ContextBolded portion is interesting. Sneaky move there, god.
The reason for the plagues appears to be twofold:[22] to answer Pharaoh's taunt, “Who is Yahweh, that I should obey his voice to let Israel go?”[23] and to indelibly impress the Israelites with Yahweh's power as an object lesson for all time, which was also meant to become known “throughout the world”.[24][25]
According to the Torah, God hardened Pharaoh's heart so he would be strong enough to persist in his unwillingness to release the people, so that God could manifest his great power and cause it to be declared among the nations,[26] so that other people would discuss it for generations afterward.[27] In this view, the plagues were punishment for the Egyptians' long abuse of the Israelites, as well as proof that the gods of Egypt were powerless by comparison.[28] If God triumphed over the gods of Egypt, a world power at that time, then the people of God would be strengthened in their faith, although they were a small people, and would not be tempted to follow the deities that God put to shame. Exodus portrays Yahweh explaining why he did not accomplish the freedom of the Israelites immediately:
“ I could have stretched forth My hand and stricken you [Pharaoh] and your people with pestilence, and you would have been effaced from the earth. Nevertheless I have spared you for this purpose: in order to show you My power and in order that My fame may resound throughout the world. ”
— Exodus 9:15-16 (JPS)
Extreme "darkness" before the "Light"……..God struck Egypt with 10 plagues --- 1 of them was "Darkness" (Exodus 10:21-23). Complete and TOTAL darkness cast over the land of Egypt. They wandered around aimlessly as good as blind--- not even so much as seeing their own hand in front of their face.
FrontGood catch MJonmind. Really good catch.
There was no milk and honey served to them on a silver platter.
TS
We have only a few days left (until 11-29), but 7b and 7c should fall into place rather quickly—especially since I will be handing much of it out on a silver platter.
(http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ5c1FdFOXV64yjTH3FpmgsevRagk-DPKTu658WuT8uPCVM1_VSIw)
This redirect is a map from Ron Wyatt who made claims to have found the location of the Red Sea crossing and the location of the Ark of the Covenant as well as other biblical archeological discoveries.
Here's the link to the site about the DVD of discoveries.
http://www.arkdiscovery.com/red_sea_crossing.htm (http://www.arkdiscovery.com/red_sea_crossing.htm)
Wadi Watir had the Children of Israel "entangled." Exit point at the large beach at Nuweiba (2005)
When traveling through "the wilderness of the Red Sea" Ex.13:18, escaping Pharaoh's army, God told Moses to turn south, so they headed through a wadi or canyon area that is called the Wadi Watir which led to the sea. The Bible in Ex. 14:3 says, "They are entangled in the land, the wilderness hath shut them in."
When arriving at the beach, the children of Israel felt trapped, as they could not turn back, nor head north because at the northern end of the beach was a three story, Egyptian military fortress which is still standing today undergoing restoration.
ON TO THE REAL MT. SINAI....
Ron Wyatt's Research on the Exodus to the Red Sea
This exact map with the Gulf of Aqaba as the crossing point is listed on the page link when you scroll down
However what Ron Wyatt and his team did get right (in our opinion and in the opinion of St. Paul and in the opinion therefore of the Holy Spirit and of God) is that he believed that Mount Sinai was in Saudi Arabia rather than being in the incorrectly named wilderness of Sinai. He and his sons went to Jabal al Lawz (the mountain of the Law) to see what they could find. Before they could find anything they were promptly arrested and spent 78 days behind bars! Apparently someone had phoned the embassy authorities in Saudi Arabia and told them that Ron and his party were spying for Israel! Perhaps they got a bit too close to the truth? It is quite possible that the artifacts Wyatt and others have found in the Nuweiba beach area, further up the gulf, are actually remains of an Egyptian army which crossed Red Sea at the mouth of the gulf. This is because the force of the powerful surge of water which returned when the wind died, could certainly have carried Pharaoh and his army quite a way up the gulf, and then over time, who knows where they may have been carried. But we do not that the land bridge at Baal Zephon would prevent them ever leaving the gulf. So they are in there somewhere!! The best place to search for them would appear to be just north of the strait of Tiran. As a final technical point, the narrow trench between the beach where the sons of Israel encamped (which is now Sharm Al Sheik's airport) and Baal Zephon, is today around 800 meters wide at over 75 meters depth. But the trench has a huge volume of water, that of the whole tide of the gulf moving through it in both directions on a daily basis. This presently eats away at the depth of the trench which increases by 15 -16 mm per year www.geocities.com/athens/parthenon/3021/resea9.html (http://www.geocities.com/athens/parthenon/3021/resea9.html) .3500 years of this gives us around 50 meters of erosion. But when the trench was smaller, it would have been eroded faster, because the waters of the gulf would have had to have passed through a smaller channel. So the erosion is less today than it was 3500 years ago. It is not hard to see that the max depth of the land bridge may only have been between 50 or 100 meters in 1513 BC rather than the 205 meters that it is today.
(http://www.truebiblecode.com/resources/p2strait%20of%20tiran%20satellite2.jpg)
(http://www.truebiblecode.com/resources/p9coralreefs.jpg)
http://www.truebiblecode.com/understanding249.html (http://www.truebiblecode.com/understanding249.html)
So here we have TS redirecting to a picture that Front used in his 31st Dec post:
http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=5167.msg381542#msg381542
Front wrote:
Moses led the Israelites out of Egypt, which was no easy feat. But through guidance & strength from God--- and an "army" (of L.O.V.E.) whose faith remained strong despite the fears and unknowns--- they crossed the Red Sea as "east winds" (whispers) were deLIVEred to divide the waters and create a pathway for them to walk upon.
They were promised a place of "milk & honey" (Exodus 3). This was certainly not a case of "instant gratification"--not by a LONG stretch. There was no milk and honey served to them on a silver platter. And where was this land that was spoken of, "flowing with milk and honey"? They could not see it…but they believed. They pressed on, continuing to Trust in God. They bolstered their faith --- and they never lost hope. It took many years before they finally reached their destination. BUT--- they had enough to survive the journey.
Bottom line: They didn't get what they wanted, when they wanted it…..but they got what they needed, when they needed it.
Extreme "darkness" before the "Light"……..
God struck Egypt with 10 plagues --- 1 of them was "Darkness" (Exodus 10:21-23). Complete and TOTAL darkness cast over the land of Egypt. They wandered around aimlessly as good as blind--- not even so much as seeing their own hand in front of their face.
