Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators
Hoax Investigation => General Hoax Investigation => Other Odd Things => Topic started by: BLKROSE77 on March 22, 2010, 08:29:37 PM
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This just off of yahoo. This is crazy. What do you guys make of this. We now have Alberto "Tippy" Alvarez finally speaking out through his attorney and this is what we hear. Not something I wanted to hear. :? The link is below
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_michael_jackson (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_michael_jackson)
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Copied and pasted it here as this is more comprehensive than TMZ.
What sticks out to me? DR MURRAY SAID THIS WAS THE FIRST TIME HE HAD PERFORMED CPR
Are they shitting me or what???? he is a effing CARDIOLOGIST.
Im a nobody and IVE done it, for Gods sake... and i also have to do first aid training once a year and do CPR on one of those dummy things!!!!
LOS ANGELES – Michael Jackson's doctor halted CPR on the dying pop star and delayed calling paramedics so he could collect drug vials at the scene, according to documents obtained by The Associated Press that shed new light on the singer's chaotic final moments.
The explosive allegation that Dr. Conrad Murray may have tried to hide evidence is likely to be a focus as prosecutors move ahead with their involuntary manslaughter case against him.
The account was given to investigators by Alberto Alvarez, Jackson's logistics director, who was summoned to the stricken star's side as he was dying on June 25. His statement and those from two other Jackson employees also obtained by the AP paint a grisly scene in Jackson's bedroom.
Alvarez told investigators that he rushed to Jackson's room and saw the star lying in his bed, an IV attached to his leg. Jackson's mouth was agape, eyes open and there was no sign of life. Murray worked frantically, at one point performing mouth-to-mouth resuscitation while Alvarez took over CPR.
Two of the star's children, Prince and Paris, came in the room and cried as they saw Murray trying to save their father. A nanny was called to usher them away and they were taken to wait outside in a vehicle.
The documents also detail an odd encounter with Murray after Jackson was declared dead at a nearby hospital. Murray insisted he needed to return to the mansion to get cream that Jackson had "so the world wouldn't find out about it," according to the statements, which provide no elaboration.
Murray's lawyer, Ed Chernoff, rejected the notion his client tried to hide drugs. He also noted Alvarez was interviewed twice by police and gave different accounts of what happened in Jackson's bedroom. During the first interview, Alvarez made no mention of being told to tidy away medicine vials.
"He didn't say any of those things, then two months later, all of a sudden, the doc is throwing bottles into the bag," Chernoff said. "Alvarez's statement is inconsistent with his previous statement. We will deal with that at trial."
Alvarez and the others who gave the statements, Jackson's personal assistant Michael Amir Williams and driver/bodyguard Faheem Muhammad, could be key witnesses should Murray go to trial. Except for the brief appearances by the nanny and the children, Alvarez and Muhammad were the only others in the room with Murray as he tried to save Jackson before paramedics arrived.
A call to Alvarez's attorney was not immediately returned.
Jackson, 50, hired Murray to be his personal physician as he prepared for a series of comeback performances in London. He was participating in strenuous rehearsals and Murray would routinely meet him at the star's home in the evening for treatments.
The Los Angeles coroner ruled Jackson's death a homicide caused by an overdose of the powerful anesthetic propofol and two other sedatives given to get the chronic insomniac to sleep. Propofol, a milky white liquid, is supposed to be administered only by anesthesia professionals in medical settings. Patients require constant monitoring because the drug depresses breathing and heart rate while lowering blood pressure, a potentially deadly combination.
Murray, 57, a cardiologist licensed in Nevada, California and Texas, has acknowledged briefly leaving Jackson's bedside the day he died but maintained from the outset that nothing he gave the singer should have killed him. It wasn't illegal for him to administer propofol, though whether he followed proper procedures while Jackson was under the influence is a key part of the case.
California Attorney General Jerry Brown's office has asked a court to suspend Murray's license pending the outcome of criminal proceedings against him.
