. I mean noone knew the future of baby Michael and i'm sure if there was a twin there would be people to confirm that (relatives, neighbours, a school teacher, just somebody...)
- At least it would be a matter of dispute all these years. It could even surface as a rumour that Michael has a twin brother in hiding used as a double. How many rumours have we all heard surrounding Michael... I don't know if any of you is aware of such a rumour but i am not. If you do please come forward.
- Finally, what kind of a mother would agree one of her kids to be in hiding, in other words to have no life, just to serve his famous brother? It's sooo unfair and heartless...
(Feel free to add your own ideas to this list...) :roll: ]
For all the above reasons I'm sceptical concerning the ''Twin Theory''. But I appreciate the hard work of the admins to put the theory together and I'm willing to discuss the matter.
Apart from the twin theory, I mentioned above that the ''Joe-Joseph'' thing is really confusing. (I wanna make it clear that I do respect ALL the opinions.)
IMHO Michael is behind everything..I think that ''Joe'' is used as the Michael Jackson persona that was carefully created all these years -the megastar- and sadly the singer who was accused of child molestation and proved to be INNOCENT..
''Joseph'' is used as the child, the brother, the father, the friend (Michael's name by birth, the will, the birth certificates of his children).
NOTE that both names ''Joe&Joseph'' have been used to his driving licenses... :?: :!:
Last but not least, I would like to express my opinion concerning the morhing pictures in an attempt to figure out who the real deal is....That's A COOL IDEA :!: Personally I'm sceptical over who the real Michael is on Bashit documentary. I think that in this documentary we see at least 2 Mikes.[attachment=1:5ghyvrnd]bashit555e.jpg[/attachment:5ghyvrnd]
IMHO the real Deal is this one: [attachment=0:5ghyvrnd]bashir doc..jpg[/attachment:5ghyvrnd]
I would very much appreciated if Mo and Souza could try to morph the pics that show the 2 at least different Mikes from Bashit documentary to see who the real deal is, if there is one. Girls who do you think is the real one?
To end my post:
http://www.myspace.com/realmichaeljackson
I've been to this account posted by the member ''Grace''.
It looks tottaly fake to me and the story seems to be made up. My post is already long so i'll cut my opinion short just by saying that i agree with Mo's opinion concerning this.
ABOUT THE PROFILE PHOTO: doesn't it look photoshopped??
I apologise for the lenght of my post. Originally i was planning to post it on ''The real deal...at least that's what we think'' thread but since it is locked I decided to post it here.
THANK YOU ALL 4 READING :roll: ;)
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At memorial, Michael was asked to hug Brandon.
Why was this said if - what we think to know now - was known then by the family since a long time ?
Have we seen any DC for Brandon?
Did we ever check what happened to Brandon?
If he did not die, was he raised with the clan?
There are still too many questions to be answered.
Alabama is where Brandon is said to have been buried.
Katherine said Alabama is home.
Anybody out there to check it for us?
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elenamjgirl, their exposure is good and I agree with many of the things I write ;)
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Thank you for your fantastic and thoughtful posts. You have analyzed the twin and double theories very well, I think. I have always thought that the statement concerning Brandon was a hint, although I was told it was insignificant. I don't think so. There were two very important clues given by Marlon during his speech: the first one is concerning the disguises, the second one about the twin. Now why would Marlon have mentioned these two things at the end of the Memorial? These were meant to provide clues to fans or believers. And a Memorial? What was the purpose of that?
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Thanks for your extensive post Elena!
I am not excluding anything, it's way too early for that as there are still too many unanswered questions. Keep thinking outside the box while examining everything.
I wonder if we'll ever get to the bottom of all this, as there might be very good reasons to keep certain things in the closet.
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[- Since the group '' The Jackson 5'' immerged, Michael was too young when he joined his brothers.. noone could be sure back then whether the band would have a success or not so if Michael had a twin brother I don't see why the family would have to hide him back then.
- With paparazzi hunting the Jackson family for years at least we would have a shot of the 10th member of the family...I mean shamone....where has this human been hiding all these years?? (Originally the kids of the Jackson family were 9, including Marlon's twin who died at birth. Michael was born after Marlon. Michael was the 7th child. I'm sure most of you know this facts.)
- Back in 1958 when Michael and his supposed twin were born there was no reason for the twin to be kept a secret.. I mean noone knew the future of baby Michael and i'm sure if there was a twin there would be people to confirm that (relatives, neighbours, a school teacher, just somebody...)
- At least it would be a matter of dispute all these years. It could even surface as a rumour that Michael has a twin brother in hiding used as a double. How many rumours have we all heard surrounding Michael... I don't know if any of you is aware of such a rumour but i am not. If you do please come forward.
- Finally, what kind of a mother would agree one of her kids to be in hiding, in other words to have no life, just to serve his famous brother? It's sooo unfair and heartless...
Agree 100%
When the kids were born, they (Joe and Katherine) could never know that they became famous in the future.
And besides that, I can't imagine that someone would hide their child...
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Oh you would wonder how many children are being hidden or diprived from life by their families on this planet. Please don't forget that the Jackson kids - like millions still today - had to make the money for the family. It was child labour and selling the kids if we want to be honest. It happens everywhere each second.
If you are not a strong one, don't read further pls. as truth is very hurtful some times.
I don't want to go for all injustice on earth. Some shocking truths however are:
- in Africa disabled children are hidden from public throughout their lifetime (often disabled due to genetic defects resulting from inzest and too close marriages within the families). It is very difficult to break up the taboos surrounding inzest and genetic defects. The child is seen as a stroke of negative fate by God, not a result of human misbehaviour. The child is an impersonated shame and God's punishment to the family.
- in Asia female babies are being killed right after birth or aborted on purpose because female gender means that the family has to pay for the marriage. Many cannot afford this so they kill the children. Girls are a shame, they are often sold to city prostitution at age of 8 or 10 to at least bring some money home (read about Bangkok and related).
- in Africa, girls are still facing the threat of concision (removal of clitoris and sewing of vagina). This happens even in Europe, executed by corrupt physicians serving the immigrated families. Btw it is in many cases that the concised mothers insist their girls should undergo this torture.
- we are facing the sexual abuse cases all over the industrialized and "socially devellopped" countries. It seems that violence against women and children does not know any borders anymore. There have been cases where girls have been imprisoned as slaves to their father half of their lives (with the knowledge of their mothers) in Europe and in the U.S., no difference. There have been many cases where churches and priests were involved in sexual and physical abuse.
If it is possible that such peaks of injustice icebergs executed on children are coming to daylight everywhere now, if we are honestly discussing child abuse of all kind (remember Souza's and Mo's blogs) then it is also potentially in the scope that there was a child hidden for whatever reason and purpose in the Jackson clan. Remember all their other secrets.
I am not saying that it was the case. I am saying it is not impossible.
There is still a long way to go and a lot of tasks out there for everyone to do some good and help the non- privileged in our neighbourhood.
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I know unfortunately it happens everywhere.... :( :( :(
But I just dont think this happened in this case.
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Every family has secrets. Why would the Jacksons be any different? Their fame does not make them above any other family or immune from what other families face. The Jacksons are in the public eye yet they still maintain private lives hidden from the public. Therefore individual secrets and those of the family as a collective unit do exist.
Some family secrets are good and there are also some not-so-good ones. Some family secrets are revealed by choice. Usually secrets are openly revealed if a family thinks that the time is right and that outsiders need to know those secrets for any reason. Sometimes secrets are taken to the grave and never revealed. Just like all other families, the Jacksons have demonstrated that they can keep secrets within their family.
Ask yourselves a question. Who outside of your family knows all of your family secrets?
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Ask yourselves a question. Who outside of your family knows all of your family secrets?
Even within a family there are secrets. Just a few weeks ago my sister revealed a story of which I didn't know anything until the day she decided it was time for me to know what had happened... I'm sure there are things that took place in both my sisters lives of which I don't know anything, or just know part of. Same goes for certain events which took place in my life, of which I never told my sisters or just told just one of them. We ALL have secrets.
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I believe for sure that every family has their own secrets, unfortunatly I have experienced it too...
But I can't imagine that they (Joe and Katherine) got a twin and hide one half. They didn't know that their children became famous and succesfull. And besides that, what other reason would there be for hiding the child? It doesn't make sense to me....
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All reasons you could imagine.
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Let's try an experiement. It isn't designed to encourage anyone to change their mind. It may simply shed light on how sometimes hard to understand and inexplainable things manage to occur in the everyday lives of families .
List 10 of the deepest and darkest secrets that you and/or family members have on a piece of paper. These should be the most heavily guarded secrets that you have not shared with anyone...not even your best friend. Now review the list and place a check mark next to the ones that would make sense to random outsiders or strangers. How many of those secrets did not receive a check mark?
The secrets of one family may cause another family to yawn and roll their eyes. Some family secrets may cause another family to run screaming in the streets. It's a judgement call as far as determining what needs to be revealed versus what must remain hidden. In addition, timing is everything. This is especially true for celebrities who work hard to maintain a certain type of public image. Did Janet reveal her marriage right away? No. Did Jermaine and Randy reveal right away that they fathered children with the same woman? No. Did the Jacksons reveal right away that Marlon had a twin? No. Did Michael Jackson reveal that he was dating and about to marry? No. Did the public learn right away that Joseph had a child out of wedlock? No.
I am reminded about a family secret that shocked the entertainment industry. Mackenzie Phillips revealed a horrifying family secret last year about her incestuous relationship with her own father, John Phillips. Fans of Mackenzie's and those of her father were mortified to learn about John's abuse and manipulation toward her. As I watch re-runs of One Day At A Time or listen to old Mama's and the Papa's records, you could never have convinced me in a million years back then that the talented actress and the musically gifted father would have been involved in anything other than a traditional father and daughter relationship. To have looked into a crystal ball and learned that John Phillips would become sick and sinister toward his own daughter would have made no sense to me or any other fans back then. Technically it still makes no sense but it did take place. Sadly ...it was a deep, dark and heavily guarded family secret for decades.
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imo i dont think that the family was hiding the twin because they shared the spotlight together just like mary kate and ashley olsen for years the world thought that there was only one olsen girl until they decided to share with the world that there were actually two (twins).
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imo i dont think that the family was hiding the twin because they shared the spotlight together just like mary kate and ashley olsen for years the world thought that there was only one olsen girl until they decided to share with the world that there were actually two (twins).
maybe they will REVEAL the twin later on.. who knows.
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imo i dont think that the family was hiding the twin because they shared the spotlight together just like mary kate and ashley olsen for years the world thought that there was only one olsen girl until they decided to share with the world that there were actually two (twins).
maybe they will REVEAL the twin later on.. who knows.
there is no twin... :? but there are dubbelMJ's... for his safety and freedom
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imo i dont think that the family was hiding the twin because they shared the spotlight together just like mary kate and ashley olsen for years the world thought that there was only one olsen girl until they decided to share with the world that there were actually two (twins).
maybe they will REVEAL the twin later on.. who knows.
there is no twin... :? but there are dubbelMJ's... for his safety and freedom
everyone is entitled to their own oppinion and btw anything is possible ;)
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I posted this in another thread tto,, but maybe we should start comparing HANDS??? You can change aloton a persons face but its hard to fake hands...as well as the eyes....
Ive seen pics where his fingers are long and lean and others his fingers look short and stubby and differences in the length between the joints in his fingers?
If anyone has the time to do this it would be great. I dont have time during the day to go thru tons of pics cus I work and Im not suppose to be on here anyways!!!
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I posted this in another thread tto,, but maybe we should start comparing HANDS??? You can change aloton a persons face but its hard to fake hands...as well as the eyes....
Ive seen pics where his fingers are long and lean and others his fingers look short and stubby and differences in the length between the joints in his fingers?
If anyone has the time to do this it would be great. I dont have time during the day to go thru tons of pics cus I work and Im not suppose to be on here anyways!!!
People have been comparing hands, and focused on palm prints. But...if you compare palm prints and fingerprints of twins, you find that the broad-brush pattern of lines, whorls, loops, etc., as well as what researchers call "ridge count," are quite similar for both. Nonetheless each kid has unique prints due to differences in detail. Keep that in mind when comparing hands.
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I posted this in another thread tto,, but maybe we should start comparing HANDS??? You can change aloton a persons face but its hard to fake hands...as well as the eyes....
Ive seen pics where his fingers are long and lean and others his fingers look short and stubby and differences in the length between the joints in his fingers?
If anyone has the time to do this it would be great. I dont have time during the day to go thru tons of pics cus I work and Im not suppose to be on here anyways!!!
People have been comparing hands, and focused on palm prints. But...if you compare palm prints and fingerprints of twins, you find that the broad-brush pattern of lines, whorls, loops, etc., as well as what researchers call "ridge count," are quite similar for both. Nonetheless each kid has unique prints due to differences in detail. Keep that in mind when comparing hands.
Well I mean fingers and thumbs...his fingers and thumbs, the shape of them seem ALOT diff in some pics.
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I posted this in another thread tto,, but maybe we should start comparing HANDS??? You can change aloton a persons face but its hard to fake hands...as well as the eyes....
Ive seen pics where his fingers are long and lean and others his fingers look short and stubby and differences in the length between the joints in his fingers?
If anyone has the time to do this it would be great. I dont have time during the day to go thru tons of pics cus I work and Im not suppose to be on here anyways!!!
