Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators
Hoax Investigation => General Hoax Investigation => Other Odd Things => Topic started by: bliss1712 on May 21, 2010, 02:26:51 AM
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Mike usually had 2-4 guards at any one time. On the night he "died" he had 13. They apparently appeared agitated on that night, and their behaviour was strange. Now this can mean 2 things:
1) They were preparing to make Mike disappear
2) Murder plot
I am leaning towards the first one quite heavily. He would need security guards for the hospital and security guards to help him to disappear....hence the increase in numbers!!
If this has been discussed before, please delete. However, it's always good to revisit things.
:D :D :D
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Mike usually had 2-4 guards at any one time. On the night he "died" he had 13. They apparently appeared agitated on that night, and their behaviour was strange. Now this can mean 2 things:
1) They were preparing to make Mike disappear
2) Murder plot
I am leaning towards the first one quite heavily. He would need security guards for the hospital and security guards to help him to disappear....hence the increase in numbers!!
If this has been discussed before, please delete. However, it's always good to revisit things.
:D :D :D
Hey bliss where exactly did you get this info. from? If it's true that he had this many security guards that night I would say option 1 also. It would take a lot of people to get him out safely and to pull off a hoax. If it were option 2 I would say there would be way less security because If someone was planning to murder him I don't think they would have that many people around. Sounds like MJ was being heavily protected to me which would be a good thing. I can't believe there would be 13 security guards involved with harming MJ. Maybe they were irritated or anxious because they had a great task ahead of them to pull off.
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Mike usually had 2-4 guards at any one time. On the night he "died" he had 13. They apparently appeared agitated on that night, and their behaviour was strange. Now this can mean 2 things:
1) They were preparing to make Mike disappear
2) Murder plot
I am leaning towards the first one quite heavily. He would need security guards for the hospital and security guards to help him to disappear....hence the increase in numbers!!
If this has been discussed before, please delete. However, it's always good to revisit things.
:D :D :D
Hey bliss where exactly did you get this info. from? If it's true that he had this many security guards that night I would say option 1 also. It would take a lot of people to get him out safely and to pull off a hoax. If it were option 2 I would say there would be way less security because If someone was planning to murder him I don't think they would have that many people around. Sounds like MJ was being heavily protected to me which would be a good thing. I can't believe there would be 13 security guards involved with harming MJ. Maybe they were irritated or anxious because they had a great task ahead of them to pull off.
This information came straight from Samantha Gosson on Facebook...she counted the guards on that night, as she was there......and another person who was there also noticed their strange behaviour....sums it up for me!!!! :D
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If they murdered him, they would not change the number of bodyguards from 4 to 13!!! They would act as always, calm and normal. 13 bodyguards in a murder case would cause attention...he must have faked his death though...the bodyguards thing is one of the best clues so far.
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I remember her saying that and I remember her saying they were not allowed near him that night. Makes sense to have the increased security for the escape. Makes it even stranger that it was increased on that particular night. A couple of the fans that followed him around during those days said the same thing.
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
Anything is possible I guess. But the news did show his family entering the home after his "death." And also the fans said they spoke to him outside the home. Or did they?? I firmy believe that MJ had all this planned, hence the increased security. And also, before he "died," he told the people at Dr Klein's clinic to think of him as "dead," and told Paris that he wouldn't be there for Father's Day. Either he had something terminally wrong with him and knew he was going to die, or he faked it!! I don't believe for one minute that he would take drugs in the same house as his kids.....he just wasn't like that. Unless of course we never really knew him after all :D
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
:?:
I have not heard that story before, could you please expand, do you have a link ;)
Perhaps senile dementia has crept in its been a long 11 months :lol:
Blessings
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
I 99% believe that too now. :D
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Mike always had a ton of people around him. How does Samantha know who was a BG and who wasnt? Just sayin..
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
:?:
I have not heard that story before, could you please expand, do you have a link ;)
Perhaps senile dementia has crept in its been a long 11 months :lol:
Blessings
I think the Christmas wreaths on the gates that house indicate the time of Mikes "departure". There was also mentioning of Christmas decorations in that house on June 25th.
The first reports of Mike renting this house appeared on December 22nd, 2008:
Michael Jackson's New Crib
Originally posted Dec 22nd 2008 8:26 AM PST by TMZ Staff
He's been teetering on the financial brink for years, yet we've learned somehow Michael Jackson has rented a home in one of the most exclusive areas of L.A. for a whopping $100,000 a month.