Alvarez, Muhammad and Williams are all represented by attorney Carl Douglas and gave their statements separately on Aug. 31 at the lawyer's Beverly Hills office. None of the three has spoken publicly about the events of June 25.
Alvarez told police he arrived at Jackson's home around 10:20 a.m. He was awaiting instructions for the day in a security trailer outside Jackson's rented mansion when, at 12:17 p.m., his phone rang. It was Williams.
Williams told Alvarez that Murray had just called to say Jackson was in trouble. Alvarez rushed into the mansion and up the stairs to Jackson's room, where he saw Murray standing at the pop star's bedside, performing CPR with one hand, according to the statements.
Alvarez asked the doctor what had happened.
"He had a reaction, he had a bad reaction," Murray replied, according to Alvarez's statement.
Murray then grabbed a few vials with rubber tops and told Alvarez to put them in a bag, Alvarez told investigators. Alvarez picked up a plastic bag from the floor and Murray put the bottles inside, then Murray told Alvarez to put that plastic bag inside a brown canvas bag, according to the account.
Alvarez said Murray then told him to remove an IV bag from a stand and put it in a blue canvas bag. He did, and noticed the bag had a connector with a milky white substance in it. Alvarez didn't say what happened to the bags, nor did he identify what was in the vials.
Two days after Jackson's death, under several hours of questioning by police, Murray eventually directed them to a closet in Jackson's bedroom. In it, they found propofol and other sedatives in a bag.
On the day Jackson died, Murray waited until the bags were filled before telling Alvarez to call 911, according to Alvarez's statement.
"I need an ambulance as soon as possible," Alvarez told a dispatcher. "We have a gentleman here that needs help and he's not breathing."
The dispatcher told Alvarez to put Jackson on the floor.
At that moment, Muhammad rushed into the room and began helping with chest compressions while Murray attempted mouth-to-mouth resuscitation.
Murray told the men it was his first time performing CPR, Alvarez said, though Chernoff said Murray had administered CPR many times before.
Murray then placed a dark brown machine with wires onto Jackson's fingers, Alvarez said. Police later said they found a pulse oximeter at Jackson's home, a medical device that shows heart rate and the amount of oxygen in the blood.
By 12:27 p.m., paramedics arrived at the house. According to their report, Jackson was not breathing and had no pulse at 12:29 p.m. However, Murray stated he could feel a weak pulse in Jackson's upper thigh area, Alvarez and Muhammad said.
According to the paramedic report, emergency responders tried two rounds of resuscitation attempts and were ready to discontinue treatment, but Murray said he would take responsibility and insisted resuscitation be continued in the ambulance.
At 1:07 p.m., the singer was taken to Ronald Reagan UCLA Medical Center, where doctors attempted a range of resuscitation techniques. Jackson was pronounced dead at 2:26 p.m.
At the hospital, after the death had been called, Williams said he saw Murray crying.
Murray asked Williams if he or someone else could take him back to the mansion so he could pick up the cream, according to Williams' statement.
Williams said he didn't think it was a good idea for Murray to return to the house. He spoke to Muhammad and they agreed they wouldn't take Murray back. They concocted a story that police had taken all the keys to the vehicles as part of the investigation.
Murray said he would take a cab, and Williams said he saw him leave the hospital through a side door.
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OMFG :cry: :cry: :cry: MJ WAS MURDERED!!! :cry:
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And where the hell have they got this picture from, all of a sudden?
Is Murray doing studio shots now???
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OMFG :cry: :cry: :cry: MJ WAS MURDERED!!! :cry:
If what you say is true, Murrays a** should be put under the jail. I don't know what to believe at this point. :cry: :x
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neither do i :|
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So he went back to the Carolwood Drive when he left the hospital to get "cream" or to get his hands on the surveilance tapes?
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Everyone take a deep breath and calm down.
Listen...
First of all, is it just me or does this article read like a short story? lol...
But seriously - IF this was a murder, why on earth would this information just be surfacing NOW? After an 8 month investigation. If Alvarez was there, and it was a planned murder, then he would have known what was going on and he would have been instructed NOT to speak about it, right?