People have been comparing hands, and focused on palm prints. But...if you compare palm prints and fingerprints of twins, you find that the broad-brush pattern of lines, whorls, loops, etc., as well as what researchers call "ridge count," are quite similar for both. Nonetheless each kid has unique prints due to differences in detail. Keep that in mind when comparing hands.
Well I mean fingers and thumbs...his fingers and thumbs, the shape of them seem ALOT diff in some pics.
True Jack-ster, very true!
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Have a look of this picture. The hands are different.
http://[url=http][img]http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/5731/hndeverschi1.jpg[/img][/url]
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Have a look of this picture. The hands are different.
http://[url=http][img]http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/5731/hndeverschi1.jpg[/img][/url]
Now see...to me those are the same hands. In the first pic his fingers are slightly bent, making htem look smaller. The thumbs in both pics are the same.
These are strange pics of MJ to me....he almost looks Asian in the 2nd one. His eyes.
I was also thinking that maybe someone who is really good at photoshop to take some of his possible "double" pics and compare them with the real MJ, but make his skin darker like he never had vitiligo....this might help us as well in determining who is real and who isnt. IDK...just a thought.
...and for the record...Im still 50-50 on the doubles thing....
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Have a look of this picture. The hands are different.
http://[url=http][img]http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/5731/hndeverschi1.jpg[/img][/url]
the fingernails are different, one has longer fingers then the other, both of there wrist are different one is skinner one is fatter, and one hand is longer then the other. obviously a doulbe in this pic. maybe both.
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Have a look of this picture. The hands are different.
http://[url=http][img]http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/5731/hndeverschi1.jpg[/img][/url]
the fingernails are different, one has longer fingers then the other, both of there wrist are different one is skinner one is fatter, and one hand is longer then the other. obviously a doulbe in this pic. maybe both.
I think the thinner fingers are MJ's.
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Have a look of this picture. The hands are different.
http://[url=http][img]http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/5731/hndeverschi1.jpg[/img][/url]
the fingernails are different, one has longer fingers then the other, both of there wrist are different one is skinner one is fatter, and one hand is longer then the other. obviously a doulbe in this pic. maybe both.
I think the thinner fingers are MJ's.
i think the dark fingernails are Michael. he always had those Dark Fingernails for some reason.
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i think the dark fingernails are Michael. he always had those Dark Fingernails for some reason.
Maybe he had vitiligo... :roll:
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Both the same person, Michael! :lol:
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I know this topic has been discussed ad nauseum however I couldn't help but post this for your comments - those of you who can still tolerate discussing it. To those who can't I am sorry but I couldn't help myself...I just need to discuss it one more time. Am I seeing it wrong or is there something amiss. Please look at 4:22 of this video by dmovie and stop the frame. This is a rare look at Michael's profile from the days when he wears the straight hair. His hair is blowing back. His face looks fine to me...he looks young and good but I couldn't help but think there was something with his ear. If I am seeing things just tell me.
If you compare this ear to the pic above in the previous persons post, they are def different
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zObRzJKLdK0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zObRzJKLdK0)
mjkate
Posts: 99
Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2010 3:36 pm
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(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/fcfbec/variousprofiles.jpg)
more posted here: http://exploringthehoax.wordpress.com/2 ... ins-oh-my/ (http://exploringthehoax.wordpress.com/2010/04/20/doubles-dopplegangers-n-twins-oh-my/)
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Thank you.
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(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/fcfbec/variousprofiles.jpg)
more posted here: http://exploringthehoax.wordpress.com/2 ... ins-oh-my/ (http://exploringthehoax.wordpress.com/2010/04/20/doubles-dopplegangers-n-twins-oh-my/)
wow, nice stuff.. 8-)
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(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/fcfbec/variousprofiles.jpg)
more posted here: http://exploringthehoax.wordpress.com/2 ... ins-oh-my/ (http://exploringthehoax.wordpress.com/2010/04/20/doubles-dopplegangers-n-twins-oh-my/)
wow, nice stuff.. 8-)
At the risk of getting bashed again for speaking out my thoughts: I also see what you see, bec. 8-)
There are obviously visible differences, partially recurring ones, over a longer period.
Edit: History /pointy ear argument invalid (see below).
Question:
Do you think that´s Michael at the 2001 Invincible signing session / performing at the 30th anniversary?
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Just fyi, the pointy ear is caused by the headset, it's clear in the large version of that pic from which that thumbnail was contrived.
For the record I'm not comparing soft tissue in this pic study.
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Of course there are differences ... :geek:
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(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/fcfbec/variousprofiles.jpg)
more posted here: http://exploringthehoax.wordpress.com/2 ... ins-oh-my/ (http://exploringthehoax.wordpress.com/2010/04/20/doubles-dopplegangers-n-twins-oh-my/)
wow, nice stuff.. 8-)
At the risk of getting bashed again for speaking out my thoughts: I also see what you see, bec. 8-)
There are obviously visible differences, partially recurring ones, over a longer period.
Edit: History /pointy ear argument invalid (see below).
Question:
Do you think that´s Michael at the 2001 Invincible signing session / performing at the 30th anniversary?
This is where I thought he looked truly different and much heavier. I thought his voice sounded the same though.
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Oh Mikaeel mi angelo!! You can change height, body shape, weight, nose, jaws, ears, profile, mouth and eyes in a split second! It's a miracle!
Ok, on a serious note.... I have seen pictures (prior to this hoax stuff) of him where I thought wtf, what did he do now? But then later I saw a pic of him where I thought huh, he looks just like he looked years ago. I'll see if I can post some pics to point out what I mean, BAD/DANGEROUS & HISTORY..
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Oh Mikaeel mi angelo!! You can change height, body shape, weight, nose, jaws, ears, profile, mouth and eyes in a split second! It's a miracle!
Ok, on a serious note.... I have seen pictures (prior to this hoax stuff) of him where I thought wtf, what did he do now? But then later I saw a pic of him where I thought huh, he looks just like he looked years ago. I'll see if I can post some pics to point out what I mean, BAD/DANGEROUS & HISTORY..
I know EXACTLY what you mean. There have been times when it almost hurt to look at him because he looked so different, like I just couldn't believe that was him. But then I'd see him again later and he'd look great and just like he used to. I especially noticed it around the time Invincible came out, his interview with Carson Daly, I thought he didn't look like himself. But then in 2005 (his trial), I thought he looked acceptionally better and more like himself...
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I know EXACTLY what you mean. There have been times when it almost hurt to look at him because he looked so different, like I just couldn't believe that was him. But then I'd see him again later and he'd look great and just like he used to. I especially noticed it around the time Invincible came out, his interview with Carson Daly, I thought he didn't look like himself. But then in 2005 (his trial), I thought he looked acceptionally better and more like himself...[/quote]
You know you're right--I used to think I was crazy. I couldn't figure out why he looked so good during the trial--so different from that 1999-2001 period.
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When it´s that what I have seen in a magazine today then I´m really really scared. The body of the doppelgänger scared me even though I know it is not Michael, but the stories are so hard to read :cry:
Guyz please tell me that Michael is NOT DEAD!!! Please...you are my only rock in here where I can lean on and gives me hope. Michael cannot be dead...no :cry:
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When it´s that what I have seen in a magazine today then I´m really really scared. The body of the doppelgänger scared me even though I know it is not Michael, but the stories are so hard to read :cry:
Guyz please tell me that Michael is NOT DEAD!!! Please...you are my only rock in here where I can lean on and gives me hope. Michael cannot be dead...no :cry:
He is NOT dead. Obviously one of his doubles died.
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..and here also the ears different, but also as child.
http://[url=http][img]http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/4952/ohrenrechtslinks.jpg[/img][/url]
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:o I am really surprised
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The ears are not different at all...you are comparing one pic thats dark and the other one's thats light....Its quite obvious that the shading on th ears in the darker pic sid more pronounced......
This is really not adding up.had tehre been 2 MJ's since birth, Papa Joe would have not kept it a secret..instead, he would have exploited that too....like some kind of a "double wonder".....two identical lead boys of one band....sounds like a profitable spectacle doesnt it? I am not trying to be rude, but going by his nature...thats what he would have done....
I agree taht there were doubles used on many occassions, but I dont buy the theory that there were 2 michael jacksons since birth. Had that been the case, both of the would have had the same plastic surgeries, the same pattern of skin discolouraion. the same pattern of balding, the same pattern of evrything...and I dunno if thats possible at all.[attachment=0:3rosud4n]012.jpg[/attachment:3rosud4n]
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This is really not adding up.had tehre been 2 MJ's since birth, Papa Joe would have not kept it a secret..instead, he would have exploited that too....like some kind of a "double wonder".....two identical lead boys of one band....sounds like a profitable spectacle doesnt it? I am not trying to be rude, but going by his nature...thats what he would have done....
IMO a very good point!
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This is really not adding up.had tehre been 2 MJ's since birth, Papa Joe would have not kept it a secret..instead, he would have exploited that too....like some kind of a "double wonder".....two identical lead boys of one band....sounds like a profitable spectacle doesnt it? I am not trying to be rude, but going by his nature...thats what he would have done....
You're pretty quick on ruling things out and on thinking to know what Joe would have and would not have done. Be careful with your judgments...
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@ girlsaturday i will have to check out that movie and it sounds interesting :) :)...and to those who have doubts im not tryin to bring about fear just the possibility..heres my overall goal that i want to show is that (1.)michael had doubles maybe even one that was very prominent..that he himself trained to moved and act liked him (2.)All these years it hasnt been "all michael" as some would believe or say that there has been an illusion going on (3.) With the genious idea by Michael to use doubles or a doppelganger..it could have also had its down sides..and as i stated in my video.."conflict" could have risen out of using doubles and that Michael's best wishes wasnt carried out like they was suppose to (4.) that i truly believe we havent seen the REAL MJ for a long time and that maybe with all the doubles and doppelgangers something went wrong and that now maybe the real MJ has to show come out and show himself..because we dont know how Michael really looks now
Say... :shock: I posted something about this very thing---almost verbatum--- on the old MJHD forum, without any reaction. I didn't bring it up HERE, because I read in the rules that we were NOT supposed to mention the children, I assumed for their safety.
I ALWAYS believed that the "50 plastic surgeries" was an internally conceived rumor to drive the acceptance of all the inconsistencies in the man's appearance over the years. MJ is not a liar. He told us a million times,TWO surgeries. But he IS a resourceful, clever Boy, bent on making his life SAFE and SANE. [/b] :wink:
The same with the rumor about taking (female) hormones. Sheeesh. When he began complaining about his back, it only enforced the rumor about hormones.That one worked because male and female hormonal manipulation can change a person's appearance SO drastically, his own mother couldn't tell him from a stranger!! These chemicals can change bone structure---something I could never understand, because I always thought MJ too intelligent to mess up his dna like that, yet he looked SO drastically different to me, yes, in interviews, too!
When he started wearing sunglasses ALL the time --even indoors---no matter WHAT he said about that, I FELT he was distancing himself from us. Not to be mean--but as a STRATEGIC COPING mechanism, with the future in mind. He has been fascinated with magic and disappearing acts since very young, and he has been PLANNING THIS disappearing act since BEFORE the BAD era.
I know it.
The only thing no one can copy is the EYES. This could be a reason for hiding them: trying to keep his real "giveaway" a secret, making us "unfamiliar" with them.
THE EYES HAVE IT!
Then, he began to wear all this make up. NOT foundation for cover---I mean the "face" he put on, which any decoy could ALSO put on , and the expectation would be that we'd see that "face" and ASSUME it was MJ---not really scrutinizing him---why would we? Eyeliner, shading and lipcolor applications can make even dissimilar faces look eerily alike---look at all the Bozos and Ronald McDonalds we've had over the years!
Michael Jackson is more clever than anyone EVER even thought about, besides the given sheer Genius of his musical/dance acumen. He IS :wink: :wink: going to be found to be more of a Magic-Man than anyone will even believe when he comes out and ADMITS it!!!!!!!
THANK YOU for saying that you think we haven't seen HIM (the real one) in a long time. I think we HAVE seen him periodically, just for moments. But I'm beginning to suspect any notion of HIM touring after Dangerous. He COULD get away with doubles on tour, as long as it is not recorded. This is better for me to believe than that MJ was actually ill or drug compromised.
BTW, Where is this video, everyone is talking about on this thread??
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Yea? What video?
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A lot of people don't have a soul of steel like you, Bec, Mo, Souza, etc, and to learn that all this time was WASTED on fakes.. God. This hoax has showed me some of the most sick ideas on Earth, and knowing that practically Michael's whole life is a total waste.. That person here named Hopeless is a pretty good summary, since reading this nothing about "Michael" brings me joy anymore, just worry and depression..anyone who cares even a little will have a piece of their heart smashed by this, what else would you think?
That is quite something you state here PinkTopaz. Soul of steel? No, I don't have a soul of steal, I'm just being realistic, down to earth. We have compared hundreds of photos over the last months, as we noticed different facial features in the beginning of the hoax already. Maybe the fact that Souza and I are not fans made it easier for us to realize quite quickly that there has been more than one MJ for years, but that doesn't mean we have souls of steel. Believe me, we had a very rough time researching MK Ultra and some of the other subjects we wrote theories about, those didn't leave us untouched. It has been an emotional roller-coaster for me as well.