(http://ll-media.tmz.com/2008/12/22/1222_jacko_launch_2-1.jpg)
Click to see the pics: http://photos.tmz.com/galleries/michael ... ouseintaer (http://photos.tmz.com/galleries/michael_jacksons_new_houseintaer)
The $38 million Holmby Hils pad has seven bedrooms, 13 baths, 12 fireplaces, a screening room and, of course, a cellar for Jesus juice. For sleepovers, there's a guest house, swimming pool and garden.
The deal was inked several weeks ago under a heavy-duty confidentiality agreement. Michael already has stayed there.
Remember how only the guys from the National Photo Group were there on June 25th and everyone wondered how come there were no more paps there while an ambulance was called to Michael Jackson's house? The answer is quite simple - if this was all staged before December 22nd, no pap would have been alarmed when hearing this address, as they had no clue then that this was to be Michael Jackson's future address.
Also - Mike is not stupid, he KNEW the second talk about a come back tour would get out, there would be another attempt to take him down. If you know that people are after you, would you tell them exactly where you live...? I think not.
Souza and I have discussed this over and over again, but we think that IF we saw the real Mike throughout 2009 it was very rarely, mostly we saw doubles wearing mouth caps, scarfs and sunglasses.
Because of all the above, we think Mike left around Christmas 2008.
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"Because of all the above, we think Mike left around Christmas 2008."
Could this possibly prove why the Jackson family was so calm at the "memorial" :?:
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Mike usually had 2-4 guards at any one time. On the night he "died" he had 13. They apparently appeared agitated on that night, and their behaviour was strange. Now this can mean 2 things:
1) They were preparing to make Mike disappear
2) Murder plot
I am leaning towards the first one quite heavily. He would need security guards for the hospital and security guards to help him to disappear....hence the increase in numbers!!
If this has been discussed before, please delete. However, it's always good to revisit things.
:D :D :D
I read that and that always seemed to me strange ;)
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Mike always had a ton of people around him. How does Samantha know who was a BG and who wasnt? Just sayin..
true..it's hard to say who was a guard and who wasn't !
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
He did. My friend met him there in 2005, in front of the house's door. He was coming back from trial, and by the time, we were only few fans to know he lived there.
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
:?:
I have not heard that story before, could you please expand, do you have a link ;)
Perhaps senile dementia has crept in its been a long 11 months :lol:
Blessings
I think the Christmas wreaths on the gates that house indicate the time of Mikes "departure". There was also mentioning of Christmas decorations in that house on June 25th.
The first reports of Mike renting this house appeared on December 22nd, 2008:
Michael Jackson's New Crib
Originally posted Dec 22nd 2008 8:26 AM PST by TMZ Staff
He's been teetering on the financial brink for years, yet we've learned somehow Michael Jackson has rented a home in one of the most exclusive areas of L.A. for a whopping $100,000 a month.
(http://ll-media.tmz.com/2008/12/22/1222_jacko_launch_2-1.jpg)
Click to see the pics: http://photos.tmz.com/galleries/michael ... ouseintaer (http://photos.tmz.com/galleries/michael_jacksons_new_houseintaer)
The $38 million Holmby Hils pad has seven bedrooms, 13 baths, 12 fireplaces, a screening room and, of course, a cellar for Jesus juice. For sleepovers, there's a guest house, swimming pool and garden.
The deal was inked several weeks ago under a heavy-duty confidentiality agreement. Michael already has stayed there.
Remember how only the guys from the National Photo Group were there on June 25th and everyone wondered how come there were no more paps there while an ambulance was called to Michael Jackson's house? The answer is quite simple - if this was all staged before December 22nd, no pap would have been alarmed when hearing this address, as they had no clue then that this was to be Michael Jackson's future address.
Also - Mike is not stupid, he KNEW the second talk about a come back tour would get out, there would be another attempt to take him down. If you know that people are after you, would you tell them exactly where you live...? I think not.
Souza and I have discussed this over and over again, but we think that IF we saw the real Mike throughout 2009 it was very rarely, mostly we saw doubles wearing mouth caps, scarfs and sunglasses.
Because of all the above, we think Mike left around Christmas 2008.
I think you are both so right about this. So do you think the fans that got close and talked to him during this time were talking to doubles? Remember they were saying that Mike was telling them he needed to eat?
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
He did. My friend met him there in 2005, in front of the house's door. He was coming back from trial, and by the time, we were only few fans to know he lived there.