The miraculous story of parting the Red Sea is told in the Book of Exodus 13:17-14:29. It's also mentioned in the Qur'an (Surah 26: Al-Shu'ara, verses 60-67).
"If you're not a religious person…it matters not!
...........................................................................
...........................................................................
...........................................................................
If you're not, then have faith in Michael. "
According to the Torah, God hardened Pharaoh's heart so he would be strong enough to persist in his unwillingness to release the people, so that God could manifest his great power and cause it to be declared among the nations,[26] so that other people would discuss it for generations afterward.
Sneaky move there, god.
They were promised a place of "milk & honey" (Exodus 3). This was certainly not a case of "instant gratification"--not by a LONG stretch. There was no milk and honey served to them on a silver platter. And where was this land that was spoken of, "flowing with milk and honey"? They could not see it…but they believed. They pressed on, continuing to Trust in God. They bolstered their faith --- and they never lost hope. It took many years before they finally reached their destination. BUT--- they had enough to survive the journey.
Bottom line: They didn't get what they wanted, when they wanted it…..but they got what they needed, when they needed it.
Why Would the “Return” Depend on Hoaxers?
Several have asked: why would the timing of the MJ return be dependent (at least partly) upon few thousand hoax believers, and their understanding/accepting the TIAI information? A simple answer is that the reaction of the few before the return, can be a pretty good indicator of the reaction of the many after the return
{http://http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=1991}.
But think about it. After returning, MJ can speak publicly about the environment and other issues related to healing the world; but with some aspects, well I think you can figure things out. As soon as MJ returns, there will be a stampede on all the hoax forums; there will be tens of thousands, or even hundreds of thousands, suddenly interested in what we have been investigating and saying all along. So if we hoax believers now are united on the reasons for the hoax: it will be much more effective when others come asking questions, than if we are all confused and disagreeing on the reasons for the hoax.
Here is how Mo put it: “It's a process to make people AWARE of what is going on. If you don't research, read, learn and understand, you won't become aware. If S.T.U.D.Y., TS or any Anonymous poster would have told you plain out who he/she is and where all the info he/she has came from, you would not have read the full explanation and wouldn't have learned anything. TIAI pointed out to conspiracies and NWO, and those issues were rejected by a lot of people until TIAI pointed out to them. Me? Guilty as charged... I skipped the ‘Illuminati’ threads as well until TIAI forced me to look into this whole issue. After researching it, and not reading up on the conspiracies and NWO only, a lot of things became clear to me.” {http://http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=1936&start=75}
So if there are any questions or objections that I have not addressed in this thread, please post them in the replies below; and I will answer them directly right here in the replies (I will watch this thread pretty closely, for the next week or two, and respond to things as needed—so as to help clear the way as far as possible for a speedy “Return”).
I have a question about TS. I remember when we began here originally in the forum and S.T.U.D.Y. appeared. There was research done and didn't we decide whoever it was seemed to be a "preacher" with the name Tim S something? Then once we began talking about that, he stopped the semi religious talk, and we got down to serious investigating business. Then the name changed...who knows if it's the same person or not..as Study, back, front, ts or ts_comments, tiai.... but, he's back to the religious stuff. True purpose is coming back. I waited a long time, but I knew it would.
I really miss hearing and learning about Michael. I get the religion elsewhere.
I have a question about TS. I remember when we began here originally in the forum and S.T.U.D.Y. appeared. There was research done and didn't we decide whoever it was seemed to be a "preacher" with the name Tim S something? Then once we began talking about that, he stopped the semi religious talk, and we got down to serious investigating business. Then the name changed...who knows if it's the same person or not..as Study, back, front, ts or ts_comments, tiai.... but, he's back to the religious stuff. True purpose is coming back. I waited a long time, but I knew it would.
I really miss hearing and learning about Michael. I get the religion elsewhere.
Good point /bravo/ , you have my respect respect/ and ofcourse my hug bearhug ,it's very good to see you BACK :) !!!!!
All of these are fantastic links to do with this re-direct
http://vimeo.com/33439742 (http://vimeo.com/33439742)
http://www.arkdiscovery.com/index2.htm
http://www.youtube.com/sygnate
All of these are fantastic links to do with this re-directThanks 2good2btrue......I watched Michael Rood talk about his time with Ron Wyatt. I liked his statement that afterwards, he went back and read all the anti-Wyatt info on the net and he knew that the people writing this had no first hand information and were only spreading what they had heard. I liked his take on the system also.....the religious system....where you come in and pay your 10% tax I mean tithe and you sit down, shut up and don't ask any difficult questions.
http://vimeo.com/33439742 (http://vimeo.com/33439742)
http://www.arkdiscovery.com/index2.htm
http://www.youtube.com/sygnate
ford - i am sooooo glad you are back. was just thinking of you today.
Love to you sister x
ford - i am sooooo glad you are back. was just thinking of you today.Love to you too Sister...and you have an amazing mind and a wonderful way of presenting the truth.
Love to you sister x
This may seem simplistic - but might this redirect be about TS showing us another connection to Front perhaps, rather than having us delve into another complex analysis/interpretation of the religious aspects?
This may seem simplistic - but might this redirect be about TS showing us another connection to Front perhaps, rather than having us delve into another complex analysis/interpretation of the religious aspects?
I thought equal, taking into account that there are people who are not religious
Whether you take the 'story' of the Exodus as literal or whether you believe it is simply a 'story' told by whoever for whatever purpose....there is STILL meaning/lessons to be 'interpreted' from within the 'story'.
I also believe that ONE of the reasons for the redirect is to further make 'clear' the connection between the 'screen-names'...and I LOVE that ::P
BUT...IF you accept this as 'proof' of a connection, then the fact remains that under the 'screen-name' of Front, our attention WAS drawn to the 'story' of the Exodus. So I do believe that we are meant to look at a deeper meaning/connection of that 'story' to OUR own 'story' (the hoax)...and perhaps find some parallels (and there are a few...I LOVE MJonMind's interpretation of the meaning/parallels).
It's not a requirement that one be 'religious' to engage in the discussion/topic...nor is it a requirement that one take the 'story' of the Exodus to be literal and/or to have happened at all. IMO, the only requirement is a desire to engage in the discussion. If it doesn't interest someone, they are free to skip it. BUT...IF you believe that Front and TS are on the 'same team' (which the last few posts from both have confirmed) AND you believe that they are on 'team MJ' lol...then it follows that this line of thought (the 'religious/spiritual' line) is important to MIKE...or 'they' wouldn't be 'shining a light' in that direction.