I wouldn't say Mike's whole life is a total waste, quite the contrary. I'm sorry to hear that you feel that way. Try to take some distance from your personal feelings, it will be easier to look at the big picture when you're not so emotionally involved.
I know you guys were affected by MK because you'd have to be inhuman not to. However, I am a very weak person emotionally, and I guess it just feels like everyone else is able to bear everything so much better.. I've never taken distance from my feelings before, and I don't know how.. I'm just so afraid that I'll come out of this seeing Michael as a total stranger, physically, outside, and on the inside, I know it's selfish and stupid but I just can't deny that it will break my heart completely.. and I say it's been a waste because he's had SUCH an impact on this world, and so many, many poor people love and respect.. well, a lie, really.. His genius, his personality don't have an ounce of authentic soul in them anymore, who knows who said or did this or that..
Pink Topaz, I hear your anxiety, but try to resist being taken over by emotions like anger automatically. It is just the initial panic which goes with ANYthing unknown.
Since MJ "died", EVERYone who enjoyed ANYthing about him has been shaken to their core---even people who swear they were not fans (I secretly think they misunderstand what is meant by "fan" ---one doesn't HAVE to be over the top NUTSo, to REALLY appreciate the most talented guy on our planet. If you gasped and had to bite your lip, when you heard---YOU felt ROBBED and qualify as a "fan").
@ "...and I say it's been a waste because he's had SUCH an impact on this world, and so many, many poor people love and respect.. well, a lie, really.. His genius, his personality don't have an ounce of authentic soul in them anymore, who knows who said or did this or that...":
Many other women fans (not speaking of you), who have objectified him as some kind of sex toy ARE going to feel embarrassed and foolish, at getting so PUBLICLY ( :oops: all :oops: over the :oops: dang WEB!!) hot and bothered over multiple imposters. People whose ego was all out there, connecting themselves to him in some bogus wannabe way, WILL, probably, feel "had".
If you loved his Essence---what he GAVE of himself for us---think---this is you and me, eh? You won't REALLY feel duped or that EVERYTHING about him was fake.
I can't speak for you, actually, just trying to lighten this "dark" secret up for you so it won't be taken personally as a weapon towards you. THINK. He was the most famous man in the universe. How on earth :lol: could he do everything fans expected of him, if there was only ONE body to go around?? People never really thought about it, but y'all are asking him to be some supernatural Santy-Clause. :?
I do believe that ALL acts of ministry were MJ himself---touching all the children, personally, himself.
But, entertainment is entertainment. "Michael Jackson, K.O.P" has turned into a CHARACTER, bigger than LIFE, much like Mickey Mouse and Ronald McDonald. Bigger than life, MEANS hiring a staff of look a likes to PLAY him in the show, later on... It's not evil, it is astute business. TOO many people wanted him. He found a way to give them what they wanted. Please, :( don't turn on him, now.
Do you feel you COULD have enough faith in someone you've read and listened to for years, to TRUST that he's not lying when he SAID this is ALL FOR LOVE? If he's a liar, it will all come out, anyway. Why not just wait before you get your (Pink, you are not alone) tails in a big knot? If he doesn't come back or explain/ admit this hoax this year, you'll be holding on to resentment a LOOONG time. That's not good for your health.
I believe HIM. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. He's NOT evil.
It IS all for love, I am sure of it. :) :wink:
HIS whole life can NEVER :!: be a waste (even if EVERYone turns their backs on him and quits playing "Hoax" because they are all mad :roll: ) SIMPLY because of what he does to ME, EVERY day :-).
If I had NEVER laid eyes :( on his physical charm, I would have been madly in love with just the things he wrote and the WAY he SAYS them. His passion for God, for the innocent, for Romance, Love, for what's RIGHT and wrong with the world; the HEART and feeling in his music and lyrics. God. NONE of that GIFT to me could ever be a waste. Oh, no, no, no....
You NEED to differentiate between the man and the "persona" of the Brand he created.
HE's real.
His heart and soul are real.
This MAN was NEVER ours . You know that.
Yeah, every female says they want to marry him. :roll: Good luck with that.
Look inside-----you KNOW.
The ONLY one that COULD belong to all of us, would be someone HE, in his GENIUS, had found a way to MULTIPLY. Don't be sad. He supplied the world's demand. What's evil about that? It's business. Show business. NONE of this is EVER real. The fact that we failed to detect that truth, only separates HIM from the amateurs!!! Be proud---not mad!! I think the "piece by piece" thing is to break it to us gently, BECAUSE he loves his fans, and realized people were taking the "show" too seriously (THAT, and the other, more serious NEED for a hoaxed death, which remains to be seen).
I would not be at all surprised, if we found out he and his real family had gone into full time ministry (yeah, :idea: CHURCH, religious!) ministry, doing missions work in some giant-leafed jungle these last 10--15 years, only coming out to record some new stuff for us. He would DO what GOD (Love) told him, you know :-) .
His work is real. The heart you feel there is all that matters. :) Be grateful and feel blessed.
I think he is way sweeter than any of us imagined, and perhaps he thought the media and world, having ridiculed and, later, villified him, would NOT be able to get their heads around "missionary MJ', maybe even disrupting/ harming the "work"...just my opinion. Trying to help, here. Waiting to SEE, like everyone else...:wink:
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15 Pages and FINALLY someone with a voice of reason. Thank you for your comment Its her, that is exactly the point, I have nothing to add.
Well maybe that people shouldn't even be mad if he turns out to have another job than you mention. It's his life, no one else's. Who the hell are we to tell him what to do, who to be, what to wear or how to look? It's none of our business. Artists make music. If you like the music, you buy a cd. If the artist is having a gig, you might go to a concert. That's all you get, and that's all you can expect. Whatever that artist does in his own, real life, is his or her business and we should respect that.
Mike deceived you? Really? He gave too much and people put him on a horse as high as the Empire State Building. He might have used doubles in public, but I really don't think the doubles had 300 million to spend on charity, HE did that. He also gave his fans 45 years of his life, he made sacrifices in life to please his fans. He has been slandered, ridiculed, accused, laughed at, put on fire ad STILL he went into his recording studio to give you all a new album. For all those years he took the beatings. I think I would have been in a mental institution years ago, if I had to go through all that shit. Isn't there anyone that can at least try to imagine how his life must have been like? Never being able to just go shopping on your own without a bunch of 8-feet-talls to protect you and without the damn paps behind the window shooting pictures of you, making up a story and publish CRAP the next day or fans HAUNTING him down and almost kill him, just to touch him? Not being able to trust anyone because they all want you for the $$$$$$$$$ ?
He didn't deceive anyone, he gave waaaaaaay too much and he paid the price. And then be mad and turn your back on him if he might have used doubles? Shame on you who think that way.
So I had a lot more to add actually and i will stop now before I really get mad, but this seriously pisses me off.
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I have sadly avoided this thread like the plague. But oh my God, this is so very possible. I often wondered why MJ would be out in those obvious getups and thought, that they would draw more attention than not, bandages and masks, etc. "But when I look at it this way, it makes a lot of sense. The person who is shown at the beginning of the film I don't really believe had any major surgeries to look like Michael. He probably looked a lot like him from jump, body type, bone structure, and possibly discovered so early in his life and mimicked Michael for so long that he has possibly perfected the MJ persona and it's now another part of him. We don't really know what MJ has been doing for the last 4 or 5 years, or do we? I certainly don't and I'll be first to admit that. So I was a little thrown off when I saw 02 Michael, but I wasn't shocked because I had not seen him make an appearance in years. I thought, my he has changed, but wasn't he in a wheelchair last I saw him? What a speedy recovery. The idea that while Michael was secluded or what ever you chose to call it, and the double(s) were making all the little appearances possibly thinking MJ was on the way out and now was their chance to shine, for him to suddenly be back in the spotlight could make for some resentment issues with the gangers. Like we've been you all this time, now you want to come back and put us on the shelf, not cool. Wow. I don't know but the theories are very interesting. I will read all the posts, but I just had to stop and say how brilliant this is. Very good video. It causes me to wonder. How many Michael's are there? Who died? Who didn't? Now I am confused AGAIN. Might I add that it must have been impossible to be Michael all the time. I would've given it up a long time ago so I applaud him. Everybody needs a break sometimes, even me. I cannot imagine having the schedule MJ had. No way. Talk about doubles, lol. There would have been many throughout the years.
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What do you think of this myspace of the Real Michael Jackson?
Compare his pictures to the young MJ boy pictures.
[attachment=1:2tc2785z]realmichaeljackson_myspace.jpg[/attachment:2tc2785z]
[attachment=0:2tc2785z]realmichaeljackson_myspace_2.jpg[/attachment:2tc2785z]
Read the incredible statements there.
http://www.myspace.com/realmichaeljackson
Think outside of the box with what we know now.
Could it be that the MJ we know was planted for marketing purposes to keep the brand going?
Just asking your thoughts.
I read the "Exclusive Interview" on that myspace in which a cloning process is described which allegedly took place in 1972. According to that interview the real MJ was replaced with a clone.
In order to clone scientists transplant the genetic information from a specialized cell into an unfertilized egg cell whose genetic information has been destroyed or physically removed. If the egg begins to divide normally it is transferred into the uterus of the surrogate mother.
Therefor it would have taken almost 15 years to produce a clone of the then 14 years old Michael Jackson, so that debunks that theory for me. Next to that we have no idea if cloning could be done already in 1972 as, to our knowledge, Dolly the Sheep was the first mammal to have been successfully cloned from an adult cell in 1996.
I wouldn't worry about the stories told on myspace, OR the picture which obviously is photoshopped from teenaged MJ's most flattering photos, and probably a brother or other older relative of his's similarities in face shape. It DOES take your breath away for about a hot 2 seconds! But the Poser SHOULD have kept his mouth shut. The minute he said he was the real MJ and gave it ALL up to be just a regular guy---AND that he expected me to believe God's crowning glory of creation--a human Man---could be cloned---
GONG! (remember the "Gong Show"?) :lol:
I got my hook and jerked him off the stage of my attention span. If you are going to LIE, you MUST make it at least have some element of believability, or it is just a TALL TALE.
We didn't have the technology to clone human beings back then, any more than we had the technology to send and retrieve a manned flight to the Moon, in 1969 (look at the tv quality back then in historical footage---would YOU have gone to the Moon, with junkie prehistoric equipment like that??) (now, we DID have all kinds of mind-"seeding"(I'll be polite) technique and technology, in order to DECEIVE the ones who testified that they had gone there!).
Mo touched on it a little bit, but I must tell you that cloning a human being is and will always be impossible, because it is God who puts the spirit and soul inside the human being (flesh)at conception, and He only gives ONE "spirit/soul" package per body. Just reproducing the DNA which goes with a personality(soul/spirit) which God placed here) WON"T reproduce the spirit or soul. :? If human flesh will ever be able to be cloned, it won't live long enough to take a second meal, because it will have NO volitional command center, without God's input; Only God creates life.
It would CERTAINLY NEVER be able to do the likes of things MJ's impersonator(s) learned to do !!!!!!! It would be just like Dolly the sheep. Speechless and sheepish. That is the truth.
Another thing is, we already KNOW too much about Michael Jackson to believe THAT genius talent quit it all and 32 years later decides he wants to sing again. Again, GONG.
Wrong.
I SAW MJ TAKE over an American Bandstand interview with Dick Clark, when I was a child. :D That itty bitty boy knew what he wanted THEN and TOOK over. Yeah, maybe he wondered what, if he had missed of a normal childhood, later, SOME, but the guy I saw THAT day was the BOSS and captain of his own :idea: illustrious career. He was not hating ANY of that, :!: NOR the large paychecks his dad forwarded to him to be invested creatively. Nope.
It's really hard to tell anything from pictures---even non photoshopped ones.
Line up the live ones and I'll give you the copies. [as long as I get to keep the Real Deal, once picked :wink: ] :!: :lol: :D ha ha ha
Doubles, yes. Twins, no. Clones, H. E. double hockey-stix, NO. :!:
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Reminder: There is an entirely different world that some people live in. Each time that I watch tv or read an article and learn about other lifestyles I am amazed at how an open-minded person such as myself can sometimes be so cut off and naive about some things. There are people who do what needs to be done for sheer survival. It is foreign to most of us because we have not been backed into that corner and forced to make such life altering decisions. We see the sunny side to celebrity life. We envy celebrities and wish to have what they have. However, we do not see the really ugly side. We think that we do however we do not at all. The very things that we take for granted, they cannot. Their celebrity status is a strong trade off for the normal things that we enjoy on a daily basis. I cannot imagine sitting in a restaurant and having complete strangers stare at me while I ate a cheeseburger and fries. People like MJ cannot go out in public and eat their food without such stares. Privacy is something that I cherish and the thought of not having any makes my skin crawl. MJ did not have privacy. That man couldn't fart without five people standing around to analyze it. If he found a way to claim privacy then why is that questoned and challenged. If he managed to keep a part of himself while compromising and giving the public a likeness of him then what is so wrong with that. Open your doors and let the entire world come inside of your life for just one week. Most of us would go nuts and beg for our privacy.
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15 Pages and FINALLY someone with a voice of reason. Thank you for your comment Its her, that is exactly the point, I have nothing to add.
