Some General Observations

[simplyme]

What caught my attention in the report was that it said there was a telephone (not cell phone) on the table next to the bed. Michael DID NOT have a phone in his room because he didn't want to be disturbed when he slept.

Another thing, when the medical examiner examined the 'body', he recorded the person as being a "black male". But his skin was clearly white. Shouldn't he be recording the facts as he sees them?  :roll:

Michael was black.  That is a fact.  The examiner can't say he's examining a caucasian when he knows darn well Michael wasn't caucasian.  If the examiner has said Michael was white - what would be your response to that?  Think on that and be honest.  Get my drift?  Michael was not pale all over.  That very white skin you always saw was makeup.  He always wore makeup.

[Mariso83]

Well Joe was pretending he was upset but he was clear he wasn't. When Joe and his sons went out of the court they were laughing and smilling. When they saw they were filming, they stopped smilling and laughing. A journalist asked a question about the trial to Jermaine and he said we are upset. Sorry but this speaks volume to me.

[White_Orchid]

I believe Michael is alive.

If Michael is in hiding, he must have had serious reasons.

Has anyone found that old post with the pictures of the 2 Michael Jackson driver's licenses? I remember that the DL pictures did not seem to be the same person.

I would guess that the autopsy John Doe would have had surgery and tatoos to replicate/MIMIC Michael's body exactly.

Dental records are commonly used in forensic identification so it is very convenient that the autopsy stated that dental records unavailable and incomplete.

Actually, if Michael's old medical records contained DNA records, then they could be used to determine if the John Doe was Michael or not. Joe Jackson is really smart trying to get the release of this info.  I remember Katherine requesting a 3rd or 4th autopsy, so if Michael's Mother doesn't believe that the John Doe is her son, then something is really amiss!  

One thing is for sure, John Doe's organs were saturated in Propofol. Some thread posters suggested that the Propofol cleared the body quickly.  If Propofol clears the body quickly, somebody must have been pumping the stuff into John Doe, because his organs were saturated!!!

John Doe was waay over the toxic limit.

The urine puzzled me all day so another theory popped into my mind so let me know your thoughts.  

Does anyone know if there was bathroom attached to that bedroom? If not, then maybe John Doe was hiding and peed in the glass container, earlier in the day.  

Remember  that the autopsy stated that John Doe's bladder was full of urine, so that suggests to me that John Doe, wasn't trying to sleep for 8 hours.

If John Doe had a urine catheter yet still had a full bladder and unmarked plastic bed protector, it would suggest to me that John Doe was died fast.

If John Doe died fast that would explain the  4 cups of urine and why he was so saturated with Propofol.

The full bladder and the urine container suggested that John Doe was confined to that room.

So, why would he be confined to that room? Was it a plan? If John Doe was terminal, maybe there was an agreed time to end his life, like euthanasia. Some hospices do that for people in cancer pain or by their choice.  Maybe John Doe wrote out a will to that effect or something.  

Maybe Murray was only brought in for John Doe?

Michael couldn't kill a bug so I don't believe Michael did anything wrong. Maybe the John Doe 'situation' was 'available for use'?

idk :shock:  :?:

[HJS]

I believe Michael is alive.


Actually, if Michael's old medical records contained DNA records, then they could be used to determine if the John Doe was Michael or not. Joe Jackson is really smart trying to get the release of this info.  I remember Katherine requesting a 3rd or 4th autopsy, so if Michael's Mother doesn't believe that the John Doe is her son, then something is really amiss!  

One thing is for sure, John Doe's organs were saturated in Propofol. Some thread posters suggested that the Propofol cleared the body quickly.  If Propofol clears the body quickly, somebody must have been pumping the stuff into John Doe, because his organs were saturated!        

I don't necessarily think Katherine requested those autopsies because she didn't think it was him but probably just to get a 3rd and 4th opinion on the actual cause of death? That's just my opinion..I do wholeheartdly agree though that someone else was in the room pumping propofol into his body..nothing makes sense.. :|

[akiraka]

I couldn't read here all your posts, but all that info at the begining is a great work.Sorry if I repeat something related to the bottle with urine, because I did not understand you were talking here about this bottle or other one?  

If it is correct, I  understand was mentioned a bottle of MJ's urine was found in the bedroom.

Is there any mention that they made an analyse of that urine? because in that urine would be found all the medicine we were told that was given to MJ, remember the sedatives and anxiety drugs. And in my opinion if it's true with this bottle, the urine is clean, no medicine.
So they said then in the summer that the report is delayed because they do that tests what drugs are in MJ's body? and takes time. Why?  if they have a bottle with urine, there can be found by the urine analyses all the substances.