[OR...it's important to this TS/ts_comments/TIAI/Front/Back/S.T.U.D.Y. person for us to follow these leads and study the bible. Didn't we learn that TS (Tim Sirkin) is a minister? This could be his way of preaching. But, anyhow, he does seem Very smart and quite a leader. And also, in the KNOW about Michael. Although, mostly, nothing has become really of any of anything. It's all speculation and wouldn't hold up in court about Michael being alive. I simply believe it. But, there is nothing to say that TS don't have his own addenda or that he speaks what MICHAEL wants us to know. I"M a 100% believer and 100% lover of Jah, but I just do not choose to believe that this stuff is what MICHAEL is wanting, or doing or paying someone to do. We know what's he's said that he believes. THis isn't it./size]
Whether you take the 'story' of the Exodus as literal or whether you believe it is simply a 'story' told by whoever for whatever purpose....there is STILL meaning/lessons to be 'interpreted' from within the 'story'. My best guess as to the WHY of this redirect (apart from the obvious 'link' to Front)...is that MIKE is asking us to TRY to see the connection between 'stories'. I'll keep thinking about it and will keep reading others' 'interpretations' of it...but as I mentioned, I'm really liking MJonMind's interpretation best so far.
With L.O.V.E. always.
Jackson: Because I’ve always felt that I was his back bone... someone to ...someone to ...be there for him I was there and he was sort of like Moses. Things he couldn’t say thing he couldn’t say, I would say them. During the trials I knew he was a thousand percent innocent, I knew ...we all knew.http://www.examiner.com/entertainment-in-orlando/jermaine-jackson-speaks-on-brother-king-of-pop-michael-jackson#ixzz1inRQyMIn
Romans 14:13
Let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or OBSTACLE in the way of a BROTHER or SISTER.
@Ford...I respect your opinion and I'm also glad to see you posting again ::P
I believe that TS, Front and Back do speak for Mike for a couple of 'main' reasons. First, as you said TS (and the same goes for Front and Back) KNOW quite a lot about Mike. That's been proven for anyone who has taken the time to read their posts and connect the dots. The other reason...probably the TOP reason for me...that I believe 'they' are speaking for Mike is because I KNOW that Mike is alive and you stated you are also a firm beLIEver. Based on everything I have come to KNOW about Mike...everything pre and post 'death'...makes me believe that HE would NOT allow his 'fans' to be 'manipulated' by anyone who has their own agenda to fulfill AND who his 'fans' believe is/are speaking for Mike....when, in actuality, they are NOT speaking for Mike. I just don't see that happening.
In fact, Mike would've been able to put an 'end' to Back, TS, or Front at ANY time...simply by having a family member 'tweet' about the 'dangers' of listening to, or 'following', any of these 'screen-names' IF they were 'fake' or NOT speaking for Mike. But instead, we've had several instances where the family SUPPORTED posts/statements by TS and Front...yet another very important 'bullet-point' in the list of reasons to believe that whoever Back, TS and Front are...they are 'legit'.
But again..I do respect your opinion and you are a prime example of how ANYONE can disagree or raise/have a different perspective WITHOUT being rude, condescending, or hateful. Thank you for that bearhug
With L.O.V.E. always.
I have a question about TS. I remember when we began here originally in the forum and S.T.U.D.Y. appeared. There was research done and didn't we decide whoever it was seemed to be a "preacher" with the name Tim S something? Then once we began talking about that, he stopped the semi religious talk, and we got down to serious investigating business. Then the name changed...who knows if it's the same person or not..as Study, back, front, ts or ts_comments, tiai.... but, he's back to the religious stuff. True purpose is coming back. I waited a long time, but I knew it would.
I really miss hearing and learning about Michael. I get the religion elsewhere.
Sarahli, after looking at your post, I also remember an interview with Jermaine. I don't remember who it was with but it was years ago. I remember Jermaine saying something like "If Michael is Moses, then I'm Aron".
Well I didn't really think about it back then, but now that I'm thinking "Back", he probably said that for a reason!?
I think we have enough "proof" about Michael being alive and about who is authentic and who is fake. Well, I can't speak for everyone, but I have enough for myself. If you think you have enough proof, Then let's concentrate on spreading his messages.
Sarahli, after looking at your post, I also remember an interview with Jermaine. I don't remember who it was with but it was years ago. I remember Jermaine saying something like "If Michael is Moses, then I'm Aron".
Well I didn't really think about it back then, but now that I'm thinking "Back", he probably said that for a reason!?
I think we have enough "proof" about Michael being alive and about who is authentic and who is fake. Well, I can't speak for everyone, but I have enough for myself. If you think you have enough proof, Then let's concentrate on spreading his messages.
That is very interesting Dontwalkaway because Moses "suffered" from a speech impediment (Ex. 4:10) so Aaron acted as his mouthpiece. YHWH would relay information to Moses, Moses would tell Aaron, then Aaron would tell the Israelites. (Ex. 4:16)
This is scary.
This redirect is another connection between TS and Front. WTF?? is going on here??
ps: the scary thing is they seem very different but IF they are one and the same person I really have to think about how a person can display 2 completely different personalities....well at least 2 that we are aware of.
This is scary.
This redirect is another connection between TS and Front. WTF?? is going on here??
ps: the scary thing is they seem very different but IF they are one and the same person I really have to think about how a person can display 2 completely different personalities....well at least 2 that we are aware of.
That's the million dollar question, isn't it? I think there are many false personalities on here. I suppose it would be like acting where you get into character. The BILLION dollar question, then is why? But I don't think we are supposed to question, because then we are just the "haters" and "mean girls". So I guess we just go with the flow......
This is scary.
This redirect is another connection between TS and Front. WTF?? is going on here??
ps: the scary thing is they seem very different but IF they are one and the same person I really have to think about how a person can display 2 completely different personalities....well at least 2 that we are aware of.
This is scary.
This redirect is another connection between TS and Front. WTF?? is going on here??
ps: the scary thing is they seem very different but IF they are one and the same person I really have to think about how a person can display 2 completely different personalities....well at least 2 that we are aware of.