Yeah yeah, Souza, I know I've been an idiot in here..I've cleared things up with myself, but boy was that a fresh rubbing-it-in..
Pink Topaz, I hear your anxiety, but try to resist being taken over by emotions like anger automatically. It is just the initial panic which goes with ANYthing unknown.
Since MJ "died", EVERYone who enjoyed ANYthing about him has been shaken to their core---even people who swear they were not fans (I secretly think they misunderstand what is meant by "fan" ---one doesn't HAVE to be over the top NUTSo, to REALLY appreciate the most talented guy on our planet. If you gasped and had to bite your lip, when you heard---YOU felt ROBBED and qualify as a "fan").
@ "...and I say it's been a waste because he's had SUCH an impact on this world, and so many, many poor people love and respect.. well, a lie, really.. His genius, his personality don't have an ounce of authentic soul in them anymore, who knows who said or did this or that...":
Many other women fans (not speaking of you), who have objectified him as some kind of sex toy ARE going to feel embarrassed and foolish, at getting so PUBLICLY ( :oops: all :oops: over the :oops: dang WEB!!) hot and bothered over multiple imposters. People whose ego was all out there, connecting themselves to him in some bogus wannabe way, WILL, probably, feel "had".
If you loved his Essence---what he GAVE of himself for us---think---this is you and me, eh? You won't REALLY feel duped or that EVERYTHING about him was fake.
I can't speak for you, actually, just trying to lighten this "dark" secret up for you so it won't be taken personally as a weapon towards you. THINK. He was the most famous man in the universe. How on earth :lol: could he do everything fans expected of him, if there was only ONE body to go around?? People never really thought about it, but y'all are asking him to be some supernatural Santy-Clause. :?
I never went so far as to spew fantasies like that all over the web (LOL!) or any of that pretending to be his wife stuff, but I don't think I (and probably you) could say without being even slightly dishonest that we've never lusted after him.. righhht? Just saying..
I do believe that ALL acts of ministry were MJ himself---touching all the children, personally, himself.
But, entertainment is entertainment. "Michael Jackson, K.O.P" has turned into a CHARACTER, bigger than LIFE, much like Mickey Mouse and Ronald McDonald. Bigger than life, MEANS hiring a staff of look a likes to PLAY him in the show, later on... It's not evil, it is astute business. TOO many people wanted him. He found a way to give them what they wanted. Please, :( don't turn on him, now.
Now, I get what you mean by entertainment is entertainment, HOWEVER, these are the things I absolutely cannot stand. The bolded phrase just sounds ridiculous and sick. I HATE this process of marketing famous PEOPLE like objects, because that's what CREATES the stupid insane fans in the first place, by giving them too much. It may be buisness, but that buisness IS evil. All of these words like "show", "good buisness", "illusion" that I've seen being used so often- all of those when applied to real people just sound so twisted.. If it weren't that way in the first place, there wouldn't be so many maniac fans to "want" him.. However I never understood that phrase, because I know stupid crowds form sometimes when he goes out- but fans can't really demand him to DO anything, no matter how much they want it, I mean, he's the one who releases the music and does the concerts according to his scheduling or whatever..
Do you feel you COULD have enough faith in someone you've read and listened to for years, to TRUST that he's not lying when he SAID this is ALL FOR LOVE?
I don't exactly get what you're trying to ask me here, and I haven't known about him this well for even three years, mind you.. If he's a liar, it will all come out, anyway. Why not just wait before you get your (Pink, you are not alone) tails in a big knot? If he doesn't come back or explain/ admit this hoax this year, you'll be holding on to resentment a LOOONG time. That's not good for your health.
I wrote all this a while back and my feelings have eased down since. I know that all I can do is wait, of course. However, if he doesn't get back here SOON and explain what's been happening, I WILL be resentful, darnit, I'm getting very tired of all of this speculating..
I believe HIM. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. He's NOT evil.
It IS all for love, I am sure of it. :) :wink:
I've heard so many people say that, but what exactly does "it's all for love" mean with this hoax?
HIS whole life can NEVER :!: be a waste (even if EVERYone turns their backs on him and quits playing "Hoax" because they are all mad :roll: ) SIMPLY because of what he does to ME, EVERY day :-).
If I had NEVER laid eyes :( on his physical charm, I would have been madly in love with just the things he wrote and the WAY he SAYS them. His passion for God, for the innocent, for Romance, Love, for what's RIGHT and wrong with the world; the HEART and feeling in his music and lyrics. God. NONE of that GIFT to me could ever be a waste. Oh, no, no, no....
I pretty much feel that way, too. I've always been a very people-person, though, I can easily love all of the things you've said, but I'm the type of person who doesn't feel it's complete without an image to go with it, a real person.I can't really describe it, but I care a lot about people, other people.
Types like you always make me feel like that's wrong, somehow. All of this confusion and deception and pretend nonsense- I've never handled confusion about something so important to me without negative feelings about the positive feelings I had in the past, that's what I meant at the time that I wrote that about the waste thing..
You NEED to differentiate between the man and the "persona" of the Brand he created.
Dear God, could I feel any stupider? I know that, of course I know the difference, I know that that whole "Peter Pan" image, that "mystery man" was just that PR stuff that every celebrity (annoyingly) has.
HE's real.
His heart and soul are real.
This MAN was NEVER ours . You know that.
Yeah, every female says they want to marry him. :roll: Good luck with that.
Look inside-----you KNOW.
Of course.. nice rubbing it in, there, again. I am determined to meet him, though, not to be a fanatic, but to act like a normal friend to him and apologize for the fans..
The ONLY one that COULD belong to all of us, would be someone HE, in his GENIUS, had found a way to MULTIPLY. Don't be sad. He supplied the world's demand.
As I said, there is no "demand" for him to walk down the streets. What's evil about that? It's business. Show business. NONE of this is EVER real.
You answered your own question- all of that aspect of "buisness" and none of it being real IS evil, because deception and fakery is not right, and I'm not talking about him.
The fact that we failed to detect that truth, only separates HIM from the amateurs!!! Be proud---not mad!!
When I wrote this, the types of theories that said that we haven't seen the real one and only fakes for like fifteen years are the thing that were upsetting me so badly. On the other hand, I will never be proud of "failing to detect that truth". I don't mean that I'll be furious at Michael, but I really really wish people had talked about this issue this way, way before this hoax. I wish people, including us, wouldn't have been so stupid about all of that fakery for so long, so it wouldn't even have to be that way..
I think the "piece by piece" thing is to break it to us gently, BECAUSE he loves his fans, and realized people were taking the "show" too seriously (THAT, and the other, more serious NEED for a hoaxed death, which remains to be seen).
I would not be at all surprised, if we found out he and his real family had gone into full time ministry (yeah, :idea: CHURCH, religious!) ministry, doing missions work in some giant-leafed jungle these last 10--15 years, only coming out to record some new stuff for us. He would DO what GOD (Love) told him, you know :-) .
His work is real. The heart you feel there is all that matters. :) Be grateful and feel blessed.
I think he is way sweeter than any of us imagined, and perhaps he thought the media and world, having ridiculed and, later, villified him, would NOT be able to get their heads around "missionary MJ', maybe even disrupting/ harming the "work"...just my opinion. Trying to help, here. Waiting to SEE, like everyone else...:wink:
As I said, I am about people and their hearts, and if I am confused about a person, I can't fully feel "grateful and blessed", until I find out the truth. I want to say now, before the 25th and especially since it, the main thing that upsets me is that stuff Michael says, like in that Boteach book, about being SO, SO lonely, about feeling alone and like no one loves him.. All I want, MOST of all, is for him to come back and tell us that a lot of that was PR, that his life wasn't so isolated and that he wasn't so sad all of the time, thinking that "this is the way it has to be" and being like a prisoner.. That's what hurts most. That's what makes me so angry at the stupid sick system, the "buisness", at his father, at the stupid fans.. What makes me angry when I think about fakers in his place and PR lies is again that thought of the "way it has to be", because it DOESN'T! There has to be a balance of celebrity and normalcy without having to deceive people and without people being crazy over it!! Why should it make famous people resort to deception?! All I want is for him to come back and tell us.. I have to avoid things that deal too much with his pain, I can't listen to Will You Be There, Man in the Mirror, Heal the World, Stranger in Moscow without crying.. Please please Lord, you and Michael both have mercy on us as soon as possible, let us know the solid truth.. Because like you said above me there, GirlSaturday, I don't want his suffering to have been as bad as some think for so long..
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Darlin'...he may never come back and especially in the way that fans want him to return. We must move past that. Move forward and move on. That man has given 45+ years of his life to complete strangers and he gave them what they thought that they wanted from the man. Let's realistically look at our own lives and imagine that sort of sacrifice. Call me a selfish bitch... but ...I cannot imagine giving myself to complete strangers in that way and for that duration of time. No way and no how. I could have never been a celebrity. At some point, I would have bluntly told people to kiss my....
15 Pages and FINALLY someone with a voice of reason. Thank you for your comment Its her, that is exactly the point, I have nothing to add.
Yeah yeah, Souza, I know I've been an idiot in here..I've cleared things up with myself, but boy was that a fresh rubbing-it-in..
Pink Topaz, I hear your anxiety, but try to resist being taken over by emotions like anger automatically. It is just the initial panic which goes with ANYthing unknown.
Since MJ "died", EVERYone who enjoyed ANYthing about him has been shaken to their core---even people who swear they were not fans (I secretly think they misunderstand what is meant by "fan" ---one doesn't HAVE to be over the top NUTSo, to REALLY appreciate the most talented guy on our planet. If you gasped and had to bite your lip, when you heard---YOU felt ROBBED and qualify as a "fan").
@ "...and I say it's been a waste because he's had SUCH an impact on this world, and so many, many poor people love and respect.. well, a lie, really.. His genius, his personality don't have an ounce of authentic soul in them anymore, who knows who said or did this or that...":
Many other women fans (not speaking of you), who have objectified him as some kind of sex toy ARE going to feel embarrassed and foolish, at getting so PUBLICLY ( :oops: all :oops: over the :oops: dang WEB!!) hot and bothered over multiple imposters. People whose ego was all out there, connecting themselves to him in some bogus wannabe way, WILL, probably, feel "had".
If you loved his Essence---what he GAVE of himself for us---think---this is you and me, eh? You won't REALLY feel duped or that EVERYTHING about him was fake.
I can't speak for you, actually, just trying to lighten this "dark" secret up for you so it won't be taken personally as a weapon towards you. THINK. He was the most famous man in the universe. How on earth :lol: could he do everything fans expected of him, if there was only ONE body to go around?? People never really thought about it, but y'all are asking him to be some supernatural Santy-Clause. :?
I never went so far as to spew fantasies like that all over the web (LOL!) or any of that pretending to be his wife stuff, but I don't think I (and probably you) could say without being even slightly dishonest that we've never lusted after him.. righhht? Just saying..
I do believe that ALL acts of ministry were MJ himself---touching all the children, personally, himself.
But, entertainment is entertainment. "Michael Jackson, K.O.P" has turned into a CHARACTER, bigger than LIFE, much like Mickey Mouse and Ronald McDonald. Bigger than life, MEANS hiring a staff of look a likes to PLAY him in the show, later on... It's not evil, it is astute business. TOO many people wanted him. He found a way to give them what they wanted. Please, :( don't turn on him, now.
Now, I get what you mean by entertainment is entertainment, HOWEVER, these are the things I absolutely cannot stand. The bolded phrase just sounds ridiculous and sick. I HATE this process of marketing famous PEOPLE like objects, because that's what CREATES the stupid insane fans in the first place, by giving them too much. It may be buisness, but that buisness IS evil. All of these words like "show", "good buisness", "illusion" that I've seen being used so often- all of those when applied to real people just sound so twisted.. If it weren't that way in the first place, there wouldn't be so many maniac fans to "want" him.. However I never understood that phrase, because I know stupid crowds form sometimes when he goes out- but fans can't really demand him to DO anything, no matter how much they want it, I mean, he's the one who releases the music and does the concerts according to his scheduling or whatever..
Do you feel you COULD have enough faith in someone you've read and listened to for years, to TRUST that he's not lying when he SAID this is ALL FOR LOVE?
I don't exactly get what you're trying to ask me here, and I haven't known about him this well for even three years, mind you.. If he's a liar, it will all come out, anyway. Why not just wait before you get your (Pink, you are not alone) tails in a big knot? If he doesn't come back or explain/ admit this hoax this year, you'll be holding on to resentment a LOOONG time. That's not good for your health.
I wrote all this a while back and my feelings have eased down since. I know that all I can do is wait, of course. However, if he doesn't get back here SOON and explain what's been happening, I WILL be resentful, darnit, I'm getting very tired of all of this speculating..
I believe HIM. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. He's NOT evil.
It IS all for love, I am sure of it. :) :wink:
I've heard so many people say that, but what exactly does "it's all for love" mean with this hoax?
HIS whole life can NEVER :!: be a waste (even if EVERYone turns their backs on him and quits playing "Hoax" because they are all mad :roll: ) SIMPLY because of what he does to ME, EVERY day :-).
If I had NEVER laid eyes :( on his physical charm, I would have been madly in love with just the things he wrote and the WAY he SAYS them. His passion for God, for the innocent, for Romance, Love, for what's RIGHT and wrong with the world; the HEART and feeling in his music and lyrics. God. NONE of that GIFT to me could ever be a waste. Oh, no, no, no....