Of course there is a chance that he had agreed to be silent and later felt too guilty, breaking his agreement. But wouldn't there be some kind of consequences involved in that?
I think this is just more drama, more excitement, to the hoax.
"piece by piece... until MJ is revealed..."
The reason this keeps getting more bizzare and fiction-like is because it IS bizzare and IS fiction.
I don't believe this because I want to, I believe it because nothing else makes sense.
Remember, when Michael was charged with child molestation, there was a LOT of false evidence. People simply MADE UP STORIES that caused the public to think of him as a guilty man when he was 100% innocent... Just like we are doing with Murray.
If all of this is proven in court, if Murray goes to prison, then yes - perhaps I will believe it was murder. Until then, I will believe in all the evidence we have accumulated since 6/25/09. It is 1000% more convincing than this BS.
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Why does this story constantly keep changing? Now the bodyguard is coming forth just now with this information that Murray was trying to hide drugs during CPR. Isn't it against the law to withhold important evidence like that if true. What the heck? Why is he just now coming forth with this info? Why would the bodyguard even listen to Murray's request anyway to wait to call 911? MJ was his boss not Murray his priority is to protect MJ. Also when did Paris come into the picture seeing her father in that state? Before they reported that only Prince was called by Murray. Things just keep getting more crazy day by day. New completely different story then we first heard being reported after the 25th of June. I haven't heard anything on the news on tv about this story so I don't know what's up with it.
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Why does this story constantly keep changing? Now the bodyguard is coming forth just now with this information that Murray was trying to hide drugs during CPR. Isn't it against the law to withhold important evidence like that if true. What the heck? Why is he just now coming forth with this info? Also when did Paris come into the picture seeing her father in that state? Before they reported that only Prince was called by Murray. Things just keep getting more crazy day by day. New completely different story then we first heard being reported after the 25th of June.
I was thinking the same about Paris, she suddenly appears to be in the house that day, and tmz said that they both enter in mj's room meanwhile conrad murray was doin CPR and they were crying (paris and prince) :x i'm goin crazy with this story :? ..why came up with this story 9 months after? :?:
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Alvarez had worked with MJ for years so I feel that if anything inappropriate had taken place that day he would have spoken out way before now. He and Michael were not just employer/employee. They had a friendship and he was one of the few people that MJ completely trusted. I posted on one of the other threads regarding this topic that if we think back to June 25th and remember, Alvarez was missing and not even his wife knew, or would say, where he was. My gut says that Alvarez helped Michael put this elaborate hoax together and he may have been the only one who physically helped him get away from here.
We have all questioned how many people could actually be in on this? We may never know the answer to that but money talks and I will never believe that MJ was as broke as the media has claimed. He may have been in debt but that does not mean that he was cash poor. Even nanny Grace said that Katherine called her wanting to know where Michael had hidden the money because he always had money hidden in the house. The discrepancies have just continued nonstop since that fateful day and noone can give us any straight answers. Another thing that I think about is the autopsy report for example, the fact that fingerprints were not used to ID the body but yet they were on file. How many things have we discussed in detail since his "death"? How many versions have we been given as to the events of that day? How many contradictions have we heard? Even the family hasn't been able to keep their stories straight so how are we expected to believe anything that we are told?
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Exactly. Why Alvarez just said about this? Why Alvarez does not also say that Murrey was living voice mail to his patient about his heart test results? Why children did not look too sad and stressed out after they witnessed their father dying, why Alvarez does not say why it took that long to call 911. Why this article does not specify the time Alvarez heard or saw MJ dying or dead. " Alvarez took over CPR"-what the hell, since when Alvarez is a cardiologist, instead of calling 911 right away, he started CPR? But before statement said: Murray was performing CPR on the bed instead of moving MJ on the floor. So, who was performing CPR? those BOTH COMPLETE IDIOTS?!! "so he could collect drug vials at the scene"- another inconsistence. The investigation report + I remember clearly news were showing medications supposedly collected from MJ's mansion. Then how Murrey collected drugs if there were many drugs found at the home? And who after MJ passed would allow Murrey go back to the mansion? There were police investigation going on or there could be family members, right? I remeber was reported Janet went to the house to collect jewelry? Also LAPD was telling that they could not find Murrey for a few days then they found him in Vegas, am I right or confusing something here?