I read TMZ article speaking about this bottle and I  wonder why they mentioned this? just 1 phrase that it was found there in the room.

Then please remember that somewhere are mentioned the hours when all the medicines were given to MJ begining with 1:30, 2... 5, 7, or 7:30 until 10:45 when was the Propofol. I've said before they said 1 sedative, 1 anxiety drug, 1 sedative, 1 anxiety ... and so on,  between these administrations there are almost 2 hours. MJ was not sedated and he didn't sleep, that means he can talk etc.. so what he was doing 2 hours, or Murray? did they talk or what? 2 hours and again 2 hours between the adminstration no conversation nothing between MJ and Murray? isnt it very strange that NOBODY asks about this 2 hours pause between the drug admin. ?

For me it seems so stupid : not being asleep all night, MJ had to do something between the drugs administration intervals which is a long time, almost 2 hours. And again the last sedative without any effect to put him to sleep was in the morning at 7:30, so until 10:45 hour when Propofol is involved, what was he doing?

Come on, is so illogical and what about his kids?. Supposing at 9 o'clock waked up and wanted to see their father, who I repeat was OK, I mean not asleep, not sedated do you imagine MJ telling them wait at 10:45 I must try to go asleep again, so know I can't see and talk to you?.

And the last if at aprox. 11 o'clock the Propofol was adiministrated, so for 9 hours he didn't sleep at all, it's  11 o'clock, on 3 hours he should  be at Staples, who can believe he wanted to sleep just for 3 hours? I don't believe this !

And know I was thinking about the ambulance video, if it was a real  dramatic situation we saw the gates opened,  I can't imagine that Paris and Prince wouldn't be in the courtyard, screaming, crying that is MJ there in ambulance, they saw the ambulance coming, they saw /here paramedics coming, so ?? it was very quiet when ambulance was leaving the house, if MJ was there in ambulance the kids would have been outside, not inside the house.

[tklein1014]

If John Doe was terminal, maybe there was an agreed time to end his life, like euthanasia. Some hospices do that for people in cancer pain or by their choice.  Maybe John Doe wrote out a will to that effect or something.

I had the same thought about possible assisted suicide...anyone know if it's legal in CA?

[mjthelegendlives]

The paramedics said that MJ was unrecognizable and seemed like an old wrinkled man...yet, they used a license to identify the body?  

This is Anniesnotokey's theory and she was the owner of "the troot will prevail" blog also.  

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[voiceforthesilent]

Ok, I dont wanna freak anyone out, but there was a member on the old MJKIT forum named anniesnotokey and she was writing HER account on what she thought happened at MJ's house that day. It was written way back last yr sometime.....maybe in August or Sept maybe? I cannot recall, but her story is almost EXACTLY like this.....this is so creepy. She was saying that the double was living upstairs at MJ's house...hence the reason that NO ONE was allowed upstairs because he had to be kept hidden. She called him "Jack" I think. She said he was the one who smoked and was having surgery on his face the night of the 25th and something went wrong and he died. But she included Dr Klien in the story as well cus he was doing the surgery..in the house, and Klien called Murray in a frantic state and they made a deal or something for Murray to take the fall...............I was just over at MJKIT and could not find her posts, but then again I wasnt looking very well. If someone here recalls reading this story I would SO much appreciate if you could post her story so everyone can read it.

This is REALLY odd, that we are all talking about something she wrote months ago and alot of peeps here are new and havent read it yet....

PLEASE, if someone can find her story?? You have to read it....I think her story may be the real thing.

I hope she doesnt mind..

i wasn't here at the time to read that story but I do remember a couple of weeks ago that same person "checking in" here. She had said she deleted everything in order to move on or something but keeps checking in every once in a while. These theories sound so plausible. Hmm...very interesting. Thank you.

[voiceforthesilent]

Jackson's body was fingerprinted.

If someone died in his place, why are the family trying to prosecute Murray and they want murder charges? That does not make sense. If it was a person with a terminal illness, why was this not reported in the autopsy. Is the coroner (and all the consultants) colluding? Some thoeries are so out there they will need very strong evidence to back them up. Point is, how on earth is that autopsy report fake? Every major news agency is reporting that it has been released by the LA Coroner.....why should we NOT believe that the report is the autopsy on Michael Jackson?