Mike didn't supposedly move into this house until December 22, 2008, so he wasn't living there in 2005 if he ever lived there. You might be thinking about Neverland Ranch possibly?
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I would Soooo laugh if Stalker Sam was stalking a double!!! :lol:
That would shut her up!!! ;)
I know, Me bad...... :D
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I was never that sure about doubles we all know he had impersonators but true doubles i always doubted but in the past few days i have to say i think i was very wrong and it was one the doubles there that night.
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
He lived there. I have a friend who went to see him there (like the fans did) and she saw him driving in
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
He lived there. I have a friend who went to see him there (like the fans did) and she saw him driving in
That, in my opinion, would have been a double. I'm sure Mike never lived there.
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
I also wondered why MJ had lived in rented? when he had a lot of money, even though I know that it was also a creditor, but MJ does own houses around the world in Africa, Bahrain, Ireland? I could ask, who lived in that house Carolwood... :roll:
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i´m starting to think like mo said, he never lived there... :roll:
in december so much things happen...
1-22 rented house
2-25 six month of life
3-contract with AEG
this are the most important... this was the beggining of the hoax, he never lived there, maybe the double who dead... i reallu think that someone died that day, the same who went to visit the doctor days before and the same who was at UCLA and the same who was on the coroner... that´s why the family never did a DNA test, they know is not him, but latoya have to say that was him. when he comes back latoya could say that the person looks like him but she didn´t notice that this person was not her brother or something like that... all FREE from charges... :roll:
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He lived there!!!
Look that is him after the rehearsals with Talitha
(http://www.spoton.de/files/spoton/leadimages/MJ_for_spoton.jpg)
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He lived there!!!
Look that is him after the rehearsals with Talitha
The fact that he (if this is indeed him, I didn't take a close look before hitting the reply button) was spotted there does NOT mean he LIVED there, period.
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You are not sure about it!!! You cannot say period. We can discuss this HERE!!! Saying he did not live there is STILL YOUR OPINION. WE ARE SEARCHING FOR EVIDENCE, THAT´S WHY WE ARE HERE!!!
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You are not sure about it!!! You cannot say period. We can discuss this HERE!!! IF HE DID NOT LIVE FOR YOUR OVER THERE THAN IT`S YOU OPINION. WE ARE SEARCHING FOR EVIDENCE, THAT´S WHY WE ARE HERE!!!
I said: The fact that he was spotted there does NOT mean he LIVED there, period. That is a fact. I would appreciate it if you actually read what I write, before you start yelling at me.
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You are not sure about it!!! You cannot say period. We can discuss this HERE!!! IF HE DID NOT LIVE FOR YOUR OVER THERE THAN IT`S YOU OPINION. WE ARE SEARCHING FOR EVIDENCE, THAT´S WHY WE ARE HERE!!!
I said: The fact that he was spotted there does NOT mean he LIVED there, period. That is a fact. I would appreciate it if you actually read what I write, before you start yelling at me.
I am not yelling at you!!! I used big letters cause you were typing bold letters. I read what you have written, I just don´t like it when someone is so insisting and using words like "period". I´m done!
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You are not sure about it!!! You cannot say period. We can discuss this HERE!!! IF HE DID NOT LIVE FOR YOUR OVER THERE THAN IT`S YOU OPINION. WE ARE SEARCHING FOR EVIDENCE, THAT´S WHY WE ARE HERE!!!
I said: The fact that he was spotted there does NOT mean he LIVED there, period. That is a fact. I would appreciate it if you actually read what I write, before you start yelling at me.
I am not yelling at you!!! I used big letters cause you were typing bold letters. I read what you have written, I just don´t like it when someone is so insisting and using words like "period". I´m done!
You wrote: "He lived there. I have a friend who went to see him there (like the fans did) and she saw him driving in". You base your opinion on Mike living there because he drove in. All I said was: "The fact that he was spotted there does NOT mean he LIVED there, period". There's nothing insisting about that, I just stated a fact.
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They also heard him playing with his kids! But ok it´s only my opinion. :D Hey I´m not going to discuss this any further... as I´ve told you before I´m done. ;)
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Was it really Mike during those days and the last night, or a double? I still sick to my believe that Mike never lived in the Carolwood Drive mansion.
He lived there. I have a friend who went to see him there (like the fans did) and she saw him driving in
That, in my opinion, would have been a double. I'm sure Mike never lived there.