I am only sure that I cannot take this chaos any more! :roll: :cry:
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No, you are not alone!! Way too much information for my brain to absorb. :roll:
What about the cream part??? Was Murray suggesting Bleaching cream ??????? Well, sorry, that's a joke, because MJ admitted to having never bleached his skin. What a lame excuse to go back to the Mansion. So he is suggesting MJ had this secret that he used skin bleaching cream and he didn't want to world to know about it. :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:
Sorry, but this is just more bulls**t to throw us off.
I will make my decision on April 4th, until then I stay CONFUSED. :? :? :? :? :? :| :| |
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ugh. it's on the news right now. i hate this kind of news. i don't know about this whole murray deal yet. but what i do know is that michael hasn't been in the news for a week, so it was about time for another "explosive" story to be leaked. began march with the jacksons, end march with the jacksons. busy times folks.
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So he went back to the Carolwood Drive when he left the hospital to get "cream" or to get his hands on the surveilance tapes?
Cream was still found at the scene... at least we have been told.
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There are several nice things to note about this article:
- it's not published on TMZ (they choose now official AP press agency and site #4 not #400 in global web traffic to publish - thus the heat is supposed to be getting up again - where is boiling temperature btw?)
- a publication on news.yahoo.com leads to 1461 comments in 81 minutes (translating into 17.6 comments per minute thus approximately one comment every 3.4 seconds) thus indicating that the public is reacting in a quite considerable strength to the article - PR responsiveness test was ok, I guess LOL
- the reponse to the article is still proving a highly emotionally loaded matter - the responsiveness of the public sank drastically within 47 min. to an average 11.6 comments / minute in 128 minutes. This is also proving that there is only a relativly small kernel of higly responsive persons. In other words: there are several hundreds of persons reacting very fast thus highly emotional on the article - however the pace of comments slows considerably down as time goes by (for several reasons that would need further investigation) thus indicating that the masses are not willing to comment for which reason ever.
- it is remarkable that the responsiveness was so high at publication time of the article. This indicates that the emotionally reacting target kernel has a) a high interest in articles on the matter and b) is using viral marketing over social media to "spread the news" to their fellow high responsive brothers & sisters. So this is proof that viral marketing initiatives are successful.
- Doc Murray got a new studio photo - so we're heading into more serious weeks, I assume.
- the lie attempts continue (why would Alvarez wait for instruction in any security mobile in front of the mansion during 2 hours? If he's in charge, he's in charge in his shift - he was not allowed in the house?).
Let's see how the whole story unfolds further.
Still waiting for the guerilla marketing tactics.
I recommend pop corn and a good soda. ;)
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Everyone take a deep breath and calm down.
Listen...
First of all, is it just me or does this article read like a short story? lol...
But seriously - IF this was a murder, why on earth would this information just be surfacing NOW? After an 8 month investigation. If Alvarez was there, and it was a planned murder, then he would have known what was going on and he would have been instructed NOT to speak about it, right?
Of course there is a chance that he had agreed to be silent and later felt too guilty, breaking his agreement. But wouldn't there be some kind of consequences involved in that?
I think this is just more drama, more excitement, to the hoax.
"piece by piece... until MJ is revealed..."
The reason this keeps getting more bizzare and fiction-like is because it IS bizzare and IS fiction.
I don't believe this because I want to, I believe it because nothing else makes sense.
Remember, when Michael was charged with child molestation, there was a LOT of false evidence. People simply MADE UP STORIES that caused the public to think of him as a guilty man when he was 100% innocent... Just like we are doing with Murray.
If all of this is proven in court, if Murray goes to prison, then yes - perhaps I will believe it was murder. Until then, I will believe in all the evidence we have accumulated since 6/25/09. It is 1000% more convincing than this BS.