That's the million dollar question, isn't it? I think there are many false personalities on here. I suppose it would be like acting where you get into character. The BILLION dollar question, then is why? But I don't think we are supposed to question, because then we are just the "haters" and "mean girls". So I guess we just go with the flow......
I'm thinking about Michael, if he is doing this....you think he could do this?
We know he acted a lot in his life and played different roles so maybe it is really Michael playing with us. Lisa said he is a manipulator, but how do we know Lisa is right?
This gives me headaches.
I don't think it's scary or surprising if you consider Back/Front's personality on the forum and MJ's personality in public as WE know him. And then other people who knew him personally have said in interviews that he's nothing like his public persona. We are always saying "MJ wouldn't do this or that" but we don't know what he would or would not do.
Also, Michael is a genius, child-like, businessman, loving and caring man, etc., so I do not see why it wouldn’t transpire in the “characters” he would place as messengers/informers. I love both TS and Front’s “aura” as they both for me reflect a part/side of Michael.
It's also very possible that TS and Front are NOT the same person, but they are definitely on the same team. I think Back=Front=MJ … and it can also be that TS=MJ's messenger/right-hand man.
And yes TS and Front's writing styles are different but we all know MJ has many sides (Top, Side, Back, Front LOL)...and a lot of people think they are all the same person. Who knows! It's part of the mystery fun! /woohoo/
@ anewfan, well Michael IS an amazing actor.
@ Gina, I think MJ knew EXACTLY how to manipulate people especially the media when and if necessary.
This is scary.
This redirect is another connection between TS and Front. WTF?? is going on here??
ps: the scary thing is they seem very different but IF they are one and the same person I really have to think about how a person can display 2 completely different personalities....well at least 2 that we are aware of.
That's the million dollar question, isn't it? I think there are many false personalities on here. I suppose it would be like acting where you get into character. The BILLION dollar question, then is why? But I don't think we are supposed to question, because then we are just the "haters" and "mean girls". So I guess we just go with the flow......
This is scary.
This redirect is another connection between TS and Front. WTF?? is going on here??
ps: the scary thing is they seem very different but IF they are one and the same person I really have to think about how a person can display 2 completely different personalities....well at least 2 that we are aware of.
That's the million dollar question, isn't it? I think there are many false personalities on here. I suppose it would be like acting where you get into character. The BILLION dollar question, then is why? But I don't think we are supposed to question, because then we are just the "haters" and "mean girls". So I guess we just go with the flow......
Music video by Michael Jackson performing Leave Me Alone. (C) 1987 MJJ Productions Inc.
All of these are fantastic links to do with this re-direct
http://vimeo.com/33439742 (http://vimeo.com/33439742)
http://www.arkdiscovery.com/index2.htm
http://www.youtube.com/sygnate
As far as I'm concerned back=Front=TS=Michael, but it doesn't matter, really. He's not telling all the deep dark secrets of the hoax, he's just laid out a game board, or map for us to play in. It's like GTA or Dead Rising with a giant world you are turned loose in and you can pick up the controller and go play as you please. You can follow the story line and do the missions, or you can just go smash stuff and explore; your choice and it's all ok. It's not the kind of game where if you ignore the prompts and fail to find the zombrex in time it's Game Over. Nah, you just won't find the nifty deep, dark, hidden easter eggs n bonus items but you can play on to your heart's content. Well actually you might just by chance find some cool shit because you could easily just be wandering around seeing what there is to see, and stumble upon a laser sword, that really you shouldn't be directed to until Alfred thanks you for saving his wife and leads you to the secret passageway behind the stairs that unlocks the next boss cut scene... or whatever, that's gamer talk, but you get the idea.
This Is ARG [on steriods]. Your mileage may vary, your gamer experience is the one you chose and customize yourself.
Now if MJ wanted an ARMY to go save the world from the evil, shadowy, vague, obscure entity, The Illuminati, would he not make his boundaries very strict and rigid? Think military, everyone must fall in line and learn the skills required for the mission. There is no room for individuality or exceptions because an army must move and function cohesively as a unit. What we are doing is VERY different from that, so different it is the polar opposite.
Ps. Anewfan, why did you bother posting if you feel so excluded. You know, it's obvious you want in very badly, else you wouldn't care if you were feeling excluded. The KKK excludes me from their club but I really could give a shit so the thought never even crosses my mind. You, on the other hand, just can't seem to stay away. What is it that intrigues you so much that you can't get TIAI and Front out of your head? Is it because your instincts tell you exactly what so many of us KNOW to be the truth? It almost has to be that, why else would you be so seemingly obsessed (like we are)?
To Gina-Do you have different persona's in your life? Like one role is mom, another is wife, another is worker, another one is (maybe) when around in-laws or friends. The point is we all have different personalities; so why is it such a big deal if TS and Front seem different?
The acting part comes natural to some people, it may also be called role play. This is still an ARG and we still have more to figure out before this is over. My name certainly is not Im_convincedmjalive out in the world off the net. My roleplay name is that. You all have a name you go by thus being a different persona. I think TS/Front should have the same rights we do while we are cruisin down the hoax lane.
My comment was meant for the haters who seem to pop up out of the blue, they make one post and it usually is a rant about someone being fake, (TS/Front) or the fake fans who wait in the cut to see when they can strike.
I honestly don't see someone(s) being so utterly dedicated to "fooling" a very small group of people on the internet.
But the story goes even further, that GOD caused the death of the first born male in every household... children... GOD did this. Not just condoned but CAUSED.
Bah. Doesn't matter. Just sayin'.
My comment was meant for the haters who seem to pop up out of the blue, they make one post and it usually is a rant about someone being fake, (TS/Front) or the fake fans who wait in the cut to see when they can strike.
@ IMCONVINCED, wonderful post again! regarding your comment above... oh yes, though only 4.5 months old here i know the type you are reffering to already... they are the ones who start off by saying "I have been reading here since the beginning, just made a profile now" and "I just wanted to say...." (they then put their *new* nose into a controversial discussion or back up someone who they side with)
But the story goes even further, that GOD caused the death of the first born male in every household... children... GOD did this. Not just condoned but CAUSED.
Bah. Doesn't matter. Just sayin'.
That's why I don't believe in the biblical God. I believe in God, with all my heart, but not as he's described in parts of the bible.
Why would god drown all those soldiers who are just following orders? And their poor horses? The horses are certainly innocents even if some argument could be made against the soldiers. Why would god send all those poor horses to such a horrifying death? Surely with all of gods power there was some other way of protecting the Israelites that didn't involve so much death of innocents.