I pretty much feel that way, too. I've always been a very people-person, though, I can easily love all of the things you've said, but I'm the type of person who doesn't feel it's complete without an image to go with it, a real person.I can't really describe it, but I care a lot about people, other people.
Types like you always make me feel like that's wrong, somehow. All of this confusion and deception and pretend nonsense- I've never handled confusion about something so important to me without negative feelings about the positive feelings I had in the past, that's what I meant at the time that I wrote that about the waste thing..
You NEED to differentiate between the man and the "persona" of the Brand he created.
Dear God, could I feel any stupider? I know that, of course I know the difference, I know that that whole "Peter Pan" image, that "mystery man" was just that PR stuff that every celebrity (annoyingly) has.
HE's real.
His heart and soul are real.
This MAN was NEVER ours . You know that.
Yeah, every female says they want to marry him. :roll: Good luck with that.
Look inside-----you KNOW.
Of course.. nice rubbing it in, there, again. I am determined to meet him, though, not to be a fanatic, but to act like a normal friend to him and apologize for the fans..
The ONLY one that COULD belong to all of us, would be someone HE, in his GENIUS, had found a way to MULTIPLY. Don't be sad. He supplied the world's demand.
As I said, there is no "demand" for him to walk down the streets. What's evil about that? It's business. Show business. NONE of this is EVER real.
You answered your own question- all of that aspect of "buisness" and none of it being real IS evil, because deception and fakery is not right, and I'm not talking about him.
The fact that we failed to detect that truth, only separates HIM from the amateurs!!! Be proud---not mad!!
When I wrote this, the types of theories that said that we haven't seen the real one and only fakes for like fifteen years are the thing that were upsetting me so badly. On the other hand, I will never be proud of "failing to detect that truth". I don't mean that I'll be furious at Michael, but I really really wish people had talked about this issue this way, way before this hoax. I wish people, including us, wouldn't have been so stupid about all of that fakery for so long, so it wouldn't even have to be that way..
I think the "piece by piece" thing is to break it to us gently, BECAUSE he loves his fans, and realized people were taking the "show" too seriously (THAT, and the other, more serious NEED for a hoaxed death, which remains to be seen).
I would not be at all surprised, if we found out he and his real family had gone into full time ministry (yeah, :idea: CHURCH, religious!) ministry, doing missions work in some giant-leafed jungle these last 10--15 years, only coming out to record some new stuff for us. He would DO what GOD (Love) told him, you know :-) .
His work is real. The heart you feel there is all that matters. :) Be grateful and feel blessed.
I think he is way sweeter than any of us imagined, and perhaps he thought the media and world, having ridiculed and, later, villified him, would NOT be able to get their heads around "missionary MJ', maybe even disrupting/ harming the "work"...just my opinion. Trying to help, here. Waiting to SEE, like everyone else...:wink:
As I said, I am about people and their hearts, and if I am confused about a person, I can't fully feel "grateful and blessed", until I find out the truth. I want to say now, before the 25th and especially since it, the main thing that upsets me is that stuff Michael says, like in that Boteach book, about being SO, SO lonely, about feeling alone and like no one loves him.. All I want, MOST of all, is for him to come back and tell us that a lot of that was PR, that his life wasn't so isolated and that he wasn't so sad all of the time, thinking that "this is the way it has to be" and being like a prisoner.. That's what hurts most. That's what makes me so angry at the stupid sick system, the "buisness", at his father, at the stupid fans.. What makes me angry when I think about fakers in his place and PR lies is again that thought of the "way it has to be", because it DOESN'T! There has to be a balance of celebrity and normalcy without having to deceive people and without people being crazy over it!! Why should it make famous people resort to deception?! All I want is for him to come back and tell us.. I have to avoid things that deal too much with his pain, I can't listen to Will You Be There, Man in the Mirror, Heal the World, Stranger in Moscow without crying.. Please please Lord, you and Michael both have mercy on us as soon as possible, let us know the solid truth.. Because like you said above me there, GirlSaturday, I don't want his suffering to have been as bad as some think for so long..
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Darlin'...he may never come back and especially in the way that fans want him to return. We must move past that. Move forward and move on. That man has given 45+ years of his life to complete strangers and he gave them what they thought that they wanted from the man. Let's realistically look at our own lives and imagine that sort of sacrifice. Call me a selfish bitch... but ...I cannot imagine giving myself to complete strangers in that way and for that duration of time. No way and no how. I could have never been a celebrity. At some point, I would have bluntly told people to kiss my....
I know that. I am prepared for that. But as of now, I am firmly convinced that he is alive, and that he will return, because I do also believe that the Illuminati/New World Order movement exists and has had a lot to do with him. But I have already mourned and grieved in the while before I knew about the hoax.. I realize I may have to live with it. But what do you mean by the especially not in the way and the thought they wanted part?
But what you say at the end there, that's EXACTLY what I was going to say- that I think he would be so much better off if he HAD said, like twenty years ago, "Hey, fans, stop being so nosy and intrusive, stop acting like wild baboons whenever I try to go somewhere".. I've seen how people who admire him listen to what he says, if he had JUST been more assertive, "If you like me than treat me like one of your friends, dammit!" I KNOW there would have been a great reduction in the amount of peope who like him bothering him.. So many times I've wished I could rewind the clock and give him a little shake and say "Speak up if the stupid fans go overboard- don't be afraid to tell 'em off, cuz they' may go crazy but they will listen to you!"
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Boy this is really agonizing, and wish this wasn't part of the hoax. I'm either way on this one. One thing I know for sure is Orange pants wasn't MJ. Various times in interviews MJ would seem slightly different though I couldn't put my finger on it precisely, yet I would happily agree they were all him, if MJ himself were to say that. I do think that MJ loved the mystery aspect, loved playing tricks from early age, and may have set out to make it appear that there were doubles by doing various changes, even signing his name with 2 different signatures. There is one thing that has been sticking in my mind and I don't think anyone mentioned it. In the song Threatened, he sings "This particular monster can read minds
Be in two places at the same time." If he can be in 2 places at the same time perhaps there is two MJ. But I know the whole song is about creepy visuals that most likely are for drama and not to be taken seriously like, "my face in the walls", and "I'm everywhere". The least complicated is for MJ to be ingeniously altering make-up, lighting, hair, etc. quickly. Having the doubles exponentially increases the problems of how this could have happened for 20 years, everyone close to him hiding it . Michael talked so much about being so lonely, and if he had a true double for 20+ years, this double must have stayed virtually around him all the time so that he knew everything, did everything, felt everything the same. How then could he have been lonely? I know there's a few pics showing MJ with a double in same costume, but I assume that is a stand-in double only for simple shots or scenes where audiences would easily assume it was MJ. My 2 cents.
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15 Pages and FINALLY someone with a voice of reason. Thank you for your comment Its her, that is exactly the point, I have nothing to add.
Yeah yeah, Souza, I know I've been an idiot in here..I've cleared things up with myself, but boy was that a fresh rubbing-it-in..
Pink Topaz, I hear your anxiety, but try to resist being taken over by emotions like anger automatically. It is just the initial panic which goes with ANYthing unknown.
Since MJ "died", EVERYone who enjoyed ANYthing about him has been shaken to their core---even people who swear they were not fans (I secretly think they misunderstand what is meant by "fan" ---one doesn't HAVE to be over the top NUTSo, to REALLY appreciate the most talented guy on our planet. If you gasped and had to bite your lip, when you heard---YOU felt ROBBED and qualify as a "fan").
@ "...and I say it's been a waste because he's had SUCH an impact on this world, and so many, many poor people love and respect.. well, a lie, really.. His genius, his personality don't have an ounce of authentic soul in them anymore, who knows who said or did this or that...":
Many other women fans (not speaking of you), who have objectified him as some kind of sex toy ARE going to feel embarrassed and foolish, at getting so PUBLICLY ( :oops: all :oops: over the :oops: dang WEB!!) hot and bothered over multiple imposters. People whose ego was all out there, connecting themselves to him in some bogus wannabe way, WILL, probably, feel "had".
If you loved his Essence---what he GAVE of himself for us---think---this is you and me, eh? You won't REALLY feel duped or that EVERYTHING about him was fake.
I can't speak for you, actually, just trying to lighten this "dark" secret up for you so it won't be taken personally as a weapon towards you. THINK. He was the most famous man in the universe. How on earth :lol: could he do everything fans expected of him, if there was only ONE body to go around?? People never really thought about it, but y'all are asking him to be some supernatural Santy-Clause. :?
I never went so far as to spew fantasies like that all over the web (LOL!) or any of that pretending to be his wife stuff, but I don't think I (and probably you) could say without being even slightly dishonest that we've never lusted after him.. righhht? Just saying..
I do believe that ALL acts of ministry were MJ himself---touching all the children, personally, himself.
But, entertainment is entertainment. "Michael Jackson, K.O.P" has turned into a CHARACTER, bigger than LIFE, much like Mickey Mouse and Ronald McDonald. Bigger than life, MEANS hiring a staff of look a likes to PLAY him in the show, later on... It's not evil, it is astute business. TOO many people wanted him. He found a way to give them what they wanted. Please, :( don't turn on him, now.
Now, I get what you mean by entertainment is entertainment, HOWEVER, these are the things I absolutely cannot stand. The bolded phrase just sounds ridiculous and sick. I HATE this process of marketing famous PEOPLE like objects, because that's what CREATES the stupid insane fans in the first place, by giving them too much. It may be buisness, but that buisness IS evil. All of these words like "show", "good buisness", "illusion" that I've seen being used so often- all of those when applied to real people just sound so twisted.. If it weren't that way in the first place, there wouldn't be so many maniac fans to "want" him.. However I never understood that phrase, because I know stupid crowds form sometimes when he goes out- but fans can't really demand him to DO anything, no matter how much they want it, I mean, he's the one who releases the music and does the concerts according to his scheduling or whatever..
Do you feel you COULD have enough faith in someone you've read and listened to for years, to TRUST that he's not lying when he SAID this is ALL FOR LOVE?
I don't exactly get what you're trying to ask me here, and I haven't known about him this well for even three years, mind you.. If he's a liar, it will all come out, anyway. Why not just wait before you get your (Pink, you are not alone) tails in a big knot? If he doesn't come back or explain/ admit this hoax this year, you'll be holding on to resentment a LOOONG time. That's not good for your health.
I wrote all this a while back and my feelings have eased down since. I know that all I can do is wait, of course. However, if he doesn't get back here SOON and explain what's been happening, I WILL be resentful, darnit, I'm getting very tired of all of this speculating..
I believe HIM. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. He's NOT evil.
It IS all for love, I am sure of it. :) :wink:
I've heard so many people say that, but what exactly does "it's all for love" mean with this hoax?
HIS whole life can NEVER :!: be a waste (even if EVERYone turns their backs on him and quits playing "Hoax" because they are all mad :roll: ) SIMPLY because of what he does to ME, EVERY day :-).
If I had NEVER laid eyes :( on his physical charm, I would have been madly in love with just the things he wrote and the WAY he SAYS them. His passion for God, for the innocent, for Romance, Love, for what's RIGHT and wrong with the world; the HEART and feeling in his music and lyrics. God. NONE of that GIFT to me could ever be a waste. Oh, no, no, no....
I pretty much feel that way, too. I've always been a very people-person, though, I can easily love all of the things you've said, but I'm the type of person who doesn't feel it's complete without an image to go with it, a real person.I can't really describe it, but I care a lot about people, other people.
Types like you always make me feel like that's wrong, somehow. All of this confusion and deception and pretend nonsense- I've never handled confusion about something so important to me without negative feelings about the positive feelings I had in the past, that's what I meant at the time that I wrote that about the waste thing..
You NEED to differentiate between the man and the "persona" of the Brand he created.
Dear God, could I feel any stupider? I know that, of course I know the difference, I know that that whole "Peter Pan" image, that "mystery man" was just that PR stuff that every celebrity (annoyingly) has.
HE's real.
His heart and soul are real.
This MAN was NEVER ours . You know that.
Yeah, every female says they want to marry him. :roll: Good luck with that.
Look inside-----you KNOW.
Of course.. nice rubbing it in, there, again. I am determined to meet him, though, not to be a fanatic, but to act like a normal friend to him and apologize for the fans..
The ONLY one that COULD belong to all of us, would be someone HE, in his GENIUS, had found a way to MULTIPLY. Don't be sad. He supplied the world's demand.
As I said, there is no "demand" for him to walk down the streets. What's evil about that? It's business. Show business. NONE of this is EVER real.
You answered your own question- all of that aspect of "buisness" and none of it being real IS evil, because deception and fakery is not right, and I'm not talking about him.
The fact that we failed to detect that truth, only separates HIM from the amateurs!!! Be proud---not mad!!
When I wrote this, the types of theories that said that we haven't seen the real one and only fakes for like fifteen years are the thing that were upsetting me so badly. On the other hand, I will never be proud of "failing to detect that truth". I don't mean that I'll be furious at Michael, but I really really wish people had talked about this issue this way, way before this hoax. I wish people, including us, wouldn't have been so stupid about all of that fakery for so long, so it wouldn't even have to be that way..