Sorry Mo, I am going to disagree with you about the doubles. Michael does not have a twin, he only used doubles for misdirection of paps, large crowds and illusions on stage. He was the only one living his life. You can not be "sure" that he "never lived there" this is your speculation and is no different than mine that I am sure he lived there :lol:
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This is a funny debate because there shouldn't be a debate at all. :lol: I'm only saying that because no one knows whether he was living there or not or if he had a double or not so there is really nothing wrong with stating an opinion but I think the problem here is people are stating opinions as facts. In fact, these opinions can spur on more things to investigate, hence all the wonderful theories that are on here. 8-)
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yet my thoughts... so, if MJ had this plan, so of course MJ have had to go visiting in Carolwood mansion, though, would not even lived there... and also the children, as well as child care and other staff... if the house was like a "big stage"... and I understand he had many houses, so it was also certainly afford to pick where the resident. and knowing all the MJ-owned houses? if the recipes had another name, so can the ownership of houses bought by another name, too? :roll:
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This is a funny debate because there shouldn't be a debate at all. :lol: I'm only saying that because no one knows whether he was living there or not or if he had a double or not so there is really nothing wrong with stating an opinion but I think the problem here is people are stating opinions as facts. In fact, these opinions can spur on more things to investigate, hence all the wonderful theories that are on here. 8-)
In case you are talking about my posts in which I stated two different things in this thread:
1) It's my OPINION that Mike never lived there.
2) If a person drives in or pops up somewhere, that doesn't mean the person it living there. That is a FACT.
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This is a funny debate because there shouldn't be a debate at all. :lol: I'm only saying that because no one knows whether he was living there or not or if he had a double or not so there is really nothing wrong with stating an opinion but I think the problem here is people are stating opinions as facts. In fact, these opinions can spur on more things to investigate, hence all the wonderful theories that are on here. 8-)
In case you are talking about my posts in which I stated two different things in this thread:
1) It's my OPINION that Mike never lived there.
2) If a person drives in or pops up somewhere, that doesn't mean the person it living there. That is a FACT.
Mo,
I think you might have a point on MJ not living at Carolwood at that time.
This is the piece from Carrie Fisher blog post “Michael and me”. She, as I understand, spent 2008 Christmas with MJ and his kids. This particular piece from her blog seems quite odd:
I visited him over the Christmas holiday at that weirdly expensive rental home somewhere here in Southern Cal. What’s odd is that I see fans laying flowers in front of homes that I don’t think Michael ever lived in. But then this whole scene is odd.
http://carriefisher.com/?p=439 (http://carriefisher.com/?p=439)
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This is a funny debate because there shouldn't be a debate at all. :lol: I'm only saying that because no one knows whether he was living there or not or if he had a double or not so there is really nothing wrong with stating an opinion but I think the problem here is people are stating opinions as facts. In fact, these opinions can spur on more things to investigate, hence all the wonderful theories that are on here. 8-)
In case you are talking about my posts in which I stated two different things in this thread:
1) It's my OPINION that Mike never lived there.
2) If a person drives in or pops up somewhere, that doesn't mean the person it living there. That is a FACT.
Mo,
I think you might have a point on MJ not living at Carolwood at that time.
This is the piece from Carrie Fisher blog post “Michael and me”. She, as I understand, spent 2008 Christmas with MJ and his kids. This particular piece from her blog seems quite odd:
I visited him over the Christmas holiday at that weirdly expensive rental home somewhere here in Southern Cal. What’s odd is that I see fans laying flowers in front of homes that I don’t think Michael ever lived in. But then this whole scene is odd.
http://carriefisher.com/?p=439 (http://carriefisher.com/?p=439)
This excerpt does not convey that he did not live there to me at all. So let's break it down.
I visited him over the Christmas holiday
Substantiates that she is an intimate friend with close ties and has had at least some recent relationship with him. Validates what she has to say.
Also directs us to the photos of Christmas 2008 starring Carrie Fisher, Dr. Klein and Jason (I am the gay love of his life).
It then makes the holiday of Christmas significant.
at that weirdly expensive rental home somewhere here in Southern Cal.
The weirdly expensive home in Southern California that he was renting was the Carolwood Drive home. It was all over the media how much it was costing to rent that place, which seemed ridiculous as he could have purchased a home for the yearly rental fees. Question then is why was it so expensive?
Suggests that this was really a home he was residing in, inviting friends to spend Christmas with him at his home.