But the story goes even further, that GOD caused the death of the first born male in every household... children... GOD did this. Not just condoned but CAUSED.
Bah. Doesn't matter. Just sayin'.
Horrible.
And this is reason #673259734608762 why I am an atheist.
MOSES | JESUS | |
1. | Order by King of Egypt to kill baby sons of Israelites Exodus 1:15,16,22 | Order by King Herod to kill young children Matthew 2:16 |
2. | Birth of Moses Exodus 2:1,2 | Birth of Jesus Christ Matthew 2:1-3 |
3. | Hiding of baby son Moses Exodus 2:2-5 | Hiding of baby son Jesus Matthew 2:13-15 |
4. | Moses was an Israelite Exodus 2:6 | Jesus was an Israelite (John 4:22 |
5. | King (Pharaoh) dies Exodus 2:23 | King (Herod) dies Matthew 2:19 |
6. | Moses was faithful Numbers 12:6-8 | Jesus was faithful 1 Corinthians 10:23; Heb 2:17,18; Rev 1:5 |
7. | Moses was kind (Num12:3) | Jesus was kind Heb 14:18 |
8. | Moses led people out of Egyptian slavery Exodus 12:31,42; 13:3; Hebrews 3:16 | Jesus led people out of slavery of sin John 8:34-37; 1 John 3:8; Romans 6:13-20 |
9. | Moses led Israel out on first of Abib Ex 13:3,4; 16;1-3,6; 12:2,6; 34:18 | Jesus led spiritual Israel out on first of Abib Matt 26:17-27; Mrk 14:1-26 |
10. | Moses and manna in the desert Exodus 17:5,6 | Jesus and spiritual manna in desert Mark 6:34-44; 8:3-8 |
11. | Moses and water in the desert Exodus 17:5,6 | Jesus and spiritual water in the spiritual desert John 7:37-39 |
This is scary.
This redirect is another connection between TS and Front. WTF?? is going on here??
ps: the scary thing is they seem very different but IF they are one and the same person I really have to think about how a person can display 2 completely different personalities....well at least 2 that we are aware of.
This is scary.
This redirect is another connection between TS and Front. WTF?? is going on here??
ps: the scary thing is they seem very different but IF they are one and the same person I really have to think about how a person can display 2 completely different personalities....well at least 2 that we are aware of.
2 different personalities? I don't think so. From the start I thought that TS is Front. I see no difference btw the personalities.
Yes I know, I felt the same to at the beginning.This is scary.
This redirect is another connection between TS and Front. WTF?? is going on here??
ps: the scary thing is they seem very different but IF they are one and the same person I really have to think about how a person can display 2 completely different personalities....well at least 2 that we are aware of.
2 different personalities? I don't think so. From the start I thought that TS is Front. I see no difference btw the personalities.
The thing is - if TS and Front are one and the same person - what is the reason for 2 sides - I mean TS "side" is logical, religious and serious, while Front is mostly a joker who likes to play.Well....Doesn´t that remind you of someone.....?! :) ;D
LOL but what if it is MADE to look like it's Michael Joker Jackson?The thing is - if TS and Front are one and the same person - what is the reason for 2 sides - I mean TS "side" is logical, religious and serious, while Front is mostly a joker who likes to play.Well....Doesn´t that remind you of someone.....?! :) ;D
I am not only talking about the "joker" aspect.....talking about logic, seriousness, discipline, religiousness, business sense, eloquence, entertainment skills AND of course silliness and fun-loving side sometimes .....all of them...in one respect/LOL but what if it is MADE to look like it's Michael Joker Jackson?The thing is - if TS and Front are one and the same person - what is the reason for 2 sides - I mean TS "side" is logical, religious and serious, while Front is mostly a joker who likes to play.Well....Doesn´t that remind you of someone.....?! :) ;D
Isn't it 'freaky' how these 'religious' discussions mirror the 'bigger picture' of the hoax? It's ALL already written.
Dontwalkaway
January 08, 2012, 02:00:50 AM »
Wow, Great Videos Applehead and 2Good2beTrue. Thank you for posting them. I want to see the film "The Exodus Conspiracy when it comes out. It looks very very interesting and so does the work from Wyatt the archeologist. I learned a lot from reading about the death hoax but this religion/history part is my favorite part.
We need to do this part because if we are really going to "Heal The World", we need the truth about everything including history/religion. A lot of "truth's have been hidden/manipulated for power and control and money. This is just another area where "the lie becomes the truth". In the video above they said "Wyatt was arrested when he went to certain areas to find the truth". He was following the bible. The other archaelogists were digging in other places, not even mentioned in the bible.
It is extremely difficult to find and spread the truth so that is why we have to do it. I think that is one of the main reasons for the death hoax.
lyrics from Michael that come to my mind right now, "you got the people confused, you tell the stories you choose" 8-) /bravo/
Love you
I didn't realize there was an Exodus conspiracy or a conspiracy regarding the ark until now. Did all of you ?
have been away for a day or so - have started a new job yesterday, so my total, limitless forum freedom bubble has finally burst! :-(CONGRATULATIONS on the new job!!!! I'm happy for you and miss you.
some brilliant posts here.... havent had time to make comment. but am reading all posts in this thread.
many are great, just quickly want to mention, Be the change. enjoyed your post. also white night, have not had the pleasure of getting to know you yet. but that was a great post.
Wow.....I finally get back to this thread and I am once again over-whelmed by the brilliance here. BeTheChange.....amazing thoughts and post. I remember reading about "spiritual beings" here on forum some months ago. What was new in that for me was that we choose this life.....really fascinating. I wonder if that plays into the feeling of deja vu? I experience deja vu quite a bit....it's really odd. The whole "Why would God allow....." question has always been a great question. Indeed, I can honestly say I have had times where I was just pissed off at God....really pissed off. Understanding life's journey takes time and patience. I have come to know that fully.....there is no rushing God for what you think you want in life. God is everywhere, in everything....omnipresent always. What I think I want is usually the wrong thing....God must have field days with me, lol. I have also come to learn He has a sense of humor.....I truly believe that. Although, at times His humor isn't that funny to me because I made the wrong choice....again. We are truly children....His children. As children, we really don't know what's best.....that's where faith has to come in for me. Most of the time, I feel totally lost in the world....I don't understand how people can treat people so poorly, so I feel lost. The world is really small....on God's scale. Our freedom of choice has caused millenniums of pain for the human race. True, we have come so far with technology (medicine, electricity, computers......the list is huge)...however, I have always felt there is so much more to go with our human spirit, our hearts, our souls. When there is so much violence in the world, something is wrong. We were not made for hate. We were made for love. Why can't people understand this? Is it God's fault...not hardly. It's that free choice, the freedom to know right from wrong.