I think the "piece by piece" thing is to break it to us gently, BECAUSE he loves his fans, and realized people were taking the "show" too seriously (THAT, and the other, more serious NEED for a hoaxed death, which remains to be seen).
I would not be at all surprised, if we found out he and his real family had gone into full time ministry (yeah, :idea: CHURCH, religious!) ministry, doing missions work in some giant-leafed jungle these last 10--15 years, only coming out to record some new stuff for us. He would DO what GOD (Love) told him, you know :-) .
His work is real. The heart you feel there is all that matters. :) Be grateful and feel blessed.
I think he is way sweeter than any of us imagined, and perhaps he thought the media and world, having ridiculed and, later, villified him, would NOT be able to get their heads around "missionary MJ', maybe even disrupting/ harming the "work"...just my opinion. Trying to help, here. Waiting to SEE, like everyone else...:wink:
As I said, I am about people and their hearts, and if I am confused about a person, I can't fully feel "grateful and blessed", until I find out the truth. I want to say now, before the 25th and especially since it, the main thing that upsets me is that stuff Michael says, like in that Boteach book, about being SO, SO lonely, about feeling alone and like no one loves him.. All I want, MOST of all, is for him to come back and tell us that a lot of that was PR, that his life wasn't so isolated and that he wasn't so sad all of the time, thinking that "this is the way it has to be" and being like a prisoner.. That's what hurts most. That's what makes me so angry at the stupid sick system, the "buisness", at his father, at the stupid fans.. What makes me angry when I think about fakers in his place and PR lies is again that thought of the "way it has to be", because it DOESN'T! There has to be a balance of celebrity and normalcy without having to deceive people and without people being crazy over it!! Why should it make famous people resort to deception?! All I want is for him to come back and tell us.. I have to avoid things that deal too much with his pain, I can't listen to Will You Be There, Man in the Mirror, Heal the World, Stranger in Moscow without crying.. Please please Lord, you and Michael both have mercy on us as soon as possible, let us know the solid truth.. Because like you said above me there, GirlSaturday, I don't want his suffering to have been as bad as some think for so long..
PinkTopaz,
I would NEVER ever "rub it in", even if I had made a judgment that you were wrong. I wasn't doing that, either. I felt your frustration and flying off the handle, and simply wanted to pull you back down to terra firma, if possible. Some people NEED to vent, so, just saying, "possible", meaning it's up to your choice on accepting ANYthing I say. I would never say anything hurtful .
I wasn't talking down to you or anyone, either. I meant that if you have read MJ's book and listened to him talk enough to respect and feel affection for him, it should be easy to find some trust for him to be good-intentioned with this Hoaxed death.
"All for Love" means to me, that he NEEDED to do this, in order to protect someone or FIX something gone horribly amok, and in the interim, bless and occupy US. I've thought all kinds of things, as we know MJ's middle name has been "JOKER" for decades, now, but I no longer think it is a game for the sake of gaming. I think there is something Important being accomplished in the context of a game, so that his connection to all of those who loved him doesn't die off in his necessary absence. Who knows? He'll tell us someday. All he talked about was LOVE. I don't think ANY of this was meant to cause ONE tear---for fans.
And I wasn't talking down to anyone when reminding/ explaining "Show Business" and the NONreality there. We ALL forget that it is ALL PRETEND and ACTING and ILLUSION, script, smoke, mirrors, make up, special effects, costume and FICTION, especially since we've HAD HIM for ALL our lives and he's a household word. :D :D
Theses lines blurred for me many, many times, wishing I knew him personally, as I would hear something thoughtprovoking in his song or some creative innovation, or a cause he had championed, making me proud.
Those things were REAL---but the Personality who had become the household word was just a figment of what MY mind had filtered from all the public information and video on him. He's REALLY something, this character I am attached to. I've filled in all the blanks, because...I don't REALLY know HIM. I've HAD to pinch myself.
It's a very fine line stepped over, when the most famous man in the world's news, is discussed at the dinner table as if he's become FAMILY. He seemed so sweet, so funny, so nice, so dedicated to God in his personal life----we WANT him to be. We all want that personal contact with someone so wonderful. Someone with no HINT of ever hurting us. In fact, we are all on a first name basis with him. EVERYone I know, knows who I mean when I say, "Michael..."
But, BACK TO EARTH, he puts on a GREAT show.
His whole life BECAME the show, because his public NEVER gave him down time!!
It IS a Show. Sadly. MJ SAID he wanted to bring JOY to people and give them some time to escape...And little did he realize the MONSTER he created would see to it he could NEVER have that escape himself. Pretend is one of the most fun things God ever invented. It's a great release for the stress of life. If you don't watch out, you'll want to jump in and stay there. I do. But we are here for more than PLAYtime. Someone has to run the world and the business of life.
And the fact that he's still doing it, entertaining, while he's "dead" [!!], demonstrates that it IS for Love. After all, he COULD have just disappeared and done whatever he needed to do, WITHOUT including US in this "adventure". And look what else he gave us: when he said, "Come Together Over Me", wiggling his little hips to grab our attention :wink: , even though he didn't write it, he DID it. He facilitated our Coming Together, over this mysterious "Me", probably so that we would get to know that he's not the only wonderful person on earth, and maybe we need to focus a little more on each other---ALL for LOVE. You know, things are probably going to get really hairy, on earth, and we will need each other more than we probably know yet. I don't know about you, but I've never spoken to more than a few people from other parts of the world, in all the years I've been alive, before I came to the internet to talk about HIM. I don't know. Just, again, embellishing the MJ I made up in MY head and heart, from snippets of what I've seen. But it sounds like him, doesn't it?
Oh, and I didn't mean to be proud of our 'failing to detect' that it was all an illusion. I MEANT to be proud of HIM, that he was SO darn accomplished at it, that we were caught up in it, so deeply!! He da Man!!! :lol:
I could NEVER be mad at him. :) I don't know how.
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Souza, Thank you. :)
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"All for Love" means to me, that he NEEDED to do this, in order to protect someone or FIX something gone horribly amok, and in the interim, bless and occupy US. I've thought all kinds of things, as we know MJ's middle name has been "JOKER" for decades, now, but I no longer think it is a game for the sake of gaming. I think there is something Important being accomplished in the context of a game, so that his connection to all of those who loved him doesn't die off in his necessary absence. Who knows? He'll tell us someday. All he talked about was LOVE. I don't think ANY of this was meant to cause ONE tear---for fans.
And I wasn't talking down to anyone when reminding/ explaining "Show Business" and the NONreality there. We ALL forget that it is ALL PRETEND and ACTING and ILLUSION, script, smoke, mirrors, make up, special effects, costume and FICTION, especially since we've HAD HIM for ALL our lives and he's a household word. :D :D
Theses lines blurred for me many, many times, wishing I knew him personally, as I would hear something thoughtprovoking in his song or some creative innovation, or a cause he had championed, making me proud.
Those things were REAL---but the Personality who had become the household word was just a figment of what MY mind had filtered from all the public information and video on him. He's REALLY something, this character I am attached to. I've filled in all the blanks, because...I don't REALLY know HIM. I've HAD to pinch myself.
It's a very fine line stepped over, when the most famous man in the world's news, is discussed at the dinner table as if he's become FAMILY. He seemed so sweet, so funny, so nice, so dedicated to God in his personal life----we WANT him to be. We all want that personal contact with someone so wonderful. Someone with no HINT of ever hurting us. In fact, we are all on a first name basis with him. EVERYone I know, knows who I mean when I say, "Michael..."
But, BACK TO EARTH, he puts on a GREAT show.
His whole life BECAME the show, because his public NEVER gave him down time!!
It IS a Show. Sadly. MJ SAID he wanted to bring JOY to people and give them some time to escape...And little did he realize the MONSTER he created would see to it he could NEVER have that escape himself. Pretend is one of the most fun things God ever invented. It's a great release for the stress of life. If you don't watch out, you'll want to jump in and stay there. I do. But we are here for more than PLAYtime. Someone has to run the world and the business of life.
And the fact that he's still doing it, entertaining, while he's "dead" [!!], demonstrates that it IS for Love. After all, he COULD have just disappeared and done whatever he needed to do, WITHOUT including US in this "adventure". And look what else he gave us: when he said, "Come Together Over Me", wiggling his little hips to grab our attention :wink: , even though he didn't write it, he DID it. He facilitated our Coming Together, over this mysterious "Me", probably so that we would get to know that he's not the only wonderful person on earth, and maybe we need to focus a little more on each other---ALL for LOVE. You know, things are probably going to get really hairy, on earth, and we will need each other more than we probably know yet. I don't know about you, but I've never spoken to more than a few people from other parts of the world, in all the years I've been alive, before I came to the internet to talk about HIM. I don't know. Just, again, embellishing the MJ I made up in MY head and heart, from snippets of what I've seen. But it sounds like him, doesn't it?
Oh, and I didn't mean to be proud of our 'failing to detect' that it was all an illusion. I MEANT to be proud of HIM, that he was SO darn accomplished at it, that we were caught up in it, so deeply!! He da Man!!! :lol:
I could NEVER be mad at him. :) I don't know how.
Wow so well said! You did a great job, you really hit me (in a positive way!) by this!
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PinkTopaz,
I would NEVER ever "rub it in", even if I had made a judgment that you were wrong. I wasn't doing that, either. I felt your frustration and flying off the handle, and simply wanted to pull you back down to terra firma, if possible. Some people NEED to vent, so, just saying, "possible", meaning it's up to your choice on accepting ANYthing I say. I would never say anything hurtful .
With the first part, I was mainly talking to Souza.
I wasn't talking down to you or anyone, either. I meant that if you have read MJ's book and listened to him talk enough to respect and feel affection for him, it should be easy to find some trust for him to be good-intentioned with this Hoaxed death.
"All for Love" means to me, that he NEEDED to do this, in order to protect someone or FIX something gone horribly amok, and in the interim, bless and occupy US. I've thought all kinds of things, as we know MJ's middle name has been "JOKER" for decades, now, but I no longer think it is a game for the sake of gaming. I think there is something Important being accomplished in the context of a game, so that his connection to all of those who loved him doesn't die off in his necessary absence. Who knows? He'll tell us someday. All he talked about was LOVE. I don't think ANY of this was meant to cause ONE tear---for fans.
With this part, I agree.. you spoke nicely.. it's weird that you said that particular line, because I've probably cried more in these past ten months (ESPECIALLY before I knew it was even a hoax) than I have in a few years.. LOL.
And I wasn't talking down to anyone when reminding/ explaining "Show Business" and the NONreality there. We ALL forget that it is ALL PRETEND and ACTING and ILLUSION, script, smoke, mirrors, make up, special effects, costume and FICTION, especially since we've HAD HIM for ALL our lives and he's a household word. :D :D
Theses lines blurred for me many, many times, wishing I knew him personally, as I would hear something thoughtprovoking in his song or some creative innovation, or a cause he had championed, making me proud.
So this is where it gets me, because I have wished the same thing in the same way as you many times! What are we SUPPOSED to think?
Those things were REAL---but the Personality who had become the household word was just a figment of what MY mind had filtered from all the public information and video on him. He's REALLY something, this character I am attached to. I've filled in all the blanks, because...I don't REALLY know HIM. I've HAD to pinch myself.
It's a very fine line stepped over, when the most famous man in the world's news, is discussed at the dinner table as if he's become FAMILY. He seemed so sweet, so funny, so nice, so dedicated to God in his personal life----we WANT him to be. We all want that personal contact with someone so wonderful. Someone with no HINT of ever hurting us. In fact, we are all on a first name basis with him. EVERYone I know, knows who I mean when I say, "Michael..."
But, BACK TO EARTH, he puts on a GREAT show.
His whole life BECAME the show, because his public NEVER gave him down time!!
Well then if that's true, he should have said "If you like you'll give me down time, insane public!!" I'd trade however much nessecary of this "great show" ANY day for him to have shown more of the real him and relaxed more over the years and not worried so much about giving us so much- we, not just him, would ALL be better off right now, even if some people didn't realize it at the time.
It IS a Show. Sadly. MJ SAID he wanted to bring JOY to people and give them some time to escape...And little did he realize the MONSTER he created would see to it he could NEVER have that escape himself. Pretend is one of the most fun things God ever invented. It's a great release for the stress of life. If you don't watch out, you'll want to jump in and stay there. I do. But we are here for more than PLAYtime. Someone has to run the world and the business of life.
THAT'S what depresses me, not just the fact that it's a show at all, as that's well-known, as we've discussed, it's that all of this has happened already for so long, and I want to rewind and fix it so badly.. I'm the type of person that, if I see a flaw or a problem, a different, better way that something "could have been", I get so determined to fix it, and when I can't.. I want to give him a shake twenty years ago or so and say "MAKE SURE you take care of yourself, WHO CARES about PR, you DON'T Have to make your life into a show to be successful.. PLEASE. For you AND us, in the future.."
And the fact that he's still doing it, entertaining, while he's "dead" [!!], demonstrates that it IS for Love. After all, he COULD have just disappeared and done whatever he needed to do, WITHOUT including US in this "adventure". And look what else he gave us: when he said, "Come Together Over Me", wiggling his little hips to grab our attention :wink: , even though he didn't write it, he DID it. He facilitated our Coming Together, over this mysterious "Me", probably so that we would get to know that he's not the only wonderful person on earth, and maybe we need to focus a little more on each other---ALL for LOVE. You know, things are probably going to get really hairy, on earth, and we will need each other more than we probably know yet. I don't know about you, but I've never spoken to more than a few people from other parts of the world, in all the years I've been alive, before I came to the internet to talk about HIM. I don't know. Just, again, embellishing the MJ I made up in MY head and heart, from snippets of what I've seen. But it sounds like him, doesn't it?