IF this is a hoax and The Murray trial plays an important role in showing how Media creates Truth in the heads and hearts of the public and how this negatively effected Michael, then THIS SENTENCE IN THE ARTICLE reminded me of Michael`s speech to the public before his own trial;
"He wasn't putting bottles in a bag and trying to hide them," Chernoff said. "We are confident that a fair trial will ferret out the truth."
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Everyone take a deep breath and calm down.
Listen...
First of all, is it just me or does this article read like a short story? lol...
But seriously - IF this was a murder, why on earth would this information just be surfacing NOW? After an 8 month investigation. If Alvarez was there, and it was a planned murder, then he would have known what was going on and he would have been instructed NOT to speak about it, right?
Of course there is a chance that he had agreed to be silent and later felt too guilty, breaking his agreement. But wouldn't there be some kind of consequences involved in that?
I think this is just more drama, more excitement, to the hoax.
"piece by piece... until MJ is revealed..."
The reason this keeps getting more bizzare and fiction-like is because it IS bizzare and IS fiction.
I don't believe this because I want to, I believe it because nothing else makes sense.
Remember, when Michael was charged with child molestation, there was a LOT of false evidence. People simply MADE UP STORIES that caused the public to think of him as a guilty man when he was 100% innocent... Just like we are doing with Murray.
If all of this is proven in court, if Murray goes to prison, then yes - perhaps I will believe it was murder. Until then, I will believe in all the evidence we have accumulated since 6/25/09. It is 1000% more convincing than this BS.
I know right? This new development sounds like a TALE SPIN.
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is this true :cry: then again it is quite detailed for a trial that didn't start... :?
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I've just heard this on the radio and the sky news website. It's so random! I wonder who was the source. If this turn out not be a hoax , what the hell was Murray thinking . This guy is in deep! Sky news made sure to use the most evil looking pic of Murray :lol:, adding to the tabloid sensationalism!
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Alvarez had worked with MJ for years so I feel that if anything inappropriate had taken place that day he would have spoken out way before now. He and Michael were not just employer/employee. They had a friendship and he was one of the few people that MJ completely trusted. I posted on one of the other threads regarding this topic that if we think back to June 25th and remember, Alvarez was missing and not even his wife knew, or would say, where he was. My gut says that Alvarez helped Michael put this elaborate hoax together and he may have been the only one who physically helped him get away from here.
We have all questioned how many people could actually be in on this? We may never know the answer to that but money talks and I will never believe that MJ was as broke as the media has claimed. He may have been in debt but that does not mean that he was cash poor. Even nanny Grace said that Katherine called her wanting to know where Michael had hidden the money because he always had money hidden in the house. The discrepancies have just continued nonstop since that fateful day and noone can give us any straight answers. Another thing that I think about is the autopsy report for example, the fact that fingerprints were not used to ID the body but yet they were on file. How many things have we discussed in detail since his "death"? How many versions have we been given as to the events of that day? How many contradictions have we heard? Even the family hasn't been able to keep their stories straight so how are we expected to believe anything that we are told?
Read the article again because it is written in a media spin way.
1) Alvarez did not come forward NOW. It says that the documents were gained NOW. That means this document could have been months old.
2) It says that the three have not spoken publicly about it. This means the documents were leaked from the PD.or PA.
3) The defense attorney gives an account that Alvarez made 2 statements and this came from the second "He didn't say any of those things, then two months later, all of a sudden, the doc is throwing bottles into the bag," So by the defense admission this statement is real, held in the case and is at least 6 months old
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OMG!! that sounds like a crack house!! vials on the floor? OH NO!! can't be! :(
{If Michael Jackson orchestrated all this, what a great conductor is he! :D }
I need more coffee this morning after this story...
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And where the hell have they got this picture from, all of a sudden?
Is Murray doing studio shots now???
:lol: :lol: :lol: maybe it was from his portfolio for the audition of the role of ''Doctor'' :lol:
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No, it is from the parking lot, the hearing day.
But those pics still looked possed.