MJonmind.......nail on the head! Great post in so many ways.......free choice was God's will for us......and look what it's done? Violence and destruction everywhere in the world. It's also brought about change in good ways....passion, love and knowledge have opened doorways to areas in life untouchable in the past. Everything is a balance, everything is relative when you talk about God. I know I fail more than I succeed in life. However, I believe what really matters to God is how many times you get back up after you fail......do you still have faith in yourself? Without faith in yourself, how can you have faith in anything, God included.
Perhaps that's part of the reasoning for all the light being shed on The Exodus....it's a prime example of how believing in yourself gets you through. It's been a long, hard journey...this hoax. We have faith that Michael is alive, yet no solid, absolute proof. It's like crossing the Red Sea daily. We are either going to make to the other side, or get swallowed up by doubt and tabloid headlines. I keep crossing that Red Sea of faith....so far, so good.
I also find it interesting that one year ago, the Jan 7th redirect was a TMZ article about the timeline of death:
http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=17100.0
I try to always compare the old with the new....
@applehead.......he was in Ireland and London in 2006, am I close suspicious//
Blessing to you all..........
LOVE
I personally don’t get the feeling that they are the same people, but that both (all) are getting instruction from the same person. The same message, but with a slightly different delivery. No matter the messenger, the message appears to be the same, and it seems to be pointing towards who is prepared to be loyal and , trustworthy enough to follow by blind faith. Do we believe that Michael is at the helm? Do we believe that he is sanctioning these directs towards the awakening we were promised? Or do we believe that we are being led into a web of deceit? Are these real clues or are we being fed riddles and lies? It’s up to us to decide. Us.
Humans by our very nature are hard pressed to believe that which we cannot see or touch. We don’t trust easily and our faith is constantly being tested. Maybe this is our test in Michael’s hoax. I confess that I am not ready to say with 100% certainty that any poster on this forum is Michael Jackson. But what I will say is that I can see some of Michael in many of the post they have made. And since it is my sincere belief that Michael Jackson is indeed alive not only from the TIAI directs but from a whole plethora of other undisputable facts uncovered since 6/26/09, I intend to be right here waiting when he returns. Michael loves his fans. He would not want them to worry incessantly and would want to reassure them as best he could that he is still okay. How better than on a forum where people have proven their allegiance to him, know he has a plan and are waiting and rallying his return? I believe that if he is following and communicating with any forum on the net, this one would be it. Therefore, it would not be out of the norm for him to have one or two trusted persons to impart encrypted information that those who have studied would recognize.
what do you mean?I personally don’t get the feeling that they are the same people, but that both (all) are getting instruction from the same person. The same message, but with a slightly different delivery. No matter the messenger, the message appears to be the same, and it seems to be pointing towards who is prepared to be loyal and , trustworthy enough to follow by blind faith. Do we believe that Michael is at the helm? Do we believe that he is sanctioning these directs towards the awakening we were promised? Or do we believe that we are being led into a web of deceit? Are these real clues or are we being fed riddles and lies? It’s up to us to decide. Us.
Humans by our very nature are hard pressed to believe that which we cannot see or touch. We don’t trust easily and our faith is constantly being tested. Maybe this is our test in Michael’s hoax. I confess that I am not ready to say with 100% certainty that any poster on this forum is Michael Jackson. But what I will say is that I can see some of Michael in many of the post they have made. And since it is my sincere belief that Michael Jackson is indeed alive not only from the TIAI directs but from a whole plethora of other undisputable facts uncovered since 6/26/09, I intend to be right here waiting when he returns. Michael loves his fans. He would not want them to worry incessantly and would want to reassure them as best he could that he is still okay. How better than on a forum where people have proven their allegiance to him, know he has a plan and are waiting and rallying his return? I believe that if he is following and communicating with any forum on the net, this one would be it. Therefore, it would not be out of the norm for him to have one or two trusted persons to impart encrypted information that those who have studied would recognize.
Don't forget about the psychos party/ . ok?
have been away for a day or so - have started a new job yesterday, so my total, limitless forum freedom bubble has finally burst! :-(
some brilliant posts here.... havent had time to make comment. but am reading all posts in this thread.
many are great, just quickly want to mention, Be the change. enjoyed your post. also white night, have not had the pleasure of getting to know you yet. but that was a great post.
what do you mean?I personally don’t get the feeling that they are the same people, but that both (all) are getting instruction from the same person. The same message, but with a slightly different delivery. No matter the messenger, the message appears to be the same, and it seems to be pointing towards who is prepared to be loyal and , trustworthy enough to follow by blind faith. Do we believe that Michael is at the helm? Do we believe that he is sanctioning these directs towards the awakening we were promised? Or do we believe that we are being led into a web of deceit? Are these real clues or are we being fed riddles and lies? It’s up to us to decide. Us.
Humans by our very nature are hard pressed to believe that which we cannot see or touch. We don’t trust easily and our faith is constantly being tested. Maybe this is our test in Michael’s hoax. I confess that I am not ready to say with 100% certainty that any poster on this forum is Michael Jackson. But what I will say is that I can see some of Michael in many of the post they have made. And since it is my sincere belief that Michael Jackson is indeed alive not only from the TIAI directs but from a whole plethora of other undisputable facts uncovered since 6/26/09, I intend to be right here waiting when he returns. Michael loves his fans. He would not want them to worry incessantly and would want to reassure them as best he could that he is still okay. How better than on a forum where people have proven their allegiance to him, know he has a plan and are waiting and rallying his return? I believe that if he is following and communicating with any forum on the net, this one would be it. Therefore, it would not be out of the norm for him to have one or two trusted persons to impart encrypted information that those who have studied would recognize.
Don't forget about the psychos party/ . ok?
Hello again ! This is for the ones that do NOT believe the ''informers'' are the same people..
Guys , details are the key. Many try to change their writing style , also some don't even bother..