Also begs the question of how close was she really to him if she can't recall exactly where the home is..."somewhere in S. Cal"
What’s odd is that I see fans laying flowers in front of homes that I don’t think Michael ever lived in.
So fans are laying flowers at homes he never lived in? Which ones?
Or are we being directed as in...
Fans look to homes he HAS lived in for clues. So where has he lived: Encino Compound, Neverland, Carolwood, Las Vegas and Bahrain (if you know somewhere else add it). These are significant locations.
But then this whole scene is odd.
To me this just lets us know that yes something really isn't right with the "scene". The scene would be the Carolwood Home "Death Scene". So that wasn't right, it was wrong, it was staged maybe?
The Christmas decorations still be up, the references to Blanket liking Christmas and Carrie Fisher directing us to this holiday means that Christmas is significant. Many people including myself thought perhaps this was a bamsday. Since that didn't happen then Christmas must be significant for another reason.
So what does Christmas celebrate? The Birth of Jesus.
Why would that be significant to Michael Jackson?
Why would that be significant to the messages about 2012, Illuminati, NWO etc.?
Michael is alive but this may not be a "Death Hoax" as we perceive it. Things are marketed to appeal to a wider audience. Take movies for example how many times have you watched a trailer and assumed a movie was going to be a certain presentation, only to discover that it wasn't exactly as you thought it would be.
If you answered the above two questions honestly and truthfully to yourself maybe you already have all the answers and your role really is to spread the L.O.V.E. so he can reveal himself to the world.
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just sayin' that Carrie Fisher most likely does not know a thing. she was just invited for that Christmas dinner because the kids wanted to see Princess Leia in person, so Michael asked Arnie Klein to bring her over. we know how Michael's family loved Star Wars :) i think we can find no clues from what she says.
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just sayin' that Carrie Fisher most likely does not know a thing. she was just invited for that Christmas dinner because the kids wanted to see Princess Leia in person, so Michael asked Arnie Klein to bring her over. we know how Michael's family loved Star Wars :) i think we can find no clues from what she says.
I was friendly with Michael. I believe that he considered us to be friends.
I saw Michael multiple times with his children and thought that he was a very good father. Not only based on seeing him with his children, but also based on his children themselves. They are very well behaved, respectful children, who seemed content in Michael’s company. I mean, I doubt if Michael cooked for them or parented them in ways that might be considered conventional, but you could see how much he loved them and how much they loved him.
~ Carrie Fisher
So maybe she does have something to offer
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I wonder about the increase in bodyguards. I wondered as well
if they were really bodyguards.
Did Michael once hire county firemen and off-duty police officers for
bodyguards? Would be very convenient for the hoax.
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Mo, do you mean that he left the country in December 2008?
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Mike usually had 2-4 guards at any one time. On the night he "died" he had 13. They apparently appeared agitated on that night, and their behaviour was strange. Now this can mean 2 things:
1) They were preparing to make Mike disappear
2) Murder plot
I am leaning towards the first one quite heavily. He would need security guards for the hospital and security guards to help him to disappear....hence the increase in numbers!!
If this has been discussed before, please delete. However, it's always good to revisit things.
:D :D :D
I had brought this topic up months ago in relation to Samantha seeing (around midnight of 6/24) a lot of extra "bodyguards" at the back entrance when she was leaving. Did you ever stop to think this was the "Hit Team"? MJ was trying to weasel out of doing those concerts (there is huge thread on this site about this) and AEG had been financing MJ's life; including the $100,000 per month rent on Carrollwood (which Grace had discovered those mansions rent for around $16 - $18,000 per month - so some "middleman" was making about $80,000 per month profit! - Could it be Tohme?) MJ was already in debt to the tune of almost 500 million and they knew they would never recoup their investment if he bailed Out on them. DUH - Use your heads People!
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He lived there!!!
Look that is him after the rehearsals with Talitha
(http://www.spoton.de/files/spoton/leadimages/MJ_for_spoton.jpg)
MJ just looks so gorgeous ;) .