One thing that does seem to be contradicted, is that he had no clothes. An article was printed in the Daily Telegraph Magazine - a respected paper - on August 15th. The article was around 6 pages long and titled 'The last days of Michael Jackson'. In the first paragraph it described the scene in the Coroner's where michael jackson lay on a trolley in a room. It described him looking peaceful and wearing nothing apart from black silk pyjama bottoms. It described a red mark on his chest and him being barefoot. This is all from memory. I am sure I kept the magazine but i will have to root it out to be 100% on what i just said. But, if this is true, why did the coroner say they had no clothing? All i can think is that the family asked for him to be clothed that way before he got to the coroner to perhaps protect his dignity from prying eyes? By the way, Kai Chase said in an interview that MJ would come downstairs in his PJ's before bed.

the coroner could be aware and that is why it's fake?

[tklein1014]

If John Doe was terminal, maybe there was an agreed time to end his life, like euthanasia. Some hospices do that for people in cancer pain or by their choice.  Maybe John Doe wrote out a will to that effect or something.

I had the same thought about possible assisted suicide...anyone know if it's legal in CA?

One more thought regarding the propofol injecting...maybe the person died of their terminal lung desease, then the propofol was injected post mortem to make it LOOK like it was propofol overdose...possibly in the time between when the person was discovered "not breathing" and 911 was called? Just a thought...that long time it took to call 911 has bothered me since day 1...that was the first thing that made me think that something was fishy.

Explains why the body was "swimming in it" also, even though propofol is instantly absorbed in the body, I understand.

How could they have detected the propofol in the body anyway, if it's instantly absorbed, unless it WAS injected post mortem?

Maybe the mystery patient, dying of a terminal lung desease had stopped breathing @ 11something o'clock, but their heart was still going so a heck of a lot of propofol was injected while the heart was still going to get it spread through the system a little, then the patient died, and 911 was called...not mentioning MJ's name because he's not the one who needed the ambulance...always wondered why they didn't drop his name in that call to get them to hurry it up a little...

Connect-the-dots...la-la-la-la...

This is like reading a good suspense/mystery book...lol

[White_Orchid]

Explains why the body was "swimming in it" also, even though propofol is instantly absorbed in the body, I understand.

How could they have detected the propofol in the body anyway, if it's instantly absorbed, unless it WAS injected post mortem?

Maybe the mystery patient, dying of a terminal lung desease had stopped breathing @ 11something o'clock, but their heart was still going so a heck of a lot of propofol was injected while the heart was still going to get it spread through the system a little, then the patient died, and 911 was called...

They never mentioned MJ's name in the 911 call either...always wondered why they didn't.

Connect-the-dots...la-la-la-la...

This is like reading a good suspense/mystery book...lol

Exactly, the autopsy found Propofol in the stomach, viterous, blood, liver, femerol blood,...and most of the Propofol found was waaaay over the toxic level.

Plus all  that urine....really begins to break down like an assisted suicide.

@mjthelegendives
I haven't seen any annieisnotokay posts for quite some time so glad to hear that she is still around. Also, I was unaware that she authored the Troot blog and also unaware that she had already presented the suicide theory.  Wish I'd known that, it would have saved me some sleep. annieisnotokay's contributions would be valued, so hope to hear thoughts soon, thanks.

[White_Orchid]

The old forum is a wealth of information!

Here's the link for the 2 different Michael Jackson passport photos....

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What do you think???

 :shock:  :?:  :shock:

[tklein1014]

The old forum is a wealth of information!

Here's the link for the 2 different Michael Jackson passport photos....

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

What do you think???

 :shock:  :?:  :shock:

If this is asking the Joe or Joseph question again, they both say Joe and it's my understanding that you must use your full legal name on your passport.

[ILuvUMoreMJ]

When Joe and his sons went out of the court they were laughing and smilling. When they saw they were filming, they stopped smilling and laughing. A journalist asked a question about the trial to Jermaine and he said we are upset. Sorry but this speaks volume to me.

Trust me, they knew they were being filmed the entire time...there was a mob of press and fans waiting outside for them, so they didn't stop laughing because they suddenly knew they were being filmed.  There are glass doors on the courthouse...there's no way they didn't see everyone.  They looked very upset to me, but that doesn't mean someone can't laugh or smile at times either.

I still say that the person could not have had a terminal disease or this would have been mentioned in the report.  They could not definitively say that propofol killed him then, which was their conclusion, and they would not have a case against Murray.

[tipareth]

My personal opinion over the urine matter....

As a sufferer of severe insomnia myself I know that in some cases, insomnia can dehydrate the body, by extra urine produced. Urine metabolize faster, the desire to urinate is higher, and one gets pretty dehydrated after a night of bad insomnia.

In severe cases of insomnia this becomes usual. During the nights urinating need reaches around 4-5 times or even higher.... even if one do not consume liquids, and unrelated to prostrate. So the dehydration kicks in.