Don't let yourself fooled by any smart one , okay ? In a couple of year probably things will ''calm down''..hopefully!
And I regret disappointing some of you but the psychos DO exist, you like it or not.
Sit back and think how many informers were around 'till now..but of course y'all are free to believe it or not.
The ones that (could) know something don't need 15mins (or 2-3 year ,yeah)of fame..and most important face the fact that there are TOO many of so called informers.
Anyway I never used to post here (especially on the ''page'' of TIAI WTF?? )..just take care and for any smart one don't worry the truth will prevail beerchug .
P.S.: Dear staff ..have you heard of ''IMMORTAL'' album ? :-) just sayin'... bearhug
Ever heard of GTFO? I am sick and tired of the same 'debunkers' coming back time and time again with a lot of mumble jumble, and none of them has any proof, only ridicule and attacks, ASSumptions and false allegations. I will boot every single 'new' user that pops up with the same nonsense. Go bore someone else please.
Would any self-respecting and sane individual really spend so much time devoted to a subject that they claim to have no use for or despise?
[....]LMAO (http://smileys.sur-la-toile.com/repository/Rires/haha-rire-395.gif)(http://smileys.sur-la-toile.com/repository/Rires/haha-rire-395.gif) I loved to read everything in this topic [except the "I am concerned about those who trust in insiders"-posts], and this "boot" just made me explode (http://smileys.sur-la-toile.com/repository/Rires/haha-rire-395.gif)you even assorted it to the forum colors! hahahaaaa (http://smileys.sur-la-toile.com/repository/Rires/haha-rire-395.gif)
Say Hello to Souza's Boot... 8-)
(http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r303/SCLady8/HOAX/ChristianLouboutinFifreSuedeAnkleBootsOrange.jpg) [/color][/size]
Would any self-respecting and sane individual really spend so much time devoted to a subject that they claim to have no use for or despise?
Just for the record - I'm just guessing, but I am probably included in your ASSumptions - I never said I have no use for all this or despise it. I said several times that I find certain things entertaining and/or interesting for several reasons that I won't list right now.
And if I ever come to a point in my life where I'm not interested in other people's opinions anymore, especially when they differ from mine, if I ever get that close minded, I'd probably shoot myself out of boredom.
It's not just about the time ... I'm not all that interested in TS.http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=5167.msg382238#msg382238
The miraculous story of parting the Red Sea is told in the Book of Exodus 13:17-14:29. It's also mentioned in the Qur'an (Surah 26: Al-Shu'ara, verses 60-67).
It's not a matter of opinion? Not on this forum, because there is only one opinion allowed[...][...]If only one opinion had been allowed, then you should have been banned from the very first message where you said you disagree with general opinion here.
It's not a matter of opinion? Not on this forum, because there is only one opinion allowed, so as far as this tiny part of the world or internet goes, you are right.
Also, if I'm not all that interested in TS, that doesn't mean I'm not interested in discussions and certain posts in all kinds of threads here. Or that I'm not entertained by them. TS is not the only poster on this forum or in his threads.
I find it strange: you see, I put myself in your shoes. So I tried to imagine how would it be if I went to the non-believers forums, who mourn MJ's death and shout "JUSTICE for MJ", "Death to C Murray" at every 2 words. How would it be if I went to "express my opinion" there? lol I can't even picture myself in that position! I wouldn't even waste my time to register on a forum like that. First of all because I respect their opinion as it is and I accept the fact that they really think different!
I was never THAT "worried and concerned" for the MJ- mourners forums, not as much as to go there and insist as much as you do here. I would never go there and try so hard to show them how "worried I am for their well being" or to demonstrate to them how "manipulated they are!" or just to repeat a hundred times: "I have the right to an opinion!" and then complain: "Don't attack me because I have a different opinion!" it's rather ridiculous and useless, really! I never needed to go exercise "my right to an opinion" on Mj-mourners forums!
And while I'm at it, opinions are 'allowed', but as in life away from the computer screen, common courtesy, politeness, respect and thoughfulness are the tools with which they will be welcomed and listened to.
If only one opinion had been allowed, then you should have been banned from the very first message where you said you disagree with general opinion here.
I find it strange: you see, I put myself in your shoes. So I tried to imagine how would it be if I went to the non-believers forums, who mourn MJ's death and shout "JUSTICE for MJ", "Death to C Murray" at every 2 words. How would it be if I went to "express my opinion" there? lol I can't even picture myself in that position! I wouldn't even waste my time to register on a forum like that. First of all because I respect their opinion as it is and I accept the fact that they really think different!
To say that you are "entertained" by reading conflicting discussions, is not really a nice attitude, sarah31
It's not a matter of opinion? Not on this forum, because there is only one opinion allowed, so as far as this tiny part of the world or internet goes, you are right.
Also, if I'm not all that interested in TS, that doesn't mean I'm not interested in discussions and certain posts in all kinds of threads here. Or that I'm not entertained by them. TS is not the only poster on this forum or in his threads.
The fact that you are still here, posting and posting is a proof in itself that you were not banned for having "expressed a different opinion", but most probably for some other reason, which becomes clearer to me the more I read you!If only one opinion had been allowed, then you should have been banned from the very first message where you said you disagree with general opinion here.I was banned for a couple of days a while back.
This was not even the point of the paragraph that you quoted above^^I find it strange: you see, I put myself in your shoes. So I tried to imagine how would it be if I went to the non-believers forums, who mourn MJ's death and shout "JUSTICE for MJ", "Death to C Murray" at every 2 words. How would it be if I went to "express my opinion" there? lol I can't even picture myself in that position! I wouldn't even waste my time to register on a forum like that. First of all because I respect their opinion as it is and I accept the fact that they really think different!I guess you haven't seen how much they are bashed on here sometimes?
I'm here to find the truth and I know I came pretty close.Well then I am truly happy for you. You should have found that beloved interior peace. But still something in you contradicts your words with your actions.
Yeah, really. In my opinion, those people, just like you, missed the true scope of the hoax which is clearly not "just for entertainment".To say that you are "entertained" by reading conflicting discussions, is not really a nice attitude, sarah31Oh, really? Then what's with the people who are saying that he hoaxed his death just or mostly for entertainment?
So being entertained is a bad thing?Yes, when you say it as ironically as you do.