Here is Samatha testimony.
http://www.this-is-not-it.com/en/testim ... imony.html (http://www.this-is-not-it.com/en/testimonies/49-samanthas-testimony.html)
Samantha's testimony
Last Updated on Friday, 09 October 2009 20:14
Tuesday, 06 October 2009 16:24
I don’t know where to begin with my testimony. There is simply too much to say and so many feelings involved, feelings of sadness, regret, anger, confusion and helplessness. However, I need to share my story with the rest of you, for what it’s worth. It won’t bring Michael back and the vultures around him will keep fighting for whatever is left of him and his estate. This campaign we are putting together isn’t to try and stop the unstoppable, but to simply do Michael justice by telling who we can that he wasn’t well and that he DID reach out to us and that we owe him at least the truth by telling you what he told and showed us in th elast few weeks of his life. Whether he expressed his anguish and distress in words or in obvious physical and mental states, I believe (and I am not alone) that he was crying out for help and no-one around him came to his rescue, blinded by greed, fear, self-interest, disregard or even lack of compassion.
I have been a fan for over 20 years but only over the last 8 months of Michael’s life had I become what is called a “follower”. By that meaning I followed Michael on a regular if not daily basis. I got to see where he went and how he was and the people around him. I got to see his physical and mental state and how quickly things deteriorated in the last few weeks/months of his life. This is my recollection of the events preceding his death and how some of us, including myself, knew he was running out of time and was in great danger. We tried to intervene but we were too late.
In November 2008, Michael who was then staying at the Bel-Air hotel, met with a group of us outside and spoke to us for quite a while and he was kind enough to bring us food from his favorite restaurant which he had ordered for himself too that evening. He looked great and was very calm, very clear and lucid. There was obviously nothing “wrong” with him that evening. He spoke to us about many things and hinted at many projects coming up. At that time we had no idea that concerts were in the works. In the next few weeks Michael had many meetings at that hotel, meetings which now we know were about the Tour.
After the 02 concerts were announced in March, Michael began rehearsing at Center Staging between April and May. It is around that we started seeing a pattern in the increased visits to Dr. Klein’s office. The increase in visits and their duration began to alarm me and some others, especially when we began noticing the effects they had on him. He would start leaving the facility looking "groggy". We began realizing the procedures must have involved mind-altering substances.
It reached the point where some of us commented that it was pointless to give him fan letters and gifts after doctor’s visits as he would just send them back out signed, even though they were clearly letters addressed to him and not pictures from autograph hunters.
Something alarmed me more than usual on Saturday, April 25th,2009. It was the first time Michael went to see Dr. Klein on a week-end and it was late. He stayed there from 5pm-9.30pm.
When he came out from Klein’s office Michael smelled very strongly of I would say either rubbing alcohol or Ether and looked groggy.
On May 29th, Michael brought some of us in to Center Staging to talk to us about what was going on (after some fans told him they couldn’t get tickets to the concerts and how the ticket sales didn’t make sense and how things seemed to be a mess and was he aware of it). He told us he wasn’t aware of the problem, that he wasn’t aware that it was a seated venue and that he would do something about it. He told us he had gone to bed thinking it was 10 concerts and woke up finding out it was 50! He said “They did it without my consent. They just did it for obvious reasons”. He added “They did the schedule wrong too. It was supposed to be day, show off, day, show off, day, show off”. (He meant show, day off, show, day off).
His voice was breaking as he was going to start crying and he put his hands together in a prayer position and stood quietly. We were quiet with him. It was a very intense moment and filled with, in my opinion, sadness and worry.
I left feeling like our worries were validated and so did most of us there.
Unfortunately, the day after Michael made this statement it came out in the press. We don't know, but AEG was quick to refute it and call it a lie.
This also coincides with the timing of everything changing for the small group of us who used to have open contact with Michael.
After AEG found out about Michael’s statement to us everything changed.
Security shut us out and Michael stopped being as “available”.
With restricted access (although we still saw got to see him and somewhat speak to him) the doctor’s visits became more frequent and we noticed more of a physical change in him, especially his weight. He just looked too skinny and something felt wrong overall. Even his security guards’ attitudes and ways changed.
On June 1st Michael started rehearsals at the Forum in Inglewood
A couple of weeks into it, Michael Amir (Michael’s personal assistant and security) said that Michael was very tired, that he hadn't slept the entire week-end and that AEG kept on calling him all the time.
It was around that time that Michael would go to rehearsals later and later and sometimes cancel.