Oh, and I didn't mean to be proud of our 'failing to detect' that it was all an illusion. I MEANT to be proud of HIM, that he was SO darn accomplished at it, that we were caught up in it, so deeply!! He da Man!!! :lol:
I could NEVER be mad at him. :) I don't know how.
Ah, that hips thing sounds so cute, LOL! I've always felt that about this hoax, I feel so incredibly honored to be a part of it.. I'm definitely not the same person I was at 12:20 on June 25th, 2009.. and I think that's for the better. But as great as this is, what I mean is, what gets me emotional, is that it even HAD to come to this, because I know it DIDN'T have to.. It's so frustrating. Yes, it does sound very much like him, but what you say after.. the fact that we were "so deeply caught it in" is NOT a good thing! If only all of those fans had realized that the music and the dance, the essence is real, but we don't know about ALL of his personality, like we know he's patient, but we don't know what little things make him angry, we know he's creative, but we don't know how he interprets people", you know what I mean? More power to you for the last line, but as for me, I'm sorry, I can't help but get irked with him for letting this go on for so long.. I'm mostly mad at the system, the corporations, the media, of COURSE, but he all these past years was capable of keeping us on the ground while at the same time giving himself some air. I get irked with him for caring about that IMAGE so much! I WISH we had NEVER gotten to this point, I wish he wasn't involved in a hoaxed death right now, but not an overdemanding public, either. I get depressed because a lot of this happened BEFORE i was born, I feel so FRUSTRATED that SO MUCH of this happened.. Why can't we go back and FIX it- less of Michael giving of himself and MORE OF him asserting to the fans when too much is too much= less illusion/PR= less disassociated-with-reality-because-they-think-they-HAVE-him-crazy-fans=Michael happier taking at least slightly better care of himself=MORE loyal, devoted yet aware of the need for Michael to be able to DO things (like go out in public without stupid crowds forming)= perhaps no need for a hoaxed death.. It's so depressing that it all "happened already", those are the two words that grind on me the most..But you have made me feel a little better..
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Thank you all for your very personal and very beautiful posts with so much truth in them.
I strongly believe this is the way MJ wanted us to meet and come together over him.
With a smile, with many hugs and with so many "do you remember" whispers and lots of laughter celebrating the joy and everlasting surprises he gave us.
Not judging the man, not fainting but standing tall being proud and grateful, silently lending a hand to a friend.
Nothing more to add - this thread should be made a sticky one somewhere in the enter zone to the board.
I am very happy about this evolution and positive spirit.
:D
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After reading all of these responses I am amazed at how selfish we have been unknowingly. I guess we loved him to death. He was trapped by us and there was no way out. He was suffocated and there was no room to move or breathe. He had to escape. He was a victim of his own success and the only way to be free was to figuratively die. I am just as guilty as the next person. He consumed me. I am so sorry, Michael. Now, I only want to massage your hands and feet. I grown older and wiser. Reminds me of the song, I've been to paradise but I've never been to me. It's beautiful.
[youtube:hxv9pce5]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tBd2Tn3seI[/youtube:hxv9pce5]
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hesouttamylife wrote:
After reading all of these responses I am amazed at how selfish we have been unknowingly. I guess we loved him to death. He was trapped by us and there was no way out. He was suffocated and there was no room to move or breathe. He had to escape. He was a victim of his own success and the only way to be free was to figuratively die. I am just as guilty as the next person. He consumed me. I am so sorry, Michael. Now, I only want to massage your hands and feet. I grown older and wiser. Reminds me of the song, I've been to paradise but I've never been to me. It's beautiful.
It really moved me ..... :oops:
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PinkTopaz,
I would NEVER ever "rub it in", even if I had made a judgment that you were wrong. I wasn't doing that, either. I felt your frustration and flying off the handle, and simply wanted to pull you back down to terra firma, if possible. Some people NEED to vent, so, just saying, "possible", meaning it's up to your choice on accepting ANYthing I say. I would never say anything hurtful .
With the first part, I was mainly talking to Souza.
I wasn't talking down to you or anyone, either. I meant that if you have read MJ's book and listened to him talk enough to respect and feel affection for him, it should be easy to find some trust for him to be good-intentioned with this Hoaxed death.
"All for Love" means to me, that he NEEDED to do this, in order to protect someone or FIX something gone horribly amok, and in the interim, bless and occupy US. I've thought all kinds of things, as we know MJ's middle name has been "JOKER" for decades, now, but I no longer think it is a game for the sake of gaming. I think there is something Important being accomplished in the context of a game, so that his connection to all of those who loved him doesn't die off in his necessary absence. Who knows? He'll tell us someday. All he talked about was LOVE. I don't think ANY of this was meant to cause ONE tear---for fans.
With this part, I agree.. you spoke nicely.. it's weird that you said that particular line, because I've probably cried more in these past ten months (ESPECIALLY before I knew it was even a hoax) than I have in a few years.. LOL.
And I wasn't talking down to anyone when reminding/ explaining "Show Business" and the NONreality there. We ALL forget that it is ALL PRETEND and ACTING and ILLUSION, script, smoke, mirrors, make up, special effects, costume and FICTION, especially since we've HAD HIM for ALL our lives and he's a household word. :D :D
Theses lines blurred for me many, many times, wishing I knew him personally, as I would hear something thoughtprovoking in his song or some creative innovation, or a cause he had championed, making me proud.
So this is where it gets me, because I have wished the same thing in the same way as you many times! What are we SUPPOSED to think?
Those things were REAL---but the Personality who had become the household word was just a figment of what MY mind had filtered from all the public information and video on him. He's REALLY something, this character I am attached to. I've filled in all the blanks, because...I don't REALLY know HIM. I've HAD to pinch myself.
It's a very fine line stepped over, when the most famous man in the world's news, is discussed at the dinner table as if he's become FAMILY. He seemed so sweet, so funny, so nice, so dedicated to God in his personal life----we WANT him to be. We all want that personal contact with someone so wonderful. Someone with no HINT of ever hurting us. In fact, we are all on a first name basis with him. EVERYone I know, knows who I mean when I say, "Michael..."
But, BACK TO EARTH, he puts on a GREAT show.
His whole life BECAME the show, because his public NEVER gave him down time!!
Well then if that's true, he should have said "If you like you'll give me down time, insane public!!" I'd trade however much nessecary of this "great show" ANY day for him to have shown more of the real him and relaxed more over the years and not worried so much about giving us so much- we, not just him, would ALL be better off right now, even if some people didn't realize it at the time.
It IS a Show. Sadly. MJ SAID he wanted to bring JOY to people and give them some time to escape...And little did he realize the MONSTER he created would see to it he could NEVER have that escape himself. Pretend is one of the most fun things God ever invented. It's a great release for the stress of life. If you don't watch out, you'll want to jump in and stay there. I do. But we are here for more than PLAYtime. Someone has to run the world and the business of life.
THAT'S what depresses me, not just the fact that it's a show at all, as that's well-known, as we've discussed, it's that all of this has happened already for so long, and I want to rewind and fix it so badly.. I'm the type of person that, if I see a flaw or a problem, a different, better way that something "could have been", I get so determined to fix it, and when I can't.. I want to give him a shake twenty years ago or so and say "MAKE SURE you take care of yourself, WHO CARES about PR, you DON'T Have to make your life into a show to be successful.. PLEASE. For you AND us, in the future.."
And the fact that he's still doing it, entertaining, while he's "dead" [!!], demonstrates that it IS for Love. After all, he COULD have just disappeared and done whatever he needed to do, WITHOUT including US in this "adventure". And look what else he gave us: when he said, "Come Together Over Me", wiggling his little hips to grab our attention :wink: , even though he didn't write it, he DID it. He facilitated our Coming Together, over this mysterious "Me", probably so that we would get to know that he's not the only wonderful person on earth, and maybe we need to focus a little more on each other---ALL for LOVE. You know, things are probably going to get really hairy, on earth, and we will need each other more than we probably know yet. I don't know about you, but I've never spoken to more than a few people from other parts of the world, in all the years I've been alive, before I came to the internet to talk about HIM. I don't know. Just, again, embellishing the MJ I made up in MY head and heart, from snippets of what I've seen. But it sounds like him, doesn't it?
Oh, and I didn't mean to be proud of our 'failing to detect' that it was all an illusion. I MEANT to be proud of HIM, that he was SO darn accomplished at it, that we were caught up in it, so deeply!! He da Man!!! :lol:
I could NEVER be mad at him. :) I don't know how.
Ah, that hips thing sounds so cute, LOL! I've always felt that about this hoax, I feel so incredibly honored to be a part of it.. I'm definitely not the same person I was at 12:20 on June 25th, 2009.. and I think that's for the better. But as great as this is, what I mean is, what gets me emotional, is that it even HAD to come to this, because I know it DIDN'T have to.. It's so frustrating. Yes, it does sound very much like him, but what you say after.. the fact that we were "so deeply caught it in" is NOT a good thing! If only all of those fans had realized that the music and the dance, the essence is real, but we don't know about ALL of his personality, like we know he's patient, but we don't know what little things make him angry, we know he's creative, but we don't know how he interprets people", you know what I mean? More power to you for the last line, but as for me, I'm sorry, I can't help but get irked with him for letting this go on for so long.. I'm mostly mad at the system, the corporations, the media, of COURSE, but he all these past years was capable of keeping us on the ground while at the same time giving himself some air. I get irked with him for caring about that IMAGE so much! I WISH we had NEVER gotten to this point, I wish he wasn't involved in a hoaxed death right now, but not an overdemanding public, either. I get depressed because a lot of this happened BEFORE i was born, I feel so FRUSTRATED that SO MUCH of this happened.. Why can't we go back and FIX it- less of Michael giving of himself and MORE OF him asserting to the fans when too much is too much= less illusion/PR= less disassociated-with-reality-because-they-think-they-HAVE-him-crazy-fans=Michael happier taking at least slightly better care of himself=MORE loyal, devoted yet aware of the need for Michael to be able to DO things (like go out in public without stupid crowds forming)= perhaps no need for a hoaxed death.. It's so depressing that it all "happened already", those are the two words that grind on me the most..But you have made me feel a little better..
PinkTopaz, I am SO glad. One thing I go nuts about is despair and sadness. I want to read your post again, when I'm not at work. I just wanted to say that this thing---this BEAST of MASSIVE Fame, MJ magnetized to himself, was no one's fault, and there is probably nothing we could have done---almost immediately----after he went solo, it took over like :o wildfire. ;) 8-) HE was just TOO hot, TOO sweet, and TOO alone.
It reminds me of that Bible verse which says in the end times seven women will take hold of one man, saying "MINE, MINE!" :? :oops: :oops: :roll: :cry: Only these weren't just taking hold---they were ripping pieces off him.
He generated TOO much excitement and it simply became deadly--not to mention the claustrophobic isolation, which others have talked about and we all know.
If a fan approached him once a week, even, I don't think he would have felt encroached upon---but HE underestimated his own charm---silly, silly man :roll: :!: ;) and I dare say one fan became a clawing MOB in moments EVERY time. He couldn't even enjoy the fruits of his own labor. I think ;) he also was alittle HIGH on controlling all of this, as the Grand Puppetmaster of The Show. "MICHAEL JACKSON--HAVE TIGER BY THE TAIL, WILL TRAVEL" Sort of like snake wrangling. A rush I will take his word for! :?
But the very next minute, THIS tiger had two billion heads FULL of Teeth!!!!
:o :shock: :?
I would give almost anything to see it on his FACE, that moment, when he realized he "wasn't in Kansas any more" with Toto!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :lol: :lol: :shock: :lol: :shock: :lol: ;)
I'm NOT laughing at HIM or this scary situation. I'm picturing the amazement and thoughts of words which come to mind but cannot be spoken by him---not because he's so holy (although, it could be) but, because he simply is SPEECHLESS at the sheer raw POWER of a little bit of LOVE thrown our way. 8-) 8-)
I bet the very first time---when he knew it was ALL for him, not sharing a spotlight with the brothers---I bet he was tickled silly. And Two seconds later, probably weak in the knees with worship for God, for giving him this love magnet.
He sang about looking everywhere,(and we all KNEW he'd been all over the globe!!) :lol: :lol: for the right girl, and all that romantic stuff about what he's going to do with / for /to/ her when he gets his pure little paws on her. OH MY :D
He said he was SO lonely all the time. It's the old CinderElla call:
The King needs a wife. (Sounds like, anyway... :? )
The ingenues AND the cougars came out for that one. :roll: :? Any gal worth her femininity would be compelled to SAVE him. Love is the most powerful thing in the Universe. THE MOST DELICIOUS. It makes the world go around. It's wired into us to respond to it. To give it. To feed on it and blossom into all we can become in Its glow. It's worse than nitroglycerin in volatility, though. You know it. Hearts are fragile.
He told us people told HIM not to go around breaking young girls' hearts.