Did you ever read bec's signature?Yes, actually I did read it and I think it refers to what I explained above ^^
This was not even the point of the paragraph that you quoted above^^I find it strange: you see, I put myself in your shoes. So I tried to imagine how would it be if I went to the non-believers forums, who mourn MJ's death and shout "JUSTICE for MJ", "Death to C Murray" at every 2 words. How would it be if I went to "express my opinion" there? lol I can't even picture myself in that position! I wouldn't even waste my time to register on a forum like that. First of all because I respect their opinion as it is and I accept the fact that they really think different!
I guess you haven't seen how much they are bashed on here sometimes?
Metamorphman, I guess you're happy you're getting all this attention!
I don't understand why you hang around here, if you don't like the results of our digging/thinking. Goodbye and good luck!
It's not even so much that you disagree with TS/Front being Michael, but it's your patronizing tone like you're so smart and we're so dumb. So no question you're just another common garden-variety 'shit-stirrer'.
Souza, you and Bec are just the best for keeping the forum pest-free! /bravo/
(we can all be pests sometimes ::P to someone in our lives)
This is beLIEver's turf, so naturally we will defend it against empty-handed naysayers. What gets me is their arguments against TS/Front are ones we have thoroughly hashed over so LONG ago, and mostly resolved. However if they want to be helpful, why not bring helpful discussion in a more forward approach, into new 'frontiers'. Be on the cutting edge, rather than a dragging foot slowing progress.
Love the boot Love4Michael! Classy too! :lol:
Badria, thank you for posting those sites! I've put them on my 'to read' list. I've come across the comparison of Muhammad and Moses before. My knowledge of Islam is very limited though I have done a little study and read portions of the Koran. TS made reference to the Exodus story in the Koran, but other than that he has focused on the Bible which is why I've not needed to learn more, at least for now.
Edit: It was Front, not TS--same person IMO :lol:QuoteThe miraculous story of parting the Red Sea is told in the Book of Exodus 13:17-14:29. It's also mentioned in the Qur'an (Surah 26: Al-Shu'ara, verses 60-67).
AustralianBeLIEverMJ, and Fordtocarr, congrats on the new jobs, and I hope you still manage some time for the forum!
Thank YOU!!!!! (While waiting for the job to start, I get another interview...now I have decisions to make :) NICE :)
For the ones engaging with me on the topic or freewill or not, I hope we're still friends at the end of the day. We have so much more in common than not. We are so complex as humans, and the number of separate beliefs we have about various things numbers in the hundreds, maybe thousands. Mathematically thats a lot of combinations possible! I may be very much the minority in my belief of no free will, but that's okay with me, since I've always been a bit weird. geek/
I do love you all!
bearhug
[...]I think how you are feeling is tooooooo bad. I also think is one reason why we've lose members over time...or some have not posted as much as others. If you don't follow a certain belief or thought or present a different view...you are deleted...condemned...ideas dismissed.Please don't fall into her tactics. I also felt sorry for her , few days ago when I first addressed to her. I really thought she was here with good intentions, to learn and understand things, to find truth. You can search the messages in the topic that was closed.
[...]
Pls allow me to use this new smiley for all of us to these so called "new" attackers.
*FU*
That smiley was not big enough for you? Then EAT THIS!
(http://patchstop.com/images/products/large_1028_PGS8238_-_Fuck_You_Middle_Finger_Hands.jpg)
Ever heard of GTFO? I am sick and tired of the same 'debunkers' coming back time and time again with a lot of mumble jumble, and none of them has any proof, only ridicule and attacks, ASSumptions and false allegations. I will boot every single 'new' user that pops up with the same nonsense. Go bore someone else please.
Souza...that part made me LOL for real. :lol: Thanks...it was much needed.
To me it becomes more apparent over time that what these instigators REALLY must be is closeted, frightened and/or frustrated beLIEvers. Would any self-respecting and sane individual really spend so much time devoted to a subject that they claim to have no use for or despise? So which is it...hmm? No self-respect?...Not totally sane?...Closet beLIEver?...Or the most likely scenario...they crave attention that must not be afforded to them in their daily lives and are stumped to think of a more original way of getting it. How sad for them under any of those circumstances. :cry:
Note to future pot-stirrers (because unfortunately they will come): Better bring your A game with some FACTS if you want to sling your brand of "knowledge" here. Halfa$$ed innuendo, empty accusations and your broadly generalized negative BS ain't gonna get you anything here but the door!!!
Say Hello to Souza's Boot... 8-)
(http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r303/SCLady8/HOAX/ChristianLouboutinFifreSuedeAnkleBootsOrange.jpg)
What is it that intrigues you so much that you can't get TIAI and Front out of your head? Is it because your instincts tell you exactly what so many of us KNOW to be the truth? It almost has to be that, why else would you be so seemingly obsessed (like we are)?
No you're obsessed with TIAI and Front, which is why you read these threads to be able to reply to anyone at all. Obsessed. Same as we are. Admit it.
Either that or you're obsessed with creating drama. I'd like to think it's not that.
(http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i14/AUBURN_MYSTIQUE/Cartoons_Comics_Smart%20Arse%20Humor/woflinsheepsclothing.jpg)
With L.O.V.E. always.
have been away for a day or so - have started a new job yesterday, so my total, limitless forum freedom bubble has finally burst! :-(CONGRATULATIONS on the new job!!!! I'm happy for you and miss you.
some brilliant posts here.... havent had time to make comment. but am reading all posts in this thread.
many are great, just quickly want to mention, Be the change. enjoyed your post. also white night, have not had the pleasure of getting to know you yet. but that was a great post.
I know what you mean about losing the freedom to sit on the forum..I'm waiting for
my new job start date. Its' scary to think I may be working when Michael returns and
I'll MISS IT!!! After all these years of waiting.
We'll try to keep in touch though sister!
What I fail to understand is this>>> If people feel like they are being played, WTF are they still hanging around here for? I’m sorry for saying something so vulgar and I know I never say anything about this but…damn! Why do we always have to keep spinning our wheels and going back to the same damn shit OVER AND OVER again by constantly reiterating what has already been proven!? WTF!!!! If you don’t believe, you don’t belong!!! That’s the bottom line! And if people want to bitch about these things, then they should make another thread and keep that stuff off of the redirect threads. I don’t want to read rants and debates concerning whether TS and FRONT are legit or not. (edit)>>OR DEBATING ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE!(end of edit) It’s a distraction and a BIG waste of time! I want to read interesting research and stuff that has to do with the message and redirects damn it!!!!!