One of those times was on June 12th. Michael went late to rehearsals. On arrival there he didn’t stop for us the way he usually did. Shortly afterward his security came to see where we were, driving by our cars a block away where we usually parked and waited. They made no attempt to tell us what they were doing. This was about 8-9pm. At around midnight one of his security guards called “Biggie”, came out and told us: “Michael says this is “dangerous” (?!) and that “Michael didn’t want to go to rehearsals tonight”, “he’s tired”. And then we were asked to line up one by one and that we would get to have 15 seconds each alone with Michael. It all felt awkward for all of us involved. We didn’t understand what was going on but of course we did line up and had our time individually. It was very impersonal and we were being closely monitored by his security.
In the last few days of Michael’s life I also remember noticing his security guard Alberto Alvarez often looking very agitated and breaking into a nervous sweat. He would tell us, when questioning him on whether Michael was okay or not, that Michael was “focused” and in “tour mode” and not actually answering the question. Yet we could see it was more than that, that Michael had become increasingly altered, groggy and emaciated and that his security was nervous about something. In fact, instead of having 2-3 guards behind the gates at his house, it doubled and tripled and I even counted up to 12 of them on the night he died.
Something was up, something had changed and we knew it was time to act.
In an attempt to do an intervention to save his life, a couple of dozen fans (including myself) wrote letters to Michael the week before his death. It was out intention to give him the letters and to make a statement on behalf of all the fans who felt something was wrong.
We knew it was a matter of time before he died unless an action was taken. No-one else around him seemed to care enough to do it. Once all the letters were collected and a plan was in place, we decided to intervene on June 24th, 2009.
We did in fact manage to get them in his hands that afternoon. That night would be the last time I’d see him, leaving Staples Center at around 1.30 am on June 25th,2009.
This was my letter to him:
“Michael,
I have admired and loved you since the age of 14 when you first saved my life. You have kept saving it throughout the years, as blunt and odd as it may sound to someone who doesn’t even “know” me. You kept me going and gave me hope and strength.
Now it’s my turn, all of our turns, to reach out to YOU and tell you we’re here or you and that we want to help.
Please understand we love you so much we can’t afford to lose you. You mean so much it hurts to see you unhappy the way we have seen you for a while, as hard as you’ve tried to hide it. We feel and see something is wrong.
Michael, don’t ever do anything you DON’T want to do, whether it be concerts or anything-else people want you to do to make money.
Don’t let anyone or anything stress you to the point where you lose sleep, worry or do whatever else that ultimately affects your health. None of it is worth it and you don’t need to prove yourself.
You’ve paid your dues, more than once.
I need you and love you so deeply and truly, we all do.
Samantha”
Finally I want to end this by making something very clear. I am not saying Michael seemed high or groggy all the time. I want that to be understood. We did NOT perceive him as a junkie. We were just concerned (during a certain period of time) that he was too stressed and too pressured to be able to eat and function without medication and that people around him knew he was unwell and chose to close their eyes for profit, and God knows what other reason. But I know what I saw and I know it wasn’t a healthy, happy, fit man ready to go onstage less than 3 weeks later, and they know it too. It’s time for the truth to come out.
Samantha
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Mo, do you mean that he left the country in December 2008?
I have no idea where he went if he indeed hightailed it, but here's an article that supports our thought of Mike not living there:
Dr. Murray Lawyers Up for Wrongful Death Suit
Originally posted Apr 13th 2010 6:00 AM PDT by TMZ Staff
(http://ll-media.tmz.com/2010/04/06/conrad_murray_ex_4.jpg)
Dr. Conrad Murray is already planning his legal strategy in a Michael Jackson wrongful death case ... TMZ has learned.
Dr. Murray, we're told, has already hired a civil lawyer, Charles Peckham, who handles medical board cases and wrongful death lawsuits.
We've learned Peckham has already been in touch with Dr. Murray's malpractice insurance carrier, and it turns out to be a tricky situation.
Sources connected with Dr. Murray's defense tell TMZ Dr. Murray had a malpractice policy issued in Texas that covered his medical practices in Texas and Nevada.
Here's the rub. Dr. Murray did not have a medical practice in California, which is a prerequisite for his malpractice coverage. So Dr. Murray's position is that he first saw Michael Jackson as a Nevada patient and what he did for him in L.A. was merely an extension of the Nevada treatment.
We've learned the malpractice policy would only cover civil litigation, not criminal. In the event the doctor is sued for wrongful death -- and Joe Jackson promises that will happen soon -- Murray expects the policy would cover attorney's fees and any judgment.