So...he's NOT. We just need a little trust.
We got SO excited we didn't notice that the King of Pop had thrown NO Ball together, and put out NO glass slipper for any of us to step into, hoping.
NOT to say... he will not, EVER........
but I think it helps to keep a toe or two on the ground in ALL love relationships---not that I know jack spit ABOUT ANYTHING about this it :!: :lol: :lol: :roll: (My heart has been punched flat so many times I only put it back up on the block for the sport of it, until this Timepiece we are stuck to runs out. But, I am right about the TOE thing. ;) I learned that much.)
I humbly submit, it's the same every time--stop listening to those fluttery butterflies and open your eyes. If there is NO glass slipper out for you, ever---it is ALL for play. You Can't expect more where there is no more.It's NOT to be mean or deceptive. It's just not a REAL live romance which you can leap into with flying feet. :lol: :lol: IMTO (In my twisted opinion). :|
What we are SUPPOSED to think, PT, is...that, I need to grab myself by the ear and remind ME that he is the most famous Celebrity in the world, NOT the boy next door, ready made for hanging out with, until he realizes he can't live without me. :x
I KNOW. I don't like it EITHER! :lol:
My mom used to tell me that all the time. Blame her for that nugget of pain. I think the KEY to WHY all of this got SO far and so deep in some hearts is, because of TWO reasons:
#1, there are a whole lot of gals who have no or at least are not shown enough LOVE every day to nourish their souls, and when we thought he (Mr. Love and Joy himself) died, we saw ourselves as destitute--NOT consciously, but somewhere deep inside hidden places in our own mushy little hearts. Not only was "hope"(to see him ever) gone, but the object of DEVOTION, was ripped from us, too.
I don't know about you girls, but I can live a LOOOONG time without feeling loved if I only have some one TO love. Does that make sense?
Anyway, I also was sad to the bone because I thought (and think still) that his Song was yet unsung inside him. He's the most God-blessed man I ever heard of. He wasn't done with his gifts...
Now that we've all washed our souls out, all this awful crying just told me we all need to find people and SAY the words, I LOVE YOU ,
MORE than we ever did and DO IT more than we ever did---even if it doesn't come back from the same people or right away. There are too many sweet, loving, loveable, love starved, :cry: broken hearts :o :( over a Beautiful, Mysterious Stranger that we ALL just wished we knew. It's a true famine.
Now that is tragic.
# 2) Because of what we KNOW and LOVE about MJand learned that we could do if we want to !: his neurons fire like NO others'. He thinks outside the box. He believes outside what is possible. We've seen him over and over DO BIG. If he can say :idea: "why not?" why can't WE?
Be cause. The numbers are off. There is Order in this Universe. Hmmmm.... ONE MJ, 2 or 3 billion women, using the mantra "why not?" "Dreams can come true, It can happen to you..."
but I think Destiny plays a bigger part in something like this. He's very strong. Who knows if anyone here could have taken the abuse along side him all these years? One would have to have the SAME stuffing inside them, just to keep up,maybe hold HIM up, too at times; let alone keep from being a weight--another thing HE has to cope with, as he skips through his Destiny.
Naw.
God needs to hand make one for HIM. MJ even sings about that. Remember? "Could it be YOU, could it be YOU? COULD it be YUOOOOOOOOOO?" ;) BRATT :) :D Shameless Flirt :o :)
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15 Pages and FINALLY someone with a voice of reason. Thank you for your comment Its her, that is exactly the point, I have nothing to add.
Well maybe that people shouldn't even be mad if he turns out to have another job than you mention. It's his life, no one else's. Who the hell are we to tell him what to do, who to be, what to wear or how to look? It's none of our business. Artists make music. If you like the music, you buy a cd. If the artist is having a gig, you might go to a concert. That's all you get, and that's all you can expect. Whatever that artist does in his own, real life, is his or her business and we should respect that.
Mike deceived you? Really? He gave too much and people put him on a horse as high as the Empire State Building. He might have used doubles in public, but I really don't think the doubles had 300 million to spend on charity, HE did that. He also gave his fans 45 years of his life, he made sacrifices in life to please his fans. He has been slandered, ridiculed, accused, laughed at, put on fire ad STILL he went into his recording studio to give you all a new album. For all those years he took the beatings. I think I would have been in a mental institution years ago, if I had to go through all that shit. Isn't there anyone that can at least try to imagine how his life must have been like? Never being able to just go shopping on your own without a bunch of 8-feet-talls to protect you and without the damn paps behind the window shooting pictures of you, making up a story and publish CRAP the next day or fans HAUNTING him down and almost kill him, just to touch him? Not being able to trust anyone because they all want you for the $$$$$$$$$ ?
He didn't deceive anyone, he gave waaaaaaay too much and he paid the price. And then be mad and turn your back on him if he might have used doubles? Shame on you who think that way.
So I had a lot more to add actually and i will stop now before I really get mad, but this seriously pisses me off.
I'm sorry Souza, but this is where not being a fan has hurt your analysis. MJ didn't make music or do anything for the "FANS" He said himself he did it all to be loved and so he could feel appreciated...He got more from his fans than what he had to give. It wasn't his fans that ripped him apart...it was the public. MJ said himself he would wake in the night with a song or a dance that he had to write down or dance out...he said it was a gift from above and that he did this, everything he did because it was something he had to do...Even when he was in hiding on the other side of the world...he was creating...recording songs...he recorded hundreds and hundreds of songs he never ever intended to release to his fans...he did this because he wanted to. He told us in his own book and his mother told us in her book, that MJ had a drive like no other to be the best. His mother said that after Off The Wall didn't do as good as MJ thought it would, he vowed that Thriller would be the best album ever...and it was. When asked for advice by people getting in the biz...he says....Preserver no matter what anyone tells you, no matter how they try to take you down, keep going for your dreams and be THE BEST. All he did, everything he did...he said in Shmuley tapes because "I wanted it"...He didn't do anything for his fans but appreciate the love they gave him and the support. He said about releasing a CD...that it's like giving birth, that you have this child (the Album) and you dote on it, love it, and raise it and then when it's time, you release it to the world to fend for itself and hope that your parenting and your efforts pay off. None of his fans are the reason why he is no longer here...No fan should ever feel guilty or sad...MJ always spoke about the LOVE he felt from fans screaming and chanting his name... About his fans, he said the following...
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PinkTopaz, I am SO glad. One thing I go nuts about is despair and sadness. I want to read your post again, when I'm not at work. I just wanted to say that this thing---this BEAST of MASSIVE Fame, MJ magnetized to himself, was no one's fault, and there is probably nothing we could have done---almost immediately----after he went solo, it took over like :o wildfire. ;) 8-) HE was just TOO hot, TOO sweet, and TOO alone.
I disagree- fans needed to learn to CONTROL themselves in the public, for God's sake.. I wonder just how many of those chasers feel really stupid when they see themselves on the pap's footage now. That's something I would never participate in..
It reminds me of that Bible verse which says in the end times seven women will take hold of one man, saying "MINE, MINE!" :? :oops: :oops: :roll: :cry: Only these weren't just taking hold---they were ripping pieces off him.
He generated TOO much excitement and it simply became deadly--not to mention the claustrophobic isolation, which others have talked about and we all know.
Of course.. I can't tell you how much that saddens me, that last line..
If a fan approached him once a week, even, I don't think he would have felt encroached upon---but HE underestimated his own charm---silly, silly man :roll: :!: ;) and I dare say one fan became a clawing MOB in moments EVERY time. He couldn't even enjoy the fruits of his own labor.
I wonder how many people that formed those mobs actually even APPRECIATED him? Ugh, I just can't stand all that..
I think ;) he also was alittle HIGH on controlling all of this, as the Grand Puppetmaster of The Show. "MICHAEL JACKSON--HAVE TIGER BY THE TAIL, WILL TRAVEL" Sort of like snake wrangling. A rush I will take his word for! :?
But the very next minute, THIS tiger had two billion heads FULL of Teeth!!!!
:o :shock: :?
I would give almost anything to see it on his FACE, that moment, when he realized he "wasn't in Kansas any more" with Toto!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :lol: :lol: :shock: :lol: :shock: :lol: ;)
I'm NOT laughing at HIM or this scary situation. I'm picturing the amazement and thoughts of words which come to mind but cannot be spoken by him---not because he's so holy (although, it could be) but, because he simply is SPEECHLESS at the sheer raw POWER of a little bit of LOVE thrown our way. 8-) 8-)
I bet the very first time---when he knew it was ALL for him, not sharing a spotlight with the brothers---I bet he was tickled silly. And Two seconds later, probably weak in the knees with worship for God, for giving him this love magnet.
He sang about looking everywhere,(and we all KNEW he'd been all over the globe!!) :lol: :lol: for the right girl, and all that romantic stuff about what he's going to do with / for /to/ her when he gets his pure little paws on her. OH MY :D
He said he was SO lonely all the time. It's the old CinderElla call:
The King needs a wife. (Sounds like, anyway... :? )
The ingenues AND the cougars came out for that one. :roll: :? Any gal worth her femininity would be compelled to SAVE him. Love is the most powerful thing in the Universe. THE MOST DELICIOUS. It makes the world go around. It's wired into us to respond to it. To give it. To feed on it and blossom into all we can become in Its glow. It's worse than nitroglycerin in volatility, though. You know it. Hearts are fragile.
He told us people told HIM not to go around breaking young girls' hearts.
So...he's NOT. We just need a little trust.
We got SO excited we didn't notice that the King of Pop had thrown NO Ball together, and put out NO glass slipper for any of us to step into, hoping.
NOT to say... he will not, EVER........
but I think it helps to keep a toe or two on the ground in ALL love relationships---not that I know jack spit ABOUT ANYTHING about this it :!: :lol: :lol: :roll: (My heart has been punched flat so many times I only put it back up on the block for the sport of it, until this Timepiece we are stuck to runs out. But, I am right about the TOE thing. ;) I learned that much.)
I humbly submit, it's the same every time--stop listening to those fluttery butterflies and open your eyes. If there is NO glass slipper out for you, ever---it is ALL for play. You Can't expect more where there is no more.It's NOT to be mean or deceptive. It's just not a REAL live romance which you can leap into with flying feet. :lol: :lol: IMTO (In my twisted opinion). :|
What we are SUPPOSED to think, PT, is...that, I need to grab myself by the ear and remind ME that he is the most famous Celebrity in the world, NOT the boy next door, ready made for hanging out with, until he realizes he can't live without me. :x
I KNOW. I don't like it EITHER! :lol:
My mom used to tell me that all the time. Blame her for that nugget of pain. I think the KEY to WHY all of this got SO far and so deep in some hearts is, because of TWO reasons:
#1, there are a whole lot of gals who have no or at least are not shown enough LOVE every day to nourish their souls, and when we thought he (Mr. Love and Joy himself) died, we saw ourselves as destitute--NOT consciously, but somewhere deep inside hidden places in our own mushy little hearts. Not only was "hope"(to see him ever) gone, but the object of DEVOTION, was ripped from us, too.
I don't know about you girls, but I can live a LOOOONG time without feeling loved if I only have some one TO love. Does that make sense?
All of this is not exactly what I meant. However, I know what you're saying here, and I just want to add that I come from a very tight, loving family, we are not like most families in America, all disconnected and such.
Anyway, I also was sad to the bone because I thought (and think still) that his Song was yet unsung inside him. He's the most God-blessed man I ever heard of. He wasn't done with his gifts...
YES, ME TOO! That was the main source of sadness for me, hearing a song like Heal the World and thinking "he didn't get to.." I couldn't stand the unfairness.
Now that we've all washed our souls out, all this awful crying just told me we all need to find people and SAY the words, I LOVE YOU ,
MORE than we ever did and DO IT more than we ever did---even if it doesn't come back from the same people or right away. There are too many sweet, loving, loveable, love starved, :cry: broken hearts :o :( over a Beautiful, Mysterious Stranger that we ALL just wished we knew. It's a true famine.
As I said, I DO say I love you every single day, I have NEVER felt starved of love.
Now that is tragic.
# 2) Because of what we KNOW and LOVE about MJand learned that we could do if we want to !: his neurons fire like NO others'. He thinks outside the box. He believes outside what is possible. We've seen him over and over DO BIG. If he can say :idea: "why not?" why can't WE?
Be cause. The numbers are off. There is Order in this Universe. Hmmmm.... ONE MJ, 2 or 3 billion women, using the mantra "why not?" "Dreams can come true, It can happen to you..."
but I think Destiny plays a bigger part in something like this. He's very strong. Who knows if anyone here could have taken the abuse along side him all these years? One would have to have the SAME stuffing inside them, just to keep up,maybe hold HIM up, too at times; let alone keep from being a weight--another thing HE has to cope with, as he skips through his Destiny.
Naw.
God needs to hand make one for HIM. MJ even sings about that. Remember? "Could it be YOU, could it be YOU? COULD it be YUOOOOOOOOOO?" ;) BRATT :) :D Shameless Flirt :o :)
I think we're going too off-topic, so I'm sending you a PM..
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This is a veeeery long thread, I don't have time to read all the posts, but I also suspect Michael has doubles.
He looks tooo diferent sometimes.
And I'm still not convinced it was him at O2 :?
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Too much info on possibles of MJs. I even see Janet as Michael in disguise lately :? not good, noooot good