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Don't those pictures look like the ones of Michael at the 2005 trial?'
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No, you are not alone!! Way too much information for my brain to absorb. :roll:
What about the cream part??? Was Murray suggesting Bleaching cream ??????? Well, sorry, that's a joke, because MJ admitted to having never bleached his skin. What a lame excuse to go back to the Mansion. So he is suggesting MJ had this secret that he used skin bleaching cream and he didn't want to world to know about it. :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:
Sorry, but this is just more bulls**t to throw us off.
I will make my decision on April 4th, until then I stay CONFUSED. :? :? :? :? :? :| :| |
Honey:
MJ did bleach his skin itis a known fact. Vitiligo did not make him turn completely white on his own. It's scientifically impossible to be as MJ was without bleaching cream.
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@ Truth_Freedom MJ used the cream to even out his skin tone. he didn't want two skin tones so he used the cream... he didn't ''bleach'' his skin that's a tabloid
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but what are they trying to imply with the story of the cream we all know he had to use it to even out the skin tone why are they trying to make it sound like he had to cover it up murray i mean.
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Another thing that I think about is the autopsy report for example, the fact that fingerprints were not used to ID the body but yet they were on file.
The AR DOES mention fingerprints were used, it's on page 1.
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Two of the star's children, Prince and Paris, came in the room and cried as they saw Murray trying to save their father. A nanny was called to usher them away and they were taken to wait outside in a vehicle
I remember somebody said in an interview (was it Kai Chase?) that Murray told her "go and get prince" so prince got upstairs to murray.....
And again now, another version of that day!! WTF is goin' on here?!
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Just a suggestion about the "cream" remark, it could have been propofol, which is often referred to as "milk"
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Two of the star's children, Prince and Paris, came in the room and cried as they saw Murray trying to save their father. A nanny was called to usher them away and they were taken to wait outside in a vehicle
I remember somebody said in an interview (was it Kai Chase?) that Murray told her "go and get prince" so prince got upstairs to murray.....
And again now, another version of that day!! WTF is goin' on here?!
All the changing stories just don't make sense... do they even expect us to believe that??
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Two of the star's children, Prince and Paris, came in the room and cried as they saw Murray trying to save their father. A nanny was called to usher them away and they were taken to wait outside in a vehicle
I remember somebody said in an interview (was it Kai Chase?) that Murray told her "go and get prince" so prince got upstairs to murray.....
And again now, another version of that day!! WTF is goin' on here?!
All the changing stories just don't make sense... do they even expect us to believe that??
I think they want us to doubt the stories..
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I just posted on the other thread - cream does not necessarily mean cream... we know TMZ now, don't we?
viewtopic.php?f=50&t=7604&start=25#p124758 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=7604&start=25#p124758)
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This is insane...all this stuff comes out now and stories and times keep on changing! Nobody can keep the damn story straight
Michael come back asap to fix this!!!
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"These ridiculous tactics from the district attorney's office have no other aim than to have a look to our defense because they have the necessary security for their own case to convict Dr. Murray," Sevcik said. "We will not take the bait," he added.
Sandi Gibbons, spokeswoman for the district attorney's office in Los Angeles, said the prosecution didn´t provide any documents to the media. "
Source (http://translate.google.es/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=es&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.elmundo.es%2Felmundo%2F2010%2F03%2F23%2Fcultura%2F1269327581.html&sl=es&tl=en&swap=1)
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Another thing that I think about is the autopsy report for example, the fact that fingerprints were not used to ID the body but yet they were on file.
The AR DOES mention fingerprints were used, it's on page 1.
Yes it does state that fingerprints were obtained but on page 3, at the bottom, it states under Identification:
"The body was positively identified as Michael Joseph Jackson by visual comparison to his California Drivers License on 06/25/09"
If I have missed something please let me know because this is one of the things that has been bothering me. I also remember watching a report where they interviewed someone from the coroner's office and it was stated that they did not use fingerprints in identifying MJ because they had his driver's license as positive ID. I can't remember what I was watching but I know it has been discussed on here in another thread as well.