One source told TMZ, "We fully expect the insurance company would cover such costs."
http://www.tmz.com/2010/04/12/conrad-mu (http://www.tmz.com/2010/04/12/conrad-mu) ... ce-lawyer/
Muray's and the TMZ source's expectations about the insurance coverage might mean they can prove Mike never lived there, i.e. he was still a resident of Nevada instead of a resident of California.
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And, isn't Nevada the only place Murray can practice in for now?
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I guess I don't take someones facebook comment as evidence.
It is interesting though, maybe it's true.
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& out of the 13 guards only 3 have talked to the press lol I bet these other guards had to sign confidentiality agreements.
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[quote = "* Mo *"] [quote = "Lady J"] Vivió allí!
Mira que le es después de los ensayos con] Talitha [/ quote
El hecho de que (si esto es realmente él, yo no ver de cerca antes de golpear el botón de respuesta) fue visto allí no significa que él vivía allí, y punto. [/ B] [/ quote]
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If they murdered him, they would not change the number of bodyguards from 4 to 13!!! They would act as always, calm and normal. 13 bodyguards in a murder case would cause attention...he must have faked his death though...the bodyguards thing is one of the best clues so far.
Yes, I think you're right! IF it was really murder, I don't think they would use more Bodyguars and not that much more.. Because that would cause much attention as you said.
Couldn't agree more :)
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The Christmas wreaths does not prove anything either, period?
No... I don´t like using that.
(http://alt.coxnewsweb.com/cnishared/tools/shared/mediahub/04/89/15/slideshow_1158940_145127_Michael_Jackson_Reax.JPG)
(http://soulofamerica.com/soagalleries/la/Michael-Jackson/LA-Neverland-gate.jpg)
I think that Michael loved/loves Christmas since Liza made him live it and since he had the kids.
I´ve heard, can´t remember where, that he liked/like to have Christmas wreaths at the gates.
I don´t BELIEVE Samantha either... I don´t KNOW if she´s right.
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I think that Michael loved/loves Christmas since Liza made him live it and since he had the kids.
I have to correct you, that wasn't Liza, but Elizabeth Taylor.
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hummm having 13 bodyguards around if it was a murder plot would almost guarantee someone slipping up and telling what really happened. No if it was a murder, the less people the better.
If this girl is right/telling the truth, it's very interesting that the security increased.
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This is a funny debate because there shouldn't be a debate at all. :lol: I'm only saying that because no one knows whether he was living there or not or if he had a double or not so there is really nothing wrong with stating an opinion but I think the problem here is people are stating opinions as facts. In fact, these opinions can spur on more things to investigate, hence all the wonderful theories that are on here. 8-)
In case you are talking about my posts in which I stated two different things in this thread:
1) It's my OPINION that Mike never lived there.
2) If a person drives in or pops up somewhere, that doesn't mean the person it living there. That is a FACT.
Nope I wasn't talking about you. I didn't feel the need to name names but nope not you.
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just sayin' that Carrie Fisher most likely does not know a thing. she was just invited for that Christmas dinner because the kids wanted to see Princess Leia in person, so Michael asked Arnie Klein to bring her over. we know how Michael's family loved Star Wars :) i think we can find no clues from what she says.
Do you think this has something do with the video of Blanket doing a scene from Star Wars?
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I think that Michael loved/loves Christmas since Liza made him live it and since he had the kids.
I have to correct you, that wasn't Liza, but Elizabeth Taylor.
Yes, I meant Liz... thank you.
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Postby Serenitys_Dream » Fri May 21, 2010 9:35 pm
What’s odd is that I see fans laying flowers in front of homes that I don’t think Michael ever lived in.
So fans are laying flowers at homes he never lived in? Which ones?
Or are we being directed as in...
Fans look to homes he HAS lived in for clues. So where has he lived: Encino Compound, Neverland, Carolwood, Las Vegas and Bahrain (if you know somewhere else add it). These are significant locations.
What’s odd is that I see fans laying flowers in front of homes that I don’t think Michael ever lived in.
Never Lived In: Forest lawn? :)
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[Quote = "voiceforthesilent"]Never Lived In: Forest lawn? :)[/ Quote]
true, good thing, never lived in Forest Lawn :lol: :lol:
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Update form Samantha´s facebook:
Samantha De Gosson : I believe his security were in on the scheme....from their behaviour the last 2 weeks. The last night it wasn't 13 guards in different suits and colours. They were in unison. Same look, same clothes. Suddenly violent. His car wouldn't stop the way it did everyday. We still managed to give him a number in his hand, at 1.30am. That was IT. Last chance.